Where Arsenal is going wrong

[IBK]

I don't believe a word they say anymore tbh. AW in particular sounds more like a politician every time he speaks. I understand we've always been private about business, but you can't talk on one hand about "healthy finances" and then say "we don't speak about this that or the other".

PR is all wrong, and it doesn't serve to quell the disatisfaction amongst our fanbase.

Actions speak louder than words, and so I choose not to listen too much to what our manager has to say, or what Gadzidasnjje has to say either.

But given that our actions are precisely cock all at the moment, and coming off the back of the most horrific collapse thus far, it doesn't really sit well when P-Diddy to the HW comes our with "be bloody patient".

The only way the club will make us believe again, is by making the necessary changes to to the team, and the way we play. It's a football team after all, and that is why we follow them. More words will not placate me in the slightest.

Understood, but I wonder whether the level of unrest ATM is because the manager and board give the impression either of being delusional, or of knowing what is wrong but refusing to address it for commercial reasons.

I may be naive, but I am suprised that genuine Arsenal fans (rather than plastics) would be this upset simply because of the team's limited failings. We haven't fallen out of the CL places or been relegated, have we - yet the angst around AFC is worse than it was around Liverpool last season.

Surely its the club's/manager's attitude, rather than the problems on the pitch that is to blame for the degree of disenchantment? I mean we all know that we are unlikely to win the league with our relative resources - don't we?

[LDG]

Well, we should have won the league last year IMO, but that's another discussion.

I get what you're saying, and if it hadn't been for 3 years of the same, then I'd agree with you. In fact, last season I was fairly happy, as I had assumed we'd finally take the plunge and do what was necessary. I was convinced we wouldn't fall away again....but we did, and in the most horric way yet.

We've been there or thereabouts with Chelsea spending tonnes. I know they've been better than us, and their titles show that, but we weren't that far off. And we're still a top force IMO. I think we have the talent to challenge for the title.

BUT. It does require a bit of strengthening, and it requires some tactical change, and some marshalling (both captain and manager).

So, for a limited amount of cash, and some changes in our coaching set up, we'd be comfortable. I think we'd still be biting at the leaders heels in May.

We haven't done the necessary, and I don't believe it's a question of financial disparity. It's all down to a managers refusal to accept his mistakes, a board who are happy because we're in the CL, and numerous other overlooked problems which saddle us with problems (see Nick Benders wage demands and why we can't sell the cunt).

It doesn't need loads of money throwing at it. It just needs some balls. Because all in all, that's what we lack. Bollocks. From Board to Manager, to Players.

[IBK]

Well, we should have won the league last year IMO, but that's another discussion.

I get what you're saying, and if it hadn't been for 3 years of the same, then I'd agree with you. In fact, last season I was fairly happy, as I had assumed we'd finally take the plunge and do what was necessary. I was convinced we wouldn't fall away again....but we did, and in the most horric way yet.

We've been there or thereabouts with Chelsea spending tonnes. I know they've been better than us, and their titles show that, but we weren't that far off. And we're still a top force IMO. I think we have the talent to challenge for the title.

BUT. It does require a bit of strengthening, and it requires some tactical change, and some marshalling (both captain and manager).

So, for a limited amount of cash, and some changes in our coaching set up, we'd be comfortable. I think we'd still be biting at the leaders heels in May.

We haven't done the necessary, and I don't believe it's a question of financial disparity. It's all down to a managers refusal to accept his mistakes, a board who are happy because we're in the CL, and numerous other overlooked problems which saddle us with problems (see Nick Benders wage demands and why we can't sell the cunt).

It doesn't need loads of money throwing at it. It just needs some balls. Because all in all, that's what we lack. Bollocks. From Board to Manager, to Players.

I agree entirely - and FWIW the main issue for me is AW's stranglehold on the team that seems to leech out individuality (remember when RVP was a shit hot free kick taker?), and prevents him from getting in a Martin Keown as a defensive coach.

But do the grievances you set out justify the level of bitterness we are seeing?

[LDG]

Yes. I'm not in the kamakazi club. Far from it. I'm not a spoilt brat.

But what I do see is a manager with so much to give, and players with so much talent. So why the fuck waste it all because you don't believe in teaching the basics of football?? And that is outrageous....far worse than if we just couldn't afford to buy because the board were writing themselves cheques.

The board can pay each other and the players as much as they sodding want for all I care, as long as they do the business on the pitch.

And that is what pisses me off...because effectively it feels like they're taking the piss out of me. And to do that to a fan who has followed every sodding kick and cried and cheered and lived every moment for 27 years...it's a little hard to take.

1 Centre Back. 1 Striker. TV5 gets the armband. That's all I want now in terms of spending with the current squad.

What I want most, is for us to grow a pair, and learn the basics as well as the nice stuff.

[Grebbo]

For me it's the moaning that does my head in. Constant moaning from Wenger:

'They only wanted to defend and didn't want to let us win'
'They were too rough'
'They spent money on buying players'
'I hope we recover after this disappointment'
'We're a young team'

Add the constant defeatist attitude '4th is success' and is it any wonder the team is so gutless and shit?

Wenger moans more than the fans - that's how bad he is.

[IBK]

I wonder what needs to happen, though. Could we all do with being a bit more honest?

I have lost a lot of respect for the manager because of his contadictory statements and his spin on everything. I don't want naivity, but I also don't want my manager having a reputation for whingeing.

I am more ambivalent about this issue of finishing fourth, though, because it is probably our natural level now, given the financial power elsewhere. I don't necessarily think its the talk of fourth being a good result that is the cause of the complacency amongst our players - I think its because we have paid to much, and given far too much time and patience to players who aren't good enough. The fact that we are struggling to sell some of the dead wood speaks for itself.

[LDG]

Wenger himself acknowledged all of our deficiencies at the end of the season, and said he was going to put them right.

I haven't seen anything which remotely looks like he's putting those right. He's tried to sell the dross, but failed. They're fucking around with two players who don't want to play for us, one being our captain. The same mistakes are being made pre-season in terms of the defence. Moreover, we haven't managed to buy a proper defender because we won't pay the market price.

Trophies don't matter. Fourth doesn't matter. Money doesn't matter. City don't matter. Utd don't matter. Mata doesn't fucking matter.

What does matter is that we see some action from our management that proves they have learnt from their mistakes, and are trying to put them right, whether we finish top or bottom. And we aren't seeing that, and we have 11 days until the season starts.

[Japan Shaking All Over]

I believe a lot of our problems stem from not being able to recognise our own face in the mirror!

It's as we see the problems ie the defence but just refuse to look at them more through them and my looking through them we fail to acknowledge them thus leave them unattended.

The GK/defence problem has been with us for yonks now and the lack of mental strength, just as long.......a failure to kill off games comes about by this because we prance around like everyone owes us.

No-one thinks they owe us anything, thats why we get pushed around......we get pushed around on the pitch, in the transfer market and by our own players and their contracts.
This summer seems to be a prime example.......we are incapable it seems of clinching a deal without a drawn out saga.......we get every bid we make thrown back at us be it for our lack of respect and arrogance or that we are just tight. Teams know they can say no and force us to come back with another offer or lose out.......they also know we half, maybe 3/4s have our hands tieed because we cant decide what to do about Cesc/Nasri..........FFS just grow a pair and for IMO tke a hit.......sell them both and build new tem of commited players........I will take a naff season if I see ambition in the team

I agree there is a lot of moaning but that can be expected........we are having a rough time and we all believe we have the answer, we dont know what is going on so we assume and like most, those assumptions are negative but fairly made on past experiences and evidence.
Everyone is shit scared of Wenger doing another tick like he did last year.......Kos and Squid to answer our defensive needs.

The board are the only ones who dont seem to be getting pushed around, in fact they are times seem to be unmovable, the stubborn gits.......they seem to pushing us around, getting us to accept, statements, quickly followed by contradictory actions...........I remain optimistic that there are still things to happen but I get frustrated most by the Cesc/Nasri sagas and want to see these concluded, I heard Wenger saying by Sunday, but I still feel none the wiser.

time to take a hard look, a hard look at ourselves and what needs to be done in order to make ourselves beautiful again.......it may not require that much but it does require some work Wenger........hopefully you will see it for what it really is!

[AKBapologist]

You want us to be more decisive in transfers? I agree.

Next.

[IBK]

I believe a lot of our problems stem from not being able to recognise our own face in the mirror!

It's as we see the problems ie the defence but just refuse to look at them more through them and my looking through them we fail to acknowledge them thus leave them unattended.

The GK/defence problem has been with us for yonks now and the lack of mental strength, just as long.......a failure to kill off games comes about by this because we prance around like everyone owes us.

No-one thinks they owe us anything, thats why we get pushed around......we get pushed around on the pitch, in the transfer market and by our own players and their contracts.
This summer seems to be a prime example.......we are incapable it seems of clinching a deal without a drawn out saga.......we get every bid we make thrown back at us be it for our lack of respect and arrogance or that we are just tight. Teams know they can say no and force us to come back with another offer or lose out.......they also know we half, maybe 3/4s have our hands tieed because we cant decide what to do about Cesc/Nasri..........FFS just grow a pair and for IMO tke a hit.......sell them both and build new tem of commited players........I will take a naff season if I see ambition in the team

I agree there is a lot of moaning but that can be expected........we are having a rough time and we all believe we have the answer, we dont know what is going on so we assume and like most, those assumptions are negative but fairly made on past experiences and evidence.
Everyone is shit scared of Wenger doing another tick like he did last year.......Kos and Squid to answer our defensive needs.

The board are the only ones who dont seem to be getting pushed around, in fact they are times seem to be unmovable, the stubborn gits.......they seem to pushing us around, getting us to accept, statements, quickly followed by contradictory actions...........I remain optimistic that there are still things to happen but I get frustrated most by the Cesc/Nasri sagas and want to see these concluded, I heard Wenger saying by Sunday, but I still feel none the wiser.

time to take a hard look, a hard look at ourselves and what needs to be done in order to make ourselves beautiful again.......it may not require that much but it does require some work Wenger........hopefully you will see it for what it really is!

Problem is that we now have a bad reputation in a number of different ways:

- Contract ditherers - is it any wonder that other clubs and quality players don't take us seriously in the transfer market

- A selling club - personally, I find it unsurprising that Barca are playing the game they are. They know that in all likelihood we will sell in the end. And teh upside for them is that they don't even need him, and will be getting a world class player on the cheap. Meanwhile, our misguided efforts to get market price are playing havoc with our close season.

- A stepping stone. I don't believe that we are a true destination club ATM. This is why its easy to believe that Jagielka would rather stay put. We have a reputation for giving unknown/young players a break and rewarding them handsomely - but the most ambitious of them will invitably be tempted elsewhere.

- Serial under-achievers. I'm not sure that we deserve this rep, because IMHO AW has over-achieved with the players/funds at his disposal - but nevertheless we are seen as a team that will always fall short - whether it be the CL final; the CC final or the league

The end of last season and this transfer window has done nothing but double underline the above. Yet while decisive action is necessary to do something about the club's nose-diving reputation, we are giving every impression of fiddling while Rome burns - and the problem is that even a couple of signings now will make no difference to this perception.

We seem so small time it hurts!