The next manager..

[Power n Glory]

Also, it's definitely wrong to judge Arteta's ability as a manager on what he was like as captain. His influence behind the scenes was understated for starters and we have no idea what was going on behind the scenes. Also, if you could tell a great manager from his playing days, Roy Keane and Tony Adams should have been great managers.

[Letters]

You should judge a person's ability as a manger on what he's like as a manager.
And with Arteta we really don't know right now. Would prefer someone established.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'll judge him at the end of the season.

[Power n Glory]

You should judge a person's ability as a manger on what he's like as a manager.
And with Arteta we really don't know right now. Would prefer someone established.

I think we'd all prefer someone established but this is the situation we've found ourselves in.

No CL football, a bloated wage bill and not a lot of transfer fee dosh to just splash on a brand new team for the new guy. I'm sure the new guy will have money to spend but we can't really afford to rebuild as quickly as some of the bigger teams. We've also missed out on some really good managers. Klopp would have ticked all the boxes they're looking for. Not so much with Allegri.

We're in a bit of mess. They should have pulled the trigger on Wenger a lot sooner. But I have hope that we'll get out of it. It's not too late.

[Marc Overmars]

I'll judge him at the end of the season.

At last that can be used as legitimate reasoning. :lol:

[Cripps]

So here's my take on Arteta

At first I nearly spat my tea out when I heard Gazidis was seriously gonna put a guy with 0 managerial experience in charge of a European giant. We are competing in a league with Guardiola, Klopp, Mourinho and Pochetinno. We need someone that will out think and out smart these managers, someone with bold ideas and someone that will take us to elite kind of tactics. Is Arteta really this guy?

I have my reservations. He has 0 experience as manager so it's a big risk. I don't buy into this idea he was a good player for us, he was bang average and I didn't see many leadership qualities.

On the other hand one article said he was the brightest candidate to come out of the coaching centre where wannabe managers gain their license and qualifications, so that's encouraging. Some have also said he's a no nonsense guy and that's what we need, someone to come in and shake things up instead of carry on the old goat's colney creche mentality.

The principle of taking a risk like this sums this club up. Only at Arsenal would we choose a guy with 0 managerial experience over a 4 time double winner. If we really wanted Allegri we could get him. Gazidis has no Wenger to hide behind anymore so if this doesn't work out I hope he clears off, regardless of the fact he's the reason Wenger isn't here anymore. Enough with the embarrassing, risk taking decisions at this club. There's absolutely no need to take such a massive risk especially at a time the fan base is divided. How they've come to the conclusion Rodgers is divisive but Arteta isn't I'll never know :lol:

If the champions league game against Liverpool is anything to go by where Pep was banished from the touchline and Arteta was in charge and didn't get up off his seat once, and City conceded 2 goals in that second half, then we're screwed.

Equally if we're midtable by November and the stadium is half empty, Arteta will get the chop.

And if this goes tits up every journalist and opposition fan will trudge the old 'told you the grass wasn't greener' line, and you know Wenger will be delighted with this appointment because it'll most likely go pear shaped so he'll be seen as some sort of god.

So all in all I don't really know what to make it :unsure:

But Ivan better hope this works cause if it doesn't, he'll be next.

[Globalgunner]

If we wanted to take a punt, we could have tried Marco Silva. We are like a man who needs heart surgery and decides to use the new doctor that graduated highest in Med school rather than someone who has actually opened up a live human before.

[Goonermerree]

Usually new managers start at lower league clubs, not even a PL club so it does seem a bit ridiculous to appoint Arteta as manager.That said, Moyes and Allerdyce are available with managerial experience...:blink:

[Goonermerree]

You should judge a person's ability as a manger on what he's like as a manager.
And with Arteta we really don't know right now. Would prefer someone established.

Good lord, I agree with you.:wacko:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Allegri wanted £200m for transfers, Enrique wanted a high wage.

Both Top managers with experience of winning countless trophies.

Both commanding some form of monetary expenditure to take the job.

So we look at the cheap option.

Don't get me wrong, Arteta 'could' turn out to be brilliant and lead us to new success. But he could could also be shit. Let's not kid ourselves into thinking this is some form of genius move by the club as it just smacks of penny pinching and hoping for the best.

[Goonermerree]

Allegri wanted £200m for transfers, Enrique wanted a high wage.

Both Top managers with experience of winning countless trophies.

Both commanding some form of monetary expenditure to take the job.

So we look at the cheap option.

Same old, same old then.

[Niall_Quinn]

Allegri wanted £200m for transfers, Enrique wanted a high wage.

Both Top managers with experience of winning countless trophies.

Both commanding some form of monetary expenditure to take the job.

So we look at the cheap option.

Don't get me wrong, Arteta 'could' turn out to be brilliant and lead us to new success. But he could could also be shit. Let's not kid ourselves into thinking this is some form of genius move by the club as it just smacks of penny pinching and hoping for the best.

We don't know any of that, it's all media speculation. Why would any of the parties involved talk to the media? Or confirm any of these "facts"?

The journos don't give a shit what they write provided they get clicks, and they never seem to get punished when they are found out. People keep on clicking and their "facts" keep on rolling out.

Wenger was on 10mill a year because he's been at the club for 22 years. That's pay hike after pay hike after pay hike. There was nothing to say we were going to pay the new guy the same money. Why would we? We aren't looking for one guy to run the whole show any more, we're looking for the opposite. If Allegri really did want 200 mill for transfers then maybe we said, forget it, transfers will be taken care of by somebody else. Maybe he didn't like that? I'm speculating just as much as the media. I don't know, they don't know.

If Arteta is coming to be a coach (rather than a general manager), which is highly likely, no reason to pay him big bucks because he'll have a third of the job description Wenger had. And if we want the role spread around, no reason to hire somebody who wants full control. Maybe this is why we aren't after a big, experienced name.

Looking at Arsenal's track record it's easy to say we are going cheap. But recent signings suggest otherwise. Aubameyang is supposedly the second highest paid player in the league (along with bonuses), and we have another 50 mill striker beside him. We're paying Ozil a fortune too. The money is being spent, but it is being spent in other areas. Good areas. Players on the pitch.

I'm not so keen to simply assume Arteta has been picked because he's cheap. It could still be the case, but we know as much of the truth as the media - which is none of it, at this stage.

Anyway, Arteta hasn't said yes yet. I'm sure he doesn't want to be Moyes v2. He's got plenty to think about before accepting.

[Power n Glory]

I read that the new manager would have £200m to spend.

https://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/955641/Next-Arsenal-manager-Arsene-Wenger-successor-200m-transfer-gossip

Most of what the papers print is bullshit.

[selassie]

None of us are privy to what goes on behind the scenes and how people like Arteta are regarded in the game. The new regime hasn't given us a reason to doubt them as of yet, they negated the blow of losing Alexis and finally managed to get Wenger out. It's been a good start for them but now it's time for them to make a reputation-defining decision. I'm intrigued and most importantly ready to back the club 100% for the first time in years.

Aye, the work Gazidis and the new guys have put in this season has been very impressive to be honest, very pragmatic and none of that dithering that Wenger was famous for.

I am not against Arteta as such, I have concerns which are understandable but I'll give him 100% support assuming we appoint him.

He has a lot of work to do with the team though, it's a big job to take on, even for an experienced manager because the expectations are such that we want improvement. I want to see clear tangible progess next season irrespective of who is managing the team.

[selassie]

I read that the new manager would have £200m to spend.

https://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/955641/Next-Arsenal-manager-Arsene-Wenger-successor-200m-transfer-gossip

Most of what the papers print is bullshit.

It's believable. We generate a lot of money as a Football club, I never once believed those 50million budget rumours.

[AFC Leveller]

According to Guillem Balague, Gazidis like Arteta AND Benitez, he feels the fat waiter can bring stability to the club but Sven and Raul dont want Rafa.

also, Pochetinho told Arteta 2 years ago (when he was about to join City) that he should go straight to number 1 as he has the quality and personality.

[Özim]

You mean the style that Pep just won the league with, being the first manager to reach 100 points?

Or the style that both Klopp & Pochettino employ that's won them both jack shit so far?

At any rate you being too focused on style rather than what's effective and gets results it's pretty ironic seeing as you were always moaning at Wenger for being too rigid.

Yes, found it boring at Barca and find it boring now at City, Liverpools is far easier on the eye, they also knocked City out of the CL, difference is I guess that Liverpool haven't spent hundreds of millions. Thing about Guardiola is he does win, but he does it at either a club with more money than anyone else or a club already on top, in the CL he wasn't much kop with Bayern and hasn't been great with City.

He clearly knows how to win, but he wins at clubs already well established.

[Özim]

Always thought as a big club we'd try and get someone top notch, seems we might not be thinking that way, for me though it would be Vieira over Arteta, he'd have instant respect for a start, might not work out but for me he'd be the preferred option (plus he's one of Arsenal greatest players - Real did it with Zidane), doing a decent job in the US as well even though that isn't a top league.

Arteta has never managed at all and I haven't personally seen any obvious qualities that might make him a good manager, never ever saw any kind of ruthlessness in him either, as Cripps said he was pretty average overall for us, would be a very odd choice really.

Guardiola seems good friends with Arteta (probably due to being Spanish) that probably helped him decide to have him as number 2, like I said Guardiola has won whoever his number 2 was, so it's not like they have a part in his successes. As I said before Mclaren, Queiroz were supposedly top notch number 2s, as managers however they were bang average, sometimes think managers talk up their impact so they get some credit, truth is if you look at top managers they succeed regardless of their assistants.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'm with Zim on this. PepBall is boring. The gypos hit over a thousand passes in a single game on at least one occasion this season. It might be clever and technical and soul destroying for the opposition, but it's even harder on those having to watch. I don't want to see long ball bombardments either, but the sweet spot for entertainment is somewhere between the two. If we continue to see tip tap Pep/ Wenger style in the coming pre-season it really doesn't matter what else happens because it just won't be fun to watch the football. Wenger's early teams were a hundred times better to watch than anything Pep has ever put out. I saw a stupid article in a rag today that claimed Pep's mercs are MORE STYLISH on the pitch than Wenger's early teams (Bergkamp, Henry, Pires, etc). What a laugh. It's not even close. Arsenal's transition from defence to attack in 10 seconds flat, compared to Pep's transitions over 10 minutes? Forget about it.

[Özim]

I'm with Zim on this. PepBall is boring. The gypos hit over a thousand passes in a single game on at least one occasion this season. It might be clever and technical and soul destroying for the opposition, but it's even harder on those having to watch. I don't want to see long ball bombardments either, but the sweet spot for entertainment is somewhere between the two. If we continue to see tip tap Pep/ Wenger style in the coming pre-season it really doesn't matter what else happens because it just won't be fun to watch the football. Wenger's early teams were a hundred times better to watch than anything Pep has ever put out. I saw a stupid article in a rag today that claimed Pep's mercs are MORE STYLISH on the pitch than Wenger's early teams (Bergkamp, Henry, Pires, etc). What a laugh. It's not even close. Arsenal's transition from defence to attack in 10 seconds flat, compared to Pep's transitions over 10 minutes? Forget about it.

Spot on our football was amazing, Guardiolas teams are a snoozefest, when you watch Liverpool however, the way they attack at pace is quite something, people seem to love Guardiola, but in truth he's had it easy, Barca, Bayern, City all either the best/richest or both, clesrly he knows how to put expensive teams together (not all managers do of course), he won the CL at Barca but he already had Messi when he took over which was a massive help, every else so far he's failed however.

Wenger tried to replicate his brand of football, didn't work and to be honest was boring to watch, I'd really love a change of philosophy, something that doesn't involve 500-600 of passes a game, Arteta openly said he loved our football and he clearly loves it at City too, another worry for me about him.

If he gets the job I'll give him a chance but I would expect some serious signs he's changing stuff and trying to move the club forward.

[I am invisible]

There's no doubt in my mind that we have hundreds of millions available for transfers if it's needed. All the same, I'm not sure how much I'd give the new guy in their first window? Enough to bring in a couple of trusted faces, certainly - players who can help transmit their ideas quickly to the rest of the squad - and that's on top of whatever Mislintat comes up with. But before I send them off with the best part of a quarter of a billion I'd kind of like to see what ideas they have and what they can coach into the current crop of players.

Is that wrong? To expect the new first team coach to actually do some coaching?

[I am invisible]

What I would invest in heavily is bolstering Mislintat's operation. Who's the guy at Monaco who keeps unearthing all these gems? Who's the guy at Atletico who keeps coming up with all these world class strikers and goalkeepers? Chuck money at these guys to come and work for us and then laugh at the rest of the world who have to spend 50m+ every time they want a Kyle Walker...

[KSE Comedy Club]

We don't know any of that, it's all media speculation. Why would any of the parties involved talk to the media? Or confirm any of these "facts"?

The journos don't give a shit what they write provided they get clicks, and they never seem to get punished when they are found out. People keep on clicking and their "facts" keep on rolling out.

Wenger was on 10mill a year because he's been at the club for 22 years. That's pay hike after pay hike after pay hike. There was nothing to say we were going to pay the new guy the same money. Why would we? We aren't looking for one guy to run the whole show any more, we're looking for the opposite. If Allegri really did want 200 mill for transfers then maybe we said, forget it, transfers will be taken care of by somebody else. Maybe he didn't like that? I'm speculating just as much as the media. I don't know, they don't know.

If Arteta is coming to be a coach (rather than a general manager), which is highly likely, no reason to pay him big bucks because he'll have a third of the job description Wenger had. And if we want the role spread around, no reason to hire somebody who wants full control. Maybe this is why we aren't after a big, experienced name.

Looking at Arsenal's track record it's easy to say we are going cheap. But recent signings suggest otherwise. Aubameyang is supposedly the second highest paid player in the league (along with bonuses), and we have another 50 mill striker beside him. We're paying Ozil a fortune too. The money is being spent, but it is being spent in other areas. Good areas. Players on the pitch.

I'm not so keen to simply assume Arteta has been picked because he's cheap. It could still be the case, but we know as much of the truth as the media - which is none of it, at this stage.

Anyway, Arteta hasn't said yes yet. I'm sure he doesn't want to be Moyes v2. He's got plenty to think about before accepting.
Well yes of course, you are right, but then, where is the fun in that? :lol:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Always thought as a big club we'd try and get someone top notch, seems we might not be thinking that way, for me though it would be Vieira over Arteta, he'd have instant respect for a start, might not work out but for me he'd be the preferred option (plus he's one of Arsenal greatest players - Real did it with Zidane), doing a decent job in the US as well even though that isn't a top league.

Arteta has never managed at all and I haven't personally seen any obvious qualities that might make him a good manager, never ever saw any kind of ruthlessness in him either, as Cripps said he was pretty average overall for us, would be a very odd choice really.

Guardiola seems good friends with Arteta (probably due to being Spanish) that probably helped him decide to have him as number 2, like I said Guardiola has won whoever his number 2 was, so it's not like they have a part in his successes. As I said before Mclaren, Queiroz were supposedly top notch number 2s, as managers however they were bang average, sometimes think managers talk up their impact so they get some credit, truth is if you look at top managers they succeed regardless of their assistants.

See, this echoes my issues with Arteta being appointed.

It's all speculation and here say 'Pochetino said he is good, Pep rates him highly' 'Le grove wrote some stuff about him' none of it is based on any fact that can actually be backed up.

Regardless of our supposed new management structure, we still need an experienced head to come in and sort these lads out. Someone who can drill a defence and utilise two top strikers from an organised midfield.

I'm not saying that Arteta is a bad choice as, like everyone else, I have no idea how good/bad he is. But I don't think taking a risk is neccessarily the right thing to do at this point.

I will give him my support if he is appointed, as much as I can, however, I won't also start trying to see him as a hidden gem that hasn't been unearthed yet - because there is no proof of that.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Before anyone goes medieval on my ass, I am not making a comparison between them as players or their achievements as players.

For those doubting the rationale of appointing Arteta in his first major managerial role, isn’t that what Real Madrid did with Zidane?

[Marc Overmars]

He was coach of their B team pior but yeah it's essentially the same.

Slight difference in quality Arteta would be working with compared to Zidane though..:lol:

[Cripps]

Always thought as a big club we'd try and get someone top notch, seems we might not be thinking that way, for me though it would be Vieira over Arteta, he'd have instant respect for a start, might not work out but for me he'd be the preferred option (plus he's one of Arsenal greatest players - Real did it with Zidane), doing a decent job in the US as well even though that isn't a top league.

Arteta has never managed at all and I haven't personally seen any obvious qualities that might make him a good manager, never ever saw any kind of ruthlessness in him either, as Cripps said he was pretty average overall for us, would be a very odd choice really.

Guardiola seems good friends with Arteta (probably due to being Spanish) that probably helped him decide to have him as number 2, like I said Guardiola has won whoever his number 2 was, so it's not like they have a part in his successes. As I said before Mclaren, Queiroz were supposedly top notch number 2s, as managers however they were bang average, sometimes think managers talk up their impact so they get some credit, truth is if you look at top managers they succeed regardless of their assistants.

I also question whether Arteta will sort this group of players out. If Wilshere or Ramsey didn't obey his orders would Arteta really take them to the cleaners? I have my doubts.

On the other hand reports suggest he's a bit of a prick.

We need someone ruthless with authority but compassion at the same time.

This is such a big risk it's almost negligence of duties from Gazidis.

He wants the plaudits to uncover the next Pep but it's so so risky. At least Zidane and Pep were managing B teams in a professional league. This guy holds a clipboard :unsure:

[Cripps]

P.s. Barca and Madrid have the best squads in the world. We on the other hand need major surgery. Which makes it even more mind boggling:unsure:

[Power n Glory]

Can't really compare it Madrid or Barca. Ridiculous teams for both and they promoted from within and pick managers groomed for the role.

This unprecedented in football. The only comparison I can see is in what Stan did with the LA Rams in American Football. The process has been very similar. Not long after rewarding the LA Rams coach a new contract, Stan sacked their head coach after a poor start to the season. Very similar to Wenger's dismal. The Rams appointmenter the youngest coach in the NFL's history I think. Not sure how Stan went about the selection process but it couldn't have been random. The Rams managed to finish the season as Division Champions or whatever those crazy Yanks do for their competitions. The decision paid off. A lot of writers predicted Stan may choose the same route for Arsenal. We'll see what happens. Unprecedented territory but we'll see what happens. I don't think this is Gazidis making the decision. I think this is the direction Stan wants to go in. But I also doubt Sven and Raul would stand back and not have their say if they thought the appointment was wrong. Same goes for Josh Kroenke. There has to be some research and a consensus behind this decision.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Cripps, I think you are making the understandable mistake of thinking that the next manager is going to be the guy responsible for sorting out the mess. He is likely going to be a part of a team of people, most of whom are now in place sorting it out.

Players won’t just be answerable to the next manager, who will likely be concentrating on coaching and strategy, they’ll be answerable to the people in the new structure who are to date showing competence and proving to be pretty fucking ruthless.

[Chippy]

He was coach of their B team pior but yeah it's essentially the same.

Slight difference in quality Arteta would be working with compared to Zidane though..:lol:

Arteta OUT <_<

[Marc Overmars]

Cripps, I think you are making the understandable mistake of thinking that the next manager is going to be the guy responsible for sorting out the mess. He is likely going to be a part of a team of people, most of whom are now in place sorting it out.

Players won’t just be answerable to the next manager, who will likely be concentrating on coaching and strategy, they’ll be answerable to the people in the new structure who are to date showing competence and proving to be pretty fucking ruthless.

A new era of accountability. I like it.

If it goes tits up we move on, like every other club in the world. Forget about dynasties for the time being.

[Cripps]

@PnG
I think the remit is to go young like LA Rams but in terms of going for Arteta specifically it seems Gazidis is really pushing it. Gazidis seems to see something in Arteta that makes him think he can be our Pep/Zidane.

@Mikel
Regardless of whether it's an individual or part of a team, he'll still be most important person in terms of managing the club and the guy responsible for taking us to the top.

[Cripps]

The ultra young, left wing appointment should have been someone like Nagelsmann. That should be the comparison to the LA Rams head coach. Not a guy with 0 experience.

[Power n Glory]

@PnG
I think the remit is to go young like LA Rams but in terms of going for Arteta specifically it seems Gazidis is really pushing it. Gazidis seems to see something in Arteta that makes him think he can be our Pep/Zidane.

@Mikel
Regardless of whether it's an individual or part of a team, he'll still be most important person in terms of managing the club and the guy responsible for taking us to the top.

Where are you getting this information about Gazidis pushing for the move?

Considering we have appointed two credible footballing guys in Sven and Raul, do you not think they are also backing Gazidis with this decision?

Why would Gazidis stick his neck on the line for Arteta if he doesn't have everyone's backing? Why risk it?

[Niall_Quinn]

Where are you getting this information about Gazidis pushing for the move?

Considering we have appointed two credible footballing guys in Sven and Raul, do you not think they are also backing Gazidis with this decision?

Why would Gazidis stick his neck on the line for Arteta if he doesn't have everyone's backing? Why risk it?

Maybe he's promised Ivan the secret of growing hair like his.

[Cripps]

https://twitter.com/JamesOlley/status/996716487120510976?s=19

There's been a few articles on it, it's common knowledge.

[Niall_Quinn]

https://twitter.com/JamesOlley/status/996716487120510976?s=19

There's been a few articles on it, it's common knowledge.

Nothing at all about Arteta's hair in that article.

[Power n Glory]

https://twitter.com/JamesOlley/status/996716487120510976?s=19

There's been a few articles on it, it's common knowledge.

Gazidis is Cheif Executive so of course it's going to fall on him to make the enquires about Arteta. But you make it sound as if he's the lone wolf leading the charge for him. The writer of the article is making an educated guess based off Gazidis's position at the club. It's nothing solid.

There has to be some sort of consensus for the club to take this sort of risk.

I also totally forgot that Arteta is from Barca and the school of Cryuff. A lot of positive background reports on Arteta. Worth reading them. A lot of hype around him and we may have just been the last to know. Regardless, nothing confirmed yet.

[Xhaka Can’t]

I’m loving finally having something Arsenal related to talk about.

Being hopeful for the future, challenging though it may be, is also a refreshing change.

[Cripps]

@PnG: Well the majority of the people in the know suggest so, so I'll take their word for it :shrug:

I quite like the Barca model where there's a team of specialists and a head coach comes in, and if he doesn't do well, gets the chop. But the head coaches should be actual managers, not just any random Tommy from the backroom staff :shrug:

[Xhaka Can’t]

The Head Coach definitely shouldn’t be a puppet. The assistants neither.

We are so used to puppetry at this Club, we are rightly as fans struggling to come to terms with how things may be done in this new era.

I don’t think Arteta will be anyone’s puppet. Far too many people in the game who’s opinions matter seem to think too highly of him for that.

[Power n Glory]

@PnG: Well the majority of the people in the know suggest so, so I'll take their word for it :shrug:

I quite like the Barca model where there's a team of specialists and a head coach comes in, and if he doesn't do well, gets the chop. But the head coaches should be actual managers, not just any random Tommy from the backroom staff :shrug:

But I'm asking you if you think it's Gazidis pushing for this move on his own. Gazidis is the figure head behind all club appointments of course. It's an educated guess from the press. But logically, do you think we're in a situation where Gazidis is pushing for Arteta with nobody else at the club in favour..except Kroenke?

[Cripps]

If reports are to go by Sanllehi wants Enrique, Sven wants Nagelsmann and Gazidis wants Arteta. The first 2 are ruled out but Sanllehi still isn't keen on Arteta.

Yes I think Gazidis is hell bent on Arteta, for some reason he has been since day 1. I think he's managed to convince Josh due to the LA Rams thing and now Arteta is pretty much wrapped up.

[Power n Glory]

If reports are to go by Sanllehi wants Enrique, Sven wants Nagelsmann and Gazidis wants Arteta. The first 2 are ruled out but Sanllehi still isn't keen on Arteta.

Yes I think Gazidis is hell bent on Arteta, for some reason he has been since day 1. I think he's managed to convince Josh due to the LA Rams thing and now Arteta is pretty much wrapped up.

I guessing this is all coming from the press right? Do the math and work out the educated guesses from the press. You don't see the link between the candidates and their respective backers?

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

If reports are to go by Sanllehi wants Enrique, Sven wants Nagelsmann and Gazidis wants Arteta. The first 2 are ruled out but Sanllehi still isn't keen on Arteta.

Yes I think Gazidis is hell bent on Arteta, for some reason he has been since day 1. I think he's managed to convince Josh due to the LA Rams thing and now Arteta is pretty much wrapped up.

Underwhelmed by all 3 of them.

[Marc Overmars]

Meanwhile the guy too ugly for Arsenal is helping himself to another honour with a club that has a fraction of our budget.

[Marc Overmars]

Sky Sports are reporting that talks with Arteta will get underway tomorrow.

[Mac76]

Sky Sports are reporting that talks with Arteta will get underway tomorrow.

"Mikel, we need a new kit man for when Ancelotti starts - decent salary and all the hair gel you could ever want - interested?"

[Özim]

Arteta must be rubbing his hands together at the chance of getting a job at a top club as his first job in management based on a couple of his friends recommending him and Gazidis being on friendly terms with him.

I could understand it more if it was someone like Vieira, a guy who was a top player for us, but for a player of the calibre of Arteta to then get the job when he's never managed would really only happen at a club like Arsenal.

[Letters]

I really don't care what calibre of player they were for us, a lot of great managers haven't been outstanding players.
I wouldn't want either, I'd rather have somewhere who has been there and done it at a top club.

[Özim]

I really don't care what calibre of player they were for us, a lot of great managers haven't been outstanding players.
I wouldn't want either, I'd rather have somewhere who has been there and done it at a top club.

How many managers who were not particularly good players get their 1st job with no management experience at a top club though, the reality is Arteta wasn't even Arsenal through and through, he was a panic buy who never partcularly established himself with us, his best days seemed to be with Everton. I know he was captain at one point, but this was at a time we weren't very good and he never really inspired the team to better things.

I'd understand it if he'd proved himself somewhere else, but getting the job with no experience with us is odd.

Yeah I agree with that, or even someone like Jardim who has shown some talent at management level at least.

[Özim]

Meanwhile the guy too ugly for Arsenal is helping himself to another honour with a club that has a fraction of our budget.

Amazing manager to be honest, tactically brilliant, has an eye for a top player, instill real discipline and belief in his teams and wins stuff. Has his detractors but he's proven.

[Letters]

How many managers who were not particularly good players get their 1st job with no management experience at a top club though
Not many, but I'm not sure how relevant that is. His quality as a player has no bearing on his potential quality as a manager.


I'd understand it if he'd proved himself somewhere else, but getting the job with no experience with us is odd.

Agreed, although that would apply to him or Vieira - the latter would have a few more good will points because he was a proper Arsenal legend, doesn't mean he'd do any better.

As others have said it seems that the new manager will have a far less far-reaching role than Wenger ended up having which can only be a good thing, especially for someone new to management.

[Özim]

Not many, but I'm not sure how relevant that is. His quality as a player has no bearing on his potential quality as a manager.



Agreed, although that would apply to him or Vieira - the latter would have a few more good will points because he was a proper Arsenal legend, doesn't mean he'd do any better.

As others have said it seems that the new manager will have a far less far-reaching role than Wenger ended up having which can only be a good thing, especially for someone new to management.

Vieira at least is managing and is doing a good job albeit in the MLS, but at least he has some experience, plus he the fact he's a legend will give him instant respect, from players and fans. Arteta not so much, nothing about him stands out, doesn't stand out as a leader, isn't a great, has no experience, not exactly a glittering cv, given the next man replaces Wenger a man in charge for 22 years it seems even stranger we'd be looking at him.

[Letters]

I agree it would be a strange appointment, I wouldn't regard Vieira's as any less strange although I agree some would because of his playing days with us.
I never understand why some people think that great player for us = great manager for us. Rarely follows.

[Bumble]

I agree it would be a strange appointment, I wouldn't regard Vieira's as any less strange although I agree some would because of his playing days with us.
I never understand why some people think that great player for us = great manager for us. Rarely follows.

If we are going down the cheap route though why not Eddie Howe or Sean Dyche surely they would make more sense than Arteta. If it was Simeone or Allegri competing for the job then that's different. But at least Howe and Dyche have managed and done a good job on minimal resources.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Vieira at least is managing and is doing a good job albeit in the MLS, but at least he has some experience, plus he the fact he's a legend will give him instant respect, from players and fans. Arteta not so much, nothing about him stands out, doesn't stand out as a leader, isn't a great, has no experience, not exactly a glittering cv, given the next man replaces Wenger a man in charge for 22 years it seems even stranger we'd be looking at him.

Strange to us. Yes.

But they have more information than we do and in Gazidis’s case, his job could be on the line here. It looks as if they are carrying out their due diligence here and their moves over the past year have been sound. Therefore I’m going to give them the benefit of the doubt regardless of who they appoint. Well within reason.

Bear in mind, we are appointing a Coach type Manager that will be easy to get rid of if it looks like not working out.

[AFC Leveller]

Actually wouldnt mind Dyche, he is a very good coach and has Burnley in Europe!

But he wont ever be considered by the board.

[GP]

I agree it would be a strange appointment, I wouldn't regard Vieira's as any less strange although I agree some would because of his playing days with us.
I never understand why some people think that great player for us = great manager for us. Rarely follows.

Clearly Tony Adams should be manager.

[A Gunner]

What about David O'Leary:dance:

[Özim]

I agree it would be a strange appointment, I wouldn't regard Vieira's as any less strange although I agree some would because of his playing days with us.
I never understand why some people think that great player for us = great manager for us. Rarely follows.

It doesn't no, however, Guardiola and Zidane seem to have been successes and they most likely got instant respect from the players and fans when they took over, that goes a long way if things don't start well. If Arteta starts badly I doubt he'll get as much leeway as maybe someone like Allegri or indeed even Vieira, if we lost a few games early on the pressure will mount, that's the problem with an appointment like this, almost needs to be an instant hit or else things will turn. I know people say they will support whoever comes in, it's an easy thing to say, however if he lost 4 games in a row and took a hammering at the hands of our rivals people will be quick to point out he has no experience and should have never got the job.

[Özim]

Strange to us. Yes.

But they have more information than we do and in Gazidis’s case, his job could be on the line here. It looks as if they are carrying out their due diligence here and their moves over the past year have been sound. Therefore I’m going to give them the benefit of the doubt regardless of who they appoint. Well within reason.

Bear in mind, we are appointing a Coach type Manager that will be easy to get rid of if it looks like not working out.

Is Gazidis job on the line though? How often does a manager get employed not workout and is then replaced without anyone losing their job. Surely due dilligence would point against giving someone who's never managed the job though, logic certainly does, especially given he has no real standing with the fans or indeed players.

There's no doubt though that if Arteta gets the job he needs to do a pretty good job in his first season or he'll be out, that's a lot of pressure, someone like Allegri would get more goodwill, not convinced a man who has never managed will be able to deal with that kind of pressure given that he's never experienced it, I know it's not the same but even as our captain he didn't really captain the side well, during his spell we were not particularly good.

From what's been reported, Gazidis just liked Arteta when he was at the club (much like Pochettino and Guardiola do), that doesn't translate to him being a good manager though and the fact he's seemingly so liked doesn't seem to point to a ruthless character either.

[selassie]

Arteta must be rubbing his hands together at the chance of getting a job at a top club as his first job in management based on a couple of his friends recommending him and Gazidis being on friendly terms with him.

I could understand it more if it was someone like Vieira, a guy who was a top player for us, but for a player of the calibre of Arteta to then get the job when he's never managed would really only happen at a club like Arsenal.

It really makes no sense to appoint him. Let's think about this with a clear head, we are apparently close to appointing a new manager who has ZERO management experience, it's actually laughable.

I personally think it's an unnecessary gamble. I have nothing against Arteta and will back him 100% if he gets the job but I would much rather him audition his managerial skills elsewhere.

I am happy to be proven wrong and hope he is an instant success...but as said...it's a huge gamble because we are not in great shape right now so a lot of things need to change. Is Arteta really the man to implement these changes?!

[Power n Glory]

Strange to us. Yes.

But they have more information than we do and in Gazidis’s case, his job could be on the line here. It looks as if they are carrying out their due diligence here and their moves over the past year have been sound. Therefore I’m going to give them the benefit of the doubt regardless of who they appoint. Well within reason.

Bear in mind, we are appointing a Coach type Manager that will be easy to get rid of if it looks like not working out.

Exactly. They must have real faith in Arteta. They’ve been meticulous with every other appointment thus far. It sounds like they have done their due diligence. I wasn’t in favour of this appointment at first but had to think about why they’d risk it all on Arteta.

If they wanted a cheap option with experience, they could go for Howe, Dyche, Rodgers…etc. If they really wanted to con the fans, Vieira or Henry could do the trick. It’s the cheap option, their club legends and popular amongst the fans….

If things go wrong for Arteta, it falls back on senior management for making that decision. They’d have nowhere to hide. They must really believe in Arteta is the next big thing if he gets the job. This won’t go down as a popular decision.

[Özim]

It really makes no sense to appoint him. Let's think about this with a clear head, we are apparently close to appointing a new manager who has ZERO management experience, it's actually laughable.

No it doesn't, there's other candidates out there, candidates we could get if we wanted them enough, they might cost big money but tha'ts what it takes if you want the best, Allegri, Simeone etc, you can't tell me none of those guys would want to manage a huge club like us in the PL and have the chance to make us successful again, seeing as we've just ended up 6th it won't be to hard to improve us either.

Liverpool got Klopp other clubs have got top managers when they've wanted them, we on the other hand seem to be more interested in bringing in someone with no experience, I find that incredibly odd, especially given the fact he's following Wenger who's been in charge 22 years.

[selassie]

No it doesn't, there's other candidates out there, candidates we could get if we wanted them enough, they might cost big money but tha'ts what it takes if you want the best, Allegri, Simeone etc, you can't tell me none of those guys would want to manage a huge club like us in the PL and have the chance to make us successful again, seeing as we've just ended up 6th it won't be to hard to improve us either.

Liverpool got Klopp other clubs have got top managers when they've wanted them, we on the other hand seem to be more interested in bringing in someone with no experience, I find that incredibly odd, especially given the fact he's following Wenger who's been in charge 22 years.

Yep, I personally think we are doing this the wrong way round. Bring in an experienced head now to shake things up and steady the ship, then appoint a Vieira or Arteta or whoever once things are a bit more stable.

[Özim]

Yep, I personally think we are doing this the wrong way round. Bring in an experienced head now to shake things up and steady the ship, then appoint a Vieira or Arteta or whoever once things are a bit more stable.

Agreed, this isn't the time for a rookie, let someone like that take over once we're back in a good place, don't throw them in the deep end after 22 years of Wenger where so much change is required.

[Xhaka Can’t]

There is a difference between having the experience and the qualities to perform the role. I purposely say role because the job seems to be constructed so that it bears almost no resemblance to the role Wenger had.

If we were going to pick a traditional manager with experience, there are a plethora of duffers out there with experience coming out their asses. Sadly, in most instances it seems their football was pulled out of the same orifice.

I’m not saying Arteta is the right or wrong choice, but if he is the choice it is bold in that they are taking a risk by giving greater prevalence to his qualities over experience. It could also be a bold choice in terms of the Club wanting to implement a novel approach to managing the team in a way that established managers aren’t necessarily going to want to work.

Who knows? Its all up in the air?

But at least we are now doing SOMETHING that takes us out of the stagnation we have endured for years.

[Letters]

however if he lost 4 games in a row and took a hammering at the hands of our rivals people will be quick to point out he has no experience and should have never got the job and Letters was right all along and Wenger should definitely have stayed.

Fixed your post :ninja:

[Özim]

Wenger has just backed him:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/44150823

That's enough to convince me he shoudn't get the job :run:

[Özim]

Incidentally, I do think a manager should have a say in who is signed by the club, they manage the team after all, they should have final say on who comes in (people can mke suggestions and give informed opinions, but if you're building something you should be able to choose the tools you use).

[selassie]

There is a difference between having the experience and the qualities to perform the role. I purposely say role because the job seems to be constructed so that it bears almost no resemblance to the role Wenger had.

If we were going to pick a traditional manager with experience, there are a plethora of duffers out there with experience coming out their asses. Sadly, in most instances it seems their football was pulled out of the same orifice.

I’m not saying Arteta is the right or wrong choice, but if he is the choice it is bold in that they are taking a risk by giving greater prevalence to his qualities over experience. It could also be a bold choice in terms of the Club wanting to implement a novel approach to managing the team in a way that established managers aren’t necessarily going to want to work.

Who knows? Its all up in the air?

But at least we are now doing SOMETHING that takes us out of the stagnation we have endured for years.

It seems to me that what we are implementing is just the standard thing that has been implemented everywhere else, I.E. Chelsea, Liverpool, to a lesser extent at Spurs, City and United and of course at European clubs like Real and Barca etc.

I am sure Arteta will have a say in transfers, he won't have the power of Wenger...but then we wouldn't want anyone to regardless of who they are.

I do agree it's all up in the air...but it does concern me the amount of talk of Arteta.

We are Arsenal Football Club, we are a big club going through a difficult transition, why complicate it by bringing in a novice?

[IBK]

It really makes no sense to appoint him. Let's think about this with a clear head, we are apparently close to appointing a new manager who has ZERO management experience, it's actually laughable.

I personally think it's an unnecessary gamble. I have nothing against Arteta and will back him 100% if he gets the job but I would much rather him audition his managerial skills elsewhere.

I am happy to be proven wrong and hope he is an instant success...but as said...it's a huge gamble because we are not in great shape right now so a lot of things need to change. Is Arteta really the man to implement these changes?!

I would have agreed initially, but after a bit of thought I don't think Arteta would be a bad appointment. Here's why. Firstly, I don't think there exists a 'no risk' appointment. The nearest thing that exists to this would be a Guardiola or a Klopp at the present time - managers tested in the EPL who have shown their credentials (I am not including Mourinho here as...well just no). They are not available, and anyone else would be a risk and would not necessarily deliver what us fans crave - namely instant success. Second, I think that we have to accept that there is not going to be an instant transformation of our team in terms of winning things, like there was when AW was appointed. Our domestic, and European competitors are simply too well funded and established and it is going to take time to become competetive again. While I would hope that if he is appointed, Arteta is not a Moyes at Manure, I think we have to accept that we are going to enter a turbulent and rebuilding period, and in a strange way it may be better to have a manager who doesn't come with massive expectations - which I fear that someone like Allegri or Simeone would even if they were available. If an Arteta can pull off the basic changes that we require in terms of player complacency; basic tactics and new ideas (and I do feel that we have the core of a talented squad that is capable of responding to this) then even if he does not survive this transition an effectively 'interim' appointment may not be the worst thing in the world. If Arteta could pull it off and stay longer term then obviously that would be a good thing.

What I don't think we can do as a club is start to go down the route of continual turnover of managers who come with big reps but end up not succeeding at Rasenal. We don't realistically have the financial clout to do this; and for all their success based on money, I would rather we do not become a Citeh or a Chelsea - even if we could compete on their level. Arteta would be a risk, yes, but I think that we need a new footballing approach, and he should come with some fresh ideas (given his background under Guardiala), and energy - plus he has Arsenal DNA which I think is a good thing.

A left field and by no means ideal appointment but for me I would not throw my toys out of the pram if he came.

[selassie]

I would have agreed initially, but after a bit of thought I don't think Arteta would be a bad appointment. Here's why. Firstly, I don't think there exists a 'no risk' appointment. The nearest thing that exists to this would be a Guardiola or a Klopp at the present time - managers tested in the EPL who have shown their credentials (I am not including Mourinho here as...well just no). They are not available, and anyone else would be a risk and would not necessarily deliver what us fans crave - namely instant success. Second, I think that we have to accept that there is not going to be an instant transformation of our team in terms of winning things, like there was when AW was appointed. Our domestic, and European competitors are simply too well funded and established and it is going to take time to become competetive again. While I would hope that if he is appointed, Arteta is not a Moyes at Manure, I think we have to accept that we are going to enter a turbulent and rebuilding period, and in a strange way it may be better to have a manager who doesn't come with massive expectations - which I fear that someone like Allegri or Simeone would even if they were available. If an Arteta can pull off the basic changes that we require in terms of player complacency; basic tactics and new ideas (and I do feel that we have the core of a talented squad that is capable of responding to this) then even if he does not survive this transition an effectively 'interim' appointment may not be the worst thing in the world. If Arteta could pull it off and stay longer term then obviously that would be a good thing.

What I don't think we can do as a club is start to go down the route of continual turnover of managers who come with big reps but end up not succeeding at Rasenal. We don't realistically have the financial clout to do this; and for all their success based on money, I would rather we do not become a Citeh or a Chelsea - even if we could compete on their level. Arteta would be a risk, yes, but I think that we need a new footballing approach, and he should come with some fresh ideas (given his background under Guardiala), and energy - plus he has Arsenal DNA which I think is a good thing.

A left field and by no means ideal appointment but for me I would not throw my toys out of the pram if he came.

Hey IBK, good seeing you back mate. Yeah fair points here, can't argue against any of that. TBF, I won't be throwing my toys out of the pram if we appoint Arteta, I genuinely will back him. The positive to all this Arteta talk is that he comes with a lot of ringing endorsements from many well regarded managers so he must have something about him.

I just hope that he is able to implement the changes you stated and that he has the respect of the players, they are the two key things for me and I have doubts about both of them.

We shall see...

[Niall_Quinn]

Wenger has just backed him:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/44150823

That's enough to convince me he shoudn't get the job :run:

ARTETA OUT FFS!!!!!!!!!

[Globalgunner]

The thing this appointment, if true says to me is that this 2nd class mentality really has become endemic in this club. Appointing someone with ZERO experience in management means the club are prepared to wait 2 maybe 3 years before we start competing for titles again. Anyone who thinks this is part of some well well researched esoteric thought process is basically putting the blinkers on. After a 10 year "no compete" environment at the club due to Wengers self indulgence and idiosyncrasies. The fans deserve better than to just wait and hope. We have 5 teams already ahead of us in progression and ambition and we are ready to take a punt on someone who puts out the cones for Guardiola. Not even Everton and West Ham would consider appointing Arteta.
"WTF is going on at this stupid club"?!!!

[Niall_Quinn]

The thing this appointment, if true says to me is that this 2nd class mentality really has become endemic in this club. Appointing someone with ZERO experience in management means the club are prepared to wait 2 maybe 3 years before we start competing for titles again. Anyone who thinks this is part of some well well researched esoteric thought process is basically putting the blinkers on. After a 10 year "no compete" environment at the club due to Wengers self indulgence and idiosyncrasies. The fans deserve better than to just wait and hope. We have 5 teams already ahead of us in progression and ambition and we are ready to take a punt on someone who puts out the cones for Guardiola. Not even Everton and West Ham would consider appointing Arteta.
"WTF is going on at this stupid club"?!!!

Seriously though, do you not grasp how much damage Wenger has done? I was settled in for the 2-3 years wait for a challenge regardless. We have no defence - I mean NONE. We have the weakest midfield in the top 6 by a country mile. And we have 2 decent strikers, probably thanks to somebody who went against Wenger's wishes.

We have void where an emperor used to be.

A damaged reputation.

No CL football.

We are viewed as an easy touch by everyone we play away from home, because we are.

We are boring.

Toothless.

We have a fanbase, half of which has accepted second best as a badge of honour.

Let's be realistic about the timescales required to reverse this shit.

It took Pep a year.

Klopp 2 years.

Why are we going to get it done in a summer?

The fanbase was split in two due to Wenger's selfishness. Arsenal became more of a war than a football club.

Now all the fans need to get back behind the team and at least give the guys who have made the change a chance, in my opinion.

It could go tits up, no doubt. But it hasn't done yet - we are still at the start. Let's start as we mean to go on, unified and determined.

In my opinion, because after the Wenger fiasco I'm not really 100% sure what it means to be a football fan any more.

[Marc Overmars]

Now Sky are saying Henry will be contacted. :haha:

They have no fucking clue.

But it's a firm no to Henry from me - I don't really like the way he speaks about football on TV, doesn't strike me as being a particularly insightful or inspirational coach. I'd prefer my lasting memories of him to be the greatest player I've ever seen play.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Now Sky are saying Henry will be contacted. :haha:

They have no fucking clue.


Who, Sky or the club? :coffee:

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Actually wouldnt mind Dyche, he is a very good coach and has Burnley in Europe!

But he wont ever be considered by the board.

If we're willing to stomach Simeone's football then I don't see why we can't put up with Dyche's....

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Why can't we just bring in Jardim!!!

[AFC Leveller]

When Henry is talking about football on the tely, I just want him to shut up. He talks so much nonsense and blabs on about all sorts of shit without being convincing or articulate. I think Gazidis is doing the decent thing and asking clubs legends (PV and TH) what they think to make it look like he’s doing a proper search but he will go for Arteta in the end.

[Xhaka Can’t]

They all talk shite on the telly. There are only so many times you can say the same thing.

[selassie]

Why can't we just bring in Jardim!!!

He doesn’t speak English apparently. I agree with you though, I wanted him as my first choice.

[Özim]

Would have Henry over Arteta if I had to choose a guy with no management experience personally, Arteta just doesn't appeal at all, the thought of having to watch Guardialo style of football isn't a good one, really never liked it and have always found it so boring to watch.

[Power n Glory]

Would have Henry over Arteta if I had to choose a guy with no management experience personally, Arteta just doesn't appeal at all, the thought of having to watch Guardialo style of football isn't a good one, really never liked it and have always found it so boring to watch.

What have you heard about Henry as a coach to come to that conclusion?

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Also there's a very decent chance Henry would play 'Guardiola' football too surely?

[Bumble]

Would have Henry over Arteta if I had to choose a guy with no management experience personally, Arteta just doesn't appeal at all, the thought of having to watch Guardialo style of football isn't a good one, really never liked it and have always found it so boring to watch.

have you not watched city play this year? them and Liverpool are incredibly entertaining. I enjoy watching them play and normally I am not fussed about other teams football excluding Arsenals.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Ivan is employing the old Wenger magic.

Lower everyone's expectations by asking ex players that you know just wouldn't work, so that everyone then eventually begs for Arteta!

[KSE Comedy Club]

have you not watched city play this year? them and Liverpool are incredibly entertaining. I enjoy watching them play and normally I am not fussed about other teams football excluding Arsenals.

They have been very good on occasions, more often than not.

There was some ex footballer fool (didn't catch his name though) on talksport last night saying that Pep had brought a level of football playing style to the prem the likes of which we have never seen before.........


Clearly, he must have been in a coma during the invincible's years then :coffee:

[Özim]

What have you heard about Henry as a coach to come to that conclusion?

Not a lot but then what have we heard about Arteta, at least Henry will have instant respect. That was my point though, if we're going to pick a player with no management experience would prefer it to be someone I like and who was a great, Arteta doesn't fit into either for me, wasn't a great and didn't like him much as a player, he typifies Wengers' weakest period of management.

Arteta would be the most disappointing appointment for me, nothing about him appeals, I don't much care what his friends say either, because they're bound to be complimentary, if he gets the job we'll see what happens but this appointment is potentially a disaster because the guy won't get long to prove he knows what he's doing IMO, if it's not happening after half a season people will probably say we were mad to take him on and we need to replace him (as happens at most clubs), unknowns like him don't get the same period of grace as the bigger names who have proved themselves.

Gazidis may indeed like him, but to be fair he's been here for a long time now and until recently hasn't done a huge amount of good so I'm not personally ready to trust him 100% with his decisions, especially given some of the things he's come out with over the years.

[Özim]

have you not watched city play this year? them and Liverpool are incredibly entertaining. I enjoy watching them play and normally I am not fussed about other teams football excluding Arsenals.

Liverpool are great to watch, City not so much and Guardiolas tika-taka style I just can't stomach, for me it's slow and dull to watch.

[Özim]

Also there's a very decent chance Henry would play 'Guardiola' football too surely?

Who knows, Henry played in a counter attacking team, so there's just as much chance he'd play that style instead.

[Goonermerree]

Liverpool are great to watch, City not so much and Guardiolas tika-taka style I just can't stomach, for me it's slow and dull to watch.

At least City play tika-taka with some pace, not the pissy-passy backwards, sideways stuff that reverted to.

[Özim]

At least City play tika-taka with some pace, not the pissy-passy backwards, sideways stuff that reverted to.

Barca were masters at it, far better than this City side, I didn't like it then either to be honest so either way I'm not keen. Makes me laugh all the talk about City being so amaizing, Wigan knocked them out of the cup and Liverpool beat them convincingy in th CL, yes they won the league but noone really put in a proper challenge for them.

There's been far far better sides, us, the Man U side that did the treble (and sides before and after that), Barca, Real, Milan when they were great and the list goes on, people going way over the top with Guardiola, they seem to love the guy, yes he's won stuff but let's be honest it wasn't without either inheriting the best side or being given huge amounts of money, at Bayern he failed to win the CL, his predecessor however managed it and he took over that side, so IMO he failed.

[Power n Glory]

Ivan is employing the old Wenger magic.

Lower everyone's expectations by asking ex players that you know just wouldn't work, so that everyone then eventually begs for Arteta!

Hypothetical scenario - If the year were 2009, we’ve just sacked Wenger, done the backroom staff changes and Pep Guardiola was still the Barca B team manager but the lead candidate to take over at Arsenal we’d all be sceptical. Especially if Roberto Mancini has just won his third title Serie A at Inter and Luis Van Gaal has won the Bundesliga with Bayern along with the cup! Heck, around this time, Klopp would have just started at Dortmund and wouldn’t even be considered over these two.

I can’t fault the club for trying to nab someone with massive potential as soon as possible. If we get it wrong, we get it wrong. It’s a low risk, high reward scenario.

[Goonermerree]

The first manager coming after Wenger is going to find it difficult anyway, maybe Arteta is the fall guy like I think Moyes was. I think Arteta would be mad to take it to be honest, he could start smaller and succeed.

[Marc Overmars]

The first manager coming after Wenger is going to find it difficult anyway, maybe Arteta is the fall guy like I think Moyes was. I think Arteta would be mad to take it to be honest, he could start smaller and succeed.

He'd be mad not to take it.

It's the opportunity of a lifetime for him.

[Goonermerree]

He'd be mad not to take it.

It's the opportunity of a lifetime for him.

If he does well, yes, if he fails miserably it could be hard for him.

[Power n Glory]

Not a lot but then what have we heard about Arteta, at least Henry will have instant respect. That was my point though, if we're going to pick a player with no management experience would prefer it to be someone I like and who was a great, Arteta doesn't fit into either for me, wasn't a great and didn't like him much as a player, he typifies Wengers' weakest period of management.

Arteta would be the most disappointing appointment for me, nothing about him appeals, I don't much care what his friends say either, because they're bound to be complimentary, if he gets the job we'll see what happens but this appointment is potentially a disaster because the guy won't get long to prove he knows what he's doing IMO, if it's not happening after half a season people will probably say we were mad to take him on and we need to replace him (as happens at most clubs), unknowns like him don't get the same period of grace as the bigger names who have proved themselves.

Gazidis may indeed like him, but to be fair he's been here for a long time now and until recently hasn't done a huge amount of good so I'm not personally ready to trust him 100% with his decisions, especially given some of the things he's come out with over the years.

Have you been reading anything else around Arteta?

Not to shit on Henry, but he was captain of Arsenal too and he wasn't a good captain at all. He came across as someone that was overbearing and couldn’t get his ideas across to the team. He’s was never cut out to be captain.

Arteta was captain at Everton, all the reports say he’s got a great tactical mind and thinks like a manager. That’s during his playing days and before he retired. Henry has already expressed how difficult it is to transmit ideas to players as a manager and he’s easing himself into the role.

You have to do some of your own research on this one, Zim. Look up some of the stories about Arteta. Feel free to disagree after that but you can’t be silly enough to vouch for someone like Henry who we know a lot less about and isn’t as focused on becoming a manager as Arteta.

[Marc Overmars]

If he does well, yes, if he fails miserably it could be hard for him.

If this goes well it would be the making of him and that outweighs the prospect of failing and going back to being a number 2. A career in coaching/management can be twice as long as a playing career, he will get other opportunities but none as great as this.

You don't anywhere in life without taking risks.

[Goonermerree]

If this goes well it would be the making of him and that outweighs the prospect of failing and going back to being a number 2. A career in coaching/management can be twice as long as a playing career, he will get other opportunities but none as great as this.

You don't anywhere in life without taking risks.

We'll see in May 2019, if he is appointed.

[Marc Overmars]

We'll see in May 2019, if he is appointed.

If he flopped it would suck for us, sure. It's not going to ruin a 36 year old at the start of his career in coaching though. So that's why I don't see why he'd be mad to take the role.

[Niall_Quinn]

We're looking for a lot more in a manager than how he performed as a player for the club. We really don't know too much about how individuals were perceived behind the scenes and what input they had. Merts hasn't shown up for 2 seasons as a player, but apparently he was important off the pitch. Maybe that's true, maybe it's not. We don't know. Personalities are important too. I'm not so sure Henry would make a great manager on that basis. He's shown in the past he has very little patience when things aren't going right.

Conte is still my top choice. I just have a gut feeling about him. Jardim would be next, because he's shown the flexibility both attacking and defensive that will be required to put our rather wrecked squad back on track. But if we have to have a young, inexperienced manager I'd take Arteta over Henry and Vieira, because Arteta has been positioned best to pick up directly relevant experience as a coach in a winning environment. The other two were much better players, of course.

I also like the idea of Alonso as a number 2. He should have been an Arsenal man a long time ago but Wenger penny pinched. What a great pro though, another guy who has seen it all at the top level.

PnG is right. We are in a low risk, potentially high reward situation here. And the beauty, if it doesn't work out we aren't left worried about sacking some permanent fixture that built the stadium with his bare hands and was the first man on the moon. If it doesn't work, boot him and bring in somebody else. Where were we going under Wenger? Nowhere, faster and faster. Another season going nowhere is what we had in store anyway, but at least now there's the possibility of something different.

Let's give Arteta a go and see how it works out. I have a suspicion things are going to be better than expected. Not miraculous, not instant magic, but better than slowly fading into mid table mediocrity and certainly more entertaining for the fans.

[Goonermerree]

I've wondered about Conte too.

[Mac76]

I've wondered about Conte too.

Ivan et al will never take Conte - after Wenger they're looking for someone they can control, and after Conte's arguments with the Chelski heirarchy, that man is not Conte, whether any of us want him or not

[Power n Glory]

We're looking for a lot more in a manager than how he performed as a player for the club. We really don't know too much about how individuals were perceived behind the scenes and what input they had. Merts hasn't shown up for 2 seasons as a player, but apparently he was important off the pitch. Maybe that's true, maybe it's not. We don't know. Personalities are important too. I'm not so sure Henry would make a great manager on that basis. He's shown in the past he has very little patience when things aren't going right.

Conte is still my top choice. I just have a gut feeling about him. Jardim would be next, because he's shown the flexibility both attacking and defensive that will be required to put our rather wrecked squad back on track. But if we have to have a young, inexperienced manager I'd take Arteta over Henry and Vieira, because Arteta has been positioned best to pick up directly relevant experience as a coach in a winning environment. The other two were much better players, of course.

I also like the idea of Alonso as a number 2. He should have been an Arsenal man a long time ago but Wenger penny pinched. What a great pro though, another guy who has seen it all at the top level.

PnG is right. We are in a low risk, potentially high reward situation here. And the beauty, if it doesn't work out we aren't left worried about sacking some permanent fixture that built the stadium with his bare hands and was the first man on the moon. If it doesn't work, boot him and bring in somebody else. Where were we going under Wenger? Nowhere, faster and faster. Another season going nowhere is what we had in store anyway, but at least now there's the possibility of something different.

Let's give Arteta a go and see how it works out. I have a suspicion things are going to be better than expected. Not miraculous, not instant magic, but better than slowly fading into mid table mediocrity and certainly more entertaining for the fans.

I remember hearing really early on that Arteta and Merts were influential in the dressing room. This was within the first 6 months to year of them joining. We may have missed that on the pitch and results but who knows what the players were able to get away with during training and in the dressing room. It’s no coincidence that they’re gone on to coaching roles straight after retirement.

[Özim]

I remember hearing really early on that Arteta and Merts were influential in the dressing room. This was within the first 6 months to year of them joining. We may have missed that on the pitch and results but who knows what the players were able to get away with during training and in the dressing room. It’s no coincidence that they’re gone on to coaching roles straight after retirement.

I don't get it to be honest, if they are influential in the dressing room why wouldn't it translate to the pitch, surely that's the whole point or they have in reality no influence at all, unless they were referring to boot cleaning or something.

As for Mertesacker, yes I remember him saying something after we'd lost to Bayern 5-1 in the 1st leg in the CL, he rallied the troops, we then lost the 2nd leg 5-1 as well. Wasn't impressed. Personally don't really want anyone from the "losers" era at Arsenal, all these guys did is bottle it and lose time and time again without any real fight or stomach for the fight, none of them were really winners.

[Power n Glory]

Ivan et al will never take Conte - after Wenger they're looking for someone they can control, and after Conte's arguments with the Chelski heirarchy, that man is not Conte, whether any of us want him or not

Everyone falls out with the owner at Chelsea. I wouldn't hold it against Conte. What's the fallout over?

[Özim]

Have you been reading anything else around Arteta?

Not to shit on Henry, but he was captain of Arsenal too and he wasn't a good captain at all. He came across as someone that was overbearing and couldn’t get his ideas across to the team. He’s was never cut out to be captain.

Arteta was captain at Everton, all the reports say he’s got a great tactical mind and thinks like a manager. That’s during his playing days and before he retired. Henry has already expressed how difficult it is to transmit ideas to players as a manager and he’s easing himself into the role.

You have to do some of your own research on this one, Zim. Look up some of the stories about Arteta. Feel free to disagree after that but you can’t be silly enough to vouch for someone like Henry who we know a lot less about and isn’t as focused on becoming a manager as Arteta.

Arteta was captain too, probably one of the worst ones as well, whilst he was in charge we were really poor, with little fight and were bottlers on the pitch, never saw him make an ounce of difference, seemed to have no authority to me, which makes sense because Wenger openly admitted the captaincy is overrated and pretty meaningless.

The people vouching for Arteta seem to be his friends, why wouldn't they, I've alreayd said the value of numbers 2s is minimal, Guardiola was successful way before Arteta appeared, he doesn't need a number 2 to win that's clear, he wins as long as he has money or is at the most successful club.

Likewise Mclaren and Queiroz, Ferguson raved about them, when they got into management they flopped big time, words are cheap to be honest and Arteta has shown nothing to suggest he'd make a good manager to me, no authority when he was with us and no experience at management level, guys like him don't get jobs at top clubs as a 1st job, greats do, like Zidane etc, but that's because they have instant respect from their achievements in the game (tho at least he'd managed Barca B), Vieira has more experience at least as he's doing a very good job in the MLS so at least he has something on his CV.

My preference for Henry is the fact he was a great, Arteta and Henry have no experience, but one will at least be respected by the players who know how good he was, Arteta was nothing more than a journeyman who wasn't much good with us.

[Power n Glory]

I don't get it to be honest, if they are influential in the dressing room why wouldn't it translate to the pitch, surely that's the whole point or they have in reality no influence at all, unless they were referring to boot cleaning or something.

As for Mertesacker, yes I remember him saying something after we'd lost to Bayern 5-1 in the 1st leg in the CL, he rallied the troops, we then lost the 2nd leg 5-1 as well. Wasn't impressed. Personally don't really want anyone from the "losers" era at Arsenal, all these guys did is bottle it and lose time and time again without any real fight or stomach for the fight, none of them were really winners.

Would you like to do the same with Theirry Henry's time as captain? What influence did he have?

[Özim]

We're looking for a lot more in a manager than how he performed as a player for the club. We really don't know too much about how individuals were perceived behind the scenes and what input they had. Merts hasn't shown up for 2 seasons as a player, but apparently he was important off the pitch. Maybe that's true, maybe it's not. We don't know. Personalities are important too. I'm not so sure Henry would make a great manager on that basis. He's shown in the past he has very little patience when things aren't going right.

Does that matter? If their influence doesn't translate to the pitch, it's pretty pointless, you heard all these things at Arsenal, players speaking out, backing Wenger, telling us how they've got to prove themselves in the return leg, all that ever happened was another beating, all words with no substance, IMO that era of Arsenal is one to forget, there's nothing we should be taking from that and using, it's a time we just need to forget and move on from because it was a disaster on and off the pitch.

[Özim]

Would you like to do the same with Theirry Henry's time as captain? What influence did he have?

He made things happen on the pitch, maybe not a great captain but at least he was a winner, what was Arteta?

[Power n Glory]

He made things happen on the pitch, maybe not a great captain but at least he was a winner, what was Arteta?

As a player he was a winner. What was his influence as a captain. What did we win? Do a comparison.

[KSE Comedy Club]

My worry here, is that we seem to be thinking along the lines that getting Arteta in is an 'ok idea' or is somehow acceptable....???

We are supposed to be a top club, even Everton, West ham, etc, would be looking for an established manager of some sort. When the proper names were first being mentioned, Allegri, Jardim, Tuchel, Low, Enrique - I thought, ok, at least we are looking in the right areas and it is no less than we should expect to turn things around and take us back to the top.

But I just don't understand this train of thought that someone with no experience or ex players (Legends) is acceptable as an option to replace the manager :shrug:

It's exactly akin to '4th place is like a trophy' or that train of thought.

Just not good enough for me :sulk:

[Özim]

As a player he was a winner. What was his influence as a captain. What did we win? Do a comparison.

On the pitch he won a lot, he was part of our most succesful team under Wenger, personally don't think a striker should be captain as they are ahead of the play, but in terms of his performances he was a leader.

What influence did Arteta have as captain, all I saw is us losing every big game and never having any fight, this alleged off the field influence is all very good but where is the evidence, where is the proof they did, where are the reversal of results or half time talks prompting a comeback. This era of Arsenal was all mouth and no trousers, nothing ever backed up their words, words are cheap as they say.

I take what we hear about Arteta with a pinch of salt, most of it comes from people who openly acknowledge they are his friends, they aren't exactly going to discredit him.

[Özim]

My worry here, is that we seem to be thinking along the lines that getting Arteta in is an 'ok idea' or is somehow acceptable....???

We are supposed to be a top club, even Everton, West ham, etc, would be looking for an established manager of some sort. When the proper names were first being mentioned, Allegri, Jardim, Tuchel, Low, Enrique - I thought, ok, at least we are looking in the right areas and it is no less than we should expect to turn things around and take us back to the top.

But I just don't understand this train of thought that someone with no experience or ex players (Legends) is acceptable as an option to replace the manager :shrug:

It's exactly akin to '4th place is like a trophy' or that train of thought.

Just not good enough for me :sulk:

No I don't get it either, its the equivalent of Wenger trying to find the next gem, now we seem to be doing it with managers, what we need is a guy with a proven record who has the authority required to make the changes happen and who isn't scared to ruffle a few feathers and dismantle this awful squad and start again (other than in attack) and a guy not scared to sign up top players and handle them correctly.

[Mac76]

we seem to be thinking along the lines that getting Arteta in is an 'ok idea' or is somehow acceptable....???:

not me pal

[Power n Glory]

On the pitch he won a lot, he was part of our most succesful team under Wenger, personally don't think a striker should be captain as they are ahead of the play, but in terms of his performances he was a leader.

What influence did Arteta have as captain, all I saw is us losing every big game and never having any fight, this alleged off the field influence is all very good but where is the evidence, where is the proof they did, where are the reversal of results or half time talks prompting a comeback. This era of Arsenal was all mouth and no trousers, nothing ever backed up their words, words are cheap as they say.

I take what we hear about Arteta with a pinch of salt, most of it comes from people who openly acknowledge they are his friends, they aren't exactly going to discredit him.

You do know a great players doesn't always transition into a great manager?

I get the skepticism on Arteta but you lose the argument when you suggest Henry is a better candidate. He has less experience as a coach, he spends more time talking as pundit than actually coaching players. How is that sensible?

[Özim]

You do know a great players doesn't always transition into a great manager?

I get the skepticism on Arteta but you lose the argument when you suggest Henry is a better candidate. He has less experience as a coach, he spends more time talking as pundit than actually coaching players. How is that sensible?

Yes I do, but muy point is a great player at least will get more leeway as he'll get respect from the off, not sure Arteta will get much of that based on his playing career. I just think considering neither has any management experience a former great maybe has the advantage.

[Bumble]

No I don't get it either, its the equivalent of Wenger trying to find the next gem, now we seem to be doing it with managers, what we need is a guy with a proven record who has the authority required to make the changes happen and who isn't scared to ruffle a few feathers and dismantle this awful squad and start again (other than in attack) and a guy not scared to sign up top players and handle them correctly.

we aren't going to have the £ to start again.. as that's expensive. I am sure Arteta wont be scared to sign top players but would a top player come to us for Europa league football instead of CL football. Do we need 11 top players. No. We need a few top players, we have one in Auba. ozil can be good and ramsey.

Realistically how much higher in the league can we go. 4th place. Maybe with Arteta they are looking for a smoother transition by appointing someone who knows the club but wont made ridiculous demands for players, money etc. Just trying to think behind the logic.

Although I wouldn't say its low risk but high reward, as we could get worse. Ozil and Auba could look at the new manager and thing nahhhh. We sign journeymen players and those two think there isn't long on their careers to waste waiting to see if Arteta can take us forward.

If it is Arteta then there is nothing I can do about it. so be it and we will see how it goes. I quite like Europa league myself, more interesting than the CL first round knock out.

[I am invisible]

For me, the appointment of the first team coach should purely come down to the ideas, innovation, analysis and level of effective communication they offer - everything else should be provided by the club.

Scouting and player recruitment? Club.

Contracts? Club.

Fitness and conditioning? Club.

Basic training, technical standards, discipline and mentality? Club.

Things like organising a defence properly, implementing a high-press, being able to control the ball under pressure and pass quickly and accurately with both feet... why are we waiting for the right first team coach to come along to sort these things out for us? As far as I'm concerned, these are all things that we should be drilling into our players at club level as part of the footballing identity of AFC. Ever-present standards, not things that come and go with whoever happens to be in charge of the first team at any given moment.

The first team coach should be there to prepare the first team for matches and make the big decisions in real-time on match days. They should have enough free rein to put their own, unique stamp on the side through things like shape and formation, tactics, player selection and player responsibilities (i.e. the role they're given), but beyond that they shouldn't be burdened with any other responsibilities.

This is what I'm hoping the club is working towards, anyway. We've made a promising start with Sven and Raul and the mass culling of our ineffective coaching team - now we need to go about hiring best-in-class replacements for all of those guys who have gone. I'm almost as excited about this side of what's going on as I am about who we might bring in to work with the first team - if we get it right, then the task of finding first team coaches is going to be considerably easier going forward, and we're going to have a much larger pool of candidates to choose from.

[Bumble]

Also typically Arsenal that even with Wenger leaving.... people are still complaining and moaning. we should be positive and embrace the future until at least we lose our first home game against West Ham or something!!!

[Mac76]

Wenger has just backed him:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/44150823

That's enough to convince me he shoudn't get the job :run:

yeah it's Fergushite and Moyes all over again - Wenger backing backing someone he knows will look a failure compared to him - so he's obviously convinced Arteta will have us finishing 7th or lower...

[Power n Glory]

Yes I do, but muy point is a great player at least will get more leeway as he'll get respect from the off, not sure Arteta will get much of that based on his playing career. I just think considering neither has any management experience a former great maybe has the advantage.

How does Henry have the advantage when he’s the sort of player that can produce a solo effort to change the game? What if he doesn’t have players with that sort of mentality, physical or technical ability? What’s his reference point when a player feels he can’t live up to the legendary Thierry Henry? I don’t think it’s that easy to translate how he’d react and he’d see as player to the players he’s coaching. He’s said it himself. Look it up. Respect goes out of the window quickly if you can’t find the tactical solution. Then trying to deal with players as individuals to thinking as a collective and getting them to gel and be cohesive is another level.

Besides being Captain, Arteta has shadowed a great coach and has been with Pep at City from the start. He’s seen the highs and lows and at least has a reference point on how to tackle certain problems. That doesn’t mean he’ll be able to apply what he has learnt successfully but it’s a lot more than someone trying to live off past experiences.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Hypothetical scenario - If the year were 2009, weÂ’ve just sacked Wenger, done the backroom staff changes and Pep Guardiola was still the Barca B team manager but the lead candidate to take over at Arsenal weÂ’d all be sceptical. Especially if Roberto Mancini has just won his third title Serie A at Inter and Luis Van Gaal has won the Bundesliga with Bayern along with the cup! Heck, around this time, Klopp would have just started at Dortmund and wouldnÂ’t even be considered over these two.

I canÂ’t fault the club for trying to nab someone with massive potential as soon as possible. If we get it wrong, we get it wrong. ItÂ’s a low risk, high reward scenario.

That is an excellent way of looking at it. I do understand how people feel though. We persevered with a manager who had long since passed his prime. I believe that if it does not work with Arteta, the situation won’t be replicated as some fear. Wenger had a powerbase and a route to the owner that Arteta - and any other manager is not going to have.

I think if they take the leap with Arteta, they will be monitoring and acting very quickly on any situation that develops.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Arteta was captain too, probably one of the worst ones as well, whilst he was in charge we were really poor, with little fight and were bottlers on the pitch, never saw him make an ounce of difference, seemed to have no authority to me, which makes sense because Wenger openly admitted the captaincy is overrated and pretty meaningless.

The people vouching for Arteta seem to be his friends, why wouldn't they, I've alreayd said the value of numbers 2s is minimal, Guardiola was successful way before Arteta appeared, he doesn't need a number 2 to win that's clear, he wins as long as he has money or is at the most successful club.

Likewise Mclaren and Queiroz, Ferguson raved about them, when they got into management they flopped big time, words are cheap to be honest and Arteta has shown nothing to suggest he'd make a good manager to me, no authority when he was with us and no experience at management level, guys like him don't get jobs at top clubs as a 1st job, greats do, like Zidane etc, but that's because they have instant respect from their achievements in the game (tho at least he'd managed Barca B), Vieira has more experience at least as he's doing a very good job in the MLS so at least he has something on his CV.

My preference for Henry is the fact he was a great, Arteta and Henry have no experience, but one will at least be respected by the players who know how good he was, Arteta was nothing more than a journeyman who wasn't much good with us.

I don’t think you know what “journeyman” means.

[Niall_Quinn]

My worry here, is that we seem to be thinking along the lines that getting Arteta in is an 'ok idea' or is somehow acceptable....???

We are supposed to be a top club, even Everton, West ham, etc, would be looking for an established manager of some sort. When the proper names were first being mentioned, Allegri, Jardim, Tuchel, Low, Enrique - I thought, ok, at least we are looking in the right areas and it is no less than we should expect to turn things around and take us back to the top.

But I just don't understand this train of thought that someone with no experience or ex players (Legends) is acceptable as an option to replace the manager :shrug:

It's exactly akin to '4th place is like a trophy' or that train of thought.

Just not good enough for me :sulk:

It seems to me we don't have a manager's position any more. We're looking for a coach. A fractional role compared to Wenger's all encompassing mandate. The management role is split between 3 people now. I like the idea we're doing exactly the opposite of what Wenger preferred. Depending on how limited the new role is it may have deterred the likes of Allegri who might want a bigger say. Guesswork, but that's the way it looks from the little we know.

[Marc Overmars]

Alledgedly Colin Lewin was given the boot at the behest of Arteta, who blames him for his injury troubled final years with us. :haha:

[Niall_Quinn]

Alledgedly Gary Lewin was given the boot at the behest of Arteta, who blames him for his injury troubled final years with us. :haha:

We must have a serious leaker at the club. Or else the media is pulling shit out of their holes and spreading it across paper. I wonder which it is?

[Özim]

I don’t think you know what “journeyman” means.

I know what it is, but I thought it was fitting to be honest, I know he didnt move to lots of clubs but my point was more that he was kinda average, didn't stand out in any particular way a middle of the road player.

[Özim]

How does Henry have the advantage when he’s the sort of player that can produce a solo effort to change the game? What if he doesn’t have players with that sort of mentality, physical or technical ability? What’s his reference point when a player feels he can’t live up to the legendary Thierry Henry? I don’t think it’s that easy to translate how he’d react and he’d see as player to the players he’s coaching. He’s said it himself. Look it up. Respect goes out of the window quickly if you can’t find the tactical solution. Then trying to deal with players as individuals to thinking as a collective and getting them to gel and be cohesive is another level.

Besides being Captain, Arteta has shadowed a great coach and has been with Pep at City from the start. He’s seen the highs and lows and at least has a reference point on how to tackle certain problems. That doesn’t mean he’ll be able to apply what he has learnt successfully but it’s a lot more than someone trying to live off past experiences.

He has the advantage because he's respected, players will look up to him, they won't with Arteta, in football terms he was a relative nobody. There's no way of telling if it would work or not, I just think having respect from those you manage and having people looking up to you and listening to you help.

Like I said Guardiola won at Barca, Bayern and now City, Arteta wasn't with him before City so he clearly doesn't need a specific number 2, Artetas' impact is overstated, as it the impact of any number 2 IMO, it''s the manager that makes things happen. As a side issue, since I don't like the way Guardiola does stuff and think he's somewhat overrated seeing as he's always managed the biggest clubs who already were successful or clubs with money, he does a good job in those situations, would be more interested to see how he would do at a club who haven't had success recently.

[Niall_Quinn]

Valid enough point regarding Pep. If Ivan and the gang are hoping Arteta comes here and applies what he learned in gypoland then they might need to get the chequebook out and buy extra ink. Pep has never managed a club like ours before. A club that doesn't have every financial advantage in the book. So if Arteta is coming in, hopefully Pep taught him a bit more than just how to buy his way out of every problem.

Whatever happens, what joy that various possibilities exist. Rather than the horror of the absolute certainty that accompanied every Wenger inspired season.

[Power n Glory]

He has the advantage because he's respected, players will look up to him, they won't with Arteta, in football terms he was a relative nobody. There's no way of telling if it would work or not, I just think having respect from those you manage and having people looking up to you and listening to you help.

Like I said Guardiola won at Barca, Bayern and now City, Arteta wasn't with him before City so he clearly doesn't need a specific number 2, Artetas' impact is overstated, as it the impact of any number 2 IMO, it''s the manager that makes things happen. As a side issue, since I don't like the way Guardiola does stuff and think he's somewhat overrated seeing as he's always managed the biggest clubs who already were successful or clubs with money, he does a good job in those situations, would be more interested to see how he would do at a club who haven't had success recently.

A reputation from afar only last so long. You know the saying about when people finally meet their idols. If Henry has no idea how to overcome certain tactics or how to get the best out of his squad, respect goes out the window.

It doesn't work like how you say. You still have to prove yourself because you will be tested. If what you were saying were true about great players, Maradona should have been up there as one of the best managers in football. I'm sure on first arrival he was worshipped with many young Argentine players eager to impress, wide eyed, devoted to listen to what he says. Six months later, I wouldn’t be surpised if the disrespect kicked in from those same optimistic players, now thinking, 'this coke head has no idea what he's doing'.

If Henry were to be considered for the role, I'd hope we'd be going off a lot more than his rep as player.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Who knows, Henry played in a counter attacking team, so there's just as much chance he'd play that style instead.

I'm thinking with him being an assistant to Roberto Martinez also.

[LDG]

It seems to me we don't have a manager's position any more. We're looking for a coach. A fractional role compared to Wenger's all encompassing mandate. The management role is split between 3 people now. I like the idea we're doing exactly the opposite of what Wenger preferred. Depending on how limited the new role is it may have deterred the likes of Allegri who might want a bigger say. Guesswork, but that's the way it looks from the little we know.

Yep, I think the same.

Which is why I have no real problem with ‘Tets.

If he doesn’t come up to scratch, the structure behind him is still in place. They’re after a coach/tactician/mentor

Also, are we really going to take a punt? Really? There is BIG money at stake for these cunts that run our club. If their choice hasn’t been been put through the equivilant of a CBR check, then they don’t give a fuck about their cash one bit.

[Marc Overmars]

Unless there’s a huge u-turn in the coming days, it does seem like Micky Tets is as good as done.

[Niall_Quinn]

The baldie is not for turning.

[Mac76]

Guys it's this simple: Arteta has NEVER been the manager of ANY football club EVER

That means it's a big fat NO

I can't believe some people on here were casting doubt on Tuchel etc because somehow they hadn't done things well enough or proved this or that when they did win things

And we are on the verge of having a person who has NEVER managed any football club EVER

Can't you see there's a problem here?

[Niall_Quinn]

Guys it's this simple: Arteta has NEVER been the manager of ANY football club EVER

That means it's a big fat NO

I can't believe some people on here were casting doubt on Tuchel etc because somehow they hadn't done things well enough or proved this or that when they did win things

And we are on the verge of having a person who has NEVER managed any football club EVER

Can't you see there's a problem here?

Wenger's role has been eliminated. Arsenal FC doesn't have a manager any more. We are seeking a coach. And Arteta has plenty of experience in that role as number 2 to Guardiola. I don't see a problem at all. The problem, Wenger, has gone. If Arteta is shit he'll be gone too, but it won't take a decade to chop him. The whole club is in transition now. We have zero idea how it's all going to pan out and have to trust the people in charge. Really, that's what's simple about this. If they fuck it up, then we legitimately jump all over them. But they haven't even appointed the new guy yet and, as far as I'm aware, they aren't talking. So everything in the media is well salted.

I wouldn't have picked Arteta, personally. But then again, I hardly know anything about him. I'm just chuffed to bits that Wenger has gone and in return for that I can put up with a lot for the time being. Provided we play watchable football. If we don't do that then I don't care who's in charge, I'll want them gone.

[The Emirates Gallactico]

DarrenArsenal confirms on twitter it's Arteta.

It's done.

Regardless of what we feel let's all fucking get behind him and give him a chance. There's a good chance this could be a masterstroke and he's the next hot young thing in management and we've got him locked down.

[selassie]

Arteta seems dead cert. I’m not going to sit here and pretend I’m happy, but all I / we can do is support him and hope this top class management potential that is talked of him is realised.

[Power n Glory]

Good article.

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/15118/11376659/mikel-arteta-to-arsenal-why-it-might-be-a-gamble-worth-taking


Mikel Arteta to Arsenal: Why it might be a gamble worth taking
Last Updated: 18/05/18 1:07pm

Mikel Arteta is the leading candidate to succeed Arsene Wenger at Arsenal despite having no managerial experience. His appointment would represent a gamble, but a look into his past reveals he has always been destined for the dugout, writes Nick Wright.

Alan Stubbs was nearing the end of his first spell at Everton when Mikel Arteta arrived on loan from Real Sociedad. The 22-year-old had been brought in to add flair to David Moyes' grizzled squad, but despite being a young player new to English football, it soon became clear that he was also happy to stand up in the dressing room and speak his mind.

"Mikel always had an opinion about how the team was playing," Stubbs tells Sky Sports. "He wouldn't hesitate to come forward and say something to the group. He would talk about what the team wasn't doing or what the team needed to do better, whether that was keeping the ball or creating more in the final third.

"Some people would agree and some would disagree, but it was all constructive discussion, and even though he wasn't one of the oldest in the squad, he was never afraid to have his say. Mikel had a vision and an idea of what the team needed to do to win games or get back into games."

It was obvious to Stubbs - just as it had been to Pep Guardiola and Mauricio Pochettino, Arteta's team-mates at his previous clubs Barcelona and Paris Saint-Germain - that the young Spanish midfielder was an intelligent individual with an advanced understanding of the game.

"He was very professional and focused," adds Stubbs. "It was clear that he had a good football brain. He was the type of player who wanted to get on the ball and dictate the way Everton played at the time. Looking back, I think that probably stood him in good stead for what he wanted to do next."

Mikel Arteta has spent two years as an assistant coach at Man City
Mikel Arteta has spent two years as an assistant coach at Man City
What came next was still a long way off at that point, but 13 years on, it appears to be drawing closer by the day. Two years after ending his playing career at Arsenal to take up a coaching position under his old mentor Guardiola at Manchester City, Arteta is in talks with Arsenal about a return to north London as Arsene Wenger's successor.

It is a divisive prospect among Arsenal supporters, many of whom believe the club's hierarchy should be targeting a manager in the Massimiliano Allegri or Luis Enrique bracket, and who can blame them? Allegri and Luis Enrique have years of elite managerial experience behind them. Arteta, by contrast, has none whatsoever.

But like Stubbs, who watched him mature at Everton, Guardiola, who took him to City, and Pochettino, who wanted him at Tottenham, Arsenal have seen something in him. Arteta captained the side during his time there, with his team-mates even said to have nicknamed him 'coach' as he turned his attention to the prospect of management more seriously.

"My team-mates are always going, 'What are you going to do Miki? You're going to be a manager, you should be a manager!'" he said in a revealing interview with the Arsenal Magazine in 2014.

"I know what the job means and I know how hard it is, especially when I look at the boss and see how many hours he puts in here. You need to sacrifice your family all over again, which I've done since I was 15. But I would love to manage a squad of players and staff - I've got it inside me, it's true, and I want to do it."

Arteta, still only 32 at the time, had even mapped out his approach. "My philosophy will be clear," he added. "I will have everyone 120 per cent committed, that's the first thing. If not, you don't play for me. When it's time to work it's time to work, and when it's time to have fun then I'm the first one to do it, but that commitment is vital.

"Then I want the football to be expressive, entertaining. I cannot have a concept of football where everything is based on the opposition. We have to dictate the game, we have to be the ones taking the initiative, and we have to entertain the people coming to watch us. I'm 100 per cent convinced of those things, and I think I could do it."

Those comments tally with the need for continuity mentioned by chief executive Ivan Gazidis when discussing Arsenal's next appointment last month, and it is little wonder that Wenger has already vouched for him. Arteta "has the qualities" for the job, the Frenchman said this week. "He was a leader, he has a good passion for the game and he knows what is important to the club."

Arteta grew up playing the Barcelona way and had the opportunity to follow those principles as a player at Arsenal and a coach at Guardiola's City, but crucially, he is also adaptable. Arteta's playing career had taken in four different countries by the time he was 22. As part of that, he experienced totally different playing styles at Everton and Rangers.

It is perhaps why, back in 2014, he emphasised the importance of flexibility. "I think you need to adapt," he said. "You can have an idea of a system, but you need to be able to transform it depending on the players you have - how much pace you have up front, how technical your team is, what types of risk you can take and whether your players are ready to take those risks.

"It's important to analyse your players because you can't always play the same way. There have to be different details and changes in how you approach things, and you have to look at how you can hurt whoever you are playing against. Is there something they don't like to do? If so, we're going to make them do plenty of it."

Those comments offer encouragement to the Arsenal supporters who tired of Wenger's apparent reluctance to entertain the idea of adapting his tactics, and Arteta now has the practical experience of implementing those methods under the most progressive manager there is.

Arteta is said to have relished working with Guardiola and the feeling is certainly mutual. The former Barcelona manager has described Arteta's contribution to their record-breaking Premier League success as "outstanding". "If he stays, I will be the happiest guy in the world," he said after City's 1-0 win over Southampton on the final day of the season.


Pep Guardiola details the impact Mikel Arteta has had at Manchester City
He went into more detail during his appearance on Monday Night Football this week, praising Arteta's one-on-one coaching abilities and crediting him for Raheem Sterling and Leroy Sane's improvement.

"Mikel Arteta helped both of them," he said. "They work together after training sessions, doing some drills close to the box to practice the situations which happen in the game to make them comfortable, to make them believe more in what they are going to do. Because in the end, when they have the quality to dribble, they have to use it."

That level of coaching will be vital at Arsenal, where the failure to secure Champions League football for a second consecutive season is likely to impact transfer spending. It is part of the reason why Allegri and Luis Enrique appear to have slipped out of contention, and it might also be why Gazidis says Arsenal must be "brave" and "open-minded" with their next appointment.

It all points to Arteta. He may not have managerial experience behind him, but from holding court in the Everton dressing room to the hours spent with Guardiola on the training pitches at Manchester City, this is what he has been working towards. It is a gamble, but it might just be a gamble worth taking.

It's stuff like this that has convinced me this could possibly work. I was totally against this a few weeks ago. New information changes things.

[Niall_Quinn]

Arteta's playing career had taken in four different countries by the time he was 22.

A very good thing.

[Niall_Quinn]

Good article.

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/15118/11376659/mikel-arteta-to-arsenal-why-it-might-be-a-gamble-worth-taking



It's stuff like this that has convinced me this could possibly work. I was totally against this a few weeks ago. New information changes things.

And if it doesn't work we end up where Wenger would have taken us anyway. But there's zero impediment to making a change. Everyone is so used to Wenger. But it's all different now, Wenger's legacy and Wenger's influence has gone and now there's nothing for a new manager to do except perform or he's easily replaced.

I think the manager/ coach position is actually less important than the ambition of the board. If scraping top 4 is our key aim then the manager is fucked before he starts anyway because too many of the fans have had enough of that. But if we're looking to compete and we show that on the pitch then whatever manager coming in will soon have plenty of support from the fans. We put up with Wenger for years before people started making noise. I'm sure we can give the new guy a year. Not too much to ask.

[Power n Glory]

And if it doesn't work we end up where Wenger would have taken us anyway. But there's zero impediment to making a change. Everyone is so used to Wenger. But it's all different now, Wenger's legacy and Wenger's influence has gone and now there's nothing for a new manager to do except perform or he's easily replaced.

I think the manager/ coach position is actually less important than the ambition of the board. If scraping top 4 is our key aim then the manager is fucked before he starts anyway because too many of the fans have had enough of that. But if we're looking to compete and we show that on the pitch then whatever manager coming in will soon have plenty of support from the fans. We put up with Wenger for years before people started making noise. I'm sure we can give the new guy a year. Not too much to ask.

We've been left in bad shape by Wenger. It looks like we're unable to attract a top manager and that could be down to the lack of CL football. We've never been a club that could blow £200m on transfers each year but even if we had the money I don't think it's as easy as it used to be to just buy a whole new team. FFP, homegrown player quotas and that ruling on wages has made things more difficult. We're in a terrible position. If not for the appointment of Raul, Sven and the other backroom changes, I'd have zero faith in Arteta at all.

Partly why I've wanted someone with more experience at a top club is so they can help restructure the club and bring their ideas on what internal areas need fixing. But it looks like Gazidis has already started the process and we're in a much better position than before. We're no long in a position where one man has the monopoly on footballing knowledge. We have more people that will put football first and that's encouraging. If not for Ivan, Sven and Raul, I'm certain we'd have been looking at a situation where we'd have lost Sanchez and Ozil on free transfers with no other major signings in sight. We'd have been in a much worse situation.

[KSE Comedy Club]

We've been left in bad shape by Wenger. It looks like we're unable to attract a top manager and that could be down to the lack of CL football. We've never been a club that could blow £200m on transfers each year but even if we had the money I don't think it's as easy as it used to be to just buy a whole new team. FFP, homegrown player quotas and that ruling on wages has made things more difficult. We're in a terrible position. If not for the appointment of Raul, Sven and the other backroom changes, I'd have zero faith in Arteta at all.

Partly why I've wanted someone with more experience at a top club is so they can help restructure the club and bring their ideas on what internal areas need fixing. But it looks like Gazidis has already started the process and we're in a much better position than before. We're no long in a position where one man has the monopoly on footballing knowledge. We have more people that will put football first and that's encouraging. If not for Ivan, Sven and Raul, I'm certain we'd have been looking at a situation where we'd have lost Sanchez and Ozil on free transfers with no other major signings in sight. We'd have been in a much worse situation.

That’s just wrong. We are not ‘unable to attract a top manager’ at all.

We had top managers interested & interviewed, but according to reports, we weren’t willing to meet certain monetary demands.

Looking at the last 12 years, this is more likely than not :coffee:

[Letters]

Wenger hasn't left us in bad shape at all and we're perfectly capable of attracting a top manager if we do the right things.
Liverpool and Utd weren't in the CL when they attracted Klopp and Mourinho.

[Power n Glory]

Wenger hasn't left us in bad shape at all and we're perfectly capable of attracting a top manager if we do the right things.
Liverpool and Utd weren't in the CL when they attracted Klopp and Mourinho.

What are the right things we have to do?

[Niall_Quinn]

Wenger has left us in terrible shape, relatively speaking. Sliding down the league, out of contention for the major honours, with a squad half committed and playing dire boreball. Only a final day capitulation by Burnley grabbed away points since Dec 2017. It's hellish - relatively speaking. The two new guys have started to unwind some of the damage, but there's so much still to do. Wenger was completely past it by the time he was booted. Everything he touched turned to shit, like an excremental version of Midas. One more year of it would have seen us is serious peril.

[Goonermerree]

I wish they'd appoint somebody then we can focus our moaning with more accuracy

[Power n Glory]

Wenger hasn't left us in bad shape at all and we're perfectly capable of attracting a top manager if we do the right things.
Liverpool and Utd weren't in the CL when they attracted Klopp and Mourinho.

You really are funny. For years you've warned us against changing manager because we could end up 'doing a Utd'. :lol:

We end up finishing outside the CL spot for a second season in row under Wenger and with less points than Moyes Utd team but you now say Wenger hasn't left us in bad shape! If all this were to happen under a new manager you'd be singing from a different hymn book.

[Goonermerree]

You really are funny. For years you've warned us against changing manager because we could end up 'doing a Utd'. :lol:

We end up finishing outside the CL spot for a second season in row under Wenger and with less points than Moyes Utd eam but you now say Wenger hasn't left us in bad shape! If all this were to happen under a new manager you'd be singing from a different hymn book.

Argh, I hadn't realised that, but then again, we only got 3 points away from home this year and not loads fokr the whole of the season.

[Xhaka Can’t]

I don’t think Letters would to be fair. The thing is, the two things aren’t comparable to start off with. A Manager that was bringing us to the situation we are in now, or even one that maintains us in this crap position would likely be fired more readily.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Wenger has left us in terrible shape, relatively speaking. Sliding down the league, out of contention for the major honours, with a squad half committed and playing dire boreball. Only a final day capitulation by Burnley grabbed away points since Dec 2017. It's hellish - relatively speaking. The two new guys have started to unwind some of the damage, but there's so much still to do. Wenger was completely past it by the time he was booted. Everything he touched turned to shit, like an excremental version of Midas. One more year of it would have seen us is serious peril.

Everything he touched turned to mould.

It'd odd really, even if Wenger has left us in a bad shape - at least for the new guy's perspective, is it a bad thing?

[Niall_Quinn]

Everything he touched turned to mould.

It'd odd really, even if Wenger has left us in a bad shape - at least for the new guy's perspective, is it a bad thing?

In some ways, yes. Because we still have this reputation for playing good football even though the shite we play is close on unwatchable. The new guy isn't going to get fantasy assessments from the media, pundits and half the fans. We'll actually have to play decent football now. Which means the poor sod has to deprogram the whole squad and start with the basics. It's probably a long road back. Intensive care.

And his record won't always be prefixed with, 'When he first arrived...', or, 'Built the stadium with his bare hands...'

This guy is going to have to perform. No excuses.

[I am invisible]

Good article explaining the £50m "war chest" that the new manager / coach will have to work with...

https://shewore.com/2018/05/19/arsenals-50m-budget-explained/

Short version: £50m is the amount that we can afford to increase the cost of running the business by and still break even - it doesn't refer to how much is available for transfer fees, which could be anything depending existing cash reserves, outgoing sales, how payments are structured, etc...

[Mac76]

Wenger's role has been eliminated. Arsenal FC doesn't have a manager any more. We are seeking a coach. And Arteta has plenty of experience in that role as number 2 to Guardiola. I don't see a problem at all. The problem, Wenger, has gone. If Arteta is shit he'll be gone too, but it won't take a decade to chop him. The whole club is in transition now. We have zero idea how it's all going to pan out and have to trust the people in charge. Really, that's what's simple about this. If they fuck it up, then we legitimately jump all over them. But they haven't even appointed the new guy yet and, as far as I'm aware, they aren't talking. So everything in the media is well salted.

I wouldn't have picked Arteta, personally. But then again, I hardly know anything about him. I'm just chuffed to bits that Wenger has gone and in return for that I can put up with a lot for the time being. Provided we play watchable football. If we don't do that then I don't care who's in charge, I'll want them gone.

all this brave new world stuff is all well and good but does it fit with getting and keeping good players and getting the best out of them? that 'coach' still has to do some very important things - get teams and tactics right, inspire the players, be tough with the players, get and keep respect, have the experience to know what it is to win things as a manager.

If they get someone more experienced and Arteta is assistant with a clear path to taking the big job, that's ok, but parachuting him straight in just seems a big risk with a club that needs to ge back on track fast

[Power n Glory]

I don’t think Letters would to be fair. The thing is, the two things aren’t comparable to start off with. A Manager that was bringing us to the situation we are in now, or even one that maintains us in this crap position would likely be fired more readily.

True. Letters would probably find a positive spin. But I'm not sure what you mean by not comparable. The decline and transition most feared has happened under Wenger and we're in a tough spot. Whether or not the new guy would get fired doesn't matter. We've already done a 'Utd' with Wenger. It could have been a lot worse if the Board had listened to Wenger and not appointed a Director of Football and Head of Recruitment.

In fact, Wenger was about to allow Ozil and Sanchez leave on a free and we wouldn't have Aubameyang or Mkhitaryan in the squad. It could have looked a lot worse. I have no idea what he was thinking. We could have had a massive job on our hands rebuilding the squad and having to make massive changes to the backroom staff. I'm optimistic about the season ahead but we still have a challenge ahead of us.

[selassie]

Wenger hasn't left us in bad shape at all and we're perfectly capable of attracting a top manager if we do the right things.
Liverpool and Utd weren't in the CL when they attracted Klopp and Mourinho.

He has. He has left us without a keeper, central defence or central midfield. We have imbalances all over the squad and most of our best players are in their late 20’s.

Make no mistake, there is a lot of work to do to put things right.

[Chippy]

He has. He has left us without a keeper, central defence or central midfield. We have imbalances all over the squad and most of our best players are in their late 20’s.

Make no mistake, there is a lot of work to do to put things right.

Yeah! Wenger out! :rolleyes:

[Niall_Quinn]

Yeah! Wenger out! :rolleyes:

And stay out!

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Wenger hasn't left us in bad shape at all and we're perfectly capable of attracting a top manager if we do the right things.
Liverpool and Utd weren't in the CL when they attracted Klopp and Mourinho.

I can't believe the day I've dreaded for so long has finally come- I am forced to give Letters a :gp:

No matter how you lot might want to paint it, if Arteta is chosen as our next manager, we have "settled" and the only thing I can think of more uninspiring than deciding to give this nobody ( which is what he is) our club is if we had stuck with AW for another year.

The myth that no top manager will take us on because we are out of the CL or we don't have an immediate £200 million warchest to pledge, is nothing but a myth and has no logical or footballing evidence to support and if you ask me is little worth debating.

But if we do have to, just like people have rightly pointed out, the Mourinho and Klopp examples end this line of thought pretty fast.

The facts remain, Arsenal is still one of the top clubs, in one of the top football cities, in the top football league in the world. If we could all get over our self-pity we would recognise that for any football manager this remains one of the top 10 club football jobs available, if not top 10 world football jobs in entirety!

Just try naming the opportunities available to football managers, it can't get much better than being handed an Arsenal, especially an Arsenal in this state where all expectations have been considerably lowered due to our recent "exploits".

I have nothing against Arteta, but to any sane football fan or expert, we are taking a huge risk and "settling" way below us- most people will struggle to see this in any other way.

But obviously their is precedence that these kind of risks can work (e.g. AW) but I personally don't believe in stretching your luck.

Anyway, I'm still hopeful that the right thing will be done and just like NQ, I'm still in a celebratory mood over the dinosaur's extinction.

[Niall_Quinn]

Definitive and unarguable proof Arteta is the right man for the job.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFZkC2SZLWg

[Niall_Quinn]

Sunday Supplement crew are pretty much doing "Arteta WHO?"

They are crying about Brendan Rodgers not getting the job.

Good news. Good news.

Although, to be fair, they also said we should have gone for Simeone. I don't think he was ever in the running, but he should have been.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

Definitive and unarguable proof Arteta is the right man for the job.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFZkC2SZLWg

Would you want Arteta if this actually happened?

[Niall_Quinn]

Would you want Arteta if this actually happened?

For the first couple of years anyway. Then I'd probably start an Arteta Out clique.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

No doubt....but you would accept the output of 1 league + 1 Europa league title in seven years and want him here?

[Niall_Quinn]

No doubt....but you would accept the output of 1 league + 1 Europa league title in seven years and want him here?

I don't demand any titles or cups. What I want to see most is entertaining, attacking, competitive football. I want us to be in every hunt until the end and if we win it, great, but if we don't then we accept somebody was even better than us and we try again next year. It's the competitiveness that counts for me. We lost that under Wenger. Every fan knew, even the most optimistic, we'd crumble when the big challenges came. I want to go into those challenges at least believing we have a realistic chance.

There's a big difference between planning for 4th and planning for 1st but having to settle for 4th. The former is like losing, straight out of the gate. That's what annoyed me most about Wenger. He was proud of his systematic mediocrity. Football is supposed to be a rollercoaster, not a Swiss railway timetable.

Not sure I ever want to see the same manager here for 7 years though. Football has changed. Fresh ideas are important. Money alone is not enough to keep an edge because everyone has money now. The relegated clubs shared a third of a billion between them, for total failure. So the same guy, with the same ideas, for 7 years. Not sure how viable that is any more.

And who knows who the best guy for the job is? Plenty of well experienced managers have fallen flat on their faces in this league. We missed out on Klopp and Pep because Wenger was too selfish to move over and the board was too weak to push him. If the gossip holds any truth, we couldn't get the Hoffenheim coach, we couldn't afford the demands of some of the experienced candidates so we're taking a punt on Arteta. I have a gut feeling it might work out. Can't say why for sure, it's just a feeling. But even if it does (and especially if it doesn't), of all clubs I hope we've learned the lesson that decisive action is required if we start going backwards instead of forwards - in terms of the competitiveness of the club as well as the style of the football.

[Letters]

What are the right things we have to do?

Pay them a market rate salary, indicate some ambition which these days translates into making a load of money available for transfers.

[Letters]

We end up finishing outside the CL spot for a second season in row under Wenger and with less points than Moyes Utd team
That is a disingenuous comparison. Moyes took over a Utd side who had just won the title with 89 points.
Yes, they finished with one more point the following season with 64 points and finished 7th but that's a drop of 25 points in one season.


but you now say Wenger hasn't left us in bad shape!

He hasn't, any more than Moyes left Utd "in a bad state". He did a bad job but that's not the same thing. Wenger did a bad job last season but we've got a squad I believe is capable of much better, we've got the global fan base, the history, the stadium and the money to attract top managers and top players. There is work to do but we're capable of doing it and have the resources to if we hire the right manager.

[rodders]

Until Kroenke goes things can only get worse

[selassie]

Yeah! Wenger out! :rolleyes:

Anything constructive to add?

Thought not...off you trot son, don’t trip on your tail on your way out. :)

[selassie]

I don't demand any titles or cups. What I want to see most is entertaining, attacking, competitive football. I want us to be in every hunt until the end and if we win it, great, but if we don't then we accept somebody was even better than us and we try again next year. It's the competitiveness that counts for me. We lost that under Wenger. Every fan knew, even the most optimistic, we'd crumble when the big challenges came. I want to go into those challenges at least believing we have a realistic chance.

There's a big difference between planning for 4th and planning for 1st but having to settle for 4th. The former is like losing, straight out of the gate. That's what annoyed me most about Wenger. He was proud of his systematic mediocrity. Football is supposed to be a rollercoaster, not a Swiss railway timetable.

Not sure I ever want to see the same manager here for 7 years though. Football has changed. Fresh ideas are important. Money alone is not enough to keep an edge because everyone has money now. The relegated clubs shared a third of a billion between them, for total failure. So the same guy, with the same ideas, for 7 years. Not sure how viable that is any more.

And who knows who the best guy for the job is? Plenty of well experienced managers have fallen flat on their faces in this league. We missed out on Klopp and Pep because Wenger was too selfish to move over and the board was too weak to push him. If the gossip holds any truth, we couldn't get the Hoffenheim coach, we couldn't afford the demands of some of the experienced candidates so we're taking a punt on Arteta. I have a gut feeling it might work out. Can't say why for sure, it's just a feeling. But even if it does (and especially if it doesn't), of all clubs I hope we've learned the lesson that decisive action is required if we start going backwards instead of forwards - in terms of the competitiveness of the club as well as the style of the football.

:gp:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Pay them a market rate salary, indicate some ambition which these days translates into making a load of money available for transfers.

I have to agree with you Letters :sick:

We should be showing ambition and blowing the dust and cobwebs off the company credit card!

[Power n Glory]

That is a disingenuous comparison. Moyes took over a Utd side who had just won the title with 89 points.
Yes, they finished with one more point the following season with 64 points and finished 7th but that's a drop of 25 points in one season.



He hasn't, any more than Moyes left Utd "in a bad state". He did a bad job but that's not the same thing. Wenger did a bad job last season but we've got a squad I believe is capable of much better, we've got the global fan base, the history, the stadium and the money to attract top managers and top players. There is work to do but we're capable of doing it and have the resources to if we hire the right manager.

The repositioning of your argument is what's disingenuous. So doing a 'Utd/Moyes' was more about the huge drop off in points? So our equivalent would mean a manger that has us deep in a relegation battle? That's what a 25 point drop off mean for us.

The discrepancy in points was never part of your argument. It was always about finishing outside of the CL spot and struggling to get back in. That's the position we find ourseleves in today.

As far as the infrastructure and resources, that's a different argument. We're looking good in those areas but I wouldn’t attribute that to Wenger either.

[Letters]

You seem to be trying to argue with me about two different things at once which is very confusing. Let's focus on where we are now and what state Wenger has left us in.


It was always about finishing outside of the CL spot and struggling to get back in. That's the position we find ourseleves in today.

Season before the one just gone we finished outside the top 4 for the first time in Wenger's reign, we we a couple of points away - actually had we got that point total this year we would have been in the top 4.
This is the only year we've been nowhere near the top 4, mostly because of our mysteriously bad away form. I believe the squad, while needing some work, is capable of much better so I wouldn't say that aspect of the club is in too bad shape.


As far as the infrastructure and resources, that's a different argument. We're looking good in those areas but I wouldn’t attribute that to Wenger either.

I don't think it is a different argument, it's part of the same discussion. The infrastructure and resources are absolutely part of the what shape a club is in.
Who do you attribute it to if not Wenger? Not saying he is solely responsible but the success he brought in the early years is a big factor.

[Power n Glory]

You seem to be trying to argue with me about two different things at once which is very confusing. Let's focus on where we are now and what state Wenger has left us in.



Season before the one just gone we finished outside the top 4 for the first time in Wenger's reign, we we a couple of points away - actually had we got that point total this year we would have been in the top 4.
This is the only year we've been nowhere near the top 4, mostly because of our mysteriously bad away form. I believe the squad, while needing some work, is capable of much better so I wouldn't say that aspect of the club is in too bad shape.



I don't think it is a different argument, it's part of the same discussion. The infrastructure and resources are absolutely part of the what shape a club is in.
Who do you attribute it to if not Wenger? Not saying he is solely responsible but the success he brought in the early years is a big factor.

The medical staff appointments, Sven, Raul and the recent firing of the old backroom hangers on has nothing to do with Wenger. If we had kept to Wenger’s vision where we didn’t have a Director of Football and more staff taking on key roles, we’d have been in a much worse state. Wenger has played his part in helping to save money but he’s also been responsible for blowing money. Besides the waste in the transfer window, we missed out on getting £50m-£60m for Sanchez. The wage bill is bloated. We have an ageing squad. Aubameyang, Ozil and Mkhitaryan are 28/29. As seen with Kos, Merts and Santi, their fitness and performances may fall off a cliff once they’ve hit 30. Besides Lacazette, the players in their mid 20s are of questionable quality. Ramsey, Welbeck, Wilshere, Xhaka, Mustafi, Kolasinac, Elneny. None of them are consistent performers and most of them don’t the skillset to be become world class and carry the team. The defence is terrible and the better players are well past their prime.

We’re on shaky territory. Some parts are really good and should appeal to any manager but other areas are bad and it may limit us on who we can attract for the role. I don’t think we can roll out the red carpet for just anyone with experience. Some of the candidates available aren’t that great and represent as much as a risk as someone with little experience, like Arteta.

[GP]

https://twitter.com/GuillemBalague/status/998487270041837568

[The Emirates Gallactico]

Would prefer Unai Emery over Arteta if anything just for the fact he has some decent managerial experience.

[Marc Overmars]

Yep would definitely rather give Emery a go.

[selassie]

The medical staff appointments, Sven, Raul and the recent firing of the old backroom hangers on has nothing to do with Wenger. If we had kept to Wenger’s vision where we didn’t have a Director of Football and more staff taking on key roles, we’d have been in a much worse state. Wenger has played his part in helping to save money but he’s also been responsible for blowing money. Besides the waste in the transfer window, we missed out on getting £50m-£60m for Sanchez. The wage bill is bloated. We have an ageing squad. Aubameyang, Ozil and Mkhitaryan are 28/29. As seen with Kos, Merts and Santi, their fitness and performances may fall off a cliff once they’ve hit 30. Besides Lacazette, the players in their mid 20s are of questionable quality. Ramsey, Welbeck, Wilshere, Xhaka, Mustafi, Kolasinac, Elneny. None of them are consistent performers and most of them don’t the skillset to be become world class and carry the team. The defence is terrible and the better players are well past their prime.

We’re on shaky territory. Some parts are really good and should appeal to any manager but other areas are bad and it may limit us on who we can attract for the role. I don’t think we can roll out the red carpet for just anyone with experience. Some of the candidates available aren’t that great and represent as much as a risk as someone with little experience, like Arteta.

Yep, that's how I see it too PnG.

:gp:

[selassie]

Yep would definitely rather give Emery a go.

Me too.

[Power n Glory]

Emery seems solid! I bet he's in London to see Chelsea!

[Niall_Quinn]

If Emery was onboard with the Neymar bullshit and couldn't see what that ultra fraud was doing then that's a big tick in the avoid column. I don't think he did that great a job at PSG, at least nothing beyond the minimum expectations and we've had enough of that already. He seemed more effective at Sevilla, a smaller club. He was never on my own list because he's already had his big move, an endless budget and IMO he hit his ceiling.

I still don't know why certain individuals were never really considered. Conte. Jardim. Simeone. Maybe Simeone is out of reach but the other two are surely getable?

[Xhaka Can’t]

I’m ok with taking a chance on Arteta. But my number one preference by a country mile is Conte.

He’s done it in the PL, has incredible tactical nous and is just the guy to give our weak little flowers the kick up the ass they clearly need.

He’s a winner and he’s won it in our league and he started his march to the title after he faced a 45 minute spanking against us.

Thankfully the Chelsea hierarchy did everything they could to fuck him up this season.

And he still walked away with the FA Cup.

He is a must get.

We won’t get him.

[Power n Glory]

Second thoughts on Emery. I hear he's a bottle job. Looking closer into his record, that does seem to be the case. Just seen an article about him not winning a single away game with Sevilla.

NQ might be right about this one. I

[GP]

Just seen an article about him not winning a single away game with Sevilla.



Is that true? In 3 years?

[KSE Comedy Club]

Emery is not for me I'm afraid.

Nor Conte, He won the PL in his first season but he hasn't done anything of note over the course of a season except win the FA cup.

Even Wenger managed that.

[Marc Overmars]

Emery is not for me I'm afraid.

Nor Conte, He won the PL in his first season but he hasn't done anything of note over the course of a season except win the FA cup.

Even Wenger managed that.

He won the league here 12 months ago and that means he's more qualified than most of the candidates regardless of what happened this season.

I'd hire Conte in a heartbeat.

[AFC Leveller]

Hes a good tactician and his teams play good attacking football at pace, he won 3 Europa league titles and made Seville a force again. His record in the CL wasnt too good but then again he came up against Barca and Real Madrid...

Id rather him than Arteta TBH, he at least has managerial experience and a really good CV.

Arteta is asking for more control over transfers apparently and doesnt want to be Gazidis' puppet, which is good.

[Bumble]

not keen on conte - he seems a bit of a ******* and the way he got rid of there 2nd best player was poor despite costa being costa. plus he is complaining Chelsea don't invest enough.... not sure arsenal are going to invest anymore money.

with Arteta - if things go wrong who will be the fall guy. probably the manager despite by the looks of it having no control of signings.

arsenal have the chance to get the fan base really excited about whats happening next but instead of people are relieved its not Wenger that's in charge.

[Power n Glory]

Is that true? In 3 years?

2015-16 season not a single away win. 9 draws and 10 losses.

[KSE Comedy Club]

I dont want either.

We let the best two managers slip through our fingers in Allegri and Enrique.

[Özim]

Emeri works for me, he's experienced and PSG played some great stuff under him (they played us off the park and should have beaten us convincingly). Just as long as it isn't Arteta who I just don't want in charge, Ozil is supposedly not keen on him either, the thought of having some nobody with no experience in charge is too much for me.

He's not my 1st choice, but then Simeone, Jardim and Allegri aren't happening (Simeone would have been my first choice) so that doesn't leave too many options, Conte is a no go for me, I agree with the comments about him allowing his best striker to leave being a shocker, effectively he sabotaged his own season as Costa was a key player for Chelsea, spending 70 million on Morata who is awful was also a very poor decision. Just not convinced with Conte, seems to let his emotions overshadow logic and that's cost Chelsea, you need someone more level headed who won't make decisions based on how much he likes a player.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Emeri works for me

Really, doing what?







:getcoat:

[Letters]

Really, doing what?







:getcoat:

:lol:

WUM consultant?

:run:

[Marc Overmars]

I dont want either.

We let the best two managers slip through our fingers in Allegri and Enrique.

The trouble with those guys is that they'd probably need Manchester levels of money and we obviously can't provide that.

We've set our stall out with the structure and "head coach" kind of role so we just have to go with it now. Not everyone will work under that umbrella and that's why we haven't heard of more established names being in the running.

[Globalgunner]

West Ham have just signed Pellegrini...more or less. Everton may pick up Silva...both quality managers. We on the other hand...the guy on a work experience programme who may not yet have all his coaching badges. You just couldnt make it up.....On the bright side...Wenger is gone.

Sing with me..."Always look on the bright side of life"!

[Özim]

West Ham have just signed Pellegrini...more or less. Everton may pick up Silva...both quality managers. We on the other hand...the guy on a work experience programme who may not yet have all his coaching badges. You just couldnt make it up.....On the bright side...Wenger is gone.

Sing with me..."Always look on the bright side of life"!

:haha:
This club makes me laugh, we sit there putting up with Wenger for years and the minute we get rid of him, we then go after a total nobody, who has no reputation as manager and never had any kind of reputation as a player either. I do wonder about the people running this club sometimes.

Arteta is a strange choice for anyone, I could understand it more if he was a former great (wouldn't be my choice obviously), as you hope their reputation motivates players to achieve great things (I know it doesn't always pan out that way), but this guy, really? There's enough supposedly decent assistant managers who have totally flopped to steer you away from someone like him, especially with the level of changes needed and the pressure.

Just because Gazidis finally moved Wenger on (after years of failing to do anything about him and actually supporting him) doesn't mean he's proved himself to me, choosing Arteta would be another poor decision in a long line of them by him.

I know we signed Mikhi and Auba in January, Auba is obviously a very good signing, though his age means he probably has a limited time left at the top, Mikhi hasn't done a lot and is also in his late 20s, hardly the recipe for building a team with longer term success in mind, yes it wasn't a bad January after years of poor transfer windows, but that in itself doesn't prove to me that we've turned the corner.

In addition, if we knew we'd be moving Wenger on, it might have been better to save the money in January for the new manager, particularly if this 50 million budget is true (I hope it isn't), I'm happy we signed Aubameyang of course, but giving a new manager 50 million to rebuild a team that were so poor last season just isn't enough, especially given the prices of players these days.

Don't get me wrong I'm over the moon Wenger has gone, but this was a great opportunity to build, just like Liverpool are, instead we seem to be looking for some sort of pet project to replace Wenger, which IMO is just odd, especially given how angry the fans were.

[Globalgunner]

I dont even think Arteta is the named assistant manager. He is just one of the backroom staff. If appointed, the only other novice with greater responsibility would be Trump.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'd rather have Wenger than Pellegrini tbf.

Arteta works for me. Based purely on a hunch (which is probably as much as our board are going on). If we can't have the experienced first choices on the list, or can't afford them, and we can't have my preferred choices who never made it to the list that leaves Arteta as my number one pick. Like I said, based purely on a hunch. I like the whole ide aof just going with it to see what happens. I figure we have a freebie season anyway, considering the alternative was to let Wenger stay.

[Niall_Quinn]

Wenger has officially left the building. Cleared his desk today and he's driven away for the last time.

It's happened.

Supposedly the club now falls to pieces.

I don't think so though.

[Marc Overmars]

Wenger has officially left the building. Cleared his desk today and he's driven away for the last time.



Who?

[Niall_Quinn]

Fairly undignified scenes of Ty trying to scramble through Wenger's car window. Xhaka is in the boot. Welbeck is up front.

[Globalgunner]

I'd rather have Wenger than Pellegrini tbf.

Arteta works for me. Based purely on a hunch (which is probably as much as our board are going on). If we can't have the experienced first choices on the list, or can't afford them, and we can't have my preferred choices who never made it to the list that leaves Arteta as my number one pick. Like I said, based purely on a hunch. I like the whole ide aof just going with it to see what happens. I figure we have a freebie season anyway, considering the alternative was to let Wenger stay.

Dont know what you have against Pellegrini. He did well with City and they played much better football under him than with Pep. He also is not so skewed in his analysing of things that he thinks Jesus is a better striker than Aguero.
He will have Werst Ham bubbling next season, mark my words. If we appoint Tets, then the hammers will be another team that finishes above us, Everton too. I dont see why we Arsenal fans have to see the absolute nadir before things get better.

[Niall_Quinn]

Dont know what you have against Pellegrini. He did well with City and they played much better football under him than with Pep. He also is not so skewed in his analysing of things that he thinks Jesus is a better striker than Aguero.
He will have Werst Ham bubbling next season, mark my words. If we appoint Tets, then the hammers will be another team that finishes above us, Everton too. I dont see why we Arsenal fans have to see the absolute nadir before things get better.

Good in his first season, won it in fact. But downhill from there. And grey and tired by the end of season 3. He'd be okay, but just okay. We'd need to be looking for a new manager pretty quickly I think. So I prefer the idea of a younger coach on the way up, rather than a guy who has already come down. And he'll be managing West Ham. That, in itself, says a lot.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Dont know what you have against Pellegrini. He did well with City and they played much better football under him than with Pep. He also is not so skewed in his analysing of things that he thinks Jesus is a better striker than Aguero.
He will have Werst Ham bubbling next season, mark my words. If we appoint Tets, then the hammers will be another team that finishes above us, Everton too. I dont see why we Arsenal fans have to see the absolute nadir before things get better.

I will genuinely bet you any amount of money you want to bet that that will not happen.

[rodders]

Seem to be making a right ruddy hames of all this in typical Arsenal fashion

[GP]

Sounds like it's Emery.

[Goonermerree]

emery it is then.

[GP]

He is awful...


But I like him.

:cool:

[Globalgunner]

I can get behind that. Arteta...dodged a bullet with that one

[Master Splinter]

If Arteta was supposedly the "safe, unambitious" choice because of his inexperience, then this is certainly the middle-of-the-road appointment that's neither completely terrible nor terribly exciting.

I'm not going to be obnoxiously negative and judge the guy before he's had a chance to do something, but this all seems like the compromise option that people thought Arteta was. Allegri/Enrique unavailable or too expensive. Arteta/Nagelsman too much of a risk. At least a risk is exciting, but this initially just feels underwhelming.

If we're aiming for Europa League glory, then he fits the bill. A look at his league form would give cause for concern though. Even at PSG with the overwhelming advantage of one of the most expensive teams ever assembled, he lost out to Monaco last season. And they haven't improved in the CL either.

And considering his English is not as fluent as other candidates, why not opt for Jardim who also has problems with the language but a recent track record with vastly improving players?

After all the recent changes at the club, it seemed as if the structure was in place for something genuinely new and potentially innovative. But whether it's because of clashing ideas, budget restrictions or panic, it all appears to have amounted to another opportunistic Arsenal transaction rather than a brave one.

I'd love for people to laugh at me in future for doubting this appointment after he's become another managerial legend, but at the moment it's all a bit beige/vanilla/meh.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

He is awful...


But I like him.

:cool:

:haha:

That's brilliant!

[Marc Overmars]

If Arteta was supposedly the "safe, unambitious" choice because of his inexperience, then this is certainly the middle-of-the-road appointment that's neither completely terrible nor terribly exciting.

I'm not going to be obnoxiously negative and judge the guy before he's had a chance to do something, but this all seems like the compromise option that people thought Arteta was. Allegri/Enrique unavailable or too expensive. Arteta/Nagelsman too much of a risk. At least a risk is exciting, but this initially just feels underwhelming.

If we're aiming for Europa League glory, then he fits the bill. A look at his league form would give cause for concern though. Even at PSG with the overwhelming advantage of one of the most expensive teams ever assembled, he lost out to Monaco last season. And they haven't improved in the CL either.

And considering his English is not as fluent as other candidates, why not opt for Jardim who also has problems with the language but a recent track record with vastly improving players?

After all the recent changes at the club, it seemed as if the structure was in place for something genuinely new and potentially innovative. But whether it's because of clashing ideas, budget restrictions or panic, it all appears to have amounted to another opportunistic Arsenal transaction rather than a brave one.

I'd love for people to laugh at me in future for doubting this appointment after he's become another managerial legend, but at the moment it's all a bit beige/vanilla/meh.

Great post.

It is a bit meh but he's clearly decent coach so all we can do is hope he can get his ideas across and inspire the players.

[Ernesto]

Ah GP beat me to the Emery quotes lol

[Niall_Quinn]

Shame. I had grown used to the idea of a coach rather than a manager. I still think that's the way we should have gone. A complete break from the past. A totally new set up. This seems to tip things back in favour of the managerial role.

Still, he's got to be given a chance. We'll know soon enough.

Might make the transfer window a little more interesting I suppose.

[KSE Comedy Club]

If Arteta was supposedly the "safe, unambitious" choice because of his inexperience, then this is certainly the middle-of-the-road appointment that's neither completely terrible nor terribly exciting.

I'm not going to be obnoxiously negative and judge the guy before he's had a chance to do something, but this all seems like the compromise option that people thought Arteta was. Allegri/Enrique unavailable or too expensive. Arteta/Nagelsman too much of a risk. At least a risk is exciting, but this initially just feels underwhelming.

If we're aiming for Europa League glory, then he fits the bill. A look at his league form would give cause for concern though. Even at PSG with the overwhelming advantage of one of the most expensive teams ever assembled, he lost out to Monaco last season. And they haven't improved in the CL either.

And considering his English is not as fluent as other candidates, why not opt for Jardim who also has problems with the language but a recent track record with vastly improving players?

After all the recent changes at the club, it seemed as if the structure was in place for something genuinely new and potentially innovative. But whether it's because of clashing ideas, budget restrictions or panic, it all appears to have amounted to another opportunistic Arsenal transaction rather than a brave one.

I'd love for people to laugh at me in future for doubting this appointment after he's become another managerial legend, but at the moment it's all a bit beige/vanilla/meh.

:gp:

Yep, I feel very meh at this news :shrug:

[Cripps]

He's a young, trophy laden, ambitious manager. His work at Sevilla was fantastic. He plays football the right way and his teams play good football technically.

If the option was Arteta or Emery then there really was no option.

Ivan :bow:

[Globalgunner]

He's a young, trophy laden, ambitious manager. His work at Sevilla was fantastic. He plays football the right way and his teams play good football technically.

If the option was Arteta or Emery then there really was no option.

Ivan :bow:

Now that's a great post. Novice or experience with success. Its a no brainer. Arteta is like jumping out of a plane with a parachute that everyone else has passed up.

[Penguin]

If Arteta was supposedly the "safe, unambitious" choice because of his inexperience, then this is certainly the middle-of-the-road appointment that's neither completely terrible nor terribly exciting.

I'm not going to be obnoxiously negative and judge the guy before he's had a chance to do something, but this all seems like the compromise option that people thought Arteta was. Allegri/Enrique unavailable or too expensive. Arteta/Nagelsman too much of a risk. At least a risk is exciting, but this initially just feels underwhelming.

If we're aiming for Europa League glory, then he fits the bill. A look at his league form would give cause for concern though. Even at PSG with the overwhelming advantage of one of the most expensive teams ever assembled, he lost out to Monaco last season. And they haven't improved in the CL either.

And considering his English is not as fluent as other candidates, why not opt for Jardim who also has problems with the language but a recent track record with vastly improving players?

After all the recent changes at the club, it seemed as if the structure was in place for something genuinely new and potentially innovative. But whether it's because of clashing ideas, budget restrictions or panic, it all appears to have amounted to another opportunistic Arsenal transaction rather than a brave one.

I'd love for people to laugh at me in future for doubting this appointment after he's become another managerial legend, but at the moment it's all a bit beige/vanilla/meh.

I get where you're coming from and I agree that Emery's not a particularly exciting appointment. But that type of manager might be the best of what's available to us.

We're not exactly in the best position to attract the best of the best. Our squad is awful, we're not in the CL and we only have £50m to spend in the summer (allegedly). Is it any wonder why managers of the calibre of Allegri don't give us a second look?

On the other hand we could take a risk on a complete unknown like Arteta and hope for the best. It might be more exciting at first because we can delude ourselves into thinking that he'll be some kind of genius who'll lead us back to glory. In reality it's not likely that he'll miraculously be one of the top 5% of managers in his first ever job. He's much more likely to be one of the rest, or worse a Gary Neville who'll sink us down to new depths.

[Letters]

He is awful...


But I like him.

:cool:
Do you want a punch :angry:

[Niall_Quinn]

AFTV claiming Arteta didn't want to go with new system at Arsenal and wanted more say than was being offered. Ballsy move that didn't work out for him, although he has teh gypos to fall back on of course. So I guess Emery has accepted the new system and, for me, that's a good thing. No more emperors.

[Dial Square Old Boy]

Do you want a punch :angry:

You're too young...

[Letters]

You're too young...

I actually am, but I made that exact joke about a week ago... <_<

[Power n Glory]

If Arteta was supposedly the "safe, unambitious" choice because of his inexperience, then this is certainly the middle-of-the-road appointment that's neither completely terrible nor terribly exciting.

I'm not going to be obnoxiously negative and judge the guy before he's had a chance to do something, but this all seems like the compromise option that people thought Arteta was. Allegri/Enrique unavailable or too expensive. Arteta/Nagelsman too much of a risk. At least a risk is exciting, but this initially just feels underwhelming.

If we're aiming for Europa League glory, then he fits the bill. A look at his league form would give cause for concern though. Even at PSG with the overwhelming advantage of one of the most expensive teams ever assembled, he lost out to Monaco last season. And they haven't improved in the CL either.

And considering his English is not as fluent as other candidates, why not opt for Jardim who also has problems with the language but a recent track record with vastly improving players?

After all the recent changes at the club, it seemed as if the structure was in place for something genuinely new and potentially innovative. But whether it's because of clashing ideas, budget restrictions or panic, it all appears to have amounted to another opportunistic Arsenal transaction rather than a brave one.

I'd love for people to laugh at me in future for doubting this appointment after he's become another managerial legend, but at the moment it's all a bit beige/vanilla/meh.

The Europa League wins caught my attention but when I looked at Sevilla's performance in La Liga it was a concern. In his last season for Sevilla they didn't win a single away match.

He hasn't got a great CL record, performs poorly against the bigger clubs and if you check his head to head stats vs mangers like Pep, Mourinho, Simeone, Enrique... etc, it's not pretty. In fact, he couldn't even beat Wenger.

Hopefully he has another gear in him if this is confirmed. If fans look a little closer at his record, they may have the same reservations.

[Cripps]

You can dissect anything to put whatever spin on it.

Fact is we've just hired a serial winner. One that plays exciting, attacking football. Let's get behind this appointment.

[Power n Glory]

You can dissect anything to put whatever spin on it.

Fact is we've just hired a serial winner. One that plays exciting, attacking football. Let's get behind this appointment.

Not winning a single away game all season is spin? Never making it past the last 16 of the CL or going out in the group stage is spin?

I think he's a stable appointment and may get us back in the CL and some cup victories but I'm not sure if he has the potential to topple Pep, Klopp, Pott and Mourinho. Go on Tranafermarket.com and check out his head to head stats. Hopefully, he is young enough to learn and adapt.

[Power n Glory]

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/unai-emery/bilanztrainer/trainer/5075

For the lazy fuckers out there. Unai's head to head stats.

[Marc Overmars]

Let’s face it, there was never going to be an appointment that was universally welcomed. Some people didn’t even want Allegri believe it or not. Everyone has their own preference as to what path we should have gone down but there is no sure-fire solution. We’re not going suddenly become world beaters next year, it’s going to take time and there will be plenty of set backs along the way regardless of who got the job.

We’ve got ourselves a good coach, he’s worthy enough to have a go. Time will tell just how good (or bad) Emery proves to be but let’s not revert to type and make it unnecessarily difficult for him and the team.

[Blink 1nce Quince 2wice]

That is a concern...I can't lie.

[Cripps]

Not winning a single away game all season is spin? Never making it past the last 16 of the CL or going out in the group stage is spin?

I think he's a stable appointment and may get us back in the CL and some cup victories but I'm not sure if he has the potential to topple Pep, Klopp, Pott and Mourinho. Go on Tranafermarket.com and check out his head to head stats. Hopefully, he is young enough to learn and adapt.

It went tits up for Klopp in his final season as well. Sometimes a manager exhausts a club. At least Emery won the Europa despite it going tits up. Fact is he's a serial winner.

[Power n Glory]

It went tits up for Klopp in his final season as well. Sometimes a manager exhausts a club. At least Emery won the Europa despite it going tits up. Fact is he's a serial winner.

Look at the head to head stats. I think this guy is still a work in progress. Still young enough to learn but he's not up there with the elites just yet.

[Power n Glory]

That is a concern...I can't lie.

I posted earlier that I thought he was solid when first hearing the news. It's only after seeing a few more fans Tweet about him and doing my own digging that I had some concerns. I've lowered my expectations. He definitely has something there and is young enough to get to the top but he's not there at the moment. Full support either way if this our guy.

[Cripps]

He is still a work in progress. He's only 46.

And he's won the treble and European trophy 3 times despite being in progress.

I'll take that.

[Özim]

AFTV claiming Arteta didn't want to go with new system at Arsenal and wanted more say than was being offered. Ballsy move that didn't work out for him, although he has teh gypos to fall back on of course. So I guess Emery has accepted the new system and, for me, that's a good thing. No more emperors.

Makes me laugh, this nobody should have just accepted what he got, it's his first job, he should think himself lucky he was ever considered. He has a year or too under Guardiola (Mr Chequebook) and suddenly thinks he's gods gift to football :lol:

Average player for us with absolutely no leadership qualities, this off the field leader thing was nonsense, whilst he was captain we never saw his influence and we were as bad as we ever were, so glad we didn't take him on (and we may have seen the same type of football as Guardiola which would have been awful).

[Power n Glory]

He is still a work in progress. He's only 46.

And he's won the treble and European trophy 3 times despite being in progress.

I'll take that.

He hasn't won the Treble. Stop it. If we're calling it that, you can put Brendan Rodgers down as a Treble winner too. ;)

[hobson's choice]

Makes me laugh, this nobody should have just accepted what he got, it's his first job, he should think himself lucky he was ever considered. He has a year or too under Guardiola (Mr Chequebook) and suddenly thinks he's gods gift to football :lol:

Average player for us with absolutely no leadership qualities, this off the field leader thing was nonsense, whilst he was captain we never saw his influence and we were as bad as we ever were, so glad we didn't take him on (and we may have seen the same type of football as Guardiola which would have been awful).

Let me see Sevilla never finished in the top 4 with him. Lost the title to Monaco last year. For all the tactical genius crap, somehow blew a 4-1 lead to Barca last year. His team got embarrassed by a pretty average Madrid team.


Couldn't deal with Neymar, and essentially let him do what ever he wanted too on the pitch. And can't speak English.

Yeah, great hire.

[Marc Overmars]

To be fair no PSG coach is going to be able to deal with Neymar. He’s bigger than the club and nothing more than a symbol of their wealth. If there’s an opportunity to go back to Spain he will be gone.

Emery’s CL defeats were poor but the CL is of no relevance to us at the moment.

[Static]

This guy turned Nzonzi into something decent so I'm hoping he can coach our players properly.

You don't win the Europa League three times on the trot and not have something about you.

He deserves a chance so all this whinging should be put aside until he is given at least a season or two.

[Cripps]

He hasn't won the Treble. Stop it. If we're calling it that, you can put Brendan Rodgers down as a Treble winner too. ;)

Has Brendan Rodgers won the Europa 3 times?

[Cripps]

Let me see Sevilla never finished in the top 4 with him. Lost the title to Monaco last year. For all the tactical genius crap, somehow blew a 4-1 lead to Barca last year. His team got embarrassed by a pretty average Madrid team.


Couldn't deal with Neymar, and essentially let him do what ever he wanted too on the pitch. And can't speak English.

Yeah, great hire.

He got corrupted out of the CL last season by the most blatant cheating I've ever seen :lol: that game was always going to be overturned before a ball was even kicked :lol:

As for this year they lost to what will probably be the eventual winners.

And for the English, neither could Conte.

:console:

[Power n Glory]

Has Brendan Rodgers won the Europa 3 times?

No, but has Emery won the 'tREBLE' three seasons in a row, like Brendan Rodgers! :rolleyes:

I'm not putting too much weight in the trophies at PSG. Laurent Blanc won the 'tREBLE' twice in a row with PSG. That team is too dominant in Ligue 1 and I respect PSG's last season a lot less because they had to pull a Bayern to win the league back from Monaco. I've held the same criticism of Pep at Bayern.

The stuff I think adds weight to this appointment besides the trophies is what I've heard about his attention to details and analysis. That's impressive stuff. But there is more.

[Power n Glory]

More positives.... Emery has worked with some really good players, helped develop them and they moved on to playing for bigger clubs. Juan Mata (Valencia), David Silva (Valencia), David Villa (Valencia), Jordi Alba (Valencia) Raul Albiol (Valencia) Roberto Soldado (Valencia), Ivan Rakitic (Sevilla), Carlos Bacca (Sevilla), Jesus Navas (Sevilla), Negredo (Sevilla).

That Villa, Mata and Silva combo at Valencia was impressive.

[Goonermerree]

We're going to have EKB and 'Emery out' factions before we've kicked a ball. If he comes, and it hasn't been confirmed yet, let's just get behind him. Nobody even knew who Wenger was but that turned out all right for a while. There would always be good reasons to appoint or not appoint many managers. We may have gone for a 'middle of the road' option in terms of experience, but let's just give him a chance!

[Penguin]

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/unai-emery/bilanztrainer/trainer/5075

For the lazy fuckers out there. Unai's head to head stats.

Tbf a lot of those stats must be skewed because he was managing Sevilla. Course he's not going to have a good record against people managing Barca, Real and Atletico.

Not winning an away match for a whole season IS very worrying though. Especially after our horrible away record last season...

[Power n Glory]

Tbf a lot of those stats must be skewed because he was managing Sevilla. Course he's not going to have a good record against people managing Barca, Real and Atletico.

Not winning an away match for a whole season IS very worrying though. Especially after our horrible away record last season...

Yes, that's true. He's managed Valencia and Sevilla. But it would be even more impressive if he could have outfox the bigger teams and managers. What's truly impressive about Simeone and Klopp is that they've always managed smaller teams but their records against the giants is pretty impressive. Klopp has put the hurting on Pep and Jose a number of times. Dormund vs Bayern, Madrid, City, Chelsea....Also, Simeone doesn't manage a giant team. Atletico were in the same class as Valencia and Sevilla but Simeone transformed them into a powerhouse team despite the lack of resources and having key players poached each season. No shame in Emery's record and not everyone can do what Klopp and Simeone have done but I would say those two are a step above him.

Well, at least Emery has the one important victory over Klopp! He may be able to flourish at Arsenal. PSG was toxic. With the right environment, he could do well. As said in a previous post, I'm impressed with some of the players he worked with at Valencia. He's part of the reason why I say there are talented teams in La Liga but it's held back by the lopsided financing.

[Cripps]

He wasn't the right coach for PSG and their climate. It's clear from everything I've read he was way too detailed and meticulous for those pretentious, egotistical PSG players. Neymar didn't warm to his video analysis and pre-match prep because it was deemed long and detailed :doh: imagine that, poor little Neymar actually having to listen to instructions and being told what to do :rolleyes:

Whereas at Arsenal it's completely different. After years of laissez-faire Wenger we need a meticulous manager to come in and dissect every aspect.

Sometimes profiles just don't match and I think Emery is more suited to an underdog type club like Sevilla, Arsenal, Valencia etc i.e. a club with restricted resources that has plenty to prove where his work can really take effect, instead of the PSG's and Real Madrid's of the world with a dressing room full of uncooperative, pampered prima donnas.