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Thread: Match Reaction vs Swansea (home).

  1. #121
    Administrator Letters's Avatar
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    There was the possibility of a goal scoring opportunity, but there are two defenders there and others racing back (as are attackers racing forward of course). You can always say there's a possibility of an opportunity when a team is breaking at pace, very few of those end up as goals. He wasn't bearing down on goal.

    We haven't appealed it because we wouldn't win as it's all so debatable but I agree with PnG's comment about Wenger having a word.

    Although...if you think it was as good an opportunity as all that then surely he did need to do something and take one for the team?

  2. #122
    Member Power n Glory's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Letters View Post
    There was the possibility of a goal scoring opportunity, but there are two defenders there and others racing back (as are attackers racing forward of course). You can always say there's a possibility of an opportunity when a team is breaking at pace, very few of those end up as goals. He wasn't bearing down on goal.

    We haven't appealed it because we wouldn't win as it's all so debatable but I agree with PnG's comment about Wenger having a word.

    Although...if you think it was as good an opportunity as all that then surely he did need to do something and take one for the team?
    I'm not happy when other teams do that to us so it feels slightly hypocritical to applaud this one. I'd be pissed if that happened to Theo or Ox especially considering their injury records and frail bones. Think if Ox were fouled like that when he broke to set up Theo? Instead of cursing Theo's missed chance we'd be pissed about being ribbed of an opportunity to break on the team. Especially if it were 3-3.

    This is a good piece worth reading.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/...n-a-place-whe/

    Even a blind eye as accomplished as Arsene Wenger's could not be turned from this one. Granit Xhaka's playground trip on Modou Barrow on Saturday was conducted so close to where the Arsenal manager was standing in his technical area, you could almost see his fringe lifting in the jetstream whoosh as the Swansea winger took off and flew. Barrow had been in tormenting form, twisting the Arsenal full back Nacho Monreal this way and that like he was auditioning to replace Ed Balls on Strictly Come Dancing. Every time he got the ball, the jitters of alarm spread through the most panic-prone crowd in the country. He had just bamboozled Xhaka with the pace of his turn. And the Swiss midfielder took immediate retribution, flicking out to catch his trailing leg, sending him careering turfwards. It was the kind of foul football crowds love to see in their own team.

    "Good on you," shouted the Arsenal fan closest to the press box. "Take one for the team, Granit."

    And that was what it seemed: a yellow card offence. Barrow was upended on the halfway line. The intent was cynical rather than violent. He was not denied a goal-scoring opportunity: there were at least three more defenders between him and the Arsenal area. As the referee Jon Moss approached the scene of the crime, the expectation was he would take a cautionary note of Xhaka's name and no more. When he produced a red card, everyone in the Arsenal sections went into immediate apoplexy, screaming their disdain at the official, suddenly fearing his zeal would jeopardise the pursuit of three points.

    Everyone, that is, except Wenger, who stood and watched his player head for the dressing room, arms folded, lips pursed.

    Afterwards Wenger did not attempt mitigation. He reckoned Xhaka's offence worthy of a "dark yellow". He would not dispute why Moss thought it more serious. He would, he added, be having a word with his player.

    "Intelligence means learning from such mistakes," Wenger said.



    And you can understand why he took that line. At a time when Arsenal were rocking, when their lead appeared increasingly imperilled, when Swansea looked as if they might extend their lengthy jinx on his team, Wenger was obliged to watch his defensive midfielder undermine the collective endeavour through a childish act of retribution. More to the point, however, it was the kind of foul that would most infuriate the manager had it been conducted on an Arsenal player. Barrow might be raw and wholly inconsistent, but he is clearly a talent. And he was shining in North London, his pace and directness causing continuing confusion. To stop him in such a manner was anathema to Wenger's beliefs about how the game should be played.

    Xhaka does not come with a reputation for foul play. He is whole hearted, certainly, but not dirty. As he sits out Arsenal's next couple of games, he will have the opportunity for reflection. The first thing he will have learned is not to commit a foul like that again in a place where even Arsene Wenger can't miss it.

  3. #123
    Member Kano's Avatar
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    Sure but four against two makes it extremely likely something is going to develop, even three against our two. A foul can be committed between the half way and our penalty area and still result in a sending off, even when a shot hasn't been taken. The likelihood is one would've been but there's always the chance of a poor pass, the ball getting stuck under their feet or a defender making a good tackle. In those situations the ref has to make a call on the likelihood of a goal scoring chance occurring, obviously the higher the percentage the more likely he is to blow his whistle. Given the circumstances of what was about to develop, I think he made a fair call.

    I said in my post on the last page I'm glad he did it, as we've missed that cynicism in the team. But there's no mistaking it was still rash. Wenger can have a word all he wants but it won't make a difference to Xhaka. I think it was four times last season and twice already this time round (Switzerland). Wenger knew what he was buying and we knew it would happen for one reason or another sooner or later. But it's like the good ole days, in that we have someone sent off and still take the points.

  4. #124
    Administrator Letters's Avatar
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    I'd actually be pretty happy if those sorts of cynical challenges were red cards but they're very rarely given and that in itself makes me think it was a soft one.

  5. #125
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    Just watched MOTD hoping for a big discussion on it, but Lineker just said 'a yellow would have sufficed' and nothing else was mentioned. I've always said that tackles like that should be red, but we have suffered many like that and they were only yellow. It just seems wrong that we were on the end of a red card for it, especially when I saw more dangerous ones yesterday that warranted only a yellow, or no card given at all. If Xhaka's was a red card offence, fine, but can we at least see some consistency?

  6. #126
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    Consistency is the key and I get you'll never have that 100% but these kinds of tackles are common, red cards for them are not. That's what makes it harsh in my view.

  7. #127
    Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie
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    It shouldn't be a red card offence anyway, it's not dangerous play, it's not a potential career ending challenge. It's cynical and deserving of a yellow.

    I'm frankly more concerned that it will play on Wenger's mind and he will try and discourage these type of fouls, if we are dealing with a player of pace and there's a danger they could open us up there should be no question that as long as it's done in a way that doesn't bring that player harm that they should be allowed to become intimately acquainted with the turf.
    Last edited by Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie; 17-10-2016 at 01:09 PM.

  8. #128
    Member Kano's Avatar
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    Consistency is impossible, a pipe dream. Unless we have robots and/or the absolute letter of the law applied for every single incident. But these are humans making the decisions and will always be prone to mistakes through their individual ways of perceiving a single moment.

  9. #129
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    Of course you'll never get complete consistency but you shouldn't get one ref arbitrarily deeming a certain type of tackle a red card when no others do.

  10. #130
    ***** Niall_Quinn's Avatar
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    This remains a random and unwarranted red as far as I'm concerned. When judged against countless other incidents that occur multiple times in each and every match then there's no way this is a red. If they have a new rule then they haven't been enforcing it. The criteria seems to be based on how spectacular the foul is, not whether the opponent was disadvantaged.

    When the keeper has the ball in his hands it's a goal scoring opportunity if he can kick far enough. But there has to be some sanity in that judgement. Through on goal with just the keeper to beat, that's what we've always understood to be a goalscoring opportunity. Last season they used to base the card on whether the player was heading towards or away from the goal, even if he was taken out by the last man. Now we have fouls on the touchline in midfield and it is being called a goal scoring opportunity. Ludicrous.

    Same shit happened to Kos last season, or the season before, when he was sent off as the last tackler even though the offence was over near the corner flag. And then I can't recall it happening again. Perhaps these are rules are only designed for us?

    But if this is going to be applied evenly from now on then good news, we'll be playing against 4 or 5 opponents by halftime in most games. All those shirt pulls on Alexis when he's trying to break through the middle. All the barges on Theo. All red cards by the new standard. And it's good to know that Costa will be spending most of this season serving bans. He should pick up 10-12 reds this year I should think.

    But we all know the reality. There will be no red cards dished out for challenges that cause just as much disadvantage as Xhaka's. What's really happened here is he's been singled out by an overzealous and incompetent ref who has a long track record of getting it wrong.
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