West Ham away (PL) Match Reaction Thread

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

I think his desire to see players develop overrides logic sometimes. After all these years going without a trophy, I'm surprised he's still so patient and hasn't just gone for the title. He's in his final years as well so it's even more surprising. We'll never know for sure but I think development and seeing progress trumps silverware. I don't know. I just figure he must have a different pecking order when it comes to achievements and gains more satisfaction from development over silverware.

But you even have to ask yourself how many players has he actually developed compared to what he used to?

[Power n Glory]

But you even have to ask yourself how many players has he actually developed compared to what he used to?

What players did he develop in the past that we can actually compare?

[Özim]

Yeah, again, whether he's bothered isn't in dispute. I've posted the proof, you continue to ignore it if you like.
Whether he's able to do anything about it is the key point.

And yes, he doesn't need to put us in financial peril now - that's why I'm judging him by different standards now to the ones when the stadium move required some belt tightening (again, the proof of that is in the Dein interview).

I'm not sure that's conclusive proof, I'm sure Dein doesn't go out for dinner with him after every match, it's most likely an off the cuff statement largely based on how things were when Dein was part of the club.

Dein was as good as thrown out of the club, I'm not sure Wenger would have been able to continue his relationship as normal after this happened bearing in mind who he was working for (people who couldn't stand Dein). Looking at the way he is now and how he reacts to losing without responding in any positive manner or showing any signs that he's willing to change things, says a lot more IMO....so does the way he defends 4th place and the way he praises his players regardless. Not the actions of someone who's angry and upset about losing to me.

As for the money, again there's no proof, there was something posted the other day about Dein saying Wenger had 30 million every season after the stadium move, don't think he used that if that was indeed the case, once again can't be proved either way.

let's not forget that before the stadium move we were told there would be money for a world class team.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

In fairness I think he has changed his approach to games, but it's taken him so long and it's been such a slow process it generally means no overall progress is made.

For instance we do take a different approach to playing some of the bigger sides, and the results have been mixed but it is an improvement upon total capitulation every time we play a big side.

[Power n Glory]

If Dein and Wenger are still close, I don't get why Dein hasn't set him straight about needing new signings. It's odd.

[Özim]

The problem is these guys are friends with Wenger so they won't say a bad word about him, what they actually think might be different. I'd be amazed if Dein actually thinks Wenger is doing a good job, he was a man who wanted to see Arsenal at the top of the game and yet he we are 3rd/4th every season, getting nowhere in the CL, not a great achievement for a club the size of Arsenal.

I'd suggest that if Dein were there Wenger would probably feel more pressure to sign players that he does now and we'd probably have a better chance of moving forward on the pitch.

The guys who aren't friends with Wenger as such, the former players come out and say it how it is TBH, so many of them have now they can't be all wrong.

[Özim]

In fairness I think he has changed his approach to games, but it's taken him so long and it's been such a slow process it generally means no overall progress is made.

For instance we do take a different approach to playing some of the bigger sides, and the results have been mixed but it is an improvement upon total capitulation every time we play a big side.

If he has made changes they're very subtle because despite the odd decent result against a top team (albeit most of the time in a period when they aren't performing well) the collapses still take place and we don't progress in terms of points.

I just don't think enough has changed, both in terms of personnel and style of play, there's some obvious things Wenger could try, if he showed some inclination to try something different he might get an easier time, in the last 10 years though, we've largely stuck to the tried and tested formula that fails to achieve success every season.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

If Dein and Wenger are still close, I don't get why Dein hasn't set him straight about needing new signings. It's odd.

Hmmm to be fair, Dein did say that he'd often try to reassure Wenger when he worked with him that if he wanted to sign a player that he'd do it for him, but Wenger would prevaricate.

[Herbert_Chapman's_Zombie]

If he has made changes they're very subtle because despite the odd decent result against a top team (albeit most of the time in a period when they aren't performing well) the collapses still take place and we don't progress in terms of points.

I just don't think enough has changed, both in terms of personnel and style of play, there's some obvious things Wenger could try, if he showed some inclination to try something different he might get an easier time, in the last 10 years though, we've largely stuck to the tried and tested formula that fails to achieve success every season.

Well no there isn't a progress in terms of points, all i pointed to was that there is a clear difference in the way we approach big games. The Man City away game last season, Bayern Munich this season etc.

Usually we tend to then drop silly points against nothing sides if we improve against bigger sides.

[Letters]

You also have to ask yourself what's logically the more likely?

And ask yourself, 8million a year contract, a board that is unfailingly supportive, not getting any younger and probably know you are a step behind the innovation of many much younger than you.....are you really going to be as driven as you were earlier on in your career?.

Especially when whatever else happens you can say you laid the groundwork and made it possible for any man that follows you to succeed?.

I think there's something in that, but Dein's comments show he does still care deeply.
I agree with PnG too, sometimes Wenger's idealism get in the way - he seems unwaveringly loyal to his players and in this day and age it's not reciprocated, we could do with him being more ruthless at times rather than persisting with people like Diaby.