Ozil - Do we need him?

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

Eh? I assumed we were just ignoring questions. This started when I asked you who you'd replace Ozil with, which you answered with a question. And now I STILL haven't answered?

Come off it. I never mentioned Simeone either, although if we could land him I'd be chuffed. I don't know where Simeone would play Ozil, how could I know that. But I'd have Ozil behind Alexis and Lewandowski if it was up to me. You need that quality (and intelligent) striker to see the best of Ozil. De Brown isn't fit to clean Ozil's boots, but right now he plays in a team with a proper manager and that makes all the difference. Thank fuck Pep doesn't have Ozil at his disposal, that would be scary.

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You don't replace Ozil. The number 10 role becomes redundant. I think he could benefit from playing a deeper role as a CM to be honest but he's a bit lightweight.

Hypothetical, but if we play Lewandowski with Alexis up front and Ozil behind, isn't that a diamond system?

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

I asked you who you'd replace Ozil with

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Hugh Mungus.

I think your debates with Sherbert has finally caused you to have a stroke and you're now in your recovery P n G.

Though I do recall Ozil actively being ignored by his International team mates for 45 minutes before then finally coming into his own. Ozil has been desperately let down by the manager and his team mates.

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Originally Posted by Blink 1nce Quince 2wice

I think your debates with Sherbert has finally caused you to have a stroke and you're now in your recovery P n G.

Though I do recall Ozil actively being ignored by his International team mates for 45 minutes before then finally coming into his own. Ozil has been desperately let down by the manager and his team mates.

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:lol: Am I out of line?

Last season was a travesty. The manager and players certainly didn't help Ozil but seeing where we are this season, I worry we'll see a repeat of that because I don't think Wenger will be patient with Sanchez or Perez up front. Which leads us back to the inevitable inclusion of Giroud. He's not an awful player but if we go down that road, we have to try something different because I can't see Ozil changing or Giroud. Ozil would probably thrive more with an off the shoulder pacey striker, not a target man like Giroud, but Giroud would probably thrive more off a more aggressive mobile AM or shadow striker.

How do you see things in light of what happened last season? The transfer window is over and Wenger isn't going anywhere for now.

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

You don't replace Ozil. The number 10 role becomes redundant. I think he could benefit from playing a deeper role as a CM to be honest but he's a bit lightweight.

Hypothetical, but if we play Lewandowski with Alexis up front and Ozil behind, isn't that a diamond system?

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I wouldn't know, I don't pay any attention to any of that. All I know is if you get those 3 on a pitch and get them near the opposition goals then you'll score goals. Supplement with players who can cross a ball, and pass and have a bit of ambition and you're in good shape. The more I think about our summer signings the more bizarre it all seems. The club was willing to spend 90mill after all, or forced to, or whatever. But we weren't willing to go out and get that striker we've needed for an age, and I don't pay any attention to the idea none were available. That's BS, in the world of football it's about the money. Put the money on the table and the greedy bastards who are up for a cut will make any deal happen.

Instead we end up with a rag-tag bunch of overpriced second raters, with the exception of Xhaka perhaps. Ok, not good. Then the first CL game comes along and that manager sits the new CM and striker on the bench.

I really don't think there's any point in trying to figure out what's happening at Arsenal any more. There's no plan, no system, no anything except crazy randomness. Bit like a drunk pilot wildly lurching away from one looming mountaintop and towards the next, all while flying upsidedown because he's too drunk to know which way is up. The crash is inevitable. Trying to figure out the best formation at Arsenal is like inquiring when the drinks will be served on that crazy plane.

So, we wait for the next fireball but this time we don't let that oiled up pilot anywhere near the controls.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

I wouldn't know, I don't pay any attention to any of that. All I know is if you get those 3 on a pitch and get them near the opposition goals then you'll score goals. Supplement with players who can cross a ball, and pass and have a bit of ambition and you're in good shape. The more I think about our summer signings the more bizarre it all seems. The club was willing to spend 90mill after all, or forced to, or whatever. But we weren't willing to go out and get that striker we've needed for an age, and I don't pay any attention to the idea none were available. That's BS, in the world of football it's about the money. Put the money on the table and the greedy bastards who are up for a cut will make any deal happen.

Instead we end up with a rag-tag bunch of overpriced second raters, with the exception of Xhaka perhaps. Ok, not good. Then the first CL game comes along and that manager sits the new CM and striker on the bench.

I really don't think there's any point in trying to figure out what's happening at Arsenal any more. There's no plan, no system, no anything except crazy randomness. Bit like a drunk pilot wildly lurching away from one looming mountaintop and towards the next, all while flying upsidedown because he's too drunk to know which way is up. The crash is inevitable. Trying to figure out the best formation at Arsenal is like inquiring when the drinks will be served on that crazy plane.

So, we wait for the next fireball but this time we don't let that oiled up pilot anywhere near the controls.

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We can’t overlook that sort of stuff. This is how I imagine it would look if we played with two strikers, Ozil behind with wide players that can cross. We’ll never get Lewandowski but we can look at it.

-----------Alexis-------Lewandowski------

--------------------Ozil--------------------
Iwobi---------------------------Ox/Walcott
------------------Xhaka--------------------

Monreal------Kos------Mustafi------Bellerin

-------------------Cech--------------------

Swap out the players you don’t think should be starting but we’d be pretty open and fucked over quickly. We’d only have one DM playing if we’re trying to play with wide men. Unless we play the old AC Milan style diamond with the wingbacks overlapping for width and 4 central players making up the diamond. Or it’s a case of playing 3 at the back like Juve do.

This is all hypothetical of course. Nothing will change with Wenger but even if did change or we changed manager, I highly doubt we’d ever see Ozil playing behind two strikers. He’d have to played out wide and allowed to push in.

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Originally Posted by mastermind84

if Alexis ran behind more, he would have more goals and Ozil would have more assists. He doesnt. Thats why he sucks at striker. He chases the ball too much and doesnt stay advanced.

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The point is he does make runs behind and those goals are the proof. Most of our players always come short to get the ball to feet, but Alexis is one of the few who does actually look to break the lines.

He also chases back and tries to win the ball back because that's the type of player he is. It doesn't have to be one or the other.

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Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn

I wouldn't know, I don't pay any attention to any of that. All I know is if you get those 3 on a pitch and get them near the opposition goals then you'll score goals. Supplement with players who can cross a ball, and pass and have a bit of ambition and you're in good shape. The more I think about our summer signings the more bizarre it all seems. The club was willing to spend 90mill after all, or forced to, or whatever. But we weren't willing to go out and get that striker we've needed for an age, and I don't pay any attention to the idea none were available. That's BS, in the world of football it's about the money. Put the money on the table and the greedy bastards who are up for a cut will make any deal happen.

Instead we end up with a rag-tag bunch of overpriced second raters, with the exception of Xhaka perhaps. Ok, not good. Then the first CL game comes along and that manager sits the new CM and striker on the bench.

I really don't think there's any point in trying to figure out what's happening at Arsenal any more. There's no plan, no system, no anything except crazy randomness. Bit like a drunk pilot wildly lurching away from one looming mountaintop and towards the next, all while flying upsidedown because he's too drunk to know which way is up. The crash is inevitable. Trying to figure out the best formation at Arsenal is like inquiring when the drinks will be served on that crazy plane.

So, we wait for the next fireball but this time we don't let that oiled up pilot anywhere near the controls.

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Brilliant :haha:

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Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory

I’ve seen a lot of talk of Ozil checking out early for the season and looking for the exit but do we really want him here if that’s the case? I’m usually on side with the players when it comes to this sort of issue but not in this case. I don’t think Ozil has done anything to warrant such high praise.

People point to what he did last season as proof of his quality but I’m still not convinced. After Christmas he checked out for the rest of the season. When I compare that purple patch/run of good form with other players, such as Ramsey 2013/14 season (34 games, 16 goals, 10 assists) or even Theo’s run (43 games, 21 goals, 16 assists), I’d take either of those guys replicating that form over Ozil’s 45 games, 8 goals and 20 assists.

Maybe he’s hung over from the Euros and needs to get up to speed but it’s disheartening to see us play games without Giroud and have all out pace up front and he’s not threading anyone through. His influence on the game has to extend beyond one decent pass. The chances he’s creating aren’t even killer through balls that sets us up with chance after chance. Heck, against Southampton the stats will say he created 4 chances but not one of those were clear cut one on ones. I really don’t rate him as a playmaker and won’t lose any sleep if he leaves. He’s not essential and I’ll have to see a massive improvement to think otherwise.

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PnG, I know it's already been covered, but I am of the opinion that whilst Ozil is not essential, he's still a great player to have and is simply being tasked with a role that doesn't bear the fruits of his productivity.

He's not perfect, not by any means...he does go into hiding in some BIG games too, for me though...the major issue is that he simply doesn't have the required quality up top to put away the many chances he creates.

Wenger has absolutely failed to buy a top quality striker and he's had 100 of millions to spend over the past 3, what 4 seasons? he's not found anyone...it's ludicrous and a sackable offence.

That aside, I think Ozil doesn't score enough, Wenger did mention it last season and Ozil sniped that his job is to create, sure, his job is to also score goals, especially if he's playing that high up the pitch. Fabregas scored a lot of goals for us in his prime whilst creating a lot of assists, there is no reason why Ozil shouldn't be expected to do the same. Ozil should be comfortably hitting double figures every single season.

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Originally Posted by Penguin

The point is he does make runs behind and those goals are the proof. Most of our players always come short to get the ball to feet, but Alexis is one of the few who does actually look to break the lines.

He also chases back and tries to win the ball back because that's the type of player he is. It doesn't have to be one or the other.

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Alexis mixes it. The guys the shortest guy on the pitch and will score from a header! That comes from making good runs.

Theo is a player that spends the majority of his time on the pitch making runs in behind defenders. He can go games without making a worthwhile contribution but in theory you'd think Ozil would pick him out a lot more and he'd have way more chances on goal. It should be relentless from the pair if it were that simple. Mastermind is off with this one.