Wenger's legacy - has it held us back

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GB.

Where else will I meet a Bangladeshi from Indianapolis?

---

Indianapolis


:coffee:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Letters

:(

---

How was your prawn sandwich yesterday?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GB.

The reality is I am an Arsenal fan through good and bad - I may go less as a form of protest, but I'll never stop completely. Unless you are someone who lives trhe matchday experience, you'll never know or be able to comment on what it means. Through Arsenal, I've had some of the most enjoyable days of my life - experiences I'll take to my grave. I've met wonderful friends and share great times with them - now I share these times with my son and even in recent years the vast majority of matchdays have been positive.

---

You've touched on something there, GB. Hypothetically speaking, if Arsenal fans suddenly decided to completely boycott one home game, do you thinks THAT will be what makes the board stand up and realise that something is desperately wrong?

In reality, this is very difficult to accomplish. I know Manchester City did it a few years back (when they were shit), but that was at Bolton Wanderers, because they bemoaned the high ticket prices at the Reebok. An away ground is easier avoid than your home turf.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Letters

Indianapolis


:coffee:

---

He's moved!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GB.

How was your prawn sandwich yesterday?

---

Expensive :(

But super super quality.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Letters

:(

---

Oh and Letters too.

:patrice:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GB.

Where else will I meet a Bangladeshi from Indianapolis?

---

Isn't that more due to this board though?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GB.

Where else will I meet a Bangladeshi from Indianapolis?

---

Dell technical support?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

I don't have a problem with the through thick and thin approach, this is however slightly different for me, it's basically money men doing whatever they want with no repercussions, this isn't the old we're going through bad times on the pitch issue, it's to do with people who don't give a sh*t about what happens on the pitch...it's not football.

I supported Arsenal through the Graham days and we had some bad times too, but that never bothered me, I really enjoyed that period (despite what some might say) you win some you lose some.....what does is people taking the p*ss and not giving a damn about football or the fans.

---

You keep going on about the Graham days. Football has changed loads since then. Not only with our club but all over. Its all about making money no matter which club your at. Only diffrence is most clubs don't show they are doing this.

Quote:

---

this isn't the old we're going through bad times on the pitch issue, it's to do with people who don't give a sh*t about what happens on the pitch...it's not football.

---

Its not a bad going through bad times on the pitch, its going through bad times at the club. This is the lowest i have been as a gooner. Not all fans are older then me you and know about the GG days Early AW days. This is what they grow up with and see it as a bad time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ernesto

You've touched on something there, GB. Hypothetically speaking, if Arsenal fans suddenly decided to completely boycott one home game, do you thinks THAT will be what makes the board stand up and realise that something is desperately wrong?

In reality, this is very difficult to accomplish. I know Manchester City did it a few years back (when they were shit), but that was at Bolton Wanderers, because they bemoaned the high ticket prices at the Reebok. An away ground is easier avoid than your home turf.

---

Any business - and lets face it, whatever we think of Arsenal, the Board regard it as a business, would have to take note of something so extreme. But there are many daytrippers who would likely take up the tickets we don't. A way of hitting the club without cutting your nose off to spite your face, is to not buy anything at the stadium or any merchandise.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grimandi's Perm

Dell technical support?

---

I have a HP computer.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

You keep going on about the Graham days. Football has changed loads since then. Not only with our club but all over. Its all about making money no matter which club your at. Only diffrence is most clubs don't show they are doing this.




Its not a bad going through bad times on the pitch, its going through bad times at the club. This is the lowest i have been as a gooner. Not all fans are older then me you and know about the GG days Early AW days. This is what they grow up with and see it as a bad time.

---

Yeah football has changed but there's not many clubs that treat their fans with so much contempt without really giving them anything. You could say Chelsea, but then they go out and sign top players and have won stuff over the years (so the fans get something out of it).

We basically get told to like it or lump it, there's no real investment, players are sold and the management basically telling us we know nothing and that they are doing things the right way (despite this being clearly not the case) and all this whilst charging the highest prices.......no other club does this.

This is not the same as winning and losing, this is the people at the top rolling in it and not giving a sh*t about football, it's not about the club struggling, football not being important to the guys at the top is a very bad thing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GB.

I have a HP computer.

---

http://www.trelleborg.com/upload/Ind...in%20India.JPG

Hello, thank for you callings HP, my names is Stephen

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GB.

Any business - and lets face it, whatever we think of Arsenal, the Board regard it as a business, would have to take note of something so extreme. But there are many daytrippers who would likely take up the tickets we don't. A way of hitting the club without cutting your nose off to spite your face, is to not buy anything at the stadium or any merchandise.

---

I agree with you and that's a problem, but for me the attitude they show is of people who just assume the money will keep rolling in whatever the fans think, no normal company can operate like this or they would soon find they'd have no business.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GB.

Any business - and lets face it, whatever we think of Arsenal, the Board regard it as a business, would have to take note of something so extreme. But there are many daytrippers who would likely take up the tickets we don't. A way of hitting the club without cutting your nose off to spite your face, is to not buy anything at the stadium or any merchandise.

---

The slimy ****s would just announce the attendance as 60,030 and roll on. Wenger would say we lacked a little bit supporters. Stan would get a refund off the cops and save money giving the cleaning staff the week off. Then they sit down and have a meeting to figure if there was a way to sue the fans for breach of contract.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Injury Time

You got Sky?

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

No

---

Fly Emirates?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

I agree with you and that's a problem, but for me the attitude they show is of people who just assume the money will keep rolling in whatever the fans think, no normal company can operate like this or they would soon find they'd have no business.

---

In business's it makes sense to maximise income and reign in expenditure.
People keep buying the tickets and merchandise, Wenger's done enough to keep us top 4 while making a profit in the transfer window.
Everyone's happy. Except the fans, but football clubs have an advantage over other businesses - brand loyalty. If Sainsbury's double their prices I'll go to ASDA. If Arsenal do then I'm not going to become a Spurs fan. My only option is to withdraw my custom - but for my dad I would have done that although I don't buy the shirts any more so I don't give them any more than I need to.
Until income starts to drop there's no reason Arsenal the business would change anything.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

Yeah football has changed but there's not many clubs that treat their fans with so much contempt without really giving them anything. You could say Chelsea, but then they go out and sign top players and have won stuff over the years (so the fans get something out of it).

We basically get told to like it or lump it, there's no real investment, players are sold and the management basically telling us we know nothing and that they are doing things the right way (despite this being clearly not the case) and all this whilst charging the highest prices.......no other club does this.

This is not the same as winning and losing, this is the people at the top rolling in it and not giving a sh*t about football, it's not about the club struggling, football not being important to the guys at the top is a very bad thing.

---

Regardless of all that going on this is still a low for the club its the worst we have been on the pitch, so its a bad time for the club and its fans.

This is why fans care, its nothing to do with those upstairs, its the love for the club. The club is going through a bad patch one of the worst i have seen. Maybe in a few years the fans lucky enough will grow uo to see Arsenal in a better way.

Quote:

---

This is not the same as winning and losing, this is the people at the top rolling in it and not giving a sh*t about football, it's not about the club struggling, football not being important to the guys at the top is a very bad thing.

---

No but to the fans the club is struggling. Fans only want to worry about what happens on the pitch not in the boardroom/s. To me this is a bad period in Arsenal history. Even on the pitch i have never seen us be this bad and so many others would agree.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

I don't know how there can be a waiting list to pay the highest prices around and yet get to watch dogshite on the pitch with no real effort and hunger from the players.

It's like going to the Fat Duck and being served a McDonalds Burger.

---

2 diffrent things. You go to a place like that and get treated in a bad way, then its easy to not go there again, football is not easy to walk away from.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Letters

In business's it makes sense to maximise income and reign in expenditure.
People keep buying the tickets and merchandise, Wenger's done enough to keep us top 4 while making a profit in the transfer window.
Everyone's happy. Except the fans, but football clubs have an advantage over other businesses - brand loyalty. If Sainsbury's double their prices I'll go to ASDA. If Arsenal do then I'm not going to become a Spurs fan. My only option is to withdraw my custom - but for my dad I would have done that although I don't buy the shirts any more so I don't give them any more than I need to.
Until income starts to drop there's no reason Arsenal the business would change anything.

---

I agree with you, so it's not just another business, it's a licence to print money with (in our case) no repercussions for not keeping the customers happy.

I totally agree that until income drops nothing will change, but income won't drop if the stadium is full every week, catch 22.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Injury Time

Fly Emirates?

---

No, it's a ripoff have you seen their prices?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

Regardless of all that going on this is still a low for the club its the worst we have been on the pitch, so its a bad time for the club and its fans.

This is why fans care, its nothing to do with those upstairs, its the love for the club. The club is going through a bad patch one of the worst i have seen. Maybe in a few years the fans lucky enough will grow uo to see Arsenal in a better way.

---

It's not a low time for the club at all, there's more money than ever, record profits and happy board members getting richer, the club is in a very very healthy place.....just not on the pitch.

There's a big difference between struggles for the club and what we're seeing now, we're not stuggling, we're choosing not to try and improve.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

No, it's a ripoff have you seen their prices?

---

That is why I'm flying Royal Brunei.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

It's not a low time for the club at all, there's more money than ever, record profits and happy board members getting richer, the club is in a very very healthy place.....just not on the pitch.

There's a big difference between struggles for the club and what we're seeing now, we're not stuggling, we're choosing not to try and improve.

---

of course its a low time for the club, im not talking about what the board etc are doing. Im talking from the fans point of view. This is the lowest a lot of fans would have been well in this era anyways.

When i say clud i don't mean the board or what money they make, i mean Arsenal as in the name.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

of course its a low time for the club, im not talking about what the board etc are doing. Im talking from the fans point of view. This is the lowest a lot of fans would have been well in this era anyways.

When i say clud i don't mean the board or what money they make, i mean Arsenal as in the name.

---

Then it's a low time for the fans not for the club, there's a difference (the club is in a great place).

This isn't good times bad times as I said before, it's very different it's self inflicted as the club have a choice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

No, it's a ripoff have you seen their prices?

---

Not used the Arsenal membership discou....oh right...
Used Bettson?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

Then it's a low time for the fans not for the club, there's a difference (the club is in a great place).

This isn't good times bad times as I said before, it's very different it's self inflicted as the club have a choice.

---

The club is not in a great place. The owner and those who have made money, are in a great place. thats the diffrence. The club was here before all these people and it will be after these people.

If this is not good times, then winning the league Champions league etc would not make a diffrence (lets just say we did) it will just be the money making people still making money.

The club is at its low, which is why ever paper, ever former player will tell you that. the clun and does who work for the club are not 1 in the same.

The reason's you have listed are why its a low time for the club in its history.

The board that includes Wenger have become filtthy rich from the Arsenal FC gravy train, they don't give a fcuk about me and you and the other 60,000 regulars at the Emirates being ripped of every season paying the highest prices in the country to watch a load of bollox. Wenger has a % of the player sales in his contract, so apart from his staggering 7.5 mill per season salary, I guarantee you he is making an additonal 5 mill plus all going to his offshore bank account in Monaco or Zurich. Even if half the season ticket holders did not renew thier ST's, the board know there are another 30K Arsenal fans, the johnny come latelys ready to splash the cash and inherit the season ticket. We are in a lose lose situation.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

You (the fans) putting money into the shareholders pockets is bad for the club, that's what allows them to treat the fans with contempt and get away with all the things they get away with. Until they realise it's not a gravy train they can just take for granted nothing will change.

Whether you like it or not that's the reality.

---

as i've said to you many times now, its so easy to say that as an internet supporter.

you have forgotten what it is like to be a fan going to a game. that's another reality you can't see.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

Yeah football has changed but there's not many clubs that treat their fans with so much contempt without really giving them anything. You could say Chelsea, but then they go out and sign top players and have won stuff over the years (so the fans get something out of it).

---

we've had a century, they've had a decade. i'd hedge my bets to day they're not too happy right now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BlindFaith_8

The board that includes Wenger have become filtthy rich from the Arsenal FC gravy train, they don't give a fcuk about me and you and the other 60,000 regulars at the Emirates being ripped of every season paying the highest prices in the country to watch a load of bollox. Wenger has a % of the player sales in his contract, so apart from his staggering 7.5 mill per season salary, I guarantee you he is making an additonal 5 mill plus all going to his offshore bank account in Monaco or Zurich. Even if half the season ticket holders did not renew thier ST's, the board know there are another 30K Arsenal fans, the johnny come latelys ready to splash the cash and inherit the season ticket. We are in a lose lose situation.

---

This is what happens when upstairst you kick out those who loved the game, with those who only care about business. Then you have the likes or Friar and Hillwood, who once loved the game seem to be waiting for retirement. Danny Fiszman must be turning in his grave to see the way things had turned out.

in american sports they have a minimum total salary "floor" to prevent the owners bleeding the teams dry by taking the money while serving up a plate of shit.

american owners will be american owners. theyre just doing what they do.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Terry Tuffnutz

as i've said to you many times now, its so easy to say that as an internet supporter.

you have forgotten what it is like to be a fan going to a game. that's another reality you can't see.

---

You're there to support the team and lose yourself in the moment.

I support Arsenal Football Club, not Wenger, the board or any other individuals. It's not easy to cut out something irrational like supporting a club. I don't go reguarly but the times I do go leave me wanting to go again and again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Terry Tuffnutz

we've had a century, they've had a decade. i'd hedge my bets to day they're not too happy right now.

---

Maybe not but do you reckon they'd swap seats with us?

I doubt it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

Maybe not but do you reckon they'd swap seats with us?

I doubt it.

---

Yes.

Not all their fans but some will. You only have to listend to Chav fans moaning about their club on radio to see some ain't happy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

Yes.

Not all their fans but some will. You only have to listend to Chav fans moaning about their club on radio to see some ain't happy.

---

Don't make me laugh, they sign top players are higher in the league and have won stuff in the last 7 years including the CL.

There's no way in hell they'd swap with us, we're lying 10th and barely spend a penny.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

Don't make me laugh, they sign top players are higher in the league and have won stuff in the last 7 years including the CL.

There's no way in hell they'd swap with us, we're lying 10th and barely spend a penny.

---

Yes because everything is about winning trophy's not all Chelsea fans think like you. Listen to Talk sport 606 and then you see what i mean.

And im talking about history not the last 10 years, we have won more then them in our history.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Charlie the Gooner

Yes because everything is about winning trophy's not all Chelsea fans think like you. Listen to Talk sport 606 and then you see what i mean.

And im talking about history not the last 10 years, we have won more then them in our history.

---

That's such a load of cr*p to be honest, football fans are fickle a few wins and all is forgotten a few defeats and it's the end of the world, given the chance they'd never swap with us because the reality is we're not competitive, don't bring in quality players, never make any changes and settle for 4th place......no Chelsea fan would be happy with what we put up with.

Sure we have history and that's great, but ask Liverpool fans what that means right now? In addition we've never won the biggest prize the CL.

Chelsea fans aren't happy that Benitez is in charge, but a few wins and it will all be forgotten and come next season when a new man comes in and improves things all will be well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItsMe

That's such a load of cr*p to be honest, football fans are fickle a few wins and all is forgotten a few defeats and it's the end of the world, given the chance they'd never swap with us because the reality is we're not competitive, don't bring in quality players, never make any changes and settle for 4th place......no Chelsea fan would be happy with what we put up with.

Sure we have history and that's great, but ask Liverpool fans what that means right now? In addition we've never won the biggest prize the CL.

---

Again im not talking about the roman era im talking about history. They had not history before Roman took over fact. We have a better history, not sure why you keep bringing up what they keep buying its irrelvant to the convensation.

Quote:

---

.no Chelsea fan would be happy with what we put up with.

---

know all of them by history, just you cause fickle glory hunter don't mean they all are.

Lets just agree to disagree.