did he fuck. he used to be one of the greatest managers england has ever seen. his style, the unbeatables the trophies. dont take the piss and call him a scout because you hate him now. its fucking pathetic.Originally Posted by Arse n Wonga
did he fuck. he used to be one of the greatest managers england has ever seen. his style, the unbeatables the trophies. dont take the piss and call him a scout because you hate him now. its fucking pathetic.
A great manager doesn't go from winning to doing f*ck all for 7+ years sorry. The fact he's been incapable of reproducing anything makes you question his achievements somewhat and wonder whether he was just in the right place at the right time with his knowledge of French football.
When he arrived he had a massive advantage and used that well, but on a level playing field he shown himself to be inadequate and unable to compete with other teams, he's had years to build a team and yet we've been going backwards.
Like I said his successes are a distant memory, it's beginning to be hard to remember that under Wenger, now we remember failure and lack of bottle on the pitch and boring repetitive play coupled with endless excuses.
Last edited by Özim; 21-01-2013 at 10:20 PM.
its only hard to remember his success when blinded by hatred
using your logic of right place right time, that means if a new manager comes in and uses pretty much the same squad and wins a trophy in his first season, then its because of wenger for building the squad right?
and what advantage is this you talk of which you say he had when he arrived? the one where we were fighting for fourth, and he took us to the top?
Not really not, it's a long time ago now a lot has happened since then.its only hard to remember his success when blinded by hatred
using your logic of right place right time, that means if a new manager comes in and uses pretty much the same squad and wins a trophy in his first season, then its because of wenger for building the squad right?
and what advantage is this you talk of which you say he had when he arrived? the one where we were fighting for fourth, and he took us to the top?
A new manager would never use the same squad, but ultimately Wenger has shown incapable of making a winning team out of this lot, if someone else manages it, that's because they clearly are a better manager and can get the best out of substandard players.
He knew the French market and about all the best young french players, so he used that to sign them up when other clubs didn't have the scouting systems and new nothing about them, he also inherited a great defence, a top top forward (he actually had two but sold one) and a player who was one of the best leaders you'll ever be. That combination allowed him to build a winning team and a second winning team built with the experience, leadership and winning mentality of that first team.
He did know a lot about diet etc I'll give him that and that helped the careers of the some of the older players.
That's the truth of the matter. His legacy and genius is being called into question because of the past 7 years. His record has been that poor. It's the same with all things in life and sport. With boxing, there are many champions but the all-time greats are ranked above everyone else because they fought the best and competed in a tough era. David Haye and the Klitschko Brothers will never go down as greats because the heavyweight division in boxing is weak compared to the time Ali and Frazier were fighting. If Murray has to weight until Federer and Nadal bow out of the game before winning more grandslams, he can't be considered the best of his generation.
Wenger has had a real test on his hands over the past few years and more elite managers with experience of winning trophies have stepped into the league. More coaches have access to scouts, fitness and diet information...it's more of a level playing field and he's being made to look really bad. A manager of his supposed calibre shouldn't be dropping points to caretaker managers and rookie managers to this league.
Well no, it hasn't. Clough had a lot of success with Forest and Derby in the 70s but then won very little after that (OK, a European Cup in 1980 so his success crept into the 80s, but very little after that). And he ended up taking Forest down. No-one doubts he was a great manager in his day though.
For all his failings over the last 7 years Wenger has kept us top 4 every year, we haven't dropped into mid-table, or worse (yet!). You may not value that as an achievement the board clearly do and so to most of football - clubs like Liverpool and Spurs have spent a lot of money trying to get into the top 4 without much success. Given that he has kept us up there he should have won a few trophies but it's no mean feat in an era of billionaires.
Ferguson will go down, rightly so, as an all time great manager. Possibly the all time great manager. Fergie was Wenger's competition when he joined Arsenal and Utd were already established as the dominant side of the 90s. For the first half of Wenger's time with us they stood toe to toe, Wenger arguably got the better of him in the early noughties. He has failed to maintain that, partly because of the billionaires, partly because other clubs have caught up with his training methods and scouting which initially gave us an edge, partly because of his own damn stubbornness. But let's not get all revisionist about it, in his day he was brilliant and transformed the club from a boring mid-table club into the best team in the country playing a fantastic style of football.
His biggest weakness over the last few years has been stubborness. Determined to take on the big spenders in his own way. He gambled, and failed.. and is now so cacooned in a personal obsession to prove everyone wrong that it is detrimental to all the good things he did in his early tenure. I've contemplated if he's in on a scam to make the board as rich as possible, but I just can't bring myself to believe it.
But I agree, he will still go down as a great manager, regardless of the shambles we have seen recently.
And to call him a glorified scout who got lucky is ridiculous.
The damned annoying thing is he didn't fail by much, that Eduardo year...we really should have won it that year and had we done so it would have been his greatest achievement. If only he'd swallowed his pride a bit, kept that side together and spent to strengthen - he didn't need to break the bank, a couple of decent players would have done it - we could have pushed on
Aye, one of life's mysteries.The damned annoying thing is he didn't fail by much, that Eduardo year...we really should have won it that year and had we done so it would have been his greatest achievement. If only he'd swallowed his pride a bit, kept that side together and spent to strengthen - he didn't need to break the bank, a couple of decent players would have done it - we could have pushed on
nice work letters. i change the title and still the same shite.
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