Arsene to "rise above" fan nonsense

[Olivier's xmas twist]

It's not totally wrong. The essence of sport is what goes on by those participating, not by those watching. Fans are peripheral. Without fans, there is football, without football there is just a bunch of people standing around for no apparent reason.

Do fans impact the play? Yes. Does having more fans paying more money mean more of a chance of making profits? Yes. But you don't organise your team and play in order to please fans. That's x-factor and big brother and all that shite. We don't vote to see who gets subbed every week (thank god). I don't want Wenger to alter the way he does business or picks his team to please fans. You don't run a club by pandering to public opinion. That doesn't mean I agree with everything he chooses to do or not do, but that's his job. He is central, I am peripheral. I can complain, wage a hate campaign online, boo at the games, but that should be water off a duck's back to what goes on at the centre. They should strive to win/suceed with whatever constraints they may have to deal with, whether financial, philosophical, imposed from without or self-imposed.

And players don't play for the fans. That's nonsense and has always been nonsense. Players play because they have it in them to compete and to strive for success. You think people who train their whole lives to be in the olympics in a completely irrelevant sport without any public interest do it for the fans? You compete because you can and because it's personally rewarding, if not enriching.

Too right.

[Marc Overmars]

Jam Persie has a rather depressing but also valid point.

[Fats]

So because i never agreed with you and said nothing bad about Wenger, i'm a wum, I have never ever come on here with the intention to wind up anybody, if i offended you then i aoplogise.

Nobody cares who you agree with. However to call their opinion "rubbish" is disrespectful and uncalled for. If your opinion is different thats cool.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Nobody cares who you agree with. However to call their opinion "rubbish" is disrespectful and uncalled for. If your opinion is different thats cool.

Like i said if i offended you i apologise

[Unai Tea]

Jam Persie has a rather depressing but also valid point.

Its the kernel of a valid point taken to its logical extreme. It's the counter-point to the 'fan entitlement' line of argumentation. There is a happy medium. But I disagree vehemently with the notion of 'I spent a tenner on a arsenal hat therefore I demand respect and that my views are fully taken on board in terms of how the team plays, who plays, who gets sold and who gets brought in. Who do those monkeys running the club think they are?' I don't really see the sports team/fan relationship as a wholly sterile one either and there is often a symbiotic interaction and fans can play an important role. But one has to maintain a reasonable level of perspective.

The bottom line is that I think Wenger is right to focus on his team and do everything he feels is right to succeed, rather than worrying too much about fans' opinions or opprobrium. That doesn't mean I wouldn't have liked to throttle him when he subbed Chamberlain off against Man Utd but there you go. And the premise of this thread, i..e how dare Wenger express the notion that his job is to get the best out of his team and not necessarily worry about fan opinion, is largely moot.

[Özim]

Whilst I agree with what you say, if the fans don't turn up, or watch the team on telly etc...there is no club, Arsenal would not exist without the fans and that's a fact.

I guarantee that if people stopped turning up you'd see changes, they're only able to be so dismissive because people keep turning up regardless. Wenger has his ideas of what is right etc, but it's been proven wrong for 6 years with failure after failure, the results don't lie and just because he's too stubborn to admit it it doesn't mean it isn't true.

A manager should be adaptable and react to failure and changes in the game, he fails to and thus whatever he may or may not think he's wrong. If someone who ignores everything around him thinks he's right, that does not make him so.

[Xhaka Can’t]

Six years of failure, blah blah blah.

It has not been six years of failure.

[Power n Glory]

It's no end product, that's for sure.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Whilst I agree with what you say, if the fans don't turn up, or watch the team on telly etc...there is no club, Arsenal would not exist without the fans and that's a fact.

I guarantee that if people stopped turning up you'd see changes, they're only able to be so dismissive because people keep turning up regardless. Wenger has his ideas of what is right etc, but it's been proven wrong for 6 years with failure after failure, the results don't lie and just because he's too stubborn to admit it it doesn't mean it isn't true.

A manager should be adaptable and react to failure and changes in the game, he fails to and thus whatever he may or may not think he's wrong. If someone who ignores everything around him thinks he's right, that does not make him so.

Depends what you define as Failure, Most wil say its only be 2-3 seasons of failure.

[Marc Overmars]

Doesn't matter what it is, 3, 4, 5 years.

We're all disappointed with the club and that's what needs to turn around.