Match reaction - Man City

[Niall_Quinn]

That is pretty much exactly how I see it.
The problem isn't that Wenger has changed, the problem is he hasn't while all around him has.

Isn't that what Wenger thinks himself? He's right, isn't he? With all his musings on football and how the game has changed, and how the big clubs are dopers and how the players are disloyal and so on? Everyone else is wrong.

But if he hasn't changed, then why is his record signing striker on the bench for the big game? What happened to the attacking philosophy that bagged titles and the plaudits of every football lover?

The evidence screams of him changing in the most horrible and inexplicable manner. Bringing in pixies to do men's work. Tippy tappy instead of the blistering counter attack. Complaining about being roughed up when we used to be the ones doing the roughing up. He's changed in so many ways. And for the worse. And it looks like he did it deliberately.

[Cripps]

Credit? Deserve? What?

Forget that. I'm pretty sure the gist of this is people don't buy into the excuses you are making for the bloke, regardless of when they first twigged he was a loser.

You just happen to be the last person on here that supports the bloke. I know you'll say you don't and you want him gone and all that. Maybe that's even true this season. But still, so many of your postings have that "but" clause that essentially makes an excuse for every outcome. All too predictable outcomes that can be mapped back over at least a decade and can now be projected into the future with depressing accuracy.

The fanbase has been through many stages of denial, acceptance, grief, anger,.. This is the last stage of the process, where every fan finally accepts the inevitable and the fanbase becomes unified in one goal. Not winning titles, obviously, not winning cups, because it makes no difference, not even winning matches, because we can even predict those too. But getting Kroenke, Wenger and the other leeches out of this place.

That's when it's going to change. When the fanbase has a unified and unbreakable front. And for that to happen, the last lame excuses have to be purged. There's not a single legitimate excuse to be made for any of them. Every excuse has been exposed. Every lie revealed by the passage of time.

All that is left is us, and them.

No more excuses now.

6-0 6-0 6-0

Close the thread. It's done.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Credit? Deserve? What?

Forget that. I'm pretty sure the gist of this is people don't buy into the excuses you are making for the bloke, regardless of when they first twigged he was a loser.

You just happen to be the last person on here that supports the bloke. I know you'll say you don't and you want him gone and all that. Maybe that's even true this season. But still, so many of your postings have that "but" clause that essentially makes an excuse for every outcome. All too predictable outcomes that can be mapped back over at least a decade and can now be projected into the future with depressing accuracy.

The fanbase has been through many stages of denial, acceptance, grief, anger,.. This is the last stage of the process, where every fan finally accepts the inevitable and the fanbase becomes unified in one goal. Not winning titles, obviously, not winning cups, because it makes no difference, not even winning matches, because we can even predict those too. But getting Kroenke, Wenger and the other leeches out of this place.

That's when it's going to change. When the fanbase has a unified and unbreakable front. And for that to happen, the last lame excuses have to be purged. There's not a single legitimate excuse to be made for any of them. Every excuse has been exposed. Every lie revealed by the passage of time.

All that is left is us, and them.

No more excuses now.

Not really. At this current time we don’t have a single person who uses this board who thinks the club can progress whilst Wenger is manager. That’s the prevailing view amongst the majority of the fans, arguments about when Wenger became useless are largely redundant we all came to our own conclusions differently and who was right or wrong about how things would pan out apart from winning internet debates is largely immaterial.

Unfortunately I think focusing on Kroenke is totally futile. He’s going nowhere. Him or his idiot son will be at the very least the majority shareholder of this club many, many years from now, KSE almost never sells its assets.
The focus has to be how to work around Kroenke and we all agree that starts with Wenger going.

[Cripps]

We're in an infinitely better position financially and to compete than we would have been if we were still at Highbury. In that sense we've certainly succeeded in our aims with the stadium - you can't call yourself a big club and not have a modern up-to-date big stadium - why do you think the likes of Spurs & Chelsea are desperate to do their own moves right now? Zim was right about shit regarding that.

What's holding us back is the manager and by extension the current board's lack of ruthless ambition. I was one that was initially prepared to give Wenger a chance when the money rolled in but clearly he hasn't been cut out to handle the rigours of winning the league for a while now, especially in the ultra competitive environment we're currently in. If Zim had specifically moaned about that, then he would have been right - but then again, as alluded to above, it's hardly a bold prediction.

Yep he pretty much did. So my original point stands

[Niall_Quinn]

Not really. It’s the difference between a club threatening to be the dominant force in English football and being bang average which is what we are currently.

Bang Average is totally unacceptable but it’s not cliff edge.

How much of a gap do you want before it becomes a cliff? Look at the direction we're heading in comparison to our supposed rivals. And some of those rivals aren't very good.

[Marc Overmars]

Isn't that what Wenger thinks himself? He's right, isn't he? With all his musings on football and how the game has changed, and how the big clubs are dopers and how the players are disloyal and so on? Everyone else is wrong.

But if he hasn't changed, then why is his record signing striker on the bench for the big game? What happened to the attacking philosophy that bagged titles and the plaudits of every football lover?

The evidence screams of him changing in the most horrible and inexplicable manner. Bringing in pixies to do men's work. Tippy tappy instead of the blistering counter attack. Complaining about being roughed up when we used to be the ones doing the roughing up. He's changed in so many ways. And for the worse. And it looks like he did it deliberately.

Unfortunately all the madness over the past 10 years is now part of his legacy too. Infact his tenure is now probably laced with more seasons of frustration and disharmony than satisfaction.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

How much of a gap do you want before it becomes a cliff? Look at the direction we're heading in comparison to our supposed rivals. And some of those rivals aren't very good.

I don’t want any gap. But the club is stagnated in mediocrity. We are in danger of causing our fan base to commit suicide out of sheer boredom. But going off a cliff is Leeds United stuff.

We are in danger of being Bang Average and being no more than a top six club for the foreseeable future and that’s incredibly depressing and needs rectifying. But it’s very easily explained by retaining the services of a manager who used to be cutting edge but is now as sharp as a blancmange

Again the only thing the fan base needs to be united behind is Wenger out, everything else is largely trying to rehash old debates

[Cripps]

Bang Average is totally unacceptable but it’s not cliff edge.

It'll get there

As usual most will realise when it's too late

Then when it does they'll be showing their frustration but we'll tell you we told you so

Then they'll say it was a lucky guess to save face

[Niall_Quinn]

I don’t want any gap. But the club is stagnated in mediocrity. We are in danger of causing our fan base to commit suicide out of sheer boredom. But going off a cliff is Leeds United stuff.

We are in danger of being Bang Average and being no more than a top six club for the foreseeable future and that’s incredibly depressing and needs rectifying. But it’s very easily explained by retaining the services of a manager who used to be cutting edge but is now as sharp as as blacmange

We used to be a top 2 club. We heard all the assurances about being a top 4 club. Now we are to be a top 6 club? And the same people will remain at the helm? Let's see what happens in the summer when our marquee players walk out in a statement that confirms to the whole world we are no longer a top club. If immediate action is taken and the necessary funds are put in place to allow a sane individual to resuscitate the squad, I'll be a little more convinced that the trend can be halted.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

It'll get there

As usual most will realise when it's too late

Then when it does they'll be showing their frustration but we'll tell you we told you so

Then they'll say it was a lucky guess to save face

If it gets to Leeds United standard, it will take a very long time to get there.

The reason i think it’s unlikely is that we have an owner who doesn’t give a shit about us showing ambition. But for us to be a viable asset. A Leeds United situation just isn’t conducive to that.

If for instance we were in the same boat as Everton now, Kroenke would probably sack Wenger himself to protect his investment