Reaction Vs Aston Vanilla

[Niall_Quinn]

Fair point and you are correct this is an open forum so you are quite rightly entitled to share your thoughts.

Apologies for upsetting you. It's just when you are top of the league, the current FA Cup holders and through to the last 16 of the CL it's hard to understand what there is to complain about. If you can't enjoy those moments and show your appreciation then when can you?

But my biggest concern is that if/when things don't go as you would wish then those fans who feel we should win everything all of the time playing football of the finest quality (and I don't mean the quality of George Graham, Bruce Rioch, Mourinho etc but the flowing intricate style that has been the hallmark of Arsene Wenger) will not get behind the team but would rather criticise and blame.

For me, the definition of a true fan is to show your support, allegiance and encouragement in the good and the bad times. There are too may "fans" who will only do the former.

Don't get me wrong, I am not condoning mediocrity but in my opinion we are far from mediocre (but you are free to have your own definition)

I know what type of supporter I am - it would be interesting to know what type you are?

Fair play to you, a reasonable response under provocation.

What sort of fan? The 40 year sort just like yourself. Well, 37 to be precise. I always support the team, I'm not such a big fan of the club any more though. Don't like the non-football owner and his crew, I respect but don't much like the manager either. What he did in the past can never be taken away from him, but he's been a shadow of that for at least a decade. In my view (which is not unique) he's been the primary factor in us falling short season after season and he's outstayed his welcome. All over the forum you'll find argument to and fro that goes into the details so no point going over that again. I never demand we win trophies and certainly don't feel entitled to them. But I realise it will be the team that has given maximum effort on the most occasions in combination with having decent players that will lift the big trophies come May. We have the decent players so it's a shame to watch the effort rise and fall to suit the minimum we can get away with. What I demand is the maximum possible effort win, lose or draw, every game. That's actually the starting point for me, anything less than that is inexcusable negligence. I hated, hated, hated the way we slacked off and let the gypos overhaul us last season. That was a scandal. Whenever I see the same slacking off it pisses me off, mightily. Loved the performance midweek against the Greeks, said so, hated the non-performance against Villa, even though we won, even though we went top for a few hours, said so.

[Mr. Lahey]

Fair play to you, a reasonable response under provocation.

What sort of fan? The 40 year sort just like yourself. Well, 37 to be precise. I always support the team, I'm not such a big fan of the club any more though. Don't like the non-football owner and his crew, I respect but don't much like the manager either. What he did in the past can never be taken away from him, but he's been a shadow of that for at least a decade. In my view (which is not unique) he's been the primary factor in us falling short season after season and he's outstayed his welcome. All over the forum you'll find argument to and fro that goes into the details so no point going over that again. I never demand we win trophies and certainly don't feel entitled to them. But I realise it will be the team that has given maximum effort on the most occasions in combination with having decent players that will lift the big trophies come May. We have the decent players so it's a shame to watch the effort rise and fall to suit the minimum we can get away with. What I demand is the maximum possible effort win, lose or draw, every game. That's actually the starting point for me, anything less than that is inexcusable negligence. I hated, hated, hated the way we slacked off and let the gypos overhaul us last season. That was a scandal. Whenever I see the same slacking off it pisses me off, mightily. Loved the performance midweek against the Greeks, said so, hated the non-performance against Villa, even though we won, even though we went top for a few hours, said so.

i completely agree, there was no excuse for that.

[LDG]

Stilts, coming on here all high and mighty

[Letters]

I'm not such a big fan of the club any more though. Don't like the non-football owner and his crew

I agree with that, but that's a problem throughout football. It's just business now and it's set up so the richest clubs rise to the top (well, Chelsea are doing their best to mess that up for themselves but in theory, and it tends to be the case long term). And it's set up to be a positive feedback loop so the richest clubs get the most money in prizes so are able, with decent management, to stay up there.

I respect but don't much like the manager either. What he did in the past can never be taken away from him, but he's been a shadow of that for at least a decade. In my view (which is not unique) he's been the primary factor in us falling short season after season and he's outstayed his welcome.

I don't agree he's been a shadow of his former self. He kept us in the top 4 every single year in an era when we had the double whammy of the stadium move affecting our finances and the billionaires running around buying up titles left, right and centre. Ferguson managed to get the better of them fairly often but he had a significantly bigger budget to play with than Wenger and, frankly, he's a better manager. But comparing a manager to Ferguson is like comparing a player to Henry. Without the billionaires I am convinced we'd have won a few titles in that time, but I do agree that at times we failed to win trophies when we should have and Wenger has to take responsibility for that. After the Birmingam debacle I didn't think we'd ever win a trophy under him again.
But the last 2 years HAVE shown a difference. The money is there, the signings have been at a different level and it has made a difference. Not the biggest prizes yet but we're winning trophies again, I think we all agree we need to push on but I don't think it's not unreasonable to see how this season will pan out.

We've discussed the effort thing. I don't buy that any team ever plays at full throttle every game. The Invincibles didn't, they blitzed teams early in the game then coasted. And that's fine, they got the results, they won the title. In sport you sometimes play an opponent who isn't anywhere near as good as you and you maybe ease off a bit. It's just how sport is. If it costs you the result then it's unacceptable. If you go 2-0 up against a team as poor as Villa and coast through the rest, save some energy for bigger tests to come then fine. Literally every team does that, no team ever plays at 100% intensity every game, it's just nor physically or mentally possible.

I hated, hated, hated the way we slacked off and let the gypos overhaul us last season. That was a scandal.

We've discussed this before, it seems to be your smoking gun in your argument against Wenger but I don't buy it. We can't simultaneously mock Wenger for the "Top 4 Trophy" thing and then make a big deal about not winning the "2nd Place Trophy". The way I see it there's a massive difference between some positions in the table, less of a difference between others.
2nd and the FA Cup is better than 3rd and the FA Cup, of course, but is it significantly different? I don't think so.
There's obviously a huge difference between 1st and 2nd.
Some difference between 3rd and 4th (automatic qualification vs not)
A big difference between 4th and 5th (CL or not)
A massive difference between 17th and 18th - relegation or not.
But the rest...

We slacked off a bit when the title had gone, not before. We weren't winning the title, we had the FA Cup Final to think about. We did enough to ensure we qualified automatically for the CL, won the FA Cup, job done. You make a big deal out of this "Winners' Mentality" but I don't see how finishing 2nd is "winning".

We should have challenged for the title last season, our failure to was damning but the FA Cup did mitigate somewhat. We need to challenge this year. So far, we are. While we continue to I'll believe we can win it. But we're not going to win every game, there will be bumps in the road, there will be poor performances. Not because Wenger's an idiot or a loser, just because that's how football is. Do we have to have this tiresome "Wenger Out" stuff every time we hit one on these bumps? Wenger should be sacked at the end of the season if we haven't properly challenged for the title. He shouldn't be sacked because we draw vs Norwich.

[Stilts1964]

Fair play to you, a reasonable response under provocation.

What sort of fan? The 40 year sort just like yourself. Well, 37 to be precise. I always support the team, I'm not such a big fan of the club any more though. Don't like the non-football owner and his crew, I respect but don't much like the manager either. What he did in the past can never be taken away from him, but he's been a shadow of that for at least a decade. In my view (which is not unique) he's been the primary factor in us falling short season after season and he's outstayed his welcome. All over the forum you'll find argument to and fro that goes into the details so no point going over that again. I never demand we win trophies and certainly don't feel entitled to them. But I realise it will be the team that has given maximum effort on the most occasions in combination with having decent players that will lift the big trophies come May. We have the decent players so it's a shame to watch the effort rise and fall to suit the minimum we can get away with. What I demand is the maximum possible effort win, lose or draw, every game. That's actually the starting point for me, anything less than that is inexcusable negligence. I hated, hated, hated the way we slacked off and let the gypos overhaul us last season. That was a scandal. Whenever I see the same slacking off it pisses me off, mightily. Loved the performance midweek against the Greeks, said so, hated the non-performance against Villa, even though we won, even though we went top for a few hours, said so.

Thanks AW - believe me when I say you and I share many of the same views. Here's to 3 points on the weekend (and a good display!)

[Xhaka Can’t]

Thanks AW - believe me when I say you and I share many of the same views. Here's to 3 points on the weekend (and a good display!)

What do you think of Tory Cunts?

[GP]

What do you think of Tory Cunts?

SHIT!!!

[Xhaka Can’t]

What do you think of SHIT?

[GP]

TORY CUNTS!!!

[Xhaka Can’t]

Thank-you!