If we finish 3rd Wenger is the best manager in the league

[latewinner]

How could you say that? Mourinho has never had to work under any sort of strain or external influence. Wenger has turned us from an average Premier League side into a club respected over Europe. The stadium handicapped us initially but he still did remarkably well to keep us in the top 4, all that with a young and sometimes average squad as well. I'm not saying Wenger it out right better than Mourinho, both have their relative merits but I think what Wenger has achieved is on the whole far more impressive.

Wenger is a great manager in the overall sense, managing the team and club, handling certain constraints some legitimate some self imposed but he's not on Mourinho's level strictly measuring performance and results on the pitch regardless of the money involved. Mourinho's detractors point to the bundle of money he's had but winning the treble with Inter Milan was remarkable money or no money. Do you think Wenger could have done the same, masterminding wins over, Chelsea, Barcelona and Bayern Munich. I don't think any manger could. He's the best at achieving the best results with capable players.
Would Wenger win the league with Real Madrid up against this Barcelona side?
Wenger's praised because he didn't have as much money as his rivals and its assumed he'd be even greater but give him the same resources as Mourinho and I think its clear he wouldn't achieve what he has.

[Globalgunner]

The eternal question on these blogs: Wenger the great or Wenger the wimp. He may be the second best manager in the league but in real terms Fergie is so far ahead of him that the space between them should be 1st to 5th, then comes Wenger. The sad thing about us Arsenal fans now is that we revel in glorious failure. We failed to make it past Milan, but we tell ourselves we did great by beating them at the emirates. Chelsea on the other hand faced a similar mountain and scaled through, yet we see ourselves as winners nonetheless. We have beeen long at it, When Barcelona eliminated us a few seasons ago. Wenger was back on the mic a few weeks later, chortling that we, Arsenal were one of the only 2 teams to beat them anywhere that year.

We are the kid who used to get straight A`s in high school but when at Uni, surrounded by other smart kids, starts to pat himself on the back for getting B`s. "At least i`m better than that Spud down the road who allways gets C".

So Wengers done great again eh?. A man whos list of lemon signings is at least 30 strong, talented dilettante chokers who get paid for not being able to put the ball in the net even with the goalie awol.

We like to hear what we want to hear and disregard the rest ( Sorry Simon and Garfunkel) even when it is pertinant. Sol Campbell wrote in the Guardian just yesterday that Wenger brooks no opposition to his methods especially amongst his backroom staff and also amongst the players. that is why we have no strong characters in our squad and why we make the same tactical and mental deficient mistakes each year . It is the Wenger way or no way. which is okay if you are a constant success like fergie but sheer hubris otherwise. This is probably the reason Steve Bould, Keown and other old players will not accept to be his RH stooge. Expect to see Pat Rice prevailed upon to stay another year, Hey, why break up a winning team

Wenger needs to change his ways and fast otherwise, this same discourse will continue on this forum until he leaves...........Or until Fergie finally gets tired of swanning the EPL each year with 25 titles that Pool will not be able to eclipse in a millennia,,,then Wenger can move up from 6th to 1st. OH happy days.....Hooray!!!!!!!!!

[latewinner]

Well because I'm wondering whether any manager in the world could do better with this squad of players. Buying world class players for silly money is the easy bit. I'm interested in someone getting the most out of a group of players and not being bailed out by a big fat chequebook.

To only be behind Manure and Citeh, which is to be expected, and to be in front of Chelsea etc is an achievement IMO.

Well I asked because I thought the reason we criticize him is because of the squad he's assembled.. Chamakh, Park, Almunia, Bendter, Vela, Denilson...
I do sometimes think although he could assemble a much better squad he does overachieve with what he has. Then again I think other managers like Mourinho and Ferguson could get a lot more out of them
I don't think being in front of this Chelsea is an achievement.

[latewinner]

The eternal question on these blogs: Wenger the great or Wenger the wimp. He may be the second best manager in the league but in real terms Fergie is so far ahead of him that the space between them should be 1st to 5th, then comes Wenger. The sad thing about us Arsenal fans now is that we revel in glorious failure. We failed to make it past Milan, but we tell ourselves we did great by beating them at the emirates. Chelsea on the other hand faced a similar mountain and scaled through, yet we see ourselves as winners nonetheless. We have beeen long at it, When Barcelona eliminated us a few seasons ago. Wenger was back on the mic a few weeks later, chortling that we, Arsenal were one of the only 2 teams to beat them anywhere that year.

We are the kid who used to get straight A`s in high school but when at Uni, surrounded by other smart kids, starts to pat himself on the back for getting B`s. "At least i`m better than that Spud down the road who allways gets C".

So Wengers done great again eh?. A man whos list of lemon signings is at least 30 strong, talented dilettante chokers who get paid for not being able to put the ball in the net even with the goalie awol.

We like to hear what we want to hear and disregard the rest ( Sorry Simon and Garfunkel) even when it is pertinant. Sol Campbell wrote in the Guardian just yesterday that Wenger brooks no opposition to his methods especially amongst his backroom staff and also amongst the players. that is why we have no strong characters in our squad and why we make the same tactical and mental deficient mistakes each year . It is the Wenger way or no way. which is okay if you are a constant success like fergie but sheer hubris otherwise. This is probably the reason Steve Bould, Keown and other old players will not accept to be his RH stooge. Expect to see Pat Rice prevailed upon to stay another year, Hey, why break up a winning team

Wenger needs to change his ways and fast otherwise, this same discourse will continue on this forum until he leaves...........Or until Fergie finally gets tired of swanning the EPL each year with 25 titles that Pool will not be able to eclipse in a millennia,,,then Wenger can move up from 6th to 1st. OH happy days.....Hooray!!!!!!!!!

That was funny do agree. You're right about Milan. While most Arsenal fans and especially Wenger's supporters were praising the comeback and saw no negative I saw the fact we could get three goals in the first half when it looked impossible to overturn and were living on adrenaline and no fear but couldn't get the vital next one (and never looked like we could except RVP's golden chance) in the whole of the second half when the comeback became reality a mark of the team's mentality. When it looks likely can't do it.
Now I was proud of us but the culture surrounding this club is that of false hope and readily acceptance, any positive whether is the game against milan, winning 7 in a row come he end of the season for fourth place and no trophy is blown up greater than what it is

[Olivier's xmas twist]

That was funny do agree. You're right about Milan. While most Arsenal fans and especially Wenger's supporters were praising the comeback and saw no negative I saw the fact we could get three goals in the first half when it looked impossible to overturn and were living on adrenaline and no fear but couldn't get the vital next one (and never looked like we could except RVP's golden chance) in the whole of the second half when the comeback became reality a mark of the team's mentality. When it looks likely can't do it.
Now I was proud of us but the culture surrounding this club is that of false hope and readily acceptance, any positive whether is the game against milan, winning 7 in a row come he end of the season for fourth place and no trophy is blown up greater than what it is

[latewinner]

?

[Cripps_orig]

How could you say that? Mourinho has never had to work under any sort of strain or external influence. Wenger has turned us from an average Premier League side into a club respected over Europe. The stadium handicapped us initially but he still did remarkably well to keep us in the top 4, all that with a young and sometimes average squad as well. I'm not saying Wenger it out right better than Mourinho, both have their relative merits but I think what Wenger has achieved is on the whole far more impressive.

Has Wenger? Hes in a comfort zone knowing full well he'll never get sacked. One of the reasons why we've been rubbish for a while. Wouldnt say thats working under strain.

Average side? We finished 5th the season the season before Wenger came. We could attract world class players such as Platt and Bergkamp, had been in 2 European finals winning one and had plenty trophies in the decade before Wenger came without ever really dominating for a period. All he did was continue on with the norm and change from Boring Arsenal to Entertaining Arsenal.

The stadium was meant to take us up a level so we can compete with the big boys....thats worked well. Its been nothing short of a disaster. Id rather go back to Highbury and win stuff then be where we are now and be mediocre.

Mourinho has been successful whereever hes been regardless and dont forget, the self proclaimed best team ever Barca are eating Reals dust this season as Pep is Joses bitch once more.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Has Wenger? Hes in a comfort zone knowing full well he'll never get sacked. One of the reasons why we've been rubbish for a while. Wouldnt say thats working under strain.

Average side? We finished 5th the season the season before Wenger came. We could attract world class players such as Platt and Bergkamp, had been in 2 European finals winning one and had plenty trophies in the decade before Wenger came without ever really dominating for a period. All he did was continue on with the norm and change from Boring Arsenal to Entertaining Arsenal.

The stadium was meant to take us up a level so we can compete with the big boys....thats worked well. Its been nothing short of a disaster. Id rather go back to Highbury and win stuff then be where we are now and be mediocre.

Mourinho has been successful whereever hes been regardless and dont forget, the self proclaimed best team ever Barca are eating Reals dust this season as Pep is Joses bitch once more.

Once more

Your having a shocker again.

[latewinner]

Ok I think I know what you mean. Everyone was proud pro wenger or not but what I meant with results like that many of them are quick to include Wenger in their praise

[Cripps_orig]

Once more

Your having a shocker again.

League table doesnt lie...