Was Man United a watershed?

[Olivier's xmas twist]

I kind of agree with you - for me, its a question of whether Wenger decides himself to leave. I mean you can hide behind the stadium project all you like, but there has to come a time at which you see how far your footballing legacy has come crashing down. For me, footballing wise AW continues to pat himself on the back (and in fairness, with some justification) for delivering CL football. When he no longer does so - and his stock has fallen so low that he cannot even draw the project players he wants to - I can see him walking...and I am probably one of the only people who doesn;t want him to move upstairs either, because his power and ego will end up screwing over whoever we get in.



Its going to be messy any which way you look at it.

The other point I'd make is that for all the virtues of having a long serving manager, the default position is that they will get stale. SAF has bucked the trend, but that is because he has always shared the burden by having a number 2 who can challenge him. Wenger has done the opposite - even, it would seem, with Steve Bould who clearly has no autonomy, because I simply don't believe that Bould would tolerate Santos, or Vermaelen's form.

Not really the board have said they would never sack him, so he will walk when he is ready not before. If he is about money, now then i don't think he'd be bothered about his reputation. His problem is he likes to stick to his principles. Which is fine sometimes though, you need to be less stubborn and admit when your wrong. He knows Project youth failed, henced why he has changed it up, but he will never say it failed.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

For set pieces and regardless who used it in the past, we're no good it and need to man mark players for corners and set pieces.

What does it matter when you have defenders like Dojo in your team, shit is shit no matter what marking you use lol.

[server too busy!]

We need proper wingers, having Podolski on the left just basically means we're a man down. He isn't a winger and can't take people on so he ends up passing back and we just play through the middle. Its so easy to defend.

When Arshavin came on you could see an immediate change. Same goes for Ramsey. We need proper wingers, Podolski and Giroud can take it in turns up front depending on the opposition. As soon as we get more width we will become more a threat and Giroud can be utilised properly.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Was reading Arseblog and this part struck me.



As LDG said also, we could see Arteta was getting marked out of the game but he did nothing for entire match. I don't particularly rate Arteta as a DM because he's not mobile enough or comfortable enough to drop deep, turn and pass the ball off quickly to mount an attack. He's not strong enough to hold his man off either. I've always rated Song for being able to do this with ease when playing as a DM and it really helped players like Cesc to just roam forward and find space. Fergie was in the stands and looked at where to target and he made sure all the attacks came down Santos' side and stuck Rooney on Arteta and kept a tight leash on Cazorla.

Wenger has lost it. He's stale, stubborn and we can all see it. Now the question is, how can things change? He won't listen to his players. People may disagree with RVP telling Wenger who to sign, but the captain should be able to speak to his coach about these things especially if you are asking him to commit his final years to this club. Henry did it as well. Wenger probably lied to him during the first contract talks and promised he'd bring in quality signings and when that didn't happen, Henry was pissed and went to the press as our season started to unravel again. So what are the options if he won't listen to his players, ex players, critics and pundits and seems blind to the results we see week in week out?

A boycott of games would be fantastic but failing that, the fans just need to kick up a right stink at the Emirates so the message is loud and clear. It seems like the only way now.

It would be, but it won't happen, fans say this every year and we see a little protest and they go back for more.

Henry did it as well. Wenger probably lied to him during the first contract talks and promised he'd bring in quality signings and when that didn't happen, Henry was pissed and went to the press as our season started to unravel again

Henry wanted to win the CL and he knew he could never do that with us, whether he was lied to is a different issue. Henry would not have stayed anyways. RVP was different.

The question we need to ask ourselves is why the board have let Wenger get away with so much. Like you have always said, he has so much authority at the club its stupid.

Its clear he needs a figure like Dein to give him a nudge, he clearly listened to Dein, no one can deny that. I mean we don't know the board could have given him lots of warnings, but i doubt they have.

They should never have let him and Ivan have the run of the club. Its simple.

"Arsene your job is to manage the team", I've always hated the idea managers being involved in transfers. Do it the barca way, where they have people to do it for them and let the manager focus on the team.

"Ivan your job Sort out the deals"

Ambition starts from the bottom to the top. If Roman does not have ambition, he don't employ a manager who does.

[Power n Glory]

man marking still concedes goals and no-one criticises that. it's no magic fix.

have all the systems you want in place but if players switch, as ours regularly do, it won't make a difference.

Of course it's not a magic fix but it makes very little sense in playing a system that puts the players at a disadvantage. It's all well and good talking about Brian Clough, but this is Wenger. Why persist with a system that makes us vulnerable? We conceded less from set pieces last season and looked more comfortable dealing with them.

[Syn]

About defending set-pieces, I think we're ok. Not perfect but who is. We have looked weaker than last season and I think a lot of that is down to not having a dominant Szczesny. Plucking balls out of the air is Szczesny's main strength and was solid throughout last season. Need him back and on form and we'll look less vulnerable. But, again, how many league goals have we conceded from set-pieces this season? Statistically we have to compare quite well. For all the focus on defending (even Wenger said we lost the game because of a defensive error), it's creating chances that's the biggest problem atm. No easy out-ball out wide is killing us.

[Kano]

Of course it's not a magic fix but it makes very little sense in playing a system that puts the players at a disadvantage. It's all well and good talking about Brian Clough, but this is Wenger. Why persist with a system that makes us vulnerable? We conceded less from set pieces last season and looked more comfortable dealing with them.

the point is, this system is nothing new and its being banded about as some sort of new fangled conception that is ruining defending.

playing zonal, man or dick marking it won't make a slight bit of difference. if we were man marking, would it then be better for us to switch to zonal? because exactly the same things would be happening.

every team zonal marks in open play and mostly when defending - its just more 'tactical' nonsense thrown out there without much thought.

[LDG]

About defending set-pieces, I think we're ok. Not perfect but who is. We have looked weaker than last season and I think a lot of that is down to not having a dominant Szczesny. Plucking balls out of the air is Szczesny's main strength and was solid throughout last season. Need him back and on form and we'll look less vulnerable. But, again, how many league goals have we conceded from set-pieces this season? Statistically we have to compare quite well. For all the focus on defending (even Wenger said we lost the game because of a defensive error), it's creating chances that's the biggest problem atm. No easy out-ball out wide is killing us.

Pretty much.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

About defending set-pieces, I think we're ok. Not perfect but who is. We have looked weaker than last season and I think a lot of that is down to not having a dominant Szczesny. Plucking balls out of the air is Szczesny's main strength and was solid throughout last season. Need him back and on form and we'll look less vulnerable. But, again, how many league goals have we conceded from set-pieces this season? Statistically we have to compare quite well. For all the focus on defending (even Wenger said we lost the game because of a defensive error), it's creating chances that's the biggest problem atm. No easy out-ball out wide is killing us.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

I don't think Bould would persist with this zonal marking plan either. I doubt anyone would want Wenger on the Board or involved with the club after he has gone. But he will and will probably be able to appoint his replacement.

Thats not what they say. PHW and CO i mean. End of the day even if Wenger is upstairs and a new manager comes in he has no control of the team, which is where he is failing.