is there a scenario for wenger to stay?

[Niall_Quinn]

The RvC sale. Final straw. Everyone out!

[Power n Glory]

Dpenends if you think Trophies are the be all and end all.

As pointed out, he hasn't won anything in 7 years yet it is dumb for people to question whether or not he's still up to scratch? Really?

[IBK]

As pointed out, he hasn't won anything in 7 years yet it is dumb for people to question whether or not he's still up to scratch? Really?

In itself - probably. CL football throughout is IMO and those of others at least equivalent to a CC or FA Cup. Not in terms of that glowing feeling, but in terms of footballing achievement. It is harder to finish top 4 year in year out than it is to win the odd cup competition.

So yes - I'd say that in our circumstances basing the question solely on silverware - particularly when we have had 3 very near misses in the period - is wide of the mark. There's a lot more than mere lack of silverware to base the question on now, though!

[LDG]

@ the OP. I'm afraid not.

Some thoughts...I feel strongly that the difference between formerly AKB Gooners and those who have been calling for Wenger's head for some time does not represent any blindness or difference in insight between the 2. Generally speaking, up until relatively recently it has been a debate between those who feel that we should have won silverware/shown more ambition as a club and those who have been more prepared to take into account the disparity in spending power between us an the new rich clubs and the stadium project/rebuilding/development that the club was going through.

Both views were equally justifiable - and it is no surprise that many fans felt that Wenger had earnt the right to be given time, not just because of what he has given the club in terms of the success years and the stadium - but because he had consistently delivered CL football in some sense against the odds. This is not a 'trophy' in itself - but is certainly a reason to stand by a manager.

But it now feels as though something fundamental has changed. What we are seeing now does not feel like a loss of form, a slump like we have seen so many times over the years. It feels as though something rotten in Wenger's methods and approach to the game is being exposed. Its not a question of silverware. Its a question of seeing your team with a purpose; of seeing the basics of character and application. We are not seeing this - and fans are rightly questioning whether a team so lacking in these basic attributes can ever be successful.

Wenger's training methods; his misguided obsession with wage parity; his lax attitude towards discipline on the pitch (presumably at the training ground); his tactical blind spots and his refusal to set his teams up to play the opposition appear to have resulted now in a team pretty much in freefall (an exaggeration perhaps - but not interms of our relationship with the top 3 teams in the league). With the stellar talent now sold off, there is little to paper over the cracks - yet the talent we still have is woefully underperforming. This is down to the manager. Not the board. Not the opposition. And it is naive to think that a proud and stubborn man who has done it his way for 17 years will change. He won't. All leaders have their time, and Wenger's is clearly up.

But - and here's the frightening thing. The club structure that he has been so loyal in defending is a shambles. An American majority shareholder in open dispute with an Uzbek billionaire. A chief executive who appears unfit for purpose. Noone seemingly able to challenge or influence the manager. Do we really think that this is an organisation able to demonstrate the clarity of purpose and good judgment to appoint a more illustrious successor to Wenger? I am very afraid of what is going to happen in the power vaccuum of Wenger leaving. I can see us being a Liverpool or an Aston Villa. I'm afraid that the bad times may only just be beginning.

Spot on mate.

End of debate really.

[LDG]

In itself - probably. CL football throughout is IMO and those of others at least equivalent to a CC or FA Cup. Not in terms of that glowing feeling, but in terms of footballing achievement. It is harder to finish top 4 year in year out than it is to win the odd cup competition.

So yes - I'd say that in our circumstances basing the question solely on silverware - particularly when we have had 3 very near misses in the period - is wide of the mark. There's a lot more than mere lack of silverware to base the question on now, though!

Quite.

Didn't Pompey win a trophy not too long ago?? Were they better than us?

[Kano]

Quite.

Didn't Pompey win a trophy not too long ago?? Were they better than us?

harry redknapp is.

[LDG]

harry redknapp is.

[Power n Glory]

In itself - probably. CL football throughout is IMO and those of others at least equivalent to a CC or FA Cup. Not in terms of that glowing feeling, but in terms of footballing achievement. It is harder to finish top 4 year in year out than it is to win the odd cup competition.

So yes - I'd say that in our circumstances basing the question solely on silverware - particularly when we have had 3 very near misses in the period - is wide of the mark. There's a lot more than mere lack of silverware to base the question on now, though!

You're actively questioning Wenger's managerial skills now! You have also posed the question of whether or not Wenger has gone stale. Are you dumb for questioning Wenger?

[Kano]

i think you need a break. this all seems to be getting to you.

[Power n Glory]

i think you need a break. this all seems to be getting to you.

Don't start wumming if you have nothing to add.