Wenger Out ?

[Power n Glory]

Completely baseless.

Yes, Letter's....it's baseless.

http://www.goal.com/en/news/9/englan...trophy-drought

Arsenal manager Arsene Wenger has defended the club's recent lack of trophies as he prepares for his 1000th match in charge of the Gunners against Chelsea at Stamford Bridge.

The north Londoners have failed to win a trophy since lifting the FA Cup in 2005 but remain in the title hunt this season, just four points behind leaders Chelsea, and have reached the semi-finals of the FA Cup.

However, Wenger says that winning trophies is not everything and believes the club have not been given credit for some of their achievements in recent seasons.

"When you make a decision [to build the Emirates Stadium] you don't say, 'OK, we invest in the stadium but we don't want trophies'," he told the club's official website.

"In 2006 we were in the Champions League final. Nobody speaks about it now but it's still an achievement.

"It's not a trophy but we did it without conceding a goal in the whole campaign and only lost in the last 13 minutes of the Champions League. Can you say you failed that season? I don't think so. On top of that we managed to stay in the top four that season.

"We [also] beat Real Madrid with Zidane and Beckham and all these people but nobody speaks about it. It's like we have done nothing at all. Why? Because at the end of the season you don't parade the trophy."

Arsenal have come close to ending their drought on several occasions, reaching the Champiosn League final in 2005 and the Capital One Cup final in 2011, but Wenger says a team should not just be judged purely on the silverware they collect.

"Had we won the League Cup that season people would have said, 'Ah, they won the League Cup in 2006'. But what is it compared to when you know as a manager... to win the League Cup or reach the Champions League final without losing a game, what is the difference?" he added.

"You have to take a little bit of distance with [the criticism for a lack of trophies] and assess what is difficult and what is a good season. I know that trophies are important. But it's not like if you haven't won a trophy nothing happened in the whole season and it was disastrous.

"You still played good games and bad games and in the season when you won trophies you still played bad games."

[Özim]

Depending on which way you want to move the goalposts, presumably.

No depending on his actions.

[Power n Glory]

Any quote from Wenger should be taken with a pinch of salt. We all know that, Zimm.

Why should it be taken with a pinch of salt when you consider the last 9 years? It’s not as if his words and actions have been completely contradictory.

[fakeyank]

David Dein gave a good interview ahead of Wenger's ill-fated 1000th game. He said they always go out for dinner after home games unless we've lost because then Wenger's no company at all. It clearly bothers him. Whether he's able to do anything about it is a different matter.
There's clearly been some financial restrictions on him although I also believe some have been self-inflicted too. There seems to have been a longer term plan and you look at his net spend over his whole time with us it's remarkable how he's kept us up there.
He should, of course, have won some trophies in the last 9 years too and I see the FA Cup this year as his last chance to deliver.

You can accuse him of many things but not being bothered isn't one of them, there's a physical change in him when things aren't going well, it clearly affects him deeply.

Arsenal losses, especially humiliations, affect a lot of us deeply. I know I hate talking to people afterwards. I think I have aged more watching Arsenal play than because of other stress in my life!

This doesnt mean that I should be in a job where I am not delivering. For example, there is a guy who works really hard in the office but he is just not good enough. He gets 10/10 on effort but that effort is mostly towards the wrong need. Does it help the office? No.

My sympathy for Wenger and his achievements ran out in 2009. I want to see results now. Not empty promises and effort in the wrong need. Just because he looks like he worked hard doesnt excuse him. I'd rather he work smart, rather than hard.

[LDG]

Why should it be taken with a pinch of salt when you consider the last 9 years? It’s not as if his words and actions have been completely contradictory.

So you're saying you believe everything he says?

Well, we have a saying round here...fool me once, shame on...shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again...

[Power n Glory]

So you're saying you believe everything he says?

Well, we have a saying round here...fool me once, shame on...shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again...

In relation to this discussion, you think he’s bluffing? So 4th isn’t an achievement when considering the stadium move?

This isn’t a discussion about everything Wenger says, LDG.

[Power n Glory]

"You have to take a little bit of distance with [the criticism for a lack of trophies] and assess what is difficult and what is a good season. I know that trophies are important. But it's not like if you haven't won a trophy nothing happened in the whole season and it was disastrous.

"You still played good games and bad games and in the season when you won trophies you still played bad games."

Do we take this with a pinch of salt, LDG?

[LDG]

In relation to this discussion, you think he’s bluffing? So 4th isn’t an achievement when considering the stadium move?

This isn’t a discussion about everything Wenger says, LDG.

In this instance, no. I think he's talking relative sense, and there is merit in his achievements all things considered. But he wouldn't come out and outright say what he really believes, or what some of us believe, because he's a politician in that respect.

I'm sure he thinks 4th is the very minimum that should be expected of a club our size, and that we have failed in a lot of respects to move beyond that. But he won't say that to the media will he. Just like he wouldn't wash the clubs dirty linen in public.

[Letters]

Whilst we haven't, the club and manager have many times said how great an achievment it was etc etc. I agree from a financial point of view it does have a lot of meaning, prestige perhaps but being knocked at a predictable stage every season is doing nothing for it's credibility IMO, it's this that bothers me about the CL, we don't really even seem to have an outside chance because we're almost too predictable, our game doesn't seem to play the odds (Chelsea a few years back won it when they weren't the best teams, due to some lucky breaks, but their style of play and desire gave them that chance to "get lucky" IMO).

To be honest I don't really care if we're in the CL or not. It's exciting if you've not been in there often but year on year it loses its shine, especially when we've no realistic prospect of winning it. That said if we're going to be in Europe I'd rather that than the Europa league and see a million games against nobodies. At least with the CL we see some good teams, I enjoyed the group stage this year.

I believe Wenger sees it as important we're in there as do managers of most clubs who are there or thereabouts. Like I said lots of clubs throw money around trying to get up there because they see it as a way of stepping up a level and for those who are there it's a way of staying up there by getting the extra revenue and the prestige of being in the CL. We haven't made many marquee signings of late, hardly any really, but being in the CL gives us the opportunity to look at a different class of player. There's no way we'd have got Ozil had we not been in there.

I reckon he sees it as the minimum he should be achieving but I don't think for one minute he's happy with not being higher or the lack of trophies. In fact I think it was you who posted a link of him saying that if he didn't deliver trophies he would have failed. Hardly the words of someone who is content to just finish 4th each year and not win any cups. You constantly () say he's under no pressure but I do believe he's under pressure to keep us up there and while that's not something you value it is important for the reasons I've outlined and we're not the only club who think so.

I do think he should be under more pressure to deliver trophies too although it should be recognised that past managers were able to let league form slide in order to focus on the cups (in your beloved 92/93 we had a horrible league season, we even flirted with relegation!), that's not an option now. I do see the FA Cup as his last chance to deliver a trophy. If we cock this one up then I don't think we'll ever win anything else under him.

[LDG]

Do we take this with a pinch of salt, LDG?

To a degree, yes.

My previous post relates. He's deflecting critisism away from himself, and more importantly, the club.