summer '22 transfer craziness and stupidity

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

I don’t know if it was your intention but you really made that sound like getting a “cheeky Nando’s”:lol:

It was, tbf.

And also a realisation I probably need to get rid of Shaqiri :rose:

[I am invisible]

Neto would be quality. Looked a goal threat before his injury, in a very defensive team and Arsenal's number 1 priority has to be another goal threat. They simply don't have enough in the squad to challenge, at the moment.
Agree. Not sure what his goal output could be in a more adventurous side than wolves - let’s assume it’s more - but looking at him and looking at Raphinha I think the other key thing we’re looking to add is a duel-monster.

The fact that he plays more on the left, and the fact that we’ve been using Vieira on the right for the reserves makes me think that Martinelli is the man we’re training up to cover Jesus as the extra striker if we lose him for a stretch - I certainly can’t think of anyone else we could buy who’d be a closer match. Looks like he’s learning while he plays atm.

[Marc Overmars]

Auba to Chelsea looks likely.

A bit annoying because I’m sure he’ll score a fair few for them.

[I am invisible]

Auba to Chelsea looks likely.

A bit annoying because I’m sure he’ll score a fair few for them.
It’ll improve them, but it also means they’re not going for anyone better so I can live with it.

Haven’t Tuchel and Auba already fallen out in the past, or did I just imagine that?

[KSE Comedy Club]

Have we signed Neto & Tielemans yet?

[Marc Overmars]

Have we signed Neto & Tielemans yet?

Not with the likes of Pepe, Bellerin and Maitland-Niles still to get rid of.

[selassie]

Have we signed Neto & Tielemans yet?

I think we will struggle to sign either player if this FFP stuff is serious. We certainly need to move some bodies and quick.

[Globalgunner]

Not with the likes of Pepe, Bellerin and Maitland-Niles still to get rid of.

Nooo. Not the midfield maestro that is AMN. I recall posters waxing lyrical about this boy 3 or 4 seasons back.

Bellerin?. So nobody wants a Spain international?

[selassie]

Auba to Chelsea looks likely.

A bit annoying because I’m sure he’ll score a fair few for them.

It's a decent short term fix for them, but I think Chelsea have quite a few big issues in their team / squad to challenge for the title this season or push on to where they want to be. They are firmly in the fight for a top 4 finish with us, Spuds and Man United.

[I am invisible]

How much are UEFA asking for to decide that we’re ‘fair’?

[selassie]

How much are UEFA asking for to decide that we’re ‘fair’?

Apparently we are on the watchlist, whatever that means. The club believe we are compliant with FFP. I guess it means we can't keep on spending freely and that we need to further reduce our wage bill. One of our biggest issues the past few years has been the little we have picked up on player sales. This should change now that we have a squad full of mainly young talented players.

[dazthegooner]

How much are UEFA asking for to decide that we’re ‘fair’?

We will have to ask Citey and PSG and the likes for that.

[I am invisible]

Apparently we are on the watchlist, whatever that means. The club believe we are compliant with FFP. I guess it means we can't keep on spending freely and that we need to further reduce our wage bill. One of our biggest issues the past few years has been the little we have picked up on player sales. This should change now that we have a squad full of mainly young talented players.
We’ll be fine. From what I can gather this ‘watch list’ is based on last year’s figures and we’ve shit-canned a lot of high-earners and dead wood since then. I’m sure we’re getting close to the limits of what we can do without another round of departures now, but there’s still a few players we can lose, and what we’ve already done should be covered.

The reality is every big club probably sits on this watch list permanently - some journo is trying to make it sound like some kind of special investigation to get a story out of it, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s anything more than the football equivalent of submitting your company accounts to HMRC each year.

[Gooner23]

Pepe off to Nice on loan for the season, hopefully that frees up the space for Neto!

[Gooner23]

Pepe off to Nice on loan for the season, hopefully that frees up the space for Neto!

Confirmed now

[I am invisible]

Good luck to him - really hope he can revive his career there. He’ll be a good player for someone… just not us.

[Globalgunner]

Good luck to him - really hope he can revive his career there. He’ll be a good player for someone… just not us.

Not with Arteta in charge anyways he either loves you or detests the fact that you exist.

[Marc Overmars]

Fofana to Chelsea for 70m+ :blink:

This market is stupid, he’s not even been capped by France FFS.

Makes you wonder what someone would pay for Saliba.

[I am invisible]

Fofana to Chelsea for 70m+ :blink:

This market is stupid, he’s not even been capped by France FFS.

Makes you wonder what someone would pay for Saliba.
We might actually be able to break double-figure millions! With add ons, of course.

[Marc Overmars]

Gone a bit quiet on the transfer front.

Neto or Tielemans feels unlikely now unless we fork out silly money.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Gone a bit quiet on the transfer front.

Neto or Tielemans feels unlikely now unless we fork out silly money.

Despite Arteta claiming otherwise it’s clear FFP is the issue, I can’t see how it can’t be. A winger for me is a would be nice to have but without a proper central midfielder I think we are going to struggle for top four again. We saw yesterday that having Elneny in the side nullified our attacking threat…Odegaard did a decent job but far too often he wasn’t getting the ball quickly enough and that Fulham’s deep block was denying us space and options.
That combined with Xhaka being a liability means we are only ever an injury to Partey away from being in really difficult situation. It would help if as many people on here have pointed out Arteta knew how to rotate….and we’d potentially be able to get more out of Sambi Lokonga.
This could be a very tough and not very enjoyable season

[Mac76]

It would help if as many people on here have pointed out Arteta knew how to rotate….and we’d potentially be able to get more out of Sambi Lokonga.


definitely this, though i'm giving him some leeway just now, as taking advantage of the relatively kind early fixtures does to some extent justify playing the 'best' team (though i'd argue any team with Xhaka in it can't possibly be our best)

i'm waiting for the League Cup and early Europa ties - if he doesn't use those to try other players then he's truly learnt nothing

[I am invisible]

Gone a bit quiet on the transfer front.

Neto or Tielemans feels unlikely now unless we fork out silly money.
Still think we’re pushing hard for a winger, although I have no idea how high we’ll be able to go or whether we’ll be able to get it done. That’s still the priority for me over the CM.

Assuming Tielemans is still a target I can easily see us leaving that until January, if we don’t get a price we like - everything stops for the WC in mid-November anyway so it’s really not that many games to get through before we get to the January window when he’ll be down to 6 months.

[I am invisible]

definitely this, though i'm giving him some leeway just now, as taking advantage of the relatively kind early fixtures does to some extent justify playing the 'best' team (though i'd argue any team with Xhaka in it can't possibly be our best)

i'm waiting for the League Cup and early Europa ties - if he doesn't use those to try other players then he's truly learnt nothing
Same. We need to see a plan for Sambi this year because there’s a really interesting player there - hoping we use the early stages of all the cup competitions to fast-track him into one of the midfield roles.

Part of me is also wondering if we might be deliberately keeping players like Sambi and ESR and Eddie fresh for the 2nd half of the season when everyone comes back tired and broken from the WC? Hoping that’s gonna hit our rivals a lot harder than us with their older, more-experienced players who will hopefully be seeing a lot more international minutes than ours kids.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Injury to Elneny and the possibility that Partey might be out for a bit is bringing us to looking to sign a central midfielder.

Won’t be the kind of central midfielder we need of course but it shows you how ill prepared we are in that area in general

[Marc Overmars]

Partey regularly played 40+ games a season for Atleti but he’s just so unreliable for us. Typical.

Definitely need another CM but with 2 days to go it doesn’t look likely.

[Chippy]

Partey regularly played 40+ games a season for Atleti but he’s just so unreliable for us. Typical.

Definitely need another CM but with 2 days to go it doesn’t look likely.

And so the Arsenal we know and love (or tolerate) is back :rolleyes:

I fear a panic buy coming on!

[Marc Overmars]

United sign Antony for 85m.

[Chippy]

United sign Antony for 85m.

Who?

[selassie]

Fofana to Chelsea for 70m+ :blink:

This market is stupid, he’s not even been capped by France FFS.

Makes you wonder what someone would pay for Saliba.

Chelsea and United are doing a good job of screwing up the Market again with their over the top prices they are slapping down on players.

Saliba definitely goes for that price or more with a big fat contract!

[selassie]

And so the Arsenal we know and love (or tolerate) is back :rolleyes:

I fear a panic buy coming on!

I think we are done. I think we have targets but it seems we are not prepared to pay the fees to secure them. Neto and Tielemans being the names that spring to mind. The current prices in the market are nuts, prices are very high for players who IMO are nowhere near at the top of their game.

[IBK]

This is really worring news (Elneny now injured also). We were all worried about CM cover. This has reminded us that despite our spending we are vulnerable. Not panicking yet but this does take the gloss off our great start a bit...

[IBK]

This is really worring news (Elneny now injured also). We were all worried about CM cover. This has reminded us that despite our spending we are vulnerable. Not panicking yet but this does take the gloss off our great start a bit...

If Zinchenko's back - do we shift him into MF?

[mandela8]

If Zinchenko's back - do we shift him into MF?

I think that's a solid option, tbh. I've watched Zinchenko extensively (one entire match against poor opposition) in CM and he was fantastic. He was more box to box though so I don't see him as a replacement for Partey. Moving Xhaka there is scary as fuck, obviously but that's what Arteta will do, I reckon. Arteta won't start Zinchenko and Lokonga together. Xhaka WILL be in there somewhere with one of them.

[Chippy]

If Zinchenko's back - do we shift him into MF?

What about the new Vieria?

[mandela8]

I don't these injuries changes transfer plans though. Seems like Partey is only a couple of weeks and Elnonentity is just a back anyway.

The absolute priority must remain a goal threat winger. Only a prolific nonce will disagree with that.

[I am invisible]

Arsenal in CRISIS!!!

[HCZ_Reborn]

I don't these injuries changes transfer plans though. Seems like Partey is only a couple of weeks and Elnonentity is just a back anyway.

The absolute priority must remain a goal threat winger. Only a prolific nonce will disagree with that.

Maybe you shouldn’t project onto other people your own predilections towards children

The central midfield was the outstanding issue before these two got injured and anyone who wants us to go in against United without a holding midfielder is a bigger danger to children than Sidney Cook.

[selassie]

Arsenal in CRISIS!!!

Who would have thought Partey would get injured....I mean it's not like it's ever happened before! I've been banging on about Central Midfield all summer, we lack quality and decent depth in that area...here we are 4 games in scrambling around Europe now looking for solutions now that we have 2 Central Midfielders out injured.

Central Midfield should have been the priority position this summer!!!

[mandela8]

Who would have thought Partey would get injured....I mean it's not like it's ever happened before! I've been banging on about Central Midfield all summer, we lack quality and decent depth in that area...here we are 4 games in scrambling around Europe now looking for solutions now that we have 2 Central Midfielders out injured.

Central Midfield should have been the priority position this summer!!!

Are they scrambling though???

[I am invisible]

If Zinchenko's back - do we shift him into MF?
He kind of already plays there, tbh. That Partey role isn’t a lone midfield role anymore - it’s pretty much a midfield 3 when we’re in possession, with Zinchenko and White / Tomi bracketing the man in the middle. I wouldn’t feel quite as nervous about slipping Sambi in for Partey with those guys either side of him - with Tierney / Nuno and Cedric as your FBs, absolutely not, but Zinny and White / Tomi? It could give him the support he needs.

Or we could always revert a double-pivot again - we still have lots of combos for that. Would still feel better if we can find a ready-made replacement, but we’re a long way from out of options.

[mandela8]

They play 2 CMs and have 6 players.

Partey, Elnonentity, Lokonga

Xhaka, Zinchenko, Viera

There's a quality question here but not a numbers question.

A wide player must be the priority. Otherwise there will be low output Saka and Martinelli and injury prone ESR for 2 positions. Jesus will be out wide soon with Nketiah through the middle.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Vieira isn’t a central midfielder and neither is Zinchenko. Xhaka isn’t a holding midfielder, neither is Lokonga

We have zero, zero holding midfielders available for next few weeks

And that’s even before you get to the complete dirge of creativity in central midfield

I repeat only someone who has dodgier stuff on their laptop than Paul Francis Gadd could believe any position is more important than central midfield

[I am invisible]

Who would have thought Partey would get injured....I mean it's not like it's ever happened before! I've been banging on about Central Midfield all summer, we lack quality and decent depth in that area...here we are 4 games in scrambling around Europe now looking for solutions now that we have 2 Central Midfielders out injured.

Central Midfield should have been the priority position this summer!!!
Yeah I still think there’s plenty of options we can explore before we panic. Has it even been confirmed that TP is out long-term yet or are we just fearing the worst (genuine question - I’ve been out all day with the kids and haven’t checked the updates)?

This was always a much trickier signing for me than I think most people were giving it credit for, and it’s one that I haven’t really seen any decent links to so far (maybe that kid at Brighton, but that’s about it). If we’re looking for backup for Partey then that could be a tough sell for anyone other than another Elneny who’s happy to sit on the bench (and that’s not really the sort of player that solves any problem for me). If we’re looking at a young player with potential, well we already have Sambi. And if we’re looking for someone strong enough to actually challenge Partey and maybe even take his place then that’s even harder to find and it will come at cost.

Tielemans was never going to be a long-term fix for Partey being out for an extended period - he’s more of a Xhaka replacement, and I think that’s how most people were viewing him if we’re being honest. Sure, he gives us another option to play a double-pivot if Partey is out, but we already have several combos for that and it’s not something I think we’d want to revert to for more than a couple of games.

[mandela8]

Yeah I still think there’s plenty of options we can explore before we panic. Has it even been confirmed that TP is out long-term yet or are we just fearing the worst (genuine question - I’ve been out all day with the kids and haven’t checked the updates)?

This was always a much trickier signing for me than I think most people were giving it credit for, and it’s one that I haven’t really seen any decent links to so far (maybe that kid at Brighton, but that’s about it). If we’re looking for backup for Partey then that could be a tough sell for anyone other than another Elneny who’s happy to sit on the bench (and that’s not really the sort of player that solves any problem for me). If we’re looking at a young player with potential, well we already have Sambi. And if we’re looking for someone strong enough to actually challenge Partey and maybe even take his place then that’s even harder to find and it will come at cost.

Tielemans was never going to be a long-term fix for Partey being out for an extended period - he’s more of a Xhaka replacement, and I think that’s how most people were viewing him if we’re being honest. Sure, he gives us another option to play a double-pivot if Partey is out, but we already have several combos for that and it’s not something I think we’d want to revert to for more than a couple of games.

Exactly why I don't think these injuries change anything.

The Sky Sport insight patrol on here have just latched on to Tielemans not really understanding what they're talking about. A common problem for people who kick a ball like a toddler. And also molest toddlers.

No backup for Partey has never been discussed, so why the panic now he's injured for a couple of weeks?

The argument for CM was, and should be, improving on Xhaka. But that's not more important than a wide player who provides a threat, which is a glaring void in the team. And Arteta has clearly stated than Zinchenko and Viera can, and will, play that CM role sometimes.

[HCZ_Reborn]

A lack of nuance here from the type of person who regards Thomas Hamilton as their role model

Only a complete boy bothering degenerate fails to understand that for a central midfield to work it requires strength and the ability to win the ball back and to make the transition from defence to attack

It’s bad enough we don’t have the latter, now we have neither the latter or the former.

Yet someone who was clearly before escaping to America a scoutmaster caught out for showering with the boys…makes an offhand remark about Tieleman because they are so drunk and silly and preoccupied with underage males and the safe containing their burner drive full of child pornographic imagery. Without actually understanding that Tielemans was a requirement (a must) before the injury to Partey and Elneny and now we are in a position where we have neither a holding midfielder or someone who can be trusted in the transition phase against teams that can actually play football.

Again as if it needs saying again, only someone with the criminal priors of Stuart Hall can fail to recognise the absolute necessity of a central midfielder

[I am invisible]

Exactly why I don't think these injuries change anything.

The Sky Sport insight patrol on here have just latched on to Tielemans not really understanding what they're talking about. A common problem for people who kick a ball like a toddler. And also molest toddlers.

No backup for Partey has never been discussed, so why the panic now he's injured for a couple of weeks?

The argument for CM was, and should be, improving on Xhaka. But that's not more important than a wide player who provides a threat, which is a glaring void in the team. And Arteta has clearly stated than Zinchenko and Viera can, and will, play that CM role sometimes.
Yeah, the whole game has been turned on its head these last few years - forwards do most of the aggressive pressing and terrier work now, not the “DM”, and defenders and goalkeepers are the ones being hunted and pressed into mistakes. Everyone’s skill sets have crossed over with forwards needing to be able to track and tackle like a DM and defensive players needing composure, balance and control in tight spaces and strong passing skills (very close to what we used to look for in attacking midfielders).

Oddly enough, I don’t think Tielemens would be a terrible fit for the Partey role in terms of skills. People look at TP and where he plays and assume he’s a midfield destroyer, but that’s not really what he does for us or what makes him special. His superpowers are being able to take the ball under pressure, evade the press / turn his marker and either carry the ball out of defence or distribute quickly and decisively (he’s actually fairly average at ball-winning imo - decent, but not elite). Tielemens actually ticks quite a few of those boxes - my issue with him if we’re talking specifically about Partey cover is that he’d probably have to play in a two, and if we’re talking about a midfield two then does he really add a new option?

[mandela8]

Yeah, the whole game has been turned on its head these last few years - forwards do most of the aggressive pressing and terrier work now, not the “DM”, and defenders and goalkeepers are the ones being hunted and pressed into mistakes. Everyone’s skill sets have crossed over with forwards needing to be able to track and tackle like a DM and defensive players needing composure, balance and control in tight spaces and strong passing skills (very close to what we used to look for in attacking midfielders).

Oddly enough, I don’t think Tielemens would be a terrible fit for the Partey role in terms of skills. People look at TP and where he plays and assume he’s a midfield destroyer, but that’s not really what he does for us or what makes him special. His superpowers are being able to take the ball under pressure, evade the press / turn his marker and either carry the ball out of defence or distribute quickly and decisively (he’s actually fairly average at ball-winning imo - decent, but not elite). Tielemens actually ticks quite a few of those boxes - my issue with him if we’re talking specifically about Partey cover is that he’d probably have to play in a two, and if we’re talking about a midfield two then does he really add a new option?

Aye, agree with all that. I'd also add that Partey is the only midfielder who tries to play the ball through the lines too. He's just different quality to everyone else there.

I'd have no issue with Tielemans. I think he makes the squad better and, if a direct swap for Xhaka, the team better. But it's simply not as urgent a need as a wide player who can score/create.

[mandela8]

Arteta's comments on Zinchenko...

Arteta considers him an option in midfield.

Asked about the summer signing’s versatility, he said: “He’s one of the options [in midfield], we can use him as an attacking midfielder, a holding midfielder.

“Of course, he’s an option, he’s played there, I think he’s really good, really comfortable playing there as well, so, it’s great to have players that can give us that versatility.”

[selassie]

Are they scrambling though???

Last minute loan offer to PSG for Paredes. They accepted but the player wants to go to Juve. Juve are haggling as per normal, skint c*nts!

I guess my point is I think we should have been pro-active when it comes to Central Midfield, we are a a much weaker team without Partey.

[mandela8]

Last minute loan offer to PSG for Paredes. They accepted but the player wants to go to Juve. Juve are haggling as per normal, skint c*nts!

I guess my point is I think we should have been pro-active when it comes to Central Midfield, we are a a much weaker team without Partey.

Source?

I mean, I seen it too but seemed a bit click baity, man.

Arsenal have a couple of players injured...let's link to every semi available player of that position. Naw sure I'm buying it.

This is a team who didn't buy a striker. For the entire second half of a season because the ones they identified weren't available. Now we're supposed to believe they're "scrambling" to cover a 2 week(?) Injury???

Nah.

[mandela8]

Last minute loan offer to PSG for Paredes. They accepted but the player wants to go to Juve. Juve are haggling as per normal, skint c*nts!

I guess my point is I think we should have been pro-active when it comes to Central Midfield, we are a a much weaker team without Partey.

How many CMs do you think they need. As already pointed out, they have 6 players for those 2 positions and that doesn't even include people like AMN.

[selassie]

How many CMs do you think they need. As already pointed out, they have 6 players for those 2 positions and that doesn't even include people like AMN.

3 good ones is better than 5 average ones and a crap one. It’s not the numbers, it’s more the quality that’s an issue to me.

[selassie]

Source?

I mean, I seen it too but seemed a bit click baity, man.

Arsenal have a couple of players injured...let's link to every semi available player of that position. Naw sure I'm buying it.

This is a team who didn't buy a striker. For the entire second half of a season because the ones they identified weren't available. Now we're supposed to believe they're "scrambling" to cover a 2 week(?) Injury???

Nah.

Who do you think Arteta sees as options for CM?

[mandela8]

3 good ones is better than 5 average ones and a crap one. It’s not the numbers, it’s more the quality that’s an issue to me.

Ahh, well I'm with you there. I've already said there's a quality argument but not a numbers argument. But the injuries to Partey and Elnonentity don't really push the quality argument anymore than where we were yesterday. The club ain't buying a player the level of Partey as it's cost too much (and he's only out for a couple weeks) and Elnonentity is fuckin shite anyway and literally any player in the squad, including that yank goalkeeper, could come in and do what he does in CM.

[mandela8]

Who do you think Arteta sees as options for CM?

Arteta has already said Zinchenko can play there (attacking and holding MF) and he also stated "When Viera plays there" talking about Xhaka's position.

That's what he's said, it's not my opinion or interpretation, man. He literally said it.

He's also played Lokonga in the DM position before too, so even with Partey and Elnonentity out he still has Lokonga, Xhaka, Zinchenko and Viera.

[IBK]

3 good ones is better than 5 average ones and a crap one. It’s not the numbers, it’s more the quality that’s an issue to me.

Yet we've strenghtened since last year, when we only just missed out on top 4 - and TP was injured for huge parts of the season also. Look, I also have the 'Arsenal' condition of being pessimistic - and God knows its understandable given our fall from the top and the turmoil of the past few years but the way I see it, we have the WC in November (and are already at September). Then a transfer window opens in January. If we can't get the player(s) we have targeted before 2 September I can see the sense in not just signing anyone - we have been down this route before. I feel nervous too but lets not despair just yet...

[Mac76]

I was feeling rwally good after the first three games but came away from the Fulham one with some trepidation, albeit we did show character to win.

Arteta's faults are still there, underusing subs, thinking Xhaka should wear an Arsenal shirt, ignoring some useful players (anyone see how Tavares is scoring for fun now he's free of Arteta's undermining management style?) etc

Happy to be proved wrong but we need to beat Villa soundly and get at least a point at Old Shiteford to show we're serious

[I am invisible]

Aye, agree with all that. I'd also add that Partey is the only midfielder who tries to play the ball through the lines too. He's just different quality to everyone else there.

I'd have no issue with Tielemans. I think he makes the squad better and, if a direct swap for Xhaka, the team better. But it's simply not as urgent a need as a wide player who can score/create.
He’s the only midfielder who does that, but a big focus of all our recent recruitment has been putting together a group of defenders (and a GK) who can all do it too. Whoever the ball falls to in that defensive 6 now, we move it to the forwards as quickly and directly as possible - it falls to Partey, it goes straight to the forwards… it falls to White or Zinchenko, it goes straight to the forwards… it falls to Saliba or Gabriel, it goes straight to the forwards… it falls to Ramsdale, it goes straight to the forwards. Sometimes we’ll still have to go the long way round, but a lot of the time we’ll just bypass midfield completely.

Elneny as Partey-cover was never going to be exciting, but I could have lived with it if he hadn’t picked up this freak injury - I don’t think sticking with him was negligent or a gross oversight. He can’t do what Partey does, but we didn’t really need him to (and tbh I think he would have got in trouble if he’d tried) - all he really had to do was keep it simple, hold his position and make one extra pass to hand it off to one of those other defensive quarterbacks, or maybe make a shorter pass to one of our 8s who might have had to drop s little deeper. It would have slowed us down a little when it fell to him, but there’s other ways we could have built attacks.

Agree about the wide player (or at least I did before we lost Elneny - it’s more 50/50 on priority for me now). Aside from adding competition and cover (and hopefully goals) to our current wide options, my main reason for wanting that player is it frees up Martinelli to cover Jesus - the striker market looks dead this summer and I can’t see a more natural, like-for-like replacement that’s available anywhere in terms of the energy and tenacity he brings to the front line. We lose that energy and we really are a different team again.

[Letters]

I was feeling rwally good after the first three games but came away from the Fulham one with some trepidation, albeit we did show character to win.

Arteta's faults are still there, underusing subs, thinking Xhaka should wear an Arsenal shirt, ignoring some useful players (anyone see how Tavares is scoring for fun now he's free of Arteta's undermining management style?) etc

Happy to be proved wrong but we need to beat Villa soundly and get at least a point at Old Shiteford to show we're serious

I honestly think we need to stop over-reacting to individual results/performances. In any season you're going to get great results and performances and days where it all goes to shit. Happens to every club.
Sometimes you can play brilliantly and still not get a result - City last season, in All or Nothing I was once again reminded how we were robbed that day. Other days you don't play that well but still get a result somehow, the Fulham game was one of those. Let's see where we are at Christmas.

[Marc Overmars]

I think Arteta will have no choice but to show some faith in Lokonga. I haven’t been particularly impressed with him but he’s a CM by trade and needs to be given a shot. I would start him tonight tbh.

[selassie]

Arteta has already said Zinchenko can play there (attacking and holding MF) and he also stated "When Viera plays there" talking about Xhaka's position.

That's what he's said, it's not my opinion or interpretation, man. He literally said it.

He's also played Lokonga in the DM position before too, so even with Partey and Elnonentity out he still has Lokonga, Xhaka, Zinchenko and Viera.

That Midfield quartet you posted is largely untested. Xhaka and Zinchenko is passable, but Viera has not played a minute for us yet and Lokonga hasn't really developed in the way I would have liked. Compare our Midfield to our rivals challenging for top 4, right now it doesn't look great.

Its not about panicking, it's about bringing in quality additions to an area of the team that needs it.

[Mac76]

I honestly think we need to stop over-reacting to individual results/performances. In any season you're going to get great results and performances and days where it all goes to shit. Happens to every club.
Sometimes you can play brilliantly and still not get a result - City last season, in All or Nothing I was once again reminded how we were robbed that day. Other days you don't play that well but still get a result somehow, the Fulham game was one of those. Let's see where we are at Christmas.

I agree everyone can have a bad day, it's just a concern when it seems as though long-standing problems are still there, which could point to real issues if true

[selassie]

I was feeling rwally good after the first three games but came away from the Fulham one with some trepidation, albeit we did show character to win.

Arteta's faults are still there, underusing subs, thinking Xhaka should wear an Arsenal shirt, ignoring some useful players (anyone see how Tavares is scoring for fun now he's free of Arteta's undermining management style?) etc

Happy to be proved wrong but we need to beat Villa soundly and get at least a point at Old Shiteford to show we're serious

Feel the same, minus the Xhaka bit ;)

[Mac76]

I think Arteta will have no choice but to show some faith in Lokonga. I haven’t been particularly impressed with him but he’s a CM by trade and needs to be given a shot. I would start him tonight tbh.

if Lokonga, AMN, Tavares, Pepe and others had been given all the chances Xhaka has, they'd all be established and making a real contribution by now, but Arteta's undermining of each one of them has cost us time and money and wasted those players' time

[HCZ_Reborn]

It looks like Zinchenko is in full training which suggests he might play tonight. Of course no one who has a brain can think that being able to cut inside to clear up the mess Xhaka invariably makes, makes you a central midfielder. For tonight we should go with Lokonga and that Albanian Cunt. It will be disastrous but given we are playing Villa we might just be able to sneak a draw (not blaming Lokonga he’s not a holding midfielder and it’s not his fault that Cunt Arteta won’t play him)

Before Sunday we must go into the transfer market for a central midfielder, any other position is irrelevant compared to that

I’d prefer Tielemans in a perfect world but with Partey crocked and Elneny hopefully out forever we need to gamble and buy a midfielder who can both hold the ball and run with it….given our budget it will have to be someone of limited technical ability which will hamper our chances of getting top four. But frankly we are in a position where our best hope for getting it will rely on Chelsea getting results like last night, it’s not in our hands.

[I am invisible]

Who do you think Arteta sees as options for CM?
CM as in the Partey part of CM?

If we’re looking at keeping the exact same formation then you’re looking at Lokonga, Xhaka or White coming in for Partey - the important thing here is they’d be bracketed by Zinchenko and either White or Tomi as the inverted FBs so it would effectively be a midfield three for much of the game. (Zinchenko could also play the Partey role, but we’d then lose our inverted FB on that side so I don’t know if I’m as keen on that option. Maybe Tomi could play inverted LB, but that starts to feel like too many unnecessary changes.)

If we’re looking at reverting to a double-pivot then it’s going to be Xhaka-Zinchenko, Xhaka-Lonkonga or Zinchenko-Lokonga. Tierney at LB would work fine in that setup, with Gabriel, Saliba and White sliding across to make a back three.

None of it will probably work quite as well as having all our first choice options in their usual places, but this is what cover looks like. Personally, I think stuff like this is what makes the game interesting! Should be the first proper test of this leaner, more flexible squad we’ve been building.

[selassie]

CM as in the Partey part of CM?

If we’re looking at keeping the exact same formation then you’re looking at Lokonga, Xhaka or White coming in for Partey - the important thing here is they’d be bracketed by Zinchenko and either White or Tomi as the inverted FBs so it would effectively be a midfield three for much of the game. (Zinchenko could also play the Partey role, but we’d then lose our inverted FB on that side so I don’t know if I’m as keen on that option. Maybe Tomi could play inverted LB, but that starts to feel like too many unnecessary changes.)

If we’re looking at reverting to a double-pivot then it’s going to be Xhaka-Zinchenko, Xhaka-Lonkonga or Zinchenko-Lokonga. Tierney at LB would work fine in that setup, with Gabriel, Saliba and White sliding across to make a back three.

None of it will probably work quite as well as having all our first choice options in their usual places, but this is what cover looks like. Personally, I think stuff like this is what makes the game interesting! Should be the first proper test of this leaner, more flexible squad we’ve been building.

Aye, CM as in Partey.

I'll be honest the Midfield without Partey does worry me. Games like Fulham the other day and maybe tonight we should have just enough, but forget about it going into a game against a top half side, I think we will struggle in Midfield.

On paper the Midfield looks alright, but we struggle to get consistent performances out of the Midfield Partey and Xhaka aside. I guess part of that is to do with nobody else really getting games unless we have injuries to those two. Though to be fair, Zinchenko we haven't seen yet in Midfield.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Aye, CM as in Partey.

I'll be honest the Midfield without Partey does worry me. Games like Fulham the other day and maybe tonight we should have just enough, but forget about it going into a game against a top half side, I think we will struggle in Midfield.

On paper the Midfield looks alright, but we struggle to get consistent performances out of the Midfield Partey and Xhaka aside. I guess part of that is to do with nobody else really getting games unless we have injuries to those two. Though to be fair, Zinchenko we haven't seen yet in Midfield.

Maybe because Zinchenko isn’t a midfielder he’s a left wing back who can play in left midfield. For Man City he’s never played in central midfield and only seldom does for Ukraine.

We needed a Tielemans player before Partey and Elneny were inured we now need a Tielemans and a competent holding midfielder. That we are in this position on August 31st shows the extent of the incompetence of Arteta and Edu. Getting rid of Xhaka and Elneny should have been the top priority. And then bought in two midfielders to replace them.

If we hadn’t wasted money on Skeet Ulrich I’d have prioritised a winger after a striker.

And then we come back to Zinchenko, for me the only reason we could countenance that signing is selling Tierney and having Tavares as his back up.

Another summer with money spaffed up the wall. With the exception of Gabriel Jesus it’s been wasted

[mandela8]

That Midfield quartet you posted is largely untested. Xhaka and Zinchenko is passable, but Viera has not played a minute for us yet and Lokonga hasn't really developed in the way I would have liked. Compare our Midfield to our rivals challenging for top 4, right now it doesn't look great.

Its not about panicking, it's about bringing in quality additions to an area of the team that needs it.

Again, no issue improving the quality of CM but anyone who thinks it's in more need of an upgrade than the wide positions is simply fuckin mental.

And Lokonga has played nearly 100 games in his career and is capped for Belgium. He's not unproven, at all. He's unplayed by Arteta. That's entirely different to untested, man.

[mandela8]

He’s the only midfielder who does that, but a big focus of all our recent recruitment has been putting together a group of defenders (and a GK) who can all do it too. Whoever the ball falls to in that defensive 6 now, we move it to the forwards as quickly and directly as possible - it falls to Partey, it goes straight to the forwards… it falls to White or Zinchenko, it goes straight to the forwards… it falls to Saliba or Gabriel, it goes straight to the forwards… it falls to Ramsdale, it goes straight to the forwards. Sometimes we’ll still have to go the long way round, but a lot of the time we’ll just bypass midfield completely.

Elneny as Partey-cover was never going to be exciting, but I could have lived with it if he hadn’t picked up this freak injury - I don’t think sticking with him was negligent or a gross oversight. He can’t do what Partey does, but we didn’t really need him to (and tbh I think he would have got in trouble if he’d tried) - all he really had to do was keep it simple, hold his position and make one extra pass to hand it off to one of those other defensive quarterbacks, or maybe make a shorter pass to one of our 8s who might have had to drop s little deeper. It would have slowed us down a little when it fell to him, but there’s other ways we could have built attacks.

Agree about the wide player (or at least I did before we lost Elneny - it’s more 50/50 on priority for me now). Aside from adding competition and cover (and hopefully goals) to our current wide options, my main reason for wanting that player is it frees up Martinelli to cover Jesus - the striker market looks dead this summer and I can’t see a more natural, like-for-like replacement that’s available anywhere in terms of the energy and tenacity he brings to the front line. We lose that energy and we really are a different team again.

I think you're massively overstating the ability of anyone other than Partey to do it. They're all fuckin shit in comparison.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Again, no issue improving the quality of CM but anyone who thinks it's in more need of an upgrade than the wide positions is simply fuckin mental.

And Lokonga has played nearly 100 games in his career and is capped for Belgium. He's not unproven, at all. He's unplayed by Arteta. That's entirely different to untested, man.

I know because you’re a massive pussy you avoid directly replying to me but what the fuck are you on about.

Lokonga played over 100 games (two thirds for Anderlecht) and capped for Belgium…he has won one cap for Belgium. Leandro Trossard has 16 would you play him for Arsenal?

I agree that the main issue is Arteta not playing him but regardless of the reason that makes him untested at the highest level.

Your obsession with Saka aside, the winger was always a be nice to have. And again if you have issue with us not signing one you should have asked Arteta why he spunked thirty million up the wall on Vieira

Unless you have wing backs like Liverpool have where you can bypass your midfield, central midfield is the most important area on the pitch. You dictate the game from central midfield and we haven’t dictated the midfield since Fabregas left 11 years ago.
Now Partey has excellent skills but you compare him to our best midfield pairing (Gilberto and Vieira) he is more Gilberto than Vieira. And our new Vieira couldn’t even begin to do for us what his namesake did.

Given Wenger used to from time to time lump that useless cunt Ramsey on the right I’m not really sold on the absolute necessity of a winger now. If anything from an attacking sense we could do with a tall physical striker to mix it up as Eddie N and Jesus are too similar.

[Chippy]

I know because you’re a massive pussy you avoid directly replying to me but what the fuck are you on about.

Lokonga played over 100 games (two thirds for Anderlecht) and capped for Belgium…he has won one cap for Belgium. Leandro Trossard has 16 would you play for Arsenal?

I agree that the main issue is Arteta not playing him but regardless of the reason that makes him untested at the highest level.

Your obsession with Saka aside, the winger was always a be nice to have. And again if you have issue with us not signing one you should have asked Arteta why he spunked thirty million up the wall on Vieira

Unless you have wing backs like Liverpool have where you can bypass your midfield, central midfield is the most important area on the pitch. You dictate the game from central midfield and we haven’t dictated the midfield since Fabregas left 11 years ago.
Now Partey has excellent skills but you compare him to our best midfield pairing (Gilberto and Vieira) he is more Gilberto than Vieira. And our new Vieira couldn’t even begin to do for us what his namesake did.

Given Wenger used to from time to time lump that useless cunt Ramsey on the right I’m not really sold on the absolute necessity of a winger now. If anything from an attacking sense we could do with a tall physical striker to mix it up as Eddie N and Jesus are too similar.

:gp:
Especially the bit about the money wasted on the injured Vieria.

[selassie]

Again, no issue improving the quality of CM but anyone who thinks it's in more need of an upgrade than the wide positions is simply fuckin mental.

And Lokonga has played nearly 100 games in his career and is capped for Belgium. He's not unproven, at all. He's unplayed by Arteta. That's entirely different to untested, man.

Im simply fuckin mental then. Out wide at the very least we have ESR who is a very capable 3rd choice wide player, his numbers and performances last season back that up. At a push, Jesus can play there as can Viera.

Lokonga has had plenty of game time for us, he is a passive player, hides from responsibility and plays it safe. He's basically a developing version of Elneny. :lol:

Central Midfield is basically just Partey and Xhaka and at a push Elneny. Who else do we have in this position who can contribute now? We are aiming to finish above Spurs, Chelsea and United right?

[mandela8]

Im simply fuckin mental then.

Glad we've been able to conclude this amicably, mate.

[selassie]

Glad we've been able to conclude this amicably, mate.

Ah we have an "Internet" hard man. :rolleyes:

Schools are back tomorrow aren't they?

[HCZ_Reborn]

Ah we have an "Internet" hard man. :rolleyes:

Schools are back tomorrow aren't they?

Yeah but he’s no pupil, he likes to stand by the gates with his flies unzipped

[mandela8]

Ah we have an "Internet" hard man. :rolleyes:

Schools are back tomorrow aren't they?

Not trying to be hard, man. Although I am hard as utter fuck, tbf.

We're just going round in circles. You think a CM is a priority because of a lack of quality. I agree...but don't think it's as important as a wide player as there's a lack of quality AND a lack of numbers there.

We can just continue saying the same things if you want though.

[KSE Comedy Club]

I think we should sign 4 more CB's as we are looking a but thin in that area now based on past personnel numbers.

[Letters]

We can just continue saying the same things if you want though.
Please do. That's pretty much kept GW going over the last 10 years.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Uhuh.

:console:

[Marc Overmars]

We’re trying to terminate Bellerin’s contract. :lol:

Surely we can get a few pennies for him? Again, it’s crazy how little we get for departing players.

AMN linked with Southampton on loan too.

[HCZ_Reborn]

We’re trying to terminate Bellerin’s contract. :lol:

Surely we can get a few pennies for him? Again, it’s crazy how little we get for departing players.

AMN linked with Southampton on loan too.


A lot of the issue is player wages, if you take a player on loan you can maybe handle paying their wages for a year but after that it’s more of a commitment. This is why I think an otherwise decent midfielder like Torreira hasn’t gone to a bigger club

The other issue is when a club wants rid of a player they become less of an attractive prospect, Bellerin injury prone aside is probably worth 20million at least but a combination that the selling club wants him off its books and a potential buyer like Barcelona clearly has issues with its wage bills makes it a difficult proposition

[I am invisible]

I think you're massively overstating the ability of anyone other than Partey to do it. They're all fuckin shit in comparison.
I wasn’t commenting on individual ability-levels at all - that’s all you, dude. Your point was that Partey is our only midfielder who even *tries* to play the ball through the lines, implying that we lose that option completely without him - my point was that, whilst that might be true of our midfielders, our defenders and keeper also *try* those passes with regularity. You might not rate their ability to execute as highly as Partey’s - that’s a different conversation - but none of them shirk the responsibility or take the coward's way out, looking for someone else when those passes open up for them. They all take them on.

[I am invisible]

Danilo and Mudryk look like the strongest links going into the final day.

Honestly, all of the usual trusted sources look all over the place, so I haven’t got a clue whether we get either (or anything) done. I really don’t think the club will be panicked into anything though - we proved that in January when the squad was in a far more desperate state.

[Marc Overmars]

Chelsea have bid 43m for Edson Alvarez from Ajax.

I’m sure their new owner thinks he’s playing Football Manager.

[Chippy]

Chelsea have bid 43m for Edson Alvarez from Ajax.

I’m sure their new owner thinks he’s playing Football Manager.

No different to Uncle Roman then <_<

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Chelsea in talks with Auba too.

Wonder if they can get past Forest's 18 players coming in before the transfer window SLAMS SHUT.

[Chippy]

Danilo and Mudryk look like the strongest links going into the final day.

Honestly, all of the usual trusted sources look all over the place, so I haven’t got a clue whether we get either (or anything) done. I really don’t think the club will be panicked into anything though - we proved that in January when the squad was in a far more desperate state.

No point in panic buying because we will be in the current situation in three years time trying to offload the shit players. We still have shit players that we can't get rid of from yesteryear.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Chelsea have bid 43m for Edson Alvarez from Ajax.

I’m sure their new owner thinks he’s playing Football Manager.

Probably felt sorry for Tuchel after his comments about not having much squad depth the other night.

[Marc Overmars]

Linked with Douglas Luiz. :lol:

At this stage I’m sure we’re just seen as a viable destination for any Portuguese speaking player.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Linked with Douglas Luiz. :lol:

At this stage I’m sure we’re just seen as a viable destination for any Portuguese speaking player.

do que diabos você está falando???

[Letters]

do que diabos você está falando???

Thunderbolts and lightening, very very frightening me? :unsure:

[I am invisible]

Linked with Douglas Luiz. :lol:

At this stage I’m sure we’re just seen as a viable destination for any Portuguese speaking player.
I know what I hate… and I don’t hate this?

You’re probably right, though - I’d be surprised if there was anything more to this than ‘he’s Brazilian’ and ‘he’s fresh in everyone’s minds because he was at the Emirates last night.’

[I am invisible]

Thunderbolts and lightening, very very frightening me? :unsure:
:lol:

[HCZ_Reborn]

I know what I hate… and I don’t hate this?

You’re probably right, though - I’d be surprised if there was anything more to this than ‘he’s Brazilian’ and ‘he’s fresh in everyone’s minds because he was at the Emirates last night.’

He was on the bench because he’s likely to be sold as he wants out. That of course doesn’t mean he will go to us. But we’ve been linked with him before and if we have the money (if doing a lot of heavy lifting) he’s exactly the kind of player we should go for.
If we had a midfield of him and Tielemans would be immense, it’s exactly the kind of midfield we should have given the vast sums we’ve spunked up the wall. What about Partey you say? Fuck Partey he clearly can’t hack the premier league given how constantly he gets injured

[Marc Overmars]

One year left on his deal too. Could be a decent option in terms of value for money and the fact he’s PL ready.

Hope something happens though, definitely feel like need at least one more to keep us ticking over until January.

[Marc Overmars]

Ornstein says we’ve made an offer for Luiz. :popcorn:

Villa don’t want to sell but he wants to leave. Hopefully they cave in.

In other news, AMN has gone to Southampton.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Would be happy with that have to say. Though I think arguably personnel wise we’d have one too many central midfielders…we only need four for two positions. Elneny needs to be junked, and hopefully Xhaka fucks off in the summer. If in a years time we had a central midfield four of Luiz, Tielemans, Lokonga and Partey…I’d argue only city would have a better midfield than us.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Hmm, that's an interesting one.

Funny as last night at the end of the game, the cameras showed him and Jesus on the pitch talking with their hands covering their mouths.
I was joking with my boy that he was saying 'come and join us' !! :d

[I am invisible]

One year left on his deal too. Could be a decent option in terms of value for money and the fact he’s PL ready.

Hope something happens though, definitely feel like need at least one more to keep us ticking over until January.
Ticks a lot of the boxes i’m looking for in a CM, would have that instant connection surrounded by the 3 Gabriels, and tbh we’re probably not going to find a more instantly Prem-ready option at this stage.

Wasn’t he at City at the same time as Arteta? This could be really seamless.

[Marc Overmars]

Ticks a lot of the boxes i’m looking for in a CM, would have that instant connection surrounded by the 3 Gabriels, and tbh we’re probably not going to find a more instantly Prem-ready option at this stage.

Wasn’t he at City at the same time as Arteta? This could be really seamless.

Didn’t even realise he was bought by City tbh.

Arteta would have worked with him so yeah this is starting to make a lot of sense. City’s recruitment is the best in the business and from what I’ve read it was only work permit issues that prevented him from playing for them. Could be a really smart move if we can pull it off.

[I am invisible]

Didn’t even realise he was bought by City tbh.

Arteta would have worked with him so yeah this is starting to make a lot of sense. City’s recruitment is the best in the business and from what I’ve read it was only work permit issues that prevented him from playing for them. Could be a really smart move if we can pull it off.
Ok, I’m in! When does he sign?

[Chippy]

Ok, I’m in! When does he sign?

He won't.

[KSE Comedy Club]

He only has 1 year left on his contract so there is a chance Villa will have to sell

[I am invisible]

He only has 1 year left on his contract so there is a chance Villa will have to sell
Will probably hinge on whether Villa can find a replacement (and whether the club they’re buying from can find a replacement, etc)…

[KSE Comedy Club]

Villa have just had a bid accepted by Wolves for a midfielder......

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/19556868/arsenal-transfer-news-live-douglas-luiz-mudryk-zaha-danilo/


11 MINUTES AGO
Villa bid for Dendoncker accepted

Leander Dendoncker’s exit from Molineux is fast approaching with Aston Villa now understood to have had a £12.9m accepted.

Wolves have reluctantly agreed to allow the Belgian midfielder to leave with just one year remaining on his contract.

West Ham and Everton are also understood to be interested in the 27-year-old.

Whether Dendoncker’s arrival will prove to be basis for Villa accepting a bid for Douglas Luiz remains to be seen.

Interesting.

[cricketsi]

He's Brazilian and his middle name is Gabriel, this one is definitely happening.

[Marc Overmars]

Villa have just had a bid accepted by Wolves for a midfielder......

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/19556868/arsenal-transfer-news-live-douglas-luiz-mudryk-zaha-danilo/



Interesting.

Well if Villa have a replacement coming in you have to be quite optimistic now. :popcorn:

[Chippy]

He's Brazilian and his middle name is Gabriel, this one is definitely happening.

Just another squad player IMHO.

[I am invisible]

He's Brazilian and his middle name is Gabriel, this one is definitely happening.
I mean, that was literally the final ‘t’ that needed crossing.

[mandela8]

From what Arteta said last night, it seems Partey's injury is more serious than a couple of weeks.

Pretty disasterous.

[I am invisible]

When is it not with Partey?

[Marc Overmars]

Pretty standard for Partey. Can’t be relied on, nowhere near robust enough.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Pretty disastrous us having signed him in the first place. Don’t get me wrong obviously a very good player when fit, but could easily have said the same about Jack Wilshere.
Of course it’s easy to be wise in hindsight he clearly didn’t have these injury problems at Atletico but it does point out the difference in physicality and intensity between La Liga and the premier league.
On a similar vein, thats why I’m so heavily critical of Granit Xhaka, he’s clearly not a player without ability but he is a player that was not meant for this league…I honestly think he’d get into most Bundesliga teams (with the obvious exception of Bayern Munich) and this is why I was aghast when we didn’t sell him to Hertha Berlin two years ago

[Marc Overmars]

Xhaka is capable of playing 40+ games a season though, might explain why he’s consistently picked because he’s always available while others around are made of toast.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Xhaka is capable of playing 40+ games a season though, might explain why he’s consistently picked because he’s always available while others around are made of toast.

Thus why I said similar

His fitness levels aren’t in question, but he lacks the physical strength, acceleration or technical ability to make it either as a DM or a box to box midfielder. He’s often caught in possession because he seems to need time to control the ball or pick out a pass that you just don’t get in the premier league. He’s an excellent long passer of the ball, the only other player I remember having such success finding players with a 40-60 yard pass was Fabregas.
I’m sure his fitness levels are a reason why he gets picked but his getting picked is also a big reason why we lose games like Newcastle where they were in our faces from the kick off harried us all over the pitch. Of course Xhaka wasn’t individually responsible for us losing, but he’s a good example of a player that becomes a luxury we can’t afford when we need players who can withstand that intensity

[Marc Overmars]

Douglas Luiz is happy to sign by all accounts, depends on Villa and the 20m fee.

Also, Bellerin should be off to Barcelona once his deal is torn up here.

[Chippy]

Pretty standard for Partey. Can’t be relied on, nowhere near robust enough.

Sell him. He's shit and always injured.

[I am invisible]

Xhaka isn’t a player you can just drop into any team and any system with any old players around him - at the base of midfield, with slow, non-ball-playing CBs behind him and miles of space between defence and attack he’s going to be a liability, and unfortunately for him that’s been Arsenal for most of his time here. This current setup seems to suit him down to the ground though - the space in the middle is compressed, he has players behind him he can trust to start moves and mop up so he doesn’t have to keep sticking his nose in where he shouldn’t, and JdP in general is all about rotation, covering and positional discipline, all of which is a great fit for his game.

One unexpected bonus has been the surprise factor he’s adding this season - no one seems to rate him as any particular threat in his current role and we’ve caught opponents with their pants down several times now as he’s ghosted into shooting positions relatively unchallenged. I’m sure teams will wise up to that at some point, but right now it’s a cheap trick we can keep using.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Xhaka isn’t a player you can just drop into any team and any system with any old players around him - at the base of midfield, with slow, non-ball-playing CBs behind him and miles of space between defence and attack he’s going to be a liability, and unfortunately for him that’s been Arsenal for most of his time here. This current setup seems to suit him down to the ground though - the space in the middle is compressed, he has players behind him he can trust to start moves and mop up so he doesn’t have to keep sticking his nose in where he shouldn’t, and JdP in general is all about rotation, covering and positional discipline, all of which is a great fit for his game.

One unexpected bonus has been the surprise factor he’s adding this season - no one seems to rate him as any particular threat in his current role and we’ve caught opponents with their pants down several times now as he’s ghosted into shooting positions relatively unchallenged. I’m sure teams will wise up to that at some point, but right now it’s a cheap trick we can keep using.

I don’t know I kind of feel you’re making excuses for him. Even if you’re correct none of that changes my assertion that he’s. Luxury player that we can ill afford. But it’s more than that, I do agree that too many of our centre backs in the past have been immobile and uncomfortable on the ball (Gabriel Magahat is whilst strong and reasonably quick not good with ball to feet).
But too often he gives the ball away even if there is no pressure let alone when there is. I can’t abide that. Look at the game against Bournemouth and the amount of times Zinchenko had to put out the fires he started.
Villa the irony was that Kamarra was so shit that Xhaka managed to dispossess him but he is not quick, strong or good enough in possession to be anything but a liability when we play decent sides.
Every time we play one of the supposed big five I come out in a cold sweat thinking of how he could undo all our good work with one careless sideways pass.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Douglas Luiz is happy to sign by all accounts, depends on Villa and the 20m fee.

Also, Bellerin should be off to Barcelona once his deal is torn up here.

They have rejected our initial offer of £20m and remain firm in their stance of 'not for sale'.

However, Ramano says personal terms wont be an issue as the player has said he would be happy to join, so I am guessing it's just finding a fee that Villa will agree to.

Ultimately he could go on a free next summer.

[mandela8]

Sell him. He's shit and always injured.

Partey is the best player in the squad.

It's not even close either. He's levels above the next best in Odegaard and Jesus. Who are levels above the rest.

[I am invisible]

I don’t know I kind of feel you’re making excuses for him. Even if you’re correct none of that changes my assertion that he’s. Luxury player that we can ill afford. But it’s more than that, I do agree that too many of our centre backs in the past have been immobile and uncomfortable on the ball (Gabriel Magahat is whilst strong and reasonably quick not good with ball to feet).
But too often he gives the ball away even if there is no pressure let alone when there is. I can’t abide that. Look at the game against Bournemouth and the amount of times Zinchenko had to put out the fires he started.
Villa the irony was that Kamarra was so shit that Xhaka managed to dispossess him but he is not quick, strong or good enough in possession to be anything but a liability when we play decent sides.
Every time we play one of the supposed big five I come out in a cold sweat thinking of how he could undo all our good work with one careless sideways pass.
Just credit where it’s due - he’s been one of our better players so far this year, and tbf he’s been decent ever since we switched to 433. Doesn’t mean I don’t think we could (and should) upgrade that area, but right now he’s playing his part without causing problems.

[mandela8]

Just credit where it’s due - he’s been one of our better players so far this year, and tbf he’s been decent ever since we switched to 433. Doesn’t mean I don’t think we could (and should) upgrade that area, but right now he’s playing his part without causing problems.

He's fuckin shit, mate.

We're basically at the point of if he doesn't actively fuck us up then it's a good performance. His display last night was fuckin pathetic. The number of poor passes, putting team mates under unnecessary pressure or even just giving it away was ridiculous for a CM player at an aspiring 'top' club.

Any defence of him just fuckin reeks of desperation, tbh.

[I am invisible]

:rolleyes:

[I am invisible]

Bellerin to Barca looks like it’s on - another one where it looks like we’re going to have to terminate a contract because of ridiculous wages.

[Mac76]

One unexpected bonus has been the surprise factor he’s adding this season - no one seems to rate him as any particular threat in his current role and we’ve caught opponents with their pants down several times now as he’s ghosted into shooting positions relatively unchallenged. I’m sure teams will wise up to that at some point, but right now it’s a cheap trick we can keep using.

much as i hate to admit it, there is something to that - and i can't deny his pressure caused us to get our first goal last night - still, a better player would make things run smoother in the first place - we shouldn't be in the position where we're begging the ref to blow the final whistle against teams like Fulham and Villa and not having better quality in that position is part of it

[mandela8]

Bellerin to Barca looks like it’s on - another one where it looks like we’re going to have to terminate a contract because of ridiculous wages.

Barca are selling Auba to Chelsea for 12m plus a player, ffs.

Absolutely mental Arsenal are just giving them another player. Hopefully they've at least insisted on a sell on clause of some sort for when Barca flip him to another club for more free money.

[I am invisible]

much as i hate to admit it, there is something to that - and i can't deny his pressure caused us to get our first goal last night - still, a better player would make things run smoother in the first place - we shouldn't be in the position where we're begging the ref to blow the final whistle against teams like Fulham and Villa and not having better quality in that position is part of it
Bah, we had more than enough clear chances to put both of those games out of sight - that’s on our forwards lacking a bit of sharpness, not Xhaka.

Again, I agree that there’s another level for this team to find if we can ever upgrade Xhaka - really hope I live to see the day! - but I’m also trying to be fair with criticism of him. So far he’s contributing, he hasn’t made any fuck-ups, the team is playing well and we’re top of the league with a 100% record - feels like we’re really reaching for problems atm and I’m not sure why?

[I am invisible]

Barca are selling Auba to Chelsea for 12m plus a player, ffs.

Absolutely mental Arsenal are just giving them another player. Hopefully they've at least insisted on a sell on clause of some sort for when Barca flip him to another club for more free money.
That’s because Auba took a 50% pay cut to go to Barca - if we were trying to shift him on £160k/wk instead of £320k/wk then we might have been able to get a fee. (Barca have also massively lucked out with Chelsea’s batshit crazy nee owner!)

The problem we have is the only teams who can afford our players’ wages are other PL clubs, and none of them are interested - the only market there is for them is Europe and those clubs are all skint after the pandemic. Getting them off the wage bill might be the best we can do.

None of this is a problem with selling - it’s a problem with being bad at buying and utterly shit at contract negotiations.

[Marc Overmars]

2nd bid for Luiz incoming according to Ornstein. Stop being cunts Villa.

[Marc Overmars]

That’s because Auba took a 50% pay cut to go to Barca - if we were trying to shift him on £160k/wk instead of £320k/wk then we might have been able to get a fee. (Barca have also massively lucked out with Chelsea’s batshit crazy nee owner!)

The problem we have is the only teams who can afford our players’ wages are other PL clubs, and none of them are interested - the only market there is for them is Europe and those clubs are all skint after the pandemic. Getting them off the wage bill might be the best we can do.

None of this is a problem with selling - it’s a problem with being bad at buying and utterly shit at contract negotiations.

Think the problem was that we were dishing out CL contracts without having CL income. These were contracts most of the squad Arteta inherited were coasting on because it’s money they wouldn’t have got anywhere else.

The number of players just let go shows what a mess we were in. Glad we seem to have got a hold on that now.

[KSE Comedy Club]

2nd bid for Luiz incoming according to Ornstein. Stop being cunts Villa.

Apparently personal terms are already agreed and he is pushing for the move to happen (behind the scenes of course)

So a question of when not if now, surely?

[KSE Comedy Club]

Villa want £40m apparently.


Villa asking price for Luiz revealed

Arsenal will submit a second offer for Douglas Luiz worth £25million according to reports from Sky Sports.

However, it is understood Aston Villa want almost double this to sell the midfielder.

The Independent's Miguel Delaney has reported Steven Gerrard's struggling side want as much as £40m for him.

[Mac76]

Villa want £40m apparently.

that's ridiculous we should tell them to stuff it, we're not that desperate

[Gooner23]

Yeah they can do one, hope they bomb this season and lose him on a free next summer

[Gooner23]

Think the problem was that we were dishing out CL contracts without having CL income. These were contracts most of the squad Arteta inherited were coasting on because it’s money they wouldn’t have got anywhere else.

The number of players just let go shows what a mess we were in. Glad we seem to have got a hold on that now.

I was hoping we'd hold firm on getting a fee for Bellerin as a point of principle, but I suppose getting his wages of the bill is more important.

[Mac76]

Fulham have signed Willian :haha: :haha: :haha:

[Marc Overmars]

Villa want £40m apparently.

40m for a player who doesn’t want to be there and can speak to other clubs in January anyway? :lol:

No thanks.

Come on Douglas, force it through.

[mandela8]

Dendoncker for 13m is good business for Villa. He's a good player.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Dendoncker for 13m is good business for Villa. He's a good player.

The reports seem to be that Dendoncker purchase is unrelated to potential sale of Luiz, although that could be Villa playing hard ball

[Marc Overmars]

There’s a 20% sell-on clause for Man City with Luiz, hence Villa being stubborn with the price.

[HCZ_Reborn]

There’s a 20% sell-on clause for Man City with Luiz, hence Villa being stubborn with the price.

Maybe someone should remind them that 80% of nothing is nothing

[Mac76]

AMN loan to Saints confirmed

[HCZ_Reborn]

Villa have rejected third bid for Luiz, that appears to be that

[Gooner23]

General consensus is that's it now, no deal.

If Elneny injury is long term we have left ourselves short in midfield. Xhaka, Sambi and an injury prone Partey to cover all fixtures until January.

[HCZ_Reborn]

General consensus is that's it now, no deal.

If Elneny injury is long term we have left ourselves short in midfield. Xhaka, Sambi and an injury prone Partey to cover all fixtures until January.

Partey likely to be out for about a month as well.

I think wagering on Partey’s fitness was nuts. But can’t really blame the club over today…Villa clearly shooting themselves in the foot because they don’t want to sell to us

[Gooner23]

Partey likely to be out for about a month as well.

I think wagering on Partey’s fitness was nuts. But can’t really blame the club over today…Villa clearly shooting themselves in the foot because they don’t want to sell to us

Which is their perogative. Just a bit weird that we spent all day chasing a deal that seemingly wasn't possible.

I just hope Villa have a miserable season now.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Which is their perogative. Just a bit weird that we spent all day chasing a deal that seemingly wasn't possible.

I just hope Villa have a miserable season now.

The thing is you aren’t in negotiations all day, you make a bid and wait for the club to respond. We gambled on the idea that they’d relent at the last moment, they gambled on the idea that we were so desperate we’d give them 40 million (they can fuck off for that)

[HCZ_Reborn]

Interesting, specculation that Villa won’t sell because they may sack Steven Gerrard soon and next manager will have Luiz in their plans unlike Gerrard and that they might tie him down to a new deal

[selassie]

I don't understand what we are doing with the squad. How are we going to manage the Europa and PL with this tiny squad? A few more injuries and we are down to the bare bones.

[HCZ_Reborn]

It’s a head scratcher but given that Arteta doesn’t even know how to rotate the players he’s got maybe not that surprising

I don’t think Edu is especially good at the job he does, I don’t blame him for today but in general his record is sketchy at best.

It’s possible we may sack off the Europa league and go all out for 4th via the league but I think putting all your eggs in one basket not especially clever strategy

[HCZ_Reborn]

Arsenal fan twitter meltdown is quite the experience :haha:

I liked Douglas Luiz as a player I’d have gone for him a year ago but what can you do. I’d still take him and Tielemans next summer. Bit worried about overall squad numbers and think it was mad not to buy a central midfielder but the apocalyptic meltdowns are something else

[Chippy]

He won't.

As I said.

Night.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Deleted my last post because someone objected to me using a certain four letter noun beginning with C

This is Britain, that word denotes affection. I mean it wasn’t meant affectionately because I don’t like any of you but I’m just saying.

[HCZ_Reborn]

At the risk of being serious I will have the final word on our transfer business

Disappointing basically but in a way understandable, we can pull as many accountancy tricks as we like but the fact remains that we’ve hardly kept the purse strings tight in the last few years and getting people off the wage bill even on loan was considered necessary
Whatever I personally think, I think the intention had been to bring in a winger/second striker until the injury to Elneny proved to be worse than originally thought.
If you take the refusal of Blackburn to sell Diaz and the refusal of Villa to sell Luiz together it suggests that clubs are gambling short term on promotion (in Blackburn’s case) or avoiding relegation (in Villas)
I think we tried to apply the pressure on Villa by agreeing personal terms with the player but I think ultimately the club want to player available should they dispense with the services of Gerrard
Yes we have players that are multi functional, and maybe when we consider the World Cup coming in November. As long as we get through 11 premier league games and 6 europa league games unscathed we can reassess our needs in January.
Hard to say really, there seems to be an element of future planning which is all very well but you can’t neglect the here and now.

[mandela8]

Bit of a dereliction of duty not buying a wide player and leaving players like Sakashit as first choice.

Not fussed in the slightest by not getting a CM in. Absolutely stunk of panic anyway.

[Marc Overmars]

Hope Villa go down tbh. Wankers.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Hope Villa go down tbh. Wankers.

To be honest from their point of view it makes sense, why get in money 20% of which you have to give to Man City for a player that lets be honest when and not if Gerrard is sacked could be the difference between whether they stay up or not.

Of course it’s too early to say they will be in a relegation scrap for definite but they aren’t getting anything at the weekend

Regarding the comments of the silly fool above you, we needed a central midfielder (two arguably) before the injuries happened. If we were going to strengthen in attack I’d have preferred an out and out striker to contrast with what we’ve got given we can play Skeet Ulrich and for that matter Eddie wide right if the need arises.

[I am invisible]

Arsenal fan twitter meltdown is quite the experience :haha:

I liked Douglas Luiz as a player I’d have gone for him a year ago but what can you do. I’d still take him and Tielemans next summer. Bit worried about overall squad numbers and think it was mad not to buy a central midfielder but the apocalyptic meltdowns are something else
I know, right? The hysterics get a bit much some times - we’re top of the league, with a 100% record and we’re playing some good, dominant football, but everything’s shit and all our players are bums and Arsenal are the worst club in the world to follow.

I’m just amazed no one is ever prepared for it - if you can guarantee 3 things in life it’s that refs will fuck us, injuries will fuck us and we’ll always be a couple of players light. Accept those three fundamental truths of life and you’ll breeze through each season in a zen-like state of utter tranquility.

[I am invisible]

I don't understand what we are doing with the squad. How are we going to manage the Europa and PL with this tiny squad? A few more injuries and we are down to the bare bones.
I get the logic - if you have a smaller group of more adaptable players then you have a better chance of keeping everyone engaged and motivated because there’s more minutes to go around. I don’t think it was meant to be quite this small though! They very obviously wanted at least another couple of players to choose from.

Guess we’ll find out just how adaptable this squad is now!

[I am invisible]

On the plus side, it feels like we’ve finally cleared out the last of the sad-sacks who were moping around the place, bringing the mood down - what we have left looks light, but at least it should be super-focussed with everyone pulling in the same direction.

[Mac76]

The problem with Arteta is he won't throw the League Cup like he should or put enough younger players into our early Europa ties.

He'll play that firat eleven into the groumd and it'll all fall apart again.

Sending AMN out on loan is crazy given he's a decent utility player

[KSE Comedy Club]

To be honest from their point of view it makes sense, why get in money 20% of which you have to give to Man City for a player that lets be honest when and not if Gerrard is sacked could be the difference between whether they stay up or not.

Of course it’s too early to say they will be in a relegation scrap for definite but they aren’t getting anything at the weekend

Regarding the comments of the silly fool above you, we needed a central midfielder (two arguably) before the injuries happened. If we were going to strengthen in attack I’d have preferred an out and out striker to contrast with what we’ve got given we can play Skeet Ulrich and for that matter Eddie wide right if the need arises.

They signed another midfielder so they had cover.

They are now in a position where the player may also not want to bother playing for them anymore as he clearly wanted the move to happen by all accounts.

Villa have been a bit stupid here imo. They just thought they could up the price at the last minute and it backfired.

Apparently everyone involved in the negotiations were a bit bemused as it was understood that Villa would listen to offers of £20m+.

I hope he leaves them on a free now.

[KSE Comedy Club]

The worrying thing for me is that we ended last summer with 24 senior players registered.

This summer we have ended with 23.

This is not good when everyone and their dog knew we needed a CM'er and we had at least a week before the window shut to find one.

Not good enough for me on that front despite the solid signings we have made, and decent start.
We are just one more injury away from disaster now.

[Mac76]

I know, right? The hysterics get a bit much some times - we’re top of the league, with a 100% record and we’re playing some good, dominant football, but everything’s shit and all our players are bums and Arsenal are the worst club in the world to follow.

I’m just amazed no one is ever prepared for it - if you can guarantee 3 things in life it’s that refs will fuck us, injuries will fuck us and we’ll always be a couple of players light. Accept those three fundamental truths of life and you’ll breeze through each season in a zen-like state of utter tranquility.

Some of the reaction might be OTT but I suspect it's partly based on the fact that we're already now just winning our games on sheer willpower, but once we drop points that bubble will be burst and without the ability to change things much, we'll struggle to find new ways of beating teams - Arteta's hero Pep rotates a lot but it's not something Arteta has learnt from him

[Chippy]

On the plus side, it feels like we’ve finally cleared out the last of the sad-sacks who were moping around the place, bringing the mood down - what we have left looks light, but at least it should be super-focussed with everyone pulling in the same direction.

I agree.

The priority was to get rid as much of the dead wood as possible, and I believe that we have, including ANM.

As Mandela8 has already said, this smelt like a panic buy, so probably good that it did not go through?

We are very short on players, but we will have to use what we have until January. Obvs.

[HCZ_Reborn]

They signed another midfielder so they had cover.

They are now in a position where the player may also not want to bother playing for them anymore as he clearly wanted the move to happen by all accounts.

Villa have been a bit stupid here imo. They just thought they could up the price at the last minute and it backfired.

Apparently everyone involved in the negotiations were a bit bemused as it was understood that Villa would listen to offers of £20m+.

I hope he leaves them on a free now.


Given how bad Villa were in midfield against us (literally Xhaka was successfully pressing Kamarra) I think it’s fair to say they could probably use both Dendoncker and Luiz. The idea that Villa were going to sell him seemed to change after Wednesday night, Villa didn’t just score when Luiz came on they looked much better in general. I don’t buy into this bollocks that they didn’t want to sell to us or some shit like that. Gerrard wanted to keep him so they were going to hold out for much higher.
Yes it’s frustrating for us, but we should have had the position covered months ago. If we were truly sensible we’d have let Xhaka and Elneny go and brought in players like Luiz and Tielemans who would have improved central midfield immeasurably.
Luiz of course was a panic buy in so far that, that is what motivated us to sign him but definitely would have been an improvement on what we have.
I think in many respects the reticence to sign players was about getting players off the wage bill first.

[Letters]

Hope Villa go down tbh. Wankers.

Why, because they didn't cave to a player's whining and agitating for a move? Nah. I mean, I hope they go down because I think it would be funny, but not because of this.
We've been on the other end of that way too many times and we always cave. Just once it would be nice to say to a player "No, get on with it, you signed a contract".
Possibly counter productive in some cases if it affects squad unity, but I'm sick of players and agents having all the power.

[Mac76]

but we should have had the position covered months ago. If we were truly sensible we’d have let Xhaka and Elneny go and brought in players like Luiz and Tielemans who would have improved central midfield immeasurably.

Agree, this is down to Arteta actually thinking Xhaka is a good enough first team choice, I still think Elneny is a very useful squad player and he seems happy to be, but as you say we underestimated the need to strenghten in this area badly

[Marc Overmars]

Why, because they didn't cave to a player's whining and agitating for a move? Nah. I mean, I hope they go down because I think it would be funny, but not because of this.
We've been on the other end of that way too many times and we always cave. Just once it would be nice to say to a player "No, get on with it, you signed a contract".
Possibly counter productive in some cases if it affects squad unity, but I'm sick of players and agents having all the power.

Tongue in cheek. Just annoyed we’re a little short now in midfield.

The drop off in quality is very steep for us without Partey. Odegaard could possibly miss the United game now as well as Zinchenko. I’d say we’re almost certain to lose if they’re all missing.

[Letters]

It always bemuses me how we manage to have an injury pile up this early in the season :doh:

[Chippy]

It always bemuses me how we manage to have an injury pile up this early in the season :doh:

I know. How many times have we been in this position?

Harold Shipman is back as the club's Doctor :lol:

[HCZ_Reborn]

It always bemuses me how we manage to have an injury pile up this early in the season :doh:

With pre-season and everything there’s been very little in the way of a break. And with Odegaard, those Villa cunts just kicked him about didn’t they?

[Mac76]

Tongue in cheek. Just annoyed we’re a little short now in midfield.

The drop off in quality is very steep for us without Partey. Odegaard could possibly miss the United game now as well as Zinchenko. I’d say we’re almost certain to lose if they’re all missing.

plus that game has 'Xhaka red card' written all over it

[selassie]

It’s a head scratcher but given that Arteta doesn’t even know how to rotate the players he’s got maybe not that surprising

I don’t think Edu is especially good at the job he does, I don’t blame him for today but in general his record is sketchy at best.

It’s possible we may sack off the Europa league and go all out for 4th via the league but I think putting all your eggs in one basket not especially clever strategy

Edu has failed in his role so far, he pretty much just gives our players away or terminates their contracts. IMO It's set a precedence now within Football, teams don't want to pay for our players!!!

Let's take Villa for example, we pretty much gave them Chambers yet when negotiating for Douglas Luiz they gave us the runaround, what kind of relationships has Edu built with fellow clubs...because it seems to me as if they are happy to do as they please with us.

[selassie]

I get the logic - if you have a smaller group of more adaptable players then you have a better chance of keeping everyone engaged and motivated because there’s more minutes to go around. I don’t think it was meant to be quite this small though! They very obviously wanted at least another couple of players to choose from.

Guess we’ll find out just how adaptable this squad is now!

Our problem is that we have a couple of key players in our team who are injury prone, Tomiyasu, Tierney and Partey, these are a given. ESR is quite injury prone too. Take those 4 away from our matchday squad and the squad looks threadbare. It's poor planning on our part and not good enough IMO, it happened last season and there is a good chance it's going to happen again. If we collapse through the lack of options in the squad then questions need to be asked of Arteta and Edu.

[HCZ_Reborn]

plus that game has 'Xhaka red card' written all over it

I’ve sacked off that game in fairness, just glad we have an eight point cushion on Chelsea

[selassie]

Tongue in cheek. Just annoyed we’re a little short now in midfield.

The drop off in quality is very steep for us without Partey. Odegaard could possibly miss the United game now as well as Zinchenko. I’d say we’re almost certain to lose if they’re all missing.

Even with a fully fit squad this game would have been very difficult. For me now without Partey and potentially Odegaard and Zinchenko it's a write off. They are coming into good form too.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Ross Barkley is available on a free.....

[Letters]

I’ve sacked off that game in fairness, just glad we have an eight point cushion on Chelsea

Sorry to be all "NQ", but this is a terrible attitude. This is exactly the sort of game we need to be standing up in if we want to push on.
It will be difficult - our first big test this season. I'd be OK with a point but we have to get something IMO.

[selassie]

Sorry to be all "NQ", but this is a terrible attitude. This is exactly the sort of game we need to be standing up in if we want to push on.
It will be difficult - our first big test this season. I'd be OK with a point but we have to get something IMO.

I think it's a "must not lose" kind of game. A point up there is a good result, 3 points would be a huge statement. Personally, I think they will put us under immense pressure in large parts of the game, it's how we react to that and compete. If for example Partey and Elneny are the only absentees then I think we are good enough to go there and at least get a point if we play well. Without Ode and Zinchenko I don't see us getting anything from the game.

For all the early season mocking of United, I watched their game against Liverpool and United were really good in spells, very quick on the counter / transition and strong in Midfield too surprisingly. It's going to be a very difficult game.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Sorry to be all "NQ", but this is a terrible attitude. This is exactly the sort of game we need to be standing up in if we want to push on.
It will be difficult - our first big test this season. I'd be OK with a point but we have to get something IMO.

100% agree with this.

If we really have anything about us or any aspirations of proving our worth, this is one game to do it in.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Sorry to be all "NQ", but this is a terrible attitude. This is exactly the sort of game we need to be standing up in if we want to push on.
It will be difficult - our first big test this season. I'd be OK with a point but we have to get something IMO.

Well it would be a terrible attitude if I was a player or a coach and I’m not for a second suggesting they should sack it off that would be appalling

As I’m a largely armchair fan who isn’t quite solipsistic enough to believe that what I personally think has any bearing on the outcome of the game, I can’t see it matters.

I have written off the game because I don’t think we are in a position to get anything from it. So anything we do get is a bonus

[Letters]

As I’m a largely armchair fan who isn’t quite solipsistic enough to believe that what I personally think has any bearing on the outcome of the game, I can’t see it matters.
:lol: Fair enough.

[Mac76]

Well it would be a terrible attitude if I was a player or a coach and I’m not for a second suggesting they should sack it off that would be appalling

As I’m a largely armchair fan who isn’t quite solipsistic enough to believe that what I personally think has any bearing on the outcome of the game, I can’t see it matters.

I have written off the game because I don’t think we are in a position to get anything from it. So anything we do get is a bonus

exactly

we want the players to go out and do their best, but looking at it as a fan (though not an armchair one ;)) this game is pretty much lost already

i'm more worried about the effect it will have if it's a big defeat - Arteta's made the mistake in the past of trying to defend in games like this and just bringing the other team on to us, who then win 4-0

we need to keep this one tight and if we do lose, it should just be by one goal

[mandela8]

Some absolute fuckin [silly people] up in here, man.


Same people were laughing at Man U being bottom of the league last week now they're foregoing the game??

Fannies.

[selassie]

About the injuries....taken from Arteta's press conference....

https://www.arsenal.com/news/every-word-mikels-pre-man-utd-presser


on Ramsdale and Odegaard’s fitness…
Those two are being assessed, we will see more tomorrow. Hopefully they will be able to train with the team. Unfortunately with Alex [Zinchenko] that’s still not the case, he missed two games and has not been able to train with the team yet.

on Zinchenko’s fitness...
Again after missing two games and not being able to be ready yet to train with the team, unfortunately, that is the situation that we have.



Sounds like Zinchenko is definitely out and Ramsdale and Ode are touch and go.

[selassie]

Some absolute fuckin [silly people] up in here, man.


Same people were laughing at Man U being bottom of the league last week now they're foregoing the game??

Fannies.

We are going up there with many key players missing. United away regardless of form and who we have available is always a tough game. They have won 3 games on the bounce too...they are 5th now.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Some absolute fuckin [silly people] up in here, man.


Same people were laughing at Man U being bottom of the league last week now they're foregoing the game??

Fannies.


Better than being an ex pat Scot who feels the need to affect an accent whilst typing on a forum

Plus didn’t say anything about foregoing the game, said it’s been written off…a bit like your mums hips after she squeezed you out of her.

It’s genuinely hard to tell whether you’re a child or you’re just one of those vulnerable adults with the mental capacity of one

[Chippy]

Better than being an ex pat Scot who feels the need to affect an accent whilst typing on a forum

Plus didn’t say anything about foregoing the game, said it’s been written off…a bit like your mums hips after she squeezed you out of her.

It’s genuinely hard to tell whether you’re a child or you’re just one of those vulnerable adults with the mental capacity of one

Erm... I will stick a fiver on the latter :tiphat:

[Chippy]

We are going up there with many key players missing. United away regardless of form and who we have available is always a tough game. They have won 3 games on the bounce too...they are 5th now.
Could be another 8-2

[HCZ_Reborn]

Ben White, Odegaard, Zinchenko all doubts

To be honest Ben White not a huge loss as he’s not a right back. Tierney is playing so same with Zinchenko. Smith Rowe is lopsided and overweight but can still play in Odegaards role

At the risk of sounding like a broken record where we are going to have harm done to us is central midfield.

[mandela8]

We are going up there with many key players missing. United away regardless of form and who we have available is always a tough game. They have won 3 games on the bounce too...they are 5th now.

Missing one key player, Partey.

Assuming Odegaard is fit.

Or are we now calling Elnonentity a key player? Because, if we are, we're in a much fuckin worse position than I ever thought, ffs.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Surely Vieira should get some game time in this one?

He looked sharp in the under 21 game.

If we aren't going to play him then what was the point of buying him :rolleyes:

[HCZ_Reborn]

Surely Vieira should get some game time in this one?

He looked sharp in the under 21 game.

If we aren't going to play him then what was the point of buying him :rolleyes:

There was no point in buying him whatsoever

Even with Odegaard out which frankly isn’t a big loss, more likely Smith Rowe will start

[Mac76]

Surely Vieira should get some game time in this one?

He looked sharp in the under 21 game.

If we aren't going to play him then what was the point of buying him :rolleyes:

One of Arteta's hobbies is ignoring good players, you know that - we'd be playing CL football this year if he'd not insisted Saliba "wasn't ready" for two seasons running - when he very clearly was

[GP]

Even with Odegaard out which frankly isn’t a big loss

Extraordinary

[KSE Comedy Club]

There was no point in buying him whatsoever

Even with Odegaard out which frankly isn’t a big loss, more likely Smith Rowe will start

I hate to say it but he looked better than Smith Rowe.

His passes were absolutely spot on.

[KSE Comedy Club]

One of Arteta's hobbies is ignoring good players, you know that - we'd be playing CL football this year if he'd not insisted Saliba "wasn't ready" for two seasons running - when he very clearly was

Massively true - sadly

[selassie]

Missing one key player, Partey.

Assuming Odegaard is fit.

Or are we now calling Elnonentity a key player? Because, if we are, we're in a much fuckin worse position than I ever thought, ffs.

Have you read press conference?

[HCZ_Reborn]

I hate to say it but he looked better than Smith Rowe.

His passes were absolutely spot on.

Oh he is better than Smith Rowe no doubt but I don’t rate either that highly

Unless someone can point out a big game in which Odegaard has been anything but anonymous.

And Skeet Ulrich I can’t put my faith in someone from the Portuguese league with the upper body strength of Bobby Sands

[HCZ_Reborn]

Have you read press conference?

Making a big assumption there

[HCZ_Reborn]

Extraordinary

Extraordinary? That because Odegaard has scored a few goals against bullshit opposition that he’s suddenly irreplaceable?

As I said in another reply, I can’t think of any big game where he has shown up

[I am invisible]

Some of the reaction might be OTT but I suspect it's partly based on the fact that we're already now just winning our games on sheer willpower, but once we drop points that bubble will be burst and without the ability to change things much, we'll struggle to find new ways of beating teams - Arteta's hero Pep rotates a lot but it's not something Arteta has learnt from him
I totally understand a bit of angst, but some of the carry-on you see online is just embarrassing - grown-ass adults throwing full-blown tantrums! Show a bit of dignity, ffs. Most children understand that if they write a letter to Santa they’re probably not going to get everything on their list - not online football fans, though. Absolute meltdown, every time.

Agree about the rotation - trusting his squad is the next big thing that Arteta needs to learn as a manager. Who knows, maybe the deadline day disappointment will turn out to be a good thing in the long run? He has no choice but to put his faith in guys like Sambi now, and if they take their chances then that might give him the confidence we need to do it more often.

Disagree that we’re getting through games on sheer willpower, though - the score lines and the order of the goals are making some of these games look close, but we’ve absolutely dominated 4.5 out of the 5 games we’ve played so far and we should have come away from the most recent 4 with much bigger margins. Need to sharpen up our finishing and decision-making in the box and cut out the stupid mistakes at the back (seriously, all of the goals we’ve conceded have been freak occurrences, completely against the run of play).

[HCZ_Reborn]

Oh I think we all know the Twitter reaction was going to be nothing but incontinent petulance

I was disappointed not to sign Luiz because I happen to rate the player otherwise wouldn’t have given that much of a fuck…for me if were going to take central midfield seriously we wouldn’t have given Xhaka or Elneny contract extensions…but there it is.

When I say I don’t think we’ve got a chance against United. To be without one decent midfielder by playing Partey and Xhaka would be bad enough to play without two is like trying to roll a cigarette with your arms tied behind your back. And I’m not saying that because I suddenly rate United I don’t they are shit. But they beat Liverpool comfortably who had Henderson and Milner in midfield and I’m sorry to say Xhaka and Lokonga is weaker than that (still could be worse could be Xhaka and Elneny) I would have sacked the game off if it was Brentford we were playing….in fact I’d say we’d have an easier time playing United than Brentford.

[mandela8]

Have you read press conference?

Huv I fuck

[mandela8]

Partey is "weeks, not months, hopefully less".

Going for Luiz stinks of even more panic, given that context.

Viera must be earmarked for a wide role as there's simply no way the club could have neglected that position. It baffles me that we know Raphinha was sought but when that fell through, what, the need for another attacking player dissipated? Just very strange, in terms of strategy.

You never know what is going on behind the scenes, I guess. Maybe they tried and someone isn't always better than no one, as we know from people like Willian coming in.

[I am invisible]

Surely Vieira should get some game time in this one?

He looked sharp in the under 21 game.

If we aren't going to play him then what was the point of buying him :rolleyes:
His chances are coming - don’t forget he didn’t really get a preseason because of that injury so he’s still playing catch-up with fitness.

Also this is a bit of a freak season because of the World Cup that’s right in the middle of it - I have a sneaky feeling we may be holding certain players back for the second half of the season, when everyone else’s key players are coming back knackered. We don’t have too many advantages over the best clubs, but one of them is that we have some very good players who either won’t be going to Qatar or won’t be that involved because of their lack of seniority.

[Mac76]

His chances are coming - don’t forget he didn’t really get a preseason because of that injury so he’s still playing catch-up with fitness.

Also this is a bit of a freak season because of the World Cup that’s right in the middle of it - I have a sneaky feeling we may be holding certain players back for the second half of the season, when everyone else’s key players are coming back knackered. We don’t have too many advantages over the best clubs, but one of them is that we have some very good players who either won’t be going to Qatar or won’t be that involved because of their lack of seniority.

I wish i could believe we're that tactical but i'm sceptical tbh...

[HCZ_Reborn]

Douglas Luiz would have been a good buy even if Partey was fit, he’s 29 and he’s already injured all the time. Lokonga is not a holding midfielder.
If we were serious about challenging for things down the line a midfield four of Luiz, Tielemans, Partey and Lokonga would be far superior to our current quartet.
I absolutely think we should go in for Luiz in January…certainly not spaffing money up the wall on someone like Pedro Neto when we’ve already got adequate cover in the wide areas and actually if anything we could do with a striker that gives us a different dimension to Nketiah (who actually I think we should start playing on the wings) and Jesus.

[I am invisible]

Luiz would have been a good buy - ticked a lot of boxes as a player, Prem-ready, Arteta-ready… made a lot of sense.

Can’t get too worked up about it, though - we’re not talking about a Partey replacement here, we’re talking about an Elneny replacement, and there’s only so excited / devastated you can get about that either way.

Might be something to revisit in January, but then there may be other options open to us if we have more than 2 days to get something done.

[I am invisible]

Douglas Luiz would have been a good buy even if Partey was fit, he’s 29 and he’s already injured all the time. Lokonga is not a holding midfielder.
If we were serious about challenging for things down the line a midfield four of Luiz, Tielemans, Partey and Lokonga would be far superior to our current quartet.
I absolutely think we should go in for Luiz in January…certainly not spaffing money up the wall on someone like Pedro Neto when we’ve already got adequate cover in the wide areas and actually if anything we could do with a striker that gives us a different dimension to Nketiah (who actually I think we should start playing on the wings) and Jesus.
Tbf Partey’s not strictly a holding midfielder either (or at least he wasn’t when we bought him) - he’s a natural B2B midfielder who we’re asking to play at the base of midfield, and that sounds very much like what we’d be asking of Lokonga.

In truth, Lokonga is probably to only option we have who even has a chance of replicating what Partey does for us - guys like Elneny and Luiz can stand in the same place, but they’re going to play the role completely differently. Lokonga isn’t at Partey’s level yet, but his profile is at least in the right ball park - if he could add a bit more intensity and aggression to his game then I’d be happy to give him the minutes and watch him grow into it. It’s not like we have much choice now anyway!

Interesting thoughts about Nketiah - I’ve wondered the same thing. Could see him working as a wide option in the same way as someone like Mane plays the role. Still think we need the extra winger, but this could be an option.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I don’t consider Partey comfortable enough in possession to be a true box to box player, he can’t withstand a heavy press either (although neither in fairness can Lokonga)

I think the last true B2B midfielder we had was Abou Diaby and he unfortunately had glass knees otherwise he could have been a potential Patrick Vieira

[Globalgunner]

I don’t consider Partey comfortable enough in possession to be a true box to box player, he can’t withstand a heavy press either (although neither in fairness can Lokonga)

I think the last true B2B midfielder we had was Abou Diaby and he unfortunately had glass knees otherwise he could have been a potential Patrick Vieira

We never replaced Vieira, fortunately he is still available, at Palace.

[I am invisible]

I don’t consider Partey comfortable enough in possession to be a true box to box player, he can’t withstand a heavy press either (although neither in fairness can Lokonga)

I think the last true B2B midfielder we had was Abou Diaby and he unfortunately had glass knees otherwise he could have been a potential Patrick Vieira
Cue: today’s argument with mandela8 :lol:

When people talk about B2Bs these days I think they mostly mean midfield all-rounders - it’s a bit of a legacy term that’s stuck around from the days of midfield specialists, probably because the profile of player is much the same, but yeah it’s not strictly accurate any more. You don’t tend to see a lot of actual box-to-box running these days because the game has swung back to squeezing space in the middle again and there’s no real need for it - it’s more about controlled, intense bursts over short distances now.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Suffice to say especially in the system we play central midfield has a no6 role and a no8 role.

Last season or so it felt more like Xhaka was operating as the defensive midfield and allowing Partey the more expansive role. This was clearly fucking insane and contributed to leaving our back four exposed and too often not creating enough through the middle.
The roles have been reversed somewhat this season although Partey is not a typical holding midfielder in the way someone like Makelele or Gilberto was and Xhaka of course is certainly not a typical box to box player especially not when you consider how Vieira occupied that position.
Lokonga I think is better at moving the ball forward than Partey, more acceleration and more comfortable with the ball to feet…Partey a better passer of the ball, physically stronger and more positional discipline.

[mandela8]

Tbf Partey’s not strictly a holding midfielder either (or at least he wasn’t when we bought him) - he’s a natural B2B midfielder who we’re asking to play at the base of midfield, and that sounds very much like what we’d be asking of Lokonga. I'm just not a fan of these so called DMs who barely move from their position and just keep the ball moving to the nearest player. Elnonentity and Luiz fit that profile. It's a waste of a position.

In truth, Lokonga is probably to only option we have who even has a chance of replicating what Partey does for us - guys like Elneny and Luiz can stand in the same place, but they’re going to play the role completely differently. Lokonga isn’t at Partey’s level yet, but his profile is at least in the right ball park - if he could add a bit more intensity and aggression to his game then I’d be happy to give him the minutes and watch him grow into it. It’s not like we have much choice now anyway!

Interesting thoughts about Nketiah - I’ve wondered the same thing. Could see him working as a wide option in the same way as someone like Mane plays the role. Still think we need the extra winger, but this could be an option.

I think that's a good assessment, man. Definitely agree with what Lokonga needs to do in terms of adding some aggression. Partey is also elite at taking the ball under pressure and looking to do something progressive with it...although some of his passes are wild. Weird, really.

The Nketiah out wide stuff is obviously nonsense but 1. You made other good points so I'll leave it be and B/ He'd be better than Sakashit, tbf.

[mandela8]

Cue: today’s argument with mandela8 :lol:

When people talk about B2Bs these days I think they mostly mean midfield all-rounders - it’s a bit of a legacy term that’s stuck around from the days of midfield specialists, probably because the profile of player is much the same, but yeah it’s not strictly accurate any more. You don’t tend to see a lot of actual box-to-box running these days because the game has swung back to squeezing space in the middle again and there’s no real need for it - it’s more about controlled, intense bursts over short distances now.

And I don't really argue with people, man. I make a point of never engaging with idiots too. There's no point.

So, if I do decide to correct something you've said, then take it as a compliment, mate.

[LDG]

The MF we need is a positionally aware player who arrives in the right place at the right time, defensively and late into the opposition box. He’s the dude who makes it look like we have 11 outfield players because he only commits when he needs to and is always anticipating.

The closest we have to that is Partey…but he can lack the dicipline at times. We always struggle when you have a player like Son who plays between the lines, because you don’t have someone prepared to keep him under wraps. It’s our weak spot. They’re always the players that arrive in our box to convert the cutback or cross without any bastard in his grill

[HCZ_Reborn]

And I don't really argue with people, man. I make a point of never engaging with idiots too. There's no point.

So, if I do decide to correct something you've said, then take it as a compliment, mate.

So what you’re saying is you don’t talk to yourself ?