Are the doubters wrong about Wenger?

[She Wore A Yellow Ribbon]

Yeah I love his enthusiasm, but when Michael J Fox in all likelihood can trap and control a ball better than you, you know you're on a hiding to nothing

Michael J Fox is overrated.

[Power n Glory]

Do they?....plus Ferguson's side used to try and rough us up a bit and that's fine but there is a difference between that and sticking 11 men behind the ball and then whinging when smaller sides come to you and do it. To be fair, I used to get annoyed with Wenger when we dropped points at home and bemoaned smaller sides playing for a draw. If in terms of resources you can't compete in terms of football, setting up for a clean sheet is understandable and acceptable. For a team like Chelsea, whilst I can understand them playing that way against Barcelona...a team like Atletico Madrid who have far less than them in terms of financial resources its pretty depressing.
Than again I think the 0-0 wasn't so much about a Mourinho masterclass, it was exposing the limitations of players like Diego Costa....I hope Chelsea do sign him because I think he's overrated....one season wonder like Diego Tristan at Deportivo.

Tristan

I'm not a fan of Diego Costa's either. When we were linked with him, I wasn't impressed and couldn't see how he'd solve our problems up front. I think we need something more. For some reason, I think he'd fit in at Chelsea. I complete shit of a player from what I heard with the wind ups and diving.

[Kano]

If money has nothing to do with it, then why is it always brought up on here when talking about Jose's achievements?

i've just spent the best part of 4/5 posts explaining why.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

The money Ferguson spent was generated by the teams performance and the teams he created were built in a piecemeal way.
Mourinho inherited a team with Oscar and Hazard in it, he's spent money on Matic, Willian, Salah etc and yet trots out excuses for why he and his side have under performed like somehow he's Barack Obama and he's inherited a car crash.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Michael J Fox is overrated.

As is your mother

[Power n Glory]

i've just spent the best part of 4/5 posts explaining why.

I'm totally convinced so I guess we'll move on. Attacking football and defensive football is down to a matter of preference. I wouldn't choose a defensive style because I like attacking football. But if you choose to build a solid defensive team to win titles with all the money the club gives you and it wins titles, that's the managers choice.

I hopped in on this debate when Herb mentioned the amount of money Jose has spent and the clubs he's been with and then mentioned Fergie as the better manager. As originally said, if we're going to make comparisons that way, then it's hard to ignore the resources Fergie has had access to.

[selassie]

The Times did a piece today, analysing how EPL teams have been affected by injury this season. It was entitled
Mourinho stays silent after Chelsea keep their casualties to a minimum

The article calculated how many player weeks each of the top teams have lost this season through injury. First, it looked at the loss of weeks from players likely to be first choice for a starting 11.

The data?



It went further, and looked at the loss of teams' likely first 15.



Of course, stats can be manipulated at will - but Arsenal's injury data is shocking - even if we are well used to key players being out.

My first reaction to our last few positive results has been that we have shown, recently, that we can perform against teams below the top 6, and that we know how to scrape top 4 - its doing better than that that is our problem.

But I freely admit that the above stats make me question whether my points of criticism of Wenger are accurate, and whether the question marks over him should be in relation to his fitness regime and his failure to back his first team up properly rather than his ability to read and understand the game.

Am I right to reconsider, or am I falling back into the Arsene 'brainwash' of always looking to explain our failure to win, rather than accepting that he is no longer a good enough football coach to win the league?

I personally feel that even with a fully fit squad all season we would have still fallen short this season. IMO Arsene has too many flaws in his management style to execute a title winning team at Arsenal given the make up of his squad. Injuries did and do play a part in titles but I am not so sure we would have made up the requisite number of points with a fully fit squad.

We went into the season clearly handicapped with an unbalanced squad and we suffered the consequences.

Our issues with building balanced squads is just as much as a problem as our injury issues, as it is our tactics. These 3 issues combined make it neigh on impossible for us to win the league every season.

[Power n Glory]

The money Ferguson spent was generated by the teams performance and the teams he created were built in a piecemeal way.
Mourinho inherited a team with Oscar and Hazard in it, he's spent money on Matic, Willian, Salah etc and yet trots out excuses for why he and his side have under performed like somehow he's Barack Obama and he's inherited a car crash.

How the money is generated shouldn’t really come into it. On the flip side, you’ve criticised Rogers even though he plays a more attractive brand of football.

Ahh whatever….we can all agree they’re better manager than David Moyes!

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I'm totally convinced so I guess we'll move on. Attacking football and defensive football is down to a matter of preference. I wouldn't choose a defensive style because I like attacking football. But if you choose to build a solid defensive team to win titles with all the money the club gives you and it wins titles, that's the managers choice.

I hopped in on this debate when Herb mentioned the amount of money Jose has spent and the clubs he's been with and then mentioned Fergie as the better manager. As originally said, if we're going to make comparisons that way, then it's hard to ignore the resources Fergie has had access to.

There is no comparison to a club like United spending money and a club like Chelsea with no constituency, no independent financing that would allow it to spend like United. Before Abramovich bought Chelsea it was well known that qualifying for the champions league in 2003 was not only a massive achieving it was financially essential as it was about to go down the plug hole. And if your asking me to respect a man for spending hundreds if millions at the whim of an oligarch and then win in the most turgid fashion, I cannot do that.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

How the money is generated shouldn’t really come into it. On the flip side, you’ve criticised Rogers even though he plays a more attractive brand of football.

Ahh whatever….we can all agree they’re better manager than David Moyes!

Well it is relevant because your living off the finances you've helped generate and whilst United have spend a fair amount I'm pretty sure they haven't spent the money Chelsea have in the last ten years. Ferguson may have bought the odd 30 million signing a season, or two or three 15-20 million signings but he wasn't signing six-ten players in that price bracket like Chelsea have done.