Arsenal AGM

[Power n Glory]

Before the era of Ambramovich and billionaire owners, it was a different (much easier) ball game.

Also worth noting the £10m+ paid for someone like Henry at that time is very different than paying £10m for a player right now. Inflation in football teams has spiralled.

Inflation is a factor but that's for players that get caught on the billionaire boys radars. Besides, Chamakh, Wenger is usually able to find good players in their mid 20's that slot well into our team. Signings like Hleb, Eduardo, Sagna, Vermaelen and recent guys like Santos, Park and Gervinho.

We should have been focussing on finding experienced playere hitting their peak instead of taking gambles on teens and trying to develop them into better players. Buying players like Vela, Diaby, Walcott, Denilson, Ramsey, Bendy...it has all back fired. Slowly, we've lost our talent because we've gambled on youth that have been slow to deliver. Wenger has been reluctant to buy central mid playere because he wanted to give players like Denilson and Diaby and in the end we end up losing out on both ends. Our experienced players don't want to babysit and carry the team anymore and the youth players turn out to be duds and we can't even sell them on for a healthy fee. We moved on Eduardo to give Vela a chance it has totally backfired. Now, we've gone out and done what we should have been doing from the get go. Find playere that are unheard of but ready to do a job for the first team and provide competition for places. It hasn't cost an arm and leg either.

Inflation is a factor, but playere like Park, Santos and Gervinho have always been around. We just haven't been going for them. Each summer, Wenger will look to add one or two players that's hitting their peak and ready for first team football. Sagna, Vermaelen, Eduardo....but it's not enough to add one first team player to the squad a season. It's taken him way too long to build a squad and he's placed too much hope on youth stepping up their game.

[Syn]

Inflation is a factor but that's for players that get caught on the billionaire boys radars. Besides, Chamakh, Wenger is usually able to find good players in their mid 20's that slot well into our team. Signings like Hleb, Eduardo, Sagna, Vermaelen and recent guys like Santos, Park and Gervinho.

We should have been focussing on finding experienced playere hitting their peak instead of taking gambles on teens and trying to develop them into better players. Buying players like Vela, Diaby, Walcott, Denilson, Ramsey, Bendy...it has all back fired. Slowly, we've lost our talent because we've gambled on youth that have been slow to deliver. Wenger has been reluctant to buy central mid playere because he wanted to give players like Denilson and Diaby and in the end we end up losing out on both ends. Our experienced players don't want to babysit and carry the team anymore and the youth players turn out to be duds and we can't even sell them on for a healthy fee. We moved on Eduardo to give Vela a chance it has totally backfired. Now, we've gone out and done what we should have been doing from the get go. Find playere that are unheard of but ready to do a job for the first team and provide competition for places. It hasn't cost an arm and leg either.

Inflation is a factor, but playere like Park, Santos and Gervinho have always been around. We just haven't been going for them. Each summer, Wenger will look to add one or two players that's hitting their peak and ready for first team football. Sagna, Vermaelen, Eduardo....but it's not enough to add one first team player to the squad a season. It's taken him way too long to build a squad and he's placed too much hope on youth stepping up their game.

I agree with most of that and it makes sense under a certain assumption...the same assumption that pretty much underlines everyone's view on Wenger. Some people think it's obvious and not debatable; some people think it's more complicated behind the scenes and that we are not seeing the truth. The assumption is about whether the 'youth project' was forced and whether Wenger really wouldn't choose to spend £20m if available on proven quality rather than stick with Denilson. I'm still not sure to this day.

But my point was simply that a £37m loss over the course of 9 seasons beginning in 1996 is a larger monetary hit than a £37m loss beginning from 2002 onwards. But I also agree that maybe inflation is more relevant for bigger targets...if we wanted top signings, it matters. If we wanted more smart signings, maybe a £10m signing like Vermaelen would've cost us £7m 5-7 years ago so not much difference.

I don't completely absolve Wenger from the fact that he was pinning his hopes on a Vela or Walcott-type signing turning into an Henry by now. I think it's a strategy that he had chosen. But I think his choice of potential strategies at the time weren't as large as some are making out.

[IBK]

Inflation is a factor but that's for players that get caught on the billionaire boys radars. Besides, Chamakh, Wenger is usually able to find good players in their mid 20's that slot well into our team. Signings like Hleb, Eduardo, Sagna, Vermaelen and recent guys like Santos, Park and Gervinho.

We should have been focussing on finding experienced playere hitting their peak instead of taking gambles on teens and trying to develop them into better players. Buying players like Vela, Diaby, Walcott, Denilson, Ramsey, Bendy...it has all back fired. Slowly, we've lost our talent because we've gambled on youth that have been slow to deliver. Wenger has been reluctant to buy central mid playere because he wanted to give players like Denilson and Diaby and in the end we end up losing out on both ends. Our experienced players don't want to babysit and carry the team anymore and the youth players turn out to be duds and we can't even sell them on for a healthy fee. We moved on Eduardo to give Vela a chance it has totally backfired. Now, we've gone out and done what we should have been doing from the get go. Find playere that are unheard of but ready to do a job for the first team and provide competition for places. It hasn't cost an arm and leg either.

Inflation is a factor, but playere like Park, Santos and Gervinho have always been around. We just haven't been going for them. Each summer, Wenger will look to add one or two players that's hitting their peak and ready for first team football. Sagna, Vermaelen, Eduardo....but it's not enough to add one first team player to the squad a season. It's taken him way too long to build a squad and he's placed too much hope on youth stepping up their game.

A good summary of what's gone wrong. Too much faith that players with potential will deliver on it. Every good manager (and by 'good' I mean those who have to operate in the normal world rather than the likes of Mancini or Villas Boas) will gamble on potential to an extent. In our case the principle has become too all consuming, because it has induced secondary gambles such as not buying cover for injured players; playing 'development' players out of position in a bid to make them more complete (and established players out of position in order to provide cover), and having to change the entire shape of the team to cope with project players' deficiencies.

And the fact that for all his eye for potential talent, Wenger has had a 'hit rate' that has generally been lower than that needed to sustain a winning side (the nearest he got was probably 2008/9) has meant a team building exercise that was doomed never to complete as his best players ran out of patience with it. He could encourage players to share his philosophy so far, but because he has the time that players do not have - they were never going to do so 100%.

The problem for Arsenal is that times have changed, and in the absence of a billionaire benefactor we have no choice but to try to build a successful side. But it has become much more difficult because the calibre of players that we are now able to attract - after so many trophyless years and with at least 3 teams so firmly established above us - and perhaps more importantly the calibre of players that will stay with the project rather than leave as soon as they improve - is self-limiting.

[Super Ghel]

So in summary: "No, we won't put any money in. Yes, we want all your money." Nothing new or surprising here. Well maybe one, Stan's hint that something perked his interest in football and Arsenal in particular when previously there was no interest at all. Wonder what it could have been?

Dunno about others, but I read it more as some form of stunted speech impediment disorder. I think it’s nothing but some constipated code-speak for “ho ho, yippee ki-yay I’ve spotted a good investment opportunity here yo suckers”. One thing is for sure though, as far as his intentions for the club are concerned; it ain’t so that he can twirl his ‘tache thin in anxious agony for some silverware at the end of the day.

[Super Ghel]

Also apparently for the first time ever there was no Q&A section at the end.

Bastard fans ask too many awkward questions.

Could be the start of a worrying trend. With no proper Q&A grilling sessions, AGMs are effectively no better than stage managed events where the main participants go about on some farcical lap of appreciation by patting themselves on the back as they re-new their vows to the self-sustaining model; with Gazidis harping about the financial health of the club in one corner, while Arsene reaffirms his commitment to the board’s “courageous” policy in the other, with a smirk but nevertheless bewildered looking Ron Burgundy impersonator fidgeting uncomfortably in his seat as PHW provides the eventual comic relief to break the doldrums. All this is done of course with a big two fingers sign hanging majestically in the background.

[Super Ghel]

PHW - "That's how we roll, bitches"

Nah. As much as we love good old Pete and how his sensibilities and priorities gets more “coherent” with each passing year, it’s a lot more fitting with slick Gazidis at the end of that line imo. PHW is nothing more than a figurehead at the club these days and his role has been greatly diminished since the arrival of Ivan. Slick Ivan is the one we need to watch out for since he’s effectively the de facto man in charge who’s running the investment vehicle for Kroenke’s Sports Empire on this side of the Atlantic now. Pete’s role is more or less reduced to that of the perennial court jester at the AGM.

[fakeyank]

Gazidis was brought on board by AW.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...al/7749742.stm

First time ever at a football club properly where the chief executive of a club was done by the manager of the club. Arsene is much more powerful than a poor puppet. He pulls almost all the strings at Arsenal. It is very simple.. he wouldnt have stayed at Arsenal if he didnt have control over the running of the football side of things. If AFC is failing at football, I'll blame AW. When we went unbeaten, I dont recall people creaming their pants over the board, they were creaming over AW (and rightly so). If we are failing at football then the blame is entirely on Arsene.

[Niall_Quinn]

AGMs are effectively no better than stage managed events where the main participants go about on some farcical lap of appreciation by patting themselves on the back as they re-new their vows to the self-sustaining model

We've finally arrived in the 21st century. So everything can now proceed on behalf of the victims who, unfortunately, are compelled to say nothing on this occasion. All that remains is to dig in your pocket and hand over the money so the act can be spun as approval. 60,000 occupied seats say they can't be wrong. This is what makes football such an attractive business to the wrong sort. Abusive, amoral psychopaths have all the fun, whichever way it turns out. It's a bit like the vote. You get what you deserve if you fail to endorse one of the pre-selected serious criminals on offer, whereas those who exercise their rights and do their duty end up getting the same.

[Niall_Quinn]

Gazidis was brought on board by AW.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...al/7749742.stm

First time ever at a football club properly where the chief executive of a club was done by the manager of the club. Arsene is much more powerful than a poor puppet. He pulls almost all the strings at Arsenal. It is very simple.. he wouldnt have stayed at Arsenal if he didnt have control over the running of the football side of things. If AFC is failing at football, I'll blame AW. When we went unbeaten, I dont recall people creaming their pants over the board, they were creaming over AW (and rightly so). If we are failing at football then the blame is entirely on Arsene.

Where does it say in that article Wenger appointed Gazidis?

[fakeyank]

Where does it say in that article Wenger appointed Gazidis?

Not in that article but thats common knowledge Arsene was involved in his appointment. See article:

http://www.arsenalinsider.com/arsena...-ivan-gazidis/

Read "About Arsene Wenger’s role in the appointment"