Wolves 0-1 Arsenal Player Rating and Match Reaction

[HCZ_Reborn]

Is it though?

So is normal defending just having your line of 4 and GK trying to stop the other team from scoring exclusively, whilst the rest of the team just sit in midfield watching and waiting?

Again what part of having almost every player in your box are you failing to understand ? I don’t even get why you’re arguing with me…I’m basically agreeing with you that our build up play is too slow. But because of this insistence of failing to understand that two things can be true…you’re trying to refute the idea that certain teams play in a way that means pretty much all of their players are in their own penalty area to make it congested.

I’ve not suggested it’s an excuse, is that what you’re afraid of?

[HCZ_Reborn]

Correct



not just this season, it's a term which has crept in over the last few years - it's basically people tryig to make football sound more intellectual



well then 'our own making' would partly be that we are capable of scoring lots of goals if people don't park the bus - see Crystal Palace away recently, where they went for it and it played into our hands.

but we do make it worse because our attack is so slow in transition that it allows the oppostion to get neatly into shape and then we're in that familiar horseshoe routine until Odegaard tries to put one over the top or Trossard, the most enterprising Arsenal player by some distance, tries to break through

Im not exactly sure how low or deep block are especially intellectual terms, it’s just a term of succinctness. You are basically sitting deep to block chances on your goal (it’s pretty much what I’d call a Ronseal term)

The problem is, when its mentioned that’s what other teams do….people shit their pants and invent in their own mind that you are implying that other sides are cheating by playing this way. Nonsense it’s a perfectly legitimate way to play, and teams will do it against us because they know it will be successful. Therefore it’s on us to counter it.

I wouldn’t mind but this was true when Wenger coached us (especially away from home when teams would sit deep, get a goal on the break and then sit deep again whilst we huffed and puffed)

No one is trying to reinvent the wheel here

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Correct



not just this season, it's a term which has crept in over the last few years - it's basically people tryig to make football sound more intellectual



well then 'our own making' would partly be that we are capable of scoring lots of goals if people don't park the bus - see Crystal Palace away recently, where they went for it and it played into our hands.

but we do make it worse because our attack is so slow in transition that it allows the oppostion to get neatly into shape and then we're in that familiar horseshoe routine until Odegaard tries to put one over the top or Trossard, the most enterprising Arsenal player by some distance, tries to break through

I think the point he's making is that we (our managers, the team and our fans) seem to complain about the "deep block" more than any other team and like everyone has agreed, its not really new or revolutionary.

I must admit, Arsenal complaining about the deep block didn't start with Arteta though (AW takes the crown there) and I don't remember the deep block being much of an issue under Emery.

The thing to note is other top teams don't seem to give this deep block thing that much of a significance, and that includes teams like Man City who also excel at slow boring build up play.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I think the point he's making is that we (our managers, the team and our fans) seem to complain about the "deep block" more than any other team and like everyone has agreed, its not really new or revolutionary.

I must admit, Arsenal complaining about the deep block didn't start with Arteta though (AW takes the crown there) and I don't remember the deep block being much of an issue under Emery.

The thing to note is other top teams don't seem to give this deep block thing that much of a significance, and that includes teams like Man City who also excel at slow boring build up play.

The point being is that I’m not going to deny its existence simply because our managers have in the past blamed it for their own shortcomings. I wouldn’t mind but I only even mentioned it in reference to our own slow build up play

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

The point being is that I’m not going to deny its existence simply because our managers have in the past blamed it for their own shortcomings. I wouldn’t mind but I only even mentioned it in reference to our own slow build up play

I don't think KSE is denying its existence either, he's just saying it shouldn't be a big deal since it has always existed.

But I agree that compared to all the other big teams, no team suffers with this "tactic" being employed against them more than us and that's because the world can see its effective against us.

You sit back 90 mins against City pre 2024, you get pumped a minimum of 3 goals. You do that against this current Liverpool side they'll have 20 shots at you and eventually score one. As for us, 50% of the time you are guaranteed a point and 20% out of the 50, all 3 points.

IMO why it's so effective against us compared to the others I mentioned earlier is our reluctance to pull the trigger, that looking for the perfect opening, the perfect goal. Or to be a bit more detailed, a particular "type" of goal that looks like it was put together and choreographed at the training ground. The current Citeh side has been making the same mistake and I think its just the natural evolution of a corrupted tippy tappy.

This is what I think anyway, but really if you look at our recent past, you can see exactly when this thing started becoming an issue for us and it was when AW got all enamoured with tippy tappy and tried to mimic it, with less and less emphasis on individuality and more and more on a particular pre-planned devised style.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Firstly, no he has outright refused to suggest there is any difference between it and ordinary defending. Secondly why take the two words when they have only been used in the broader context of saying our build up play is too slow to make an counter argument to an argument no one is making to begin with.

I don’t necessarily think it’s about not taking on shots, the expectation when a side is defending deep that the shot will be blocked by bodies…so you might get a fortunate deflection that wrong foots the keeper but ultimately it’s a wasted effort. Don’t get me wrong I do think often players don’t want to take responsibility for taking the shot on, but I don’t think that’s necessarily the biggest reason for our shortcomings.

It’s that because we play the full back as an extra man in midfield, we play defensive minded players in the no8 role that we seem to have almost no transition between defence and attack. You even see Odegaard do 180 turns and play the ball backwards as soon as anyone tries to close him down. You need aggressive passing and movement, what Liverpool have always been good at is to over commit defenders and defensive midfielders by sucking them in to deal with one player on the ball and then that player will pass to about three or four players who are now operating in acres of space.

To do that you need a player who is comfortable enough on the ball to deal with closing down and make passes under pressure

[Letters]

As for us, 50% of the time you are guaranteed a point and 20% out of the 50, all 3 points.

86% of statistics are made up on the spot

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

86% of statistics are made up on the spot

[KSE Comedy Club]

Again what part of having almost every player in your box are you failing to understand ? I don’t even get why you’re arguing with me…I’m basically agreeing with you that our build up play is too slow. But because of this insistence of failing to understand that two things can be true…you’re trying to refute the idea that certain teams play in a way that means pretty much all of their players are in their own penalty area to make it congested.

I’ve not suggested it’s an excuse, is that what you’re afraid of?

I understand perfectly well.

But this idea that it isn't normal defending is something I find rather odd.

Do we not expect everyone to muck in and defend when the shit hits the fan?
Also based on how well we used to attack teams, do you not expect opposition to get everyone they can in the box to defend against us when we get in the final third?

[KSE Comedy Club]

I think the point he's making is that we (our managers, the team and our fans) seem to complain about the "deep block" more than any other team and like everyone has agreed, its not really new or revolutionary.

I must admit, Arsenal complaining about the deep block didn't start with Arteta though (AW takes the crown there) and I don't remember the deep block being much of an issue under Emery.

The thing to note is other top teams don't seem to give this deep block thing that much of a significance, and that includes teams like Man City who also excel at slow boring build up play.

Yes this is it in a nutshell.

I think that is where my personal irritation lies

I've just heard fans saying it a lot this season, like it's this big deal, but the reality is that teams will come and defend, sometimes with 11 men in their own half, because we used to rip them to shreds if they didn't.

They have learnt from past mistakes, but we haven't learnt how to adapt back to quick counter attacking play.