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Thread: Match Reaction - Arsenal 1-2 Watford

  1. #81
    Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blink 1nce Quince 2wice View Post
    Sherbert...do you still want us to throw FA cup games so we can Ante up for the league challenge/title?
    i don't think it really matters what i want, when i foolishly believed that even with the team we put out against watford our team would actually bother to go and get the three points rather than just assume they are already in the bag yes i thought the fa cup would be an unnecessary distraction.

    But frankly looks like the only way to save our season......i have a nasty feeling we will win it and that will be a wenger reprieve.

  2. #82
    MOe Marc Overmars's Avatar
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    We're as good as in the quarter finals of the cup (unless we sink to an all time low), so it's certainly something we should have designs on winning.

    It's no saving grace though. We're not challenging for the league so as far as I'm concerned this season is already looking like a failure. Again.
    Last edited by Marc Overmars; 03-02-2017 at 12:23 AM.

  3. #83
    ***** Niall_Quinn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie View Post
    http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/footba...-anger-9746051

    John Cross in another quid pro agreement with Arsenal Football club to Harold McMillan us ungrateful prole scum in return for unlimited access for a soapy tit wank interview with AW at end of the season.
    An article by a clueless cunt in support of clueless cunts.

    And that’s the frustration among Wenger and the board is that if you look at the bigger, overall picture, then the club is in good shape.
    The "bigger picture" being, MORE MONEY! SHOOOOOOOW ME THE MONEY Arsene!

    Yes of course they are happy with him and perplexed that fans aren't salivating over soaring share prices, increased revenues and gold plated collateral. They can do all this without having to win a damn thing? That's efficiency.

    We'll just have to wait these cunts out. Eventually something will happen that will sour their milk and they'll move on to wreck something else.
    Für eure Sicherheit

  4. #84
    Member Power n Glory's Avatar
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    When Two Vibes Go To War
    Tim Stillman
    February 2, 2017
    Columnists
    • 6 arses

    I have long suspected that choice is one of Arsene’s great enemies. Squad rotation is not something he has ever shown a particular flair for. I have always thought of him as more of an alchemist than a strategist. Given a low number of options, he is able to forge cohesive teams from scarce materials. His players have let us peer behind the curtain over the years and revealed some fascinating aspects of Wenger’s personality.

    Ray Parlour spins a good yarn about Arsene spilling his desert in the club canteen and not noticing until he got back to his table when he began to poke at an empty plate with his fork. He is a man that thinks very deeply and sometimes that can aid indecisiveness. He rarely seems to plan his squad incomings meticulously- see his ongoing confusion as to the type of player he has bought in Granit Xhaka. From the outside it often appears that he buys players without a cogent plan in how to use them.

    Podolski was, by Wenger’s own admission, signed as a centre forward. Yet he rarely ever actually played there. Alexis’ first three games in an Arsenal shirt saw him play a central striking role, before he was shifted to the right, then the left, before being given another chance upfront this season. Sometimes he seems to hoard players that he likes and then works out how to use them later. This can be a strength and gives him great flexibility, but sometimes the lack of clarity seems to gild the lily of his squad.

    Occasionally, this filters through into his team selections. Arsene places a lot of stock in the human side of management and, again, it is important to articulate that this is probably a great strength. One can only speculate, but it is likely that he gets a response from a lot of his players by treating them well as human beings. It is one of those intangible aspects of his management that attracts opprobrium after bad results, but is never considered a contributory factor to good ones.

    That said, I think sometimes his loyalty to individuals spills over and confuses the collective. Gabriel has been performing reasonably well recently, whilst Olivier Giroud has hit a rich vein of goalscoring form. From the outside, it appears that Arsene can feel obligated to reward individuals with games, even if the overall team chemistry suffers as a result. On Saturday, he selected a weakened team against Southampton at St. Mary’s.

    Yet the eleven turned in a performance greater than the sum of its parts, because there was an obvious identity, which promotes chemistry. With the likes of Welbeck, Walcott, Rene Adelaide and Chamberlain combining, knitted together by Lucas Perez’s impressive play as a false 9, Arsenal had a very clear personality based on mobility and interchangeability. A good team is a team that is well balanced with a good variety of attributes, but ultimately has a detectable modus operandi.

    With Alexis Sanchez playing as a false 9, Arsenal had begun to develop a coherent attacking identity. Flanked by the creative, Rosicky like zip of Iwobi and the penetrative running of Theo Walcott, the Gunners found their most balanced attacking combination in some years. The natural attrition of a gruelling season means rotation is necessary and often enforced. With Walcott and Özil unavailable over Christmas, Olivier Giroud was welcomed in from the cold and scored some vital goals.

    I maintain the impression that the Frenchman is best deployed from the bench, but it was understandable that Giroud was going to have to come in for some games. The issue then became that Arsene found it difficult to drop Olivier, even if the team appears to play its best football with a more mobile striker. As such, Arsenal have turned in a number of confused looking, soporific first half displays over the last month.

    I think this is because Arsenal’s attacking identity has been muddled again. This is not to hang Olivier Giroud out to dry, you understand. Starting Giroud commits your team to a certain style, but Arsene has seemed reluctant to adopt the tactics that allow the striker to flourish. Only in the final 20 minutes when the situation becomes panicked do the team revert to the sort of service he craves.

    Teams that function well do so via a network of symbiotic partnerships. Giroud has a good partnership with Alex Oxlade Chamberlain, who drives to the by-line and also whips crosses in from the touchline. He also has an effective relationship with Lucas Perez, who acts as a very effective foil for the Frenchman. He acts as a kind of second striker to bounce off of Giroud’s clever layoffs and knockdowns- as expertly demonstrated by his wonder strike against Bournemouth. Lucas also takes up good positions in the channels to lash the ball across goal, which is the sort of service Giroud enjoys.

    In other words, if you’re going to start Olivier Giroud, you have to commit to his style. That means being direct, putting in crosses and trying to get to the by-line. On Tuesday against Watford, Arsene’s team selection was indecisive. Iwobi and Giroud do not have much of a relationship at all. The Nigerian partners well with mobile front men like Alexis and Welbeck. He is also far more effective from the left, where he is much more comfortable drifting in field and linking play.

    Starting Iwobi from the right with Giroud upfront created extra dysfunction in a team that was already forced to operate with a jarring central midfield duo and with a centre half at right back. Playing Giroud whilst the likes of Lucas, Chamberlain and Bellerin sat on the bench just exacerbated the bad chemistry. But it kind of looks like Arsene played Gabriel at right back and Giroud upfront out of a sense of obligation to give them minutes and the team’s approach became scrambled as a result.

    This becomes a bigger issue still when you factor in Arsene’s aversion to micro management. The players are left to gather the pieces and form the puzzle themselves. Again, this probably has a lot of invisible benefits that we do not fully realise in the long term. But the manager sometimes makes that job even more difficult for his team when he makes disjointed team selections. There is a certain irony in Wenger making life harder for players he seems to have selected out of a feeling of personal loyalty.

    Conte has not done anything groundbreaking at Chelsea. He bought a couple of players with a particular system in mind, he got the buy in of his squad (admittedly, only after a couple of poor early season results) and he has not indulged the players that have not been able to adapt to it. Long time servants such as Mikel, Oscar and Ivanovic have been deemed surplus to requirements, whilst household names like Fabregas and Terry look on from the bench.

    That kind of clarity gives players a conviction and belief in the style they are adopting. It provides important future proofing, because the team maintains its belief, even after a bad result. For Arsenal to have any chance of rescuing their feint title hopes at Stamford Bridge on Saturday, they are going to have to have a clear strategy and identity. The manager needs to commit to a certain style.

    The team will need complementary partnerships- especially given the forced unfamiliarity of Arsenal’s central midfield; if that means bruising a few egos, so be it. Arsene receives a smorgasbord of critiques throughout any given season, but I pretty sure I am alone in asking him to be a little more stubborn on occasion. But I’m probably not alone in calling for him to be more decisive.
    Good read and sums up the disjointed mess we saw.

  5. #85
    Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
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    I agree, sums up Wenger very well, he is above all else loyal to his players and this is usually why in their post-arsenal careers either at other clubs or in retirement they speak well of him (something that was discussed a few weeks ago in regards to Souness criticising Wenger for it, but at the same token Souness probably thought he was a good manager because his players hated him).

    I have read a lot about him where he wants to treat his players like adults and leave them to figure out how best to use their skills.

    It can work if you have natural leaders in the side and that filters through the squad, but at the moment we don't and it's clearly leading to confusion.

  6. #86
    Member Globalgunner's Avatar
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    The real problem is that none of these principals....ie board members football writers even Arsene himself is a football fan. Football fans want to see their club do great things. Even fans of Torquay dream of winning their league and the FA cup. Fans dont take pride in fancy stadiums and great account balances. Only profiteers do that. None of the current board have Arsenal blood in their veins...least of all the mustachioed corporate raider whose slimy American hands we fell into. These sleazeballs will be quite happy to see another 13 years like the 13 that have gone before. " 2 FA cups...whats not to like?". While other clubs are winning titles and going into the last 4 of the CL dreaming of the big final. They tell us fans that we are spoilt. Why are we complaining?. What about West Ham and Everton fans?. Do we wish to swap places with them?

    Fools just dont get it.

    Football writers are mostly just shit stirring scum. Most support other clubs and pray silently that Wenger gets a new 10 year contract. They want him to stay because they too know he couldnt win a CL in 30 years of trying.
    Make 2mrw better than 2day

  7. #87
    Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
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    Quote Originally Posted by Globalgunner View Post
    The real problem is that none of these principals....ie board members football writers even Arsene himself is a football fan. Football fans want to see their club do great things. Even fans of Torquay dream of winning their league and the FA cup. Fans dont take pride in fancy stadiums and great account balances. Only profiteers do that. None of the current board have Arsenal blood in their veins...least of all the mustachioed corporate raider whose slimy American hands we fell into. These sleazeballs will be quite happy to see another 13 years like the 13 that have gone before. " 2 FA cups...whats not to like?". While other clubs are winning titles and going into the last 4 of the CL dreaming of the big final. They tell us fans that we are spoilt. Why are we complaining?. What about West Ham and Everton fans?. Do we wish to swap places with them?

    Fools just dont get it.

    Football writers are mostly just shit stirring scum. Most support other clubs and pray silently that Wenger gets a new 10 year contract. They want him to stay because they too know he couldnt win a CL in 30 years of trying.
    I'm not 100% convinced that the board are totally satisfied, they are just risk adverse

    They believe with Wenger they are guaranteed a minimum outcome of champions league revenue with not exceptional amount of outlay to get it

    I think at the same time they know whilst Arsenal are not winning things they are denied the same lucrative deals that may be available to bigger clubs, not only that but articles like that appreciate there is fan dissent even though they think fans should be more appreciative of Wenger....it's desperation because they know if the dissent continues it will have a negative impact with attracting sponsorship.

  8. #88
    Member Power n Glory's Avatar
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    People shouldn't be questioning the fans when it comes to turning up late or leaving early. I question why people turn up at all when this sort of shit keeps coming out of the Arsenal PR machine.
    Last edited by Power n Glory; 03-02-2017 at 12:15 PM.

  9. #89
    Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
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    Shouldn't?

    Firstly I'm not the one conflating the two issues, i don't think it's caused by the turgid football and neither do i think it causes the turgid football. Nor do i think it's an issue confined to Arsenal football club

    Feel absolutely free not to contribute if you don't like that i have brought it up, you have made your feelings on the matter pretty clear.

    Yes it's abundantly clear that John Cross has been employed to do Arsenal PR Spin, however i tend to think it may have the adverse effect that they hoped for. If the season goes belly up, fans have been given the distinct impression that kicking up a fuss will make poor Arsene feel unloved i think it's gone too far for fans to say "aww shucks we didn't mean it". And if he signs an extension (which is clearly what they are pushing for him to do) then we can dispense with any lingering pretence that the manager cares about anything other than self-enrichment.

  10. #90
    Member Power n Glory's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie View Post
    Shouldn't?

    Firstly I'm not the one conflating the two issues, i don't think it's caused by the turgid football and neither do i think it causes the turgid football. Nor do i think it's an issue confined to Arsenal football club

    Feel absolutely free not to contribute if you don't like that i have brought it up, you have made your feelings on the matter pretty clear.

    Yes it's abundantly clear that John Cross has been employed to do Arsenal PR Spin, however i tend to think it may have the adverse effect that they hoped for. If the season goes belly up, fans have been given the distinct impression that kicking up a fuss will make poor Arsene feel unloved i think it's gone too far for fans to say "aww shucks we didn't mean it". And if he signs an extension (which is clearly what they are pushing for him to do) then we can dispense with any lingering pretence that the manager cares about anything other than self-enrichment.
    Whatever. Argue now and do a 180 in a few weeks like you've just done on the whole debate about fans having an effective on revenue.

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