So, how do WE win the league?

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Well if Fergie can't do it, then there is little hope.

And again, you're saying as though this is a business. It isn't, not when they'd collapse if one person's assets were frozen.

Pretty much, id not even think Jose could do it without spending a little.

[Kano]

Yes at a manc level
Some people on here think that With AW gone we will go on and Win the league a few times in a row etc.. Had chavs not got into money and the Invincibles been younger we'd have had an era of dominance i believe.

But it was not too be. Now i just can't see us doing that well not under Wenger or anew manager any time soon.




I agree and this is why i believe Wenger and the board, (both to blame for this) to leave the club they have failed and no amout of excuses can cover this up.

I just can't see us wining the league soon and im fine with that as long as we pick up a few cup and challenge for the league. Till we can get ourselves in a place where we can challenge City at the top.

the board have become complacent since they found a gem like wenger, a unique manager that can hone some cheap quality players into very good teams.

we have had some some fantastic players over the past 7 years, enough talent to achieve better than we have in that time and it has taken the stumble toward third this season to make me realise that changing the manager could improve things even further. now, the very fact that this group of players had a target of 3rd to achieve and actually done so as a group, could prove to be a key catalyst for their development and self belief. it's no trophy of course but they looked pretty bloody happy at doing it. yet i still think that would not be enough for us to make a significant change to our recent similar patterns.

i didn't expect us to keep on that winning streak where we ran past spurs but i didn't expect us to let go of the reigns so quickly and leave it until we had 35 minutes of the season left. we've done well to finish in 3rd and secure next seasons cl bounty but with the astonishing groundwork laid out by wenger during his time here, the platform is there for someone to get us back to winning some cups or just missing out on prems.

[Olivier's xmas twist]

the board have become complacent since they found a gem like wenger, a unique manager that can hone some cheap quality players into very good teams.

we have had some some fantastic players over the past 7 years, enough talent to achieve better than we have in that time and it has taken the stumble toward third this season to make me realise that changing the manager could improve things even further. now, the very fact that this group of players had a target of 3rd to achieve and actually done so as a group, could prove to be a key catalyst for their development and self belief. it's no trophy of course but they looked pretty bloody happy at doing it. yet i still think that would not be enough for us to make a significant change to our recent similar patterns.

i didn't expect us to keep on that winning streak where we ran past spurs but i didn't expect us to let go of the reigns so quickly and leave it until we had 35 minutes of the season left. we've done well to finish in 3rd and secure next seasons cl bounty but with the astonishing groundwork laid out by wenger during his time here, the platform is there for someone to get us back to winning some cups or just missing out on prems.

Agree. Not one gooner fan should be happy with 3rd again we need to aim higher now. In honesty id have like AW to have gone last summer a new man brought in and he could have planned from there.

But like you say we have a good crop of players and now a new man can take these lot forward.

[Niall_Quinn]

I'm not saying money doesn't matter. I'm saying there is too much of an emphasis on money in football. It was always going to end up going this way. Clubs are forgetting about basic coaching and development. The answer is always to buy and some clubs just don't have that option and it leads to these sort of problems.

Yep, I don't disagree with you there, the culture of football is deteriorating. But doesn't that coincide with the rise of the mercenary footballer? Bosman wanted the entirely lop-sided privileges afforded to the professional footballer (in comparison to the average joe) and at the same time wanted the average joe's contract conditions (or at least to cherry pick the useful bits). You think of Scholes, Giggs, Adams, don't you need those types of players to build a meaningful club culture and history? Where are they now? Who are the equivalents?

We'll see what happens at Barca now, will they stick with the academy approach or will they tip it in favour of writing even bigger cheques? Should Ajax consign themselves to feeder club status now and be happy with it? What about this Euro league that's being formed bit by bit? Utd ditching the FA Cup so they could go on money spinning tours. Money is stripping football of everything that matters to the fan. Chelsea turbocharged the decline, city have fitted a rocket engine. None of it is any good and even when we talk about trophies, how much do they really matter any more in the scheme of things? City have just "won" their first in 44 years, give it 3 more seasons and it'll be routine.

It's not even about the money, it's about greed. Greedy players, greedy agents, greedy TV companies, greedy authorities (look at those corrupt shits at FIFA and UEFA). They're all sucking the life out of the game and praying for sensationalism like Sunday to disguise the rats nest.

Meanwhile you have Wenger saying it's crazy and coming 3rd anyway. Is he really the "loser"?

[Power n Glory]

Well if Fergie can't do it, then there is little hope.

And again, you're saying as though this is a business. It isn't, not when they'd collapse if one person's assets were frozen.

Fergie was close and that wasn't a strong United team. Also, they won the league last year and complacency and sometimes kick in. They lost on goal difference and City didn't run away with the league.

As for the business part...countries are on the verge of bankruptcy becaue of a few greedy individuals. Business isn't really the word. Money and greed is probably more accurate. It was always going to spiral out of control if left unregulated and that's what we're seeing now.

[Niall_Quinn]

No one thinks that.

You do.

[Ollie the Optimist]

we win the league by buidling on what we have now, keeping the squad and the spirit the same and adding in quality players. not by getting rid of everyone on the backroom team

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Fergie was close and that wasn't a strong United team. Also, they won the league last year and complacency and sometimes kick in. They lost on goal difference and City didn't run away with the league.

As for the business part...countries are on the verge of bankruptcy becaue of a few greedy individuals. Business isn't really the word. Money and greed is probably more accurate. It was always going to spiral out of control if left unregulated and that's what we're seeing now.

Sure but this summer Citeh can throw more darts at the wall except this time, knowing what team they can play, as their default option, much like Chelsea. They now know, it works. Like you say about countries, the only way it's really going to fail is through self-implosion but I don't think they'll make the same mistakes Chelsea did.

It's going to be incredibly difficult to overturn them now. Man Utd have got through this season through sheer force of will but even at 89 points that wasn't enough.

[Power n Glory]

Yep, I don't disagree with you there, the culture of football is deteriorating. But doesn't that coincide with the rise of the mercenary footballer? Bosman wanted the entirely lop-sided privileges afforded to the professional footballer (in comparison to the average joe) and at the same time wanted the average joe's contract conditions (or at least to cherry pick the useful bits). You think of Scholes, Giggs, Adams, don't you need those types of players to build a meaningful club culture and history? Where are they now? Who are the equivalents?

We'll see what happens at Barca now, will they stick with the academy approach or will they tip it in favour of writing even bigger cheques? Should Ajax consign themselves to feeder club status now and be happy with it? What about this Euro league that's being formed bit by bit? Utd ditching the FA Cup so they could go on money spinning tours. Money is stripping football of everything that matters to the fan. Chelsea turbocharged the decline, city have fitted a rocket engine. None of it is any good and even when we talk about trophies, how much do they really matter any more in the scheme of things? City have just "won" their first in 44 years, give it 3 more seasons and it'll be routine.

It's not even about the money, it's about greed. Greedy players, greedy agents, greedy TV companies, greedy authorities (look at those corrupt shits at FIFA and UEFA). They're all sucking the life out of the game and praying for sensationalism like Sunday to disguise the rats nest.

Meanwhile you have Wenger saying it's crazy and coming 3rd anyway. Is he really the "loser"?

I agree with Wenger's philosophy. But I think he's a bad coach. Plus, it's a little misguided to pay kids over inflated wages and spending over the odds for young players. But overall, I like the idea of having a club that has a strong youth set up. We just need someone that actually pull it off. Having the vision is one thing, I but i don't think he has the character or skill to do it.

[Power n Glory]

Sure but this summer Citeh can throw more darts at the wall except this time, knowing what team they can play, as their default option, much like Chelsea. They now know, it works. Like you say about countries, the only way it's really going to fail is through self-implosion but I don't think they'll make the same mistakes Chelsea did.

It's going to be incredibly difficult to overturn them now. Man Utd have got through this season through sheer force of will but even at 89 points that wasn't enough.

With the amount of egos Mandini has to manage and keep in check...it won't last. They won't dominate every year. They'll be a strong side but complacency will kick in, jealousy, competition for places...that will take it's toll on them and they won't be at their best. Soon enough, they will have to rebuild their squad and that's where the most together and stable clubs step in to take advantage. That's where we have screwed up. Two or three seasons ago, Man Utd, Liverpool and Chelsea were all unstable because they had major players leaving and new managers settling in. We never took advantage of that period even though our squad was the most stable.