Here's where we are.

[mandela8]

I think there are players who get overhyped by the fan base. Ramsey for example was the bane of my existence because he summed up a midfield that lacked dynamism, no pace, poor first touch….passing not brilliant.

Yes I do think Saka is our best player and is better than the players you mentioned, but again it feels odd saying that because not comparing like for like. I don’t think there is a single player that has individually won us a game in the way a Henry or Van Persie did. But unlike you I would take Saka over Pepe in the position they play.

Pepe is the closest player I’ve ever seen to Laurent Robert in his application, and believe me that’s not a positive comparison. Robert was capable of excellent football but he was capable of being an utter prick and doing nothing. Pepe has an awful first touch, he doesn’t track back and it’s a 50/50 as to whether he shows for the ball at all. He’s a luxury player, but not one who’s grit and determination wins you games.

I think Arteta has made a lot of mistakes with not rotating the squad last season but Pepe just simply does not give a fuck

Saka pesters defenders, he’s always there to receive a pass and frankly I think he actually makes Odegaard look better than he is.

I agree with you about there being a tendency towards orthodoxy amongst the fan base I just think you’re utterly wrong on this.

I like Martinelli and Smith Rowe, I think Martinelli has especially been frustrated by putting in service to Lacazette with him no where to be seen. Smith Rowe frankly looks like he needs to lose a bit of weight, I think he’s got a good footballing brain but he has looked unfit for a while, plus not helped by Arteta playing him and Odegaard in the same team.

We actually have a lot of common ground, tbh. Ramsey was another fan favorite but he couldn't play a single position.

Also agree on Martinelli and ESR.

On Pepe I think he stopped giving a fuck when Arteta started messing him about...not that I think he stopped caring, as such, but I know exactly what you mean and how it could be perceived as such.

On Saka you're just plain wrong though, man. I don't think you actually think he's our best player either. That's just too ridiculous. He's your favorite player, not the best player. Comments like he always shows for the ball are mind blowing to me because that's one of my biggest gripes with him. He can and does disappear from games constantly and is happy just hanging out on the line, behind an opposition player. As for his impact on Odegaard...it's the opposite way about. If Odegaard had someone other than Saka there he'd have double the assists he had. Sala doesn't pres well and his defensive efforts are often lamentable, ffs. I'm not even sure who you're watching, man. Just utterly blinded by bias/favoritism, maybe? I'd have thought even his biggest, objective, fans would sees the glaring issues in his game.

Can you even tell me a couple of games you thought he was really good in?

[HCZ_Reborn]

We actually have a lot of common ground, tbh. Ramsey was another fan favorite but he couldn't play a single position.

Also agree on Martinelli and ESR.

On Pepe I think he stopped giving a fuck when Arteta started messing him about...not that I think he stopped caring, as such, but I know exactly what you mean and how it could be perceived as such.

On Saka you're just plain wrong though, man. I don't think you actually think he's our best player either. That's just too ridiculous. He's your favorite player, not the best player. Comments like he always shows for the ball are mind blowing to me because that's one of my biggest gripes with him. He can and does disappear from games constantly and is happy just hanging out on the line, behind an opposition player. As for his impact on Odegaard...it's the opposite way about. If Odegaard had someone other than Saka there he'd have double the assists he had. Sala doesn't pres well and his defensive efforts are often lamentable, ffs. I'm not even sure who you're watching, man. Just utterly blinded by bias/favoritism, maybe? I'd have thought even his biggest, objective, fans would sees the glaring issues in his game.

Can you even tell me a couple of games you thought he was really good in?

I don’t have favourite players, I’m not a 12 year old collecting panini stickers

Yes I do think he’s our best player. It’s got nothing to do with whether I think he’s a nice lad (because I have absolutely no idea if he is….I know he’s a bit of a bible basher but that’s it)

So it’s nothing to do with favouritism. To be honest it would easier to name games where he was poor and I think he wasn’t great towards the end of the season as he looked like he needed to be rested

But I think he absolutely tormented Spurs and City in the games at the Emirates

Leeds away, first half against Leicester away, Villa away also particularly stand out for me

I think it’s lazy to blame Pepe on Arteta. With the exception of his cameo against Wolves, the guy has done nothing when brought on. Why on earth would you not just put on a performance just to prove Arteta wrong, but he looks disinterested. Lazy passes, heavy first touches, doesn’t show for the ball and often just gives the ball away.

This was a player that we all had high expectations from because of how much we paid Lille for him, and I’ve seen nothing that makes me think Arteta was wrong to drop him.

He can dribble better than others in the team (when he feels like it) but given that three years ago Iwobi was the only player we had that could dribble it’s a low bar to get over.

Saka can dribble, he is technically good, decent first touch, excellent work rate and has come good in terms of goal scoring. And I think he has been the most consistent performer for us this season gone

[mandela8]

I don’t have favourite players, I’m not a 12 year old collecting panini stickers

Yes I do think he’s our best player. It’s got nothing to do with whether I think he’s a nice lad (because I have absolutely no idea if he is….I know he’s a bit of a bible basher but that’s it)

So it’s nothing to do with favouritism. To be honest it would easier to name games where he was poor and I think he wasn’t great towards the end of the season as he looked like he needed to be rested

But I think he absolutely tormented Spurs and City in the games at the Emirates

Leeds away, first half against Leicester away, Villa away also particularly stand out for me

I think it’s lazy to blame Pepe on Arteta. With the exception of his cameo against Wolves, the guy has done nothing when brought on. Why on earth would you not just put on a performance just to prove Arteta wrong, but he looks disinterested. Lazy passes, heavy first touches, doesn’t show for the ball and often just gives the ball away.

This was a player that we all had high expectations from because of how much we paid Lille for him, and I’ve seen nothing that makes me think Arteta was wrong to drop him.

He can dribble better than others in the team (when he feels like it) but given that three years ago Iwobi was the only player we had that could dribble it’s a low bar to get over.

Saka can dribble, he is technically good, decent first touch, excellent work rate and has come good in terms of goal scoring. And I think he has been the most consistent performer for us this season gone

Favouritism.

Exactly as I suspected.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Favouritism.

Exactly as I suspected.

Bit of a silly arse aren’t you?

Nah the last player there was at Arsenal who even vaguely approached being my favourite was Flamini. Not because he was any good, it was just he seemed to take perverse pride in felling people, would put in a clumsy tackle to halt an attack and then pump his fist at the crowd like he’d scored a goal. It wasn’t Stoke level thuggery, but he took genuine enjoyment in introducing people to the turf.
I had a soft spot for Rosicky even though arguably he was crocked and a more ruthless club would have moved him on years ago but I’d been at the game when he scored those two long range howitzers at Liverpool in the fa cup.

I just think Saka is a genuinely good performer who menaces defences

The other players you’ve mentioned with the exception of Ramsdale have been distinctly hit and miss at times

Ben White was a decent signing because he’s the only centre back we have who is comfortable on the ball but his positional play in defence can be suspect and he’s too easily beaten in the air

Partey by his own admission has been shit at times. I wish he’d stopped going for goal constantly seems determined to score a screamer but his two goals for us have come from corners. I think this partly comes down to the lack of protection he gets from Xhaka but he’s not great at dealing with the high press either.

Odegaard goes missing far more often than Saka, like Ozil he’s no interest in dropping deep to receive the ball and a lot of his best attacking moves comes from link up play with Saka.

I don’t think Saka is head and shoulders better than everyone around him because we don’t have that stand out player in the team anymore. But I think he’s by far our most consistent performer

[mandela8]

Bit of a silly arse aren’t you?

Nah the last player there was at Arsenal who even vaguely approached being my favourite was Flamini. Not because he was any good, it was just he seemed to take perverse pride in felling people, would put in a clumsy tackle to halt an attack and then pump his fist at the crowd like he’d scored a goal. It wasn’t Stoke level thuggery, but he took genuine enjoyment in introducing people to the turf.
I had a soft spot for Rosicky even though arguably he was crocked and a more ruthless club would have moved him on years ago but I’d been at the game when he scored those two long range howitzers at Liverpool in the fa cup.

I just think Saka is a genuinely good performer who menaces defences

The other players you’ve mentioned with the exception of Ramsdale have been distinctly hit and miss at times

Ben White was a decent signing because he’s the only centre back we have who is comfortable on the ball but his positional play in defence can be suspect and he’s too easily beaten in the air

Partey by his own admission has been shit at times. I wish he’d stopped going for goal constantly seems determined to score a screamer but his two goals for us have come from corners. I think this partly comes down to the lack of protection he gets from Xhaka but he’s not great at dealing with the high press either.

Odegaard goes missing far more often than Saka, like Ozil he’s no interest in dropping deep to receive the ball and a lot of his best attacking moves comes from link up play with Saka.

I don’t think Saka is head and shoulders better than everyone around him because we don’t have that stand out player in the team anymore. But I think he’s by far our most consistent performer

Wilshire was my last real favorite, but as I said earlier, I have an unexplainable soft spot for Holding.

I think Ramsdale and Gabriel were consistently good. They both had a couple of dodgy moments but that's expected from players of their age and position. They were the best players, by a distance for me. Then Odegaard. Tierney, Tommy and Partey we're out too often to be considered, unfortunately. And on Partey, I actually agree he hasn't been as good as he can be. He's still a class apart from anyone in the squad though and he was demonstrating that pretty consistently before his last injury...for a few months he was showing what he was really about. Strange that a player so robust at Atletico hasnt been able to stay fit at Arsenal.

Saka is consistent. I'll give you that. Consistently shit though. Odegaard plays on the right hand side so it's obvious he'll engage more with Saka. That's also partly why we're imbalanced and ESR and Martinelli are often exposed as they rarely have CM support. If anything this is another black mark against Saka. He has Odegaard in there occupying space and opposition for him and he fails to exploit it.

White just seems too lightweight for me but more than that, the frequency I which he puts his foot on top of the ball to look for a pass drives me fuckin mental. The pace and momentum of the team (which is shit as it is) grinds to a complete halt when he has the ball.

[IBK]

Some...intradesting opinions there.

Xhaka being the strangest one. 7/10??? We clearly rate the game entirely differently. Even when Xhaka does nothing wrong (which is always a fear with him, which says it all) he does very little right/well.

He's one of these insignificant players. Everything he does is junk. Takes the balls plays it short to the side or backwards. Almost all of his involvements could be bypassed by the player who gives the ball to Xhaka simply giving it to the player Xhaka then gives it to. That's how easy it would be to replicate Xhaka's contribution to the team.

He's also woeful defensively, letting players run off him more than any other CM I've ever seen.

Elneny is exactly the same with his cowardly possession of the ball, but he's slightly more disciplined defensively.

Props to you for trying to stimulate debate. Alls I'll say is that we are all entitled to our opinions, and I'm not afraid to swim against the tide.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Props to you for trying to stimulate debate. Alls I'll say is that we are all entitled to our opinions, and I'm not afraid to swim against the tide.

I have to say I disagree with him completely about Saka but I 100% agree with him about Xhaka

Defensively he’s a total liability. Plus
He’s slow, one footed and is incredibly casual in possession.

Tielemans would have been an upgrade on him, not the quickest but a good passer of the ball and a good dribbler

I fear Arteta is being galaxy brained by overlooking this. Saw a newspaper article today that said he was going to rely on Lokonga being the next yaya Toure…well first off good luck with that I don’t think he’s got the upper body strength for that.

And also if you felt that way about him, why did you hardly play him after autumn.

I watched him at the Emirates against Brighton, he started off dreadfully (though I think he was chucked in at the deep end) but actually grew into the game and was making runs from deep and drawing fouls from Brighton. I’m not sure how good he is, I’ve seen worse technically but also seen better. But whilst he’s a youngster he’s not a kid, he’s 23 in October and if he’s going to make it he needs to start playing regularly.

[mandela8]

Props to you for trying to stimulate debate. Alls I'll say is that we are all entitled to our opinions, and I'm not afraid to swim against the tide.

For sure, man.

I'm clearly in the minority about Saka, man.

I came back cos I love taking about fitba and arsenal but if we all agreed it'd be shit so I'm always glad of dissenting views, man.

[IBK]

For sure, man.

I'm clearly in the minority about Saka, man.

I came back cos I love taking about fitba and arsenal but if we all agreed it'd be shit so I'm always glad of dissenting views, man.

[mandela8]

What's the consensus on Jesus then?

I just can't get excited about it, man.

Man City went an entire season as the team without a center forward now we're signing the guy who couldn't even get recognized as their striker as our number 9.

Probably doesn't matter really but the bigger concern I have is we bid for Vlahovic and and now in for Jesus. Two very different players...just doesn't strike me as much of a strategy here.

I do think Jesus is a good player, don't get me wrong...I just don't see the sense in it. Him, Nketiah and Balagun are all similar stature and mould/style.