Interesting video and the comparison of the Invincibles. What the heck happened? Used to score goals in 5 passes now it takes us 500 to score 1.
Interesting video and the comparison of the Invincibles. What the heck happened? Used to score goals in 5 passes now it takes us 500 to score 1.
Barcelona happened. Then WUMger thought he would abandon his own blueprint for success and (poorly) imitate theirs.
I'll keep saying it - we have no cunts in the team. Almost zero cynicism.
Get that back into the spine of the first eleven and you'll see a massive difference.
Every successful team has their fair share, we used to. It's no surprise that since they left, we haven't won the league. We used to have players opposing teams loved to hate. Now? Not really. Just written off as skilful technicians.
The biggest problem was that the essential pub ethic that is so essential to winning the PL wasn't passed on by the Invincibles as it was to them by the back four of old. They all shipped out of the club too quickly and so there was no continuation of that ethic. Wenger was never going to instil it, that had to from the players but Wenger clearly didn't value it highly enough. That has been one of his biggest mistakes, especially when he leaves his players to their own devices to much.
I don't see how that would make a big difference. We'd kick people more, get more bookings and give away freekicks but what happens when we can't defend the set piece? We'd still be that same tippy tappy team with no purpose going forward but just a bit dirtier. It wouldn't solve our problem imo. What brings it home for me is when Henry said that we'd be in the opponents box with a goalscoring opportunity in 3 to 4 passes. Always looking to play the ball forward. That's a million miles away from the way we're playing now. We need to get that back. Quick bursts of attacks instead of working through gears and trying to build momentum in our attacks.
On the defensive side, we are better and wouldn't say we need cynicism. We just need everyone to have that defending as unit mentality which is what we saw last season. We scored some good counter attacking goals like the old days when we focused more on our defensive shape but now it looks like we're back to the old tippy tappy, squeeze the opponents in their box style.
You don't think that Invincibles side had that in spades? Look at Chelsea, Man City or Man U. All have had and currently have horrible players that have the right mentality for this game. It's naive to think otherwise. Wenger has brainwashed even those fans that want him out into thinking his approach is the right way. It will never work in this league. It can't. It is too raw and aggressive to be played completely the right way. To be a winner you have to be cynical too, able to play dirty - sometimes more obviously than not - but without it you'll be a flash in the pan. The old guard at this club were English scrotes, who understand the horrible side of the game and that was taken on by physically strong players who had flair. Once they left, so did that cynicism and any hint of real success that came with it. Get in guys with the right mentality and physique in places, get rid of speed merchants we play on the wing that 'do a job' and get some specialists who can do the job properly and suddenly things change. Every single title winning side has a few scrotes (as we clearly used to) combined with some flair and proper width. Wenger has even convinced people that Ox, Theo, Welbeck and co are sufficient because they are fast. Absolute rubbish. All those players want to play in the middle and even the managers longer term plan is to play then centrally. He's turning our first eleven into a learning centre, so players can learn their trade in other positions and all the while the team suffers.Originally Posted by Power_n_Glory
Defensively we are only better by our previously low standards. Again I'll keep repeating, our 'improvement' was built off the back of the lesser teams. Look at the results against the top 8 last season and let's discuss how much we improved when it really mattered. Last season the perception was that Citeh had a awful season, yet they still only conceded a few more goals than us. The English media is full of bullshit cliches but some of them are actually true and if someone like Keown says we need a leader in our back line, then given his experience, I'd sit up and listen. Kompany, Vidic, Terry - all massive wankers but the type of player that would instantly improve our defence, if we can look beyond our bias for a second. Fergie'd teams were full of horrible cynical shits but they knew how to play too (well bar the latter years). Why do you think he included Fletcher in title winning squads? For his technical ability? No, because he knew he had bundles of energy and acres of cynicism.
This change can only take place once Wenger leaves and a new mentality is hopefully installed. Until then, we will have to swallow the slow side-to-side football that has taken hold of this team. Ship out the dead wood in the starting eleven and squad and we have to start again. Look at the state of the games played in this league, it has slowly descended into park football season on season, glossed over by billions being spent and flashy presentation. Either we eventually get with it or forget talking about the title ever again.n
You have rose tinted glasses on when you think back to the Invincibles. Sure we played some great, direct passing football but those boys also knew when to disrupt a game, put in a foul, stick up for their team mates and become just as thuggish as the stadium crowd that bays them on.
Last edited by Kano; 02-09-2015 at 11:33 PM.
You do realise the Invincible squad won the Fair Play Award, right? Being tough and able to win a tackle is one thing but we don't need cynicism.
Last edited by Power n Glory; 02-09-2015 at 11:48 PM.
Agreed - there was a mentality in those teams that did not put up with any BS from other teams but could dish it out themselves. GN and JC highlighted it in the video, those Arsenal teams had other teams scared in the tunnel before the game because they knew they were in for a fight, GN "it was never fun to play games against Arsenal". Im a believer in the psychological aspect of sport and I do believe that this does influence the outcome of matches.
The whole period when we were challenging for titles regularly featured games where we'd pick up yellows and a stack of red cards - I think over two thirds of the sending offs we collected under Wenger were by players who who were in those teams. It is no coincidence that since our overall discipline improved, our general performance levels have dropped. As you said, there was a fear about playing our old teams, not just because of their ability but because they knew they would impose themselves physically on their opponents too. But you don't just gain the rep of being a bastard by just being a thug, there is a lot more that goes into the dark arts of managing a game and undermining the opposition.
I don't know if anyone else followed the youth side that much, but Coquelin and Wilshere actually formed an excellent midfield partnership in that side that won the Youth Cup under Steve Bould? Haven't had much of a chance to see those two next to each other in the senior side yet, but I'd be interested to see if they've still got that same understanding? Wilshere is better at defending than people generally give him credit for (or at least he's not shy about putting in a challenge), and Coquelin is a better passer and dribbler than people think. Are there better individuals out there? Probably. But as MarcO says, those little partnerships and understandings can sometimes lift you up another level.
I'd certainly like to see Wilshere used in one of those deeper roles, whether he's paired with Coquelin or not. He's a very similar player to Rosicky, for me, who I've also always thought was far better suited to playing deeper, with the game in front of him. Might stop him getting injured so much too, if he's not constantly running at a wall of massive CBs and getting chopped down every 5 minutes? Never thought I'd say it, but England have the right idea here...
I would agree about the partnership of Coquelin and Wilshere if the latter was able to stay fit, to be honest we have given Wilshere chance after chance to stay fit and really he has to go at the end of the season if he doesn't feature in at least half the games.
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