People's accents sometimes drift with time, I know that much. I haven't studied accent change on an individual level so I don't know the exact causes at play.Originally Posted by Letters
Neither does anybody here, though as you'll see above that doesn't stop anybody from making up explanations that suit their own worldview and assuming they're correct.
You used to be everything to me
Now you're tired of fighting
I did say I was oversimplifying
The process I described applies to the birth of MLE.
It's since spread to other social classes via a similar dynamic: middle class kids spend time with working class kids and so pick up aspects of their speech.
Honestly, making moralistic judgements about accent/language change is a bit like making judgements about particle physics or biological evolution. They're all natural phenomena that the individuals involved have essentially no control over. ESR speaks MLE for broadly the same reason he's 6 feet tall. We don't make moralistic judgements about people's height (well some people do, but they're generally regarded as morons), so why do it about their accents?
You used to be everything to me
Now you're tired of fighting
But this isn’t some generational change, this is like me picking up a Mancunian affectation because Oasis were big when I was a teenager our kidI did say I was oversimplifying
The process I described applies to the birth of MLE.
It's since spread to other social classes via a similar dynamic: middle class kids spend time with working class kids and so pick up aspects of their speech.
Honestly, making moralistic judgements about accent/language change is a bit like making judgements about particle physics or biological evolution. They're all natural phenomena that the individuals involved have essentially no control over. ESR speaks MLE for broadly the same reason he's 6 feet tall. We don't make moralistic judgements about people's height (well some people do, but they're generally regarded as morons), so why do it about their accents?
I don't think that's what ESR's doing, is it? I don't have any clips of him speaking at age 10 to hand, but I'd be surprised if he was full-on RP at that age.
People do speak differently in different situations, which is called code-switching. Again, I've not studied that very much so I don't know the ins and outs of it, but it's something we all do unconsciously from time to time. As far as I'm aware, a common place where code-switching is observed is in the classroom vs in the playground, i.e. when speaking to authority vs to peers.
What we switch between, and how much that happens, is again something that depends on the individual.
You used to be everything to me
Now you're tired of fighting
Doubt he was calling people Bruv or saying you get me? at ten
Perhaps not, but do you speak the same way you did when you were ten?
You used to be everything to me
Now you're tired of fighting
You understand that the way we speak is influenced by our peers and friends, right?
I say "Really?!" when I'm exasperated by something because of a colleague at work who used to. And now my son does.
I'm currently working with a lady who grew up in Australia, came over here at around 10 with an Aussie accent which she says was "bullied out of her". She now speaks quite posh, like.
What is your anyone's actual problem with any of this?
The Yute of today or the Mandem as the Yute like to call themselves all kind of speak this way, especially if raised in Urban London / Greater London / Any town near to London with a big ethnic minority.
When I was growing up as a kid in Brixton (I am black and from Caribbean parents), some of the white kids use to speak some of the yardie / patois slang that derived from Yard Jamaica but not all of them, you were either a urban kid or a cockney back then. These days it seems most kids adopt the street slang, patois mixed with even some Arab Muslim type words / sayings.
An increased vocabulary aside mainly yes
My flat dull Essex intonation is an irritation on the ears even to me
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