Wenger Referendum: Yes Or No

[fakeyank]

It wouldnt surprise me if Wenger is pissed off at Sanchez for being direct. Sanchez must be considering Euthanasia playing the style of football we play.

[Injury Time]

It wouldnt surprise me if Wenger is pissed off at Sanchez for being direct. Sanchez must be considering Euthanasia playing the style of football we play.
Oh great so he's linked to an Eastern Bloc team already!

[Dein-machine]

The news of new contracts being offered to Giroud & Arteta are exactly the reason why Wenger has to go. We have to have better than Giroud or Arteta to compete at top level, none of the other top teams in England or Europe would have either of these in their teams.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Giroud is an excellent back up but Arteta is woeful. The thought of him being at the heart of our midfield for another 2 years is soul destroying and worrying.

[Bumble]

Giroud is an excellent back up but Arteta is woeful. The thought of him being at the heart of our midfield for another 2 years is soul destroying and worrying.Arteta is way past his best, and what happened to the policy of getting rid of over 30s...... if Pires wasn't offered a longer deal then no way should arteta!!

giroud is a bit shit. but decent 3rd choice.

[selassie]

The stadium move was a good thing but I have a problem with anyone saying we needed it to stay Top 4. Sounds like we’re on the same page with that one, so that can be skipped.

The teams below us catching up to us….I just don’t think they were ever good enough at the time. Wenger is a much better manager than the guys managing the lower teams and we had better players regardless of price tags. I guess you can call that credit. But if he’d ever finish below Harry, Moyes, AVB…I’d see that as more of an underachievement on our end. Like a great upset. Like Tyson losing to Buster Douglas and the story that follows is how off our game we were rather than our foes being that good and equal. This season and last season are different and now I think we’ll truly be tested for the Top 4 spot because there are 5 genuine teams that can really push for spots. Years before, there were only ever 3 consistent top teams or 4 at most.

Also, the financial constraints…honestly, I don’t think Wenger used his resources wisely. This season and last are an example of that.

:gp:

The part I have highlighted I have thought for a while, Wenger simply doesn't use his resources wisely and their are countless examples to backup the claim, stuff such as refusing to pay an extra million or two to acquire our principal target, ignoring problem areas in the team, Central Midfield for a good few seasons, then the goalkeeper issue, even Central Defence was a major problem for a while. I don't think now and didn't think then the solution was to spend like "Chelsea", it was more about squad management, planning and as you say using the resources wisely.

Ironically we now have money and he still isn't spending it efficiently or wisely! We all know what the problems are.

[I am invisible]

I don't know, I can still see the value in keeping Arteta and other older players around the place, even if it's largely for the benefit of younger / newer players, so they know what kind of professional standards are expected (plus it sends out a good message to any peak-players that we're looking to sign that there's long-term security at this club, and that we take care of our own)? The only problems I see with this arrangement are a) if we end up keeping players on massive salaries, when they're not playing enough to justify it, and b) if we start using it as a reason not to further invest in certain areas of the side (but that one's not really the fault of the player, or even the policy of keeping over 30s on)...

[Dein-machine]

I don't know, I can still see the value in keeping Arteta and other older players around the place, even if it's largely for the benefit of younger / newer players, so they know what kind of professional standards are expected (plus it sends out a good message to any peak-players that we're looking to sign that there's long-term security at this club, and that we take care of our own)? The only problems I see with this arrangement are a) if we end up keeping players on massive salaries, when they're not playing enough to justify it, and b) if we start using it as a reason not to further invest in certain areas of the side (but that one's not really the fault of the player, or even the policy of keeping over 30s on)...

There is NO value in doing this - it simply clogs up the squad, wastes good money on wages & gives Wenger the excuse not to have to buy because he has third rate cover on the bench - this costs us games like it did on Sat having to bring Flamini on who is no better than a Sunday morning park player. Wenger has consistently kept players in the squad when he knows deep down they are not good enough to take us forward. Flamini, Podolski, Rosicky & the Swede with the bad back are simply not good enough for a team with top ambitions. I would add Arteta & Monreal to that list.

[Dein-machine]

Giroud is excellent back up for Stoke but not Arsenal. The football we play demands movement, pace & quality from the striker - Giroud has none of these, nor will he.
If we play more direct he could be useful but can you see that under Wenger?

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I think Sanchez did lack a bit of confidence when he first came into the side, every time he was required to do anything but keep the ball on the floor the ball was overcooked.
If Wenger didn't like players with raw pace he wouldn't have signed Welbeck, Oxlade Chamberlain, Walcott etc so this stuff about drilling in tippy tappy nonsense is nonsense. We play that stuff because we have no real pace in central midfield and because apart from Wilshere, Ozil, Rosicky nobody really has the ability in our central midfield to do one touch passing as opposed to two or three touches.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

The news of new contracts being offered to Giroud & Arteta are exactly the reason why Wenger has to go. We have to have better than Giroud or Arteta to compete at top level, none of the other top teams in England or Europe would have either of these in their teams.

Keeping Arteta and Giroud in the squad are no brainers imo.

Arteta especially is very well respected by everyone at the club and is a great role model for the youngsters according to most of the reports I've read emanating from the club. When Sanchez first arrived in the country, it was Arteta who went out of his way to make sure he was settled in properly. Additionally, him and Per are the two mainly responsible for creating the new healthy atmosphere and culture among the squad. Things used to be bad several years ago when you had all the different cliques and dressing room cancers like Gallas, RVC, Adebayor, Bendtner etc etc ................ it should be a lot more noticeable now how well everyone gets on now.

Don't see why we couldn't do a Rosicky on him and use him for squad depth and experience. Honestly think it would be extremely shortsighted to get rid of him.

Now Flamini on the other hand can fuck off. Useless mercenary twat who's long past his best.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Arteta especially is very well respected by everyone at the club and is a great role model for the youngsters according to most of the reports I've read emanating from the club. When Sanchez first arrived in the country, it was Arteta who went out of his way to make sure he was settled in properly. Additionally, him and Per are the two mainly responsible for creating the new healthy atmosphere and culture among the squad. Things used to be bad several years ago when you had all the different cliques and dressing room cancers like Gallas, RVC, Adebayor, Bendtner etc etc ................ it should be a lot more noticeable now how well everyone gets on now.

And for as long as Arteta is at the club we will not be winning the league.

Cut the sentimental crap. It's got us nowhere over the years.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

And for as long as Arteta is at the club we will not be winning the league.
Cut the sentimental crap. It's got us nowhere over the years.

I'm not saying he should be first choice DM, clearly he isn't good enough, but we shouldn't be forcing him out of the club either as he brings a lot of positives off the pitch which would be missed. We can still craft a role for him here that isn't first choice DM.

It's ridiculous to think that we couldn't win the league or the CL with Arteta as a backup squad midfielder to a more powerful and mobile World class DM.

[Fist of Lehmann]

I'm not saying he should be first choice DM, clearly he isn't good enough, but we shouldn't be forcing him out of the club either as he brings a lot of positives off the pitch which would be missed. We can still craft a role for him here that isn't first choice DM.

It's ridiculous to think that we couldn't win the league or the CL with Arteta as a backup squad midfielder to a more powerful and mobile World class DM.

It's an interesting question, you say Arteta clearly isn't good enough for first choice, but then how good should a second choice be? Given our propensity for injuries a second stringer might have to play anywhere between ten and forty games a season.

Was it Mourinho who talked about having 2 world class players for every position? It makes a lot of sense.
Two players of similar quality provide each other with competition, allow you to rest, rotate and cover for injuries with no significant loss of quality.

Arteta's off the field qualities are laudable, his conduct exemplary, and his contribution should be without question. But on the pitch he is waning fast and his increasing injuries make him an unreliable backup. You have weigh up whether what he can bring to the team as a whole at 33 years of age is worth a squad place and a 60k+ salary.

Oh and I thought we could have done with throwing a Giroud on late into the NLD, injury substitutions notwithstanding.

[Niall_Quinn]

Arteta is still one of the best passers in Europe, season after season. But he's also played out of position, season after season. He's been a good servant, putting up with Wenger's weirdness all this time. Aging now, true enough, but a shame so many fans can't show a bit of grace when it comes to a player who has served the club well. It's not about sentimental bullshit. We hate cunts like Cole and RvC when they jump ship, but some also seem to hate the guys who stick around.

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-matrix#premier_league/2014/2015/mikel_arteta/126/126/398/0/p|premier_league/2014/2015/fernando/126/126/9362/0/p|premier_league/2014/2015/nemanja_matic/126/126/9284/0/p#total_score/possession_score/total_passes/pass_completion/key_passes/assists/chances_created/avg_pass_length/tackles_won/interceptions/blocks/defensive_errors#total

The stats show where Arteta's strengths lie (as good as Alonso any day) and where his weaknesses lie. Wenger has dumped him in a position that plays to all his weaknesses. Arteta's fault?

Per 90 metrics are interesting too:
http://www.squawka.com/comparison-matrix#premier_league/2014/2015/mikel_arteta/126/126/398/0/p|premier_league/2014/2015/fernando/126/126/9362/0/p|premier_league/2014/2015/nemanja_matic/126/126/9284/0/p#total_score/possession_score/total_passes/pass_completion/key_passes/assists/chances_created/avg_pass_length/tackles_won/interceptions/blocks/defensive_errors#90

Last season - same story.
http://www.squawka.com/comparison-matrix#premier_league/2013/2014/mikel_arteta/126/64/398/0/p|premier_league/2013/2014/fernandinho/126/64/4958/0/p|premier_league/2013/2014/nemanja_matic/126/64/9284/0/p#total_score/possession_score/total_passes/pass_completion/key_passes/assists/chances_created/avg_pass_length/tackles_won/interceptions/blocks/defensive_errors#90

The idea Arteta is "shit" is just a fantasy, nothing more.

[Fist of Lehmann]

The idea Arteta is "shit" is just a fantasy, nothing more.

Aye, but one that serves the narrative quite well.

The 4-1-4-1 isn't doing us any favours either because it places such a heavy burden on the 1.

[Globalgunner]

Arteta is shit at being a DM.
Does that sound better?
He was never a DM until Wenger decided to shoehorn him into the position because he didn't have the guts to tell him there was no place for him in the AM line up and he couldn't just dump him. Wenger does this because, he can and because he knows after all his cock ups. He still gets 4th.

This is not a plug for Flamini either, he has a bit more energy, but is just as shit at the DM role.

[saintnickle]

That more than makes up for the summer transfer window.WOW all we need to do now is tie sanogo down to a new improved 5 year deal and we are good to go.Giroud arteta and sanogo on new deals,think how much we will get when barca and real come sniffing.Just shows the SUPER SUPER ambition of the club!!

[Letters]

18 years as manager today :bow:

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Arteta is shit at being a DM.
Does that sound better?
He was never a DM until Wenger decided to shoehorn him into the position because he didn't have the guts to tell him there was no place for him in the AM line up and he couldn't just dump him. Wenger does this because, he can and because he knows after all his cock ups. He still gets 4th.


Excellent post.

[Letters]

He was never a DM until Wenger decided to shoehorn him into the position because he didn't have the guts to tell him there was no place for him in the AM line up and he couldn't just dump him.
Wenger hardly played Vermaelan last season, who was captain. Why would he suddenly not be able to 'have the guts' to drop Arteta? :unsure:

[Power n Glory]

I'm not saying he should be first choice DM, clearly he isn't good enough, but we shouldn't be forcing him out of the club either as he brings a lot of positives off the pitch which would be missed. We can still craft a role for him here that isn't first choice DM.

It's ridiculous to think that we couldn't win the league or the CL with Arteta as a backup squad midfielder to a more powerful and mobile World class DM.

That's just it. Clearly he isn't good enough as you say, but why is Wenger handing him a new contract? I'm not sure he intends on keeping him as a backup squad player. He wasn't replaced in the summer and now a new deal is on the table for him. It's a worry.

[Dein-machine]

The Atreta situation is one that helps explain the issues that we have under Wenger. Rather than buy specialist players for important roles ie DM, he will ask a player to alter his game to fill a role for the team - Is he doing this because he really feels that Arteta for example can become a world class DM or is he doing it to save the £30 mill it would take to buy the correct player. Even this year when questioned by the media about his lack of CF options in light of Girouds injury, he came out with Podolski, Campbell, Walcott, Sonogo as options, even telling us he bought Sanchez as a striker which was crap because he didn't give him that role at all pre-season. You CANNOT play the likes of the Chavs, Mancs, Barca, Munich by putting someone upfront because he's not good enough to play ahead of others in his real position. We played Sonogo against the reigning ( at that time ) champions of Europe last year when he had hardly kicked a ball for us, something is seriously wrong when this happens.
The only way forward is to have quality players in every position, players that are strong enough, fast enough & clever enough for the roles they play. On top of that we need squad players of similar quality to allow rotation without affecting the team.
Arteta shouldn't even be considered as DM cover, he is too slow & not strong enough. Having Flamini as cover has cost us already this season - the proof is infront of Wenger's eyes.

[Fist of Lehmann]

Watched a little bit of Willy Carvalho last night.

He was not too great.

[LDG]

I seriously think Wenger is still pinning everything on a fit Diaby.

He's his man in that role.

It's mental, but I can understand in a weird way, as a fit Diaby is just what we want and need.

[Dein-machine]

I seriously think Wenger is still pinning everything on a fit Diaby.

He's his man in that role.

It's mental, but I can understand in a weird way, as a fit Diaby is just what we want and need.

But he never showed he was we want & need when he was fit. Too slow on the ball, weak decision maker & poor passer - we cannot compete trying to polish turds all the time, its another major weakness of Wenger.

[Globalgunner]

Wenger hardly played Vermaelan last season, who was captain. Why would he suddenly not be able to 'have the guts' to drop Arteta? :unsure:

Vermaelen was injured and lost his place. HE could see the combination of Merts and Kosc were ahead of him. Who is ahead of Arteta in that position. Flamini or a training cone. He dumps players he doesn't take a fancy to. But the players he likes as individuals he keeps them on even after they keep costing him points. The proof is in the pudding. Which crap player did Fergie ever keep playing in critical positions for purely sentimental reasons?

[Fist of Lehmann]

I seriously think Wenger is still pinning everything on a fit Diaby.

He's his man in that role.

It's mental, but I can understand in a weird way, as a fit Diaby is just what we want and need.

If you don't wince every time there is physical contact with Diaby you're a stronger man than I.

That role is one of the most physically demanding on the pitch, or can be, in terms of combined competing for the ball and yardage. I'm thinking of Schweinstiger in that role, running everything down, throwing himself into blocks and tackles, getting fouled constantly.

If we're going to play only 1 guy in there then he needs to be everywhere.

[LDG]

Vermaelean was injured and lost his place. HE could see the combination of Merts and Kosc were ahead of him. Who is ahead of Arteta in that position. Flamini or a traioning cone. He dumps players he dosent take a fancy to. But the players he likes as individuals he keeps them on even when they keep costing hiom points. The proof is in the pudding. Which crap player did Fergie ever keep playing in critical positions for sentimental reasons?
Rooney

[Globalgunner]

Rooney
Apparently you were not observant of the last 6 months of Fergies season
Rooney may be crap but he is head and shoulders above Giroud or Welbeck. So what are they?

[LDG]

Apparently you were not observant of the last 6 months of Fergies season

Jeeezus.

I was only fuckin joking.

[Letters]

I seriously think Wenger is still pinning everything on a fit Diaby.
:haha:

:ilt:, if so.

[I am invisible]

A lot of this Arteta rage feels like chucking the baby out with the bath water to me? If your problem with him is that you genuinely think he has no value whatsoever, and isn't capable of making any kind of contribution, even as an occasional squad player and mentor, then fair enough. But if your problem is more specifically with him being our first choice defensive midfielder, and us not signing anyone else to play there, then your problem is actually with Wenger.

Let's put it another way - if Wenger left tomorrow, and a new guy came in and bought a wizard-good DM in the januray window, would you still believe that Arteta should be ditched, or would you think he might still be a useful asset to keep around?

[Özil's Panoramic View]

We would still want him to be ditched. Such an average player has no business wearing an Arsenal shirt. Unless, of course, he bought one.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Jeeezus.

I was only fuckin joking.
You need to be clear about things like that on this hard hitting and incisive forum.

[Power n Glory]

A lot of this Arteta rage feels like chucking the baby out with the bath water to me? If your problem with him is that you genuinely think he has no value whatsoever, and isn't capable of making any kind of contribution, even as an occasional squad player and mentor, then fair enough. But if your problem is more specifically with him being our first choice defensive midfielder, and us not signing anyone else to play there, then your problem is actually with Wenger.

Let's put it another way - if Wenger left tomorrow, and a new guy came in and bought a wizard-good DM in the januray window, would you still believe that Arteta should be ditched, or would you think he might still be a useful asset to keep around?

Good point. Again, I have no problem with him being a back up squad player but like Verm, I doubt Wenger can make that sort of transition for a player. It’s a managerial problem. He can’t manage a big squad and once a player falls from the first team, he’ll leave them to rot on the bench and eventually let them leave. He just doesn’t make the best use of his squad and it’s partly why we get so many injuries.

[LDG]

:haha:

:ilt:, if so.

At least someone got it :(

:getcoat:

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

We would still want him to be ditched. Such an average player has no business wearing an Arsenal shirt. Unless, of course, he bought one.

Spot on.

Average in every aspect and the fact many of our fans are happy with him embodies the mediocre mindset that has taken over this club.

He can't tackle, has no physical presence, has crap distribution and has no real authority about his play. He's just another Denilson. But because he has this professional, obedient look about him which fits into the whole 'Arsenal ooze class' image we like to uphold, he's loved.

Bang average player.

[Niall_Quinn]

You need to be clear about things like that on this hard hitting and incisive forum.

Especially when talking to Henry Winter's illegitimate sproglet.

[LDG]

You need to be clear about things like that on this hard hitting and incisive forum.

Hang on. I need to consult my argument play book.

[Dein-machine]

A lot of this Arteta rage feels like chucking the baby out with the bath water to me? If your problem with him is that you genuinely think he has no value whatsoever, and isn't capable of making any kind of contribution, even as an occasional squad player and mentor, then fair enough. But if your problem is more specifically with him being our first choice defensive midfielder, and us not signing anyone else to play there, then your problem is actually with Wenger.

Let's put it another way - if Wenger left tomorrow, and a new guy came in and bought a wizard-good DM in the januray window, would you still believe that Arteta should be ditched, or would you think he might still be a useful asset to keep around?

Ditched - slows us down as an attacking force & has had he's best days. Need better than that now both as a 1st 11 player & reserve.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Ditched - slows us down as an attacking force & has had he's best days. Need better than that now both as a 1st 11 player & reserve.

Stop speaking sense.

[fakeyank]

A lot of this Arteta rage feels like chucking the baby out with the bath water to me? If your problem with him is that you genuinely think he has no value whatsoever, and isn't capable of making any kind of contribution, even as an occasional squad player and mentor, then fair enough. But if your problem is more specifically with him being our first choice defensive midfielder, and us not signing anyone else to play there, then your problem is actually with Wenger.

Let's put it another way - if Wenger left tomorrow, and a new guy came in and bought a wizard-good DM in the januray window, would you still believe that Arteta should be ditched, or would you think he might still be a useful asset to keep around?

I would keep Arteta in the squad. We have seen the effects of letting go some of the experienced players and then hoping the youngsters are just going to start leading the line. What happens in the dressing room is just as important as to what happens on the pitch. Utd kept a hold of Giggs, Scholes and Ferdinand way beyond their sell by date. Why? Because you cannot buy experience..

[Maestro]

is the match thread now just for the etonians? why is it closed/shut to some of us?

[Letters]

I wondered why no-one was posting in there. No idea :unsure:

[adzzzbatch]

Fucked us over big time today :ilt:

[gunnerrrrr]

I have no idea how anyone can any longer support Wenger as manager.

After the plastering we took last year, here we are again, completely out thought by a superior manager (yes he is a cunt and yes the ref has been shit).

He has to leave the club, utterly utterly clueless.

Look at the batterings he has taken in big games recently...8-2. 6-3. 5nil etc etc etc .... which other world class manager, on the money he is on, has such a shocking record in the big games.

He is mugging us all off.

[Marc Overmars]

You'd think after so many years of constant disappointment in these games he would have figured out an effective way to approach them, but no.

He's got to be one of the weakest "big game" managers in the business.

[Darknight02]

Fcuk off Wenger.

No trophy will make me want to keep him.

Just can't bear watching football with Wenger in charge of us.

Seeing that fcuking pass from Cesc just makes me so sad.

[selassie]

We won't win PL again if we stick with Arsene. There are too many superior managers around. Mourinho completely has his number, Arsene is his bitch.

[adzzzbatch]

Fcuk off Wenger.

No trophy will make me want to keep him.

Just can't bear watching football with Wenger in charge of us.

Seeing that fcuking pass from Cesc just makes me so sad.

He plays for a bunch of cunts now, but I feel the same the quality he as is amazing, should have acted on the clause.

[Globalgunner]

He can't win the CL
He can't win the PL
He can' t win the CC
He can win the FA Cup
Reasons to be cheerful

[Xhaka Can’t]

We won't win PL again if we stick with Arsene. There are too many superior managers around. Mourinho completely has his number, Arsene is his bitch.
Nah - Arsene is the set of hotel curtains Mourinho uses to wipe his cock dry after seeing to his bitches.

[mastermind84]

As for the Wumget, he is finished tactically and dont even know it. He is done, imo but no one is going to tell him he is done at the club so we are stuck.

my positions is unchanged

[Ernesto]

Where do people stand on his spat with the C*nt today?

Do you think he had it coming after many years of very personal jibes against Wenger (something he, notably, avoids with any other manager)?

Or do you think Wenger has become à liability? After history with Pardew, Jol and Ferguson, is he letting himself down on something the club and the média take the most pride in- Wenger's intelligence and class?

[Marc Overmars]

He had it coming because he is a nasty piece of work.

[Xhaka Can’t]

It is the only good thing Wenger did today.

Maureen looked like he shat his frilly knickers.

[Globalgunner]

Mourinho is the scum of the earth. But a man who has at his disposal the means to avoid humiliation, but can't bring himself to flex enough to dodge what's coming deserves a shit pie in the face.

[Niall_Quinn]

Where do people stand on his spat with the C*nt today?

Do you think he had it coming after many years of very personal jibes against Wenger (something he, notably, avoids with any other manager)?

Or do you think Wenger has become à liability? After history with Pardew, Jol and Ferguson, is he letting himself down on something the club and the média take the most pride in- Wenger's intelligence and class?

Maureen is the worst scum to ever slither into the game. Whatever happens to him, provided it is bad, he thoroughly deserves it.

[Munchies]

Maureen is the worst scum to ever slither into the game. Whatever happens to him, provided it is bad, he thoroughly deserves it.

:gp:

We keep fucking losing to the cunt though. Im pissed off

[Niall_Quinn]

We need a nice, calm, carefully thought out and properly planned replacement of the manager. Not some circus event. I'm hoping the board is savvy enough to already be on the case. If it takes another season so be it, provided we get the right man.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

3 more years of this shit. Of utter stagnation and embarrassments.

[Ralpheroo72]

Cant stand seeing him or hearing him, same shit different season. I would like to see Klopp as the new man in charge. You would imagine given the money we have now, he would spend it on what we need, and sell Ozil.

[Gooner23]

He needs to go, but he won't resign or get sacked so no debate really.

[Niall_Quinn]

It's a catch-22. We don't have a sugar daddy who dumps huge wads of cash into the club we instead have a manager who is highly focused on the financial side of things and fits everything to that model. He's done that job excellently, better than anyone else could do it. This is why he is coveted by all the big clubs around Europe. On the other hand, because the focus is shifted from the fine details of what happens on the pitch we are inferior in every respect to those managers who are 100% concentrated on getting results. Even with decent players now being brought in as a result of the financial upturn there is a clear deficit that's spelled out by the atrocious record against the top teams. But had we not concentrated on the financials we wouldn't have the players and around it goes. It has taken a decade to put the club into a position where we can compete to some degree with the dopers. For the first time we are in a position to be able to think about bringing in a manager who doesn't have to worry about finances and can concentrate exclusively on the team. This is what I hope is in progress, a shift to a top quality coach instead of an accountant who also manages the team.

[selassie]

It's a catch-22. We don't have a sugar daddy who dumps huge wads of cash into the club we instead have a manager who is highly focused on the financial side of things and fits everything to that model. He's done that job excellently, better than anyone else could do it. This is why he is coveted by all the big clubs around Europe. On the other hand, because the focus is shifted from the fine details of what happens on the pitch we are inferior in every respect to those managers who are 100% concentrated on getting results. Even with decent players now being brought in as a result of the financial upturn there is a clear deficit that's spelled out by the atrocious record against the top teams. But had we not concentrated on the financials we wouldn't have the players and around it goes. It has taken a decade to put the club into a position where we can compete to some degree with the dopers. For the first time we are in a position to be able to think about bringing in a manager who doesn't have to worry about finances and can concentrate exclusively on the team. This is what I hope is in progress, a shift to a top quality coach instead of an accountant who also manages the team.

:gp:

[topgun]

Unfortunately Wenger will probably be asked to nominate his successor when he does finally decide move on.

[Bumble]

Unfortunately Wenger will probably be asked to nominate his successor when he does finally decide move on.
Like Ferguson did and look how that turned out.

You don't need a sugar daddy to spend loads of money to be competitive in individual matches. Perhaps over the season there is a benefit but the games are still 11 v 11. We never looked like scoring. We never really look like scoring against Chelsea.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Cant stand seeing him or hearing him, same shit different season. I would like to see Klopp as the new man in charge. You would imagine given the money we have now, he would spend it on what we need, and sell Ozil.

I think Klopp is someone who proves that success is ephemeral.

Frankly I doubt many Dortmund fans are too happy with the job he's doing at the moment

[PGFC]

Cant stand seeing him or hearing him, same shit different season. I would like to see Klopp as the new man in charge. You would imagine given the money we have now, he would spend it on what we need, and sell Ozil.


I think Klopp is someone who proves that success is ephemeral.

Frankly I doubt many Dortmund fans are too happy with the job he's doing at the moment

:good: Be careful what you wish for...

[Maestro]

We need a nice, calm, carefully thought out and properly planned replacement of the manager. Not some circus event. I'm hoping the board is savvy enough to already be on the case. If it takes another season so be it, provided we get the right man.

From the look of things, that process is likely to involve Wenger. Either him being made aware that's what the club is doing or him having hands-on involvement.

[1_nilto the arsenal]

I can almost believe without a shadow of a doubt, that if Klopp managed the same the players that Wenger has at his disposal we would be champions of England and Europe.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I can almost believe without a shadow of a doubt, that if Klopp managed the same the players that Wenger has at his disposal we would be champions of England and Europe.

Really???

Don't get me wrong we have some fantastic players in certain positions but it's also a very unbalanced squad...yes Wenger is responsible for that obviously but you can't square the circle of having six defenders in your squad and having flamini and arteta as your defensive midfielders.

[Marc Overmars]

I think Klopp is someone who proves that success is ephemeral.




Didn't know what that meant but Google tells me it's short term, not sure what you mean by it though.

He's the one manager in Europe who has done a similar job to Wenger and should rightly be considered as a successor. He's been there for 6 years and turned them from also rans into one of the most revered teams in Europe, unearthing several bargain players on the way as well. Ok they've seen a drop off in performance but they're obviously going through a transition having lost key players and needing to compete with a club who can bludgeon their way to the top. Sound familiar?

Ironically Wenger had about 6-7 years of success before the quality dropped as well.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

From the look of things, that process is likely to involve Wenger. Either him being made aware that's what the club is doing or him having hands-on involvement.

It's hard to say, i don't think Wenger had any involvement in appointing Andries Jonker or Shad Forsythe.

This to me suggests he is acknowledging that this is his final contract and that it's for the club to build for the future. Will he be consulted on a replacement?...quite possibly but let's face it who ever comes in will be their own man.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Didn't know what that meant but Google tells me it's short term, not sure what you mean by it though.

He's the one manager in Europe who has done a similar job to Wenger and should rightly be considered as a successor. He's been there for 6 years and turned them from also rans into one of the most revered teams in Europe, unearthing several bargain players on the way as well. Ok they've seen a drop off in performance but they're obviously going through a transition having lost key players and needing to compete with a club who can bludgeon their way to the top. Sound familiar?

Ironically Wenger had about 6-7 years of success before the quality dropped as well.


True you can't really say much until the end of the season, but Dortmund's current form is quite worrying and they haven't lost the volume of players we did under Wenger. But success is ephemeral, and really in the last season or so Dortmund have looked average.

[1_nilto the arsenal]

I really do believe Klopp is the future for Arsenal. He's just gone a little stale at Dortmund and has taken them as far as he can. He has proven success in the Bundesliga and Champions League. I am almost certain 100% this Arsenal squad would be the team to beat this season. He will deliver us not only the league championship but our first European Cup, thats how good he is. He will tear Moureen apart tactical and knowledge wise. With the money at his disposal we could enjoy a decade of success and being the top club in the premier league and Europe.

[1_nilto the arsenal]

Didn't know what that meant but Google tells me it's short term, not sure what you mean by it though.

He's the one manager in Europe who has done a similar job to Wenger and should rightly be considered as a successor. He's been there for 6 years and turned them from also rans into one of the most revered teams in Europe, unearthing several bargain players on the way as well. Ok they've seen a drop off in performance but they're obviously going through a transition having lost key players and needing to compete with a club who can bludgeon their way to the top. Sound familiar?

Ironically Wenger had about 6-7 years of success before the quality dropped as well.:good: They tore us apart and they play by far some of the best attacking football in Europe having lost their best players, they still produce and give 150%. Klopp is the man that can shootdown Chelsea and City.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

they tore us apart because we were shit, i think Hartlepool would have torn us apart the way we performed in Dortmund.

[Bumble]

Does it have to be a big name. Wenger was a nobody and has had three terrific seasons in 18 years. Even in our penny pinching days our wages Bill was always top four.

Wenger will leave in next few years so there needs to be a plan in place and if it is bould I am ok with that. But for anyone to suggest no one can do it better, is ludicrous and we aren't talking about James Bond.

[selassie]

Klopp would still be a great choice for me, he's struggling a bit this season but he has still built great squads with small budgets. I also like how they play.

Rudi Garcia at Roma seems to be doing great work, I have been really impressed with the Job he has done there, he has built a really decent team, lots of good young talents like Iturbe mixed in with veterans like Totti and Maicon.

He also has players like Gervinho playing at a really high level. I watched Roma the other week against Man City and they more than matched them, was very impressed, I really liked the football they played too, really high tempo passing game.

[mr_brighterside]

would love Klopp

if we could get guardiola on the 'not won this league' basis then I'd be seriously chuffed

[Bumble]

Gazidis has stated arsenals biggest challenge is replacing Wenger when he leaves. Well by the sounds of it it won't happen any time soon so I expect the prep done now for a couple of years time.

It would be good if they were already in the set up to aid continuity.

Picking a new manager there is no guarantee of success but hopefully like when Wenger joined he had a defence ready made for him so he could focus on attack which is his strength. Now any new guy would need to focus on the defence as attacking wise the players are already in place. Also the new manager could do with bringing an actual magic sponge.

[Power n Glory]

The signs are there that we're preparing for life after Wenger and beefing up the backroom staff so we're not so dependent on one individual and his small inner circle.

[Dein-machine]

Wouldn't it seem sensible to bring in someone who fits the bill, with the backing of Wenger, but to also move Wenger into a role whereby the new guy has Wengers experience close by should he need it. It would be made clear that Wenger has no hold over him whatsoever but was simply in place to make a smooth transition. I wonder if the Moyes situation would have been better had Fergie been given a similar role. I understand new managers will want to make their own stamp on things & if we bring in a Guardiola or a Klopp then its not an issue but if we go for a lesser name ( like Wenger was when we bought him in ) then it may be beneficial. I would expect however the new manager to want to make an immediate improvement on Wengers weak points ie Squad stength, transfers & match day tactics without consulting Wenger. Wenger seems to like being involved in the commercial interests of the club so surely we could find him a role in this aspect.
As we've given him a contract with another 2 years, this won't help short term but it could be discussed with him now & suitable managers who's contracts are due to be looked at in 2016 could be notified.

[Globalgunner]

Best not to keep Wenger for any reason. If hes gone . Hes gone. You can imagine him trying to persuade the new manager not to buy a particular player because he is 2m too expensive or some crap like that, besides any new manager knows its his head on the block and will likely insist on being given a free hand. I heard that Fergie counselled Moyes not to disband the United back room staff, but Moyes insisted. If true, kudos to Moyes for standing up to Fergie, but in hindsight he was a fool for not listening. Either way, the debacle is all his fault. So it should be. We must learn to sink or swim without Wenger. There are a lot of great candidates out there and 2017 would be a great time to grab the former Juventus manager, now managing Italy Antonio Conte. He would be my first choice, Or Klopp or of course Guardiola.

[mastermind84]

Fergie hired Moyes and did all you suggested. That was probably the issue with Moyes more than anything.

[fakeyank]

Klopp's contract is till 2018 supposedly. Wenger's is till 2017. Frankly, I'd take Martinez and let him build the club... he has all the makings of a top level manager.

[AFC Leveller]

Wenger loves the club (and the control he has) to just walk away when his contract expires and i dont expect him to leave for good. I think they'll offer him a job of some kind and probably let him have a say in who comes in for him.

Right now, someone like Martinez would be good but he has only shown potential so far and the next couple of years should tell us if he is the real deal or not. Not too long ago, the likes of Coyle and Phil brown were manager of the season candidates but where are they now? it can all turn around ina year or so.

The likes of Klopp, Guardiola, Conte, Simeone however have shown consistancy and the ability to win major titles and anyone of these would be a real coup.

[Power n Glory]

I wouldn't want Wenger to take a job upstairs when his time as manager is over and I doubt he'd take the position anyway. As a manager, he always says he enjoys the way the club is run because he's left to work and nobody interferes. I think he'd recognise that taking on a position upstairs would be counterproductive and possibly do more damage than good.

[fakeyank]

Wenger loves the club (and the control he has) to just walk away when his contract expires and i dont expect him to leave for good. I think they'll offer him a job of some kind and probably let him have a say in who comes in for him.

Right now, someone like Martinez would be good but he has only shown potential so far and the next couple of years should tell us if he is the real deal or not. Not too long ago, the likes of Coyle and Phil brown were manager of the season candidates but where are they now? it can all turn around ina year or so.

The likes of Klopp, Guardiola, Conte, Simeone however have shown consistancy and the ability to win major titles and anyone of these would be a real coup.

I really do not rate Guardiola. I want him to win something without having top players everywhere who have won everything in sight. Simeone does not seem like someone who will stick around for too long at a club, though I think he give a right bollocking to lazy pricks in our team (refer to a certain German international), Conte and Klopp are a good shout.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Wenger loves the club (and the control he has) to just walk away when his contract expires and i dont expect him to leave for good. I think they'll offer him a job of some kind and probably let him have a say in who comes in for him.

Right now, someone like Martinez would be good but he has only shown potential so far and the next couple of years should tell us if he is the real deal or not. Not too long ago, the likes of Coyle and Phil brown were manager of the season candidates but where are they now?



http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00810/tom-brown682_810858a.jpg

Phil is on the road with Tom Jones.

[Penguin]

I would take Guardiola but not as my first choice. I would rather have someone like Klopp who would give us a different and more direct style of football than we have had in Wenger's reign (or at least in his last decade, we used to play some stunningly quick counter attacking football).

[Xhaka Can’t]

From the perspective of a fan, Wenger's position has to be untenable now.

I desperately wanted him to leave on a high for all he did for the Club over early years and transition to the new season. He had the opportunity to do that with the FA Cup win.

That he didn't is his problem, it shouldn't be ours. I want him gone, don't care how it happens now.

[Niall_Quinn]

He can't want to lose - so what the fuck is up with him? Why can't he see something and then remember it the next time? Why has he developed this fanatical hatred of entertaining football?

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

I don't like Guardiola's quite public proclamations towards short termism as a modus operandi in management. Basically he only takes on short term projects and moves on.

If Klopp doesn't hall his team out of where they currently are in their league, then all bets are off. That is entirely unlikely but the longer it continues the dodgier it looks. It would be like Wenger steering us to where QPR currently are.....or getting us relegated.

I would be happy with a manager I'd never heard of if he came with a high repute within football circles.

[Marc Overmars]

It's so hard to defend him, anything positive you can say is worthless because it's purely sentimental now. There's nothing to suggest this team is going to improve and become more coherent and effective.

He is holding us back, without a doubt.

[selassie]

It's so hard to defend him, anything positive you can say is worthless because it's purely sentimental now. There's nothing to suggest this team is going to improve and become more coherent and effective.

He is holding us back, without a doubt.

Yep totally agree.

I really hope he walks at the end of the season.

[topgun]

It's so hard to defend him, anything positive you can say is worthless because it's purely sentimental now. There's nothing to suggest this team is going to improve and become more coherent and effective.

He is holding us back, without a doubt.

Agreed but the guy is so stubborn I can,t see him going without a little push.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

It's so hard to defend him, anything positive you can say is worthless because it's purely sentimental now. There's nothing to suggest this team is going to improve and become more coherent and effective.

He is holding us back, without a doubt.

I would agree, we are certainly not going to improve with him as manager

However the AGM leaves me quite pessimistic that any real positive change will happen with someone else

I just think to an extent the board do withhold funds even now, and I'm not convinced a new guy would get the necessary financial backing in order to do what needs to be done

Our Majority share holder is nothing but a Robber Baron


Hope I'm wrong

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Agreed but the guy is so stubborn I can,t see him going without a little push.

Hmmm I think he wanted to go last season, I think it's the board that are keen for him to stay and I wouldn't be surprised if they try and persuade him to stay after 2017

Sorry to make you even more depressed

[Dein-machine]

That is why I stated that winning the FA cup last year has probably fucked us for the foreseeable future. I think the silverware has fed his delusional ideals that he was right all along, you can win things on the cheap & with very little tactical nous.
It really is a shame because I honestly don't want to guy to become a hate figure. The board have to take responsibility for the new contract - its like not wanting to put your beloved dad in a old folks home, so you keep him at home when you really don't have room for him.

[Özim]

Hmmm I think he wanted to go last season, I think it's the board that are keen for him to stay and I wouldn't be surprised if they try and persuade him to stay after 2017

Sorry to make you even more depressed

I can't see why you'd say he wanted to go, he gave no indication of this.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I can't see why you'd say he wanted to go, he gave no indication of this.

I'm saying that because he waited until his contract had almost expired before he signed a new one when in the past a contract extension had been signed 18 months before the expiry of his existing deal

His body language on the touchline was that of a frustrated and unhappy figure, he's a deluded figure and since David Dein buggered off after bringing us the double kick in the balls of Kroenke and Usmanov felt like he had to take on the role of Atlas and do everything himself and the greedy, incompetent laissez faire board let him do it.

I'm not saying I'm definitely right, but I think part of him feels in signing a new contract he's doing the board a favour.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

And yes in case you're wondering I think last season would have been the perfect time for him to go and I wish he had

[Marc Overmars]

No one can say with a straight face that he is doing a good job anymore, I want him gone before this contract is up. He's tainting his legacy every additional year he remains at the helm.

Gazidis needs to earn his money here.

[selassie]

I'm saying that because he waited until his contract had almost expired before he signed a new one when in the past a contract extension had been signed 18 months before the expiry of his existing deal

His body language on the touchline was that of a frustrated and unhappy figure, he's a deluded figure and since David Dein buggered off after bringing us the double kick in the balls of Kroenke and Usmanov felt like he had to take on the role of Atlas and do everything himself and the greedy, incompetent laissez faire board let him do it.

I'm not saying I'm definitely right, but I think part of him feels in signing a new contract he's doing the board a favour.

Well he gets paid 8 million pounds a year to experiment and use the team as some kind of "personal" project. It's not just about the nasty board. He's in a very privileged position IMO.

I'll tell you one thing, Wenger wouldn't get away with this in any other leading European team or any of our top 4 rivals, he knows this too.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Well he gets paid 8 million pounds a year to experiment and use the team as some kind of "personal" project. It's not just about the nasty board. He's in a very privileged position IMO.

I'll tell you one thing, Wenger wouldn't get away with this in any other leading European team or any of our top 4 rivals, he knows this too.

Apart from City, United or Chelsea...Wenger would have kept his job

Despite our increased spending power we are in a lower financial tier to these clubs

I've no doubt his bumper salary and the lack of accountability is a big pull for him, but i cant believe the fan abuse (justified abuse) and probably knowing deep down he can't hack it anymore wasn't responsible for him waiting till the last minute to sign a new contract.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

No one can say with a straight face that he is doing a good job anymore, I want him gone before this contract is up. He's tainting his legacy every additional year he remains at the helm.

Gazidis needs to earn his money here.

Gazidis is interested in self preservation

What incentive does he have to put the boot in on the manager, when the manager has the unquestioned backing of the chairman and the majority shareholder and the majority shareholders son (a trinity of for fuck sake)

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

That is why I stated that winning the FA cup last year has probably fucked us for the foreseeable future. I think the silverware has fed his delusional ideals that he was right all along, you can win things on the cheap & with very little tactical nous.
It really is a shame because I honestly don't want to guy to become a hate figure. The board have to take responsibility for the new contract - its like not wanting to put your beloved dad in a old folks home, so you keep him at home when you really don't have room for him.

You should see the state of the carpet in the VIP lounge when Old Uncle Arsene keeps having accidents

[Power n Glory]

Hebert – Last season you were saying we didn’t have the funds to buy a striker and bulk up the squad in the January because we had spent all our money on Ozil. This year the excuse for Wenger is the Board hanging him out to dry and he’s doing them a ‘favour’ by signing an extension. Really? We’re supposed to feel sorry for him as if he’s being forced to do this ‘shitty job’? I’ve heard it all. Excuse after excuse.

[Power n Glory]

Gazidis is interested in self preservation

What incentive does he have to put the boot in on the manager, when the manager has the unquestioned backing of the chairman and the majority shareholder and the majority shareholders son (a trinity of for fuck sake)

Gazidis has removed himself from the spotlight. Wenger's used the 'financial restriction' argument for yeas and that had placed Gazidis directly in the crosshair of angry fans. Now, since he's done the new sponsorship deals and made it very public, there can be no more excuses from Wenger. The financial part of the game is Ivan's domain and he's delivering. The backroom staff, the injury problems, he's hired new blood so Wenger can't say we're not doing enough to support him in that area either.

The board would often tell the fans Wenger had a 'war chest' and they'd look like complete tools when another window would pass without us spending. The assumption always was that they were holding funds back and poor poor old Wenger was powerless. Now look at last season and this season in particular and it says a lot. We have money and he's chosen not to spend in the right areas. Again. Even if he did spend, he has no idea how to rotate a squad and make use of what he has.

Gazdis has always said we don't restrict the manager and we have obvious limitations but do what we can to help. I believe that because why in the world would they risk pissing off their golden goose?

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Hebert – Last season you were saying we didn’t have the funds to buy a striker and bulk up the squad in the January because we had spent all our money on Ozil. This year the excuse for Wenger is the Board hanging him out to dry and he’s doing them a ‘favour’ by signing an extension. Really? We’re supposed to feel sorry for him as if he’s being forced to do this ‘shitty job’? I’ve heard it all. Excuse after excuse.

My comment was purely based on someone saying he will need to be pushed because he won't jump

My point is in his own deluded mind he is doing everyone a favour and not leaving us in the lurch, my point is that I don't think it would take much as people might think for him to go

It's not a case of not blaming Wenger, I'm just saying the main reason he is still here is that I believe Gazidis convinced him to stay, the board are 100% happy with him and
When Wenger goes they are still here with their questionable motives and judgement

I don't feel the slightest bit of sympathy for Wenger, but his attitude in press conferences seems to indicate a man that wouldn't need prising away

[selassie]

Apart from City, United or Chelsea...Wenger would have kept his job

Despite our increased spending power we are in a lower financial tier to these clubs

I've no doubt his bumper salary and the lack of accountability is a big pull for him, but i cant believe the fan abuse (justified abuse) and probably knowing deep down he can't hack it anymore wasn't responsible for him waiting till the last minute to sign a new contract.

They are our direct rivals.

Look I can accept that we have been financially handicapped in the past, not anymore. I accept that City & Chelsea have bigger budgets than us, what I dont accept is our manager continually neglecting areas of the team/squad. He literally had no excuses this summer not to strenghten the necessary problem positions. At the very least he should be making the requisite tactical changes to address the deficiences. The collapse like last night was all too common, wenger builds team that collapse like this. I dont even think he should be given time, things are not going to change with him in charge, his approach is too flawed.

[Power n Glory]

They are our direct rivals.

Look I can accept that we have been financially handicapped in the past, not anymore. I accept that City & Chelsea have bigger budgets than us, what I dont accept is our manager continually neglecting areas of the team/squad. He literally had no excuses this summer not to strenghten the necessary problem positions. At the very least he should be making the requisite tactical changes to address the deficiences. The collapse like last night was all too common, wenger builds team that collapse like this. I dont even think he should be given time, things are not going to change with him in charge, his approach is too flawed.

I still can't understand why he's not playing Chambers at CB and giving Bellerin a run at RB or at least Coquelin or Flamini if he wants some sort of experience there. At least they've actually played in the position.

Monreal doesn't even have the stature to play CB and has never played there before joining us. It makes no sense but it's the type of thing he does all the time.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

They are our direct rivals.

Look I can accept that we have been financially handicapped in the past, not anymore. I accept that City & Chelsea have bigger budgets than us, what I dont accept is our manager continually neglecting areas of the team/squad. He literally had no excuses this summer not to strenghten the necessary problem positions. At the very least he should be making the requisite tactical changes to address the deficiences. The collapse like last night was all too common, wenger builds team that collapse like this. I dont even think he should be given time, things are not going to change with him in charge, his approach is too flawed.

Apart from City and Chelsea I'd ask which teams in the summer addressed the deficiencies in their squad

It's not saying Wenger hasn't blundered because he has, unfortunately I believe in order to get the balanced squad we have been crying out for you need to have a budget like Chelsea or Man City

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I still can't understand why he's not playing Chambers at CB and giving Bellerin a run at RB or at least Coquelin or Flamini if he wants some sort of experience there. At least they've actually played in the position.

Monreal doesn't even have the stature to play CB and has never played there before joining us. It makes no sense but it's the type of thing he does all the time.

The decision to send Jenkinson on loan seems an incredibly strange one

Fair enough if you were going to make more defensive signings but we didnt

I'd rather see Chambers at centre back than at right back as well, but nothing I've seen of Bellerin makes me confident of him at right back.

Mertesacker also needs to be dropped but we can't do it.

[Globalgunner]

I still can't understand why he's not playing Chambers at CB and giving Bellerin a run at RB or at least Coquelin or Flamini if he wants some sort of experience there. At least they've actually played in the position.

Monreal doesn't even have the stature to play CB and has never played there before joining us. It makes no sense but it's the type of thing he does all the time.

He does it because he thinks he can get away with it and afterwards people will be praising his genius at getting by again without spending. He sees what Barcelona have done to some extent with Mascherano and thinks...Hey i can do that too. Firstly Mascherano is a supremely talented player but even he has his limitations there, secondly Barca are a much better team allround than us. Mascherano only gets found out when Barca play the best teams because Messi and co will blitz most teams to the point of rendering defence superfluous.

But most importantly it is an unnecessary complication of a simple solution. He needed a new defender to replace the experienced Vermaelen, but didnt buy one, only Chambers who he has played mostly at RB. Even Hayden would be better than Monreal at this time, give him the experience but better still buy a good enough 25 year old. There are plenty enough out there without having to list names. I seriously believe we missed a trick not buying Diame who left West ham for a pittance. He has all the attributes to play anywhere in midfield. but no. He wants to make sure his favourites play and play ALL the time. This is the same manager who will trot out excuses like tiredness. WTF!. You play the same 11 in literally every game and you claim they could be tired. I will not be surprised if he doesnt buy a defender in January, especially if Koscielny comes back. He will then conclude that a new defender isnt needed.

[Globalgunner]

Apart from City and Chelsea I'd ask which teams in the summer addressed the deficiencies in their squad

It's not saying Wenger hasn't blundered because he has, unfortunately I believe in order to get the balanced squad we have been crying out for you need to have a budget like Chelsea or Man City

Seriously???. You need a billionaire before you can buy someone like Reid from W-ham or Caulker. Please if you accept that he's messed up stop finding excuses for him, especially ones that have little merit. Our 2 central defenders played at the WC, had little or no rest before this season and he still wouldn't buy a replacement for Vermaelen. You dont have to spend 30m in every position to have a great team. Teams on 1/5 of our budget have given Chelsea harder games than we ever could.

[Power n Glory]

Seriously???. You need a billionaire before you can buy someone like Reid from W-ham or Caulker. Please if you accept that he's messed up stop finding excuses for him, especially ones that have little merit. Our 2 central defenders played at the WC, had little or no rest before this season and he still wouldn't buy a replacement for Vermaelen. You dont have to spend 30m in every position to have a great team. Teams on 1/5 of our budget have given Chelsea harder games than we ever could.

It's a poor excuse. I could accept that argument if we looked comfortable dealing with the smaller teams but always came unstuck against our big spending rivals. But yesterday's result isn't even a shock anymore. It happens far top often and we'll struggle against any team that has a well thought out game plan.

Around the Cesc era, we had a season or two where we'd beat or put up a serious good fight against the big spenders but were very complacent against the lower league teams, so I don't think it's just a case of money. Even if Wenger had billions to spend in the window, he's spend it on the wrong sort of players, play them out of position or leave really good players on the bench until there is an all out mutiny. He'd never be able to cope with the sort of egos our rivals have to
cope with.

[fakeyank]

It's a poor excuse. I could accept that argument if we looked comfortable dealing with the smaller teams but always came unstuck against our big spending rivals. But yesterday's result isn't even a shock anymore. It happens far top often and we'll struggle against any team that has a well thought out game plan.

Around the Cesc era, we had a season or two where we'd beat or put up a serious good fight against the big spenders but were very complacent against the lower league teams, so I don't think it's just a case of money. Even if Wenger had billions to spend in the window, he's spend it on the wrong sort of players, play them out of position or leave really good players on the bench until there is an all out mutiny. He'd never be able to cope with the sort of egos our rivals have to
cope with.

Its always one or the other with this team, isnt it? When we play very well at home, we have a horrible away record and vice versa. When we have a good record against the big teams, we fail against the smaller teams or vice versa. The last time we were consistent was possibly 2005! And Wenger will always throw some random stat to show we did well and the supporters will lap it up like Jesus's words.
Bottom line is that we are not successful, neither do we play good football. So why are we sticking with this manager? He does not provide entertainment or success.. just generic excuses every season. Tired of him.

Just praying to Allah that the board grows some cojones!

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Seriously???. You need a billionaire before you can buy someone like Reid from W-ham or Caulker. Please if you accept that he's messed up stop finding excuses for him, especially ones that have little merit. Our 2 central defenders played at the WC, had little or no rest before this season and he still wouldn't buy a replacement for Vermaelen. You dont have to spend 30m in every position to have a great team. Teams on 1/5 of our budget have given Chelsea harder games than we ever could.

I'm confused, I think it's atrocious that we didnt sign a defender, if it was a money issue I think we should have signed a defender instead of Welbeck.

I simply asked you other than man city or Chelsea who has a completely balanced squad

In order to challenge for the title, we need two defenders, at least one world class defensive midfielder and a world class striker

Wenger has massively blundered in not sorting out our defence, but my point Is we weren't going to win the title anyway and fortunately Liverpool and United are so shit that his blundering won't cost us too badly

[rodders]

Unfortunately Arsenal are averse to rash decisions, if they are interested in a player they examine it from all possible angles then do it two or three times again. Having reached a decision the player has signed for another club.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Unfortunately Arsenal are averse to rash decisions, if they are interested in a player they examine it from all possible angles then do it two or three times again. Having reached a decision the player has signed for another club.

Pretty much

[selassie]

Apart from City and Chelsea I'd ask which teams in the summer addressed the deficiencies in their squad

It's not saying Wenger hasn't blundered because he has, unfortunately I believe in order to get the balanced squad we have been crying out for you need to have a budget like Chelsea or Man City

I don't know, all I care about is Arsenal.

Herbert, quit with this nonsense that you need billions to build balanced squads. We have 2 Senior Central Defenders, that's right 2! We sold our other Senior Central Defender and failed to replace him.

We haven't had a DM for years. Until we signed Welbeck we had Giroud and Sanogo as our First team Strikers. Wenger dithered for 3 seasons regarding buying a striker.

Wenger has wrecked the squad and loaded it with Attacking Midfielders, he's obsessed with them and buys Attacking Midfielders every single season. Our squad is woefully inbalanced and it has nothing to do with Money.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

The issue in many other squads is not one of balance it is more to do with quality and that is more prevalent the lower you go down. City and Chelsea are the only two who have the balance AND the quality. There's absolutely no reason why Manure couldn't have had the balance it looks like they need with the amount they spent and Liverpool are pretty balanced but are just behind on quality now. Suarez left and his replacements aren't as good as his shadow and captain Fantastic is getting on a little.

[Alpha]

No one is irreplaceable . If you can find a better manager to fill the gap , it is yes . But if it is a change just for the sake of it then , it is a no . Better the devil you know than the angel you don't , they say .

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view7/2552441/tapir-and-its-giant-penis-o.gif

[Özil's Panoramic View]

Is he still here?

[LDG]

Who, SWAYR?

Yeah :(

[Özil's Panoramic View]

:lol:

Good one.

[fakeyank]

I don't know, all I care about is Arsenal.


Plenty of Wenger backers use the 'If the neighbor dont have it and we dont have it, then we are good' excuses. We pay the highest ticket prices in Britain and we still have to pray that some other team fucks up. This season it is Chelsea and City, last season it was just City, the season before it was Utd and City, the season before it was someone else... never us! Our club is a sham right now.. right from the manager to his buddies in the boardroom.. they are fleecing the fans, and most of them are happily getting fleeced!! The more I think about it, the problem is not the board or the manager, it is the fans! Most of them can be fed anything and they will just happily 'take it'- typical middle class mentality.

[selassie]

I still can't understand why he's not playing Chambers at CB and giving Bellerin a run at RB or at least Coquelin or Flamini if he wants some sort of experience there. At least they've actually played in the position.

Monreal doesn't even have the stature to play CB and has never played there before joining us. It makes no sense but it's the type of thing he does all the time.

Me neither.

Oh I totally agree regarding Monreal, I actually thought Wenger was joking in pre-season when he stated Monreal could play there, I thought he was just saying it to deflect the attention away from him not buying a CB.

I am guessing we have no prospects coming through at CB otherwise they should have seen some kind of action or at least been on the bench.

[selassie]

Plenty of Wenger backers use the 'If the neighbor dont have it and we dont have it, then we are good' excuses. We pay the highest ticket prices in Britain and we still have to pray that some other team fucks up. This season it is Chelsea and City, last season it was just City, the season before it was Utd and City, the season before it was someone else... never us! Our club is a sham right now.. right from the manager to his buddies in the boardroom.. they are fleecing the fans, and most of them are happily getting fleeced!! The more I think about it, the problem is not the board or the manager, it is the fans! Most of them can be fed anything and they will just happily 'take it'- typical middle class mentality.

:gp:

Totally agree.

[Letters]

Plenty of Wenger backers
Who are the Wenger backers? We are pretty much all on the same page right now in that we need to move on from Wenger.
But it is possible to have that view and also think he's not the biggest c*** on Earth, not a bumbling idiot , not the most incompetent manager in football history and that not everything he does is ridiculous and incompetent.

There is NEVER a middle ground on here. I will defend him against some of the more extreme slating posted on here as I think it's way over the top.
That doesn't mean I think he's the best manager in world history (I do think he's the best manager in Arsenal history though) and should definitely stay at Arsenal forever and that when he dies I think he should be stuffed and remain manager (add your own joke about how we'd do better then)

It's also possible to think that Wenger should move on but that we shouldn't panic, sack him immediately and get any idiot in as pretty much anyone would do better.
That clearly isn't true. 6 months ago we won the cup and finished with our most points since 2008. Then we seemed to be buying well in the summer.
And yet it's all falling apart this year, we're all over the shop.

That said, for all our wobbling we're hardly in a crisis. We're still in the top 4. God alone knows how, everyone bar Chelsea seem to be awful this year.
We're only 3 points off City who have far more resources than us and despite Tuesday's embarrassment we'll almost certainly progress from our group, City still may but they're bottom of their group right now and haven't won a single CL game.

I think we'll finish top 4 this year and with the new financial deals in place we're in great shape for any other manager to take over. I think all the 'Wenger backers' are saying is that transition to a new manager needs to be managed carefully, especially having had a manager for so long - ManYoo are in a mess and their desperate attempts to buy their way out of trouble hasn't yielded results yet, although it may. We're not about to be relegated, we're still in the CL and will probably qualify again next year, we'll be able to pay a new manager very well. We're a very high profile side and will be an attractive proposition for most managers. We can afford to take our time and get it right.

[Dein-machine]

Who are the Wenger backers? We are pretty much all on the same page right now in that we need to move on from Wenger.
But it is possible to have that view and also think he's not the biggest c*** on Earth, not a bumbling idiot , not the most incompetent manager in football history and that not everything he does is ridiculous and incompetent.

There is NEVER a middle ground on here. I will defend him against some of the more extreme slating posted on here as I think it's way over the top.
That doesn't mean I think he's the best manager in world history (I do think he's the best manager in Arsenal history though) and should definitely stay at Arsenal forever and that when he dies I think he should be stuffed and remain manager (add your own joke about how we'd do better then)

It's also possible to think that Wenger should move on but that we shouldn't panic, sack him immediately and get any idiot in as pretty much anyone would do better.
That clearly isn't true. 6 months ago we won the cup and finished with our most points since 2008. Then we seemed to be buying well in the summer.
And yet it's all falling apart this year, we're all over the shop.

That said, for all our wobbling we're hardly in a crisis. We're still in the top 4. God alone knows how, everyone bar Chelsea seem to be awful this year.
We're only 3 points off City who have far more resources than us and despite Tuesday's embarrassment we'll almost certainly progress from our group, City still may but they're bottom of their group right now and haven't won a single CL game.

I think we'll finish top 4 this year and with the new financial deals in place we're in great shape for any other manager to take over. I think all the 'Wenger backers' are saying is that transition to a new manager needs to be managed carefully, especially having had a manager for so long - ManYoo are in a mess and their desperate attempts to buy their way out of trouble hasn't yielded results yet, although it may. We're not about to be relegated, we're still in the CL and will probably qualify again next year, we'll be able to pay a new manager very well. We're a very high profile side and will be an attractive proposition for most managers. We can afford to take our time and get it right.

You've moved on to a page most of us were on years ago. The trouble is your page is now one where Wenger should stay coz he's not that bad & we don't know who can replace him. My page is that he should never have been offered a new contract & he should have been replaced asap. He is NOT the biggest C*** on earth but he is becoming one, he was never a bumbling idiot but he is becoming one & he was never the most incompetent manager in history but he's trying bloody hard to get there.

There are simply no positives to him anymore, there is not a job in the world that you do better at 65 than you did at 55 - the arrogant trait that served him so well in the early years is now his biggest problem, won't buy quality to replace the obvious dross, still thinks you can challenge by bargain buying, doesn't have a plan B & is tactically a million miles away from what we need. He's comments mean nothing to me anymore because he doesn't talk sense, he talks in a guarded, paranoid manner which suggest a man who now knows he's fucked up for years & he is unable to do anything about it.

[Letters]

The trouble is your page is now one where Wenger should stay coz he's not that bad & we don't know who can replace him.
No, it isn't.

[Dein-machine]

No, it isn't.

Ok - We get the chance to take Paul Clements from Madrid next month & Wenger has agreed to a move upstairs to oversee other issues for a couple of years to see out his contract. Do we do it or not?

[Marc Overmars]

Paul Clement would be quite an interesting move, very left field. Not sure I'd like someone cutting their teeth with us though.

I do wonder if the fact he's English and working abroad is the only reason why he's been spoken about in high regard.

[Letters]

I have literally no idea who that is. Sorry, I really don't follow football that closely.
As a general principle though I'd be wary of changing managers mid-season.

[Dein-machine]

I have literally no idea who that is. Sorry, I really don't follow football that closely.
As a general principle though I'd be wary of changing managers mid-season.

You don't follow football that closely! - then I must apologise for some of my sarcastic responses to you in the past - should have realised that your views on the Mighty Wenger could only come from someone who's football knowledge was somewhat limited.
So, your general principle would be to NOT get rid of Wenger at the moment which I suggest equates to you wanting Wenger to stay - therefore you are not on the same page as most of us. How many more years do you want to waste?

[Letters]

So, your general principle would be to NOT get rid of Wenger at the moment which I suggest equates to you wanting Wenger to stay

Well no, those two things aren't the same. I don't want Wenger to stay, but I don't want us to do something which puts us in a worse position.
To pick up fakeyank's (not very good, IMO) analogy of someone in an abusive relationship, you might want to get out of said relationship but extricating yourself may not be simple, if it's a long relationship, and you don't want to do so on a way which leaves you in a worse position.

If you want Wenger to be gone NOW with no plan as to who to replace him with, so basically have a caretaker manager, then no we're not on the same page.
IMO that would put us in a worse position, at least in the short term, so I can't see any sense in it.

I'll ignore your childish first sentence...

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Ok - We get the chance to take Paul Clements from Madrid next month & Wenger has agreed to a move upstairs to oversee other issues for a couple of years to see out his contract. Do we do it or not?

Hmmm interesting proposition

I've read things about Paul Clement that make me think he'd suit us very well, but there is an air of uncertainty over a man who has never taken the reigns himself at club level

Basically I think this season is a write off anyway, if we wanted someone like Clement to replace Wenger I still think it'd be better to wait until the end of the season instead of chucking him in at the deep end.

[Dein-machine]

Well no, those two things aren't the same. I don't want Wenger to stay, but I don't want us to do something which puts us in a worse position.
To pick up fakeyank's (not very good, IMO) analogy of someone in an abusive relationship, you might want to get out of said relationship but extricating yourself may not be simple, if it's a long relationship, and you don't want to do so on a way which leaves you in a worse position.

If you want Wenger to be gone NOW with no plan as to who to replace him with, so basically have a caretaker manager, then no we're not on the same page.
IMO that would put us in a worse position, at least in the short term, so I can't see any sense in it.

I'll ignore your childish first sentence...

IMO whoever replaces Wenger has to see our obvious weaknesses & will have to address them. Even if Bouldy took over for the rest of the season he would have to strengthen us in Jan whereas I'm not sure Wenger will. With the quality already in the team strengthening us defensively inc a proper DM can only result in more points. Our football may change, become less tippy-tappy & more direct but again I think this would be good for us. IMO this would give us more chance of a top 4 finish than leaving Wenger to do fuck all in Jan to sort us out defensively & continue to shit himself against the big clubs & drop points to the pubbers.

[Dein-machine]

Hmmm interesting proposition

I've read things about Paul Clement that make me think he'd suit us very well, but there is an air of uncertainty over a man who has never taken the reigns himself at club level

Basically I think this season is a write off anyway, if we wanted someone like Clement to replace Wenger I still think it'd be better to wait until the end of the season instead of chucking him in at the deep end.

We should all know by now that every season Wenger is in charge is a write-off. We cannot progress under this man, i'm not interested in the fact that he finally won us a trophy last year - when it comes to the titles we're actually interested in we simply don't have the quality or tactics to compete.
I differ from you on the issue of putting a new guy in at the end of the year. If we are writing this season off already, which I do agree with, why would it be a problem. The worst that could happen is that his new style etc takes time to kick in & we may well lose out on a C.L. place, but this could happen under Wenger anyway. If a C.L. place means Wenger staying another year then its hardly worth being in it anyway.
If the new guy was given 5 months to bed in it would mean the transition had started, he could spend pre-season signing the players he needs, he would already have a squad used to his style of play & wouldn't then be starting a new season as a novice.

[Niall_Quinn]

We should all know by now that every season Wenger is in charge is a write-off.

Apart from last season.

[Dein-machine]

Apart from last season.

Why - because we won the FA Cup, pubing through the semi's & final, proudly taking over as holders from the mighty Wigan.

[Letters]

Why - because we won the FA Cup, pubing through the semi's & final, proudly taking over as holders from the mighty Wigan.

*sigh*

I went through this with someone else the other day but, in brief, the mighty Wigan beat City in the final which was a shock result.
And Portsmouth won it one time (vs Millwall, wasn't it?) in a freak season when none of the top sides made it to the final.
Every other year in recent memory it's been a top side winning it. Of course the nature of the cup, any cup, is that shock results can happen on the day which doesn't guarantee a top side winning it but in the last 20 years those are the only 2 notable exceptions to the rule that it always has been.
And we did play 3 of the top 6 on the way to the semi-final. All at home, granted, but we earned our place.
You can't beat Wenger with the stick of not winning trophies and then dismiss it when we do win one.

[Xhaka Can’t]

There is NEVER a middle ground here. I think he's the best manager in world history.

:eek:

[Letters]

Hoisted on my own petard :(

[Niall_Quinn]

Why - because we won the FA Cup, pubing through the semi's & final, proudly taking over as holders from the mighty Wigan.

Of course because we won the FA Cup. A write-off is when you throw something in the bin because zero value remains. Unless the FA Cup is perceived as having no value whatsoever then winning it means the season wasn't a write-off.

[Dein-machine]

*sigh*

I went through this with someone else the other day but, in brief, the mighty Wigan beat City in the final which was a shock result.
And Portsmouth won it one time (vs Millwall, wasn't it?) in a freak season when none of the top sides made it to the final.
Every other year in recent memory it's been a top side winning it. Of course the nature of the cup, any cup, is that shock results can happen on the day which doesn't guarantee a top side winning it but in the last 20 years those are the only 2 notable exceptions to the rule that it always has been.
And we did play 3 of the top 6 on the way to the semi-final. All at home, granted, but we earned our place.
You can't beat Wenger with the stick of not winning trophies and then dismiss it when we do win one.

*sigh*
We didn't move to the Emirates in order to win the FA cup once every decade.
We were winning titles & reaching C.L. semi's & finals whilst playing great football, the move was to enable us to build on this a become a European super power.

Now, we play shit football & have for a few years now, we don't get compete to win our own league, wank ourselves silly over 4th place & now acknowledge that finishing 2nd in our C.L. qualifying group gets us a good raping from one of the actual European super powers. Were we not supposed to be on of them by now. And those of us with season tickets pay more than any of the supporters of the top teams that we're supposed to be as good as.

But, never mind - we won the FA cup.

[Letters]

*sigh*
We didn't move to the Emirates in order to win the FA cup once every decade.
Agreed, but if you're going to beat Wenger with the stick of not having won a trophy in 'n' years then it's a bit rich to then dismiss it out of hand when we do finally win one.
The FA Cup has been devalued by the CL but it's still a major trophy.

The move was clearly needed but quite a few factors have conspired to mean it hasn't pushed us on as it might. You can argue Wenger is one of them, but you could also argue he did well to keep us 'up there' during the move. The billionaires sticking their nose in distorted the market, the commercial deals we had were good at the time but as things have spiralled ridiculously in terms of sponsorship deals we were stuck into them. That was arguably a wrong decision to tie ourselves in to long term deals but it was an understandable one given it ensured us the money to make the stadium repayments.

Now those deals are over we should have the resources to compete more seriously, the Ozil and Sanchez deals are signs of that. I think we all agree Wenger isn't the right person to push us on but he'll leave us in pretty good shape when he goes.

[Niall_Quinn]

*sigh*
We didn't move to the Emirates in order to win the FA cup once every decade.
We were winning titles & reaching C.L. semi's & finals whilst playing great football, the move was to enable us to build on this a become a European super power.

Now, we play shit football & have for a few years now, we don't get compete to win our own league, wank ourselves silly over 4th place & now acknowledge that finishing 2nd in our C.L. qualifying group gets us a good raping from one of the actual European super powers. Were we not supposed to be on of them by now. And those of us with season tickets pay more than any of the supporters of the top teams that we're supposed to be as good as.

But, never mind - we won the FA cup.

All fair enough points that I agree with. We're all pissed with the set up and return at Arsenal right now. But that doesn't make it legitimate to throw out the few positives as if they mean nothing. The point was not to win just the FA Cup, but we won it and that has at least some value if not all the value we wanted. Signing Alexis was a big positive too. And Chambers. But true enough, a club this size and a club that expects so much of the fans needs to be achieving more. Wenger will pay in the end if that doesn't happen. Nobody is immune and nobody can miss expectations forever without having to pay the consequences eventually. With Wenger it will be his legacy that's tarnished or even lost if he can't step up his game now there are resources available and the excuses have run out. The FA Cup was always seen as a kicking off point, not a culmination. We are fresh into a new season so the cup win still counts, but it won't count for much at the end of this season if we haven't pushed on.

[Globalgunner]

All fair enough points that I agree with. We're all pissed with the set up and return at Arsenal right now. But that doesn't make it legitimate to throw out the few positives as if they mean nothing. The point was not to win just the FA Cup, but we won it and that has at least some value if not all the value we wanted. Signing Alexis was a big positive too. And Chambers. But true enough, a club this size and a club that expects so much of the fans needs to be achieving more. Wenger will pay in the end if that doesn't happen. Nobody is immune and nobody can miss expectations forever without having to pay the consequences eventually. With Wenger it will be his legacy that's tarnished or even lost if he can't step up his game now there are resources available and the excuses have run out. The FA Cup was always seen as a kicking off point, not a culmination. We are fresh into a new season so the cup win still counts, but it won't count for much at the end of this season if we haven't pushed on.

You're still on this Wenger must do this Wenger must do that crap. I'm sorry, that ship has sailed?. Wenger is the problem, his legacy is already tainted. The FA cup was nice but as we can already see it was a blip. We are not building on it and we won't. The only question is if we will be forced to endure another 2 seasons of his intransigence and inanities. I hope not

[Niall_Quinn]

You're still on this Wenger must do this Wenger must do that crap. I'm sorry, that ship has sailed?. Wenger is the problem, his legacy is already tainted. The FA cup was nice but as we can already see it was a blip. We are not building on it and we won't. The only question is if we will be forced to endure another 2 seasons of his intransigence and inanities. I hope not

Well who else is going to do it if not Wenger? The board has already backed him unequivocally. He's delivering precisely what they want - revenues and a share price.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Well who else is going to do it if not Wenger? The board has already backed him unequivocally. He's delivering precisely what they want - revenues and a share price.

You can explain it to you're blue in the face some people just refuse to accept this very simple premise

You'd think the previous AGM was definitive proof if any were needed

Wenger is consistently delivering on a comparatively modest budget the results that allow the massive revenue streams, and that to the people that matter make him worth his salary and overlook his glaring deficiencies as a manager that are unlikely to be rectified by a man of his age.

So the only choice is to back the manager and ride out the groundhog season until 2017

[Globalgunner]

The problem is not the Arsenal board. It is this board. Do you think any of the Wenger doubters is under the delusion that we are speaking to the Arsenal board. The people who need convincing are the fans and we speak to them as we speak to you who deflect these arguments. Before Wenger signed the last contract we told you that this was a road to nowhere. You same people said no. He deserves another chance, he has money now. It's as if you want to pretend that this never happened and Wenger is just now showing signs of megalomania and delusion. At the end of 2017, the same people will find arguments for him to stay, basically, saying he's meeting the boards objectives so fans opinions don't count.

The board here is for fans....I cannot believe that any true fan can want this man to stay. What rational argument can any fan have to continue this perpetuation of stagnation

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

The problem is not the Arsenal board. It is this board. Do you think any of the Wenger doubters is under the delusion that we are speaking to the Arsenal board. The people who need convincing are the fans and we speak to them as we speak to you who deflect these arguments. Before Wenger signed the last contract we told you that this was a road to nowhere. You same people said no. He deserves another chance, he has money now. It's as if you want to pretend that this never happened and Wenger is just now showing signs of megalomania and delusion. At the end of 2017, the same people will find arguments for him to stay, basically, saying he's meeting the boards objectives so fans opinions don't count.

The board here is for fans....I cannot believe that any true fan can want this man to stay. What rational argument can any fan have to continue this perpetuation of stagnation

No i just deal in reality not hypothetical bubbles

Wenger should have gone last season, he didn't and as we are Arsenal fans and whether we like it or not he's the manager it's counter intuitive not to back him.

Either that or boycott the club until 2017

[Maestro]

i know it wont happen but he should be sacked today, there's absolutely no more mileage in this guy

[Xhaka Can’t]

No, lets see what he can waste in the transfer window and judge him at the end of the season.

[Maestro]

No, lets see what he can waste in the transfer window and judge him at the end of the season.



:haha:

[fakeyank]

No, lets see what he can waste in the transfer window and judge him at the end of the season.

:haha:

[Niall_Quinn]

He has to resign. If he could have kept us at the level we were at last season, fair enough. But we've fallen off another cliff and I'm not even sure we've hit the bottom yet. He has to resign. There's no excusing a home performance like that. We may well have handed the 4th place trophy to Utd today, without putting up the slightest fight. At home. There's no sign whatsoever of improvement. Under these circumstances the manager has to go. He has to resign.

[Maestro]

He has to resign. If he could have kept us at the level we were at last season, fair enough. But we've fallen off another cliff and I'm not even sure we've hit the bottom yet. He has to resign. There's no excusing a home performance like that. We may well have handed the 4th place trophy to Utd today, without putting up the slightest fight. At home. There's no sign whatsoever of improvement. Under these circumstances the manager has to go. He has to resign.

we know wumget will shake it off and keep his cheques for now

[Munchies]

Please leave at the end of the season Wenger, because we all know the board won't do anything

[Marc Overmars]

Only way I could see him resigning is if we don't finish 4th. Once he can't bring up the "x amount of consecutive years in the CL" stat then he's essentially finished because it opens him up to a new wave of criticism not heard before.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Problem is its a double edged sword, even if Wenger did leave if we finished outside the top four (no evidence suggests to me he would or the board would push him) We would be in a mass exodus situation with a lot of our players (I don't think there is any question that what we have are good players who are being coached abysmally) using Wengers going and the lack of champions league football to find a new club, which could massively destabilise us for years.
The ideal solution would be for Wenger to acknowledge he's not capable of getting the required standard from these players and hand over the reigns to Steve Bould, and for once I don't mean at the end of the season.

I actually think today was a worse humiliation than the 8-2 game, we had the personnel and the territorial dominance to obliterate this Man Utd side, De Gea was the best player on the pitch but he made no saves that he wouldn't have been expected to save, in fact if you wanted to be critical he was beaten too easily by Giroud at his near post.

A dreadful Man United side gifted three points, a Man United side that didnt even get a shot on target until the 84th minute, a Man United side who didnt seem for the first thirty minutes to be able to keep its shape or even understand the formation it was playing.

It doesn't get any easier, Dortmund next and then fixtures in December against Stoke, Southampton, Liverpool and West Ham....and you have to rely on the same back four and hope that none of them break down in that period.

Just admit its beyond you Mr Wenger, you are 65 now and the game has left you behind.

[Niall_Quinn]

Whether the game has left him behind or not, what's contemporary about a cross or a corner? These are the age old basics of the game and we can't do them. We can't shoot either, preferring to pass when the shot is on, and shoot when there's fuck all chance of the ball going in the net. Couldn't any old fool suggest we're better off moving the ball towards the opponent's goal rather than our own? Couldn't the village idiot figure out which team he's on and then pass to them rather than the opposition? What makes this myths that we are a wildly entertaining, free flowing, passing machine persist? Have the fans been duped into watching one game while everyone else watches the real match elsewhere? What are they seeing that we can't see? We can't pass, cross, shoot, defend and we have no drive, energy, tempo or a hint of ambition. You don't need a modern day maestro to figure it out, even an old has-been should get an inkling when he sees the shit being spread in front of him week after week. I have my doubts about Bould too. If he's sitting there being a yes man then those aren't the credentials we want in a manager. But if he's an active part of this then WTF?

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

My theory on Bould is that he clearly wants Wengers job, I am actually convinced that he has been offered it by Gazidis as well.
And as bad as things are I don't think Bould thinks they have got bad enough to rock the boat

Along with the board, he knows that as long as there is champions
League football he has a platform on which to build.

In his first season he did start bollocking Wenger in the dug out

And I think the defensive solidity between March and May 2013 was his doing

[Ernesto]

This isn't a Wenger defence post. I think, like many, that he should leave. He perhaps should have left, or been asked serious questions about his tenure, in 2006 after an abysmal title challenge. A victim of his own success (we all are, no matter what line of work we're in), the employers are the ones who should be questioning him as to why he is underperforming.

I'm sure he loves the club. He isn't a mercenary. Yes, he has an extortionate wage packet, but I'm certain that the likes of Real Madrid (who have been coveting him for some time) would easily offer him more. There is something keeping him here even when the going gets tough and he, himself, could so easily walk.

In terms of a replacement, we have to use the example of other clubs. Manchester United wanted Klopp. He said no. What makes us think, on that basis, that he would come to us? Spurs wanted van Gaal. He said no because a better offer came in. Can we also afford to be 'competed out' of a good manager? The most pertinent question is, is there enough quality about? The most appetizing option I've heard is à Bergkamp/De Boer combination. Bergkamp doesn't tend to have problems with the English media (who, if you're not Mourinho, will be quick to hound you out if your surname isn't Smith) and he loves the club. Again, not a mercenary.

The most crucial thing for us is Champions League qualification. This echoes the views of other posters. How are we going to attract players, keep our own players and interview the very best managers out there without that carrot? As ridiculous as we think it sounds, it actually would be like a trophy this season, in my eyes. (But all hinging on the hope that Wenger leaves this summer)

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

We will never know until we try.

Klopp this week stated he wanted to come to the EPL. Seemed like a come and get me plea.

He would be perfect.

[Globalgunner]

This isn't a Wenger defence post. I think, like many, that he should leave. He perhaps should have left, or been asked serious questions about his tenure, in 2006 after an abysmal title challenge. A victim of his own success (we all are, no matter what line of work we're in), the employers are the ones who should be questioning him as to why he is underperforming.

I'm sure he loves the club. He isn't a mercenary. Yes, he has an extortionate wage packet, but I'm certain that the likes of Real Madrid (who have been coveting him for some time) would easily offer him more. There is something keeping him here even when the going gets tough and he, himself, could so easily walk.

In terms of a replacement, we have to use the example of other clubs. Manchester United wanted Klopp. He said no. What makes us think, on that basis, that he would come to us? Spurs wanted van Gaal. He said no because a better offer came in. Can we also afford to be 'competed out' of a good manager? The most pertinent question is, is there enough quality about? The most appetizing option I've heard is à Bergkamp/De Boer combination. Bergkamp doesn't tend to have problems with the English media (who, if you're not Mourinho, will be quick to hound you out if your surname isn't Smith) and he loves the club. Again, not a mercenary.

The most crucial thing for us is Champions League qualification. This echoes the views of other posters. How are we going to attract players, keep our own players and interview the very best managers out there without that carrot? As ridiculous as we think it sounds, it actually would be like a trophy this season, in my eyes. (But all hinging on the hope that Wenger leaves this summer)
Nobody in competitive football covets Wenger anymore. That myth has well and truly been blown out of the water. He more than anyone else knows this that is why it will be hard to dislodge him. He wont go anywhere where winning above all is the imperative. He will not tire of underperforming at Arsenal, we will have to embarrass him out of the club it seems as he will not resign willingly. Sad, but it really has come to this. Kroenke, The board, Gazidis, None of them will do it only the fans by a show of absence or mass protest will free us from Wengers clutches.

[Bumble]

The unfortunate situation is that things won't change if we maintain top 4. But falling out of top 4 could lead to a struggle to get the right man in and the players without over the top salaries and fees like United have done. And they will struggle to do it for more than one season so what chance do we have.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

We will never know until we try.

Klopp this week stated he wanted to come to the EPL. Seemed like a come and get me plea.

He would be perfect.

Two-three years ago i'd agree but i think he'd be a Wenger Mark II, his teams play entertaining football (like we once did) but he doesn't seem to be able to adjust his own teams tactics....talk about them losing key personnel as much as you like but defensively they are just as bad as us at the moment and his back four has largely been unchanged.
A few months ago i thought that if Wenger was to go ASAP we'd need a big name with experience of winning to come in, i'm not even sure that's the case we just need someone who can come in and get the basics right. Even going into this period with a lack of defensive options, the results do not reflect that there is quality in the squad....there is no excuse to hide behind. Chelsea for me were always going to win the title this season, but 15 points behind them at this stage?....a team that was battling against relegation six-seven weeks ago is now two points above us.
If Wenger had any pride and walked away, it's almost inevitable that the board would appoint Steve Bould even if it was just to the end of the season....Bould is the right choice for me he is the inside man that knows every aspect of the club but would bring a more street smart approach to us and would not be same messianic regard that everyone currently regards Arsene the demagogue.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Klopp's won 2 league titles, 1 fa cup, 2 community shields and got them to a champions league final in the last 5 years.

They also blitzed us when we played them this season.

No brainer.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Also a return of 11 points from 12 league games, including this weekend where they threw away a two nil lead

blitzing us is hardly even much of an achievement at this moment in time

Even if they beat us on Wednesday which i fully expect them to, i still have my reservations about him

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

He's had 10 bad weeks and you're criticising him but you stick up for wenger who's had 10 bad years :haha:

[Power n Glory]

Also a return of 11 points from 12 league games, including this weekend where they threw away a two nil lead

blitzing us is hardly even much of an achievement at this moment in time

Even if they beat us on Wednesday which i fully expect them to, i still have my reservations about him

Bould over Klopp? What makes you think the players will respond to Bould once Wenger's gone? They're not responding to him now.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

He's had 10 bad weeks and you're criticising him but you stick up for wenger who's had 10 bad years :haha:

That's funny in my original response to you i called for Wenger to be replaced by Bould for the remainder of the season. And throughout this thread i've said i've wanted Wenger to go when the right man comes into to replace him....

If that's sticking up for the man, i'd hate to know what you think being critical is

Klopp has been treading water in the domestic league for the past few seasons, even if you consider that the German league is 34 games compared to 38 the point accumulation has certainly been no better than ours especially when you consider that outside of Bayern and Borussia Dortmund (and maybe Schalke and Leverkusen) most of the German teams would struggle to even remain in the Premier league.

It's not to say he couldn't adapt and make a good fist of things here, but to be honest if we got rid of Wenger right now it's probably unlikely Klopp would chuck in Dortmund to come to us anyway (even with his struggles in the Bundesliga he probably feels he can have a crack at the Champions League).

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Bould over Klopp? What makes you think the players will respond to Bould once Wenger's gone? They're not responding to him now.

Depends how much say he has, at the moment i suspect very little.

I just fear that in Klopp there are similarities to Wenger a) tactical inflexibility and b) someone who is likely to build a cult of personality around himself

What we need is a captain on a touchline, someone who can be the leader that we don't have on the pitch....and whilst Klopp is very vocal and gesticular from the touchline i don't know how well that would translate.

[Power n Glory]

Depends how much say he has, at the moment i suspect very little.

I just fear that in Klopp there are similarities to Wenger a) tactical inflexibility and b) someone who is likely to build a cult of personality around himself

What we need is a captain on a touchline, someone who can be the leader that we don't have on the pitch....and whilst Klopp is very vocal and gesticular from the touchline i don't know how well that would translate.

Do you think Bould can make the transition to manager and earn the respect of the players after playing the 'yes man' for so long? After working day in day out with the players I really don't know if he's going to be able to stamp his authority once Wenger is out the door. The players have been used to the 'softly softly' approach and I doubt they'll respond to a more strict approach if that hasn't been his stance from first walking in the door.

Klopp at least has credentials behind him to back up his bark. Bould doesn't and I doubt he'd be able to be so heavy handed with them.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Do you think Bould can make the transition to manager and earn the respect of the players after playing the 'yes man' for so long? After working day in day out with the players I really don't know if he's going to be able to stamp his authority once Wenger is out the door. The players have been used to the 'softly softly' approach and I doubt they'll respond to a more strict approach if that hasn't been his stance from first walking in the door.

Klopp at least has credentials behind him to back up his bark. Bould doesn't and I doubt he'd be able to be so heavy handed with them.

Who is talking about being heavy handed?.....and i think it's harsh on Bould to call him a yes man....put yourself in his shoes.....probably got tired of voicing his opinion and it being ignored, but if you think you have a chance of replacing the man currently in charge what would be the sense of storming off in a fit of pique?.

Would you agree that if Wenger was to go ASAP, that bringing in Klopp to replace him wouldn't be incredibly likely, and therefore bringing in Bould to the end of the season would be the most likely outcome?. Then you assess Bould on how he has performed in that interim period, and you decide whether to give him the chance to take on the job full time or go for someone with bigger credentials.

[Power n Glory]

Who is talking about being heavy handed?.....and i think it's harsh on Bould to call him a yes man....put yourself in his shoes.....probably got tired of voicing his opinion and it being ignored, but if you think you have a chance of replacing the man currently in charge what would be the sense of storming off in a fit of pique?.

Would you agree that if Wenger was to go ASAP, that bringing in Klopp to replace him wouldn't be incredibly likely, and therefore bringing in Bould to the end of the season would be the most likely outcome?. Then you assess Bould on how he has performed in that interim period, and you decide whether to give him the chance to take on the job full time or go for someone with bigger credentials.

If we want a manager to get this team back on track, we need someone to be vocal and more strict which is more 'heavy handed' compared to Wenger's approach. How Bould would approach things as manager is all speculation and what he actually gets up to in training is also. But the results are there for all to see and he's part of this set up that's failing. Has to shoulder some of the blame.

You say it's harsh but I think you're being very harsh on Klopp. I'm not questioning the interim manager thing. I just don't see the logic on writing off Klopp, someone that's one a title, done the basics and gone beyond, yet you question his ability. Bould is failing in his current role as assistant manager but you're ok with him taking the manager role on. It makes no sense.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

IHow Bould would approach things as manager is all speculation and what he actually gets up to in training is also. But the results are there for all to see and he's part of this set up that's failing.. Bould is failing in his current role as assistant manager but you're ok with him taking the manager role on. It makes no sense.

Of course it's speculative, and what i would specculate on is that there have been periods of times in the past two-three seasons where we have defended far better than we have at any time since we had the George Graham era back four, and then suddenly reverted to being a disorganised rabble....for instance in 2013 the last 11 games of the season we conceded five goals including the complete shut out of Bayern Munich in Germany....i'd be hard pressed to believe anyone but Bould was responsible for that. But i think it's part of a power struggle on the training ground.

There is also the clear instance of him lambasting Wenger on the touchline including "How many times must i say it to you". Plus you have the reports in the Independent after the Swansea game where the coaching staff are not happy, presumably because they are not being allowed to do their job.

If he thinks he is in with a shout of replacing Wenger probably he now thinks it's best just to shut up and say nothing, although saying that i'm reading Twitter rumors that this might no longer be the case and Bould is considering jacking it in at Arsenal, probably complete bollocks but you never know.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

My concern with Klopp, is that Arsenal's no 1 priority is to sort out it's defence organisation and discipline....and perhaps at least in the short term we need someone more pragmatic and safety first.
Klopp is a more charismatic and extroverted version of Wenger, he believes in high tempo, pressing high up the pitch attacking football.
But then again maybe he's not as much as a micro manager as L'Ouisseau, maybe he would take a back seat and allow someone like Bould or another defensive coach to work on what we do when not in possession.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Actually I think Bould's heavy handed approach would work wonders with this lot, getting them into gear for the next 8 months, before someone like Klopp takes over in the summer.

[AFC Leveller]

As Henry Winter said (he is a prick but knows his stuff) noone has the balls to fire Wenger and it will have to be him resigning rather than the club firing him. Gazidis was hired by Wenger and just the other week he was on about dreading the day Wenger leaves because the board have no fucking clue what to do.

The man wont resign because he's always respected his contracts + he is way too stubborn to see that he is ruining his reputation and he club in the process.

[Power n Glory]

Of course it's speculative, and what i would specculate on is that there have been periods of times in the past two-three seasons where we have defended far better than we have at any time since we had the George Graham era back four, and then suddenly reverted to being a disorganised rabble....for instance in 2013 the last 11 games of the season we conceded five goals including the complete shut out of Bayern Munich in Germany....i'd be hard pressed to believe anyone but Bould was responsible for that. But i think it's part of a power struggle on the training ground.

There is also the clear instance of him lambasting Wenger on the touchline including "How many times must i say it to you". Plus you have the reports in the Independent after the Swansea game where the coaching staff are not happy, presumably because they are not being allowed to do their job.

If he thinks he is in with a shout of replacing Wenger probably he now thinks it's best just to shut up and say nothing, although saying that i'm reading Twitter rumors that this might no longer be the case and Bould is considering jacking it in at Arsenal, probably complete bollocks but you never know.

I'd speculate on whether Bould wants to be a first team manager. He is 52. Does he want the manager role? Had this debate with another poster some years back and he pointed out his age and whether he even wanted the role when I suggested he could take over from Wenger. It's a good point. It's rather late for him to be getting into the game with just over a year's worth of experience as assistant manager. How old was Wenger when he arrived here? How old are Pep, Jose and Klopp? Bould might just be waiting on Wenger's contract to run down so he can work with another manager as assistant.

I was rooting for Bould to become assistant manager. I'd hope the defence would be sorted and we'd see more of his influence. But the reality is that hasn't happened. How much that is down to Wenger restricting his role, we don't know, but it's possible that Wenger is indeed restricting him to collecting cones during training. That's even more of a reason to question his management ability. How much has he learned in such a short period?

This all may sound harsh on Bould, but I think we need to be realistic. We're comparing a man that's struggling in the assistant role with no first team management experience to someone with a very solid record at Dortmund. The ideal version of Bould as manager vs someone that has real management experience and accomplishments. I think it's harsh to knock Klopp's record but then nominate Bould. The ideal and imagined version of Bould as manager will always sound good. Similar to how I thought he'd flourish as assistant manager.

I wouldn't mind him as a stop gap for someone like Klopp. But he'd have to pull off some really impressive results if we're talking about a full time role over Klopp. It goes beyond sorting out the defence. I'd be pissed with the Board if they passed up on Klopp for Bould.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

You could be right in respect of Boulds age but after Wenger I am not keen on the idea of another manager being in charge for years upon years.
But yes you could be right that he may want to be assistant under a new Manager and perhaps he would be retained in that position if someone like Klopp came in.
To be honest though I get the impression Gazidis is looking for someone he is more likely to have control over and will work within the coaching framework he is looking to set up (Jonker and Forsythe being his appointments) and this is why names like Paul Clement being mooted. I get the impression that whilst he knows he has no leverage over Wenger, he is the one who will be in charge of his successor.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Bould over Klopp? What makes you think the players will respond to Bould once Wenger's gone? They're not responding to him now.

The season is a write off - sack Wenger now. It would provide us with time to ascertain if the players would respond to Bould. If they don't, then get someone else in by the start of the Summer.

[Injury Time]

4th place fight is on! It's only November, time for Wenger to go, but he won't. <_<

[mr_brighterside]

we should rack up a uk plc sized debt if needs be to get in guardiola now

[fakeyank]

Think the pressure is really ramped up on Wenger now. Even the pundits who shied from ever asking for his head are now saying that he needs to go. Defeat to Dortmund and it'll just raise the temperature even higher. I still dont think he will move his arse but things are slowly but surely becoming untenable for him! :)

[Niall_Quinn]

What's the danger half the players would be looking for the exit if Wenger left? If he's coddling them and giving them the easy life maybe that's the key selling point for some of them? We're just in a bad situation now. He's so ingrained in the club at every level it's going to be a massive upheaval when/ if he goes. But it's something we'll have to face at some point and I also think the season is a write off. So might as well take the pain now rather than let this infect the next season. The line was crossed on the weekend.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

As Henry Winter said (he is a prick but knows his stuff) noone has the balls to fire Wenger and it will have to be him resigning rather than the club firing him. Gazidis was hired by Wenger and just the other week he was on about dreading the day Wenger leaves because the board have no fucking clue what to do.

The man wont resign because he's always respected his contracts + he is way too stubborn to see that he is ruining his reputation and he club in the process.

:lol: Fucks sake.

How are we in such a mess.

[Power n Glory]

Jack out for 3/4 months. Still waiting on Arteta results. We'll have a central midfield injury crisis by January.

What's the odd on us signing Khederia?

[Globalgunner]

Dont worry. Diaby will be back anytime soon. Hes playing himself into a new contract

[Niall_Quinn]

"Arsenal will topple Chelsea and Manchester City and win the Premier League within three years, insists boss Arsene Wenger"
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2858798/Arsenal-topple-Chelsea-Manchester-City-win-Premier-League-three-years-insists-boss-Arsene-Wenger.html

Does that mean he'll be signing a new contract when the current one expires? Or does he mean we'll win something as soon as he leaves?

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

3 years :haha: :haha: :haha:

[Maestro]

Seriously he can just fuck off now

[Xhaka Can’t]

3 years :haha: :haha: :haha:
We just need to be patient.

[Niall_Quinn]

We just need to be patient.

Patience with padded walls.

[AFC Leveller]

In 2008 it was 2 or 3 percent from world domination, then it was 3 years away from the title. He's right, do the math guys, 6 years after he said 3 years, its now 3 years again. 3 years + 3 years = 6 years.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

In 2008 it was 2 or 3 percent from world domination, then it was 3 years away from the title. He's right, do the math guys, 6 years after he said 3 years, its now 3 years again. 3 years + 3 years = 6 years.

:haha:

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Ridicule aside...it is unusual for Wenger to be this forthcoming with his statements. Especially ones where he is categorically speaking about delivering.....

The days are long gone now but it did remind of when he predicted us going unbeaten, albeit season too early, but nevertheless it eventually happened.

[adzzzbatch]

Get out of my club you clueless old twat.

[mr_brighterside]

three centuries wouldn't be enough time. he must leave and with enough notice that we can get a top manager before they are picked off and so they can use the transfer window. realistically not much point in going now as klopp, guardiola, etc. wouldn't leave mid season

[Marc Overmars]

A shambles.

[1_nilto the arsenal]

This is as much as I can take. I no longer can support this club while this BAFOON is in charge. I despise the man for making one of the great clubs in to the whipping boys of the premiership.

FUCK OFF WENGER NOW!

[fakeyank]

Pile of shit > Wenger

[Master Splinter]

Bafoons :bow:.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Wenget. :lol:

Somebody put Old Yeller out of his misery.

[Master Splinter]

@Arsenal:



Wenger:"You cannot say we did not fight. I believe we showed top fighting qualities and as well spirit."




Wenger: "Footballing qualities? We don't want to speak about that."




Wenger: "I must say, the second half was exceptional. They have shown they are winners."




Wenger: "Will we buy defensive cover? We are of course on the side of the market looking in, but sometime the internal market has the best solutions."




Wenger: "Do I mean we have a market stall in the Emirates? No. We will give Ajayi a chance to show his quality. And do not forget we have Diaby who is only four months away."

[Marc Overmars]

Come on Gazidis, save us from Wenget.

[selassie]

We should sticky this thread because we will be having the exact same conversations this time next season and the season after that.

[Niall_Quinn]

@Arsenal:

It's getting harder and harder to tell if this stuff is genuine or if it's Wenger impersonating MS.

[mr_brighterside]

he is the blatter of arsenal, nothing can be done to remove him from power :(

[1_nilto the arsenal]

If Wenger had any love for the club and the fans, he would annouce his now and this be is swansong finale season. Does he not see the divide and problems his presence as manager is doing to the fans. Arsenal fans fighting each other is the lowest of the low and makes me sick. Its like watching two brothers or sisters having it out fists and hair pulling. This is wrong Arsene and you are the problem but you also hold the key to end this hatred between gooners, walk away end of the season. We will never forget you for the wonderful football, the invincibles, the doubles, the year after year qualification for CL football, and that moment when we were 16 mins away from beating the mighty Barcelona with 10 men. But Mr Wenger this is Arsenal Football Club not Tottenham or Everton and 4th palce is for these clubs not for Arsenal.

We are one of the most famous clubs and we are one of the biggest in Europe. We dont support your stance with 4th place each season, we want to be in the mix with Chelsea and Citeh fighting for the title, not fighting for 4th place and getting thrashed every now and thee, The insult and pain we gooners have endured since that 8-2 loss to United, it was so embarssing that Fergie begged his players not to score anymore goals, the thrashings at the hands of Liverpool and Chelsea. It should never happen to Arsenal, ever. So the hounorable thing, your not short of a bob or two, just go and relax and enjoy life with your £30+ Million bank account. Spend time with your family and then comeback after a years sebatcle and go into international football, or manage PSG or commentated full time with Qatar, but please leave for you own health and well being. I will never boo you or swear at you in public as I have too much respect for you as a gentleman, and those idiots who did are a bunch of fucking tossers, and had me and mates been present they would have had the full wrath, as you dont deserve to be treated in that manner.

[Özim]

We should sticky this thread because we will be having the exact same conversations this time next season and the season after that.

Yeah and the season after that too, when he then signs a new contract we'll then be having the same conversations again for a while.

[Globalgunner]

Yeah and the season after that too, when he then signs a new contract we'll then be having the same conversations again for a while.

Funny how some seem to think that this Wenger is crap business only started this season. No one it seems could have foretold His Crapness masterminding another crap season.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Well I don't think anyone believes that, the rising levels of discontentment amongst the fan base are a result of a self-perpetuating cycle of poor results, mismanagement and failure to change.
It's a kind of purgatory because we never seem to fall hard enough to prevent our qualification for Champions League football, but the qualification never acts as a springboard for anything better. Neither does it appear does our first silverware in nine years.
Ultimately I think the greatest ire to the fans is the lack of bragging rights over clubs we aspire to be competing with, we haven't beaten the likes of Chelsea, Man City and Man United ( the only three sides to have won the title since we did in 2004) in the last 16 attempts in the league.

[fakeyank]

If Wenger had any love for the club and the fans, he would annouce his now and this be is swansong finale season. Does he not see the divide and problems his presence as manager is doing to the fans. Arsenal fans fighting each other is the lowest of the low and makes me sick. Its like watching two brothers or sisters having it out fists and hair pulling. This is wrong Arsene and you are the problem but you also hold the key to end this hatred between gooners, walk away end of the season. We will never forget you for the wonderful football, the invincibles, the doubles, the year after year qualification for CL football, and that moment when we were 16 mins away from beating the mighty Barcelona with 10 men. But Mr Wenger this is Arsenal Football Club not Tottenham or Everton and 4th palce is for these clubs not for Arsenal.

We are one of the most famous clubs and we are one of the biggest in Europe. We dont support your stance with 4th place each season, we want to be in the mix with Chelsea and Citeh fighting for the title, not fighting for 4th place and getting thrashed every now and thee, The insult and pain we gooners have endured since that 8-2 loss to United, it was so embarssing that Fergie begged his players not to score anymore goals, the thrashings at the hands of Liverpool and Chelsea. It should never happen to Arsenal, ever. So the hounorable thing, your not short of a bob or two, just go and relax and enjoy life with your £30+ Million bank account. Spend time with your family and then comeback after a years sebatcle and go into international football, or manage PSG or commentated full time with Qatar, but please leave for you own health and well being. I will never boo you or swear at you in public as I have too much respect for you as a gentleman, and those idiots who did are a bunch of fucking tossers, and had me and mates been present they would have had the full wrath, as you dont deserve to be treated in that manner.

http://i970.photobucket.com/albums/ae188/mcfan_01/Emotional.gif

[fakeyank]

those idiots who did are a bunch of fucking tossers, and had me and mates been present they would have had the full wrath, as you dont deserve to be treated in that manner.

:haha:

Could you be specific on 'full wrath'?

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

In some ways best not to get involved, people who lack the capacity to think tend to revert to aggression when challenged.

[Niall_Quinn]

In some ways best not to get involved, people who lack the capacity to think tend to revert to aggression when challenged.

Shut it or I'll smash your face in!

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

We should sticky this thread because we will be having the exact same conversations this time next season and the season after that.

:lol:

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

I will never boo you or swear at you in public as I have too much respect for you as a gentleman, and those idiots who did are a bunch of fucking tossers, and had me and mates been present they would have had the full wrath, as you dont deserve to be treated in that manner.

You won't do fucking shit you cunt. You lot give it the big one over social media and forums then when you see the wenger out brigade holding the banner cack yourself. Like matey who tried acting big at stoke and confronted them and got lynched so hard he fell 5 rows down :haha:

[mr_brighterside]

does everyone realise we are only dealing with football, violence and abuse for a punch of over priced wallies who occasionally give a ball a sniff of the opposition goal is ridiculous

[Niall_Quinn]

does everyone realise we are only dealing with football, violence and abuse for a punch of over priced wallies who occasionally give a ball a sniff of the opposition goal is ridiculous

You're so wrong. I've heard the players say they love the fans loads of times.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

You won't do fucking shit you cunt. You lot give it the big one over social media and forums then when you see the wenger out brigade holding the banner cack yourself. Like matey who tried acting big at stoke and confronted them and got lynched so hard he fell 5 rows down :haha:

Sorry I hate to be discriminatory but myself and a lot of fellow users only speak English would you mind translating?

[LDG]

Sorry I hate to be discriminatory but myself and a lot of fellow users only speak English would you mind translating?

He said:

"look at my horse, my horse is amazing"

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

He said:

"look at my horse, my horse is amazing"

Is...horse...slang for penis?

[LDG]

Is...horse...slang for penis?

No. SWAYR is.

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Sorry I hate to be discriminatory but myself and a lot of fellow users only speak English would you mind translating?

I said you're a twat.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I said you're a twat.

And you couldn't have done that in three words instead of a paragraph?

[Xhaka Can’t]

Shut it or I'll smash your face in!
What's the matter for you eh?

[adzzzbatch]

No one out there good enough to replace Wagner :haha:

I read in other threads how the injuries are ridiculous and have taken their toll, but it was the manager that declared that the squad was strong enough to go through the season. He is the man at fault for what we see today.

[Master Splinter]

Whoever we buy will just end up injured anyway. If Wenger is the root problem of our never-ending injury nightmare, then that is his biggest failure because as it continues to show no signs of ever abating, we can't move forward in any way. No club could cope with this ridiculous and disastrous situation. We probably have more players currently out than Chelsea have actually used this season.

A completely new medical and fitness team to go with new playing and coaching staff. Basically, we require another Big Bang.

[Marc Overmars]

It's ironic that someone supposedly meticulous with player fitness and performance level has absolutely no grasp whatsoever on the situation.

[adzzzbatch]

Whoever we buy will just end up injured anyway. If Wenger is the root problem of our never-ending injury nightmare, then that is his biggest failure because as it continues to show no signs of ever abating, we can't move forward in any way. No club could cope with this ridiculous and disastrous situation. We probably have more players currently out than Chelsea have actually used this season.

A completely new medical and fitness team to go with new playing and coaching staff. Basically, we require another Big Bang.

The thing is though we already have a completely new medical and fitness team. The thing we haven't changed is the playing and coaching staff.

[adzzzbatch]

It's ironic that someone supposedly meticulous with player fitness and performance level has absolutely no grasp whatsoever on the situation.

Times change, 10/15 years ago he was top of his game if not the game. He just hasn't adapter to the present whatsoever.

[AFC Leveller]

it really is time for him to go now, its getting more and more painful.

Please go.

[topgun]

Going over same old ground I know but every man and his dog can see the failings of this team and Wenger either can't see or can't fix them, either way the sooner he is gone the better.It may mean having to take a step back in order to put things right but carrying on as things are is only delaying the inevitable,thanks and all that but goodbye.

[selassie]

Sad thing is I have just seen Spurs tear Chelsea to shreads and we all know deep down Wenger isn't capable of getting us to beat Mourinho's Chelsea like that.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I don't think it took a lot tactically for Spurs to do that to Chelsea, their back four is susceptible to pace attacks and as soon as they were chasing the game they were vulnerable,

[Power n Glory]

Whoever we buy will just end up injured anyway. If Wenger is the root problem of our never-ending injury nightmare, then that is his biggest failure because as it continues to show no signs of ever abating, we can't move forward in any way. No club could cope with this ridiculous and disastrous situation. We probably have more players currently out than Chelsea have actually used this season.

A completely new medical and fitness team to go with new playing and coaching staff. Basically, we require another Big Bang.

That's why I'm against him spending anymore money. We had midfield players in the abundance at the start of the season and now we're having to plug gaps with makeshift players.

He runs the team ragged and we had the same problem last season but fortune was on our side because Giroud and our two main CB's didn't pick up long term injuries.

[Niall_Quinn]

If he doesn't spend the money then it goes in a pot to be shared out when the next gang jump overboard. Might as well spend it and see if something works by luck.

[Letters]

Why does no-one post in here when we win?

[Niall_Quinn]

Why does no-one post in here when we win?

People were probably away over Christmas. But in general fewer post when we win.