Should we be worried about our club's future?

[Özim]

You're the worst #WengerOut member ever!

Pretty much spot on, it's so bad it's hard to believe it's genuine.

There's a few on here who praise Wenger and the team and then randomly throw in that's it is time to go unconvincingly, it's almost as if they feel the tide has turned and they can't disagree even though inside they do.

If you don't think he should go, say so, yeah sure it will make you look like a bit of a loon but at least you'll be an honest loon and true to yourself.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

But what I love Zim is that you're totally blinkered by your hatred of Wenger

There is of course the element of players underperforming under him and that we haven't pushed on

But a new manager always brings in a new coaching set up with them, and some players will improve and many players will be gone (Arteta, Flamini, Rosicky, Mertesacker)

But actually you look at our squad, it's really stupid to talk of it like its one of those stray dogs you find malnourished and crawling with parasites that needs months of treatment and rehabilitation.

Cech, Koscielny, Bellerin, Cazorla, Coquelin, Sanchez, Ozil are all very good players

Monreal, Gabriel, Ramsey, Ox, Wellbeck, Giroud - despite indifferent form are all very able players

Elnenny and Campbell - I'd say the Juries out still

Wilshere probably needs to be sold because he's never going to be fit and Walcott just hasn't been able to do what we require of him. But no not a massive overhaul, we are in need of making additions to the team in key areas.

For me the main thing would be to bring in someone who is experienced as a winner but getting on in years to add some leadership to the team. As much as I hate his fucking guts, I think we'd do worse than going all out to bring in John Terry for a year, the guys an unbelievable cunt but he's a leader on the pitch....and what we have him do is mentor one of our other players to follow his footsteps (not fucking other people's wives and muttering racial epithets at people).

These players are no more mentally weak than any other player in the league, but they lack someone to shout at them and encourage them when the chips are down

Vieira tried to lead by example as he wasn't vocal himself, but he would get those around him to do it for him. Like he'd get Sol Campbell to bollock him if he sloppily lost posession.

Confidence and psychology are important things in sport and if you concede a goal it makes all the difference if there is someone wearing an armband who is saying "fuck it, this isn't over....give these cunts hell"

To talk about third as an achievement is course a celebration of failure, but what Letters is saying is that it's not a sign of something fundamentally wretched either.

[Power n Glory]

Good points re the Owner/board simply indulging Wenger - and I do agree that we are seeing an unholy alliance between a non-pragmatic and increasingly flawed managerial approach and an unambitious board that is happy to indulge him as long as finances are looking after themselves. The question is whether any replacement manager will, whatever his personal ambition, alter the board's approach. My concern is that the owner will remain content with the financial rewards of 4th place. Just as it can be unhealthy having too much board interference, so success is surely reliant on a board/owner having an ambition/appetite for the same? Kano is quite right - our owner is going nowhere - and we have seen from his US sports franchises that sporting success is simply not on his agenda.

The owner may be content with 4th but will the new manager? Again, I think it all boils down to the manager and his ambition. I just can't see the next manager taking on a position like this and not pushing us all the way. Even if Stan and co are content with 4th, whoever takes on this club must be able to see the potential and want more for us. More for himself in fact. Unlike Wenger, who now seems to take more pride in his years of service over actual trophies, the next manager has to.measure himself by the trophies won. There would be no pride in a 4th place finish each year.

[Özim]

But what I love Zim is that you're totally blinkered by your hatred of Wenger

There is of course the element of players underperforming under him and that we haven't pushed on

But a new manager always brings in a new coaching set up with them, and some players will improve and many players will be gone (Arteta, Flamini, Rosicky, Mertesacker)

But actually you look at our squad, it's really stupid to talk of it like its one of those stray dogs you find malnourished and crawling with parasites that needs months of treatment and rehabilitation.

Cech, Koscielny, Bellerin, Cazorla, Coquelin, Sanchez, Ozil are all very good players

Monreal, Gabriel, Ramsey, Ox, Wellbeck, Giroud - despite indifferent form are all very able players

Elnenny and Campbell - I'd say the Juries out still

Wilshere probably needs to be sold because he's never going to be fit and Walcott just hasn't been able to do what we require of him. But no not a massive overhaul, we are in need of making additions to the team in key areas.

For me the main thing would be to bring in someone who is experienced as a winner but getting on in years to add some leadership to the team. As much as I hate his fucking guts, I think we'd do worse than going all out to bring in John Terry for a year, the guys an unbelievable cunt but he's a leader on the pitch....and what we have him do is mentor one of our other players to follow his footsteps (not fucking other people's wives and muttering racial epithets at people).

These players are no more mentally weak than any other player in the league, but they lack someone to shout at them and encourage them when the chips are down

Vieira tried to lead by example as he wasn't vocal himself, but he would get those around him to do it for him. Like he'd get Sol Campbell to bollock him if he sloppily lost posession.

Confidence and psychology are important things in sport and if you concede a goal it makes all the difference if there is someone wearing an armband who is saying "fuck it, this isn't over....give these cunts hell"

To talk about third as an achievement is course a celebration of failure, but what Letters is saying is that it's not a sign of something fundamentally wretched either.

I'm not going lie, I can't stand the guy, he's patronising, irritating, boring, repetitive and dishonest IMO, I also don't like the way he pins everything on anyoen else and absolves himself of any responsbility.

Cech, Koscielny, Bellerin, Cazorla, Coquelin, Sanchez, Ozil are all very good players

I agree with this

Monreal, Gabriel, Ramsey, Ox, Wellbeck, Giroud - despite indifferent form are all very able players

This is debateable, Monreal I agree about, Gabriel is unproven and has been average so far, Ramsey has had one good season so he's not proven much so far, Ox has talent but just hasn't delivered thus far, but that could change, Wellbeck I just don't rate, IMO he won't have a future under a new manager, he's just not consistent enough and has never been and at his age I doubt he ever will be. Giroud is just a sub, he can't be relied on, he'll score a few and is a plan B but he's shown he goes on long barren run where he does next to nothing regularly

Elnenny and Campbell - I'd say the Juries out still

Campbell is a quality player IMO, jury isn't out on him, he's a very good winger.

A new manager will change things, though I think this will take time, but there's still a fair few personnel changes and that's a lot of work to replace those players and incorporate them.

A few of our mainstays are also getting older now and will need replacing in a few years which isn't going to help, I don't personally think our squad is in that great a shape.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

Compared to whose though?....you could make the argument you've made for us essentially about any side with the exception of Spurs who have a relatively very young team.

I believe the current squad is good enough to win the league but the manager hasn't got the best out of them, a few additions and a combination of better match preparation and a manager who is prepared to rotate and drop failing players more consistently rather than when his hand is forced....and we will be up there to challenge regardless of who city, United and Chelsea bring in.

Wenger is no different to any other manager in press conferences, what you find frustrating is the lack of success there has been for so long which is equally attributable to both financing the stadium move and a manager with clear flaws being given far too much responsibility.

I don't hate Wenger because the club I feel is in a position far better than it was when he became manager, but it's time to hand the baton onto others. Irrespective of what he wins (or probably doesn't) it seems unthinkable to me that he should sign a contract extension.
And without a league title this season or next I don't see an offer being forthcoming, whatever we say about the board being happy with 4th they know full well the indirect lucrative deals they can make with a club winning major silverware.
I think the chances of him going at the end of the season are slim to none

[fakeyank]

Yeah. Again. Last season. 3rd and the FA Cup.
LAST SEASON.

I hoped with the new money Wenger would push us on, the signings and Cup wins were rays of hope but this year it's clear he can't push us any further.
But we're not sliding anywhere. We're stagnating. We need to stop that but let's not overstate the problem.

Stagnating while others are stagnating is fine. Stagnating while others are gaining i.e. Spurs, Leicester, West Ham, to me seems like we are falling behind. Anyway, correct terminology aside, you get the gist of the message.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

No one has said it's acceptable, all that's being said is that a new manager coming in isn't inheriting a car crash

When Mourinho takes over United you will hear nothing from him other than bemoan the side he inherits even though the mouthy little prick will probably eclipse LVGs spending....the thing is though that United team is far less for a new guy to work with than what we have.

Plus we have an excellent training facility at London Colney, anyone who comes in to replace Wenger will be chomping at the bit to make their mark with us.

[IBK]

No one has said it's acceptable, all that's being said is that a new manager coming in isn't inheriting a car crash

When Mourinho takes over United you will hear nothing from him other than bemoan the side he inherits even though the mouthy little prick will probably eclipse LVGs spending....the thing is though that United team is far less for a new guy to work with than what we have.

Plus we have an excellent training facility at London Colney, anyone who comes in to replace Wenger will be chomping at the bit to make their mark with us.

That's a good point - despite our misgivings about the owner - we are an excellent prospect for an incoming manager. Stable; good bunch of players and a good set up - not to mention our reputation and CL pedigree. I can see a hungry young manager recognising where Arsene is getting it wrong, and believing that he can find the 'extra 2%' in a fairly straightforward way. But against this is the massive transition that will be required, and the culture of parsimony that is as much the hallmark of Arsenal now as anything else. The new manager will have to spend, as for all our misgivings about Wenger there is noone better at consistently attaining CL football without splashing big transfer cash, and we cannot expect a like for like replacement in this regard. Also in terms of transition, how will the players react to the potential end of the 'flat' pay structure that is Arsene's mantra. And will players be drawn to a Pochettino type manager as they were to Wenger who is still hugely respected in the game?

[Letters]

Last season we played Man U away, a team who were struggling for any kind of form, not hard draws in reality however you sugar coat them.

When we played them we were only 1 point ahead of them and they had only lost 2 at home all season.

[Letters]

You're the worst #WengerOut member ever!

I'm not in your #WengerOut group.

I'm perfectly capable of thinking Wenger should be sacked without thinking EVERYTHING he does or says is wrong.

See my post in the match reaction thread from last night