Originally Posted by Letters
That's the truth of the matter. His legacy and genius is being called into question because of the past 7 years. His record has been that poor. It's the same with all things in life and sport. With boxing, there are many champions but the all-time greats are ranked above everyone else because they fought the best and competed in a tough era. David Haye and the Klitschko Brothers will never go down as greats because the heavyweight division in boxing is weak compared to the time Ali and Frazier were fighting. If Murray has to weight until Federer and Nadal bow out of the game before winning more grandslams, he can't be considered the best of his generation.
Wenger has had a real test on his hands over the past few years and more elite managers with experience of winning trophies have stepped into the league. More coaches have access to scouts, fitness and diet information...it's more of a level playing field and he's being made to look really bad. A manager of his supposed calibre shouldn't be dropping points to caretaker managers and rookie managers to this league.
well, says us lot, some muppets on a message board.
however, ask anyone in the game and they will put you straight on the question of his 'legacy' being called into question.
and like it or not - and by the looks of it some won't - it will be those in the game that certify his place in the game, not a bunch of fed up fans who pass off quick judgements on a keyboard.
i was hesitant to label the thread with this title, because i knew it would just descend into the same dull, boring, repetitive wenger bollocks.
problem solved.
First ever 'the muppet' thread for one of our own players.
A precedent has been set.
Pretty shameful tbh.
Some people on here refuse to call wenger out for turning into a shit muppet who's been here for years and produced zilch in the last 7, yet they'll happily do it to a new player who hasn't even had a chance to settle into the PL yet.
Same with Cathorla, and it happened to Chamakh as well.
Chamakh deserved it for some many reasons it would be better to use the search feature and pick your favourite. Giroud tries for the team so hopefully the fans will take that into account. He's not really a top striker, he's an average player. It's easy enough to see. Same as Bendtner but without the mouth, another reason to give him a bit of credit. We had one of the world's very best players up top last season so just about anyone coming in was going to be disadvantaged. Every time Giroud misses from now on we should groan and shout, "Kroenke! You greedy ****!" If that bastard was in any way serious about the football side of this club he would have chucked his chequebook on the table the minute he gained control and orderer everyone to press on. Opposite happened. We sold even bigger, more vital players and got inferior players in to replace them. Giroud is one of those inferior players.
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Discourse?! you could've done better than that ffs.
Well no, it hasn't. Clough had a lot of success with Forest and Derby in the 70s but then won very little after that (OK, a European Cup in 1980 so his success crept into the 80s, but very little after that). And he ended up taking Forest down. No-one doubts he was a great manager in his day though.
For all his failings over the last 7 years Wenger has kept us top 4 every year, we haven't dropped into mid-table, or worse (yet!). You may not value that as an achievement the board clearly do and so to most of football - clubs like Liverpool and Spurs have spent a lot of money trying to get into the top 4 without much success. Given that he has kept us up there he should have won a few trophies but it's no mean feat in an era of billionaires.
Ferguson will go down, rightly so, as an all time great manager. Possibly the all time great manager. Fergie was Wenger's competition when he joined Arsenal and Utd were already established as the dominant side of the 90s. For the first half of Wenger's time with us they stood toe to toe, Wenger arguably got the better of him in the early noughties. He has failed to maintain that, partly because of the billionaires, partly because other clubs have caught up with his training methods and scouting which initially gave us an edge, partly because of his own damn stubbornness. But let's not get all revisionist about it, in his day he was brilliant and transformed the club from a boring mid-table club into the best team in the country playing a fantastic style of football.
His biggest weakness over the last few years has been stubborness. Determined to take on the big spenders in his own way. He gambled, and failed.. and is now so cacooned in a personal obsession to prove everyone wrong that it is detrimental to all the good things he did in his early tenure. I've contemplated if he's in on a scam to make the board as rich as possible, but I just can't bring myself to believe it.
But I agree, he will still go down as a great manager, regardless of the shambles we have seen recently.
And to call him a glorified scout who got lucky is ridiculous.
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