If he is shit, would you be fussed if he went to Chelsea, Man city or Spurs, say
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If he is shit, would you be fussed if he went to Chelsea, Man city or Spurs, say
no way should he be sacked now and he wont leave until the end of his contract guaranteed.
I think most people would be sad to see him go, and upset that he hasn't managed to do what he set out to achieve.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan B'stard
But it's not a question of whether we are fussed. I think we all would be if he did what you say above.
It's a matter of principle for most fans, where it pains people to say, he is not doing the job he should be doing, and therefore, it leaves no option.
too many fans state that as fact with no knowledge of what is happening inside the club
i would imagine that the issues are far harder to rectify than shouting it at a game
Wouldnt mind if he went Chelsea or Man City. They wouldnt be challenging for the title but only for 4th place.
We dont want Spuds challenging for 4th though so would mind if he went there.
Wouldn't mind seeing him go to one of those clubs either, he won't spend any money and after a couple years they'd be passing the ball to death and not winning anything :lol:
He's not suddenly become a bad manager but I think he has become a little too principled.
Thing is I basically agree with his principles of not getting involved with the silly money transfer market (he has got involved with the silly money wages but he has no option there) but I think he could have spent a bit more without 'selling out' and given us a better chance of success.
He has done well to keep us top 4, I think people underestimate how well, but I do think he should move on now as I'm not sure he can take us any further. Which doesn't mean I think anyone else can in this era of the billionaire sugar-daddy.
He can F Off..
The mere thought of Wengerball backed up with endless amounts of money scares me.
For that reason, I wouldn't like him to go to Chelsea, Man Utd or Man City.
ha; say it exactly how you really feel, letters. It is easy to be 'too' principled when you are under no pressure (to deliver).Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters (TPFKA WWTL@WHL)
Been reading a few things on his days at Monaco and the stubborn pattern we see here didn't develop overnight. He was there for 7 years and won a league title and cup on his early years. Lost a Cup Winners Cup final, a string of Quarter and Semi final exits in Europe and a consistent record of finishing on the top 3. Finally got the sack when he finished 9th. Was a hero at first but fans grew tired of the lack of progression from what I've read. Trying to find out more.
His philosophy of keeping a team together and the youth set up comes from his love for Ajax and the Total Football years. He's trying to achieve the same at Arsenal but keeps hitting a brick wall. 7 year at Monaco and 1 league cup, 1 title isn't a great record. He won the title in his first season and after that it went down hill. I don't think he has it in him to get Arsenal out of this rut. His trend is to dig his heels in until sacked.
He is better than the respective managers of our rivals except for Fergie, so yes I would care if he left us for them.
I think we need a new manager, so it'll be a step in the right direction if he leaves. I would be indifferent to him joining Chelsea or City, because if he tries to implement the same, discredited philosophy that he's used in the last 5 years, then those clubs will stagnate in the same way we have.
no; he will get sacked before he even thinks of it. hahaQuote:
Originally Posted by Joker
Also, he had a chance to manage the French team and Bayern Munich. When sacked he went off to Japan to coach. Why? I think the Munich offer was still on the table after Munich. Why choose to go to Japan and off the radar when you could have gone to a bigger club?
I reckon he turned down Munich because of the pressure aspect. He could have gone to Madrid on a few occasions but wouldn't have lasted 5 minutes there either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
They absolutely would not put up with him using there first team as a nursery.
Define deliver. Had we slipped out of the top 4 then I suspect he'd have been long gone.Quote:
Originally Posted by budesonide
It's nonsense to say he's under no pressure but I think the board are too satisfied by perennial CL football and not bothered enough about trophies.
Why do you think it's OK to be so disrespectful to just about the most important manager in our club's history?Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeYank
Frustrated as I am with him and things at the club (and with football in general), I'd never be so disrespectful to Wenger. He's taken us places I never thought I'd see Arsenal go.
I think so. Under pressure, he can't cope. When he's the underdog he excels but when expected to deliver he buckles. I think the nerves get to him.Quote:
Originally Posted by selassie
Exactly, the board are too obsessed with share prices, property values, the balance sheet etc etc. I'm not saying these aspects are not important, but you get the impression that the board know the price of everything but the value of nothing. This explains why PHW can write arrogant, disrespectful columns in the Daily Star criticising fans for having the temerity to question the direction of the club. "The share price is increasing, we're getting the revenue from UCL qualification, why are people unsatisfied?" is what he's thinking, because he's too much of a free market fundamentalist to understand the deeper reasons why we all follow the club.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters (TPFKA WWTL@WHL)
@ the OP. I would be hugely fussed, because I think that initially he would eb very successful at Chavs and Citeh, working with players who know how to win things. He would also be kept on his toes and challenged - which would vastly increase his effectiveness.
Of course, it wouldn't happen, because he would not tolerate any reduction in the omnipotent status he has with us.
Bottling it has been a recurring theme for all of his teams.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
99 FA Cup semi, losing to Leeds in the 99 title run in, Uefa Final 2000, FA Cup final 2001, 2003 title run in. The seeds were sown long before the Emirates era begun.
I don't think that's fair. It's easy to cherry pick big games we lost but there were loads we won too. Utd at Old Trafford in '98 in the title run in, again in 2002 to win the title, a few FA Cup finalsQuote:
Originally Posted by Marc Overmars
Did Utd bottle it in the FA Cup semi-final or CL Final this year? No team wins every big game.
I know you can;t win every big game but we lost the games I mentioned in an exceptional manner/circumstance which is what I wanted to allude to. Just like how we screw up in the same vein these days as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters (TPFKA WWTL@WHL)
I was thinking about this recently.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Overmars
Well more about the 2003 collapse than the others. That has been swept under the carpet for what we did the season after but in hindsight you can see, as you say the mentality issue was a problem then as well.
If we replaced him with Pep Guardiola and spent 100mill in building a squad I couldn't give two shits where he went. If we replaced him with with some midtable dross like Hughes, I'd hope he went abroad tbh.
:clap: ThisQuote:
Originally Posted by Letters (TPFKA WWTL@WHL)
Is the most lucid summary I have read on the AW conundrum.Quote:
He has done well to keep us top 4, I think people underestimate how well, but I do think he should move on now as I'm not sure he can take us any further. Which doesn't mean I think anyone else can in this era of the billionaire sugar-daddy.
I defy anyone to be able to predict confidently that a successor would do better, because as much as I and almost everyone else have had enough of the frustration of seeing Wenger unwilling or unable to correct the obvious failings in our team, losing him will lose the other things that have made us able to compete in relative adversity. Being a mangnet for the best young talent; the technical excellence that he has fostered; the ability at (albeit increasingly infrequent) time to play Barca-style total football; the reputation with which he enhances the club.
Winning trophies is very, very difficult. We should not confuse our desperation to at least try something new with the likelihood that it will be better.
Is it?Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasri Scoreng
Since we last won a trophy, all of our major rivals for the title/CL places have won something. In fact if it wasnt for a bout of Rafaitis that struck Liverpool, they'd be much better placed atm as well.
Even Birmingham have won something since 2005
and writing about it and shouting from the stands is far easier when you know you don't have to back it upQuote:
Originally Posted by Nasri Scoreng
Well, quite, Terry. But we're fans of the club, and this is a message board to debate that club.
If you're gonna say that to everyone, we might as well abandon the site and all fuck off. Then we can just sit in silence (irony there) at the emirates, and just thank our lucky stars that we've just paid £100 + on a day out to watch the same old shite.
The thing which is most frustrating about Arsenal right now is that watching them play sometimes we're clearly good enough to be winning trophies. A Spurs supporting friend said that in the first half hour at WHL we were the best side he'd seen there this season. But then it went back to 3-2, the heads went down and instead of pushing on and winning it we dropped points from a commanding 3-1 position. It's the combination of knowing we're good enough to win trophies but having no belief that we actually will which is so maddening.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasri Scoreng
debate doesn't = fact which seems to be the case for too many at the games. there's debate then there's hysteria which is what fans are boardering on and this is far from a crisis but when your head is invaded by so much football 'analysis' on tv, internet, radio etc then it just keeps it stirring. £100 for same old shite? winning most games and going home happy more often than not? that's what i mean about hysteria.Quote:
Originally Posted by LDG
Yes it is. You know as well as I do that the likes of Birmingham can win the CC out of a mixture of other sides' apathy and sheer unadulterated good luck. Same goes to an extent for the FA Cup these days.
Look at our major rivals - the Chavs who have hired really top class managers and spant massively on the right players. Manure who have arguably the best manager this country has ever seen, and Citeh who have had to spend 100's of millions to buy the FA Cup.
It is ridiculous to argue that winning cups - at least proper ones - is anything other than very difficult.
No. Most people are being very considered in their opinions tbh. None of this is kneejerk reaction. Some may well be more vorciferous / extreme in their views. But to most it is obvious that the same failings have happened for the last three / four years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry Tuffnutz
Most have been patient with the club, and supported the policies that have been upheld by Wenger and Co. these last six years.
But there does come a point, that when the glaringly obvious, even to the most unknowledgable football fan, is not corrected, you have to question the managers decisions.
considered? not from where i've been sitting (standing) they haven't been.
no problem questioning but a lot of the nonsense said is ridiculous, utter garbage when questions and debate become fact.
So you're saying it's just bad luck we've capitulated so badly this year??
sure why not, if thats what you've taken from what i said
i meant "pressure" and "deliver" in the sense of performing at one of the top clubs in europe and the world today.Quote:
Originally Posted by Letters (TPFKA WWTL@WHL)
and i seriously doubt wenger would have been sacked any of the previous seasons had we fallen out of the top four. I highly doubt that.
qualifying for the CL means our resources are not unduly that stretched (based on my knowledge of our loan that I have read). So unless we slipped completely into midtable mediocrity i doubt this board have the cajones and vision to sack wenger.
for all his warts.....Wenger has almost won the right to choose when he walks, no amount of griping is going to se him get booted out the door.
He has become very stuck in his ways and a new side to him, the one that gets irratated andcomes out with a lot of twoddle post match, has become more and more evident, so much so it does make you wish he shut the hell up however
he is arguably the most successful manager we have ever had and will be given another chance under the regime that we have at the club. How much patience they show, especially if things continue along the same lines is something we will have to wait and see.
What I hope is that Wenger regains so of that famed intelligence to anaylsis what has happened to every facet or the club both good and bad.
The fact that we were turned down by Jones gives me the slightest tinge of hope (Mindless Optimist Clique member speaking!:)) as it shows that we were tryimng for one of the better players that was being touted about. What we need now, is not for AW to sit back and say "Well I tried! but he didn"t want to come, so I will go back to scouring the French second division" - he needs to get on his bike and go after another top target, Samba or the slightly expensive Cahill.......what we need at the back should be PL tested and why not someone who has seen the ugly side of the league, the relegation battle........would be better than someone who has a degree in 'square ball passing'
I think the real question is, would you expect our club to adequately replace Wenger with a manager with an exemplary record of success at other clubs?
Or do you think any mid table mongolid can do better than AW at Arsenal?