Will we bottle the Fa Cup ?

[Niall_Quinn]

But... the 8 years is how long it has taken to build the stadium and the financial footing to start delivering the objectives. I'm really not sure why people aren't seeing this. Correct, no trophies in 8 years. Instead, stadium, hugely expanded financial model, partly funded by player sales but now that can reverse. Saw the first signal with Ozil and the pursuit if Suarez. The other option was to go back to the early 80s and battle it out and even nick a cup from time to time, while the big clubs played in the billion quid marketplace and the gap became insurmountable. But yes, it has taken time to build what most of the others have written out a cheque to buy. Fair play to Liverpool, they have (sort of) done it in a similar way but they have their big challenges yet to come. And they have spent, what, three times what we have net on players over the last few years?

[Dein-machine]

But... the 8 years is how long it has taken to build the stadium and the financial footing to start delivering the objectives. I'm really not sure why people aren't seeing this. Correct, no trophies in 8 years. Instead, stadium, hugely expanded financial model, partly funded by player sales but now that can reverse. Saw the first signal with Ozil and the pursuit if Suarez. The other option was to go back to the early 80s and battle it out and even nick a cup from time to time, while the big clubs played in the billion quid marketplace and the gap became insurmountable. But yes, it has taken time to build what most of the others have written out a cheque to buy. Fair play to Liverpool, they have (sort of) done it in a similar way but they have their big challenges yet to come. And they have spent, what, three times what we have net on players over the last few years?

Yes, I agree with a lot you say but the money Liverpool have spent is not "out of our league" & it has given them to push they needed to compete at the top - we haven't spent when we obviously needed to & more importantly, when we've had the money to do so. 3 out of our last 4 signings have been free transfers. It worries me that Wenger still believes that buying cheap to get good is better than buying expensive to get quality - it can't work nowadays.

[fakeyank]

Because we've made progress this year and if we win a trophy too that will be something worth building on.

Last year we were struggling most of the season and only just snuck into the top 4 on the last day.
This year after 29 games we were 4 points off the top with a game in hand. Yes yes, the thumping was embarrassing but we're still 9 points off better than at this stage last year and we've got a lot of good wins this year in games we were drawing or losing last year. We've negotiated 3 tricky Cup ties (all at home, admittedly, but still 3 of the top 6 teams and one who are genuine title contenders) to get us to the FA Cup semi final. We've had this big mental block in big games over the last few years which has contributed to us not winning trophies. If we go and do it this year - and with the teams left then we really should - then that's something we can build on. The players will no longer be playing for a side who haven't won a trophy in 9 years. We're a top striker away from being a side who can genuinely challenge. We don't need to rip everything up and start again.

What exactly is progress? A few seasons back, 2009-10, we were in the PL running and folded completely around this time. Ditto for the 07-08 season. Progress to me for a club of Arsenals size is playing better football than last season, winning or at least challenging the big teams, having an air of positivity around the club etc.

You want to see progress? Look at Liverpool... that is what you call progress. To me, there are two sides where we made some progress this season: Defense (a record whose stats look like poo because of our hammerings this season) and the fact that we spend 42 million quid on a player (albeit someone we didnt necessarily need).

What makes you think we will have big match mentality, play better football, go beyond 2nd round of the CL? To me, there is very little that makes me optimistic of any of this happening under Wenger.
If Wenger signs a new contract after winning the FA Cup, it will certainly give him one more season to stay and build. Do I think it'll be different? I do not see much reason to believe so.

[Letters]

What exactly is progress?

I've posted a million times the progress I've seen this year and the signs of hope for the future.

The title was never the benchmark this year. Did you think we'd win the title before the season started? If so then fine, but I certainly didn't although it's nice to have been far more involved in the title race than I expected.

Finish the job in the FA Cup and that will show there's a bit more about this lot than in the past few seasons ago, they can do it when it matters.
It would be a good basis for further progress and last summer we were going after players of the calibre that could seriously push us on. Ozil was a great signing, it sounds like the club weren't as stupid as some on here made out in their pursuit of Suarez. The money is there now so there are no more excuses, we've made some progress this year and if we win the Cup that would give the players some real belief that they can win trophies. I don't think that's the time to be disrupting all that by changing manager.

If we cock up the FA Cup then fine, with the clubs left that would be a capitulation too many for me and show we'll never win anything under Wenger again.

[Dein-machine]

What exactly is progress? A few seasons back, 2009-10, we were in the PL running and folded completely around this time. Ditto for the 07-08 season. Progress to me for a club of Arsenals size is playing better football than last season, winning or at least challenging the big teams, having an air of positivity around the club etc.

You want to see progress? Look at Liverpool... that is what you call progress. To me, there are two sides where we made some progress this season: Defense (a record whose stats look like poo because of our hammerings this season) and the fact that we spend 42 million quid on a player (albeit someone we didnt necessarily need).

What makes you think we will have big match mentality, play better football, go beyond 2nd round of the CL? To me, there is very little that makes me optimistic of any of this happening under Wenger.
If Wenger signs a new contract after winning the FA Cup, it will certainly give him one more season to stay and build. Do I think it'll be different? I do not see much reason to believe so.

Totally agree - I think Letter's stance is that we have more points than last year. I would say that we'll get less points in the second half of this season compared to the 1st. Don't think that is progress & its totally up to date..
If you look at the negative football we are playing this year, to me started at Dortmund with a wonder result but then for some reason we decided we were Italian's who wanted to defend 1-0 leads & play counter attacking football - even 2-0 up at home to Coventry in the cup. We have ruined Ozil after a promising start by asking him to become a defensive midfielder & by given him no options in front of him apart from the statuesque Giroud. We had a natural successor to Theo to give us pace & purpose down the flanks enabling us to get behind defenses, but we've decided the OX is a central midfielder. The football in the last 3 months is possibly the worst I've seen from any Wenger team.

[Letters]

It's not just about points although that is a good indication of where a team is (agreed the end of the season is when it really matters though).
It's just some of the games we've won this year which we wouldn't last year. We look like a better, more solid side. It's not always great to watch when we're hanging on for dear life but we've been moaning for years about us conceding silly goals late in games to drop points, this year we've hardly done that.
Win the FA Cup and that would show they can finally finish the job and hopefully push on next year. That is not the time to throw everything up in the air by changing manager or having huge clearouts. We've not been a million miles away this year, let's build on that.

[Dein-machine]

It's not just about points although that is a good indication of where a team is (agreed the end of the season is when it really matters though).
It's just some of the games we've won this year which we wouldn't last year. We look like a better, more solid side. It's not always great to watch when we're hanging on for dear life but we've been moaning for years about us conceding silly goals late in games to drop points, this year we've hardly done that.
Win the FA Cup and that would show they can finally finish the job and hopefully push on next year. That is not the time to throw everything up in the air by changing manager or having huge clearouts. We've not been a million miles away this year, let's build on that.

Its progress defensively against the lesser teams, certainly won games this year by defending well. But to be defending heavily against lesser teams must mean we are not attacking them, playing too deep, counter attack football - IS THIS PROGRESS?
This is NOT the Arsenal way, NOT the philosophy of Wenger & NOT why players such as Ozil come to Arsenal.
Wenger is desperate to win something but he has lost the plot in doing so. If you want to play like Stoke on match days, buy the correct type of player ( Huth ) & train like it 5 days a week. We continue to train as Barca & yet want to play like Stoke on a weekend - it can't work.

[Letters]

Play like Stoke? Seriously? Behave...

[fakeyank]

The problem that I see under Wenger in recent years has been this- if we are solid defensively like this year, our attack seems crap. If our attack is good, our defense is shit. If we win/draw big matches, we lose the silly ones against mid-table teams. If we win against the mid-table teams, we cant win the big games. If we win the home games, we drop points in the away games. If we win the away games, we drop points at home.

Its never being able to cohesively be good in every department. Its one or the other. How many times can you recall AW saying "Our home form is great but away form is a worry", "Our away form is better than home form because the fans are on our backs", "we played with a little bit handbrake", "we conceded goals we should not have conceded"

May be winning the FA cup will change everything, just like it turned the tables for Man Utd but I just do not have faith in AW after the repeated failures of the last 7-8 seasons.

[AFC Leveller]

Agree with the yank. A good manager/coach is able to find the right balance between attacking and defending and Wenger simply can't.

These capitulations run a lot deeper than just "off days" and i think either the players dont listen/trust him anymore or he doesnt set them up properly.

Ive had so much crap taken the piss out of me this week from all sorts of fans that its gone beond banter! all because of this usueless team and clueless manager.