summer '22 transfer craziness and stupidity

[mandela8]

Linked with Milinkovic-Savic. Never heard of him but he’s apparently an all action box to box midfielder.

Sign him up tbh.

I'm struggling to believe that. If it sounds too good to be true and all that.

He's one of the best MFs in Italy and would cost more than anyone we've been linked with up until now, probably.

[selassie]

Also on Tielemans, think about what we’re not seeing… where are all the rival offers? We’re talking about a very good, PL-ready central midfielder who’s available at a very reasonable fee so it’s curious that no one else has made a move yet.

Ironically, he seems like one of a small number of decent players who actually wants to come here, typical of us not to move for him! :lol:

Everybody else we seem to be going for wants to go elsewhere, but we don't give up! :blah:

[I am invisible]

Ironically, he seems like one of a small number of decent players who actually wants to come here, typical of us not to move for him! :lol:

Everybody else we seem to be going for wants to go elsewhere, but we don't give up! :blah:
Mate, I haven’t got a clue what’s going on anymore! Everything gone quiet, which is probably just how the club like it.

Jesus was the important one to get over the line - the rest of the names I’m trying not to get too invested in. The roles are needed, but there seem to be a lot more options to choose from for those so I’m less fussed about who we end up landing on…

[KSE Comedy Club]

:tumbleweed:

[I am invisible]

Observing the holding period.

[Gooner23]

Rumours that Saka and Saliba will be signing contract extensions. Massive if true.

[Letters]

New signings :bow:

[KSE Comedy Club]

New signings :bow:

You forgot to add 'Lika'

[Chippy]

Rumours that Saka and Saliba will be signing contract extensions. Massive if true.

Joking aside, that would literally be like new signings.

:ladynana:

[Marc Overmars]

Not much word on outgoings at the moment. At least 5 or 6 players who don’t have a future here need to be shown the door.

[Mac76]

Not much word on outgoings at the moment. At least 5 or 6 players who don’t have a future here need to be shown the door.

Arseblog said we probably wouldn't see that until we'd finished with signings - might not be until later in the window, after the season's started

[mandela8]

Arseblog said we probably wouldn't see that until we'd finished with signings - might not be until later in the window, after the season's started

Arseblog is a fuckin clown, tbf.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Arseblog said we probably wouldn't see that until we'd finished with signings - might not be until later in the window, after the season's started

That sounds very much like 'we will see if we can sign anyone else first but if not we will make do with the same shit we had last season'

[selassie]

Rumours that Saka and Saliba will be signing contract extensions. Massive if true.

Great news if true.

[mandela8]

That sounds very much like 'we will see if we can sign anyone else first but if not we will make do with the same shit we had last season'

Last season they loaned out players like Gendouzi and Torriera, leaving CM options of an injury prone Partey, Xhaka and Elneny. So they're not exactly known for being sensible in this regard...maybe they've learned from that mistake.

[mandela8]

Thing is business and fitba intradests are often conflicting.

On the one hand someone like Telemans should be brought in asap to adapt and hit the season running. On the other, it makes sense to leave Leicester in a position of only having as little time as possible to negotiate before he effectively becomes a zero value asset to them when the window closes.

I clearly prefer the option of getting them in early though. Take last season for as an example. Pay a couple of million extra could've made the difference at the start of the season and banked a couple of points then...rather than missing out on CL fitba 20+ million by a single point.

[HCZ_Reborn]

One would imagine a lot of that was to get them off the wage bill. And Torreira would have been on a higher wage than Elneny. Torreira equally wasn’t likely to accept spending much of the season on the bench. Rumour is that Roma are in for him

[Mac76]

Arseblog is a fuckin clown, tbf.

i'm sure the feeling is mutual

[KSE Comedy Club]

Last season they loaned out players like Gendouzi and Torriera, leaving CM options of an injury prone Partey, Xhaka and Elneny. So they're not exactly known for being sensible in this regard...maybe they've learned from that mistake.

Exactly.

Maybe is worrying, but there is always hope.

[Mac76]

One would imagine a lot of that was to get them off the wage bill. And Torreira would have been on a higher wage than Elneny. Torreira equally wasn’t likely to accept spending much of the season on the bench. Rumour is that Roma are in for him

didn't Roma want Xhaka too? maybe we can offer them two for the price of one? or pay for them to take Xhaka off our hands even? :pray:

[Marc Overmars]

Seems like Barca have won the race for Raphinha. Guess that’s probably what he wanted from the start.

[dazthegooner]

Not sure how Barca are funding all these transfers rumors report that they still have at least 100m outstanding on transfers and are massively in dept.

[GP]

They are about to spend 50m on a 34 year old as well.

Ridiculous club.

[I am invisible]

No way I'd be accepting any kind of instalment plan from Barcelona - money up front or no deal! Player on receipt of funds.

[Mac76]

If Raphina's not joining us, am glad he's not joining another PL club

[Marc Overmars]

Looks like Martinez is joining United. :rose:

Balogun likely to be loaned out.

[Chippy]

Looks like Martinez is joining United. :rose:

Balogun likely to be loaned out.

Excellent.
We have too many short ass defenders as it is.

[I am invisible]

Shame - he looked like he'd be ideal as an inverted LB. Have to agree, though - I'm struggling to see him as a CB in this league, which is seemingly how United view him. Guess we'll have to wait and see on that.

Also think we were right to stop bidding when we did - again, I think he would have been a really strong option for the role we had planned for him, but if we're talking 40-50m then we might as well try our luck for Zinchenko, who's PL-ready and knows the coach.

[Mac76]

Balogun likely to be loaned out.

FFS this guy is the new Saliba - a promising player (and a striker and we've not got many of those) we could be integrating into the side in cup games etc, but no instead he's being farmed out

[Chippy]

Rumours that Saka and Saliba will be signing contract extensions. Massive if true.

https://tbrfootball.com/report-william-saliba-not-planning-to-sign-new-arsenal-contract/

:unsure:

[Gooner23]

https://tbrfootball.com/report-william-saliba-not-planning-to-sign-new-arsenal-contract/

:unsure:

Wouldn't read too much into that one, don't think it's from the most reliable source.

[Gooner23]

Ornstein reckons we are in for Zinchenko.

[GP]

Wouldn't read too much into that one, don't think it's from the most reliable source.

He's definitely signing. No doubt.

[GP]

FFS this guy is the new Saliba - a promising player (and a striker and we've not got many of those) we could be integrating into the side in cup games etc, but no instead he's being farmed out

Loaning out young players is a good thing.

Loaning out Saliba was a good thing. That's pretty obvious.

[selassie]

Ornstein reckons we are in for Zinchenko.

I am happy with this. I really like him as a player. Very tidy, great passer, tactically quite sound for a player who is a Midfielder but regularly plays at full back.

He is a player that brings quality to both the Full back position and Central Midfield IMO, I am all for this transfer.

[selassie]

Looks like Martinez is joining United. :rose:

Balogun likely to be loaned out.

I'm not particularly bothered by Martinez snubbing us which was obvious the minute United got involved. He sounds like he is a very good player, but.....he has played mainly as a LCB so spending upwards of 50mill on a LCB to play at LB seemed a bit strange to me. Zinchenko pursuit seems more logical as he can cover left back and central midfield.

[I am invisible]

Tbh I kind of just assumed we were going for Martinez because Zinchenko was off the table - if both players are available then of course you go for Zinchenko! He’s already playing the role we need, he’s PL-ready and he’s worked with the coach before - tick, tick, tick.

Guess we must have thought Martinez would be the cheaper, easier deal to get done, otherwise I don’t understand why we’d make that move first? Maybe the Raphinha move collapsing suddenly freed up more funds for other moves?

[Marc Overmars]

Zinchenko would be a slam dunk of a signing.

As good as he is, Tierney is not reliable because of his fitness issues. We need a proper alternative there and Zinchenko would be quite a seamless addition to the squad.

[Gooner23]

Yeah I've really warmed to Zinchenko over last couple of years, he's technically superb and seems to have grown in confidence. I'd take him over the Ajax guy because he knows the league and the manager.

[Mac76]

all of the above - Zinchenko would be a great signing

[I am invisible]

Omari Hutchinson going to Chelsea, the little shit!

[Mac76]

nevver 'eard of 'im tbh :shrug:

anyway we'll get him back aged 32 and for the cut price of £50m...

[I am invisible]

Fine! But only if we can pay him a quarter of a million a week, otherwise he’s dead to me! Whoever he is.

[I am invisible]

What do we think the plan is for Zinchenko then? First choice LB who can ‘invert’ into CM (same as Martinez) or a left 6/8 who can drop to cover LB (pretty much Martinez in reverse / Xhaka upgrade)?

And what does that mean for our interest in Tielemans? Is that maybe why we’re looking at Paqueta, who’s more of an advanced option and covers more roles across the attack?

Not sure how the pieces fit yet, but I like the pieces.

[Globalgunner]

I read somewhere thant Zinchenko wants to play in midfield which is where he plays for country and may be seeking guarantees that we play him there and is likely why he is jumping ship from Etihad. Problem is, he will likely see a lot of action at LB given the fragility of our first choice Scotsman in that position. Either way. He would be a great addition to the squad. A pairing of him and Tierney on that wing is quite an enticing prospect. With Saka slightly ahead of both.

Memories of Cole and Pires together there makes my eyes well up with sadness

[HCZ_Reborn]

nevver 'eard of 'im tbh :shrug:

anyway we'll get him back aged 32 and for the cut price of £50m...

That’s obviously because you don’t play football manager

[I am invisible]

I read somewhere thant Zinchenko wants to play in midfield which is where he plays for country and may be seeking guarantees that we play him there and is likely why he is jumping ship from Etihad. Problem is, he will likely see a lot of action at LB given the fragility of our first choice Scotsman in that position. Either way. He would be a great addition to the squad. A pairing of him and Tierney on that wing is quite an enticing prospect. With Saka slightly ahead of both.

Memories of Cole and Pires together there makes my eyes well up with sadness
Plus we have a CF who can run both channels now in Jesus - Henry drifting to the left was a big part of that Pires + Cole dynamic, do that’s another box ticked.

I’m tempted to say Zinchenko is my highest priority signing at this point? He’d just unlock so many options down that side, and we so desperately need to get that side functioning. It’s all so easy for teams to ignore it at the moment and double-up on our right - everyone across the attack will benefit from getting this fixed.

Martinelli would certainly benefit from having more of an inverted LB option behind him - that allows him to be more of wide forward with less backtracking - and as a midfielder he offers so much more physical and tactical agility than Xhaka. Better combination player and playmaker in tight spaces in the final third, and better at dropping to cover LB.

[Munchies]

Zinchenko fee agreed

https://twitter.com/fabrizioromano/status/1548201264261079040?s=21&t=fK6a-zBQo3zYldKg2K0P1A

[Gooner23]

I think he'll start in the left 8 position ahead of Xhaka and offer a bit of cover to Tierney when the inevitable injury happens.

Does this move mean Tielemans deal is dead? Or perhaps that will be reliant on Xhaka reading the room and moving on.

[I am invisible]

Zinchenko fee agreed

https://twitter.com/fabrizioromano/status/1548201264261079040?s=21&t=fK6a-zBQo3zYldKg2K0P1A
That’s very reasonable.

[I am invisible]

I think he'll start in the left 8 position ahead of Xhaka and offer a bit of cover to Tierney when the inevitable injury happens.

Does this move mean Tielemans deal is dead? Or perhaps that will be reliant on Xhaka reading the room and moving on.
You know what, I’ve just read Tim Stillman’s column for the week and he makes a really good point - the fact that we moved for Martinez first, who we clearly wanted as an inverted LB, makes me think that we’re probably also looking at Zinchenko for the same role? Otherwise it’s all a bit scattergun.

The links to Tielemans and Paqueta also make a lot more sense if you assume he comes in in that LB role - with an overlapping LB you probably want more of a 6/8 on that side who spends more time dropping into a double-pivot and/or covering the LB, but with an inverted LB you probably want more of an attacking 8/10 in left midfield who stays forward, with the LB stepping up to be the deep playmaker at the base of midfield.

I guess the good think about Zinchenko is he gives us both options.

[Mac76]

he offers so much more physical and tactical agility than Xhaka.

True, but then so does a bollard

[Marc Overmars]

57m for Martinez. :lol:

Glad we swerved that, especially if Zinchenko is available.

[I am invisible]

57m for Martinez. :lol:

Glad we swerved that, especially if Zinchenko is available.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rFeVfwDvTyM

[Ralpheroo72]

Leroy Sane? Surely not

https://c.newsnow.co.uk/A/1137089984?-19387:844:tt_central_top

[Globalgunner]

Leroy Sane? Surely not

https://c.newsnow.co.uk/A/1137089984?-19387:844:tt_central_top

Not too sure about that one. Good player but I will use the ephemeral Wenger quote "Where will we play him" We are chock full of options in his position now. Ideally now we need a central striker of a different type from Jesus e.g Ollie Watkins of Villa or the chap from Everton Calvert-Lewin. After that and with Zinchenko likely to arrive, we would be about complete......apart from selling that Mutton head Xhaka.

Arteta will really have no hiding place if he fails again this season

[Mac76]

Not too sure about that one. Good player but I will use the ephemeral Wenger quote "Where will we play him" We are chock full of options in his position now. Ideally now we need a central striker of a different type from Jesus e.g Ollie Watkins of Villa or the chap from Everton Calvert-Lewin. After that and with Zinchenko likely to arrive, we would be about complete......apart from selling that Mutton head Xhaka.

Arteta will really have no hiding place if he fails again this season

100% correct

[HCZ_Reborn]

I’d rather spring for Sane than pay over thirty million for a player in a position where we don’t need a player

Oh Zinchenko is versatile? Great I mean that’s much better than signing the central midfielder we desperately need (if Partey ends up in the slammer we are looking at a midfield of Elneny and Xhaka for the season…that’s the level of negligence that ranks alongside the guy who worked for Townsend Thoresen who literally couldn’t be bothered to check if the car hold bulkhead doors were closed before the Herald of Free Enterprise left port…enquiries need to be held)

How many fucking defenders do we have on the books, how many of them are we going to even be able to offload and yet we keep signing more of them. At this point I don’t question Arteta’s transfer strategy, I question his sanity

[Marc Overmars]

Sane would be an electric signing tbh.

I think if we can bag Tielemans it would give a more rounded and complete look to our summer. I do worry about our centre midfield options.

Tierney would be lucky to play more than 30 games a season so Zinchenko would be a valuable addition to the squad.

[KSE Comedy Club]

I think he'll start in the left 8 position ahead of Xhaka and offer a bit of cover to Tierney when the inevitable injury happens.

Does this move mean Tielemans deal is dead? Or perhaps that will be reliant on Xhaka reading the room and moving on.

Hopefully Tielemans in and Xhaka getting the hint

[I am invisible]

We still need another wide forward imo - preferably right sided and one who’s a little more about the goals than the build up. I’d be surprised if it was Sane, though - would be a great move, but that one feels like journos guessing to me: Jesus + Zinchenko = Arteta wants all the ex-City players he’s worked with.

[Marc Overmars]

Sounds like Zinchenko is done. :popcorn:

[Gooner23]

Sounds like Zinchenko is done. :popcorn:

Yep, just time for another 10 Fabrizio tweets about it being close and then it will be done. For 30 million I think that's a good bit of business.

I reckon we'll then focus on shifting some players before any more incomings.

[Mac76]

Zinchenko's a terrific signing - if only Spuds weren't also signing a lot of players this would be looking like a perfect summer - oh and provided we offload Xhaka of course...

[Globalgunner]

Zinchenko's a terrific signing - if only Spuds weren't also signing a lot of players this would be looking like a perfect summer - oh and provided we offload Xhaka of course...

8 points a season Xhaka...the average amount of points he costs us (guessing). Without him we would have qualified for the CL five seasons running now

[I am invisible]

Well we know from the Raphinha bid that a sale isn’t a barrier to bringing in a right-sided wide forward, so I can see that one happening at any moment if we identify a target we like.

Wouldn’t be surprised if CM was one out, one in, though, although (*** TRIGGER WARNING! ***) I have a feeling that’s less about finances and more about the manager still trusting Xhaka to do a job for him if it comes to it (which he clearly doesn’t with Pepe on RW). I think we’re open to that sale, and are clearly sounding out options - I just think the club are a little more prepared to fold their arms and hold out for what they want on that one than the fans are.

The rest of the sales have no real bearing on anything as far as I’m concerned. Find permanent moves or go out on endless loans until their contracts expire, I really don’t care - as long as they’re off the wage bill that’s the main thing. Happy to sanction those as and when offers come in, although they all have the whiff of deadline day transfers to me.

[I am invisible]

8 points a season Xhaka...the average amount of points he costs us (guessing). Without him we would have qualified for the CL five seasons running now
Tbf he’s been far less of a risk in that more advanced left-8 role than he was as the guy at the base of midfield. And if you stuck an inverted fullback like Zinchenko behind him I think he’d be even less of a worry.

But even if we remove all risk from his game completely there’s still clearly an upgrade to be had there. If we brought a Tielemans or a Paqueta in, for example, what would the expectation level be in terms of goals and assists? Probably 5-10 of each. What does Xhaka usually give us? Maybe 1-2 of each? Not good enough.

[I am invisible]

Zinchenko's a terrific signing - if only Spuds weren't also signing a lot of players this would be looking like a perfect summer - oh and provided we offload Xhaka of course...
Forget about spurs - we both have very different projects on the go with very different timelines.

Their two best players will be in their 30s this year and they have a manager who very rarely stays anywhere longer than 2 years (8.5 months down already) - whatever they’re doing, it needs to happen immediately! Will they finish above us this year? Maybe. Will they win the league? No. So who gives a fuck?

Ultimately our rivalry with them is just a side-show - the real challenges is making up the 20-point, 30-goal deficit on City and Liverpool. Kane and Son are already performing at their maximum - there’s not too much more to be wrung out of those two, and they’re unlikely to ever go through another season completely injury-free at their ages (and especially in a year with a ridiculous mid-season WC in the middle of the desert). We, on the other hand, played most of last season with a striker who couldn’t even get in the box, bracketed by a collection of 20 year olds. Just my opinion, but considering there was only 2 points and 8 goals scored between us, I think our potential to make up that deficit is higher than theirs, and I think we have a lot more time on our side and growth in the group.

[Letters]

:gp:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Tbf he’s been far less of a risk in that more advanced left-8 role than he was as the guy at the base of midfield. And if you stuck an inverted fullback like Zinchenko behind him I think he’d be even less of a worry.

But even if we remove all risk from his game completely there’s still clearly an upgrade to be had there, imo. If we brought a Tielemans or a Paqueta in, for example, what would the expectation level be in terms of goals and assists? Probably 5-10 of each. What does Xhaka usually give us? Maybe 1-2 of each? Not good enough.

I can't stand Xhaka.

We just need to upgrade on him and move him on.

He isn't good enough, and all the hype he gets is when the competition around him is weaker

[selassie]

Zinchenko's a terrific signing - if only Spuds weren't also signing a lot of players this would be looking like a perfect summer - oh and provided we offload Xhaka of course...

Our handicap right now is Arteta TBH. If we are honest, City and Liverpool are absolutely guaranteed to finish above us, I would also put money on both Spurs and Chelsea finishing above us too for the simple reason they have better managers and in Chelsea's case a better squad, Spurs give or take probably marginally have a better squad than us.

Our target is top 6 this season. Despite the fact we have improved our squad / team to a lesser extent, we are up against 2 sides outside of the big 2 who we will need to perform at a high level all season to finish above them.

[selassie]

Forget about spurs - we both have very different projects on the go with very different timelines.

Their two best players will be in their 30s this year and they have a manager who very rarely stays anywhere longer than 2 years (8.5 months down already) - whatever they’re doing, it needs to happen immediately! Will they finish above us this year? Maybe. Will they win the league? No. So who gives a fuck?

Ultimately our rivalry with them is just a side-show - the real challenges is making up the 20-point, 30-goal deficit on City and Liverpool. Kane and Son are already performing at their maximum - there’s not too much more to be wrung out of those two, and they’re unlikely to ever go through another season completely injury-free at their ages (and especially in a year with a ridiculous mid-season WC in the middle of the desert). We, on the other hand, played most of last season with a striker who couldn’t even get in the box, bracketed by a collection of 20 year olds. Just my opinion, but considering there was only 2 points and 8 goals scored between us, I think our potential to make up that deficit is higher than theirs, and I think we have a lot more time on our side and growth in the group.

I agree with this up to a point. Whether we like it or not they (Scum) have a world class manager we don't. They have significantly improved their squad we haven't.

At what point do we move forward and say right top 4 finish is now a priority, we will do all we can to ensure it happens by recruiting quality in the right areas.

We have Jesus and Nketiah as our forwards. We have Xhaka still likely starting in Midfield. We have Cedric still likely starting a large number of games at right back. We have some American Rookie to challenge a worryingly off form Ramsdale.

Yes we need to bridge the gap between us and the top 2 but I think our target this season is to keep pace with the likes of Chelsea, Spurs and potentially Man United.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I can't stand Xhaka.

We just need to upgrade on him and move him on.

He isn't good enough, and all the hype he gets is when the competition around him is weaker

I don’t actually think he’s a terrible player

And I say this despite 100% agreeing with you that a) he’s not good enough for us and b) we desperately need an upgrade on him

I think he is exceptional at picking out players with long passes, but needs time and space which you just don’t get in the premier league. He’d actually do ok for a mid table side in the Bundesliga or a top six Series A side

[Chippy]

Forget about spurs - we both have very different projects on the go with very different timelines.

Their two best players will be in their 30s this year and they have a manager who very rarely stays anywhere longer than 2 years (8.5 months down already) - whatever they’re doing, it needs to happen immediately! Will they finish above us this year? Maybe. Will they win the league? No. So who gives a fuck?

Ultimately our rivalry with them is just a side-show - the real challenges is making up the 20-point, 30-goal deficit on City and Liverpool. Kane and Son are already performing at their maximum - there’s not too much more to be wrung out of those two, and they’re unlikely to ever go through another season completely injury-free at their ages (and especially in a year with a ridiculous mid-season WC in the middle of the desert). We, on the other hand, played most of last season with a striker who couldn’t even get in the box, bracketed by a collection of 20 year olds. Just my opinion, but considering there was only 2 points and 8 goals scored between us, I think our potential to make up that deficit is higher than theirs, and I think we have a lot more time on our side and growth in the group.

I will be mocked for saying this but the Spuds have the right mix to go and win something big next season. Dare I say the Champions League? The opposition are not as scary as when we were in it. They are all beatable.

[I am invisible]

I don’t actually think he’s a terrible player

And I say this despite 100% agreeing with you that a) he’s not good enough for us and b) we desperately need an upgrade on him

I think he is exceptional at picking out players with long passes, but needs time and space which you just don’t get in the premier league. He’d actually do ok for a mid table side in the Bundesliga or a top six Series A side
Yeah, this is about where I am - I don’t hate him, and I think we can avoid a lot of his self-destruct moments by pushing him further away from the back line, but he just doesn’t excel in any of the midfield roles that we’re moving towards.

As you say his one super-power is his long passing, but we’ve spent the last year or so moving that skill into our defenders - we don’t really need it in our CMs any more.

[Mac76]

I can't stand Xhaka.

We just need to upgrade on him and move him on.

He isn't good enough, and all the hype he gets is when the competition around him is weaker

:gp:

[mandela8]

The problem with moving Xhaka further forward is that he offers absolutely fuck all in an attacking sense. In fact, he's seriously detrimental to it with his complete inability to move the ball quickly and decisively. He slows everything down to fuck.

[mandela8]

Definitely need a WR too.

Unless Vieira is earmarked for a wider role. I think we were still in for Raphinha after we signed Vieira though, so that kinda hints that a WR is still required. Need more goals/creativity from those areas.

[I am invisible]

The problem with moving Xhaka further forward is that he offers absolutely fuck all in an attacking sense. In fact, he's seriously detrimental to it with his complete inability to move the ball quickly and decisively. He slows everything down to fuck.
Exactly! We might be able to mitigate risk, but that doesn’t mean you’re adding anything to t to be role. The fact is he’s become a little obsolete in this system - his output and creativity isn’t high enough to be the left-8, and he doesn’t have the agility to evade pressure and take the ball for a walk as the 6. He’s only really at home as the deep distributor in a double-pivot (I’m getting all the wanky terms out here because I know you love them, m8), but tbh our defenders do that job now - it’s not really needed in our midfielders.

[I am invisible]

Definitely need a WR too.

Unless Vieira is earmarked for a wider role. I think we were still in for Raphinha after we signed Vieira though, so that kinda hints that a WR is still required. Need more goals/creativity from those areas.
Vieira isn’t the player we’re looking for on RW, imo. He can definitely play there, but he’s more of a creative - I think we’re after someone with more devastation. A duel-monster who measures himself on goals.

That being said, I do think the fanbase are sleeping on this kid - he sounds a real talent and most of the writers and analysts who I actually respect are very excited about him.

[Marc Overmars]

Funny hearing the naysayers mock us as though we’re signing rejects again. Wasn’t Henry a Juve reject….?

The most important thing though is that these are players with their best years ahead of them.

It’s not the same as signing the likes of David Luiz and Willian who only came here because they wanted to stay in London and we were dumb enough to put up the sort of money they wouldn’t get anywhere else.

[I am invisible]

Funny hearing the naysayers mock us as though we’re signing rejects again. Wasn’t Henry a Juve reject….?

The most important thing though is that these are players with their best years ahead of them.

It’s not the same as signing the likes of David Luiz and Willian who only came here because they wanted to stay in London and we were dumb enough to put up the sort of money they wouldn’t get anywhere else.

Can you imagine the reaction if our summer business was a 33yo Perisic, a 34yo Fraser Forster, a championship fullback, an inconsistent, temperamental winger who everyone hates and a CB loanee who completely bombed at Barcelona (I'll let them have Bissouma - that was a good bit of business)?

And can you imagine the hype if spurs had added Jesus, Zinchenko, one of the best young CBs in europe, one of the best young playmakers in europe and the best GK from the MLS (doesn't matter if you rate him or not, that's how everyone would be talking about him if he went to spurs).

[HCZ_Reborn]

The problem with moving Xhaka further forward is that he offers absolutely fuck all in an attacking sense. In fact, he's seriously detrimental to it with his complete inability to move the ball quickly and decisively. He slows everything down to fuck.

Yep, better to try and shift him.

[GP]

Can you imagine the reaction if our summer business was a 33yo Perisic, a 34yo Fraser Forster, a championship fullback, an inconsistent, temperamental winger who everyone hates and a CB loanee who completely bombed at Barcelona (I'll let them have Bissouma - that was a good bit of business)?

And can you imagine the hype if spurs had added Jesus, Zinchenko, one of the best young CBs in europe, one of the best young playmakers in europe and the best GK from the MLS (doesn't matter if you rate him or not, that's how everyone would be talking about him if he went to spurs).

Yeah exactly. It's weird to me to see people saying they're improving and we aren't. Looks like the exact opposite to me.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Can you imagine the reaction if our summer business was a 33yo Perisic, a 34yo Fraser Forster, a championship fullback, an inconsistent, temperamental winger who everyone hates and a CB loanee who completely bombed at Barcelona (I'll let them have Bissouma - that was a good bit of business)?

And can you imagine the hype if spurs had added Jesus, Zinchenko, one of the best young CBs in europe, one of the best young playmakers in europe and the best GK from the MLS (doesn't matter if you rate him or not, that's how everyone would be talking about him if he went to spurs).

Agreed.

This is better though in some ways. Let the usual idiots create all the fanfare they want about Spurs, etc and then we will quietly go out and put in the performances and get results.

They will soon eat their words over the next season

[Globalgunner]

Yeah but the Spuds have a WC manager and we have a trainee. Big difference. If we had switched managers for the last 3 games of the season. I bet we would be in the CL now...Instead we shat ourselves big time. Spuds have improved or maybe not. But they still have Conte. United have a manager of great repute now...who knows but one thing is for sure 6 does not go into 4 places.

[Xhaka Can’t]

The Spuds, with their squad are coming close to the end of their window in respect of challenging for major honours.

Key players are ageing and the return they can expect from and for them are diminishing.

In particular, Son and Kane. Unless they get lucky with development of their squad, these will be expensive to replace.

I like where we are in squad development relative to the Spuds.

[KSE Comedy Club]

The Spuds, with their squad are coming close to the end of their window in respect of challenging for major honours.

Key players are ageing and the return they can expect from and for them are diminishing.

In particular, Son and Kane. Unless they get lucky with development of their squad, these will be expensive to replace.

I like where we are in squad development relative to the Spuds.

I think that is a pretty fair statement.

They literally have this season as their window of opportunity before the gradual decline sets in.

[mandela8]

Spurs have done great business. Mon tae fuck.

Richarlison is quality. Even though he's a cunt. A front 3 of Son Kane and Richarlison is absolutely elite.

Bissouma is proven quality.

Looks like they've addressed the biggest issue of RB...and then added some depth.

That's the objective truth.

[Mac76]

Spurs have done great business. Mon tae fuck.

Richarlison is quality. Even though he's a cunt. A front 3 of Son Kane and Richarlison is absolutely elite.

Bissouma is proven quality.

Looks like they've addressed the biggest issue of RB...and then added some depth.

That's the objective truth.

correct - except it's 'spuds' not spu*s' please

[mandela8]

The Spuds, with their squad are coming close to the end of their window in respect of challenging for major honours.

Key players are ageing and the return they can expect from and for them are diminishing.

In particular, Son and Kane. Unless they get lucky with development of their squad, these will be expensive to replace.

I like where we are in squad development relative to the Spuds.

Wishful thinking.

Their best players are 30, not 35, ffs.

We can hate them and be objective at the same time, man.

[Bumble]

we have done some really good business so far. age profile of signings very good 20-25. just need to work on selling a few bodies.

but done enough to finish top 4, certainly ahead of spurs. United as things stands yes but they are capable of pulling a quality signing or two or just bringing in more individualistic duds.

[Globalgunner]

Wishful thinking.

Their best players are 30, not 35, ffs.

We can hate them and be objective at the same time, man.

Exactly: Fortunately they have kept Dier, who is their version of our Xhaka

[mandela8]

There are too many variables to compare and contrast for me.

Complicated moreso for arsenal with players like Zinchenko and Vieira who can play multiple positions.

At the start of the window I wanted a progressive/Creative CM, a striker (possibly 2, tbh) and a winger with end product.

You could argue 1 or 3 of those have been satisfied.

Fuck knows, basically.


Regardless, I think we should also benefit from many players just getting better. Unlike most of the teams we're competing with who are only improving with transfers, we have at least 6 (Saka, Martinelli, Saliba, ESR, Gabriel, White) players we can hopefully expect an improvement from, in terms of development.

So, I don't think we even need to have the 'best' window to improve the most.

[fakeyank]

I am still not comfortable with our striking options. Whats our alternative if Jesus is injured? Telephone Nketiah? I think we need to invest in another player in this position.

Also think our squad has a lot of baggage- Torreira, Reiss, Mari, Tavares, Leno, Pepe... we need to sort out what we are doing with these guys. Personally I'd love to give Torreira a run on the field but we seem to have burnt our bridge there. Also, with Pepe, I think he could be a good option for striker but again, not sure thats what Mikel has in mind.

[Chippy]

Wishful thinking.

Their best players are 30, not 35, ffs.

We can hate them and be objective at the same time, man.
Totally agree.

[Globalgunner]

I am still not comfortable with our striking options. Whats our alternative if Jesus is injured? Telephone Nketiah? I think we need to invest in another player in this position.

Also think our squad has a lot of baggage- Torreira, Reiss, Mari, Tavares, Leno, Pepe... we need to sort out what we are doing with these guys. Personally I'd love to give Torreira a run on the field but we seem to have burnt our bridge there. Also, with Pepe, I think he could be a good option for striker but again, not sure thats what Mikel has in mind.

Striker and a CM needed because Xhaka is a liability and Partey is gonna miss half of each season. We need an experienced, PL ready option.

[mandela8]

I am still not comfortable with our striking options. Whats our alternative if Jesus is injured? Telephone Nketiah? I think we need to invest in another player in this position.

Also think our squad has a lot of baggage- Torreira, Reiss, Mari, Tavares, Leno, Pepe... we need to sort out what we are doing with these guys. Personally I'd love to give Torreira a run on the field but we seem to have burnt our bridge there. Also, with Pepe, I think he could be a good option for striker but again, not sure thats what Mikel has in mind.

Agree with most. I do like Nketiah for some reason but I can't justify. I think with better players around him he'd be ok.

Definitely agree on Pepe...in fact, I'm convinced if he started most games we'd have got 4th last year. He was the only player in the squad who offered a consistent threat.
He's been horribly managed. Clearly a confidence player who Arteta went out his way to destroy his confidence, ffs. Which is bad enough but Arteta also mismanaged Saka in doing so. Overplaying him to the point he knew he was never being dropped and rarely subbed despite some abysmal performances and he was pretty fuckin rubbish the entire run in with absolutely zero consequences. Is it any wonder he just stroll about the pitch thinking he's Messi, doing fuck all for 85 minutes a game? Woeful management.

Agree on Torriera too. Levels above Xhakant and Elnonentity.

[Mac76]

Agree with most. I do like Nketiah for some reason but I can't justify. I think with better players around him he'd be ok.

Definitely agree on Pepe...in fact, I'm convinced if he started most games we'd have got 4th last year. He was the only player in the squad who offered a consistent threat.
He's been horribly managed. Clearly a confidence player who Arteta went out his way to destroy his confidence, ffs. Which is bad enough but Arteta also mismanaged Saka in doing so. Overplaying him to the point he knew he was never being dropped and rarely subbed despite some abysmal performances and he was pretty fuckin rubbish the entire run in with absolutely zero consequences. Is it any wonder he just stroll about the pitch thinking he's Messi, doing fuck all for 85 minutes a game? Woeful management.

Agree on Torriera too. Levels above Xhakant and Elnonentity.

mainly agree but a bit harsh on Elneny

[ed.] good pun though :lol:

[I am invisible]

Spurs have done great business. Mon tae fuck.

Richarlison is quality. Even though he's a cunt. A front 3 of Son Kane and Richarlison is absolutely elite.

Bissouma is proven quality.

Looks like they've addressed the biggest issue of RB...and then added some depth.

That's the objective truth.

Yeah, look I wasn't talking about whether they'll turn out to be quality additions for them or not - I was talking more about the footballing world's skewed reaction to whatever it is that us and them do. If we'd signed the exact same players spurs have this summer then you just know they'd all be written off as a giant waste of money and bunch of bums - people would have found some issue with every single one of them. And if spurs had signed the players we've brought in then they'd all be hyped up as future Ballon d'or winners. As it is their players are the shrewdest of shrewd buys and ours are a bunch of bums that don't improve us.

Fwiw I think you're right - I think spurs will be really tough this year, but I'm not really worried about it. As I said a few pages back, us and them are on very different timelines - they need to be achieving success immediately, while Conte is still interested and their key players are at their peak, and I'm not sure they're going to be quite good enough to topple City or Liverpool in the next year or two. Our team, on the other hand, still has another 2-3 years before it hits its peak years, and we're already right up their arses! 2 points between us last season despite them having the world-class manager and the elite forward line, and us having the rookie coach and the youngest, thinnest squad in the league with no strikers. Honestly, I'm happy with where we are and what we're doing.

[fakeyank]

Striker and a CM needed because Xhaka is a liability and Partey is gonna miss half of each season. We need an experienced, PL ready option.

Isnt Zinchenko supposed to be that player? Also, AMN if not loaned out or killed can also be the player there.

[mandela8]

Yeah, look I wasn't talking about whether they'll turn out to be quality additions for them or not - I was talking more about the footballing world's skewed reaction to whatever it is that us and them do. If we'd signed the exact same players spurs have this summer then you just know they'd all be written off as a giant waste of money and bunch of bums - people would have found some issue with every single one of them. And if spurs had signed the players we've brought in then they'd all be hyped up as future Ballon d'or winners. As it is their players are the shrewdest of shrewd buys and ours are a bunch of bums that don't improve us.

Fwiw I think you're right - I think spurs will be really tough this year, but I'm not really worried about it. As I said a few pages back, us and them are on very different timelines - they need to be achieving success immediately, while Conte is still interested and their key players are at their peak, and I'm not sure they're going to be quite good enough to topple City or Liverpool in the next year or two. Our team, on the other hand, still has another 2-3 years before it hits its peak years, and we're already right up their arses! 2 points between us last season despite them having the world-class manager and the elite forward line, and us having the rookie coach and the youngest, thinnest squad in the league with no strikers. Honestly, I'm happy with where we are and what we're doing.

Ahh...fair enough, man.

I've never really had much exposure to the English fitba press, tbh. So not something I was actually aware of, tbh.

[Globalgunner]

Isnt Zinchenko supposed to be that player? Also, AMN if not loaned out or killed can also be the player there.

AMN....Seriously?. That boy has the talent at football that an elephant would have at ballet. He is below average

[Marc Overmars]

I’m actually feeling really positive and looking forward to the start of the season. I honestly don’t remember when I was last eager for things to get under way.

I think the club has done a lot over the past couple of years to bridge the gap with fans. I feel there’s a lot more transparency now and there’s quite a clear direction of travel. Fuck knows how things will go this season but I’m all in for it.

Defeat at Palace is incoming btw…

[IBK]

Yeah, look I wasn't talking about whether they'll turn out to be quality additions for them or not - I was talking more about the footballing world's skewed reaction to whatever it is that us and them do. If we'd signed the exact same players spurs have this summer then you just know they'd all be written off as a giant waste of money and bunch of bums - people would have found some issue with every single one of them. And if spurs had signed the players we've brought in then they'd all be hyped up as future Ballon d'or winners. As it is their players are the shrewdest of shrewd buys and ours are a bunch of bums that don't improve us.

Fwiw I think you're right - I think spurs will be really tough this year, but I'm not really worried about it. As I said a few pages back, us and them are on very different timelines - they need to be achieving success immediately, while Conte is still interested and their key players are at their peak, and I'm not sure they're going to be quite good enough to topple City or Liverpool in the next year or two. Our team, on the other hand, still has another 2-3 years before it hits its peak years, and we're already right up their arses! 2 points between us last season despite them having the world-class manager and the elite forward line, and us having the rookie coach and the youngest, thinnest squad in the league with no strikers. Honestly, I'm happy with where we are and what we're doing.

Good points here. It does rankle with me, however that we are obsessed with those twats. F*ck them. I refuse to talk them up and fervently hope that they will Sp*rs it up as usual...

[I am invisible]

I’m actually feeling really positive and looking forward to the start of the season. I honestly don’t remember when I was last eager for things to get under way.

I think the club has done a lot over the past couple of years to bridge the gap with fans. I feel there’s a lot more transparency now and there’s quite a clear direction of travel. Fuck knows how things will go this season but I’m all in for it.

Defeat at Palace is incoming btw…

I think the overall coherency of the strategy has been crucial to bridging that gap too. When you can clearly see what the plan is, even if you don't particularly agree with it, you at least know where to set your targets and expectation levels. You can predict what's coming, how long it will take and where the bumps in the road are likely to be, and that takes so much of the stress and anxiety out of following the club. Fans don't like being surprised - they like knowing what's coming and being prepared for it. They don't like being made to look like mugs in front of other fans because they've set their expectation levels completely wrong - that embarrassment gets passed straight back to the club in rage.

[I am invisible]

Good points here. It does rankle with me, however that we are obsessed with those twats. F*ck them. I refuse to talk them up and fervently hope that they will Sp*rs it up as usual...

We play them twice a season - beyond that we have precisely zero control over what they do. As long as we actually have a plan of our own, and are making good on it, that's all I ask.

[I am invisible]

Interesting... Zinchenko to Arsenal = Cucurella to City = maybe Nuno going to Brighton on loan? That works for me.

[IBK]

We play them twice a season - beyond that we have precisely zero control over what they do. As long as we actually have a plan of our own, and are making good on it, that's all I ask.

This :good:

[fakeyank]

I’m actually feeling really positive and looking forward to the start of the season. I honestly don’t remember when I was last eager for things to get under way.

I think the club has done a lot over the past couple of years to bridge the gap with fans. I feel there’s a lot more transparency now and there’s quite a clear direction of travel. Fuck knows how things will go this season but I’m all in for it.

Defeat at Palace is incoming btw…

I am cautiously optimistic although I think we need one more striker. While Nketiah has shown promise, I dread having him as no.1 striker if Jesus is injured. I also dont get the call for Tielemans.. where is he going to play?! I am still confused whats our best XI with Vieira, Zinchenko now in the mix..

[Mac76]

Defeat at Palace is incoming btw…

without a doubt we will lose that game

of course Sky have put it up on a nice big plate for the media to feast on 'Arsenal lose to Plucky Palace' headlines as a nice start to the usual Arsenal-bashing media season...

[mandela8]

At this point I reckon we start at Palace with only one new player in the starting 11.

Knowing Arteta it might even be none because "Eddie trains so well and deserves it".

[I am invisible]

I am cautiously optimistic although I think we need one more striker. While Nketiah has shown promise, I dread having him as no.1 striker if Jesus is injured. I also dont get the call for Tielemans.. where is he going to play?! I am still confused whats our best XI with Vieira, Zinchenko now in the mix..
Forget best XIs - 5 subs is going to be a seismic change to the game in this country, and I think a lot of what we’re seeing with our activity is us tooling up for it. Everything’s about to get a lot more tactical, with far more system changes and counter-changes within games, specific players picked to start games, different players picked to finish games, etc, and the most successful teams are probably going to be the ones who have the most options and adaptability.

Chuck in Europa league and a couple of domestic cup runs (and a ridiculous WC in the middle of the season) (and the usual injuries we have to cover) and there will easily enough minutes to keep everyone happy!

I know what you mean with Tielemans - I want him, but I can’t quite picture what job he does for us? I get the feeling he might be our ‘everyman’ in CM - someone who can play left-8, right-8, as one half of a double-pivot and maybe even cover Partey as the lone 6 (I really don’t think that role is what people think it is in our system).

Eddie will be fine for this season. If he can come into a creaking, threadbare team in the run in and bang in 5 goals in 8 games (and we had some tough games in that run!) then he’ll do just fine with our best players around him and everyone fresh. At the very least he buys us a year to look at 2nd striker - I don’t feel any great urgency to do anything about that one this summer (nor can I see who might be available who would make a difference to us). I feel like the immediate answer here is to stick with the original plan and bring in a goal-scoring wide forward.

[selassie]

I’m actually feeling really positive and looking forward to the start of the season. I honestly don’t remember when I was last eager for things to get under way.

I think the club has done a lot over the past couple of years to bridge the gap with fans. I feel there’s a lot more transparency now and there’s quite a clear direction of travel. Fuck knows how things will go this season but I’m all in for it.

Defeat at Palace is incoming btw…

My feelings too. We have definitely improved, but so has everyone else aside from Manure so it’s not as open as it was say 5 or 6 seasons ago.

Im looking forward to the season more out of hope than belief. I personally don’t think we have done enough to upgrade our team and I don’t believe Arteta and the coaching staff are good enough to improve us to the position I want us to be in.

[Munchies]

Still hoping for a right winger/striker that can get goals.

Not sure who is available however now

[McNamara That Ghost...]

https://www.arsenal.com/oleksandr-zinchenko-joins-arsenal-manchester-city-transfer

:dance:

[GP]

Good signing.

We've done some great business aside from Turner who looks like a dud.

[Mac76]

aside from Turner who looks like a dud.

Wrong - he snubbed a spuds fan so he's already a legend

[Mac76]

Zinchenko's a good hire but my excitement at the signings is a bit tempered by not just Xhaka but also Cedric not being talked about as likely to go - it's looking like Arteta sees them as part of the future, at least for the time being.

Until we get rid of that kind of banter trash player we're going nowhere

[Chippy]

[QUOTE=Mac76;4558918]Zinchenko's a good hire but my excitement at the signings is a bit tempered by not just Xhaka but also Cedric not being talked about as likely to go - it's looking like Arteta sees them as part of the future, at least for the time being.

Before we start selling, especially defender's, we need to look at replacing Tommy. He is injured yet again and is pretty shit anyway.

[LDG]

[QUOTE=Mac76;4558918]Zinchenko's a good hire but my excitement at the signings is a bit tempered by not just Xhaka but also Cedric not being talked about as likely to go - it's looking like Arteta sees them as part of the future, at least for the time being.

Before we start selling, especially defender's, we need to look at replacing Tommy. He is injured yet again and is pretty shit anyway.

It’s ok, we have cover there. Ben White, Cedric…we don’t need another right back, especially with Hyphen-Hyphen coming through

[Mac76]

[QUOTE=Mac76;4558918]Zinchenko's a good hire but my excitement at the signings is a bit tempered by not just Xhaka but also Cedric not being talked about as likely to go - it's looking like Arteta sees them as part of the future, at least for the time being.

Before we start selling, especially defender's, we need to look at replacing Tommy. He is injured yet again and is pretty shit anyway.

He's one of our best defenders, but if it's true re injury then it's a worry

[selassie]

[QUOTE=Chippy;4558919]

He's one of our best defenders, but if it's true re injury then it's a worry

When fit Tommy is one of our best defenders and one of the best right backs in PL IMO. Problem is he is always injured. I think this season we will get away with having White or to a lesser extent Cedric cover him. Another season of Tommy's injuries and we need to dip into the market for solid competition similar to what we have done with Zinchenko for Tierney.

[mandela8]

[QUOTE=Mac76;4558921]

When fit Tommy is one of our best defenders and one of the best right backs in PL IMO. Problem is he is always injured. I think this season we will get away with having White or to a lesser extent Cedric cover him. Another season of Tommy's injuries and we need to dip into the market for solid competition similar to what we have done with Zinchenko for Tierney.

I really like Tommy but I don't see how anyone can suggest he's anywhere close to being one of the best RBs in the league. He's genuinely clueless in a attacking sense, which is a huge part of fullbacks games now.

We've watched him have simple forward balls to play but he almost always opts to play it inside or backwards. It's really not good enough for a modern fullback, tbh.

[Mac76]

[QUOTE=selassie;4558938]

I really like Tommy but I don't see how anyone can suggest he's anywhere close to being one of the best RBs in the league. He's genuinely clueless in a attacking sense, which is a huge part of fullbacks games now.

We've watched him have simple forward balls to play but he almost always opts to play it inside or backwards. It's really not good enough for a modern fullback, tbh.

Not sure i agree tbh, my memory of him going forward is pretty positive but it feels like a small sample ATM, we just need him to stay fit and he can iron out any issues, the point is he has potential to be a legend whereas Suarez is just banter

[I am invisible]

Atalanta looking the favourited to take Tavares on loan now.

Edu has also rubbished the Paqueta talk so we can officially ignore that one.

[I am invisible]

Fucking hell, Edu's not mincing his words!

https://dailycannon.com/2022/07/80-of-arsenals-squad-were-too-comfortable-says-edu/

Love to hear it, tbf - keep on with that attitude and I might be able to look past the dodgy start with Raul...

[Marc Overmars]

Fucking hell, Edu's not mincing his words!

https://dailycannon.com/2022/07/80-of-arsenals-squad-were-too-comfortable-says-edu/

Love to hear it, tbf - keep on with that attitude and I might be able to look past the dodgy start with Raul...

As I said the other day, I love the transparency with the club now. This is a huge factor in mending the relationship with the fans who were so disconnected. He’s literally said what the fans had suspected for so long, that we had a squad full of players who were just coasting on big contracts and enjoying the London lifestyle.

We fucked it post-Wenger by going for the best on-paper options to fill all the gaps but now it seems like most of that shit has been weeded out.

[Mac76]

Edu signed Willian and David Luiz - this is just BS

[Marc Overmars]

Edu signed Willian and David Luiz - this is just BS

And given how quickly they were shipped off, especially Willian, I think it’s fair to say he understood what was actually needed after that. He was new in the job too and obviously just went with what he knew - the profile of player we now sign is drastically different and that’s what he should be judged on.

[fakeyank]

Still hoping for a right winger/striker that can get goals.

Not sure who is available however now

Depay is available and at close to 15 million quid, I think that would be a great buy. Max 3 year contract, and he is only 28.

[mandela8]

Depay is available and at close to 15 million quid, I think that would be a great buy. Max 3 year contract, and he is only 28.

That's a good shout, btw. Very solid player.

I also quite like Ziyach from Chelsea, for someone we know to be available. Not sure he's quite the goal threat we need though...more of a play making wide player.

[Marc Overmars]

Looks like Leno could finally be off to Fulham.

[dazthegooner]

Haven’t got a link but according to The Metro Marseille are in London for talks with Saliba’s agent over a potential deal..

[Marc Overmars]

Haven’t got a link but according to The Metro Marseille are in London for talks with Saliba’s agent over a potential deal..

100m and they can have him tbh.

[GP]

Haven’t got a link but according to The Metro Marseille are in London for talks with Saliba’s agent over a potential deal..

lmao no they aren't.

They couldn't afford him.

[Mac76]

Looks like Leno could finally be off to Fulham.

i take they don't deploy the passing-out-from-the-back strategy...? :lol:

[Chippy]

100m and they can have him tbh.

He will stay one season. Won't sign a new contract and we will have to sell him to the highest bidder. Same old with this kind of player.

[Marc Overmars]

Looks like Tavares could be loaned to Marseille.

:wave:

[Globalgunner]

Rumours of a potential swap deal with Leicester. They get Leno we get Tielemans. Some cash may also be involved. Apparently Schmeichel wants to leave. Not so fast the Fulham deal

[Marc Overmars]

Don’t know why United don’t just let Ronaldo go, they’d be much better off without him.

[Letters]

Don’t know why United don’t just let Ronaldo go, they’d be much better off without him.

You think? I mean, they were a hilarious car crash but pretty sure they did a lot better when he played than when he didn't.
Obviously he's old in footballer terms so they need to replace him anyway.

[I am invisible]

Don’t know why United don’t just let Ronaldo go, they’d be much better off without him.

They probably would if they could - I get the feeling they're stuck where we were, trying to find a buyer who is willing to cover his wages. Tough spot for them - they won't want to see him go to a PL rival, but who else is going to be able to afford them?

[I am invisible]

You think? I mean, they were a hilarious car crash but pretty sure they did a lot better when he played than when he didn't.
Obviously he's old in footballer terms so they need to replace him anyway.

Yes and no. He forces the team to play in a way that makes him look great, but stops them from really adopting modern standards (not to mention it sends out a pretty terrible message to the rest of the group when your highest-paid, most-respected player just does what he wants and gets away with it - sets the tone for some pretty poor behaviour and standards). That's the gist I get from talking to a couple of united-supporting friends, anyway.

[Letters]

:good:

[Mac76]

Yes and no. He forces the team to play in a way that makes him look great, but stops them from really adopting modern standards (not to mention it sends out a pretty terrible message to the rest of the group when your highest-paid, most-respected player just does what he wants and gets away with it - sets the tone for some pretty poor behaviour and standards). That's the gist I get from talking to a couple of united-supporting friends, anyway.

depends what you mean by "just does what he wants and gets away with it " - isn't he reputed to be the first on the training ground, last to leave, leads by example etc etc?

yes he's a prancing peacock and a terrible diver etc but i'm not sure he's such a bad example otherwise

[I am invisible]

depends what you mean by "just does what he wants and gets away with it " - isn't he reputed to be the first on the training ground, last to leave, leads by example etc etc?

yes he's a prancing peacock and a terrible diver etc but i'm not sure he's such a bad example otherwise

I mean he doesn't want anything to do with pressing from the front, which is how both his current and previous coach want/ed to play, and he mostly wants to lurk around the area pumping his own goal tally. I'm sure he trains harder than anyone, and is more ruthlessly focussed than anyone, but he's not doing what his coaches want.

Ronaldo might be legendary enough to get away with that, but the problem they is they have a lot of other overpaid players there who think a bit too much of themselves, and are nowhere near his level, who then think that they shouldn't have to press or run around either. And then the younger players see that and they start to think that's the way to behave. They're basicaaly us from 2-3 years ago.

[Mac76]

I mean he doesn't want anything to do with pressing from the front, which is how both his current and previous coach want/ed to play, and he mostly wants to lurk around the area pumping his own goal tally. I'm sure he trains harder than anyone, and is more ruthlessly focussed than anyone, but he's not doing what his coaches want.

Ronaldo might be legendary enough to get away with that

i dunno about that, i recall he wasn't started a few times last season, presumably as a reasult of the coach reminding him who was boss and that everyone has to play the right role

[McNamara That Ghost...]

https://www.arsenal.com/news/nuno-tavares-joins-marseille-loan

Tavares to Marseille confirmed, on loan.

[IBK]

https://www.arsenal.com/news/nuno-tavares-joins-marseille-loan

Tavares to Marseille confirmed, on loan.

I hope he does well, and develops there. Whether we then sell him or whether there is somehow a way back to Arsenal, this would be in our interests.

[Marc Overmars]

Leno joins Fulham.

They’ve got themselves a bit of a bargain there at 8m. Another player let go for a pittance.

[I am invisible]

Shocker of a deal when you actually read the details, but best of luck to him anyway. Decent servant to the club - didn’t complain when we completely changed GK-direction on him and went for something else - so I can make my peace with bending a little to help him stay in London for his family, if that’s what he wants. End if the day it’s another 100k-a-week / 5m-a-year off the wage bill that was just sitting on the bench doing very little.

[I am invisible]

At least we’re finally starting to see some movement on the outs now - Nuno and Balogun have both got decent loans and Leno, Torreira and Mari could all be sold this week.

[Gooner23]

If Fulham get relegated it's only 4m which is insane for a keeper of Leno's quality.

The fire sale has started this week, sounds like Torreira and Mari will be the next ones to go for peanuts.

Patino off on loan to Blackpool for a season which is a good move.

[Mac76]

we're so shit at getting any kind of decent money for good players and then when people offer us good money for morons like Xhaka we turn them down :rolleyes:

[Chippy]

we're so shit at getting any kind of decent money for good players and then when people offer us good money for morons like Xhaka we turn them down :rolleyes:

And the same old story from the ones that are staying :shrug:

https://www.thesportsbank.net/football/arsenal-2/vieira-tomiyasu-smith-rowe/

If they were horses, they would be shot.

[selassie]

Leno joins Fulham.

They’ve got themselves a bit of a bargain there at 8m. Another player let go for a pittance.

Yep, he's still a decent keeper. We literally get nothing for any of our players!

[selassie]

Rumours of a potential swap deal with Leicester. They get Leno we get Tielemans. Some cash may also be involved. Apparently Schmeichel wants to leave. Not so fast the Fulham deal

I think Tielemans will come on Deadline Day.

[Ralpheroo72]

Anyone else think our business is done?

[HCZ_Reborn]

4th will be unlikely if it is especially if Chelsea sign Auba

[mandela8]

I think Tielemans will come on Deadline Day.

Is Tielemans even that good or is it just the connection?

All arsenal fans are to want the deal done but if he wasn't linked would he be touted?

[mandela8]

Anyone else think our business is done?

No chance, imo.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Is Tielemans even that good or is it just the connection?

All arsenal fans are to want the deal done but if he wasn't linked would he be touted?

He’s a player I’ve wanted at Arsenal long before he was linked with us, excellent technically, great at linking defence to attack. He’s basically a player that can do the things we bought Xhaka to do but he can’t do.

[Marc Overmars]

Bit of talk that Lokonga could be loaned out, with Milan being interested. Another one who needs a lot before he can be considered a reliable first team option.

Would make sense if Tielemans is coming in.

[mandela8]

Bit of talk that Lokonga could be loaned out, with Milan being interested. Another one who needs a lot before he can be considered a reliable first team option.

Would make sense if Tielemans is coming in.

You say he needs a lot but he's already better than Xhaka, Elneny and any of the other CMs other than Partey.

It is encouraging as surely it can only be contemplated of an addition is being considered.

[Marc Overmars]

You say he needs a lot but he's already better than Xhaka, Elneny and any of the other CMs other than Partey.

It is encouraging as surely it can only be contemplated of an addition is being considered.

I don’t actually rate any of our CM’s anyway apart from Partey. All heavily flawed/limited players, by far the weakest area of the team.

[mandela8]

I don’t actually rate any of our CM’s anyway apart from Partey. All heavily flawed/limited players, by far the weakest area of the team.

Aye, CM and wingers are woeful. Partey aside.

[Niall_Quinn]

Is Tielemans even that good or is it just the connection?

All arsenal fans are to want the deal done but if he wasn't linked would he be touted?

He's good(ish) by modern standards. Means he can kick a ball, make a pass, might put a bit of effort in and isn't a headless chicken. Fantastic and rare attributes in the modern game. Bog standard beforehand. A journeyman. But it doesn't really matter either way because he'd just be absorbed into the catastrophically pointless system that reduces every player to a tightly screwed cog in a very, very basic machine.

[selassie]

Is Tielemans even that good or is it just the connection?

All arsenal fans are to want the deal done but if he wasn't linked would he be touted?

Decent player. Is he an upgrade on what we have, probably not but he offers something different, is experienced whilst being relatively young and when he is on it is a very good midfielder.

For 25mill it’s a no brainer.

[selassie]

He's good(ish) by modern standards. Means he can kick a ball, make a pass, might put a bit of effort in and isn't a headless chicken. Fantastic and rare attributes in the modern game. Bog standard beforehand. A journeyman. But it doesn't really matter either way because he'd just be absorbed into the catastrophically pointless system that reduces every player to a tightly screwed cog in a very, very basic machine.

Who would you like us to sign in midfield?

[Niall_Quinn]

Who would you like us to sign in midfield?

As I said, it doesn't matter. We've already had more than enough players in the middle who could have made an impact if Dick and Mik had been worth their pay. Go ahead and buy this guy and you'll see exactly the same cycle as with all the others that have come, impressed for 5 minutes and then faded out and fucked off on the cheap. It's the attitude that needs to change, not the players.

[selassie]

As I said, it doesn't matter. We've already had more than enough players in the middle who could have made an impact if Dick and Mik had been worth their pay. Go ahead and buy this guy and you'll see exactly the same cycle as with all the others that have come, impressed for 5 minutes and then faded out and fucked off on the cheap. It's the attitude that needs to change, not the players.

Right

[Chippy]

Right

Right indeed!
Also, we have Super Granit Xhaka!! :bow:

[selassie]

Right indeed!
Also, we have Super Granit Xhaka!! :bow:

Aye, to be fair he was superb on Saturday, more of the same please Granit!

[HCZ_Reborn]

Right indeed!
Also, we have Super Granit Xhaka!! :bow:

Ugh all it proves that sticking him in a deep lying position is an utter waste of time because whether he’s there or not the defensive work is left to Partey. We’ve got plenty of free roaming midfielders already. Get rid and bring in Tielemans FFS

[selassie]

Ugh all it proves that sticking him in a deep lying position is an utter waste of time because whether he’s there or not the defensive work is left to Partey. We’ve got plenty of free roaming midfielders already. Get rid and bring in Tielemans FFS

No way Tielemans starts ahead of Xhaka if he comes in. Not based on his performances of the past season or so. Tielemans is a decent player but I don't think he upgrades our team, he just brings in much needed quality for competition.

[HCZ_Reborn]

No way Tielemans starts ahead of Xhaka if he comes in. Not based on his performances of the past season or so. Tielemans is a decent player but I don't think he upgrades our team, he just brings in much needed quality for competition.

Are you high?

Xhaka was consummately our worst performer last season, yet you’re creaming your shorts based on what? Because Arteta literally gave up on the idea of asking him to adopt positional discipline and said ok do what you like.

Did it escape you that because of him we were close to going 1-0 down on Saturday and if it had been someone more clinical than Fofana who dispossessed him we surely would have done.

How many years of having him in the team does it take for people like you to accept what a liability he is

Practically any midfielder is an improvement on Xhaka at this point. I’m sorry if I’m sounding harsh but this is insanity…yes because he got away with roaming away from his position by a Leicester side not in good enough form to punish us for it doesn’t mean he should be a starter or playing for us full stop.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Sorry I actually can’t drop this

Did you watch any of the Brentford/Man United game

Because if you did you will see how much Brentford pressed United high up the pitch

We have to go there next month. If we start Xhaka the scoreline could be similar….his ability to lose games for us single handedly is legendary.

Fuck me

[mandela8]

Just seen Aouar is off to Forest (unconfirmed) which seems mental. I know Arsenal were heavily linked and he's a player I rate highly, based entirely on football manager. I still reckon he'd be better than Tielemans who was fuckin non exisakatent on Saturday.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Just seen Aouar is off to Forest (unconfirmed) which seems mental. I know Arsenal were heavily linked and he's a player I rate highly, based entirely on football manager. I still reckon he'd be better than Tielemans who was fuckin non exisakatent on Saturday.

Do you not think we have enough attacking midfielders?. We have so many of them who’s potential is limited because we don’t have a deep lying player who gets the ball forward quickly enough. And that Aouar is off to Forest is more indicative that so many players in the French ligue appear to be rated off the back of one decent season.

This is how we ended up with the African equivalent of Laurent Robert at the cost to us of 72 million

Tielemans did do nothing on Saturday but that doesn’t change the fact that in every possible way he’s a complete technical upgrade on Granit Xhaka who has been the weak link in our team for so many seasons it’s crazy.

Could we do better than Tielemans? Possibly….he wasn’t exactly brilliant last season. But his passing, technique and movement are definitely what we need.

[HCZ_Reborn]

What I will say for Forest is that I think Emmanuel Dennis is a good signing for them.

[selassie]

Are you high?

Xhaka was consummately our worst performer last season, yet you’re creaming your shorts based on what? Because Arteta literally gave up on the idea of asking him to adopt positional discipline and said ok do what you like.

Did it escape you that because of him we were close to going 1-0 down on Saturday and if it had been someone more clinical than Fofana who dispossessed him we surely would have done.

How many years of having him in the team does it take for people like you to accept what a liability he is

Practically any midfielder is an improvement on Xhaka at this point. I’m sorry if I’m sounding harsh but this is insanity…yes because he got away with roaming away from his position by a Leicester side not in good enough form to punish us for it doesn’t mean he should be a starter or playing for us full stop.

Completely sober thanks

I am not creaming my shorts at all, just saying that if we get Tielemans I don't think he walks into our team ahead of any of our current midfielders, not because I think the current ones are amazing, but more because I think Tielemans is pretty much on their level. Decent Midfielder who has plenty of experience playing for their national teams. Tielemans offers different qualities to the current lot, they offer different qualities to him.

Xhaka is Xhaka, he is not perfect by any stretch of the imagination but he isn't useless either, practically any midfielder isn't an improvement because Xhaka has been out of the team plenty of times and our alternatives to him have stunk up the place.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Completely sober thanks

I am not creaming my shorts at all, just saying that if we get Tielemans I don't think he walks into our team ahead of any of our current midfielders, not because I think the current ones are amazing, but more because I think Tielemans is pretty much on their level. Decent Midfielder who has plenty of experience playing for their national teams. Tielemans offers different qualities to the current lot, they offer different qualities to him.

Xhaka is Xhaka, he is not perfect by any stretch of the imagination but he isn't useless either, practically any midfielder isn't an improvement because Xhaka has been out of the team plenty of times and our alternatives to him have stunk up the place.

In terms of actually single handedly costing us more points than any other player who has made it into the first team in years I do actually think any midfielder would be an improvement on Xhaka.

If you play Elneny and Partey together you have zero creative impetus but you’re less likely to lose

And yes I’m sorry to keep contradicting you but Tielemans is the player in the premier league who pound for pound most resembles the type of player Xhaka is (the deep lying playmaker) he’s better at tackling, better technically, can use both feet, can dribble and has a better range of passing than Xhaka.

If Xhaka played in Germany or Italy he’d be ok in fact he’d be a decent player, but you simply don’t get the time on the ball in the premier league that Xhaka seems to need.

[mandela8]

Completely sober thanks

I am not creaming my shorts at all, just saying that if we get Tielemans I don't think he walks into our team ahead of any of our current midfielders, not because I think the current ones are amazing, but more because I think Tielemans is pretty much on their level. Decent Midfielder who has plenty of experience playing for their national teams. Tielemans offers different qualities to the current lot, they offer different qualities to him.

Xhaka is Xhaka, he is not perfect by any stretch of the imagination but he isn't useless either, practically any midfielder isn't an improvement because Xhaka has been out of the team plenty of times and our alternatives to him have stunk up the place.

Pretty much, man.

Arteta said he's given Xhaka new directions and he's in more of a box to box role. Don't get me wrong, I'd fuckin love to replace him as regardless of how 'not shite' Xhaka was yesterday as he's always liable to undermine the team in a major way.

I just don't think Tielemans improves the team that much, tbh.
It's a good point about the alternatives though, although hopefully Zinchenko and/or Viera can play this new role Arteta seems to be implementing.

I can't even bring myself to respond to that other fud, tbh. Clueless gammon.

[Mac76]

In terms of actually single handedly costing us more points than any other player who has made it into the first team in years I do actually think any midfielder would be an improvement on Xhaka.



This

[HCZ_Reborn]

Pretty much, man.

Arteta said he's given Xhaka new directions and he's in more of a box to box role. Don't get me wrong, I'd fuckin love to replace him as regardless of how 'not shite' Xhaka was yesterday as he's always liable to undermine the team in a major way.

I just don't think Tielemans improves the team that much, tbh.
It's a good point about the alternatives though, although hopefully Zinchenko and/or Viera can play this new role Arteta seems to be implementing.

I can't even bring myself to respond to that other fud, tbh. Clueless gammon.

Angry Scotsman accuses other person of being a gammon

You’ve as much self reflection as Count Dracula don’t you chief?

[Globalgunner]

Arsenal fans do like to self own. How do you not see Xhaka for the liability he is?. He plays at least 40 games a season as he in never injured, but is out for card accumulation more than any other player in the squad. He has good games against poor opposition who do not close him down. Against any good team or high press he is useless and sometimes more than useless.
I will drink myself to a stupor the day he leaves the club

[Mac76]

I will drink myself to a stupor the day he leaves the club

I already do that, to cope with the fact he's still here

[HCZ_Reborn]

He’s had his one decent game for the season and scored his obligatory single goal for the season. Good time to be rid

[selassie]

In terms of actually single handedly costing us more points than any other player who has made it into the first team in years I do actually think any midfielder would be an improvement on Xhaka.

If you play Elneny and Partey together you have zero creative impetus but you’re less likely to lose

And yes I’m sorry to keep contradicting you but Tielemans is the player in the premier league who pound for pound most resembles the type of player Xhaka is (the deep lying playmaker) he’s better at tackling, better technically, can use both feet, can dribble and has a better range of passing than Xhaka.

If Xhaka played in Germany or Italy he’d be ok in fact he’d be a decent player, but you simply don’t get the time on the ball in the premier league that Xhaka seems to need.

Any player is an improvement on any player if you focus only on their weaknesseses. Xhaka and Partey to a lesser degree both need upgrading.

Tielemans and Xhaka are nothing like each other, nothing like each other at all, aside from the fact they both play in Central Midfield and are both slow. Tielemans is a decent player in that he is experienced and is decent technically, but he is by no means perfect and IMO wouldn't improve this team ahead of Xhaka. In Tielemans, we are talking about a player who has a year left on his contract and is wanted by pretty much nobody. I like Tielemans, but only as a Squad player option, essentially rotating with Xhaka. If we want to upgrade our Midfield then we need to be aiming higher than Tielemans IMO.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Any player is an improvement on any player if you focus only on their weaknesseses. Xhaka and Partey to a lesser degree both need upgrading.

Tielemans and Xhaka are nothing like each other, nothing like each other at all, aside from the fact they both play in Central Midfield and are both slow. Tielemans is a decent player in that he is experienced and is decent technically, but he is by no means perfect and IMO wouldn't improve this team ahead of Xhaka. In Tielemans, we are talking about a player who has a year left on his contract and is wanted by pretty much nobody. I like Tielemans, but only as a Squad player option, essentially rotating with Xhaka. If we want to upgrade our Midfield then we need to be aiming higher than Tielemans IMO.

I agree that he’s nothing like Xhaka and I’ve listed the reasons why

[mandela8]

Any player is an improvement on any player if you focus only on their weaknesseses. Xhaka and Partey to a lesser degree both need upgrading.

Tielemans and Xhaka are nothing like each other, nothing like each other at all, aside from the fact they both play in Central Midfield and are both slow. Tielemans is a decent player in that he is experienced and is decent technically, but he is by no means perfect and IMO wouldn't improve this team ahead of Xhaka. In Tielemans, we are talking about a player who has a year left on his contract and is wanted by pretty much nobody. I like Tielemans, but only as a Squad player option, essentially rotating with Xhaka. If we want to upgrade our Midfield then we need to be aiming higher than Tielemans IMO.

Nah, he's a definite upgrade. Even if you want to under rate him and put him on a par with Xhaka, in terms of ability, his temperament would save arsenal the 5-8 points Xhaka loses them every. Single. Fuckin. Season.

I just don't think he's that good and there are other options...but I'm not really opposed to the move either, tbh.

[Mac76]

Nah, he's a definite upgrade. Even if you want to under rate him and put him on a par with Xhaka, in terms of ability, his temperament would save arsenal the 5-8 points Xhaka loses them every. Single. Fuckin. Season.


Exactly

[selassie]

I agree that he’s nothing like Xhaka and I’ve listed the reasons why

You said he most resembles Xhaka in terms of a player in the Premier League! You called Tielemans a deep lying playmaker which he absolutely isn't. He is more like a box to box type, more number 8 than number 6.

If we are talking about deep lying playmakers then someone like Jorginho most resembles the Xhaka of old (when he was playing the deep lying playmaker role).

[selassie]

Nah, he's a definite upgrade. Even if you want to under rate him and put him on a par with Xhaka, in terms of ability, his temperament would save arsenal the 5-8 points Xhaka loses them every. Single. Fuckin. Season.

I just don't think he's that good and there are other options...but I'm not really opposed to the move either, tbh.

That's debatable. You are making an assumption that Xhaka only makes mistakes and never contributes anything to the team. Have a look at the stats for how many points Xhaka has won us, assists etc! You have to be objective when looking at a player.

We are on the same page with Tielemans.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Xhaka has been named vice captain.

Disgraceful tbh

[Marc Overmars]

Xhaka is a weird one.

Obviously he’s going to cost the team at various points in the season, it’s just what he does. Yet on the other hand, he’s also seen as a very reliable option by every coach he’s played with and clearly he’s a leader who the dressing room probably look to for help.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Xhaka is a weird one.

Obviously he’s going to cost the team at various points in the season, it’s just what he does. Yet on the other hand, he’s also seen as a very reliable option by every coach he’s played with and clearly he’s a leader who the dressing room probably look to for help.

It was interesting watching all or nothing - Xhaka was sent off against Liverpool for being his usual calamitous shit self - and Arteta came in and gave him a hug - ??

Yet when Pepe was sent off - he was ostracised from the team.

One rule for one and one rule for another it would seem.

[mandela8]

That's debatable. You are making an assumption that Xhaka only makes mistakes and never contributes anything to the team. Have a look at the stats for how many points Xhaka has won us, assists etc! You have to be objective when looking at a player.

We are on the same page with Tielemans.

Assumption?

Mate, I watch him every week and have done for years, ffs.

He's proven beyond any doubt that he is a liability.

I can't believe there's actually someone left on earth to debate this, man.

[selassie]

Assumption?

Mate, I watch him every week and have done for years, ffs.

He's proven beyond any doubt that he is a liability.

I can't believe there's actually someone left on earth to debate this, man.

So he costs us every season yet continually gets picked by every manager who is at Arsenal. If he was that easy to replace we would have upgraded on him already, we have been spending money the past few seasons so it's not even as if we haven't had the budget to replace him.

I'm no fan of his, but he is nowhere near as bad as you and others on here are making out.

[mandela8]

So he costs us every season yet continually gets picked by every manager who is at Arsenal. If he was that easy to replace we would have upgraded on him already, we have been spending money the past few seasons so it's not even as if we haven't had the budget to replace him.

I'm no fan of his, but he is nowhere near as bad as you and others on here are making out.

Well, he played for Wenger on his way out when the fans basically hounded him out of the club. Then he played under Emery who was shit. Now under Arteta who's lucky to still be in a job. So I wouldn't be using his managers as justification. Also, I think he's benefitted from more immediate problems (players leaving and having to be replaced) and players not working out (Torreria, Gendouzi, for example).

I don't think there's any doubt that almost every arsenal fan would have him as the one player they'd replace.

You can make senseless arguments like "look at results without him", when there are far too many variables for that to be valid and could be easily countered by "look at arsenals league positions since he arrived", which is probably equally unfair...but really, the simple eye test tells you all you need to know.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Indeed, and whether Tielemans is the replacement we need for Xhaka remains to be seen. I am biased as I am a big fan of the player and have wanted him at the club since he was at Monaco.

That there may be someone far better out there is something I am readily willing to concede

That Xhaka is a liability and needs upgrading on should be beyond doubt

[selassie]

Well, he played for Wenger on his way out when the fans basically hounded him out of the club. Then he played under Emery who was shit. Now under Arteta who's lucky to still be in a job. So I wouldn't be using his managers as justification. Also, I think he's benefitted from more immediate problems (players leaving and having to be replaced) and players not working out (Torreria, Gendouzi, for example).

I don't think there's any doubt that almost every arsenal fan would have him as the one player they'd replace.

You can make senseless arguments like "look at results without him", when there are far too many variables for that to be valid and could be easily countered by "look at arsenals league positions since he arrived", which is probably equally unfair...but really, the simple eye test tells you all you need to know.

It's not really justification, but more related to the fact that the club has been through turmoil, has rebuilt the playing squad but yet he is still here getting picked every week. Do I think he can upgraded on? Absolutely. Do I think he is the route of all our problems no? He is somewhere in the middle. Xhaka is no more of a problem to me than say Partey.

[mandela8]

Xhaka is no more of a problem to me than say Partey.
Genuinely the single worst fitba opinion I have ever heard.

Incredible.

[Globalgunner]

This is why even in courts witness testimony is never taken as gospel. Many people can witness the same assault and there will be 1 person who defends the guy wielding a knife.

"Milud, I saw the plaintiff run headlong onto this mans knife. He repeatedly bashed his abdomen against this fellows defensive instrument"


I have always said that the test of a good player is to ask yourself. If he was playing for any other club apart from Arsenal, would you be clamouring for the manager to buy him?. In the case of Xhaka, that would be a 99% fan NO

[Letters]

I definitely wouldn’t be coveting Xhaka if he was elsewhere.
But I don’t think he deserves all the hate he gets.
He deserves some of it tbf.

[Globalgunner]

Its not hate, that another culturally misused term. He hasn't stolen any fans wife or lunch. He is just a genuinely poor football player in the EPL.

[selassie]

Genuinely the single worst fitba opinion I have ever heard.

Incredible.

Says that man that gives Saka a 3 rating every game. You think I take your posts seriously? 🤣

[mandela8]

Says that man that gives Saka a 3 rating every game. You think I take your posts seriously? ��

Well, it's only been 2 games and I don't think anyone honestly rates him higher, tbh.

[Letters]

Its not hate, that another culturally misused term. He hasn't stolen any fans wife or lunch. He is just a genuinely poor football player in the EPL.

I think poor is harsh. But he's certainly not the level of player we need if we're going to step up and start thinking seriously about a title challenge.

[selassie]

I think poor is harsh. But he's certainly not the level of player we need if we're going to step up and start thinking seriously about a title challenge.

Yep I'm with you.

[selassie]

Well, it's only been 2 games and I don't think anyone honestly rates him higher, tbh.

Saka is clearly not playing to a level he is capable of but rating him at 3 suggests he is doing more harm than good, sorry dude that hasn't been the case.

You rated Ramsdale above him, Ramsdale was directly at fault for both goals and his decision making was very questionable throughout the game. He did more harm than good, that's a 3 rating not Saka.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I think poor is harsh. But he's certainly not the level of player we need if we're going to step up and start thinking seriously about a title challenge.

No poor isn’t harsh. Slow ditherer who simply cannot excel in this league where you don’t get given time and space by the opposition. He can look good against mediocre opponents but like with Aaron Ramsey put him up against against quality and he’s truly exposed.

[mandela8]

Saka is clearly not playing to a level he is capable of but rating him at 3 suggests he is doing more harm than good, sorry dude that hasn't been the case.

You rated Ramsdale above him, Ramsdale was directly at fault for both goals and his decision making was very questionable throughout the game. He did more harm than good, that's a 3 rating not Saka.

I don't think Ramsdale was at fault for the first, tbh. He was never in a position to do anything. Saliba made the move before Ramsdale could do anything. He was at fault for the second. However, he did make a good save to keep it 0-0 when Xhaka Xhaka'd and put Fofana in, so there was also positive contribution.

Saka barely got involved and when he did he gave the ball away almost every single time. The very definition of more harm than good. People may be faux outraged at him being rated a 3 for both his performances but they really know that both ratings stand up to any and all scrutiny.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I don't think Ramsdale was at fault for the first, tbh. He was never in a position to do anything. Saliba made the move before Ramsdale could do anything. He was at fault for the second. However, he did make a good save to keep it 0-0 when Xhaka Xhaka'd and put Fofana in, so there was also positive contribution.

Saka barely got involved and when he did he gave the ball away almost every single time. The very definition of more harm than good. People may be faux outraged at him being rated a 3 for both his performances but they really know that both ratings stand up to any and all scrutiny.

:haha: I love how full of shit you are

I love how it’s not sufficient for you to hold a ridiculous opinion but you have to claim that we’d all think the same as you if we were being honest.

He was quiet, it wasn’t a great game but the idea that he did any harm to our chances of getting all three points especially compared with Ramsdale is a joke.

No Saliba was put in the position by Ramsdale who should have called for him to leave it but when charging out and left Saliba to deal with a ball.
His save from Fofana wasn’t that great, it was more a case of a defenders finish. And if it hadn’t been for the fact that VAR officials decided to intervene to point out that Vardy is a cheating cunt, his impetuousness would have cost us a penalty as well. Yes Vardy dived but the reason we were in that position was because he came charging out and didn’t get the ball.

Saka is playing in front of Ben White therefore he’s basically having to get the ball from deep himself to make any attacking headway where as Martinelli is getting far more supply from Zinchenko on the left.

In the small time Tomoyasu was on the pitch you could see a complete change in Saka’s effectiveness but interesting how you the impartial observer never mention that.

[Mac76]

I didn't see the whole game but it does look like Ramsdale had a shocker

Tomi definitely connects better with Saka and his being back should be an improvement

[Marc Overmars]

Love Ramsdale but I think he’s been quite erratic for a while now. I think that near post goal he conceded against Liverpool earlier this year shattered his confidence and he’s looked a bit unsure ever since. Quality keeper but just needs to regain some composure.

[selassie]

:haha: I love how full of shit you are

I love how it’s not sufficient for you to hold a ridiculous opinion but you have to claim that we’d all think the same as you if we were being honest.

He was quiet, it wasn’t a great game but the idea that he did any harm to our chances of getting all three points especially compared with Ramsdale is a joke.

No Saliba was put in the position by Ramsdale who should have called for him to leave it but when charging out and left Saliba to deal with a ball.
His save from Fofana wasn’t that great, it was more a case of a defenders finish. And if it hadn’t been for the fact that VAR officials decided to intervene to point out that Vardy is a cheating cunt, his impetuousness would have cost us a penalty as well. Yes Vardy dived but the reason we were in that position was because he came charging out and didn’t get the ball.

Saka is playing in front of Ben White therefore he’s basically having to get the ball from deep himself to make any attacking headway where as Martinelli is getting far more supply from Zinchenko on the left.

In the small time Tomoyasu was on the pitch you could see a complete change in Saka’s effectiveness but interesting how you the impartial observer never mention that.

:gp:

[I am invisible]

Love Ramsdale but I think he’s been quite erratic for a while now. I think that near post goal he conceded against Liverpool earlier this year shattered his confidence and he’s looked a bit unsure ever since. Quality keeper but just needs to regain some composure.


Could be more of a goalkeeping coaching issue than a problem with the player? I've been unimpressed with the standard of GK coaching at the club for a while now and I'm not sure how much I trust the current guy after he vouched for Runnarsson? You'd have thought things like being beaten at the near post would be a relatively easy thing to coach out of our keepers, but it seems to be a consistent theme going back years.

Not sure I blame Ramsdale too much for a lot of the "rashness" I see - some of it is him, but a lot of it looks like an inevitable consequence of the way we want to play. With the whole team pushing up higher our GK has to act as an 11th outfield player at times, and often has the unenviable choice of staying on his line and letting the striker run through on goal, or readying himself to rush out and sweep up. Also the way we want him to launch attacks quickly means that he's probably always sat there in a semi-frantic state with his adrenaline through the roof! The occasional heart-in-mouth moment might just be something that we have to get comfortable with as fans.

The way his confidence seems to ebb and flow is a worry, but I have a feeling that will eventually work itself as he starts to gain more and more faith in our ability to score goals - last year a goal conceded would almost certainly have meant valuable points dropped, but this season, with Jesus and co racking them up, maybe it won't be quite as consequential as it was. Give him the same backing that we've shown to Saliba and I think we can get him back to a happy place pretty quick.

[mandela8]

I didn't see the whole game but it does look like Ramsdale had a shocker

Tomi definitely connects better with Saka and his being back should be an improvement

He did. A factual 4/10.

As for Tomi returning, I don't really see how that instigates more effort from Saka. The simple truth is that, due to idiotic favoritism and fanboyism, he thinks he's made it.

He needs dropped, not just for the benefit of the team but to benefit himself as a stark reminder that he has a long way to go.

[fakeyank]

:haha: I love how full of shit you are

I love how it’s not sufficient for you to hold a ridiculous opinion but you have to claim that we’d all think the same as you if we were being honest.

He was quiet, it wasn’t a great game but the idea that he did any harm to our chances of getting all three points especially compared with Ramsdale is a joke.

No Saliba was put in the position by Ramsdale who should have called for him to leave it but when charging out and left Saliba to deal with a ball.
His save from Fofana wasn’t that great, it was more a case of a defenders finish. And if it hadn’t been for the fact that VAR officials decided to intervene to point out that Vardy is a cheating cunt, his impetuousness would have cost us a penalty as well. Yes Vardy dived but the reason we were in that position was because he came charging out and didn’t get the ball.

Saka is playing in front of Ben White therefore he’s basically having to get the ball from deep himself to make any attacking headway where as Martinelli is getting far more supply from Zinchenko on the left.

In the small time Tomoyasu was on the pitch you could see a complete change in Saka’s effectiveness but interesting how you the impartial observer never mention that.

:gp:

[Marc Overmars]

United on the verge of signing Casemiro.

Solid player but huge outlay on someone who’s probably had his best years now.

[Mac76]

United on the verge of signing Casemiro.

Solid player but huge outlay on someone who’s probably had his best years now.

I guess Eddie Howe's trying to buy in some more experience

[HCZ_Reborn]

United on the verge of signing Casemiro.

Solid player but huge outlay on someone who’s probably had his best years now.

The very definition of a panic buy. The problem is they’ve got a restive fan base who have until nine years ago been used to winning and competing for major silverware. Even having a go at the Glazers for their lack of spending if you can believe that.
Casemiro is a decent defensive midfielder but he’s not going to get them to play the way they want to be playing

[McNamara That Ghost...]

They couldn't get De Jong, they couldn't get Rabiot.

Now they go for Casemiro.

Does feel quite odd. Obviously had a great time with Real Madrid in the Champions League but it feels like such a short-sighted signing.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

https://www.manutd.com/en/news/detail/man-utd-confirm-agreement-with-real-madrid-for-transfer-of-casemiro?utm_campaign=ManUtd&utm_medium=post&utm_source=twitter

And it's done. :blink:

How much did they offer?

[HCZ_Reborn]

What fresh hell is this? :haha:


Casemiro is an excellent CDM it should be said arguably been one of Real Madrid’s best players for years. But 70 million for a player who is already 30 when the team needs a complete overhaul is insanity writ large

[I am invisible]

Where’s Gary Neville gone? I didn’t see him dancing with the Brentford fans last week and I’m not seeing his detailed breakdown of united’s transfer strategy? I guess he feels it’s so clear that maybe he doesn’t have to?

[I am invisible]

What an absolute basket-case of a club! The manager, the owners and the fans all want something different and they don’t know which way to turn. Ten Hag has his plan, but the owners can’t stop chasing the commercial signings that they’re addicted to. The fans accept that they’re looking at a 2-3 year restructuring and rebuild, but they also demand immediate results and are ready to call time on it after two bad games.

Paul on Arsenal Vision nailed it - they’re like a donkey caught between 3 different carrots on 3 different sticks and they’re going to end up starving to death, turning in circles, because they don’t know which one to go for.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Yep, whilst I’m not at all sold on the “process” in terms of Arteta being the visionary of that process, ultimately there’s no doubt in my mind that we’ve chosen the right method of bringing in young players and giving those from the academy who have shown promise a chance.
The thing is whether Arteta himself turns out to be a failure is immaterial to the direction we’ve chosen being the correct one.
And with United there is clearly a lack of leadership in terms of someone as you say choosing one of the carrots and being clear to the fans about what their intentions are.

[I am invisible]

Pepe to Nice on loan looking likely.

Not normally a fan of loans, but this one makes sense - get his value up, sell him next summer for anything more than nothing, which is pretty much where we are now.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Pepe to Nice on loan looking likely.

Not normally a fan of loans, but this one makes sense - get his value up, sell him next summer for anything more than nothing, which is pretty much where we are now.

I don’t rate Pepe

I think he has great technical ability but I think there’s just something not right there in terms of his work ethic

But if the choice is between having him at the club, and sending him out on loan but not replacing him I would rather keep him

So I hope if he is sent out on loan this is a pre-cursor to bringing someone in.

Despite the feverish rumours about Edu going to Spain to negotiate a deal with Villarreal for Pino, the truth is he’s on holiday

[I am invisible]

I don’t rate Pepe

I think he has great technical ability but I think there’s just something not right there in terms of his work ethic

But if the choice is between having him at the club, and sending him out on loan but not replacing him I would rather keep him

So I hope if he is sent out on loan this is a pre-cursor to bringing someone in.

Despite the feverish rumours about Edu going to Spain to negotiate a deal with Villarreal for Pino, the truth is he’s on holiday
Edu is 100% in Valencia on holiday - he has family and friends out there. That’s not a problem though - he can do his job from anywhere, as long as he has a phone signal and an internet connection. I remember everyone losing their shit last year because he posted a few Instas up of his BBQs, but we were still working on deals.

Don’t know where I stand on the latest round of names we’re being linked with? On the one hand Pino and Neto and co sound like exciting young players who could become something special and would add immediate depth, but when you look at the bid for Raphinha (and Jesus and Zinchenko / Martinez) the profiles don’t quite tally for me? I suspect we’re after someone who’s a little more ‘now’ - someone in their mid-20s who’s proven and ready to lead and will push for an immediate place in the starting XI. Trouble is if it’s not Raphinha then I’m really not sure who that player is, so maybe we’ll have to compromise on age and experience?

Pepe has to move on no matter what, though -
he’ll be a good player for someone, but he doesn’t fit our system and we clearly have no intention of using him, so this is doing no one any favours. Ideally we’d all like an immediate replacement to come in (and my gut feeling is Edu has probably already sounded someone out a long time ago), but I don’t want to see us making any panic-buys for the sake of it - the last thing we want is another long-term bad deal for the wrong player. I want the forward over the midfielder, but if the right player isn’t there then concentrate on the midfielder.

[HCZ_Reborn]

My point about Edu being on holiday was merely to say that his being in Valencia has nothing to do with Pino. Whether he can or can’t try and do deals on holiday is kind of academic because I believe he returns in a few days anyway

[selassie]

United on the verge of signing Casemiro.

Solid player but huge outlay on someone who’s probably had his best years now.

Panic buy, they are stuck with him on those huge wages now for what 4 or 5 years. He is the sort of signing that would have been perfect if the rest of your team is set and you want to add the final missing piece, problem with United is whilst they do on paper have a decent-ish side, there are still huge question marks over their Midfield, Defence and to a degree their Attack.

[selassie]

The very definition of a panic buy. The problem is they’ve got a restive fan base who have until nine years ago been used to winning and competing for major silverware. Even having a go at the Glazers for their lack of spending if you can believe that.
Casemiro is a decent defensive midfielder but he’s not going to get them to play the way they want to be playing

This.

If United had been winning stuff and their signings been successful they would not be mentioning the Glazers at all, Gary Neville and a majority of their fanbase are a bunch of morons. They throw money around like it's Confetti and then blame their owners when things don't work out. They have spent an absolute fortune post Fergie, it's not the owners fault that their Managers can't get a tune out of their players regardless of whether the money has come directly from the Glazers or not.

[I am invisible]

My point about Edu being on holiday was merely to say that his being in Valencia has nothing to do with Pino. Whether he can or can’t try and do deals on holiday is kind of academic because I believe he returns in a few days anyway
What’s your feel on this? Do you think we’ll see movement on someone once Pepe’s out?

[HCZ_Reborn]

What’s your feel on this? Do you think we’ll see movement on someone once Pepe’s out?

I don’t know because it’s kind of two questions. Is the intent there to bring in someone to replace him? I’d say yes but that is tempered by the fact that coaches when asked about player transfers always tend to take this “we only want players who will improve us” response. I mean first off that should be a universal attitude, second it’s the kind of thing a coach will say if the players they are after are not available to them at the price they want.
If we take Tielemans for example, it feels almost like we are prepared to wait until we can sign him for nothing a year down the line.
Pino I accept seems too expensive for a player that isn’t likely to be a first team starter same you’d imagine with Cody Gakpo.

So yes I think the intent is there but I think the consideration is that even if we don’t replace Pepe, we’d prefer Nice to pay his wages.

[I am invisible]

This.

If United had been winning stuff and their signings been successful they would not be mentioning the Glazers at all, Gary Neville and a majority of their fanbase are a bunch of morons. They throw money around like it's Confetti and then blame their owners when things don't work out. They have spent an absolute fortune post Fergie, it's not the owners fault that their Managers can't get a tune out of their players regardless of whether the money has come directly from the Glazers or not.
I’ve done A LOT of watching United fan channels over the last couple of weeks (seriously, the gift that keeps on giving), and tbf their gripe isn’t that the Glazers don’t spend money - it’s that they keep pissing the club’s own money up the wall because they haven’t got a plan and have never had a plan (beyond commercials).

Ultimately the buck stops with them. The football stuff might be handled by the managers they appoint, but you still need a clear vision and direction from the top. You need the right supporting people and structure in place to make it work. You need everyone pulling in the same direction towards the same goal. I’ve certainly noticed the difference it’s made having an engaged, interested KSE who are giving clear direction and are finally providing oversight, but the Glazers don’t look like they could give less of a fuck if they tried!

[HCZ_Reborn]

Hmmm not saying it’s a likely occurrence (Liverpool would have to be mad to sell a midfielder) but seeing rumours linking us with Naby Keita. For me totally under-utilised player at Liverpool, would love him here.

[I am invisible]

I don’t know because it’s kind of two questions. Is the intent there to bring in someone to replace him? I’d say yes but that is tempered by the fact that coaches when asked about player transfers always tend to take this “we only want players who will improve us” response. I mean first off that should be a universal attitude, second it’s the kind of thing a coach will say if the players they are after are not available to them at the price they want.
If we take Tielemans for example, it feels almost like we are prepared to wait until we can sign him for nothing a year down the line.
Pino I accept seems too expensive for a player that isn’t likely to be a first team starter same you’d imagine with Cody Gakpo.

So yes I think the intent is there but I think the consideration is that even if we don’t replace Pepe, we’d prefer Nice to pay his wages.
I have to assume the intent is there for the forward / winger - we’d have bought Raphinha in a cold minute if Barca and Chelsea hadn’t come in so it must just be a question of opportunity for that one.

I’m not really feeling the same urgency to get the midfielder, though - that one feels more like a ‘nice to have’, but I don’t think they’re going to stretch themselves to do it. (Also I’m wondering whether we might be holding some resources back if, for example, we suddenly find that we need to buy a new 6. For whatever reason?) But personal preferences and feelings about our current players aside, I think the club probably feel that there’s more options to shuffle the pack in that area, and with the inverted fullbacks bracketing the man at the base we might be a little better equipped to get away with it.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I tend to agree and this sums up why I have no faith in Arteta

The central midfield issue is one that has been glaring for years and every year we fail to address it. Though of course Emery and Wenger are just as guilty of this. Arguably we haven’t been able to control a game in the middle of the park going back to the days when Arteta was playing for us before his legs went and when we had Diaby fit (about 8-10 years ago)

A winger would be a nice to have, even though I definitely think Pepe being turfed out leaves Saka without cover on that right hand side and we know that premier league players have taken a liking to kicking him.

But at a stretch Vieira or Smith Rowe could play in that position.

Central midfield we aren’t potentially vulnerable we are vulnerable. We can just about get away with Xhaka at home or affecting a deep block against mid table teams away from home. I mentioned Keita about an hour ago now even though I think Tielemans is a better technical player, I think Keita would be exceptional for driving runs and next to Partey we actually could control the ball in the centre of the park against almost all teams.

Seems a better option than Arteta screaming at his players for not showing enough desire to win the ball but when in reality it’s the lack of ability to win the ball

[GP]

Ornstein says we're in for Pedro Neto

[HCZ_Reborn]

Ornstein says we're in for Pedro Neto

Likely to be a loan deal if we move Pepe out

If it’s only a loan I’m ok with it to be honest. My fondest hope is that we save all the pennies we have under the couch to get a central midfielder on deadline day

[Marc Overmars]

Bit underwhelming but he’s a winger that we need and could have a few more levels to his game given his age.

Also, is our plan to have an entire Portuguese speaking squad? :lol:

[selassie]

Ornstein says we're in for Pedro Neto

I really like him, happy about this. He looked a top class talent a few seasons back prior to his big injury. He has come back and looks to be doing well so I think this is potentially a very good signing. He is PL ready and developing here along with our other young talents will be a good place for him IMO.

[Gooner23]

Yeah I'd be very happy with Neto, just surprised we're in the mix given his potential cost.

[mandela8]

Neto would be quality. Looked a goal threat before his injury, in a very defensive team and Arsenal's number 1 priority has to be another goal threat. They simply don't have enough in the squad to challenge, at the moment.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Nothing wrong with a Portuguese from Wolves tbf.

They're boss.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Nothing wrong with a Portuguese from Wolves tbf.

They're boss.

I don’t know if it was your intention but you really made that sound like getting a “cheeky Nando’s”