The next manager..

[Özim]

Have you been reading anything else around Arteta?

Not to shit on Henry, but he was captain of Arsenal too and he wasn't a good captain at all. He came across as someone that was overbearing and couldn’t get his ideas across to the team. He’s was never cut out to be captain.

Arteta was captain at Everton, all the reports say he’s got a great tactical mind and thinks like a manager. That’s during his playing days and before he retired. Henry has already expressed how difficult it is to transmit ideas to players as a manager and he’s easing himself into the role.

You have to do some of your own research on this one, Zim. Look up some of the stories about Arteta. Feel free to disagree after that but you can’t be silly enough to vouch for someone like Henry who we know a lot less about and isn’t as focused on becoming a manager as Arteta.

Arteta was captain too, probably one of the worst ones as well, whilst he was in charge we were really poor, with little fight and were bottlers on the pitch, never saw him make an ounce of difference, seemed to have no authority to me, which makes sense because Wenger openly admitted the captaincy is overrated and pretty meaningless.

The people vouching for Arteta seem to be his friends, why wouldn't they, I've alreayd said the value of numbers 2s is minimal, Guardiola was successful way before Arteta appeared, he doesn't need a number 2 to win that's clear, he wins as long as he has money or is at the most successful club.

Likewise Mclaren and Queiroz, Ferguson raved about them, when they got into management they flopped big time, words are cheap to be honest and Arteta has shown nothing to suggest he'd make a good manager to me, no authority when he was with us and no experience at management level, guys like him don't get jobs at top clubs as a 1st job, greats do, like Zidane etc, but that's because they have instant respect from their achievements in the game (tho at least he'd managed Barca B), Vieira has more experience at least as he's doing a very good job in the MLS so at least he has something on his CV.

My preference for Henry is the fact he was a great, Arteta and Henry have no experience, but one will at least be respected by the players who know how good he was, Arteta was nothing more than a journeyman who wasn't much good with us.

[Power n Glory]

I don't get it to be honest, if they are influential in the dressing room why wouldn't it translate to the pitch, surely that's the whole point or they have in reality no influence at all, unless they were referring to boot cleaning or something.

As for Mertesacker, yes I remember him saying something after we'd lost to Bayern 5-1 in the 1st leg in the CL, he rallied the troops, we then lost the 2nd leg 5-1 as well. Wasn't impressed. Personally don't really want anyone from the "losers" era at Arsenal, all these guys did is bottle it and lose time and time again without any real fight or stomach for the fight, none of them were really winners.

Would you like to do the same with Theirry Henry's time as captain? What influence did he have?

[Özim]

We're looking for a lot more in a manager than how he performed as a player for the club. We really don't know too much about how individuals were perceived behind the scenes and what input they had. Merts hasn't shown up for 2 seasons as a player, but apparently he was important off the pitch. Maybe that's true, maybe it's not. We don't know. Personalities are important too. I'm not so sure Henry would make a great manager on that basis. He's shown in the past he has very little patience when things aren't going right.

Does that matter? If their influence doesn't translate to the pitch, it's pretty pointless, you heard all these things at Arsenal, players speaking out, backing Wenger, telling us how they've got to prove themselves in the return leg, all that ever happened was another beating, all words with no substance, IMO that era of Arsenal is one to forget, there's nothing we should be taking from that and using, it's a time we just need to forget and move on from because it was a disaster on and off the pitch.

[Özim]

Would you like to do the same with Theirry Henry's time as captain? What influence did he have?

He made things happen on the pitch, maybe not a great captain but at least he was a winner, what was Arteta?

[Power n Glory]

He made things happen on the pitch, maybe not a great captain but at least he was a winner, what was Arteta?

As a player he was a winner. What was his influence as a captain. What did we win? Do a comparison.

[KSE Comedy Club]

My worry here, is that we seem to be thinking along the lines that getting Arteta in is an 'ok idea' or is somehow acceptable....???

We are supposed to be a top club, even Everton, West ham, etc, would be looking for an established manager of some sort. When the proper names were first being mentioned, Allegri, Jardim, Tuchel, Low, Enrique - I thought, ok, at least we are looking in the right areas and it is no less than we should expect to turn things around and take us back to the top.

But I just don't understand this train of thought that someone with no experience or ex players (Legends) is acceptable as an option to replace the manager

It's exactly akin to '4th place is like a trophy' or that train of thought.

Just not good enough for me

[Özim]

As a player he was a winner. What was his influence as a captain. What did we win? Do a comparison.

On the pitch he won a lot, he was part of our most succesful team under Wenger, personally don't think a striker should be captain as they are ahead of the play, but in terms of his performances he was a leader.

What influence did Arteta have as captain, all I saw is us losing every big game and never having any fight, this alleged off the field influence is all very good but where is the evidence, where is the proof they did, where are the reversal of results or half time talks prompting a comeback. This era of Arsenal was all mouth and no trousers, nothing ever backed up their words, words are cheap as they say.

I take what we hear about Arteta with a pinch of salt, most of it comes from people who openly acknowledge they are his friends, they aren't exactly going to discredit him.

[Özim]

My worry here, is that we seem to be thinking along the lines that getting Arteta in is an 'ok idea' or is somehow acceptable....???

We are supposed to be a top club, even Everton, West ham, etc, would be looking for an established manager of some sort. When the proper names were first being mentioned, Allegri, Jardim, Tuchel, Low, Enrique - I thought, ok, at least we are looking in the right areas and it is no less than we should expect to turn things around and take us back to the top.

But I just don't understand this train of thought that someone with no experience or ex players (Legends) is acceptable as an option to replace the manager

It's exactly akin to '4th place is like a trophy' or that train of thought.

Just not good enough for me

No I don't get it either, its the equivalent of Wenger trying to find the next gem, now we seem to be doing it with managers, what we need is a guy with a proven record who has the authority required to make the changes happen and who isn't scared to ruffle a few feathers and dismantle this awful squad and start again (other than in attack) and a guy not scared to sign up top players and handle them correctly.

[Mac76]

we seem to be thinking along the lines that getting Arteta in is an 'ok idea' or is somehow acceptable....???:

not me pal

[Power n Glory]

On the pitch he won a lot, he was part of our most succesful team under Wenger, personally don't think a striker should be captain as they are ahead of the play, but in terms of his performances he was a leader.

What influence did Arteta have as captain, all I saw is us losing every big game and never having any fight, this alleged off the field influence is all very good but where is the evidence, where is the proof they did, where are the reversal of results or half time talks prompting a comeback. This era of Arsenal was all mouth and no trousers, nothing ever backed up their words, words are cheap as they say.

I take what we hear about Arteta with a pinch of salt, most of it comes from people who openly acknowledge they are his friends, they aren't exactly going to discredit him.

You do know a great players doesn't always transition into a great manager?

I get the skepticism on Arteta but you lose the argument when you suggest Henry is a better candidate. He has less experience as a coach, he spends more time talking as pundit than actually coaching players. How is that sensible?