Summer transfer joy and happiness

[Marc Overmars]

Been linked with Leon Bailey today.

Bit of quality in the wide areas would be welcome.

[Özim]

Been linked with Leon Bailey today.

Bit of quality in the wide areas would be welcome.

Seems to be linked with Roma and Chelsea as well.

[GP]

I choose to believe that that’s true.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44957390

[Özim]

Ramsey said his agent was handling the contract with the club and that's he's still got a year left and he's looking forward to that, apparently nothing imminent.

To be honest, the club has messed up again, only year left again, getting annoyed at this now.

We should just sell the guy now, we're 2 weeks away from the close of the transfer window and need to find a replacement, it' dragged on for so long so in reality it's not looking good on him signing, he's had his chance.

[Power n Glory]

Ramsey said his agent was handling the contract with the club and that's he's still got a year left and he's looking forward to that, apparently nothing imminent.

To be honest, the club has messed up again, only year left again, getting annoyed at this now.

We should just sell the guy now, we're 2 weeks away from the close of the transfer window and need to find a replacement, it' dragged on for so long so in reality it's not looking good on him signing, he's had his chance.

This is why Xhaka and Iwobi are getting new contracts. If they suddenly have good seasons, we can sell for a higher price.

[Özim]

This is why Xhaka and Iwobi are getting new contracts. If they suddenly have good seasons, we can sell for a higher price.

I hold no hope for Xhaka, he's got little ability, if anything it'll mean we're stuck with him because let's be honest who is going to take this guy off our hands?

[I am invisible]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44957390
Chelsea :pal:

[SMatthews]

I hold no hope for Xhaka, he's got little ability, if anything it'll mean we're stuck with him because let's be honest who is going to take this guy off our hands?

No-one. He’ll stay here until retirement and take over as manager building a team in his image to create a 20 year legacy.

[Power n Glory]

I hold no hope for Xhaka, he's got little ability, if anything it'll mean we're stuck with him because let's be honest who is going to take this guy off our hands?

You see how much Everton are spending so you never know. It doesn't have to be a high profile club that wants him.

[Özim]

Atletico signed Gelson Martins on a free, got to give that club credit they have an eye for talent and don't waste any time.

Considering he was free if money is an issue for us we should have snapped him up, very good player, will probably thrive at Atletico and be worth 70-80 million in a few years.

[I am invisible]

Atletico signed Gelson Martins on a free, got to give that club credit they have an eye for talent and don't waste any time.

Considering he was free if money is an issue for us we should have snapped him up, very good player, will probably thrive at Atletico and be worth 70-80 million in a few years.
Every player will be worth at least 80m in a few years, if we keep on at this rate!

[Power n Glory]

Every player will be worth at least 80m in a few years, if we keep on at this rate!

The bubble will eventually burst. I highly doubt big broadcasters like Sky and BT Sports can continue to payout such huge amounts of money for licensing. They don't generate enough revenue to cover the debt they're racking up. New players will come in to vote for the rights but I doubt they'll pay as much. TV habits are changing. The money isn't the same and they'll have to come up with a new model.

When that happens, clubs that haven't got their own house in order will suffer. With all this money rolling in they should really invest in their infrastructure and having a presence in the local community.

[Bumble]

The bubble will eventually burst. I highly doubt big broadcasters like Sky and BT Sports can continue to payout such huge amounts of money for licensing. They don't generate enough revenue to cover the debt they're racking up.
haven't sky justed announced like the 11 consecutive year of increase profits hence a bidding competition for control from COMCAST and FOX. so maybe the money they are paying out is affordable.

[Power n Glory]

haven't sky justed announced like the 11 consecutive year of increase profits hence a bidding competition for control from COMCAST and FOX. so maybe the money they are paying out is affordable.

I don't how these companies pull this witchcraft when it comes to reporting profits and revenue but it's all based on debt management.

https://www.fool.co.uk/investing/2018/01/27/heres-why-id-buy-sky-plc-ahead-of-bt-group-plc-for-2018/

Perception is everything. Netflix have a ridiculous amount of debt and once those unimpressive subscriber numbers came back their share prices took a hit.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Nothing is forever...the question is when rather than if. It's not letting up anytime soon though.

[Power n Glory]

Nothing is forever...the question is when rather than if. It's not letting up anytime soon though.

These sort of things tend to happen quickly when nobody expects it.

[Chippy]

This is why Xhaka and Iwobi are getting new contracts. If they suddenly have good seasons, we can sell for a higher price.

Neither good enough for Arsenal.

[Ralpheroo72]

If Richarlison is worth £50M, and Mitrovic is worth £27M, the Chavs can fuck right off with their alleged £30M bid for Ramsey. Mind you, it wouldn’t surprise me if our board sold him on the cheap.

[dostoy]

Ramsey will go to Chelsea or stay without signing a new deal.

If Arsenal will not allow him to stay without signing then he will go to Chelsea.

He won't sign a new deal.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

These sort of things tend to happen quickly when nobody expects it.

Things may reach a peak and stabilise but the 'bubble' won't burst for the foreseeable future.....ie the next 5 years imo.....unless FFP grows a pair, is made more robust and/or is reformed.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Ramsey will go to Chelsea or stay without signing a new deal.

If Arsenal will not allow him to stay without signing then he will go to Chelsea.

He won't sign a new deal.

So what you're saying is that he will certainly go to Chelsea.....

[Marc Overmars]

Things may reach a peak and stabilise but the 'bubble' won't burst for the foreseeable future.....ie the next 5 years imo.....unless FFP grows a pair, is made more robust and/or is reformed.

I agree, it's the most popular sport in the world by a considerable distance. There are fans on every continent who cannot consume enough of the product.

[Mac76]

So let's see Ramsay go to Chelski and piss the fans off by rushing forward and giving the ball away all the time, it'll be just like Sanchez, Moan Ure fans thought they'd got a good player but realised he has a very big downside

[SMatthews]

The problem with Alexis is Utd are not set up to get the best out of him. He needs to be the main guy in the frontline, the one the team is feeding. But he has Lukaku there who is the priority. Even when we had Giroud up front he was second fiddle to Alexis. The frontline needs to be set up around him, he can’t play a single role in front three. Long may it continue at Utd.

[SMatthews]

I agree, it's the most popular sport in the world by a considerable distance. There are fans on every continent who cannot consume enough of the product.

Amazon are getting involved, and Facebook, Netflix, Google and Apple were sniffing around too. I’m not sure the bubble will ever burst. It has such global appeal there will always be a company willing to spend mega money.

[Özim]

If Richarlison is worth £50M, and Mitrovic is worth £27M, the Chavs can fuck right off with their alleged £30M bid for Ramsey. Mind you, it wouldn’t surprise me if our board sold him on the cheap.

Trouble is he only has 1 year left on his contract (yes we've done it again), which impacts his value a lot. Also with him not having signing yet and being just over a week until the close of the transfer window I don't know why we haven't just set a deadline and then pursued a replacement, it's not looking good with him signing on now.

It's a pretty simple procedure, ask him if he wants to stay, ask him (or his agent) how what he wants, decide if you're willing to pay it, if not sell him.

[Power n Glory]

Amazon are getting involved, and Facebook, Netflix, Google and Apple were sniffing around too. I’m not sure the bubble will ever burst. It has such global appeal there will always be a company willing to spend mega money.

A lot of these companies are operating off debt but their stock market value stays sky high because people continue to flock to their services. But that's another story.

It's all based on viewers and how much can be squeezed from consumers. I don't know how many more times they can carve up the same cake and ask viewers to pay extra to watch the same thing but on a different platform.

[Mac76]

Trouble is he only has 1 year left on his contract (yes we've done it again), which impacts his value a lot. Also with him not having signing yet and being just over a week until the close of the transfer window I don't know why we haven't just set a deadline and then pursued a replacement, it's not looking good with him signing on now.

It's a pretty simple procedure, ask him if he wants to stay, ask him (or his agent) how what he wants, decide if you're willing to pay it, if not sell him.

What's Emery said about him so far? if he rates him then surely they should be getting him to re-sign but if he's not sure he needs him, and or are hoping to sign what they consider to be a better replacement, maybe that's why they're prevaricating

[Globalgunner]

Its pretty clear that the club want to keep him but not at any price. His attempting to get wage parity with Ozil is laughable IMO. We made a mistake giving Ozil that monstrous wage, especially since he was not really our marquee player and no one was really contending to sign him. The player we should have kept at all costs was Sanchez as we were completely reliant on him for goals these last 3 seasons. The club simply panicked as they did not want to lose 2 senior players at a crucial time in the life of the club. I am sure if Gazidis had been able to assure Sanchez that Wenger would be leaving at the end of the season, he might have signed on. however at the time Ivan had not gained the upper hand and it was until the fans deserted the stadium that Stan pulled the trigger.

As it is Ozil should have been signed on at least 100kpw less and Ramsey is stretching it to even turn down 150k
Fk Ramsey, let him take his no discipline, crocked half a season arse to Chelsea. They have plenty of space on the bench and physio`s aplenty to keep his bank account happy.

[Özim]

Its pretty clear that the club want to keep him but not at any price. His attempting to get wage parity with Ozil is laughable IMO. We made a mistake giving Ozil that monstrous wage, especially since he was not really our marquee player and no one was really contending to sign him. The player we should have kept at all costs was Sanchez as we were completely reliant on him for goals these last 3 seasons. The club simply panicked as they did not want to lose 2 senior players at a crucial time in the life of the club. I am sure if Gazidis had been able to assure Sanchez that Wenger would be leaving at the end of the season, he might have signed on. however at the time Ivan had not gained the upper hand and it was until the fans deserted the stadium that Stan pulled the trigger.

As it is Ozil should have been signed on at least 100kpw less and Ramsey is stretching it to even turn down 150k
Fk Ramsey, let him take his no discipline, crocked half a season arse to Chelsea. They have plenty of space on the bench and physio`s aplenty to keep his bank account happy.

Whether we want to keep him but not at any price doesn't matter too much, we should just tell him that's what's on the table, please give us an answer by this day and if not we'll have to look for a replacement, we shouldn't be sitting around aimlessly for months waiting for someone to sign on, either the want to or they don't and if they don't then we should move on and sign someone else and sell them.

We do seem to dither a lot when it comes to contracts, well that's excluding contracts for players who are useless and noone wants of course, with those we seem quite happy to hand them longer contracts well ahead of time.

[Globalgunner]

Whether we want to keep him but not at any price doesn't matter too much, we should just tell him that's what's on the table, please give us an answer by this day and if not we'll have to look for a replacement, we shouldn't be sitting around aimlessly for months waiting for someone to sign on, either the want to or they don't and if they don't then we should move on and sign someone else and sell them.

We do seem to dither a lot when it comes to contracts, well that's excluding contracts for players who are useless and noone wants of course, with those we seem quite happy to hand them longer contracts well ahead of time.

You have a immutable way pf saying the same thing with different words and believing you have spoken different. Me, I agree with everything you've just said.

[SMatthews]

A lot of these companies are operating off debt but their stock market value stays sky high because people continue to flock to their services. But that's another story.

It's all based on viewers and how much can be squeezed from consumers. I don't know how many more times they can carve up the same cake and ask viewers to pay extra to watch the same thing but on a different platform.

Most are massively in debt and don’t make much profit compared to turnover. That’s why they keep expanding into new areas. But if they fail, there’ll always be another one coming up on the rails. The last TV deal was slightly smaller than the previous but the PL sell off the right across the world for huge amounts ($700m to China alone). The PL couldn’t care less as long as they can keep whoring it out to the highest bidder.

[Power n Glory]

Most are massively in debt and don’t make much profit compared to turnover. That’s why they keep expanding into new areas. But if they fail, there’ll always be another one coming up on the rails. The last TV deal was slightly smaller than the previous but the PL sell off the right across the world for huge amounts ($700m to China alone). The PL couldn’t care less as long as they can keep whoring it out to the highest bidder.

I wonder how long BT can keep churning out the billions for CL money? In fact, it’s just been announced that they’ve lost the rights for NBA basketball and UFC because of spiralling costs. If you’re football, NBA and UFC fan, you’re going to have to dig deep if all your favourite sports are scattered across different platforms. I don’t know how long that can last for. Traditional TV is dying and I’m sure one day we’ll see a Premier League app that gives you access to all games in one place.

[Penguin]

Whether we want to keep him but not at any price doesn't matter too much, we should just tell him that's what's on the table, please give us an answer by this day and if not we'll have to look for a replacement, we shouldn't be sitting around aimlessly for months waiting for someone to sign on, either the want to or they don't and if they don't then we should move on and sign someone else and sell them.

We do seem to dither a lot when it comes to contracts, well that's excluding contracts for players who are useless and noone wants of course, with those we seem quite happy to hand them longer contracts well ahead of time.

You would think the club would have learned by now. I used to blame Wenger for naively believing that all of his players would definitely sign new contracts with us. It's really disappointing that the club is STILL getting caught in this situation after all the experience we've had with players running down their contracts.

[Power n Glory]

You would think the club would have learned by now. I used to blame Wenger for naively believing that all of his players would definitely sign new contracts with us. It's really disappointing that the club is STILL getting caught in this situation after all the experience we've had with players running down their contracts.

This isn’t a ‘STILL’ situation imo. It’s an inherited issue from Wenger’s era. Ramsey isn’t a solid performer. He’s injury prone and can be a liability. The only real reason to offer him a new deal would be to keep his valuation high on the market. But as pointed out in an earlier post, we’ve just extended Xhaka and Iwobi’s contracts. That’s two more players that divide opinion and we’re not all pleased with that move. The clubs damned if they do and damned if they don’t in a lot of these cases. I think we have enough cover for Ramsey and I like what I’ve heard about this new French kid we’ve just signed. No need to panic over this situation at all.

[Özim]

I wonder how long BT can keep churning out the billions for CL money? In fact, it’s just been announced that they’ve lost the rights for NBA basketball and UFC because of spiralling costs. If you’re football, NBA and UFC fan, you’re going to have to dig deep if all your favourite sports are scattered across different platforms. I don’t know how long that can last for. Traditional TV is dying and I’m sure one day we’ll see a Premier League app that gives you access to all games in one place.

UEFA said a couple years back they regretted selling the CL rights to BT and wished they'd kept it on terrestrial TV due to the huge difference in audience numbers, so I doubt BT will get it next time round.

[Özim]

This isn’t a ‘STILL’ situation imo. It’s an inherited issue from Wenger’s era. Ramsey isn’t a solid performer. He’s injury prone and can be a liability. The only real reason to offer him a new deal would be to keep his valuation high on the market. But as pointed out in an earlier post, we’ve just extended Xhaka and Iwobi’s contracts. That’s two more players that divide opinion and we’re not all pleased with that move. The clubs damned if they do and damned if they don’t in a lot of these cases. I think we have enough cover for Ramsey and I like what I’ve heard about this new French kid we’ve just signed. No need to panic over this situation at all.

Ramsey has far more value than Iwobi or Xhaka to be fair, he seems to be rated by maby clubs, Xhaka and Iwobi we'd stuggle to give away!

No panic but if we sell someone I expect us to spend the money on someone else, point is it should be done and dusted by now, IMO he should have either signed or we should have already sold him and had someone else coming in, the fact we haven't is just a repeat of what happened last summer.

[I am invisible]

This isn’t a ‘STILL’ situation imo. It’s an inherited issue from Wenger’s era. Ramsey isn’t a solid performer. He’s injury prone and can be a liability. The only real reason to offer him a new deal would be to keep his valuation high on the market. But as pointed out in an earlier post, we’ve just extended Xhaka and Iwobi’s contracts. That’s two more players that divide opinion and we’re not all pleased with that move. The clubs damned if they do and damned if they don’t in a lot of these cases. I think we have enough cover for Ramsey and I like what I’ve heard about this new French kid we’ve just signed. No need to panic over this situation at all.

With or without Ramsey, I'm a lot happier about our CM options going in to this season - Torreira, Guendouzi, and Maitland-Niles all look like exciting talents who are ready for regular games, we have Elneny as an unspectacular-but-steady performer, Iwobi might be a wildcard option, and there's at least a chance that we might see something more out of Xhaka with a proper DM next to him. I'd even chuck Smith-Rowe's name into the hat for a few games.

Certainly better than last year's offering of Xhaka, Elneny and Ramsey / Wilshere (who really only amount to a single player in terms of appearances)...

[Mac76]

Ramsey has far more value than Iwobi or Xhaka to be fair, he seems to be rated by maby clubs, Xhaka and Iwobi we'd stuggle to give away!

No panic but if we sell someone I expect us to spend the money on someone else, point is it should be done and dusted by now, IMO he should have either signed or we should have already sold him and had someone else coming in, the fact we haven't is just a repeat of what happened last summer.

I agree we should do what we did with Sanchez and cash in while Ramsay's a hot prospect in the minds of people who don't watch him week in week out - i notice he's shaved his beard off btw, is he trying to look smarter for the shop window...?

[Power n Glory]

Ramsey has far more value than Iwobi or Xhaka to be fair, he seems to be rated by maby clubs, Xhaka and Iwobi we'd stuggle to give away!

No panic but if we sell someone I expect us to spend the money on someone else, point is it should be done and dusted by now, IMO he should have either signed or we should have already sold him and had someone else coming in, the fact we haven't is just a repeat of what happened last summer.

This is the damned if they do/don’t statement I’m talking about. Iwobi is 22 years old. If he starts putting together great performances under Unai, his valuation will rocket and you’ll be pissed off we find ourselves in the same situation we’re now in with Ramsey. Same for Xhaka. Even if they don’t improve significantly, if we decide to sell next year, they maintain their valuation and we don’t have to sell for a knockdown price. If the likes of Everton are throwing around silly money, I bet a few clubs lower down would be willing to spend some money on these guys.

As said in my previous post, I think we may have already signed Ramsey’s replacement.

[Marc Overmars]

I'd rather Ramsey stayed because in the right system and under a good coach I think he could be a very effective player.

I get that he's looking after himself by chasing a big contract but he's not worth THAT much. So if he left then so be it. I think we will be able to move on fairly quickly.

[Özim]

This is the damned if they do/don’t statement I’m talking about. Iwobi is 22 years old. If he starts putting together great performances under Unai, his valuation will rocket and you’ll be pissed off we find ourselves in the same situation we’re now in with Ramsey. Same for Xhaka. Even if they don’t improve significantly, if we decide to sell next year, they maintain their valuation and we don’t have to sell for a knockdown price. If the likes of Everton are throwing around silly money, I bet a few clubs lower down would be willing to spend some money on these guys.

As said in my previous post, I think we may have already signed Ramsey’s replacement.

I'm not sure about Iwobi, I don't think he's got that much talent to be honest, his valuation could rocket, he could also be worth little
and we could end up being stuck with him, like so many before him.

Xhaka, not sure who will pay much for Xhaka, it's pretty much been shown the guy has little to offer, his performances for Switzerland are testament to that, can't see anyone paying anything of note for him.

Ramsey on the other hand is 27, coming into the prime of his career and we'd have no problem selling, signing him up would have made more sense in terms of resale value, he also offers more to the team.

With all due respect if you're referring the the French guy, he's 19 and has only played in a handful of friendlies, that's hardly evidence that he's going to be a ready made replacemement, most players struggle in their 1st season in the PL, never mind and 19 year old with little experience. He's realistically a player who will feature on and off, not a regular we should rely on.

That leaves Xhaka, no thanks.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

We can absorb the loss of Ramsey player wise (though there are a distinct lack of regular goal scorers in the squad), but the whole thing is still really annoying. We will probably end up giving in and having to pay up. The prospect of losing another asset of his magnitude won't sit well with the club and the cheaper option (all things considered) is probably to overpay him on wages because of his potential value.

[Power n Glory]

I'm not sure about Iwobi, I don't think he's got that much talent to be honest, his valuation could rocket, he could also be worth little
and we could end up being stuck with him, like so many before him.

Xhaka, not sure who will pay much for Xhaka, it's pretty much been shown the guy has little to offer, his performances for Switzerland are testament to that, can't see anyone paying anything of note for him.

Ramsey on the other hand is 27, coming into the prime of his career and we'd have no problem selling, signing him up would have made more sense in terms of resale value, he also offers more to the team.

With all due respect if you're referring the the French guy, he's 19 and has only played in a handful of friendlies, that's hardly evidence that he's going to be a ready made replacemement, most players struggle in their 1st season in the PL, never mind and 19 year old with little experience. He's realistically a player who will feature on and off, not a regular we should rely on.

That leaves Xhaka, no thanks.

Ramsey is injury prone and hasn't had a injury free season since 2012. He's 27 and things are pretty quiet for him on the transfer front. Fans are getting carried with this proposed resale value because we once upon a time the press reported a story of Barca wanting him for £50m. Outside of that, there has been no talk of any other club wanting him past or present for serious money. He's a £30m player. If we'd have no problem selling him, why have we not heard of anyone else besides Chelsea making a bid?

[SMatthews]

I'd rather Ramsey stayed because in the right system and under a good coach I think he could be a very effective player.

I get that he's looking after himself by chasing a big contract but he's not worth THAT much. So if he left then so be it. I think we will be able to move on fairly quickly.

It’s all ifs and maybes with that guy. If he hadn’t been injured so much...if he was developed under Wenger...maybe he’ll be better under Emery. Really don’t care if he leaves. A decade is a long time and for whatever reason he’s never been an exceptional player. Maybe that’s all he could’ve been whatever the club or manager. He’s too representative of the Wenger years and a replacement could give us what he has for years at the very least.

[fakeyank]

Ramsey can F*ck off tbh.. I think he can be a decent player under a good coach but I think he has been Wengerized to the point where he wont become world class anymore. Bring on some of the youth players and use his cash to get a solid winger.

#ByeFelicia

[Syn]

I’m actively rooting for Ramsey to fail even if he stays at Arsenal. The guy is toxic. He can thank Wenger for inflating his worth. No club will win a serious trophy as long as that goalhanger pretends to be in midfield. Top marks as a marathon runner, 2/10 for technical ability.

[Letters]

I’m actively rooting for Ramsey to fail even if he stays at Arsenal. The guy is toxic. He can thank Wenger for inflating his worth. No club will win a serious trophy as long as that goalhanger pretends to be in midfield. Top marks as a marathon runner, 2/10 for technical ability.

Harsh. He had that one season where he looked the real deal, he's not sustained that.
I don't think Ramsey is toxic, neither do I think he's particularly high quality but maybe with a different coach he could be, he's shown some potential.

[Marc Overmars]

Ramsey is pretty much a poor mans Lampard.

[Özim]

My thoughts on Ramsey as that he has a decent amount of talent, as he's shown when playing for Wales and also in flashes for us, he's scored some cracking goals.

He's had one good season and not maintained it, but I feel Wenger has to take a lot of the blame with his training regimes and also the way he used him, used in the right way he got be very useful for us.

I won't be devastated if he leaves, but losing him cut price would bug me, we shouldn't be losing players like this anymore, nor should we be waiting around until the end of the window when he has just a year left.

If we lost him I'd want us to spend the money for sure, in my eyes we should have cut our losses on Xhaka (probably wouldn't have got more than 10 million for him if we were lucky), I don't see how he can play in the team, he can't defend and can't attack, so how will he feature at all? At least Ramsey has clear strengths in that he likes to get forward and with Torreira it might allow him to do that.

[Özim]

Ramsey is injury prone and hasn't had a injury free season since 2012. He's 27 and things are pretty quiet for him on the transfer front. Fans are getting carried with this proposed resale value because we once upon a time the press reported a story of Barca wanting him for £50m. Outside of that, there has been no talk of any other club wanting him past or present for serious money. He's a £30m player. If we'd have no problem selling him, why have we not heard of anyone else besides Chelsea making a bid?

So were half of our squad with Wenger in charge, be interesting to see how that changes now. 27 but Chelsea are interested and Barca were as well, that's two top clubs, clearly they must see something in him as well.

Right now people know they can get him on a free next summer, why would they pay 30 million, that's the way I'd be seeing it, paying big money for a player out of contract in a year is a waste IMO, last summer only City came in for Alexis, does that make him a bad player?

[Power n Glory]

My thoughts on Ramsey as that he has a decent amount of talent, as he's shown when playing for Wales and also in flashes for us, he's scored some cracking goals.

He's had one good season and not maintained it, but I feel Wenger has to take a lot of the blame with his training regimes and also the way he used him, used in the right way he got be very useful for us.

I won't be devastated if he leaves, but losing him cut price would bug me, we shouldn't be losing players like this anymore, nor should we be waiting around until the end of the window when he has just a year left.

If we lost him I'd want us to spend the money for sure, in my eyes we should have cut our losses on Xhaka (probably wouldn't have got more than 10 million for him if we were lucky), I don't see how he can play in the team, he can't defend and can't attack, so how will he feature at all? At least Ramsey has clear strengths in that he likes to get forward and with Torreira it might allow him to do that.

;) You didn't have that sort of energy for Walcott despite him scoring more goals than Ramsey and having more than just one good season.

Also, Iwobi is still young, a more polished technical player than Ramsey in terms of dribbling, control and passing. Has suffered under Wenger's poor too but he's written off as a nothing player. But Ramsey has talent? Besides his running, he has no clear strengths. He's not even that clinical in front of goal.

[Özim]

;) You didn't have that sort of energy for Walcott despite him scoring more goals than Ramsey and having more than just one good season.

Also, Iwobi is still young, a more polished technical player than Ramsey in terms of dribbling, control and passing. Has suffered under Wenger's poor too but he's written off as a nothing player. But Ramsey has talent? Besides his running, he has no clear strengths. He's not even that clinical in front of goal.

You're right of course, but I'll be honest and say I thought he was rubbish right from the start, no skill, no footballing brain, just a speed merchant and thats how it turned out :d

Iwobi I'm not overly impressed with either, can be a decent player but will never be world class IMO, so if we'd sold him I wouldn't have been fussed, he's another one from our youth policy, like countless others that IMO probably won't make it (Akpom is about to be sold for 1m to a Greek club incidentally). You can't really compare Iwobi with Ramsey as they're different players, Ramsey makes some decent touches, but primarily it's his runs and attacking instinct that are his strengths. I've seen enough from him in the past and for Wales to see that he could be a very good goalscoring midfielder if used in the right way.

[Power n Glory]

So were half of our squad with Wenger in charge, be interesting to see how that changes now. 27 but Chelsea are interested and Barca were as well, that's two top clubs, clearly they must see something in him as well.

Right now people know they can get him on a free next summer, why would they pay 30 million, that's the way I'd be seeing it, paying big money for a player out of contract in a year is a waste IMO, last summer only City came in for Alexis, does that make him a bad player?

It was reported that Man City bid £60m for Sanchez with just one year on his contract. Come January he was still being linked with clubs for a £30m move. He was being linked with PSG, Liverpool, Chelsea and Bayern. But the point is, with just one year left on his deal, he was still being linked to a major money move. That's not the case for Ramsey. If a club want you they won't risk a free transfer.

[I am invisible]

Who comes in if Ramsey goes out then? Do we go big, or will it be another leftfield signing that no one sees coming?

[Bumble]

Who comes in if Ramsey goes out then? Do we go big, or will it be another leftfield signing that no one sees coming?

promote from within, give AMN more game time or one of the other young midfielders.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

This summer we could have had any of Max Meyer, Golovin, Seri, Moutinho and Nzonzi, Lemar, koulibaly and Oblak,yet people keep saying we can't compete. We can compete.....it's down to us as a club to make a mixture of definitively quality signings with measured gambles.

I don't even rate all of those as much as some but if we the unenlightened fans can pick a few players to improve us and spur us on, the club should be able to.

We've also had the benefit of most of our players back in good time for preseason. If we fail to get into the top 4 it will be on the current regime, not Wenger. Whatever we decide to do with Ramsey it better all work out in the end. We've had plenty of time with this one.

[Power n Glory]

This summer we could have had any of Max Meyer, Golovin, Seri, Moutinho and Nzonzi, Lemar, koulibaly and Oblak,yet people keep saying we can't compete. We can compete.....it's down to us as a club to make a mixture of definitively quality signings with measured gambles.

I don't even rate all of those as much as some but if we the unenlightened fans can pick a few players to improve us and spur us on, the club should be able to.

We've also had the benefit of most of our players back in good time for preseason. If we fail to get into the top 4 it will be on the current regime, not Wenger. Whatever we decide to do with Ramsey it better all work out in the end. We've had plenty of time with this one.

We’ve got a midfield imbalance to solve if we plan on playing a 3 man midfield. Xhaka, Ramsey and Ozil shouldn’t start in the midfield together. In fact, a combination where two out of the three start together shouldn’t happen. All three of the fuckers need support players around them to compensate for their weaknesses and we don’t have enough players on the pitch to solve that. They don’t complement each other and what they offer as individual players is lopsided. Ozil – Assists, Xhaka – Long range passes, Ramsey – Goals. All three are weak on defence and helping to dictate the tempo of a game with build-up play.

Saying that, we have just signed Lucas Torreira. I mentioned Guendouzi. AMN should get a run. Elneny is underrated. I think Iwobi should play a central role. I think we have the DM and CM positions covered even if we sell Ramsey. My main concern comes back to the wide positions, creative players and strikers. I guess we may see youth players getting game time plus Mkhitartan can play as the 10 or out wide. Same goes for Iwobi.

I really have no idea what the set up will be this season or how Emery will deal with rotation. How do you see us lining up this season?

[Power n Glory]

UEFA said a couple years back they regretted selling the CL rights to BT and wished they'd kept it on terrestrial TV due to the huge difference in audience numbers, so I doubt BT will get it next time round.

I remember they said that. But that didn't stop Uefa from renewing the deal for £1.2bn with BT. With BT increasing prices and now announcing the loss of NBA and UFC, they may lose customers. Their broadband and TV service aren't great from what I've heard. They've laid off thousands of workers for this. Seems like a nutty strategy that's not sustainable and will hurt them in the long run.

[Bumble]

I remember they said that. But that didn't stop Uefa from renewing the deal for £1.2bn with BT. With BT increasing prices and now announcing the loss of NBA and UFC, they may lose customers. Their broadband and TV service aren't great from what I've heard. They've laid off thousands of workers for this. Seems like a nutty strategy that's not sustainable and will hurt them in the long run.
BT CEO has left as well and it was his brainchild the Sports expansion and don't think shareholders are happy with the outlay when the money could have been spent on improving service and infrastructure.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

We’ve got a midfield imbalance to solve if we plan on playing a 3 man midfield. Xhaka, Ramsey and Ozil shouldn’t start in the midfield together. In fact, a combination where two out of the three start together shouldn’t happen. All three of the fuckers need support players around them to compensate for their weaknesses and we don’t have enough players on the pitch to solve that. They don’t complement each other and what they offer as individual players is lopsided. Ozil – Assists, Xhaka – Long range passes, Ramsey – Goals. All three are weak on defence and helping to dictate the tempo of a game with build-up play.

Saying that, we have just signed Lucas Torreira. I mentioned Guendouzi. AMN should get a run. Elneny is underrated. I think Iwobi should play a central role. I think we have the DM and CM positions covered even if we sell Ramsey. My main concern comes back to the wide positions, creative players and strikers. I guess we may see youth players getting game time plus Mkhitartan can play as the 10 or out wide. Same goes for Iwobi.

I really have no idea what the set up will be this season or how Emery will deal with rotation. How do you see us lining up this season?

I think we should be completely beyond seeing Xhaka, Ramsey and Ozil as a midfield trio unless less they show us something very firm in the way of why we should play that trio.

I think with instruction Ramsey can have the sort of game he had in his standout season. My worry is that Emery hasn't had the time to get into the focus on individuals and has emphasised focus on to the system (High press and fitness) which I wouldn't necessarily criticise.

With that in mind (and admittedly going mostly on reports, world cup cameos aside) I'd say Torreira is the first name on the sheet in midfield. Pair him alongside AMN or Ramsey, then I think you can play Ozil ahead. The discipline of Torreira will also allow Ramsey and Ozil to swap when Ozil what's to come deeper to affect the game from there.

If Guendouzi proves he is ready he seems like a far more mobile version of Xhaka, so I'm increasingly seeing less where Xhaka fits in and why he should play.

I think a lot of what we do actually hinges on a pacey wide player, of which we still don't have!....which is partly why there is such temptation to play Aubameyang wide as well as central. I think if we don't make that signing, it will hinder us sooner rather than later.

Getting rid of Alexi and Walcott and replacing him with Miki was not good for the squad in terms of balance or goals.

[Mac76]

I'm increasingly seeing less where Xhaka fits in and why he should play.

League Cup games, early Europa League ties...


Getting rid of Alexi and Walcott and replacing him with Miki was not good for the squad in terms of balance or goals.

don't agree - we got rid of two selfish wayward players who broke up our play and got a high-quality team player who will be a consistent deliverer of goals and assists as well as a hard worker in midfield

[Power n Glory]

League Cup games, early Europa League ties...



don't agree - we got rid of two selfish wayward players who broke up our play and got a high-quality team player who will be a consistent deliverer of goals and assists as well as a hard worker in midfield

Sanchez scored 30 goals with 18 assist whilst Walcott scored 19 goals in their last full seasons. Blinks right. That's a major loss and I don't see anyone else in the current squad getting those numbers.

[Marc Overmars]

I think Auba is likely to score 30 if he stays injury free. I agree though, in selling Alexis, Theo and Giroud in one go, we lost so much firepower.

Another reason why I'd prefer if Ramsey stayed, he can score goals from midfield.

[Özim]

Lacazette will also get a fair few, goal wise we're in a better place than we have been for years, two very good strikers.

Alexis was quality, but Walcott offered next to nothing often doing nothing in games.

I agree about the wide man though, we lack one, we have for years to be fair and that would be the player I'd be looking to sign, could have got Gelson Martins on a free if we'd been more proactive.

[Power n Glory]

Lacazette will also get a fair few, goal wise we're in a better place than we have been for years, two very good strikers.

Alexis was quality, but Walcott offered next to nothing often doing nothing in games.

I agree about the wide man though, we lack one, we have for years to be fair and that would be the player I'd be looking to sign, could have got Gelson Martins on a free if we'd been more proactive.

Ramsey in a nut shell. But playing in a key central position where we're more vulnerable and despite seeing the danger he won't defend. Credit to Walcott for actually doing a good job of defending and getting back in his last full season but still scoring 19.

[Özim]

Ramsey in a nut shell. But playing in a key central position where we're more vulnerable and despite seeing the danger he won't defend. Credit to Walcott for actually doing a good job of defending and getting back in his last full season but still scoring 19.

There's no point talking about Walcott, ultimately he was a failure at Arsenal, never performing well enough, despite scoring a few goals, 12 1/2 seasons and just twice getting close to or more than 20, in other seasons he barely got a dozen at most, even at Everton he's been poor despite a more prominent role.

Ramsey has more natural ability, interested to see what Emery can do with him.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Walcott in terms of how teams played against us and how they set up and his movement was very crucial, he often stretched the play when he was on the field and didn't score so many by accident.

We all agree that a) We're missing a wide player and b) that it would be ideal if that wide player is dynamic for the varied scenarios presented over the course of a season.

It's not use signing another centre forward who scores neither to swap in for Aubameyang/Lacazette, the potential additional goals need to come from other parts of the field...i.e midfield and/or wide.

We don't know that Emery will settle on Auba from wide left and Laca centre too.

I like Douglas Costa and Dembele don't I won't be the farm of either happening.

[Özim]

Walcott was basically a speed merchant most effective when coming on later when teams were tired, when he started games he rarely affected the play, problem with the guy is other than his speed he had very little to his game, hence the reason he never made it.

Douglas Costa is great, really energetic and makes things happen won't happen though as Juve just completed signing him for 40 million Euros in June, Juve really doing some good business this summer. Dembele forget it that's just media nonsense.

[Power n Glory]

There's no point talking about Walcott, ultimately he was a failure at Arsenal, never performing well enough, despite scoring a few goals, 12 1/2 seasons and just twice getting close to or more than 20, in other seasons he barely got a dozen at most, even at Everton he's been poor despite a more prominent role.

Ramsey has more natural ability, interested to see what Emery can do with him.

Ramsey has been here 10 years. The most he's scored is 16 and that was in 2013. He's never come close to scoring 20 goals and just about hits double figures. In 2014 he scored 10 and last season 11 goals. Other than that, we've got 7 seasons where he's scored between 1 to 6 goals.

I'll just let the numbers speak.

APP GOALS
2008–09[134] Premier League 22 1
2009–10[135] Premier League 29 4
2010–11[136] Premier League 8 1
2011–12[137] Premier League 44 3
2012–13[138] Premier League 47 2
2013–14[139] Premier League 34 16
2014–15[140] Premier League 41 10
2015–16[141] Premier League 40 6
2016–17[142] Premier League 32 4
2017–18[143] Premier League 30 11


Walcott's tally in comparison.
APP GOALS
2005–06[196] Premier League 0 0
2006–07[31] Premier League 32 1
2007–08[42] Premier League 39 7
2008–09[44] Premier League 35 6
2009–10[197] Premier League 30 4
2010–11[198] Premier League 38 13
2011–12[199] Premier League 46 11
2012–13[200] Premier League 43 21
2013–14[201] Premier League 18 6
2014–15[202] Premier League 21 7
2015–16[203] Premier League 42 9
2016–17[130] Premier League 37 19

[I am invisible]

We’ve got a midfield imbalance to solve if we plan on playing a 3 man midfield. Xhaka, Ramsey and Ozil shouldn’t start in the midfield together. In fact, a combination where two out of the three start together shouldn’t happen. All three of the fuckers need support players around them to compensate for their weaknesses and we don’t have enough players on the pitch to solve that. They don’t complement each other and what they offer as individual players is lopsided. Ozil – Assists, Xhaka – Long range passes, Ramsey – Goals. All three are weak on defence and helping to dictate the tempo of a game with build-up play.

Saying that, we have just signed Lucas Torreira. I mentioned Guendouzi. AMN should get a run. Elneny is underrated. I think Iwobi should play a central role. I think we have the DM and CM positions covered even if we sell Ramsey. My main concern comes back to the wide positions, creative players and strikers. I guess we may see youth players getting game time plus Mkhitartan can play as the 10 or out wide. Same goes for Iwobi.

I really have no idea what the set up will be this season or how Emery will deal with rotation. How do you see us lining up this season?
I can see those 3 in the same team, but, as you say, not in the same 3-man midfield - Özil would have to play as a creative winger and Ramsey would have to be in a more advanced role, where his marauding, maverick ways are less of a problem for us defensively. That frees up the extra space at the base of midfield that we need to make it work.

In terms of the support players needed, I think they do actually solve some of each other’s problems: Özil needs Ramsey (and other high-energy players who make runs and offer a goal threat); Ramsey always seems to play best with a Xhaka or Arteta type (ie someone who can feed him the ball from the back); but Xhaka, unfortunately, really needs a proper DM next to him at the base of midfield... and this is where the whole thing usually turns into a house of cards. Hopefully Torreira solves this for us, and that chain of dependency stops with him.

If Ramsey’s still here in a couple of weeks time then I expect we’ll be looking at some combo like that. So glad we have a couple of hungry players like Guendouzi and AMN there to keep them honest though - could be a very different midfield that ends the season to the one that starts it!

[Power n Glory]

Walcott in terms of how teams played against us and how they set up and his movement was very crucial, he often stretched the play when he was on the field and didn't score so many by accident.

We all agree that a) We're missing a wide player and b) that it would be ideal if that wide player is dynamic for the varied scenarios presented over the course of a season.

It's not use signing another centre forward who scores neither to swap in for Aubameyang/Lacazette, the potential additional goals need to come from other parts of the field...i.e midfield and/or wide.

We don't know that Emery will settle on Auba from wide left and Laca centre too.

I like Douglas Costa and Dembele don't I won't be the farm of either happening.

We're we're really missing an Alexis type to play out wide. Auba out wide just feels like a waste and I have a feeling he'll have games where we want him playing through the middle.

[Mac76]

Lacazette will also get a fair few, goal wise we're in a better place than we have been for years, two very good strikers.

Alexis was quality, but Walcott offered next to nothing often doing nothing in games.

I agree about the wide man though, we lack one, we have for years to be fair and that would be the player I'd be looking to sign, could have got Gelson Martins on a free if we'd been more proactive.

Don't forget we have Perez on the books, who looked very effective on the left even with the very few chances Wenger gave him - i really hope Emery gives him another chance

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Alexis was instrumental to us picking points up away from home and in truth Emery would have loved him for the pressing game.

Fortunately Mourinho is doing his magic so we don't have to pine for the player we lost so much.

[Power n Glory]

I can see those 3 in the same team, but, as you say, not in the same 3-man midfield - Özil would have to play as a creative winger and Ramsey would have to be in a more advanced role, where his marauding, maverick ways are less of a problem for us defensively. That frees up the extra space at the base of midfield that we need to make it work.

In terms of the support players needed, I think they do actually solve some of each other’s problems: Özil needs Ramsey (and other high-energy players who make runs and offer a goal threat); Ramsey always seems to play best with a Xhaka or Arteta type (ie someone who can feed him the ball from the back); but Xhaka, unfortunately, really needs a proper DM next to him at the base of midfield... and this is where the whole thing usually turns into a house of cards. Hopefully Torreira solves this for us, and that chain of dependency stops with him.

If Ramsey’s still here in a couple of weeks time then I expect we’ll be looking at some combo like that. So glad we have a couple of hungry players like Guendouzi and AMN there to keep them honest though - could be a very different midfield that ends the season to the one that starts it!

Slightly disagree with that. Because we had Giroud clogging up the middle with little movement up front for Ozil to work with, Ramsey going forward helped our lack of movement in the box. But Ozil didn't need Ramsey. He could play just as well when Sanchez was playing up top as striker or put a skillful CM like Cazorla behind him, it gives Ozil way more time to find space when off the ball. Ramsey bombing forward all the time made it harder for Ozil to pick up the ball in the final third, so he ends up chasing shadows and not really getting on the ball. Plus it helps to weaken our midfield even further because with Ozil in the final third and Ramsey impersonating a striker, we're left with one man in the midfield to defend which would be a problem for the best of players and god help us if that player turns out to be Granit Xhaka. Deer in a headlight effect when a player comes running at him.

The amount of goals Ramsey scores doesn't justify the pain it causes the midfield. He needs to find some discipline and find his way back to winning the ball for us with tackles and just dishing the ball off. If he reins it in a little, he'd be fine. Just needs to cut out the constant goal hunting every second of the game.

Xhaka's passing range doesn't justify his selection either. There is more than one way to skin a cat and I'm sure there are other ways to find Aaron Ramsey. In fact, I wouldn't want a player on the pitch that helps enable that gung ho approach from Ramsey. If we're playing Auba and Laca up top, Xhaka should be looking to for their runs. I'll never forget the video Theirry Henry did where Lacazette was making runs but Xhaka wasn't pulling the trigger. What was all that about? Pointless player if he can't get that right. Brings nothing to the table at all. By far the worst of the players and we need a sharp improvement.

[Mac76]

Slightly disagree with that. Because we had Giroud clogging up the middle with little movement up front for Ozil to work with, Ramsey going forward helped our lack of movement in the box. But Ozil didn't need Ramsey. He could play just as well when Sanchez was playing up top as striker or put a skillful CM like Cazorla behind him, it gives Ozil way more time to find space when off the ball. Ramsey bombing forward all the time made it harder for Ozil to pick up the ball in the final third, so he ends up chasing shadows and not really getting on the ball. Plus it helps to weaken our midfield even further because with Ozil in the final third and Ramsey impersonating a striker, we're left with one man in the midfield to defend which would be a problem for the best of players and god help us if that player turns out to be Granit Xhaka. Deer in a headlight effect when a player comes running at him.

The amount of goals Ramsey scores doesn't justify the pain it causes the midfield. He needs to find some discipline and find his way back to winning the ball for us with tackles and just dishing the ball off. If he reins it in a little, he'd be fine. Just needs to cut out the constant goal hunting every second of the game.

Xhaka's passing range doesn't justify his selection either. There is more than one way to skin a cat and I'm sure there are other ways to find Aaron Ramsey. In fact, I wouldn't want a player on the pitch that helps enable that gung ho approach from Ramsey. If we're playing Auba and Laca up top, Xhaka should be looking to for their runs. I'll never forget the video Theirry Henry did where Lacazette was making runs but Xhaka wasn't pulling the trigger. What was all that about? Pointless player if he can't get that right. Brings nothing to the table at all. By far the worst of the players and we need a sharp improvement.

:clap:

[Özim]

Ramsey has been here 10 years. The most he's scored is 16 and that was in 2013. He's never come close to scoring 20 goals and just about hits double figures. In 2014 he scored 10 and last season 11 goals. Other than that, we've got 7 seasons where he's scored between 1 to 6 goals.

I'll just let the numbers speak.

APP GOALS
2008–09[134] Premier League 22 1
2009–10[135] Premier League 29 4
2010–11[136] Premier League 8 1
2011–12[137] Premier League 44 3
2012–13[138] Premier League 47 2
2013–14[139] Premier League 34 16
2014–15[140] Premier League 41 10
2015–16[141] Premier League 40 6
2016–17[142] Premier League 32 4
2017–18[143] Premier League 30 11


Walcott's tally in comparison.
APP GOALS
2005–06[196] Premier League 0 0
2006–07[31] Premier League 32 1
2007–08[42] Premier League 39 7
2008–09[44] Premier League 35 6
2009–10[197] Premier League 30 4
2010–11[198] Premier League 38 13
2011–12[199] Premier League 46 11
2012–13[200] Premier League 43 21
2013–14[201] Premier League 18 6
2014–15[202] Premier League 21 7
2015–16[203] Premier League 42 9
2016–17[130] Premier League 37 19

Chalk and cheese really, you'd expect a winger/striker to score more goals, that's pretty much all Walcott did, he wasn't really involved in games for large parts and often came on as sub which was pretty much the only time he was effective. I think Ramsey offers more to the team than that, in addition he usually played from the start so didn't have the advantage of playing against tired defences as often.

As mentioned though, if we lose Ramsey, I'm not that fussed, just as long as we go and get a winger which is what we really need. But if I had to get rid of someone it would be Xhaka, he just has no role and nothing to offer, best thing we can do is sell him for what we can get for him.

[Power n Glory]

Chalk and cheese really, you'd expect a winger/striker to score more goals, that's pretty much all Walcott did, he wasn't really involved in games for large parts and often came on as sub which was pretty much the only time he was effective. I think Ramsey offers more to the team than that, in addition he usually played from the start so didn't have the advantage of playing against tired defences as often.

But he offered next to nothing, right? Right! ;)

At least you can admit when you're wrong. Do some research. Find some wingers that have a better goal scoring record.

[Özim]

Don't get it Max Meyer is available for free, apparently he wants big wages but Palace are close to signing him so they can't be that big, why aren't we in for him and getting rid of Ramsey with a week to go till the end of the season.

I do find our transfer/contract negotiation poor on the whole, why do things like this keep happening?

[Özim]

But he offered next to nothing, right? Right! ;)

At least you can admit when you're wrong. Do some research. Find some wingers that have a better goal scoring record.

:d

Truth is having seen Walcott in the flesh for years, if we could go back I wish we'd never signed him, too often he didn't deliver, his goals (the amount which never was anything particularly amazing when you put in context and who he scored against into the mix) just was nowhere near enough, there are loads of better wingers than him, that's why he's at Everton not pulling any trees out and not at another big club. He also feature up front a fair bit in that time.

[I am invisible]

Slightly disagree with that. Because we had Giroud clogging up the middle with little movement up front for Ozil to work with, Ramsey going forward helped our lack of movement in the box. But Ozil didn't need Ramsey. He could play just as well when Sanchez was playing up top as striker or put a skillful CM like Cazorla behind him, it gives Ozil way more time to find space when off the ball. Ramsey bombing forward all the time made it harder for Ozil to pick up the ball in the final third, so he ends up chasing shadows and not really getting on the ball. Plus it helps to weaken our midfield even further because with Ozil in the final third and Ramsey impersonating a striker, we're left with one man in the midfield to defend which would be a problem for the best of players and god help us if that player turns out to be Granit Xhaka. Deer in a headlight effect when a player comes running at him.

The amount of goals Ramsey scores doesn't justify the pain it causes the midfield. He needs to find some discipline and find his way back to winning the ball for us with tackles and just dishing the ball off. If he reins it in a little, he'd be fine. Just needs to cut out the constant goal hunting every second of the game.

Xhaka's passing range doesn't justify his selection either. There is more than one way to skin a cat and I'm sure there are other ways to find Aaron Ramsey. In fact, I wouldn't want a player on the pitch that helps enable that gung ho approach from Ramsey. If we're playing Auba and Laca up top, Xhaka should be looking to for their runs. I'll never forget the video Theirry Henry did where Lacazette was making runs but Xhaka wasn't pulling the trigger. What was all that about? Pointless player if he can't get that right. Brings nothing to the table at all. By far the worst of the players and we need a sharp improvement.

Yes, of course. I was including Ramsey as a general type of player who Özil needs around him - basically players who put in the energy that he often doesn't, and who offer movement and goal-threat, whether that's in front of him (strikers), from the side (wingers / wide atatckers), or on the overlap (attacking midfielders). The general point was that he's a play-maker in the attacking third, so his role is always going to be contingent on having other players around him to actually provide for (in the same way that forwards like Auba and Laca will always be largely reliant on the service they receive to do their jobs) - it would be nice if he could chip in with a few more goals himself, and get involved with the high-press, but the need for a supporting cast kind of goes with the territory with that type of player. If Ramsey has been getting in his way, then adapt their positions slightly so they don't keep ending up on top of each other in the centre.

I kind of take the opposite view with Ramsey: I think we absolutely should be enabling his gung-ho approach... just not in an area of the side that is discipline-critical (i.e. as one half of a two-man base in midfield). I A lot of my problems with him stem from how I view him as a player: as one half of a CM pairing (as we so often play) he's a liability, as he constantly disappears up front, leaving his partner exposed; but viewed as an attacker who frequently drops back as a bonus man in midfield... I think that could be an asset? Finding a way to effectively utilise that marauding style of his is what marks him out as something a bit different (and potentially special) in my eyes, and is the only thing that makes him worth all the effort we're putting in to trying to keep him - if what we're looking for is a more disciplined CM to play at the base of midfield, who can win the ball back and distribute it well, then I kind of feel that we have several better options for that already in AMN, Guendouzi and maybe even Elneny (all of whom would require less coaching for the role, and would cost considerably less in wages). I'd rather just cash in on Ramsey now and reinvest in other areas than spend a lot of time trying to mould him into that kind of midfielder.

You're point about Xhaka I totally agree with - for me, Guendouzi already looks like he'd give us that long-range distribution from the back, with a lot of extras besides, so if it were up to me then I'd be very tempted to chuck him in straightaway alongside Torreira (or AMN, although I haven't quite decided what kind of midfielder I think he is yet). However, what I'd like to see happen and what I think the club will do are two completely different things, and unfortunately I just don't see Xhaka, Ramsey (if he stays) or Özil being dropped - at least not to start with), anyway. Pragmatism is likely to be our best option to begin with: if we're going to be starting the season with these players, then we need to find a way to make them work together, and that's probably going to mean fitting all the supporting players in too. As I said, hopefully the buck stops with a DM (Torreira), where the supporting cast is concerned.

[Power n Glory]

Don't get it Max Meyer is available for free, apparently he wants big wages but Palace are close to signing him so they can't be that big, why aren't we in for him and getting rid of Ramsey with a week to go till the end of the season.

I do find our transfer/contract negotiation poor on the whole, why do things like this keep happening?

Never seen Max play but I’ve heard about him. What is he? I’m checking his background and seen he’s moved all over the shop. He was an attacking midfielder, he’s also played on the wings but spent the majority of last season playing as a DM.

His goal and assist numbers aren’t great so maybe that’s why. Still very young but you have to question why he’s on a free and only wanted by Palace. Remember what you said about Ramsey yesterday? If clubs aren’t moving for him with a year left on his contract, flood gates should open if he’s available on a free.

Have you watched him play? Is he really good?

[Power n Glory]

:d

Truth is having seen Walcott in the flesh for years, if we could go back I wish we'd never signed him, too often he didn't deliver, his goals (the amount which never was anything particularly amazing when you put in context and who he scored against into the mix) just was nowhere near enough, there are loads of better wingers than him, that's why he's at Everton not pulling any trees out and not at another big club. He also feature up front a fair bit in that time.

Name names bro!

I get the frustration with Walcott but not many have his goal scoring record. Always maintained that he should have been developed as a Lacazette type striker from a younger age. A lay a huge part of the blame on Wenger for that. But Walcott and the people around him should have advised him better and told him to leave earlier.

[I am invisible]

Never seen Max play but I’ve heard about him. What is he? I’m checking his background and seen he’s moved all over the shop. He was an attacking midfielder, he’s also played on the wings but spent the majority of last season playing as a DM.

His goal and assist numbers aren’t great so maybe that’s why. Still very young but you have to question why he’s on a free and only wanted by Palace. Remember what you said about Ramsey yesterday? If clubs aren’t moving for him with a year left on his contract, flood gates should open if he’s available on a free.

Have you watched him play? Is he really good?

Until recently, just another small, nippy attacking midfielder.

However, he's now one of a growing number of that type of AM who has made the switch to a deeper, DLP / DM role at the base of midfield, and is proving to be bloody good at it! (As former AMs, I guess they come with the perfect skill set to beat a high press, either through dribbling ability or creative passing?)

The next Alonso...? (https://www.bundesliga.com/en/news/Bundesliga/schalke-s-max-meyer-xabi-alonso-s-royal-blue-heir-bayern-munich-tedesco-474104.jsp)

The next Cazorla...? (https://www.football.london/arsenal-fc/transfer-news/arsenal-max-meyer-cazorla-schalke-14230237)

(If you look for any YT clips, don't bother looking beyond this season because they won't tell you much about his reinvention as a deep midfielder.)

I like the sound of him - sticking point might be the money he's asking for though? It's not that we can't comfortably afford it - it's that he's only 22, and I dread to think how high his wages could end up a few years down the line (esp. as he now has a history of running down his contract and forcing an exit).

[Özim]

Never seen Max play but I’ve heard about him. What is he? I’m checking his background and seen he’s moved all over the shop. He was an attacking midfielder, he’s also played on the wings but spent the majority of last season playing as a DM.

His goal and assist numbers aren’t great so maybe that’s why. Still very young but you have to question why he’s on a free and only wanted by Palace. Remember what you said about Ramsey yesterday? If clubs aren’t moving for him with a year left on his contract, flood gates should open if he’s available on a free.

Have you watched him play? Is he really good?

Didn't want to re-sign for Schalke apparently, allegedly the next German young hope, think he's creative but can play DM, seems very versatile.

Apparently his wage demands were too high initially which put clubs off, seem Palace have negotiated with him tho.

[Marc Overmars]

Walcott was limited but he did manage to score goals for us when Wenger felt generous enough to give him a run in the team. What you see is what you get with players like him, he's got one strength and if he can't express that he's rendered useless. He suffered one too many injuries and a lot of those came at times when he was enjoying a spell in the team but it was obvious Wenger never really fancied him.

He wasted his career here but of course there's no sympathy. He was on a huge contract and he clearly chose the easy option by staying for so long.

[Özim]

Name names bro!

I get the frustration with Walcott but not many have his goal scoring record. Always maintained that he should have been developed as a Lacazette type striker from a younger age. A lay a huge part of the blame on Wenger for that. But Walcott and the people around him should have advised him better and told him to leave earlier.

There's Martins, Perisic, Douglas Costa, Lemar, Di Maria, Draxler, Malcolm, Guedes, Pulisic all of these could have been signed (albeit some more expensive than others).

[Power n Glory]

There's Martins, Perisic, Douglas Costa, Lemar, Di Maria, Draxler, Malcolm, Guedes, Pulisic all of these could have been signed (albeit some more expensive than others).

:doh: Dude. Thomas Lemar has a career total of 27 goals. Single digits for all seasons besides once where he scored 14. I said to name players that have a better goal scoring record.

Draxler has career total of 53! Most he's scored in a season is 13. Another season he scored 10. Single digits every other season.

Douglas Costa...single digits for every season and he's 27 years old. Has never scored more than 7 in a season.

Gelson Martins - 13 goals is his highest. Career total of 31 goals. Single digits in every other season.


Do some research on all the players. I'm not saying they're not better players but not one player has better goal scoring record than Walcott. Not one player has had a better goal scoring season than Walcott. Only Di Maria matches the 21 goals he's scored.

[Özim]

:doh: Dude. Thomas Lemar has a career total of 27 goals. Single digits for all seasons besides once where he scored 14. I said to name players that have a better goal scoring record.

Draxler has career total of 53! Most he's scored in a season is 13. Another season he scored 10. Single digits every other season.

Douglas Costa...single digits for every season and he's 27 years old. Has never scored more than 7 in a season.

Gelson Martins - 13 goals is his highest. Career total of 31 goals. Single digits in every other season.


Do some research on all the players. I'm not saying they're not better players but not one player has better goal scoring record than Walcott. Not one player has had a better goal scoring season than Walcott. Only Di Maria matches the 21 goals he's scored.

Goals are too simplistic a method to judge a wingers' talent on, we've seen with Walcott that he's never excelled, despite the odd half decent goalscoring season, you also have to look at who his goals came against to give that stat context.

A winger is there more to create than score at the end of the day, goals are a bonus, Walcott added very little in that respect, having watched him for years and never really been impressed (and many others would say the same) I can say he wasn't very good for us and that we're better off without him.

If we found a creative winger with some dribbling skills I'd be more than happy, we don't need lots of goals from a winger, we need them to offer penetration and creativity for us.

[Power n Glory]

Goals are too simplistic a method to judge someones' talent, we've seen with Walcott that he's never excelled, despite the odd half decen goalscoring season, you also have to look at who his goals came against to give that stat context.

A winger is there more to create than score at the end of the day, goals are a bonus, Walcott added very little.

But I asked you a specific question about his goal scoring record and to find players with a better record. I already know what you think of his ability. Now you're switching goal posts.

As the original point Blink was making, it's not that easy to find goal scoring wingers, even those with much more talent than Walcott, they're not banging in that many goals yet you criticise Walcott's goal record. It's silly and shows ignorance and unnecessary bias.

Walcott lacked the creativity of most wingers but he's up there in terms of his goal record. That's why he's an enigma. I've always felt he'd be appreciated more if developed as a striker because you can get away with a strikers that are just goal machines and poachers. They're appreciated more in the game.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Think Walcott got a ton of assists in the RvP golden season but let's avoid the Walcott debate. The numbers PG tips just provided does make for stark and interesting reading though. Scoring goals is not easy no matter the opposition, lest we forget the horrendous away record last season.

I don't want to be sitting there when Aubameyang is injured and Lacazette is having an off day, thinking, where the hell is a goal going to come from. But we will be in that position a number of times before Christmas at the rate we are going.

I'm so desperate for us to sign a tricky winger, I find myself warming to the idea of Zaha....though Palace would want a nonsensical fee and he is yet another player who's end product is sketchy even if his value to Palace isn't.

There's only value in bringing a winger of high quality or a pointedly useful and effective skill set otherwise, we aren't getting anything Perez and Welbeck couldn't provide.

[Özim]

But I asked you a specific question about his goal scoring record and to find players with a better record. I already know what you think of his ability. Now you're switching goal posts.

As the original point Blink was making, it's not that easy to find goal scoring wingers, even those with much more talent than Walcott, they're not banging in that many goals yet you criticise Walcott's goal record. It's silly and shows ignorance and unnecessary bias.

Walcott lacked the creativity of most wingers but he's up there in terms of his goal record. That's why he's an enigma. I've always felt he'd be appreciated more if developed as a striker because you can get away with a strikers that are just goal machines and poachers. They're appreciated more in the game.

Fair enough, but just focussing on that is wrong IMO, his goals were rarely crucial to us, he wasn't a matchwinner.

Most wingers don't focus on goals, that was his only focus, he had no skill, couldn't beat his man, couldn't cross all he could do was run, on that basis he's bound to have a better record than most, because mostly wingers are there to create.

The point with him is how many times did his goals win us key games and how many times were they against average opposition, in addition how often were they when he came on against tired defences, doesn't really take much skill to perform at your best when the opposition is tired and when you've got pace.

IMO he just never had any footballing intelligence, ultimately all he had was pace. But despite his goals, I just never really saw what he brought to the team, yes he scored a few goals but that most of the time he was anonymous, I think he basically was overhyped and could never deliver on that hype because he never had the talent.

I'd never want us to sign another player like him, too one dimensional and unlike someone like Overmars, couldn't deliver when it mattered.

[Power n Glory]

Think Walcott got a ton of assists in the RvP golden season but let's avoid the Walcott debate. The numbers PG tips just provided does make for stark and interesting reading though. Scoring goals is not easy no matter the opposition, lest we forget the horrendous away record last season.

I don't want to be sitting there when Aubameyang is injured and Lacazette is having an off day, thinking, where the hell is a goal going to come from. But we will be in that position a number of times before Christmas at the rate we are going.

I'm so desperate for us to sign a tricky winger, I find myself warming to the idea of Zaha....though Palace would want a nonsensical fee and he is yet another player who's end product is sketchy even if his value to Palace isn't.

There's only value in bringing a winger of high quality or a pointedly useful and effective skill set otherwise, we aren't getting anything Perez and Welbeck couldn't provide.

Dragging up Theo’s assist stats would be a mission but I remember those years.

It’s not easy to score goals, especially when you’re playing a wide position. That’s probably my main concern this season for Aubameyang or Lacazette if they’re pushed to a wide position. Agree on the type of winger we need to bring in as well. If they don’t fit the profile, we might as well just stick with what we have and hope someone there makes their mark.

[Power n Glory]

Fair enough, but just focussing on that is wrong IMO, his goals were rarely crucial to us, he wasn't a matchwinner.

Most wingers don't focus on goals, that was his only focus, he had no skill, couldn't beat his man, couldn't cross all he could do was run, on that basis he's bound to have a better record than most, because mostly wingers are there to create.

The point with him is how many times did his goals win us key games and how many times were they against average opposition, in addition how often were they when he came on against tired defences, doesn't really take much skill to perform at your best when the opposition is tired and when you've got pace.

IMO he just never had any footballing intelligence, ultimately all he had was pace, a decent striker needs m. But despite his goals, I just never really saw what he brought to the team, yes he scored a few goals but that most of the time he was anonymous, I think he basically was overhyped and could never deliver on that hype because he never had the talent.

I'd never want us to sign another player like him, too one dimensional and unlike someone like Overmars, couldn't deliver when it mattered.

Do some of your own research. We all have access to the Internet!

It's a huge waste of time for me to look this up and provide the facts for you to then switch goal posts.


Start here.
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/theo-walcott/bilanz/spieler/33713

As you can see, the top 5 clubs he's scored most goals against is Newcastle, Chelsea, West Ham, Spurs, Man City!

It’s always a problem for me when people just talk reckless without facts. Back up you’re argument with facts because most of what you’ve said can be measured and isn’t simply subjective.

[Özim]

Do some of your own research. We all have access to the Internet!

It's a huge waste of time for me to look this up and provide the facts for you to then switch goal posts.


Start here.
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/theo-walcott/bilanz/spieler/33713

As you can see, the top 5 clubs he's scored most goals against is Newcastle, Chelsea, West Ham, Spurs, Man City!

It’s always a problem for me when people just talk reckless without facts. Back up you’re argument with facts because most of what you’ve said can be measured and isn’t simply subjective.

I actually looked and couldn't find exactly when and who he scored against, with all goals you need context, if they come as the 3rd or 4th goal in a match you're winning or in a game you've lost they're rarely crucial.

What I couldn't find is which games he scored in and when.

Ignoring that the past though, we just need to look at how he's done at Everton and the truth is not very well.

[Power n Glory]

I actually looked and couldn't find exactly when and who he scored against, with all goals you need context, if they come as the 3rd or 4th goal in a match you're winning or in a game you've lost they're rarely crucial.

What I couldn't find is which games he scored in and when.

All the information is on the site I provided.

Again, switching goal posts. Look it up. Compare it to other wingers and then ask yourself why the winger you've mentioned haven't got impressive goal records since it's so easy?

[Özim]

All the information is on the site I provided.

Again, switching goal posts. Look it up. Compare it to other wingers and then ask yourself why the winger you've mentioned haven't got impressive goal records since it's so easy?

Actually I can't find it, it doesn't show the results in the games and when he scored the goals and in which games, it just gives you totals.

But I found something that illustrates what I mean, in his best season have a look at who he scored against, the results and when in the season (i.e after we were out of everything or not), from what I can see it shows his goals weren't generally against the big teams or in tight games or at key stages of the season.

He scored in a lot of big wins, defeats and in games that didn't matter and only ocasionally in games that did.

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/theo-walcott/leistungsdaten/spieler/33713/plus/0?saison=2012

As I said he's one not one of those players you can rely on to win you matches.

As for your comment about wingers, he was never a conventional winger and never played like one, to compare him with someone intent on creating wouldn't really be fair. I've seen him with my own eyes and that tells you more than most things, on that basis he just wasn't up to par and I'd have happily replaced him in a flash.

[Power n Glory]

Jesus Christ, Zim. That last paragraph has to sum up the tap dancing and shifting goal posts to justify a bullshit argument. So now it's unfair to compare him to other wingers? OK.

[Özim]

What I'm basically saying is he was rubbish up front and rubbish on the wing, the goals he scored don't change that, his performances were still average overall and I'm glad we got rid and made him someoene elses problem.

I want us to get a good winger, nothing like Walcott as he was wasn't good enough, comparing him to the best wingers around is pointless as IMO they're superior.

[Power n Glory]

Yes, of course. I was including Ramsey as a general type of player who Özil needs around him - basically players who put in the energy that he often doesn't, and who offer movement and goal-threat, whether that's in front of him (strikers), from the side (wingers / wide atatckers), or on the overlap (attacking midfielders). The general point was that he's a play-maker in the attacking third, so his role is always going to be contingent on having other players around him to actually provide for (in the same way that forwards like Auba and Laca will always be largely reliant on the service they receive to do their jobs) - it would be nice if he could chip in with a few more goals himself, and get involved with the high-press, but the need for a supporting cast kind of goes with the territory with that type of player. If Ramsey has been getting in his way, then adapt their positions slightly so they don't keep ending up on top of each other in the centre.

I kind of take the opposite view with Ramsey: I think we absolutely should be enabling his gung-ho approach... just not in an area of the side that is discipline-critical (i.e. as one half of a two-man base in midfield). I A lot of my problems with him stem from how I view him as a player: as one half of a CM pairing (as we so often play) he's a liability, as he constantly disappears up front, leaving his partner exposed; but viewed as an attacker who frequently drops back as a bonus man in midfield... I think that could be an asset? Finding a way to effectively utilise that marauding style of his is what marks him out as something a bit different (and potentially special) in my eyes, and is the only thing that makes him worth all the effort we're putting in to trying to keep him - if what we're looking for is a more disciplined CM to play at the base of midfield, who can win the ball back and distribute it well, then I kind of feel that we have several better options for that already in AMN, Guendouzi and maybe even Elneny (all of whom would require less coaching for the role, and would cost considerably less in wages). I'd rather just cash in on Ramsey now and reinvest in other areas than spend a lot of time trying to mould him into that kind of midfielder.

You're point about Xhaka I totally agree with - for me, Guendouzi already looks like he'd give us that long-range distribution from the back, with a lot of extras besides, so if it were up to me then I'd be very tempted to chuck him in straightaway alongside Torreira (or AMN, although I haven't quite decided what kind of midfielder I think he is yet). However, what I'd like to see happen and what I think the club will do are two completely different things, and unfortunately I just don't see Xhaka, Ramsey (if he stays) or Özil being dropped - at least not to start with), anyway. Pragmatism is likely to be our best option to begin with: if we're going to be starting the season with these players, then we need to find a way to make them work together, and that's probably going to mean fitting all the supporting players in too. As I said, hopefully the buck stops with a DM (Torreira), where the supporting cast is concerned.

Agree with most of that. Ozil is definitely capable of more and if he was more a goal threat, maybe that would help curb Ramsey's urge to get forward so much and just look to get him the ball in the most dangerous areas whilst making the occasional runs forward.

I thought Emery had plans of playing a 4-3-3 with Ozil going wide and three CM's in the middle. Maybe Xhaka, Ramsey and Torreira as the trio. But it looks like he's playing Ozil as a 10. I have no idea how that will work. Even with Torrira as DM, I think we'll be left badly exposed with Unai doesn't tell Ramsey to cut out the roaming forward and focus on distribution and pressing in the middle. Same goes for Ozil as a 10. He has to contribute more on both defence and attack. The guy has the feet and ball control to unlock a defence with his dribbling and wish he'd take more risks in possession and not play the percentages.

If Unai can't coach some discipline into these guys and get them to be more productive, he has to drop them. If he falls into the same trap as Wenger, we'll be in trouble. I don't want to see Ozil or Ramsey shifted on to the wing because they weaken our midfield only to discover they weaken our wing play as well. Same trap Wenger would fall into with certain players and I potentially see that happening if Emery isn't brave enough to drop unperforming players. I also think we have to be careful not to compound the problem by dumping more clay onto an already messy pile by dipping into the transfer market to buy players to compliment underperforming players with obvious weaknesses. Wenger made that mistake with Giroud when we bought Ozil. They were incompatible but Giroud was undroppable and then we bought another player that was undroppable. It could have worked if Ozil was more of a goal threat and made runs into the box. Giroud would have been great with the link up play. But on the other hand, Ozil needs a player that is faster and more of goal threat than Giroud.

Either way, a lot to look forwards to this season and we'll see how Emery addresses these the problems.

[hobson's choice]

Long as Ramsey and Xhaka are on this team, they will be shoe horned into this lineup regardless of form.

I won't get excited bout our fortunes till those 2 are playing elsewhere.

[Penguin]

I thought Emery had plans of playing a 4-3-3 with Ozil going wide and three CM's in the middle. Maybe Xhaka, Ramsey and Torreira as the trio. But it looks like he's playing Ozil as a 10. I have no idea how that will work. Even with Torrira as DM, I think we'll be left badly exposed with Unai doesn't tell Ramsey to cut out the roaming forward and focus on distribution and pressing in the middle. Same goes for Ozil as a 10. He has to contribute more on both defence and attack. The guy has the feet and ball control to unlock a defence with his dribbling and wish he'd take more risks in possession and not play the percentages.

If Unai can't coach some discipline into these guys and get them to be more productive, he has to drop them. If he falls into the same trap as Wenger, we'll be in trouble. I don't want to see Ozil or Ramsey shifted on to the wing because they weaken our midfield only to discover they weaken our wing play as well. Same trap Wenger would fall into with certain players and I potentially see that happening if Emery isn't brave enough to drop unperforming players. I also think we have to be careful not to compound the problem by dumping more clay onto an already messy pile by dipping into the transfer market to buy players to compliment underperforming players with obvious weaknesses. Wenger made that mistake with Giroud when we bought Ozil. They were incompatible but Giroud was undroppable and then we bought another player that was undroppable. It could have worked if Ozil was more of a goal threat and made runs into the box. Giroud would have been great with the link up play. But on the other hand, Ozil needs a player that is faster and more of goal threat than Giroud.

Either way, a lot to look forwards to this season and we'll see how Emery addresses these the problems.

Last night Emery tried Ozil wide so I don't think the positions are set in stone yet. Ramsey was supposed to be the most advanced CM but he injured himself before the game. :rolleyes:

The part in bold is important and without a doubt Ozil weakened our wing play last night. He plays the safe, obvious passes too often. He needs to be more proactive and take a few risks in the final third.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Ozil wide is fine if it is balanced out by a very different player on the other side, otherwise I can't abide it. His ability to swing a ball in and cross from wide positions is probably his most underrated attribute to my mind, unless you take the view that his movement is still criminally under appreciated or acknowledged.

[Gooner23]

Any one else struggling to see what Mhiki adds to the team? The occasional glimpse of quality but then goes very quiet for big chunks of the game. Can't seem him getting too many goals either. Iwobi very similar.

[Power n Glory]

Last night Emery tried Ozil wide so I don't think the positions are set in stone yet. Ramsey was supposed to be the most advanced CM but he injured himself before the game. :rolleyes:

The part in bold is important and without a doubt Ozil weakened our wing play last night. He plays the safe, obvious passes too often. He needs to be more proactive and take a few risks in the final third.

We’ll see how this Ramsey situation plays out. Either it’s a genuine injury or he’s about to be sold. If it really is an injury we really have to reconsider a new contract.

I didn’t see the game but not hard to imagine. I’ve seen how Ozil played on the wing for Germany and he’s done it for us on a few occasions and hasn’t looked great. To be fair, whenever we take a central player to play wide, they always look out of sorts. Plenty of examples to go by. Iwobi and Wilshere spring to mind. We’ll lose out on creativity and consistency if we try to play someone isn’t a natural born winger.

[I am invisible]

Any one else struggling to see what Mhiki adds to the team? The occasional glimpse of quality but then goes very quiet for big chunks of the game. Can't seem him getting too many goals either. Iwobi very similar.

An alternate option to Özil, mostly (and experience of playing with Aubameyang).

My biggest issue with him is that I don't think he and Özil should play at the same time, because they do the much the same job - if you already have Özil on the pitch, in a more prominent area, then Mkhi becomes kind of redundant, and ends up not really doing much at all. I suspect we'd get a lot more out of him, if he was being rotated with Özil rather than playing alongside him.

[Power n Glory]

Ozil wide is fine if it is balanced out by a very different player on the other side, otherwise I can't abide it. His ability to swing a ball in and cross from wide positions is probably his most underrated attribute to my mind, unless you take the view that his movement is still criminally under appreciated or acknowledged.

We missed a trick when we had Giroud. We maybe should have been playing Ozil wide left to swing in crosses to Giroud.

As for Ozil’s movement off the ball and ability to find space, It’s not something I think we should go crazy for. What purpose does it serve if it doesn’t really aide our attack? What I love about Cesc and Rosicky is that they’d find space and demand the ball when open.

[Power n Glory]

An alternate option to Özil, mostly (and experience of playing with Aubameyang).

My biggest issue with him is that I don't think he and Özil should play at the same time, because they do the much the same job - if you already have Özil on the pitch, in a more prominent area, then Mkhi becomes kind of redundant, and ends up not really doing much at all. I suspect we'd get a lot more out of him, if he was being rotated with Özil rather than playing alongside him.

MK definitely looks like another player that’s a central player. At this rate, we might as well play a 4-2-2-2 or diamond if we’re trying to keep all the main players on the pitch. Emery will have to cut a couple of big names for this to work.

[I am invisible]

Ozil wide is fine if it is balanced out by a very different player on the other side, otherwise I can't abide it. His ability to swing a ball in and cross from wide positions is probably his most underrated attribute to my mind, unless you take the view that his movement is still criminally under appreciated or acknowledged.

At the very least, I think he has all the tools to do the job. I mean, if you didn't know you were talking about Mesut Özil, and someone just listed out a lot of his best attributes... smart movement... great close control and dribbling ability... ability to swing in laser-guided crosses from wide positions... gets a lot of assists from cut-backs... then you might be forgiven for thinking that you were hearing about the tricky winger we all want?

It's not even unprecedented for him - he's played both wings for Germany many times, and he's played both wings for Madrid. Even when he plays as a no.10, he'll spend much of the game drifting wide. (I also think there's a more of a goal-threat in him than he likes to show.)

Granted, he'd have a bit of learning to do on the defensive side, but I think he's going to have to do that wherever he plays across the attack, if we're implementing a high-press?

Really not sure what the barrier is for him here? I can only assume it's a mental block or some kind of reluctance to give it a proper try?

[I am invisible]

MK definitely looks like another player that’s a central player. At this rate, we might as well play a 4-2-2-2 or diamond if we’re trying to keep all the main players on the pitch. Emery will have to cut a couple of big names for this to work.
I love how M's name gets shorter every time it's written!

Funny you should say that [about the 4-2-2-2]... I was just thinking that that's how most of these shapes / formations will probably end up in real-time when we're in possession. Most likely we'll end up Özil either coming more central to play through balls (or getting down the channels for cut-backs), with Auba hitting the near post, Laca ghosting in behind to the back post (hopefully unnoticed) and Ramsey following in as a delayed runner to give us a 3-pronged goal-threat. Any real width will be provided by the fullback on whatever side the play is on.

I've always thought that shape was more about how we regroup when we're defending anyway, and where our players should be starting attacks from - beyond that there's not much predicting how it will unfold, as wide players might come central, central players might go wide, advanced players might drop back (e.g. for hold-up play), deeper players might overlap, wingers might swap sides, etc, etc... basically anyone in the front 4 could end up anywhere, really! As long as the rest of the team maintains a more rigid, disciplined shape then I'm kind of happy for the for the attackers to freestyle it (to a certain extent).

This is why I don't think I'll ever understand why so many attackers care so much about the exact starting positions they're given - across the 90 minutes, they're likely to end up doing a bit of everything anyway, and in a high-press they're certainly all going to have to put in a defensive shift - is it really that big a deal? (Keeping in mind we're talking about "professionals" here, who are paid millions of pounds a year to do this for a living - just deal with it, please!)

[Power n Glory]

I love how M's name gets shorter every time it's written!

Funny you should say that [about the 4-2-2-2]... I was just thinking that that's how most of these shapes / formations will probably end up in real-time when we're in possession. Most likely we'll end up Özil either coming more central to play through balls (or getting down the channels for cut-backs), with Auba hitting the near post, Laca ghosting in behind to the back post (hopefully unnoticed) and Ramsey following in as a delayed runner to give us a 3-pronged goal-threat. Any real width will be provided by the fullback on whatever side the play is on.

I've always thought that shape was more about how we regroup when we're defending anyway, and where our players should be starting attacks from - beyond that there's not much predicting how it will unfold, as wide players might come central, central players might go wide, advanced players might drop back (e.g. for hold-up play), deeper players might overlap, wingers might swap sides, etc, etc... basically anyone in the front 4 could end up anywhere, really! As long as the rest of the team maintains a more rigid, disciplined shape then I'm kind of happy for the for the attackers to freestyle it (to a certain extent).

This is why I don't think I'll ever understand why so many attackers care so much about the exact starting positions they're given - across the 90 minutes, they're likely to end up doing a bit of everything anyway, and in a high-press they're certainly all going to have to put in a defensive shift - is it really that big a deal? (Keeping in mind we're talking about "professionals" here, who are paid millions of pounds a year to do this for a living - just deal with it, please!)

For me, the starting position matters and effects how we attack and defend. The more you freestyle, the harder it gets to maintain a rigid order. It relates back to what we were saying about Ramsey, if he’s bombing forward further than the striker, his recovery run to try and defend when play breaks down will be difficult and almost impossible to recover from. You need someone to cover his position.
But if you have wingers that are also cut inside to a central position exposing the flanks, full backs bombing forward to compensate for a in drifting wingers, you’re left vulnerable to counter attacking teams.

Also, this relates to what I was saying to Blink about Ozil, I believe if you’re not playing in your natural position when receiving the ball, you’re always having to work yourself into getting into the optimal position but by the time you work your way in field or out wide, the opportunity has gone or you’ve lost the ball. If you’re hogging possession and have a slow build up play, you’ll eventually get into the spot you want to be in but you’re most likely crowded out by defenders.

[Özim]

Ozil has been great on the wing for Germany and Real I believe, been very effective on the counter, IMO that's his best position when he performs.

[Mac76]

Ozil has been great on the wing for Germany and Real I believe, been very effective on the counter, IMO that's his best position when he performs.

The World Cup kind of passed you by, then...?

[Power n Glory]

Ozil has been great on the wing for Germany and Real I believe, been very effective on the counter, IMO that's his best position when he performs.

Yes and in 2011/12, Wayne Rooney was still banging in goals for Man Utd. Things change and shit happens.

[Özim]

The World Cup kind of passed you by, then...?

I didn't mean in the World Cup, but in the past when Ozil has stood out, this was generally on the wing in counter attacks, IMO that's where he excels, quick counters where he delivers a great cross or ball as his delivery is very accurate.

We just don't seem to use him to his strengths consequently we never see the best of him.

[Özim]

Yes and in 2011/12, Wayne Rooney was still banging in goals for Man Utd. Things change and shit happens.

But not for Walcott right, he's still hard done by even today ;)

More recently than that for sure, IMO we haven't used Ozil effectively, he needs to be in a counter attacking team if you want to see him at his best.

[Power n Glory]

But not for Walcott right, he's still hard done by even today ;)

More recently than that for sure, IMO we haven't used Ozil effectively, he needs to be in a counter attacking team if you want to see him at his best.

Walcott's time has come and gone.

Everything discussed yesterday was past tense and based on what he’s done and not what he can do today. I thought you’d understand that.

Bringing up what Ozil did at Real Madrid for Jose Mourinho is pointless. People are talking about his performance for Arsenal yesterday and what we’ve seen of him on the wing in the past for Arsenal and Germany. What worked almost 10 years ago might not work today.

[Özim]

Walcott's time has come and gone.

Everything discussed yesterday was past tense and based on what he’s done and not what he can do today. I thought you’d understand that.

Bringing up what Ozil did at Real Madrid for Jose Mourinho is pointless. People are talking about his performance for Arsenal yesterday and what we’ve seen of him on the wing in the past for Arsenal and Germany. What worked almost 10 years ago might not work today.

As I said though, we've never played him in the right way, I've always maintained he never suited our style of play, he's best suited to counter attacking, unless we play wth more pace and with more counters we'll never see the best of him.

He's not been in great form for Germany recently but he wasn't German footballer of the year in 2011, 2012, 2013,2015 and 2016 for nothing.

[Power n Glory]

As I said though, we've never played him in the right way, I've always maintained he never suited our style of play, he's best suited to counter attacking, unless we play wth more pace and with more counters we'll never see the best of him.

He's not been in great form for Germany recently but he wasn't German footballer of the year in 2011, 2012, 2013,2015 and 2016 for nothing.

If you’ve been following the conversation, this is exactly what folks in here have been talking about this morning.

[Özim]

If you’ve been following the conversation, this is exactly what folks in here have been talking about this morning.

We will if we play more counter attack of course, whether we do or not is up for debate of course, I didn't categorically say we'd never see the best of him, just that we may not.

[Power n Glory]

We will if we play more counter attack of course, whether we do or not is up for debate of course, I didn't categorically say we'd never see the best of him, just that we may not.

But you did that.

[Power n Glory]

Never mind. Someone else can comment on how we played yesterday and over the pre season. Are we taking a faster more counter attacking approach?

[Özim]

Never mind. Someone else can comment on how we played yesterday and over the pre season. Are we taking a faster more counter attacking approach?

From what I've seen we were played off the park yesterday in the 1st half and Chelsea should have been 3 up, then they made a stack of changes in the 2nd half (including taking Cesc off) and we got back into the game.

Bellerin had a mare but Smith-Rowe and Lacazette looked sharp. Defending was awful in the 1st half, similar to last season.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Hearing Cech is taking up a higher starting position. I get the feeling he feels invigorated for this season. Perhaps all the newness around him has given him a new lease of life and I wouldn't be astounded if he rolled back the years a little for the first half of the season and is very solid....in spite of my vocal desire for us to sign top class and consistent keeper which we haven't had since David Seaman.

Bellerin needs to break old habits and create new ones fast. Unfortunately that takes time. Unfortunately Torreira won't be ready for City.


We have too many CB's already and my feeling is that Mav, Chambers or Holding should start with one of the older more experienced guys. No point having all 3 of them in the squad on the fringes. Because of his maturity and speed I'd lean towards Mav but the brawn and brains of Koulibaly really did almost surprise me when I saw him play. Times his intervention, watches the play carefully and concentrates, immediately covers the goal line when a fellow defender makes an intervention leaving the goal more open......really impressive stuff. Would have absolutely loved to him pushing around some of these premier league Centre forwards. Admittedly he's obviously been coached intelligently though which is what comes across when you watch him....not just some supernatural ability and size.

[Power n Glory]

From what I've seen we were played off the park yesterday in the 1st half and Chelsea should have been 3 up, then they made a stack of changes in the 2nd half (including taking Cesc off) and we got back into the game.

Bellerin had a mare but Smith-Rowe and Lacazette looked sharp. Defending was awful in the 1st half, similar to last season.:upset:Cesc Fabregas! Still hurts.

[Power n Glory]

Hearing Cech is taking up a higher starting position. I get the feeling he feels invigorated for this season. Perhaps all the newness around him has given him a new lease of life and I wouldn't be astounded if he rolled back the years a little for the first half of the season and is very solid....in spite of my vocal desire for us to sign top class and consistent keeper which we haven't had since David Seaman.

Bellerin needs to break old habits and create new ones fast. Unfortunately that takes time. Unfortunately Torreira won't be ready for City.


We have too many CB's already and my feeling is that Mav, Chambers or Holding should start with one of the older more experienced guys. Not point having all 3 of them in the squad on the fringes. Because of his maturity and speed I'd lean towards Mav but the brawn and brains of Koulibaly really did almost surprise me when I saw him play. Time's his intervention, watches the play careful, concentrates, covers the goal line when a fellow defender makes an intervention leaving the goal more open......really impressive stuff. Would have absolutely loved to him pushing around some of these premier league Centre forwards.

Yeah, I heard Cech saved two penalties last night. Two!

Any ideas what formation we played?

Bellerin needs a few games on the bench. Lichsteiner might not be the quickest but hoping he's just as solid as Monreal, who also isn't that quick.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Looked like s standard 433 from what I could gather from 15 minute highlights but who knows....

I've been thinking about this for a while. I actually don't think Litchensteiner is going to be as motivating a force to Bellerin as many seem to think. I think he is just going to look behind him and see a decorated war veteran half on a last hurrah.

Is he really going to think this 34 year old slow defender who will be here 1 year...two years tops, that hasn't even played a full 90 yet and didn't look especially clever in the world cup for all his experience really something to be scared of? Even if he replaces him for a few cup games, he's not a realistic threat to his long term future which in itself is tempered by the fact he's probably ready to move on to Barcelona or somewhere else anyway. He's not playing good enough to mind....not nearly, but point being that I'm just not convinced he is majorly threatened by it.

I actually think he would have felt more threatened by AMN. I await globalgunners timely interjection here about how AMN is one of my favourites or my bastard child or something....

But seriously as an athlete AMN is right there with him, quick, has great stamina, stands his ground on one 1 v 1s, is good technically...so much so he's a consideration for midfield, can play in a number of positions so many around the club actively want him around the squad and to find him game time and was one of the few bright sparks in a dreary season last year and is of an age where he is conceivably expected to get better.

[Power n Glory]

Looked like s standard 433 from what I could gather from 15 minute highlights but who knows....

I've been thinking about this for a while. I actually don't think Litchensteiner is going to be as motivating a force to Bellerin as many seem to think. I think he is just going to look behind him and see a decorated war veteran half on a last hurrah.

Is he really going to think this 34 year old slow defender who will be here 1 year...two years tops, that hasn't even played a full 90 yet and didn't look especially clever in the world cup for all his experience really something to be scared of? Even if he replaces him for a few cup games, he's not a realistic threat to his long term future which in itself is tempered by the fact he's probably ready to move on to Barcelona or somewhere else anyway. He's not playing good enough to mind....not nearly, but point being that I'm just not convinced he is majorly threatened by it.

I actually think he would have felt more threatened by AMN. I await globalgunners timely interjection here about how AMN is one of my favourites or my bastard child or something....

But seriously as an athlete AMN is right there with him, quick, has great stamina, stands his ground on one 1 v 1s, is good technically...so much so he's a consideration for midfield, can play in a number of positions so many around the club actively want him around the squad and to find him game time and was one of the few bright sparks in a dreary season last year and is of an age where he is conceivably expected to get better.

Hey, ya never know. We were just talking about Petr Cech a second ago. Competition helps. If Bellerin isn't worried about Lichtenstein, that's Bellerin. I just hope that Lich can try to defy the odds and give Emery a selection headache with good performances.

I'd rather AMN get game time as CM to be honest but we'll see what sort of problems we face when the season kicks off. He may be left with few choices when it comes to playing.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

At this rate he can definitely have Bellerin or Kolasinac' place!

[Power n Glory]

https://metro.co.uk/2018/08/03/arsenal-fans-go-meltdown-ousmane-dembele-spotted-pierre-emerick-aubameyang-gunners-squad-7792629/

Dembele!

Swap deal for Ramsey maybe?

[Özim]

https://metro.co.uk/2018/08/03/arsenal-fans-go-meltdown-ousmane-dembele-spotted-pierre-emerick-aubameyang-gunners-squad-7792629/

Dembele!

Swap deal for Ramsey maybe?

Doubt it, just dinner with friends!

We'd never pay the money required to sign Dembele, Barca will want to recoup most of what they spend and Ramsey with one year left is worth 30 million max.

[Power n Glory]

Doubt it, just dinner with friends!

We'd never pay the money required to sign Dembele, Barca will want to recoup most of what they spend and Ramsey with one year left is worth 30 million max.

I read something about a loan deal. They just bought Malcom so maybe there is something in this.

[Marc Overmars]

A loan deal would be good business. Sign him up.

[Özim]

I read something about a loan deal. They just bought Malcom so maybe there is something in this.

I reckon he's an addition, Barca have said he's not for sale they need a good squad especially after losing Iniesta and with Suarez and Messi ageing. I don't think there's anything in this at all.

TBH not interested in a loan deal, he'll just go back at the end of the season so we don't really get a long term option, we're not some small club other clubs can loan players to only to take them back when they feel like it, this is all media nonsense IMO.

[I am invisible]

I'd take him in any capacity right now - we need that type of winger as an option, and even a loan would at least buy us another year to look for a more permanent solution. (And if it helps us get back amongst the CL spots, then so much the better!)

[Power n Glory]

Loan deals happen in football amongst big clubs all the time. Douglas Costa is on loan from Bayern to Juve. Mbappe is on loan to PSG. Agree with IAI. It's the need of the team that comes first.

[Özim]

Loan deals happen in football amongst big clubs all the time. Douglas Costa is on loan from Bayern to Juve. Mbappe is on loan to PSG. Agree with IAI. It's the need of the team that comes first.

Juve bought Douglas Costa for 40 million Euros. Loan deals happen with an option to buy but not straight loan deals which is what this would be as Barca wouldn't sell him (Costa, Mbappe were all with an option to buy and have will be bought).

[I am invisible]

Doubt it, just dinner with friends!

We'd never pay the money required to sign Dembele, Barca will want to recoup most of what they spend and Ramsey with one year left is worth 30 million max.

With regards to the money Barca would want to recoup, it's worth noting that the £135.5m figure that most people have in their heads is the maximum that they might end up having to pay over 5 years - however, 40% of that figure actually relates to performance-based add-ons, and as he only made 24 appearances in his first year (scoring just 4 goals), I doubt they'll owe Dortmund too much more than the inititial fee that was agreed, which was £96.8m.

Now that's still a lot of money, but if we're talking about including Ramsey in a partX, then all of a sudden the money involved almost starts to look average (by today's standards).

I just have my doubts that Barca would want Ramsey as part of the deal. Or, to put it another way, they might be interested in him, but probably not for the £200-300k/week he's pushing us for.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

I'd take him in any capacity right now - we need that type of winger as an option, and even a loan would at least buy us another year to look for a more permanent solution. (And if it helps us get back amongst the CL spots, then so much the better!)

That's about sums it up yes!

[Özim]

Liverpool interested in Ramsey apparently, not a bad move for him tbf, they're a club going places!

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Liverpool interested in Ramsey apparently, not a bad move for him tbf, they're a club going places!

4th.

[Power n Glory]

This really is an anti Arsenal mentality.

[Özim]

4th.

I would hope not or we'll bet without CL football again.

Besides you're wrong, Liverpool are looking to challenge and their signings certainly look like they will help them do that, they already got to a CL final last season.

[Globalgunner]

Ox probably suggested they sign him to keep him company in the physio`s room

[selassie]

Liverpool interested in Ramsey apparently, not a bad move for him tbf, they're a club going places!

If it’s a genuine interest then I would imagine he will go there. Right now they are a step up from us, they are genuine title material IMO.

[selassie]

https://metro.co.uk/2018/08/03/arsenal-fans-go-meltdown-ousmane-dembele-spotted-pierre-emerick-aubameyang-gunners-squad-7792629/

Dembele!

Swap deal for Ramsey maybe?

I think the best we can hope for here is a season long loan. For the price they would want for him assuming he is available I think it would be out of our reach. Besides, I don’t think we would be the only club interested.

Also it would be reckless to spend this amount on one player when we still need to address central defence, left back and the wing.

Central Midfield is still questionable too.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

I suppose he would slip in ahead of Henderson so it would be Fabinho, Keita and Rambo.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

I think the best we can hope for here is a season long loan. For the price they would want for him assuming he is available I think it would be out of our reach. Besides, I don’t think we would be the only club interested.

Also it would be reckless to spend this amount on one player when we still need to address central defence, left back and the wing.

Central Midfield is still questionable too.

I agreee....it will only realistically happen via way of a loan.

But it's only reckless to spend a large fee on Dembele if we were actually planning on alternatively using the cash on those other areas in the first place. As it is...I don't think we were otherwise we'd have done it by now.

[GP]

A front 3 of Lacazette, Aubameyang and Dembele would be ridiculous.

Which is why it won't happen.

[selassie]

I agreee....it will only realistically happen via way of a loan.

But it's only reckless to spend a large fee on Dembele if we were actually planning on alternatively using the cash on those other areas in the first place. As it is...I don't think we were otherwise we'd have done it by now.

Yep, agreed.

However, I wouldn’t feel comfortable us spending that large amount on one player if it meant we couldn’t improve those aforementioned areas even this winter.

We have spent a lot of money on the offensive areas over the past season or so. Don’t get me wrong,we look very good offensively, but we still lack true quality in a few positions in the first team...and that needs to be addressed with the ambitious investment.

[I am invisible]

Yep, agreed.

However, I wouldn’t feel comfortable us spending that large amount on one player if it meant we couldn’t improve those aforementioned areas even this winter.

We have spent a lot of money on the offensive areas over the past season or so. Don’t get me wrong,we look very good offensively, but we still lack true quality in a few positions in the first team...and that needs to be addressed with the ambitious investment.
I have a feeling we’ll have another look at defense next summer - if you ask me, this summer’s defensive business (not including the two DMs) looks to be mostly about stabilising the back line, and buying Emery a year to get a proper read on Chambers, Holding, Mavro’s, Bellerin and Kolasinac. (That and getting the focus and mindset in the group right).

GK could go either way. We’re obviously hoping that Leno has it in him to be our new no.1 for a lot of years, but if it doesn’t work out that way then I think we’ll be looking for another keeper within a year or two anyway, once Cech finally hangs up his gloves. We’ll get a second chance to get that one right, if we need it.

To be honest, I’m not expecting Emery’s ideas and his vision for the side to start really coming together until the new year anyway, so I’m kind of easy about the ambitious investment until it does...

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Yep, agreed.

However, I wouldn’t feel comfortable us spending that large amount on one player if it meant we couldn’t improve those aforementioned areas even this winter.

We have spent a lot of money on the offensive areas over the past season or so. Don’t get me wrong,we look very good offensively, but we still lack true quality in a few positions in the first team...and that needs to be addressed with the ambitious investment.

That depends on who it is and ultimately what his contrition is. People complain if the player doesn't justify the outlay, but if he does, it is money well spent.

If Sokratis and co don't improve us, that will also be money wasted. If the player doesn't make a meaningful contribution or improve the squad, then at the end of the day it's money wasted whether it's 10 million or 60 million+.

[dostoy]

Surely Arsenal have to sign a left back as Kolasinac is injured for 8-10 weeks and Monreal is nowhere near good enough.

Another CB is needed as Kos is out until December/January and who will Ramsey's replacement be I wonder.

[Mac76]

Surely Arsenal have to sign a left back as Kolasinac is injured for 8-10 weeks and Monreal is nowhere near good enough.

Another CB is needed as Kos is out until December/January and who will Ramsey's replacement be I wonder.

Can't understand how anyone thinks one of last season's best players for us isn't good enough, though Kolasinac is a loss

Will be interested to see what state Kos is in after wenger did his best to destroy him mentally and physically, he certainly can't play more than one game in a week IMO

As for Ramsay, we just need someone who doesn't give the ball away and leave us exposed

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Monreal was our most consistent player. I don't include Auba as he was only there half.

[Power n Glory]

Monreal has been one of our most consistent performers for at least a few years now.

Last season the guy scored more goals than Ozil, Iwobi and Xhaka. Saved our bacon on a few occasions with those goals. Always puts in a solid shift, always shows passion. He earned his shirt. Deserves more respect.

[Marc Overmars]

Chambers possibly going to Fulham on loan. Surely we need some cover with Kos not being available for another few months? He might as well stay.

Perez also linked with West Ham.

[Power n Glory]

Chambers possibly going to Fulham on loan. Surely we need some cover with Kos not being available for another few months? He might as well stay.

Perez also linked with West Ham.

Don't we have cover for Kos already with Holding, Sokratis and Mavropanos? Surprised to hear Chambers is the one making way but maybe they think playing time is what's best for his development. Heard Emery liked Chambers and had plans for him.

[Marc Overmars]

Oh yeah, I completely forgot about the Greek kid.

[dostoy]

Monreal has lost his pace and should not be playing at left back.

He is simply not good enough.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

No complaints if true as I thought we had too many players anyway and all 3 of Mav, Chambers and Holding can only get so much game time.

I would like to see Mav developed slightly more than the other two as he has the profile of a defender I would like to see be a starter. Tall, athletic, quick etc etc....

[Power n Glory]

Monreal has lost his pace and should not be playing at left back.

He is simply not good enough.

Alright man, enough.

[Özim]

Bearing in mind we signed him up on a new contract, I was expecting him to stay and if anything send holding out, seems not.

As for our CB options, we have the Greek guy (who got himself sent off pretty early in his career with us), Holding, Mustafi and Sokratis, the latter will obviously play but with him we basically have to play either the error prone Mustafi (rumours that he might be sold flying around) or some inexperienced kid and if we get an injury to Sokratis we're in trouble. Koscielny won't be back until at the earliest the end of the year so this is a risky step IMO.

[Power n Glory]

No complaints if true as I thought we had too many players anyway and all 3 of Mav, Chambers and Holding can only get so much game time.

I would like to see Mav developed slightly more than the other two as he has the profile of a defender I would like to see be a starter. Tall, athletic, quick etc etc....

I forgot Chambers already went out on loan to Middlesbrough in 2016. Might be make or break for him now.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

I think it will be... and I'm also increasingly thinking, every extension signed this summer has purely been asset safeguarding.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

6 CB's is too many.....even if Kos is only back next year. Perhaps less so if we play 3 at the back, but if we play 3 at the back....for balance it's a good idea to have a full back as one of the 3.

[GP]

Courtois has gone on strike to force a move :lol:

[dazthegooner]

Wonder how that will pan out?

[Özim]

Talk that Chelsea will go for Oblak if they lose Courtois, hope not the guy is a world beater.

[Marc Overmars]

Barca are trying to sign Pogba. :lol:

[Özim]

Think it will be almost impossible to do at this stage, the Spanish clubs haven't found it so easy to get the players they want this summer, Real and still without anyone and Barca haven't really gone for big players (until now if you believe it).

IMO Man U won't sell because they won't have time to replace him.

[selassie]

I have a feeling we’ll have another look at defense next summer - if you ask me, this summer’s defensive business (not including the two DMs) looks to be mostly about stabilising the back line, and buying Emery a year to get a proper read on Chambers, Holding, Mavro’s, Bellerin and Kolasinac. (That and getting the focus and mindset in the group right).

GK could go either way. We’re obviously hoping that Leno has it in him to be our new no.1 for a lot of years, but if it doesn’t work out that way then I think we’ll be looking for another keeper within a year or two anyway, once Cech finally hangs up his gloves. We’ll get a second chance to get that one right, if we need it.

To be honest, I’m not expecting Emery’s ideas and his vision for the side to start really coming together until the new year anyway, so I’m kind of easy about the ambitious investment until it does...

Aye, agreed with all of this.

I am slightly worried about Leno and Central Defence to an extent....I do have faith in Mavro to develop and for Chambers to have a solid season at Fulham.

I don't rate Mustafi at all to be honest, I am not even sure he would excel in a more stable system but we will see. Sokratis is a decent enough player but I have reservations about him too, new to PL...not overly mobile. Kos is more or less a write off IMO. Holding a back up...though he can develop at a slow pace.

Yeah I am with you on Emery really getting the team to play in his style...it will take a while for sure.

[selassie]

That depends on who it is and ultimately what his contrition is. People complain if the player doesn't justify the outlay, but if he does, it is money well spent.

If Sokratis and co don't improve us, that will also be money wasted. If the player doesn't make a meaningful contribution or improve the squad, then at the end of the day it's money wasted whether it's 10 million or 60 million+.

Fair do.

[selassie]

Bearing in mind we signed him up on a new contract, I was expecting him to stay and if anything send holding out, seems not.

As for our CB options, we have the Greek guy (who got himself sent off pretty early in his career with us), Holding, Mustafi and Sokratis, the latter will obviously play but with him we basically have to play either the error prone Mustafi (rumours that he might be sold flying around) or some inexperienced kid and if we get an injury to Sokratis we're in trouble. Koscielny won't be back until at the earliest the end of the year so this is a risky step IMO.

I get the impression that Emery rates Chambers quite highly but not enough for him to be a legitimate starter right now. I think he wants to give Chambers a season out on loan so he gets regular game time. We can also assess his performance and make a decision next summer.

If Chambers has a good season then he will arguably come back as a starter for us.

I personally think Mavro the greek guy could be knocking on the door as a starter if either of Mustafi or Sokratis have a poor run of games.

I get the impression Holding is happy to develop at a slower rate and just get games here and there, that's where he is in his development phase...Chambers is further ahead IMO and so too is Mavro in the sense that he seems to be really highly rated at the club.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Talk that Chelsea will go for Oblak if they lose Courtois, hope not the guy is a world beater.

If that's the case and I was a Chelsea fan. I'd drive him to the airport myself.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Fair do.

I meant contribution rather than contrition :d which I'm sure you gathered!

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Think it will be almost impossible to do at this stage, the Spanish clubs haven't found it so easy to get the players they want this summer, Real and still without anyone and Barca haven't really gone for big players (until now if you believe it).

IMO Man U won't sell because they won't have time to replace him.

I reckon Fred could replace him tbf.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

I thought Mav was highly rated and high in the pecking order....but he hasn't played that much this preseason, so God knows where they see him in the order of things.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Also not sure what the sense would be in signing Vida to add to Sokratis?

Two CB's with no resale value and questionable quality for around 50 million. Might as well just go out and try to sign a top centre half at a good age.

[Özim]

Also not sure what the sense would be in signing Vida to add to Sokratis?

Two CB's with no resale value and questionable quality for around 50 million. Might as well just go out and try to sign a top centre half at a good age.

Agreed, doesn't make sense he's also almost 30, use the money elsewhere and more wisely.

[GP]

If that's the case and I was a Chelsea fan. I'd drive him to the airport myself.

Chelsea already signed their Courtois replacement.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44957390

[Marc Overmars]

Have to say now the window is about to close I’ve been a little bit underwhelmed with our activity this summer. I’m hopeful for the new regime but that’s about it, I can’t say our signings have filled me new found confidence. If this had been a Wenger window I’m sure there would have been some choice words to be said for the players we’ve signed.

Having said that though, I’m looking forward to Sunday and the start of new chapter. A sold out and buzzing Emirates. COYG.

[Özim]

Have to say now the window is about to close I’ve been a little bit underwhelmed with our activity this summer. I’m hopeful for the new regime but that’s about it, I can’t say our signings have filled me new found confidence. If this had been a Wenger window I’m sure there would have been some choice words to be said for the players we’ve signed.

Having said that though, I’m looking forward to Sunday and the start of new chapter. A sold out and buzzing Emirates. COYG.

I'm with you, it's underwhelming, interested to see how Emery will do but it could be a rocky start for him unfortunately as he's been unlucky with the fixtures. Lacazette and Aubameyang together is exciting though.

We've also done a poor job of getting rid of the deadwood IMO, we could have brought in some cash for other new signings had we been better, that's players like Xhaka, Perez, Welbeck, Ospina or Cech, Jenkinson, Mustafi, Campbell, they all seem to still be here although Perez is close to moving.

On top of that the Ramsey situation still isn't sorted which is a shocker, we should have sorted it or sold him and used that money by now.

[Gooner23]

I think weve improved central midfield with the Torreira signing, plus Maitland-Niles and Guendouzi knocking on be door.

But agree with others on concerns over other areas, particularly the centre of defence if he's planning to go with Mustafi and Sokratis as his starters.

From the preseason games I get the impression he still doesn't know how to get the best out of all the attacking players. Hopefully their quality will pull us out of some holes.

[SMatthews]

I think weve improved central midfield with the Torreira signing, plus Maitland-Niles and Guendouzi knocking on be door.

But agree with others on concerns over other areas, particularly the centre of defence if he's planning to go with Mustafi and Sokratis as his starters.

From the preseason games I get the impression he still doesn't know how to get the best out of all the attacking players. Hopefully their quality will pull us out of some holes.

22 years won't be wiped away in the space of a handful of meaningless warm up games with a team half filled with kids and back-up options.

Hopefully Torreira will do a great job of making our defence look better than it actually is.

Either way, it's going to be a long season similar to the last couple and we won't get to see what Emery can really do until the last third/start of next season.

[selassie]

Agreed, doesn't make sense he's also almost 30, use the money elsewhere and more wisely.

Don't want him either.

This is a guy who has carved out a career in the minor leagues in Europe.

If he was young then fair play but he's not.

For 25million I would rather pass and add that amount to splashing on a good quality emerging CB in the summer if we need one.

[selassie]

Also not sure what the sense would be in signing Vida to add to Sokratis?

Two CB's with no resale value and questionable quality for around 50 million. Might as well just go out and try to sign a top centre half at a good age.

Yep agreed.

[Marc Overmars]

22 years won't be wiped away in the space of a handful of meaningless warm up games with a team half filled with kids and back-up options.

Hopefully Torreira will do a great job of making our defence look better than it actually is.

Either way, it's going to be a long season similar to the last couple and we won't get to see what Emery can really do until the last third/start of next season.

Torreira is the guy we're all pinning our hopes on I suppose, if he turns out to be a revelation we should have a competitive team.

The defence has all sorts of question marks but we've been left with too many scars from the past for those worries to go away so soon.

[dostoy]

It is inevitable that Spuds will sell Alderweireld to Man Utd and buy someone, probably Grealish.

I would love to see Alderweireld stay at Spuds and leave next summer without Spuds getting anything for him but it won't happen.

Will Arsenal allow Ramsey to stay in the same situation or will they sell him ?

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Far from a guarantee. Man U have loads of CB's and you'd have thought they'd have signed Alderweireld by now if they wanted him. They don't need to play chess or slowly slowly catchy monkey like we normally do. They are good for the money.

I think a lot of the clubs are just waiting for the English transfer buying window to close. Real Madrid have been suspiciously quiet as have most of the other big clubs.

[Goonermerree]

Has Ramsey signed yet? Been away, but just read that he wants £300k per week, please say we won't give him that.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

His agent has denied that....

[GP]

Courtois has officially joined Real Madrid.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Chelsea get Kovacic on loan. :lol:

[Marc Overmars]

71m for Kepa. :wacko:

[dazthegooner]

Never heard of him...

[Power n Glory]

71m for Kepa. :wacko:

If we left our business late with Leno, Leverkusen would have slapped a £30m £50m price tag on him by now. It's the ripple effect.

[Static]

This fee hasn't been slapped on him, it's his release clause.

[dostoy]

I wish Arsenal were signing Yerry Mina.

He is 23 and 6'5 and could become a great central defender/future captain for Arsenal.

[GP]

I wish Arsenal were signing Yerry Mina.

He is 23 and 6'5 and could become a great central defender/future captain for Arsenal.

Barca can't wait to get rid of him. He's a bit of a calamity, apparently.

[GP]

Also, the name Yerry really irritates me for some reason.

[SMatthews]

He's going to Everton. It's the final piece in their assault on the title this year.

[dostoy]

He would be far better than Mustafi and probably better than Sokratis.

[Globalgunner]

He would be far better than Mustafi and probably better than Sokratis.

He did quite well in the WC alongside the Spud guy. Almost all.our CBs are highly suspect in their own way. We shouldn't be so.quick to write anyone off.
It's going to be an interesting season that's for sure. One thing going for us is we are no.more handicapped than any of the others. Jose might even relegate the Mancs this year, who knows

[hobson's choice]

Barca can't wait to get rid of him. He's a bit of a calamity, apparently.

Yeah, after like a total of 5 games, they want to get rid of him. So idiotic.

[Özim]

Barca can't wait to get rid of him. He's a bit of a calamity, apparently.

Yeah, after like a total of 5 games, they want to get rid of him. So idiotic.

:haha:

[Marc Overmars]

Everton have signed Mina, Bernard and Andre Gomes. :wacko:

How much have they spent this summer? Combine that with last years outlay, they really need to be pushing for the CL now.

[GP]

Yeah, after like a total of 5 games, they want to get rid of him. So idiotic.

Shipped out to everton after 6 months is pretty telling.

[Marc Overmars]

Spurs signed no one. :lol:

Those new stadium bills...

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Everton winning the Transfer Cup again I see.

I've always thought Andre Gomes is bloody awful.

[Power n Glory]

Spurs signed no one. :lol:

Those new stadium bills...

Talk about throwing on the brakes to hurt momentum and morale. That has to slow them down this season.

Hopefully, Man City suffer from some sort of second season complacency and Mourinho pulls a Mourinho and causes a civil war within the club that derails them.

No idea how Liverpool and Chelsea will do this year but suspect they'll definitely be there for the top 4 challenge.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Worst transfer deadline day since... the last one?

[Penguin]

I wish Arsenal were signing Yerry Mina.

He is 23 and 6'5 and could become a great central defender/future captain for Arsenal.

Erm... :blink:

[hobson's choice]

Shipped out to everton after 6 months is pretty telling.

Nah, 5 games isn't enough to judge anyone let alone a young man playing in a new Country.

Shit look at Barca's own Pique, as a prime example of that.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DkKZ7_lX4AAl-Ay.jpg

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Literally the most pointless thread of all time.

http://www.glory-glory.co.uk/community/threads/summer-2018-transfer-thread.9452/

[Master Splinter]

They've been trying to ship out Gomes since they signed him.

It's like getting a supposed Black Friday "deal" that throws in a lot of tat in a bundle to obfuscate the fact you've been well and truly swindled.

Mina had a decent World Cup and was linked to bigger clubs in need of centre-backs, but still ended up at Everton. Barcelona have just signed Lenglet so they're obviously grateful that they've essentially recouped that fee for their unwanted, fifth choice central defender.

[Özim]

Leicester sign Caglar Soyuncu, supposed to be good and linked with us all summer, Leicester might have picked up another bargain.

Overall 6 out of 10 for the transfer window, Torreira was an important one and the young French guy looks to have potential.

[Master Splinter]

Spurs are so determined to be always in Arsenal's shadow that they fail to capitalise on their potential by refusing to spend just like their superiors.

They've obviously got the new stadium, but in this day and age there's so much money in the game that Spurs' miserly ways are even more inexplicable.

Wolves and Fulham on the other hand, have gone utterly mental. At least both those teams should be good to watch.

If Cardiff survive, Colin Wanker deserves a knighthood tbf.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

If we left our business late with Leno, Leverkusen would have slapped a £30m £50m price tag on him by now. It's the ripple effect.

I knew Oblak's value would increase..... but even I didn't think it would be this quickly....

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Leicester will have that Soyuncu kid and Maguire in the centre of their defence...whilst we will have Mustafi and Sokratis. I honestly don't know that we are better off....

[dazthegooner]

Pochettino has blamed the lack of signings saying Brexit's effect on the pound against the Euro has made for a "30 per cent" increase when looking to bring players over from the continent.

[Globalgunner]

Pochettino has blamed the lack of signings saying Brexit's effect on the pound against the Euro has made for a "30 per cent" increase when looking to bring players over from the continent.

Ordinarily I consider Brexit a bad idea but in the case of the Spuds i will make an exception...BTW is Aston Villa in another country?. Just asking.
The Spuds are notorious for always wanting to buy cheap and sell very high

[Mac76]

So we shipped out Perez and kept Welbeck - great move... :rolleyes:

[Globalgunner]

So we shipped out Perez and kept Welbeck - great move... :rolleyes:

Most likely English quota, otherwise it makes no football sense

[Özim]

How Welbeck has carved out a career in top level football I'll never know, must be all these people always saying he has it all the attributes to be great but somehow he never gets any better.

[Power n Glory]

I knew Oblak's value would increase..... but even I didn't think it would be this quickly....

It just takes one transfer and one club to pay up to change the whole market.

[Özim]

If you want the best you have to pay the going rate, otherwise you have to either sign kids/older players or players who have been out of form and whose value has dropped.

[Mac76]

Most likely English quota, otherwise it makes no football sense

they should just get some League 2 slogger then, on a quarter of the pay, couldn't be any worse and would save us money

[Power n Glory]

If you want the best you have to pay the going rate, otherwise you have to either sign kids/older players or players who have been out of form and whose value has dropped.

There is no such thing as a ‘going rate’ and it doesn’t always equate to quality. This Kepa guy wasn’t mentioned last week when we were talking about the best goalkeepers in football. Information is still king. Chelsea must have some serious scouts and stats to back up that transfer fee. But as seen with Mustfai and Xhaka, the tide will also rise for bang average players and those that aren’t even close to being the best. That is my point.

Monaco, Dortmund, Liverpool, Southampton and Athletic Bilbao because they’ve managed sign unknown players for peanuts and sell them on for world record fees despite none of them even being mentioned as the best in their position.

[Globalgunner]

It just takes one transfer and one club to pay up to change the whole market.

I blame Pogba and Utd

[Power n Glory]

I blame Pogba and Utd

Yep. Around 2016 and 2017 things went nuts with Man Utd and Mourinho being the core culprits. Add Juve in there as well. What Utd paid for Pogba for Juve to then go on to pay for Higuain was stupid. That then inflated the market for every and any striker including bums like Lukaku, another Utd signing. Yep, it's that c*nt Mourinho again. The ripple effect. It changed the striker market and fees just haven't been the same.

[Özim]

There is no such thing as a ‘going rate’ and it doesn’t always equate to quality. This Kepa guy wasn’t mentioned last week when we were talking about the best goalkeepers in football. Information is still king. Chelsea must have some serious scouts and stats to back up that transfer fee. But as seen with Mustfai and Xhaka, the tide will also rise for bang average players and those that aren’t even close to being the best. That is my point.

Monaco, Dortmund, Liverpool, Southampton and Athletic Bilbao because they’ve managed sign unknown players for peanuts and sell them on for world record fees despite none of them even being mentioned as the best in their position.

The going rate is whatever the market dictates, in the case of top goalkeeper 60-70 million. Kepa is Spanish number 2 (behind arguably the best keeper in the world De Gea) so we might not know him but clearly in Spain they do and I'm sure Chelse have plenty of scouting.

More often than not it does though, yes there are some who don't but often you when you pay big bucks you get quality.

That's bad for us yes as that seems to be what we've been focussed on for years, rather than spending extra and getting top quality we're settle for 2nd/3rd tier which actually statistically speaking for us has proved much higher risk, we've ended up with duds that cost a fair amount rather than spending that and a bit more and getting the finished artilce.

There's no defending this buy cheap policy anymore, it's a fals economy, we've failed with it time and time again, the money we shelled out would have been better spent on the best, we'd most likely be a far better side for it. This club does have a record of settling for 2nd best over the years which also reflects on the pitch.

[Goonermerree]

It started before that though,Chelsea were buying up the opposition at one point to stick them on the bench and inflating prices. City have player their part, not to mention the money that the PL gets now, no wonder foreign clubs say 'if you want him, you can delve into that considerable pot you have, or do one.'

[Özim]

Yep. Around 2016 and 2017 things went nuts with Man Utd and Mourinho being the core culprits. Add Juve in there as well. What Utd paid for Pogba for Juve to then go on to pay for Higuain was stupid. That then inflated the market for every and any striker including bums like Lukaku, another Utd signing. Yep, it's that c*nt Mourinho again. The ripple effect. It changed the striker market and fees just haven't been the same.

I think what changed the market was the TV deals, too much money for clubs. If a club decides they want a player at any cost that's up to them, besides Man U always paid big money for players, Ferdinand back in the day for 30 million was a prime example, Chelsea and Man City came in and paid megabucks too.

Not being funny you still have a choice, noone would have signed Mustafi or Xhaka for 30-35 million, they were duds.

[Goonermerree]

I think what changed the market was the TV deals, too much money for clubs. If a club decides they want a player at any cost that's up to them, besides Man U always paid big money for players, Ferdinand back in the day for 30 million was a prime example, Chelsea and Man City came in and paid megabucks too.

.

I just said that.

[Goonermerree]

/QUOTE]
Not being funny you still have a choice, noone would have signed Mustafi or Xhaka for 30-35 million, they were duds.[/QUOTE]

That is totally true.

[Power n Glory]

The going rate is whatever the market dictates, in the case of top goalkeeper 60-70 million. Kepa is Spanish number 2 (behind arguably the best keeper in the world De Gea) so we might not know him but clearly in Spain they do and I'm sure Chelse have plenty of scouting.

More often than not it does though, yes there are some who don't but often you when you pay big bucks you get quality.

That's bad for us yes as that seems to be what we've been focussed on for years, rather than spending extra and getting top quality we're settle for 2nd/3rd tier which actually statistically speaking for us has proved much higher risk, we've ended up with duds that cost a fair amount rather than spending that and a bit more and getting the finished artilce.

There's no defending this buy cheap policy anymore, it's a fals economy, we've failed with it time and time again, the money we shelled out would have been better spent on the best, we'd most likely be a far better side for it. This club does have a record of settling for 2nd best over the years which also reflects on the pitch.

So Morata and Lukaku are top top top quality strikers based on their price tag? This is how teams get got.

I'm not hearing this from you of all people either. Sorry. It's a double standard. If Arsenal sign an unknown player for a hefty price tag, it's met with cynicism (Xhaka). There is no way we'd be able to get away with spending above that sort of fee for players you haven't heard of or for players you see in lower league Premier League clubs like Everton and Southampton.

What's nuts is that there seems to be no bidding war for some of these players. It's not as if they're in high demand and clubs are clamoring for the new star. It's now to the point where clubs are slapping on a too good to say no to price first time around just so the selling club agrees to sell with little fuss. Again, I think we'd all be comfortable with this approach if we knew the current manager has a great record with knowing what sort of players he wants but that's not what's happening in football these days.

[Power n Glory]

I think what changed the market was the TV deals, too much money for clubs. If a club decides they want a player at any cost that's up to them, besides Man U always paid big money for players, Ferdinand back in the day for 30 million was a prime example, Chelsea and Man City came in and paid megabucks too.

Not being funny you still have a choice, noone would have signed Mustafi or Xhaka for 30-35 million, they were duds.

See my above post. Exactly. Seeing our record in the window, there is no way you'd feel comfortable spending way above that sort of money on players you've never heard of playing for small clubs especially when there is no bidding war from other clubs to sign them. That's exactly what we've seen during this market, especially with the keepers. Two World Records broken on young keepers that would never have featured on your top keeper target list a month ago.

[Globalgunner]

See my above post. Exactly. Seeing our record in the window, there is no way you'd feel comfortable spending way above that sort of money on players you've never heard of playing for small clubs especially when there is no bidding war from other clubs to sign them. That's exactly what we've seen during this market, especially with the keepers. Two World Records broken on young keepers that would never have featured on your top keeper target list a month ago.

There are some clubs. Utd and Real in particular, who just love the idea of having the most expensive player or type of player. It could be an ego thing but its mostly a marketing ploy, based on them knowing for sure that some poor saps in social housing are going to max out their credit cards to buy tat with said players name on it. When it started, maybe in the 70s with Malcolm Macdonald (£100k) or Shearer bought by money bags Blackburn. All I know is those players were probably worth it back then. Pogba, till now is still not worth 90m.

Mourinho being the deadbeat shopaholic that he is always wants to buy players to cover his tactical ancestry. He has now made a rod for his own back. The high ups have told him. You have the most expensive squad more or less in the country. Go earn your pay or ship out. I see him gone by Xmas. Im tempted to put a few pounds on it.

[Özim]

So Morata and Lukaku are top top top quality strikers based on their price tag? This is how teams get got.

I'm not hearing this from you of all people either. Sorry. It's a double standard. If Arsenal sign an unknown player for a hefty price tag, it's met with cynicism (Xhaka). There is no way we'd be able to get away with spending above that sort of fee for players you haven't heard of or for players you see in lower league Premier League clubs like Everton and Southampton.

What's nuts is that there seems to be no bidding war for some of these players. It's not as if they're in high demand and clubs are clamoring for the new star. It's now to the point where clubs are slapping on a too good to say no to price first time around just so the selling club agrees to sell with little fuss. Again, I think we'd all be comfortable with this approach if we knew the current manager has a great record with knowing what sort of players he wants but that's not what's happening in football these days.

For some reason they are deemed to be yes, to be fair Lukaku scores a lot at scored consistently 20+ goals at Everton so he was always going to cost a shedload, Morata has played at Real and Juve and is highly rated for some reason, never rated him myself but many did.

Not being funny but not only was Xhaka a nobody, he's also not playing in Spain or England, seen as the two richest leagues, he's also got no talent, you'd think a decent scout would spot that. As for Everton, to be hones they're putting us to shame with the amount they're spending in comparison to us, especially given our terrible season last season, they obviously will find it difficult to sign the top top players due to not playing much CL football over the years but you can se they're trying to better themselves, much like Liverpool did until they hit the jackpot with Klopp.
It's to do with their release clauses in Spain, you pay that to sign them it's the way the system works and Chelsea needed a new keeper badly.

[Özim]

See my above post. Exactly. Seeing our record in the window, there is no way you'd feel comfortable spending way above that sort of money on players you've never heard of playing for small clubs especially when there is no bidding war from other clubs to sign them. That's exactly what we've seen during this market, especially with the keepers. Two World Records broken on young keepers that would never have featured on your top keeper target list a month ago.

Lemar, Fekir all players we don't know huge amounts to be honest, but I'd have been happy for us to sign them whatever the cost, it's not for us to worry about the cost, I just want to see quality players come in, Atletico didn't hold back and just spent the money, likewise Liverpool. I have no problem with us signing players like this that are very highly rated and have some sort of matchwinning ability, unlike players like Xhaka, the only thing he'll win you is a wooden spoon.

As for the keepers, noone had heard of De Gea but he was hugely rated, I don't know that much about those keepers but certainly with the Liverpool keeper he was regarded as one of the best in the world, with Chelsea they were desperate and being Spain number 2 he can't be too bad, not saying I'd want us to pay that for him (I'd have gone for Oblak but clearly he wasn't available) but they had no choice.

When you sign an expensive player you often get your money back in merchandising and sponsorship deals, Neymar cost a lot but his marketability will bring his fee back in and more over the years and he has huge resale value, people don't see the benefits of signing top players and paying big fees, there are lots of off the pitch benefits to clubs as well.

[Power n Glory]

There are some clubs. Utd and Real in particular, who just love the idea of having the most expensive player or type of player. It could be an ego thing but its mostly a marketing ploy, based on them knowing for sure that some poor saps in social housing are going to max out their credit cards to buy tat with said players name on it. When it started, maybe in the 70s with Malcolm Macdonald (£100k) or Shearer bought by money bags Blackburn. All I know is those players were probably worth it back then. Pogba, till now is still not worth 90m.

Mourinho being the deadbeat shopaholic that he is always wants to buy players to cover his tactical ancestry. He has now made a rod for his own back. The high ups have told him. You have the most expensive squad more or less in the country. Go earn your pay or ship out. I see him gone by Xmas. Im tempted to put a few pounds on it.

The part in bold is what seems to make sense about the Pogba deal. If they have some sort of algorithm that predicts his purchase will equate to x amount of shirt sales and sponsorship money, then the price tag can be justified. But I see a lot of bum players going for silly money with nowhere near the sort of following Pogba has. I can’t see how the price tags can be justified but nothing will change unless audience spending habits change.

[Power n Glory]

Lemar, Fekir all players we don't know huge amounts to be honest, but I'd have been happy for us to sign them whatever the cost, it's not for us to worry about the cost, I just want to see quality players come in, Atletico didn't hold back and just spent the money, likewise Liverpool. I have no problem with us signing players like this that are very highly rated and have some sort of matchwinning ability, unlike players like Xhaka, the only thing he'll win you is a wooden spoon.

As for the keepers, noone had heard of De Gea but he was hugely rated, I don't know that much about those keepers but certainly with the Liverpool keeper he was regarded as one of the best in the world, with Chelsea they were desperate and being Spain number 2 he can't be too bad, not saying I'd want us to pay that for him (I'd have gone for Oblak but clearly he wasn't available) but they had no choice.

When you sign an expensive player you often get your money back in merchandising and sponsorship deals, Neymar cost a lot but his marketability will bring his fee back in and more over the years and he has huge resale value, people don't see the benefits of signing top players and paying big fees, there are lots of off the pitch benefits to clubs as well.

This is what’s bothering me about the transfer window and fees. Players are going for ridiculous fees after one or two seasons and I see fans such as yourself getting caught up in the transfer hype without seeing the player play.

When we’re talking about fees going up to £70m - £100m for players with Danny Welbeck numbers in terms of goals and still developing….it’s a massive risk for clubs. The rewards can be great but I’ve watched football long enough to know that it doesn’t always turn out that way.

Samir Nasri’s, Ryan Babel’s, Yoann Gourcuff, Maro Gotze’s, Memphis Depay, Jose Antonio Reye’s, Bojan, Ben Arfa, Van der Meyde, Steven Pienaar, Loric Remy, Mario Baloteli…..etc. Can you imagine the amount these players would go for if they were coming up in today’s era with all the hype? If Nasri were still young and playing in France we’d be shouting to spend £60m - £70m on him. Same goes for Reyes and all the rest. We’ve seen how the story ends for most of these players.

I’ve said this before, but as we’re only just starting, I want to see how Emery copes with the little he’s given, how he organises a team and only then will he get the golden stamp approval faith I used to have with Wenger. It didn’t matter who we were linked with or signing, I used to believe that Wenger could turn them into a star. We all saw how that went and it became clear that Wenger lost his mojo and needed to start signing established star players to make up for his weaknesses. Thank fuck he’s gone. In this current ‘market’ it’s also the developing players showing brief signs of potential going for ridiculous amounts of money.

[I am invisible]

Most likely English quota, otherwise it makes no football sense
It certainly can’t have come down to his ability as a finisher!

The only thing I can think of is that he’s quick, strong and hard-working, so Emery might be looking at him and thinking that he could be an asset in a high press? Perhaps his value is less about goal-scoring and more about pressuring defenders, forcing errors and generally being a pain in a the arse?

Up to Danny to make it work, because he ain’t getting a sniff as a CF with Aubameyang an Lacazette in front of him! There is an opportunity there to balance our narrow attack, though, if someone wants to take it...

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

It just takes one transfer and one club to pay up to change the whole market.

One of the many reasons I was pretty sure his value would hold.....

[Power n Glory]

One of the many reasons I was pretty sure his value would hold.....

Individual player valuations will always fluctuate and aren't set in stone. Courtois just went for £35m to Madrid despite being one of the top keepers.

£60m maybe the new £30m but that doesn't mean every players valuation will stay sky high.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

No but I think his will hold for reasons regarding the football bubble and market that I've stated before. Moreover, unlike most of the rest of those keepers I'm in no doubt about his quality having seen him plenty of times now, including live.

[Marc Overmars]

Joel Campbell is finally going. :faint:

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11670/11473263/arsenal-forward-joel-campbell-arrives-in-italy-for-frosinone-medical

[Bumble]

Joel Campbell is finally going. :faint:

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11670/11473263/arsenal-forward-joel-campbell-arrives-in-italy-for-frosinone-medical

are we going to get a fee? a sack of potatoes or something?