So, how do WE win the league?

[Özim]

Would you rather have had Liverpool's season then?

I think Liverpool have been a car crash to be honest, but I'm not entirely sure.

Part of me wants to see the club pick up a trophy again, it also feels that although we qualify for the CL we have 2 hopes of winning it, Bob hope and no hope, there's something very predictable.

I know you can always get lucky, but I just don't feel we can, you need grit determination and qualities we completely lack to get lucky, a bit like Chelsea this year. They're not a great side but they have real fighters and players who have won trophies before, when they need to be they can be rock solid, remind me of Arsenal under Graham in a sense.

I'd take our season over there's I think, however they haven't set the bar very high.

[Globalgunner]

We cannot win the league or anything under Wenger. Ask yourself honestly. If Wenger had been managing either Manchester club, would either of them have won the league?. No

He no longer has what it takes and does not have the honesty of self appraisal to accept that he cannot do it. Start of next season you will hear the same claptrap out of him and by Xmas he will be telling us how coming 4th is a fantastic achievement. We are going nowhere, unfortunately as is Wenger.

[Power n Glory]

Wenger has failed in certain ways but while a top 4 finish shouldn't be the limit of our ambitions the sad reality these days is a top 4 finish, with the associated CL qualification, has become more important than a domestic trophy. Clubs below us have spent big year on year to try and unseat us and repeatedly failed. Did you think we'd finish 3rd this year? I bloody didn't. We lost our 2 best midfielders and had a car crash of a start to the season. Everyone wrote us off this year including most of our fans and yet here we are, Wenger's delivered again. We should be winning trophies too of course and that is where Wenger has failed. I do think things need to change at Arsenal but whether the thing is Wenger, or just Wenger, is debatable.

RVP delivered more like it. We haven't played well this season and I've never seen us so dependent on one player before. RVP can't do that again next season.

But that's besides the point. If we're approaching Wenger's final year, what's the harm in looking for a new manager now? In fact, it'a pretty sad to hear you just accept a champions league qualification as our lot.

[Joker]

It's possible to at least be competitive in the league without spending money like City. There are top quality players out there who can replenish the squad and City won't be after all of them. We only need to look at Newcastle and the gems they were able to pick out this season. We have been saying for years that the squad is not strong enough, and we don't need to sign players like Messi to augment the squad with quality. Given that we don't seem to spend much of our transfer fund that we make through player sales, surely enough has built up for us to actually build a strong enough squad that can go for the domestic cups and be challenging in the EPL? That doesn't need to cost $100M.

[Syn]

If he says yes, he's lying.

Not necessarily. Just depends on how much weight your preferences put on a 'trophy'. For me and seemingly yourself, it's not all or nothing. With others, it might be. We all know eachothers views about it and after such a chaotic ending to the season, it says it all about (remembers gary's thread) some gw'ers that we keep on having pages of the same word-for-word arguments. God forbid an interesting, original thought appeared on here. Tbf this topic was a goodun until this shit again.

[GP]

I dunno. If you actually support a team, invest your own time and money in them, then the journey becomes just as important as the destination.

IF you only look at the honours list, then a shiny trophy trumps all.

[Letters]

I think Liverpool have been a car crash to be honest, but I'm not entirely sure.

The reason I ask is that their season has been very similar to our "thoroughly enjoyable" 92/93 season. They even beat their derby rivals in the semi-final like we did in 92/93. The only difference being they lost the Cup Final. We won ours (although it was very close, that could have gone either way, it went to a replay of course which we won late on). Is that one game really the difference between a car crash of a season and a "thoroughly enjoyable" one? Really? Fine lines.

Of course I want us to be winning trophies and I doubt Wenger's ability to deliver them any more but the achievement of finishing in the top few every year should not be dismissed. The CL is where it's at these days and clubs are spending big to try and get in there. The top few shouldn't qualify for the CL but there you go, it is what it is and these days it's more important than a domestic trophy both financially and in terms of a club's stature.

We won't win the CL next year but I still enjoy being in there. The group was good this year, we didn't get a great draw and a lot of people on here doubted we'd progress. We won our group. We got our arses handed to us in Milan but even then the home leg was brilliant and we made a real fight of it. It was a fantastic night, one of the best at the new stadium. I think it's a competition worth being in for lots of reasons.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

I don't see trophies as the be all and end alll, I'd rather win them that not of course but that feeling of joy subsides after a short while. I don't look back with any particular fondness of how we 'won' the FA Cup in 2005 for example.

However at the same time, I don't particularly want the feeling of being stuck in a limbo.

[Power n Glory]

Not necessarily. Just depends on how much weight your preferences put on a 'trophy'. For me and seemingly yourself, it's not all or nothing. With others, it might be. We all know eachothers views about it and after such a chaotic ending to the season, it says it all about (remembers gary's thread) some gw'ers that we keep on having pages of the same word-for-word arguments. God forbid an interesting, original thought appeared on here. Tbf this topic was a goodun until this shit again.

I tell you what, Wenger would have probably moved on or retired by now if he had the season Rafa had when Liverpool won the Champs League.

[Letters]

RVP delivered more like it.

And who bought him and stuck with him despite all his injury problems and people (I was one of them) thought we should cut our losses. You can't disassociate the players from the manager who signed them all.
But yes, we have been way too reliant on him this year and I hope Podolski is an addition, not a replacement.