Are the glory days over for good?

[Olivier's xmas twist]

Going in for Mata would have shown that we are still a big club that expects to win things - to counteract the Cesc and Nasri effect. The fact that we were pussies,
and then caught with our pants down so late in the Summer is the main reason we are so bereft of confidence now.
Second, the reason I agree with Letters that the manager has lost the players is that this Summer saw him fail, almost embarrasingly, at what he is famous for being best at. I think they no longer trust him to win anything. A Mata type signing would have helped here.

We were in for him if reports were to be believed, have to agree with Flavs don't think getting hin on his own would have made any diffrence tbh, its the sqaud mentality that needs addrresing, if he is not mentally strong then he makes no diffrence.

The only reason Gev looks poor is because plain and simple he is not sure he wants to be here its plain to see. even at Lille he had class around him and came here to find this shite id be pissed too if i was him. Must feel duped and humilated.

i agree on AW loosing the players, where as we all once thought if Aw left the players would but now its clealy not the case. The jan Window will be a big one for this club and no one can have excues this time.

[Niall_Quinn]

We have fallen so hard and so quickly that many on here seem to think that a change of manager is the only option.

But we do need to remember that for all his faults, Wenger punched above his weight continually in keeping us in the CL places for the past 6 years - and we have a majority shareholder who will not bank roll anyone else.

We are not a great proposition as a club any more. No silverware for years; best players wanting out; a running joke defensively; an inherent lack of leadership on the pitch; a reputation for penny pinching in the transfer/contract market - to an incoming player we must look the epitome of lack of ambition. Jesus, even as fans we are learning to live with failure after failure (every Gooner I know tends just to shrug and smile apoligetically when asked about the latest dropped points).

Wenger talks about a cycle restarting http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-arc...d-again-for-us. I believe that with more judicious use of the Fabregas/Nasri money, and proper planning he could have prevented the last one collapsing, but its easier to imagine ATM that what's starting is the proper spiral downwards for our club.

Is this it? Are we the Ajax of English football - a selling club that once played the best football in Europe but one destined from now on to live on fading memories?

- Well, are we?

If we change the board, change the manager, get rid of 75% of the players and spend around £150mill in the transfer market then we might be competitive again. I say "might" because the end result of such a major overhaul would be unpredictable.

If we carry on as we are then it is downhill all the way. Kroenke has very much indicated he has no ambition for the club on the pitch. I assume he's looking to make his money by selling off our talent, paying up as much debt as he can and the flogging the club on the strength of its non-playing assets. Whether he can get back more than he's had to shell out buying the shares (unless he has a surprise waiting for us and will throw the club into a debt pit to save himself the outlay) I wouldn't be able to say. But a major stadium and facilities in London plus whatever other property deals they have going on, coupled with a large fan base and probably a swathe of rejuvenated sponsorship deals might see him clear a good enough profit. The it will all be down to who he sells to.

Whatever the outcome, for as long as we continue to be a vehicle for a very small number of businessmen to enrich themselves we'll never be able to do anything on the pitch. I think Kroenke will need to make at least enough investment to stave off relegation though, as that would surely destroy a lot of the value he's trying to build on the business side. I have no doubt if he could get away with stripping the club without having to worry about staying up he wouldn't bat an eyelid if we tumbled out of the top flight.

The board will have a hard time getting a replacement for Wenger, and even he's struggling now to build anything out of such a depleted squad. Who else could do a better job (considering any superhuman success squeezed out on the pitch against the odds is sold at the earliest opportunity)? Even so, in order to save there own hides and keep the spotlight off their rock, I'm sure they'll throw Wenger to the media if it buys them time to drain a bit more for the club.

[Power n Glory]

We were in for him if reports were to be believed, have to agree with Flavs don't think getting hin on his own would have made any diffrence tbh, its the sqaud mentality that needs addrresing, if he is not mentally strong then he makes no diffrence.

The only reason Gev looks poor is because plain and simple he is not sure he wants to be here its plain to see. even at Lille he had class around him and came here to find this shite id be pissed too if i was him. Must feel duped and humilated.

i agree on AW loosing the players, where as we all once thought if Aw left the players would but now its clealy not the case. The jan Window will be a big one for this club and no one can have excues this time.

I think if we'd have shown some backbone in the transfer window and signed players like Mata and Cahill early, it would have shown the players some intent at least. But we left it late and the damage was done from the Man U game.

As for Gervinho, he's always been a hit and miss player from what I read about him before we signed him. I don't think it has anything to do with our current state. He's just a sloppy player. Reminds me of Gyan in his approach. He has this uncouthness in his style. It's not like Ade, he reminds me more of Gyan for some reason. There is a sloppiness to his final ball and decision making.

[BOBN]

will take the media a while to catch on but mata is pretty much a spanish stewart downing. not particularly talented and benefited hugely from the spanish being the flavour of the month. sid lowe even admitted at the time he looked nailed on to arsenal that although he will settle better, he wasnt as talented as jose reyes, who was/is no genius himself if we're honest.

glad we didnt get him for that kind of money. a gotze/eriksen would have a bigger impact here.

[Grebbo]

Glory days are of course long gone.

We're trying to race a Fiat against Ferrari's.

Our Fiat is also being driven by Victor Meldrew which doesn't help.

[fakeyank]

glad we didnt get him for that kind of money. a gotze/eriksen would have a bigger impact here.

At our current rate, it'll be a miracle if we can attract the likes of Denilson and Diaby.. Gotze and Eriksen are light years ahead for a club like us

[Xhaka Can’t]

It is the unrelenting misery and wallowing in self pity of the likes of the post above that have turned this forum to shit.

90% of what is posted now is just mellowdramatic drivel.

[Flavs]

But he has no end product and makes the wrong decisions. The type an experienced winger shouldn't be making at this level. We get on Theo's case about such things and Gervinho shouldn't be given a free ride.

Difference being sweetheart that Gervinho has played like 5 games for the club and Theo has been here for what 5 year now and is no better than when he got here.

Can you imagine if we played with these 2 up top? Ball would be in the crowd most of the game

[Flavs]

Mate - you perhaps misunderstand my point. I think that we have had, and still have a good group of players. But nothing has ignited the blue touch paper and really got them believing in themselves, believing in the club. There is a general negativity around the place that is visibly affecting our players. The main reason, IMO? its that nothing really exciting has happened for so long. A stadium project is exciting momentarily, but what football fans and players need a vibe to generate a sense of progress.

For years now, every time a Wenger project player has come through, he has left shortly afterwards. There has been a constant drain, that this Summer became too much to contend with.

Going in for Mata would have shown that we are still a big club that expects to win things - to counteract the Cesc and Nasri effect. The fact that we were pussies, and then caught with our pants down so late in the Summer is the main reason we are so bereft of confidence now.

Second, the reason I agree with Letters that the manager has lost the players is that this Summer saw him fail, almost embarrasingly, at what he is famous for being best at. I think they no longer trust him to win anything. A Mata type signing would have helped here.

I see, surely the fact we did go for Mata and the greedy little bastard chose Chelsea instead sums modern footie up really. The problem we now have with buying players is that the second we show an interest in anyone the big money clubs come in and take over, Jones, Smalling, Mata all show that. Add into that Citeh waving the Benjamin's in the faces of players at other teams, heads get turned.

The other problem of course is the agents. We have an offer agreed for Mata and the first thing his agent does is ring the big money clubs and tell them so they can counter offer. Its a nightmare.

Bout 5 years ago the real Madrid president said that their scouting policy was to find out who Arsenal were after and get them first, I think Citeh, Chelsea and Manyoo all do that nowadays so its get harder and in turn we have to buy players that are of a lower level or even younger and less developed because we have no choice. Imagine how hard it mus be for teams like Wigan to get players in??

But anyway none of that is relevant to making the best of what we have, which Wenger doesn't do and that's why i want him out, i agree to a point he has lost the players. I don't think in a mutiny type way but i think they have lost belief in his ability the same way the fans have.

Time to go and get the Moyes in for me.

[Özim]

I see, surely the fact we did go for Mata and the greedy little bastard chose Chelsea instead sums modern footie up really.

So he's greedy because he chose a club who want to win things and have in the last 6 years over a club that has failed to win a thing, collapses every season and sells it's best players.

On a purely football level, Chelsea is a better choice for a player who wants to win trophies at this point in time, no question about it.