Exactly that. It's unbelievable how out of touch he is.
Printable View
Exactly that. It's unbelievable how out of touch he is.
Nah. He is in touch with his inner self, his needs and that of the no ambition owner. Trophies are things that other teams struggle for and we Arsenal may someday luck upon. The business model at Arsenal is to pretend to compete while spending the absolute minimum possible....and keep Wenger from the devastation of retirement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooner23
There is no question that it's daft of people saying it's all Wengers fault, yes he has been the one who has pussied out of the transfer market, he's the one who has not prepared the squad properly for the season and he's the one responsible for one point out of six from our opening two games....and yes we know Wenger has unprecedented responsibility but he is still an employee.
For me the buck stops at the top, if an employee is underperforming and the management structure have done nothing to address it than its the management structure ultimately responsible. The board are contemptible cowards who have allowed this man to become a pastiche of himself, giving the excuse that "Arsene is a stubborn man it's hard to convince him", you don't need to convince him force it on him, I don't remember Wenger threatening to resign when Gazidis brought in Shad Forsythe and Wim Jonker without consulting Wenger....that's because Wenger is stubborn but he's non confrontational he only gets away with what he's allowed to get away with.
I have never heard a football manager at a top club talking about how he worries more about paying the 600 employees than anything else.
Also never forget, there is a drain in the car park that consistently overflows. This drain will not repair itself. It will take money to repair it. Do we spend that money on transfers instead?Quote:
Originally Posted by AFC Leveller
Force it on him? That's bad management. I wouldn't want the Board to go that way. They just need to allow him to fall on his own sword. If he's convinced Rob Holding is the answer, then they should hold him to it. If the kid has a bad season or hardly plays, they need to hold him accountable for his decision. I wouldn't want a structure where we force players onto the manager and then look to blame him if it doesn't work out. I wouldn't care so much in Wenger's case, but not if it sets a precedent for the future. Either way, I don't think anyone can really say for sure if Holding is a good or bad signing. They need to just let it play out and play that press conference back to him if we have defensive problems this year.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
Yes, but if we go through the cycle again and Holding turns out to be less than we need (which would hardly be a surprise) then should we also wait for the next cheap option that follows to play out a season before we condemn the manager? Where's Sanogo? Some fans were furious when he arrived, others said give him a chance. The inevitable transpired. Wenger does this endlessly and he should be judged harshly on his catalogue of failure. Yes of course we give the player a chance, but I think Wenger's chances have all been used up. I hope Holding comes through to be a top player, but I also say fuck you Wenger for going the cheapskate route again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
You always engage in deflection rather than realism. What does it take for you to realise that Arsenal have no board, Not in the true sense of it. The management structure at Arsenal is 2 step. Kroenke on top, Wenger directly below him. Trying to blame the board is something you and sometimes Letters always engage in. Thats why some say you have Wenger leanings. You need to see your way clear before you can see the source of the problem and the route to the solution.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
Chips and co are just seats in a board room that might as well be a cigar smoking club. There is no board. The same board that has come out to state, that they only do what Wenger wants and when he wants nothing, they do nothing. Wenger talks directly to Kroenke and Gazidis does the jobs that Wenger doesnt want to do like paying the Mortgage bills and maybe the unplugging the toilets after every home game with the Spuds.
If the Board are having to step in to force Wenger's hand, it's a deeper problem because we'll only arrive at the sake problems in the next transfer window and they'll have to do the same. They have to let him go if that's the case and they're having to force him to see sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
The season when Wenger said the same rubbish about Sanogo not being rated because he didn't have a £50m price tag, we did a deadline deal for Danny Welbeck. What if that deal was forced on him? What if scouts came up with the Xhaka signing using Stating? I heard Gabriel had good stats as well. What if he was a suggestion and forced on Wenger? The thing is we don't know what signings the Board have had to lean on him for and what they've left up to him. We all suspect Gazidis had to convince Wenger to sigh Arshavin and that panic buy for Arteta, Merts and Park. They just need to fund the balls to get rid of him if we're at this point.
Some say? :haha: you mean you say.Quote:
Originally Posted by Globalgunner
I am under no illusion that there is no tangible hierarchy at the club and that's my point, but fact remains that Wenger is an employee he serves at someone's pleasure be it the board or de facto the majority shareholder. And ultimately if he is not performing it's incumbent on those in charge to directly intervene and either dispense with his services or at least insist upon him that his current job performance is not acceptable.
Whether that takes direct intervention in terms of transfers P n G is irrelevant, the fact remains either they are happy with how he's doing his job or don't care enough to do anything about it ergo they are 100% responsible.
The situation at Arsenal is pretty clear, to me at least. The board has no authority, they exist only to make pretend at being in charge, It is much the same at Chelsea. The buck stops with the owner. As a board member of a limited liability company you only really have a say in the running of that company if you have shares, No shares means no say. The difference at Chelsea is that the owner, Abramovic really really wants his club to win things and spends his and the clubs money to further that aim. Also, no manager at Chelsea has anything like the authority like Wenger has acrrued over these years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
A similar analogy would be if your brother owned a company and made you the CEO, however he has told all senior management to call him if they have issues with you. You will find yourself blindsided and ignored repeatedly.
This is what we have to contend with at Arsenal. The worst you can accuse the muppets currently on the board of being is serial neglect, taking money for doing next to noithing.
Wenger has sized up the situation quite succinctly. He only has to keep in the good graces of Kroenke and he literally has a job for life. Truth is, every time you try to give Wenger the benefit of the dioubt, he comes out in a short while to confirm by himself everything you suspected against him.
The current board are hostages to greed, The old board sold out big time PHW`s father and grandfather were both former chairmen. Did he have no sons or was the money simply too much to refuse.
I meant 21-22 as a central forward.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
26 at lone striker.
Doesn't change that Van Persie was a much more intelligent player than Sanchez. Sanchez's brain is his problem imo.
Being in the same team as Walcott will reduce your IQ without a doubt.Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermind84
It's Alexis on his own. He is an instinctual street footballer who doesn't process situations fast enough. Great talent but he is not coachable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Globalgunner
Pass distribution chart while Xhaka was on the pitch. We were a lot more even in ball distribution than last week.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CqX66D7W...jpg&name=large
https://twitter.com/11tegen11/status/767295491851821056
This is from last week
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cp-hhiYX...jpg&name=large
https://twitter.com/11tegen11/status/765508404043456512
So when Wenger is still here at the start of next season, whose fault will it be?.....the argument over who is at charge at Arsenal is irrelevant, the fact is someone is and that someone is responsible for Wenger not doing his job. For what it's worth i agree it is the Majority share holder that calls the shots, Wenger won't have received a contract extension in 2014 had it not been countenanced by Enos and he will receive another contract extension regardless of where we finish because Enos is happy with the job he's doing. Enos is the man keeping Wenger in a job, ergo it's his faultQuote:
Originally Posted by Globalgunner
A player holding on to the ball too long or trying to do more doesn't constitute a lack of intelligence. That could just be a player lacking patience and faith in his teammates to do something meaningful with the ball. I'd have to see more consistent flaws in his game to draw that sort of conclusion. When he arrives in the box at the right moment to score or plays a well timed pass, nobody questions his intelligence. I can't draw any firm conclusions about Sanchez up front until he's given a run of games. RVP was a selfish player at times and didn't hit the ground running when he first started there.Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermind84
You say that because he's South American. It's stereotypical and I hardly ever hear people question the intelligence of players like Hazard or Robben.Quote:
It's Alexis on his own. He is an instinctual street footballer who doesn't process situations fast enough. Great talent but he is not coachable.
Hazard and Robben don't play like Alexis. Nothing to do with where he is from. Notice I don't say that about Neymar. I don't say that about Suarez. I don't say it about Agüero. I don't say that about many South Americans. Only Alex's because that's how he plays. He plays on instinct and is often unsure of what the next move is. He also don't play within a structure unless he the main man. His best form at Arsenal was when he was the only healthy first team attacked. He would still be at Barcelona if he was coachable and didn't play on instinct. Don't insinuate I'm being prejudiced on my views of south american attackers. I'm only talking about what I see of Alexis. He don't make runs behind the defense. He drops too deep to collect when he doesn't need too. He runs a lot, but it's not organized and he runs to the ball too much and tries to beat several guys when al he needs to do is beat one and make a pass.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Also, Wenger called him a street footballer several times.
Those charts show clearly why Wenger chased Xhaka and why he was prepared to open "his" wallet, regardless of the fears of the 600 employees. The only problem with this nice new arrangement is it's as ineffective as all the others. Controlling possession does not win games, every counter-attacking team on the planet knows that. Sticking the ball in the net wins games and you can't do that if you have a system that lacks penetrative movement and pace. Well you can, if you have very, very good players all over the pitch who are markedly superior to the opponent. And if you have an opponent that is interested in playing rather than preventing football. And if you have a referee that is prepared to uphold the laws of the game. Basically you need conditions that are the reverse of what's available in the PL. Wenger has built a team that is perfectly unsuited to the league we are playing in. When you watch us play (if you can bear it) we are static for 90% of the time. The passes get pinged around between static players and this is so easy to defend against. We constantly probe, but at a low tempo. So opportunities to penetrate are few and far between. Because we play such a complex and slow paced game we need absolute precision when the rare opportunities arrive .But the vast majority of the time we lack that precision, and so we lose the ball. It really is pathetic to watch. Embarrassing.
And as for Alexis, underneath he must be furious at the shit show he has found himself embroiled in. I agree, he's an instinctive player. But I absolutely disagree that this suggests he's not an intelligent player. Rapid bursts of energy, decisive movement, pace, opportunism, these are his hallmarks. If he set out to pick a team that is most incompatible with what he brings then he couldn't have done better than Arsenal. We have wasted this player. Much like we have wasted Ozil. Prime ingredients thrown into a shit stew in the hope they can magically transform the recipe. Wenger is beyond clueless. And yes, I know he's has 20 years dealing with every sort of footballing matter imaginable. I don't question his experience, I question how he uses that experience. It's shocking how inept he is.
We watch Alexis play and clearly see he is best as a right attacker.
Alexis thinks his best position is on the left.
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/arsenal-sta...t-left-1474610
He not smart. And it's becoming clear he not that fast over longer distances. (He is very quick over short distances and has great acceleration)
His movement ain't that good and he doesn't anticipate moves well.
Obviously he is shit. Winning the golden ball and best player at the last Copa america notwithstanding. We should sell him and put Walcott up front.Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermind84
I never called him shit, tbf.Quote:
Originally Posted by Globalgunner
World class talent with a 10 cent brain is more apt.
It looked like Leicester created the best chances. It's a pointless signing if it's not going to make a major difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
Of course he won't make all the difference. All the attacking players sucked and Santi was too far forward. No idea why Bellerin and Theo were on the same spot.
Clearly need an attacker with better movement.
We've always known we've needed better attackers and movement. That was obvious after signing Ozil. We need to hope something clicks with this team and we were lucky not to lose that one. Vardy had a good chance on goal after Xhaka had the ball pinched off his toes and they should have had a penalty at the end. We beat this team twice last season and dominated possession in both ties. Charts on how our distribution looks more even is pretty irrelevant considering we drew and hardly created clear cut chances.Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermind84
Distribution may have looked better compared to what we saw at Liverpool but the last time we faced Klopp's team we drew 3-3 and they held 60% of possession. We'll have to see how we cope against different set ups and do some tweaking of our own. But if we need more movement up front, Giroud is definitely not the man for that. We're going to end back at square one hence why I think we need to have some patience with Sanchez or Walcott up front if you think Xhaka needs that for his game to thrive.
Leicester should have had all 3 points with the penalty they should have had, we got lucky and luckily for Wenger he has a much easier game next weekend, he can come out and gloat after we've won that ignoring everything that's taken place before just like he always does.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
We didn't a DM though, we had Elneny and Coquelin, it's a luxury signing when we're desperate for players up front and in central defence, typical of LeClown though.
I don't trust Wenger to get the best out of any player.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
He's supposed to be a CM but he seems too similar to what we already have. If he were a box to box type that could dribble and power through the middle, I'd understand the signing. But another player that's main weapon is his passing just isn't enough from. The looks of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Özim
Neither do I, the system is a mess, happens at the start of every season where he spends the first 10/12 games basically trying to shoehorn in players in any position possible, he'll stumble across a formation that works at some point, he always does.Quote:
Originally Posted by adzzzbatch
Yeah this is what worries me about Xhaka too, he looks neat and tidy but don't we have enough of those type players? I really don't fully understand this signing at the moment. Wouldn't someone like Kante have been a more suitable signing for us? I dunno...Wenger just seems to collect players he likes and not buy players what the TEAM actually NEEDS.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Wenger has got some sort of weird obssession with midfielders who pass and tap the ball 5 yards, we're loaded with them and lack players in other areas and yet the guy continues to sign the same type of player, odd man.Quote:
Originally Posted by selassie
we did. Xhaka adds verticality to the passing. He showed it on Saturday. Vertical passing has been something this midfield has lacked for a long time. I dont understand how it was a luxury signing, lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by Özim
we just saw an improvement in our passing in his first start, and you lot think he is similar. I dont know what matches you guys watch sometimes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
the problem with this team is our forward line. And im going to put it out there, all of them are at fault. Alexis, Theo, whomever on the left.
Or the problem is we don't actually have a striker?Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermind84
Square peg in round hole solutions, what's the point? It's totally nuts that we still haven't addressed the Centre forward position. Just buy a f*cking Striker Wenger!!!
Did we have a problem with our passing last season against Leicester City? We beat them twice last season and dominated possession on both occasions. What problem has he solved considering we drew that game and created little?Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermind84
When he played the first half against City, we struggled badly until Elneny came on. Against better and more aggressive opposition, he might not have played so well. That's my worry.
Precisely, we beat them twice last season, once 5-2 without Xhaka, yet with him we draw 0-0. Xhaka doesn't bring anything we actually really needed, we should have bought a more dynamic midfielder willing to make penetrating runs at defences.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Right and how has that helped, did we beat Leicester cos we did last season, comfortably in fact with the same squad other than Xhaka (amd holding).Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermind84
im mad at Wenger too, but saying that Xhaka was a luxury signing is madness.Quote:
Originally Posted by selassie
He is a midfielder we needed for ages. Give him time to settle. I reckon he will kick it up by October because his quality is absolutely abundant.
One, you value preseason more than you should. We didnt struggle in that match that first half, and created a bunch of chances. I dont think Xhaka played well in that preseason match, but we should have been up a couple of goals in that game. IIRC, you used the second half of that match to show Alexis can play CF when he has gone out in 2 games since and shown he isnt suited for it. You want to give Alexis the chance to show something while casting aside Xhaka? It doesnt make sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Next up, what does Leicester last season have to do with this season? IIRC, Ozil started both matches. He didnt start yesterday.
Also, everyone dominated possession against Leicester last season. THat was their style of play. WE dominated possession Saturday as well, as they are still going with the same style. If I told you we had more shots (13-8), more shots on goal (4-1), and more passes (450-256) than Leicester did you would probably think I was talking out my ass.
until you complain about Arsenal passing it in a ushape and not playing long passes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Özim
What Arsenal needs is better forward play. That has been the problem with this team for some time. That and we have a flabby and sick manager.
Xhaka could turn out to be an excellent player but it's the staunch defence and argument you put up about him being essential that I really disagree with. If he's another player that is dependent on a missing component from our team to shine, he's not essential. We had this same problem with Ozil. We still need a striker for these guys to be influential and since that was the case last season when we had Ozil, Xhaka really wasn't an essential purchase. If we don't sign a striker or if the movement doesn't improve, what's the assessment on Xhaka? Was he still essential? I hope his passing can influence our forwards to make better runs and not have a case where he needs others to be influential.Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermind84
Also, I'm being patient with Sanchez because what choice do we have? Is Xhaka more like to thrive of a his movement or the static and slow movement of Giroud? I also, I think the striker position is one where the player has to learn the pattern of the team and for years we've played with a target man in Giroud. It will take more than 2 games for us to find our rhythm. I think we'd have the same adjustment period even if we signed a new striker.
As for stats, Xhaka created only 1 chance and completed 58/73 passes. 79%.That's not that impressive but stats don't tell the whole story. Either way, I wouldn't hold that Leicester game up as a reason why we needed Xhaka.
Some interesting stats.
Tackles won
Coquelin 5/6
Monreal 4/4
Theo 3/3 :lol: He had 4/6 against Liverpool. He's trying to prove to Wenger he can defend. :lol:
Chances created
Alexis - 3
Bellerin -2
Cazorla - 0 - That's a pretty shocking for Santi. Way too hit and miss.