We could've got in this guy, had Wenger not haggled over the fee :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oqq1hsFQc18
Just look at most of his goals, Giroud can't do anything of the sort.
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We could've got in this guy, had Wenger not haggled over the fee :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oqq1hsFQc18
Just look at most of his goals, Giroud can't do anything of the sort.
We would also have Yaya Toure, C.Ronaldo and Zlatan, if he hadnt haggled for prices when they were young.
Its all Wengers fault. Wenger out :fury:
:good:Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasTC
Tbf we actually did have a deal with C.Ronaldo, #9 printed shirt and everything, but United made a smart move and hired someone from Sporting Lissabon, so Cristiano, the mama's boy he is, didnt have to feel alone and ended up signing for united instead.
No one cares.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasTC
What is happening now is what were interested in.
And that is fucking Groundhog Day again
What really fucked me off before the game was loading up the SSN app and seeing the headlines 'wenger says March will define arsenals season'
I just couldn't believe I was reading exactly what I have done for the past 2-3 years again.
The collapse is on, and at this rate well be lucky to finish 5th.
I have absolutely no faith that we will win anything this year, it's been knocked right out of me.
I've said not strengthening in January was the problem, and I stand by it.
Fuck this shit, wenger can shove his new contract up his arse!
Yet, your biggest argument for hating on your club and manager, is what have happend in the last 8 years :dQuote:
Originally Posted by Jeebus
Not really, it's about now.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasTC
We're blaming Wenger for not improving the team right now.
He hasn't improved the team over the last 8 years either.
If its about now, then why are you guys not happy? :s 4 points from 1st place and quarter-final match at home in the FA cup.
Based on today's performance how many points do you see us picking up in the next four league games away at spurs, away at chelsea, home to man city, away at everton?. One if we are lucky.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasTC
if you are comparing this team to one 8 years ago then yes of course he hasn't improved it but he was never going to because the team 8 years ago just happened to be the finest team he has ever created, and quite simply the greatest team to have won a premier league title.Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchies
He has improved the team this year, the fact that this time last year we were about 15 points off top and this year we are only 4 and still, more by maths then reality still in the title race is huge improvement. lots of areas to work on though which is where Arsene has made his mistakes like not buying a striker. however interesting quotes going around this morning from liverpool's owner. there was a 40 million buy out clause in suarez contract but john henry refused to sell on the basis that he felt Arsenal wouldn't take them to court. shows our information was correct and why we wouldn't go over 40 million because there legally was a buy out clause, the question of should we have gone over is of course valid and yes we should have. ozil and suarez in this team and the title would be ours already.
we have improved, and there is no point looking at the team now and 8 years ago and saying we haven't improved because thats stupid. look at the last two years, races for fourth clinched on the last day, this season could end up going the same way, but it also currently is one game away from wembley. if we somehow come third and in touching distance of the winners and by that i mean 5 points or less then huge improvement has been made and if we get to the FA Cup final and somehow win the thing then it will be an outstanding season. There are huge faults with Arsene, his tactics yesterday were wrong, and I'm not liking this slow starting thing, why can't we play like we did against bayern however players have to take the blame too. Take podolski, acts like he is pissed off being subbed or not starting, yet plays like he did yesterday? some players are coasting and its not good enough but i guess ultimately the blame lies with ARsene. still time to make this season a good one, and yes there has been improvement
in fact the more i look at those fixtures the more it strikes me that top four is an uphill battle for us, spurs and everton have every real chance of finishing above us.
12Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
on a completely unrelated note, this vodka tastes nice
Nah, we aren't the only ones that have tough fixtures. Tottenham have Chelsea away next weekend for instance. Then us, Southampton and Liverpool (a).Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
The only way to judge if we've improved or not is whether we've won something at the end of the season. I don't really care if we're 4 off the top now, because at the end of it, we won't win it. Spurs away, Everton away, Chelsea away, City home, we'll struggle to even get a point or two from these 4, last time we won at SHL in the league was when Ade scored that goal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollie the Optimist
The Fa Cup, yeah it's our strongest chance of winning something. Hopefully we can win it.
well if we get he same points in these fixtures as we did last season we will really adrift by April and nothing suggests that we will or that we have improved that much on last season.
Fulham (h), liverpool (h), Aston villa (a), Chelsea (h), Sunderland (h) picked up nine points more this season from those fixtures than we did last season
City (a), West Brom (a), Villa (h), Liverpool (a), Stoke (a) - picked uo ten points fewer than we did from these fixtures last season.
So it's a bit of a nonsense to say we are substantially better off, the fact that we challenged for the title at all was because all the easier fixtures were played in the first half of our season.
The logic is strong with this one :bow:
I think comparisons of this type are a bit misguided. Take West Brom for instance, playing them away early in the season was a much tougher fixture then that it would be now (like we did towards the end of last season) because the grind of the season had not taken shape and the overall confidence would not be as dented.Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
If we win five games we'll have a point more than last season, that's nothing to shout about of course but I don't really think finishing lower than fourth is in danger. I do think we need Ramsey in his going mental development stage though.
Our defence is the only reason we have any title aspirations. Our attack is garbage by comparison and probably the biggest reason we've started to fade.
Reading that we should've taken Liverpool to court over Suarez, he did have a £40m clause, the cunts played it out perfectly :lol:
John Henry has admitted that Suarez did have a £40m buyout clause but refused to sell him, gambling on Arsenal not taking them to court [AR]
Ffs, should've pressed harder :doh: , offered £50m and we'd have signed him.
Of course it's his fault, he's the manager he lives by the sword dies by the sword. If his team don't win anything for 9 years and fail every time they have a good opportunity there's only one common denominator.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasTC
Dunno how rules/laws work, but can we take them to court now and then get him for 40 (in the summer)?.... Make it happend Arsenal :bow:Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchies
No clue, a big part of it would be if he wants to leave though. If they get CL, is offered even more money, he won't agree terms with us. CL was the only draw.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasTC
Our lack of quality in the final third is shocking. I'm not just talking about our centre forwards, pretty much all of our players are ineffective at breaking down teams and scoring goals and make it hard work every game. Toothless.
There's no chance of getting Suarez, if he moves it will be to one of the really big clubs like Barca, or Real, he seems happy at Liverpool, they look like they'll be in the CL and to be honest they are probably on an upward cycle and a marginally better side than us overall, can't see why he would want to move to us now tbh.
Years ago I remember being infuriated that Wenger had replaced Viera with Cesc. Cesc was talented but too young to take up the burden He would slow our play down so much, then what does Wenger do? Build the team around him. We went form having a powerful, mobile, box to box all rounder, complemented by a sitter in Gilberto to an young inexperienced AMF learning to play CMF and slowing our counters down, and with Gilberto being a sitter we now had sitters. Later on Cesc came good but it took a while when because wasn't ready for the role.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernesto
Then Wenger changed to a possession based style intead of our faster movement based attacking style, and here we are. Little movement, dribbling and penetration, just sideways and backwards passing.
Lack of pace in our attacks that's the problem, when we have played with pace (very rarely) we've looked dangerous, unfortunately Wenger is obssessed with tippy tappy and just won't let it go.Quote:
Originally Posted by Penguin
I think it's boring and largely ineffective, we're better to watch when we release the ball quickly and don't check back or pass it sideways, we're also more likeley to score. The manager is just too stubborn for his own good.
Pretty much and on top of that it's shite to watch to be honest, but you know how it is, he never learns and sticks to his guns year on year. You'd think after failing to pick up anything for 8 years he might consider something different.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tipsychubbs
I won't pull any punches, I put all the blame on Wenger for this, his team, his tactics, his subs, his team selections, his style of play, his decisions not to sign players and rely on crocks.
:good:Quote:
Originally Posted by Özim
I also think that this team knows it has more or les reached its target (top 4) and can afford to take things easily now. These players and manager only get going when their beloved trophy is in danger of slipping away. When Villa were good in 08/09, Wenger went out and bought Arshavin and gave a really good go to make sure we finished top 4. Last season, when we lost to Spuds and looked likely to miss out, the team suddently found their mojo and got there in the end.
I just think that they only get going if/when CL footy is in danger.
I never understood that theory. Cesc plays like he has eyes at the back of his hand and can release an inch perfect pass that sets us off on attack in one move. Surely it's down to the players he's surrounded by and the opposition we face. Games vary. Just look at the contrast between our style in the Champs League when we reached the final to our actual league performance. We were restricted to counter attacks in the Champs League and it was pretty successful when you think of the goals we scored. None of this pinning teams back and trying to break them down, we were hitting teams on the break.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tipsychubbs
In the league, teams were scared to come out and play against us. They'd park the bus, restricted space between the lines and stay compact. You also have to consider the fact that we played with a 4-4-2 for a very long time whilst other Prem teams were playing 4-5-1 or 4-3-3. They always had an extra man in the middle that could press Cesc and Gilberto. Cesc able to evade tackles and pass it off without getting rushed and he'd make the right pass 9/10 times. But Gilberto struggled when pressed and couldn't get the ball from out under his feet or made hurried passes that put someone else under pressure. It was a major issue always have a 2 v 3 situation in the middle of the park and Wenger took too long to address the issue. We finally started playing great possession football and opening teams up when we played 4-3-3/4-5-1. But again, Wenger still cocked things up on squad selection. Playing guys like Nasri, Rosicky or Hleb on the flanks was one issue, but it's extreme when you see him persist with Eboue or Diaby on the flanks. Why? In fact, it took him an age to play Diaby deeper in the midfield like Vieria when he was actually fit. He kept playing him out wide or behind the striker.
Then we have Denilson....fuck knows what he was thinking with that one.
He needs to get his squad selection right and recognise when a certain combination of players won't work. We've always been a team that's held more possession than the opposition. He's from the school of Total Football and his philosophy hasn't changed. I think he's out of ideas and now it's just luck of the draw for us. When he won accolades years ago in this league, it was weaker and we had players light years ahead of the opposition. It's all changed now and he's really struggling.
This is what I'm hoping. The examples of Villa in 08/09 and Spurs last season are very apt, because they were very good sides (didn't Villa record the record number of EPL away wins in a row in 08/09?) We did well to overhaul them.Quote:
Originally Posted by AFC Leveller
In a roundabout way, with the right results, we could find that we are STILL in the title race once Wenger finds that CL football might be jeopardised and asks his players to put extra effort in for the next few big games.
Hope being the operative word :(
People have lost faith for quite few years but they still coming back because they love the club. They have every right to have a go at Wenger and club's top hierarchy. :coffee:Quote:
Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
DaQuote:
Originally Posted by milla
I guess we can look forward to a week of apologies from all the ex Liverpool cronies then, who were slating us for the insulting / disrespectful / risible / disgraceful / classless / etc way we conducted our business last summer, with our offer of £40m and 1p? Which, as it turns out, was all we were obliged to offer...Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchies
Very much doubt it, although as it turns out Henry has the least integrity of anyone concerned. Maybe that's why he shouted loudest.Quote:
Originally Posted by I am invisible
A part of me actually thinks good on him? I mean, players and agents are quick enough to ignore what's in these contracts when it suits them, so you have to say turn around is fair play. It's the way we were ridiculed and mocked by all and sundry that's irked me. Were things like the 'What are they smoking at the Emirates?' comment really necessary? Was all the faux-indignation really necessary? Was it necessary to make every slight detail of what was going on public and to make such a big bloody deal about it? And yet we're the ones who came out of it apparently lacking class and respect, even though we pretty much just kept our mouths shut throughout the whole debacle.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niall_Quinn
We've also had to endure a season's worth of question marks about our lack of ambition, our competence in the transfer market, and even accusations of professional negligence on the part of the manager for not signing a striker, when, as it happens, we'd actually done everything that was necessary to sign one of Europe's best? I'd say 90% of the anger and in-fighting i've seen amongst our fans this season has stemmed from this one issue. Why didn't we sign a striker in the summer? (Well, actually we did everything necessary to sign probably the best option we could have got.) Why didn't we sign one in January? (This issue should have been irrelevant.) Giroud isn't good enough to start for a club like ours, our back-up options aren't good enough either, and we have no one who can score against our main rivals. (Suarez would have been plenty good enough to start, and Giroud would have been fine as back-up.) We're running some players into the ground because we don't have anyone else to play in those positions. (An extra body would have gone some way to helping that, especially one who can play right across the front line.) Özil is going to waste without having a world class striker to aim for. (Problem solved.) We don't have enough pace in the attack and lack variety in our shape and tactics. (Again, we'd be well on the way to addressing those problems too.) Even shock results like Saturday's would be easier to absorb, if we'd been scoring for fun all season long, and had more points on the board?! Sure, there'd still be some justifiable ranting and raving, but it might have meant the difference between just venting your spleen and moving on, and demanding that the manager, the board, the owner and half the team are burned at the stake?
Anyway... rant over. I don't like getting this riled by football, and I don't particularly like directing any of this at Liverpool, who I don't actually mind, when there are far bigger a-holes in the game. I just wish Henry's little bluff hadn't come at our expense, because it really has caused a lot of grief for us...
Admittedly now that the whole "Suarez" saga has come out we were just unfortunate/unlucky regarding it. Liverpool's screaming and posturing was obviously their way of deflecting attention away from themselves and putting it onto us and unfortunately it worked. Ultimately, we fell short because Suarez didn't try and force through the move, he choose to stay at Liverpool. It was pretty impressive of Liverpool to keep their star player, how comes they can convince their star player to stay without the offer of any European football yet we struggle to keep ours even though we regularly qualify for CL?Quote:
Originally Posted by I am invisible
Despite all the above regarding the Suarez saga, it should not be an excuse not to strengthen the attack, if Suarez wasn't available then we should have sought other options. We had all of the Summer to buy an upgrade on Giroud, regardless of that Suarez situation, we really should have had some kind of contingency/back up plan to buy someone else.
Our inability to strengthen problem areas has become a major problem for me and highlights our lack of planning in regards to player recruitment. It has happended once too many times to be called an accident and I personally think a club of our stature needs to operate a lot more efficiently in the market.
I accept that purchasing a world class striker in the January Market was nigh on impossible, yet we go looking for "crocked" central midfielders? Why? What on earth is that all about? It wasn't even a position we needed strengthening in?
Ah mate, don't get me started on Kallstrom! That was just bizarre, and I suspect it'll be another one like Park where we never really know why the hell he was signed?Quote:
Originally Posted by selassie
As far as excuses go for the lack of a striker signing though, I think the ones we're looking at here are actually perfectly valid? If we're accepting that it's nigh on impossible to get someone decent in in January, then that pretty much leaves us looking at what happened in the summer, and, from what I'm now reading, it sounds like we generally did the thing, but just got screwed over by third parties not doing their jobs properly (by which I mean Suarez's incompetent agent and legal team)? They way a lot of people now like to tell it is that we abandoned a sure thing in Higuain for a total gamble in Suarez, but the truth is it was actually the other way round: the Higuain negotiations were dragging on and on and on, Real kept moving the goal posts over price, there was more competition from other clubs, and the player himself wasn't even 100% convinced about joining us - IMO, we abandoned that for a surer thing in Suarez, who had a set release clause that we were willing to pay, where there was no other competition from other clubs, and where the player was willing to join. Add to that he was (and is) a better, more versatile player and PL ready, and I'm not sure what other choice people would have made n the club's place? I'd certainly have done the same thing (bearing in mind, that, at the time, we didn't know what we know now). Unfortunately, these two deals conspired to waste virtually our whole summer (and, IMO, the Higuain talks wasted as much of our time as Suarez), and left us almost no time to sort anything else out of an acceptable standard - granted, there's an argument to be made that maybe we should have signed any old striker as a stop-gap, but we tried that with Ba (OK, maybe that was a bad choice on our part). And, as one of the blogs put it, we kind of already have 'any old striker' in Bendtner and Sanogo - I really don't think that kind of signing would have helped much.
What there will be no excuse for is not having a new target / list of targets already lined up for this summer, for not doing our background research properly, and for not getting down to business the very second the window opens. That may be tough in a WC year, but we should be laying the ground work now, sounding out agents, players and clubs. And I agree that we need to become A LOT more efficient at how we operate in the market - this big-spending malarky may be relatively new to us, but we need to get to grips with it fast! Like, in-the-next-3-months fast...
I'm not sure why anyone is so surprised by Sat - we see the same every year & we will do for every year Wumger is manager. On the field his only claim to fame in the last 9 years is our continued C.L. qualification. I'm afraid we need to miss out this year for the board to even think about getting rid of him or him doing the decent thing & walking. What's the use of qualifying, whatever money we make from it won't be spent on adding quality & the lack of quality will mean a last 16 exit anyway. Tactically he has lost the plot & is out of his league against top managers nowadays. The Sonogo chance at the end of the game sums up Arsenal. If you don't buy quality, you don't get quality. That miss & some of Girouds this year could mean millions of pounds of lost revenue - do we build this into the equation when Wumger won't spend the extra to get the likes of a Suarez.