Summer Transfers 2025 Missed Opportunities and Regrets

[Niall_Quinn]

:tumbleweed:

[HCZ_Reborn]

So Sky suggesting we are looking at signing Kimmich on a free transfer in the summer. I don’t know what I think about this, although it would suggest to me that the departure of Jorginho and Partey means replacing them with two midfielders than just the one. And Kimmich is reasonably strong and technical

As long as his wages don’t mean we are not strengthening up front, I’m open to this I guess

[Niall_Quinn]

So Sky suggesting we are looking at signing Kimmich on a free transfer in the summer. I don’t know what I think about this, although it would suggest to me that the departure of Jorginho and Partey means replacing them with two midfielders than just the one. And Kimmich is reasonably strong and technical

As long as his wages don’t mean we are not strengthening up front, I’m open to this I guess

Don't know who Kimmich is. So looked him up.

:tumbleweed:

[Marc Overmars]

Seems like a logical move and he is a very good player tbf.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Don't know who Kimmich is. So looked him up.

:tumbleweed:

Yes…under the circumstances that was the reasonable move

[Niall_Quinn]

Yes…under the circumstances that was the reasonable move

A last big pay day for him? That's my only concern, or interest.

Then again, maybe he's Merino's replacement up front? Our new striker?

[HCZ_Reborn]

I worry about a players legs when they become 30, it’s why I’m generally not in favour of signing anyone over the age of 25 let alone older.

But he’s technically quite good (although I can imagine he would have lost those acceleration bursts he was once good at) and on a free transfer and as you say if his wages aren’t extortionate. I’m ok with it

[Niall_Quinn]

Sell to buy is now the trend floating around the net. Opinions, opinions, different than facts. But sometimes opinions tally with the historical record.

Who do we have to sell that will raise the 200-300 million required to turn us into a club that can genuinely challenge?

Tierney - we should be keeping him anyway because he's our most effective full back - 20 mill?
Partey - btw, why are we actually selling him? Isn't he a decent enough squad player? Is it because he wants to go? - 20 mill? 30mill if some mug gets collared?
Jorginho - does he have a sell-on value? Can't see it, but 10 mill if we are optimistic?
Zinchenko - 15mill, 20mill? Delusional?

Best case, 80 mill?

It's Saliba, isn't it?

[Niall_Quinn]

Trossard - 10 mill? Or Saudi for 2.5 trillion?
Martinelli - Saudi? 50 mill? 60mill?

[HCZ_Reborn]

Trossard - 10 mill? Or Saudi for 2.5 trillion?
Martinelli - Saudi? 50 mill? 60mill?

I think Trossard is going anyway (he has twice refused to sign a new contract) I mean fair enough really, he doesn’t owe us anything…in this day and age especially he’s done ok for the money we signed him for so if he wants to leave and the Saudis want to take him off our hands….fare thee well.

[Niall_Quinn]

I think Trossard is going anyway (he has twice refused to sign a new contract) I mean fair enough really, he doesn’t owe us anything…in this day and age especially he’s done ok for the money we signed him for so if he wants to leave and the Saudis want to take him off our hands….fare thee well.

Won't fund the window though, will it?

And the stupidity that is inherent in this so-called sport (in reality cash cow) means we'll need to spend 50, 60, 70 to replace him with anything half decent.

It's Hleb again, isn't it? Decent but ultimately part of the latest failed project.

[Niall_Quinn]

Here's a simple route to guaranteeing the title next season.

Sell those who are surplus. Merino. Trossard if he wants to go (hopefully he'll stay). Jorginho if he want to go. Send Sterling back, obviously. I mean seriously - WE ARE SENDING STERLING BACK, RIGHT? Zin - don't need him. I guess hang on to Calafiore as cover.

Now hire the Sporting director and bring in Gyokeres. Pay whatever is required and outbid all other rivals.

Title guaranteed because there's nobody else in this league who are much of a challenge if we can sort out that striker role. Maybe Liverpool, but their luck can't hold forever, they'll have a dip too.

I bet if they hired me and we did this we'd win the title.

Instead, somebody else will sign Gyokeres and they will win the title. Come back here and prove me wrong in a year's time.

I don't think we actually need anything else, provided Odegard gets his shit together. Then again, Odegard and Gyokeres - match made in heaven.

Means holding on to Saliba, come what may. So my 200 mill would be spent getting Gyokeres, keeping Saliba and hiring the Sporting director.

If we want to win a title.

Otherwise sell everyone and bring in players that can keep us up there, challenging but never winning. This is the sensible option if we want to enrich the Kroenkes.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Won't fund the window though, will it?

And the stupidity that is inherent in this so-called sport (in reality cash cow) means we'll need to spend 50, 60, 70 to replace him with anything half decent.

It's Hleb again, isn't it? Decent but ultimately part of the latest failed project.

According to John Cross we need to sell him to fund the Window….John Cross with the greatest of respect to him is a twat

I think again it comes down more to the wage bill than the cost of transfers.

[Niall_Quinn]

According to John Cross we need to sell him to fund the Window….John Cross with the greatest of respect to him is a twat

I think again it comes down more to the wage bill than the cost of transfers.

Wage bill spiked over the last couple of seasons. But so did revenues. A poor excuse if the football rapists that own us try it on.

I can confirm, Cross is a twat. Is he still going? Wow, shitty job for life.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Also reports saying that we want to give Partey a one year extension

I’ll be honest if we are bringing in Zubimendi, I can’t really see the point

[Marc Overmars]

The ironic thing is that Partey has remained fit all season and has actually been one of our better players. Maybe he’s playing for that contract?

[IBK]

Also reports saying that we want to give Partey a one year extension

I’ll be honest if we are bringing in Zubimendi, I can’t really see the point

We want him to agree a wage reduction to stay, and I doubt he will do so.

[dazthegooner]

Depends really on what other teams can offer we probably pay more in general than most European teams (unless he goes to the Saudi pro league then the sky's the limiit)

[HCZ_Reborn]

Andrea Bertoni targeting Lautaro Martinez apparently

Not keen for three reasons. At 28 (27 but will be 28 by time he joins) too old (in my view), I don’t think scoring in Serie A necessarily translates to being able to score in the premier league. Also at 5ft 9 too short

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6174662/2025/03/07/mika-biereth-arsenal-monaco/?redirected=1

Great article on Bierth, who scored again this weekend. Love the quote on how he deals with missing chances.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I recall similar articles about Folarin Balogun two seasons ago

He will have to have more than what he’s doing now, for me to put him on the level of Serge Gnabry in terms of players I regret us selling.

[dazthegooner]

https://www.arsenalstation.com/2025/03/24/arsenal-target-sporting-cp-striker-viktor-gyokeres/ I hope this is just a rumor he's what 26-7 his previous club was Coventry City and he wasn't tearing up the league (championship I believe) £63m would be a complete waste of money.

[KSE Comedy Club]

https://www.arsenalstation.com/2025/03/24/arsenal-target-sporting-cp-striker-viktor-gyokeres/ I hope this is just a rumor he's what 26-7 his previous club was Coventry City and he wasn't tearing up the league (championship I believe) £63m would be a complete waste of money.

You have to be joking, right?

[dazthegooner]

Well here's hoping it's just his agent trying to get him a move to Manure for more commission.

[Mac76]

You have to be joking, right?

Yeah quite, he's supposed to be good and as Isak will be silly money and Sesko's apparently not an out-and-out forward, maybe it makes sense

[KSE Comedy Club]

Yeah quite, he's supposed to be good and as Isak will be silly money and Sesko's apparently not an out-and-out forward, maybe it makes sense

I would take Gyokores over Sesko and Isak in a heartbeat.

He is a proper no. 9

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I recall similar articles about Folarin Balogun two seasons ago

He will have to have more than what he’s doing now, for me to put him on the level of Serge Gnabry in terms of players I regret us selling.

Despite the fact that Gnarby has made a great career for himself and probably tops the list of young players we let go prematurely, I've actually never really been bowled away by his performances... don't get me wrong he is quality, but losing him or playing against him hasn't really given me sleepless nights like an Anelka..... probably more miffed about us losing him for peanuts.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

BTW surprised no one has brought up us being linked with Frankfurt's Hugo Ekitike.

I've seen a few glimpses of the kid and for now he looks like something that could be really really special.

He's tall, pretty decent dribbler, has a crazy way he accelerates with the ball (not Martinelli aimless running) and seems to have that positive unpredictability that could really be a difference.

Love the glimpses of the kid I've seen so far, and though he's far from the finished article, if I had to compare him with anyone it would be Isak, and TBH the few glimpses of the kid I've seen is making me want him more than an unattainable Isak.

Right now he tops my list of strikers purely based on his potential (which is me doing a drastic uturn)...but I'd definitely take him over Sesko, all the attainable guys in the EPL , just a bit over Osimhen, and now its a straight duel between him and Gyokeres (head says a dependable Gyokeres but my heart says this kid is going to be crazy at a top club that counter attacks swiftly, really crazy). Probably fits Liverpool more than us but I sincerely hope that never happens.

[Mac76]

I was going to say, we unfortunately don't counterattack quickly, if we did Pepe might actually have been a good player for us

We'd have to move Arteta on to get the best out of him - I'll leave it there

[dazthegooner]

Possibly and looking at his goals per game ratio they weren't that bad I just can't help feeling if he tried hard enough under Arteta he might have nailed the inverted left back position ;)

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I was going to say, we unfortunately don't counterattack quickly, if we did Pepe might actually have been a good player for us

We'd have to move Arteta on to get the best out of him - I'll leave it there

Hopefully that day comes soon, not interested in any manager doing 10 years here no matter how brilliant (or not) they are.

Football is constantly evolving faster these days. Sticking with the same ideas is not only boring but also sets yourself up for failure, my opinion.

[Mac76]

Hopefully that day comes soon, not interested in any manager doing 10 years here no matter how brilliant (or not) they are.

Football is constantly evolving faster these days. Sticking with the same ideas is not only boring but also sets yourself up for failure, my opinion.

Agree, and even Arteta himself is somewhat adhering to old ideas, i.e. the way Man City used to play - if he can't move on from that there's no future for him here

If we spend big in the summer the Kroenkes will surely expect an ROI of substance, not just finishing second and playing in the CL

On paper we should be favourites next year, with possibly all of TAA, Salah and VVD leaving Liverpool, plus Citeh also rebuilding - which means Forest PL win incoming :lol:

[Marc Overmars]

Seems like Trent is itching for the Madrid move now.

Interesting to see how Liverpool adapt without him next year because his passing is such a key part of how they’ve played for years.

[IBK]

Now that this season's disappointment is not so recent, I am beginning to come to the view that it's not so much that Arteta is wedded to the same ideas and incapable of evolving, but that we will never be a team under him that favours individuality over system based football.

And I'm not so sure that this is a bad thing. Systemic football is the reality these days, and a combination of the best players and the best system is bound to prevail. Gone I think are the days when teams were built around a single mercurial talent - you only need to see Portugal with Ronaldo, or the fact that Norway strangely seem to be less effective than might be thought with Erling Haaland and Martin Ødegaard in it to see evidence of this.

I am coming to the conclusion that our travails this season have been not so much our failure to counter attack and manage transitions well (my previous view), but because Arteta's system is so finely honed that taking out Odegard (missing or out of form for most of the season); Saka and Havertz will make it look ineffective. We showed that we could survive one of our key players being absent - but not three - which I suppose is not so surprising.

I think that Arteta has a great deal of tactical acumen and the ability to evolve. Let's see whether I am right when we invest, and have a fuller complement of forwards after the Summer.

[Mac76]

Now that this season's disappointment is not so recent, I am beginning to come to the view that it's not so much that Arteta is wedded to the same ideas and incapable of evolving, but that we will never be a team under him that favours individuality over system based football.

And I'm not so sure that this is a bad thing. Systemic football is the reality these days, and a combination of the best players and the best system is bound to prevail. Gone I think are the days when teams were built around a single mercurial talent - you only need to see Portugal with Ronaldo, or the fact that Norway strangely seem to be less effective than might be thought with Erling Haaland and Martin Ødegaard in it to see evidence of this.

I am coming to the conclusion that our travails this season have been not so much our failure to counter attack and manage transitions well (my previous view), but because Arteta's system is so finely honed that taking out Odegard (missing or out of form for most of the season); Saka and Havertz will make it look ineffective. We showed that we could survive one of our key players being absent - but not three - which I suppose is not so surprising.

I think that Arteta has a great deal of tactical acumen and the ability to evolve. Let's see whether I am right when we invest, and have a fuller complement of forwards after the Summer.

I do think it's a bad thing, the best managers are able to combine a good system which inherently allows more freedom for players to exercise their strengths, I feel Arteta part-strangles some talents with the way he over manages

The inability to counter-attack you mention lies firmly at Arteta's feet, not the players IMO, there are players there who could do it a lot more under the right system

I haven't watched Norway much at all but Odegaard and Haaland by themselves can't lift a team if the other players are significantly inferior (which isn't also to say it's possible the system isn't right either)

I can only point again to Everton to show how a manager can improve a team infinitely by playing a freer style and encouraging players to be more positive, which is without doubt what Moyes has done

So the answer is to bring in Moyes obvs :haha:

[IBK]

I take your point but I wasn't saying that Arteta won't give his players freedom to exercise ther strengths. When you look at Saka, Havertz; Odegard; Nwaneri; Rice; Ben White and pretty much all our left backs - all of these players have licence to roam, and within our system I'd say that they play to their strengths - and even that the system is geared to this. Even in defence - particularly Saliba and Raya are hardly wedded to a traditional pitch position.

What I was saying is that Arteta's teams are not based around individual 'maverics' - and I can see the merits in working with a system intended to maximise potential as a team rather than relying principally on moments from individuals. I maintain that football generally is evolving in this way, and my view is that the best system rather than having mercurial individuals is likely to bring the greatest benefits.

Regarding your comments about Norway, the argument can go the other way also. Greece; Denmark won the Euros with very ordinary players. Iceland similarly humbled England and reached the Quarters in 2016. This season, Forest; Brighton; Fulham are all flying high with teams of players who pound for pound are inferior to those of the traditional top 5 or 6 in the league. Liverpool are the exception really - given their reliance on Salah and the jury is out on how they will fare without his extraordinary returns. Focussing on individuals rather than forging a team system is in my view an obviously flawed approach.

This is not to say that harnessing player strengths is not vital. It is. And we all have our views on how certain of our players could be used differently. But I don't think Arteta can be accused fairly of not playing to his players' strengths.

Whether his system is too inflexible is really another question. I think that at times it has been - not just this season, but in past ones. But as I have said, I've come to the view that this deficiency this season has been driven first and foremost by missing players rather than a manager who simply cannot see that we have lacked menace at times. This is why I am prepared to reserve judgment until we have players back, refreshed our personnel and got in a decent pre-seacon in the Summer.

I recall distinctly complaining on here in 2021/2 and 2022/3 that we looked too robotic a lot of the time and lacked movement and penetration - but this was hardly the case in the second half of last season was it? The system clicked then and we were not lamenting strangling of talent. Arteta has changed during his tenure and I am hoping that he can again.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Despite the fact that Gnarby has made a great career for himself and probably tops the list of young players we let go prematurely, I've actually never really been bowled away by his performances... don't get me wrong he is quality, but losing him or playing against him hasn't really given me sleepless nights like an Anelka..... probably more miffed about us losing him for peanuts.

Fair enough

[KSE Comedy Club]

Seems like Trent is itching for the Madrid move now.

Interesting to see how Liverpool adapt without him next year because his passing is such a key part of how they’ve played for years.

It could also derail the end of their season, the fans have already said they want to shout abuse at him every game til he leaves now, what with him being a dirty rat and a traitor, etc, etc.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

It could also derail the end of their season, the fans have already said they want to shout abuse at him every game til he leaves now, what with him being a dirty rat and a traitor, etc, etc.

Even if this happened and Liverpool tried to do a Newcastle by losing 5 of the 9 games they have left, we'd still be unable to take advantage as we aren't able to score goals consistently thanks to not having something as basic as a striker, largely due to Mr Smarty Pants.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Even if this happened and Liverpool tried to do a Newcastle by losing 5 of the 9 games they have left, we'd still be unable to take advantage as we aren't able to score goals consistently thanks to not having something as basic as a striker, largely due to Mr Smarty Pants.

Oh I agree - but there is a possibility that could all change now that Saka is due back soon.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Seems like Trent is itching for the Madrid move now.

Interesting to see how Liverpool adapt without him next year because his passing is such a key part of how they’ve played for years.

It'll be massive in terms of the way we play, because so much of what we do goes down our right to naturally exploit his passing range and ultimately getting the ball to Salah. But it may be a good think to spread our attack around. We've lost bigger and better players than Alexander-Arnold, as has everyone else (I remember being convinced you were buggered when Henry left; you weren't) so we will ultimately get over it. Bradley is a phenomenal talent, but a different player. It may not be awful if we played in a more balanced way (he gets into the box more and will get up and down the touch much more whereas TAA naturally pings balls, often wastefully, but when it does come off it's extraordinary)

The local "knowledge" has always been that TAA would go, and that Van Dijk and Salah would stay, this is at the start of the season. Even that has slipped recently, no one is sure anymore. That's then not then one hole to fill, it's 3 huge ones
And naturally gaps I can't see how we recover from quickly.

For instance, we are constantly linked with Isak. The only way I see us being able to afford Isak is if Salah leaves. Equally, does Isak join if someone like Salah goes; what is he walking into? All made up rumours of course but one can't ignore where we are with possibly the greatest single player season in PL history in the offing.

Edit: I still think both will end up staying. We obviously won't get Isak. Trent will go and we'll replace him with Bradley and Quansah as backup. We still have gaps to fill.

[KSE Comedy Club]

More news from the weekend, is that Klopp is favourite to take over from Ancelotti at Real M in the summer.

:popcorn:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Gyokeres could actually happen this summer according to reports.

That is huge news for us if true.

https://x.com/David_Ornstein/status/1906413711054541146

[HCZ_Reborn]

I’m going to die on the hill that says I don’t want Gyokeres. I simply do not see how a player who at the age of 26 and has played only championship level football and in the Portuguese league is the answer to our problems.

I’m generally hesitant to spend any money on a player older than 25 in any event.

I’m not saying Andrea Berta is wrong, but this is a guy who signed Kieran Trippier and Joao Felix (a folly that eclipses Nicolas Pepe) for Atletico.

[HCZ_Reborn]

More news from the weekend, is that Klopp is favourite to take over from Ancelotti at Real M in the summer.

:popcorn:

People were screaming at me asking me who I’d have to replace Arteta and whilst I’m still very much in the mould of it doesn’t matter because 95% of football success is based on the structure of the club and what players you have. Klopp is someone who will get players to go to war for him, we should have got him ten years ago.

[HCZ_Reborn]

So just looked at Gyokeres two seasons and he’s got 59 goals which on the face of it is impressive

But 17 of those goals have been pels (including 12 this season) and he’s a bit of a flat track bully…his record against the bigger sides in Portugal is lacking

[Mac76]

He can only be as good as the team around him and presumably compared to his current team, our squad can give better service to a striker

[Marc Overmars]

Yeah I don’t think Gyokeres would be a slam dunk of a signing but obviously we are desperate. Nunez came from Portugal where he scored a lot but look how shit he’s been here.

Just hoping we get the striker signing sorted quickly whatever happens.

[KSE Comedy Club]

I’m going to die on the hill that says I don’t want Gyokeres. I simply do not see how a player who at the age of 26 and has played only championship level football and in the Portuguese league is the answer to our problems.

I’m generally hesitant to spend any money on a player older than 25 in any event.

I’m not saying Andrea Berta is wrong, but this is a guy who signed Kieran Trippier and Joao Felix (a folly that eclipses Nicolas Pepe) for Atletico.

Gyokores pisses all over Sesko (who supposedly Arteta wants) and is on a par with Isak (who we won't be getting), but considerably cheaper (around £68m by reports)

He is a direct CF, which is what we need rather than an 'he plays here but could probably play there' type of player.

[KSE Comedy Club]

So just looked at Gyokeres two seasons and he’s got 59 goals which on the face of it is impressive

But 17 of those goals have been pels (including 12 this season) and he’s a bit of a flat track bully…his record against the bigger sides in Portugal is lacking

That could be a limitation of the team he has around him though.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Gyokores pisses all over Sesko (who supposedly Arteta wants) and is on a par with Isak (who we won't be getting), but considerably cheaper (around £68m by reports)

He is a direct CF, which is what we need rather than an 'he plays here but could probably play there' type of player.

Does he? based on what criteria. The Portuguese league is so inferior to the Bundesliga that a goal scoring comparison is not really a fair assessment. I’m far more impressed with the technique and strength of Sesko to be honest.

Direct centre forwards are a bit of a rarity and the reason for that is for one reason or another they’ve gone out of style

Gyokeres for me I expect at best to be at the level of a Teemu Pukki (would be great for a mid table team) and at worst either a Mateja Kezman or Mario Jardel.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Despite the nightmare transfer of Nicolas Pepe, I’d consider getting Jonathan David from Lille

I don’t buy into this idea of necessarily needing to sign a 6ft 5 monster (which would rule out Gyokeres and Sesko)

If we take Haaland for example, I don’t think he’s as good as he is because of his height, in many ways it’s despite his height.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Does he? based on what criteria. The Portuguese league is so inferior to the Bundesliga that a goal scoring comparison is not really a fair assessment. I’m far more impressed with the technique and strength of Sesko to be honest.

Direct centre forwards are a bit of a rarity and the reason for that is for one reason or another they’ve gone out of style

Gyokeres for me I expect at best to be at the level of a Teemu Pukki (would be great for a mid table team) and at worst either a Mateja Kezman or Mario Jardel.

Well.... he's a striker, that scores goals..... :shrug:

I'm not sure what other criteria we need to be looking at?

[HCZ_Reborn]

Well.... he's a striker, that scores goals..... :shrug:

I'm not sure what other criteria we need to be looking at?

Chris Wood is a striker who can score goals I assume that you’re not saying that based on one season he would be good enough for Arsenal


The criteria for any striker would be technique…how have these goals come about, can he score using both feet as well as his head, can he trap a ball, what’s his first touch like, is there a particular player who is providing him with assists and can those kind of assists be replicated by players at Arsenal, what is their shot to goals ratio….where are they scoring the goals from…

And most importantly Is the difference between the quality of defenders in the league the striker is currently playing in with the premier league likely to prove to be an impediment to that player scoring goals for Arsenal?

[Mac76]

There's some pretty appalling defences in the PL tbh

As for whether we need a big guy I absolutely say yes, Leo and Martinelli have been incapable of ruffling defenders' feathers specifically because they don't have the right physical presence to mix it with CBs - that's why Arteta prefers Merino and rarely, I have to say I agree with him

apparently Gyokeres, who's 6'2" btw, can score with both feet too

[HCZ_Reborn]

Id say we’ve discovered to our chagrin that defences in the premier league aren’t all that bad especially if they decide to sit deep and be organised.

And if the response to that is well it’s because our attack is shit, well the only possible counter response would be…yes and is it going to be made better by someone who was playing championship level in his mid twenties. I’m sorry but that’s a big red flag for me.

And Height and strength are not necessarily one and the same, I wouldn’t call Salah lacking physical strength yet he’s only 5ft 10. Having a good low centre of gravity helps. I’d also argue that Saka is a pretty hardy player you actually literally have to double up on him and foul him to get him off the ball.

I guess I’m not that taken with the gangly centre forward that’s all elbows.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Gyokores pisses all over Sesko (who supposedly Arteta wants) and is on a par with Isak (who we won't be getting), but considerably cheaper (around £68m by reports)

He is a direct CF, which is what we need rather than an 'he plays here but could probably play there' type of player.

I think this pretty much where I'm at too.

I started off liking Sesko a year ago when we were linked to him, but watching him a bit more and probably ( and more importantly) not rating the metrics by which Arteta judges forwards makes me want him less and less every day.

If my head rules my heart, Gyokeres probably tops my list for dependable strikers.......but I strongly think we need to bring in not one but 2 proper forwards this summer, so going for a cheaper Gyokeres makes sense if I'm hoping for a 2nd signing.

HCZ mentions Jonathan David, which is ok with me as an additional member of the squad as he'll be on a free.

But if my heart had its way, I'd go for Ekitike and Gyokeres this summer, we'd have flair and a possible superstar in one hand and a dependable Giroud like goal machine in the other hand.

My heart isn't silly so it doesn't consider Isak as an option available to us.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Chris Wood is a striker who can score goals I assume that you’re not saying that based on one season he would be good enough for Arsenal


The criteria for any striker would be technique…how have these goals come about, can he score using both feet as well as his head, can he trap a ball, what’s his first touch like, is there a particular player who is providing him with assists and can those kind of assists be replicated by players at Arsenal, what is their shot to goals ratio….where are they scoring the goals from…

And most importantly Is the difference between the quality of defenders in the league the striker is currently playing in with the premier league likely to prove to be an impediment to that player scoring goals for Arsenal?

Except we aren't looking at Chris Wood

The relevant point here is who is better Sesko or Gyokores (as they are the names we are supposedly targeting)

Gyokores wins that battle.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Except we aren't looking at Chris Wood

The relevant point here is who is better Sesko or Gyokores (as they are the names we are supposedly targeting)

Gyokores wins that battle.

Does he? As I’ve asked is there an objective criteria for saying that given they play in completely different leagues

Also if it were up to me I wouldn’t be signing only the one striker anyway. I’d be looking at signing Sesko and David myself

[KSE Comedy Club]

Does he? As I’ve asked is there an objective criteria for saying that given they play in completely different leagues

Also if it were up to me I wouldn’t be signing only the one striker anyway. I’d be looking at signing Sesko and David myself

Oh don't get me wrong, I agree that two CF's is the correct way to go in the summer as one just isn't enough.

But yes, you look at any top list of forwards around the interweb, and Gyokores comes out above Sesko in all of them.
Sesko would add quality to our attacking ability, but as a finisher Gyokeres is more clinical out of the two.

[Mac76]

yes and is it going to be made better by someone who was playing championship level in his mid twenties..

Oh dear you've done it again - Jamie Vardy was at Fleetwood Town when he was 24 - he then moved to err, Championship level Leicester City - who got promoted three years later and won the PL, thanks to bucketloads of goals from, err, Jamie Vardy :haha:

(PS please don't bother trying to get out of this one, it's another Everton - you've nowhere to go except down, trust me)

[HCZ_Reborn]

Oh dear you've done it again - Jamie Vardy was at Fleetwood Town when he was 24 - he then moved to err, Championship level Leicester City - who got promoted three years later and won the PL, thanks to bucketloads of goals from, err, Jamie Vardy :haha:

(PS please don't bother trying to get out of this one, it's another Everton - you've nowhere to go except down, trust me)

There’s nothing to get out of….you understand the word outlier I assume?

Jamie Vardy isn’t a paradigm of how frequently players can be good despite playing in lower leagues in their mid twenties, he’s the exception that proves the rule

It’s a bit like saying the existence of hemaphrodites proves that human beings aren’t sexually dimorphic

But nice to know you’re so desperate for a win that you’re prepared to die on the hill of that argument.

[Mac76]

he’s the exception that proves the rule


We keep bumping up against these 'exceptions' don't we? Vardy, Moyes, Leicester... there's quite a few it seems ;)

[Mac76]

Arteta's allegedly made his mind up about whether to keep Partey. I know Partey's been generally great but I can just see our extending his contract only for him to occupy the physio's bench next season, so I think we should sell while we can get a decent return on him. I'd try hard to keep Kiwior though.

[HCZ_Reborn]

We keep bumping up against these 'exceptions' don't we? Vardy, Moyes, Leicester... there's quite a few it seems ;)

Moyes isn’t really an exception anymore is he? Let’s be fair Everton have gone back to where they were under throat cancer boy not exactly free scoring are they.

But let’s take your arguments and apply them shall we

“You're wrong to be skeptical that a player that by the age of 26/27 hasn’t played any higher level of domestic football than the Portuguese league because Jamie Vardy is one example where it can work”


“You’re wrong to suggest that both money and having the best players is by a mile the biggest indicator of whether a team will be successful, because Leicester City won the title once”

Not exactly the most compelling arguments are they?. Leicester took a chance on Vardy because they were in a position where they could get him cheap therefore it wasn’t much of a gamble. My question is given we have money to get on someone who would be a far safer bet, why gamble on someone when the only club to date to do so is Sporting Lisbon?

Trying to dismiss that concern because of Jamie Vardy seems frankly illustrative of you being argumentative for the sake of it (something you accuse me of loads and I will concede not always unfairly, but it does mark you out as a hypocrite)


In regards to the other argument, Now of course two things can be true at once, if you have a poor coach despite having the best players and most money, that obviously can be an impediment but it means most likely that if you don’t win the teams that might not have as much money and top quality players but have far more than the clubs around them will ultimately benefit from that poor coach.
But generally speaking rich clubs hire the best coaches and quickly get rid of the ones not performing.

It seems weird to me that you’d even die on this hill, but then again this is you we are talking about isn’t it?

[HCZ_Reborn]

Arteta's allegedly made his mind up about whether to keep Partey. I know Partey's been generally great but I can just see our extending his contract only for him to occupy the physio's bench next season, so I think we should sell while we can get a decent return on him. I'd try hard to keep Kiwior though.

I’m torn on Partey. I can see both the arguments for keeping him based on how he’s performed this season and the one about selling him and getting some money (because it has been rather miraculous almost that he hasn’t had long periods out and it would be a big gamble to assume that will remain the case going forward).

And to reaffirm again, 100% agree on Kiwior

[Niall_Quinn]

I’m torn on Partey. I can see both the arguments for keeping him based on how he’s performed this season and the one about selling him and getting some money (because it has been rather miraculous almost that he hasn’t had long periods out and it would be a big gamble to assume that will remain the case going forward).

And to reaffirm again, 100% agree on Kiwior

It'll cost 100mill to replace him - so keep. Simple enough. He has set his own standards now - woe betide he drops below them. Hated the bloke (not really, but in football terms) - but he proved e wrong. Can't see where we find a better option than him at the 6, provided he plays like he's up against Madrid - every match!

[HCZ_Reborn]

It'll cost 100mill to replace him - so keep. Simple enough. He has set his own standards now - woe betide he drops below them. Hated the bloke (not really, but in football terms) - but he proved e wrong. Can't see where we find a better option than him at the 6, provided he plays like he's up against Madrid - every match!

The replacement is apparently Zubimendi who would cost us 50 million but you’re not wrong about Partey

[HCZ_Reborn]

Looking like we may be signing Jamie Bynoe-Gittens from Dortmund, another English lad who has gone there to get a chance he probably wouldn’t have got in England (another City academy player I believe)

From what I can see, he seems comfortable using both feet, although worryingly his head is down too often for my liking…so could have an Eze on our hands….lots of pace but very little grey matter


This also suggests we’ve gone for a cheaper alternative to Nico Williams, which I can’t say I’m heartbroken about. He plays on the left which tells me that Trossard is going in the summer (nothing I imagine any of us is that surprised about)

[Mac76]

Yeah Eze would be a terrible signing

Scored yesterday btw, 11 goals and 11 assists this season

Oh and as for grey matter, he apparently also just won £20k in an online chess tournament

Maybe that's another exception that proves the rule though... ;)

[HCZ_Reborn]

Yeah Eze would be a terrible signing

Scored yesterday btw, 11 goals and 11 assists this season

Oh and as for grey matter, he apparently also just won £20k in an online chess tournament

Maybe that's another exception that proves the rule though... ;)

That’s a weak argument even for you

Because he won a chess tournament that shows he has a footballing brain??

Didn’t exactly work for Walcott the straight A student did it

I imagine Rooney would have been spending hours trying to fit a square shaped object through a circular hole as a kid, had a fantastic footballing brain though.

But in fairness to you, it does form a pattern. Eze and Gakpo both very quick and reasonably strong but ultimately meat heads. They might get a run of goalscoring but just as often they’ll deal with a simple pass or decision making like Lorenzo Odone.

Though maybe it’s just a stylistic thing, you see things in a more prosaic way, it’s why you think pointing out spelling errors is important. I think lifting your head up and being able to see the game around you is important

[Letters]

Because he won a chess tournament that shows he has a footballing brain??
To be fair you said "very little grey matter".

[HCZ_Reborn]

To be fair you said "very little grey matter".

Yes but I even give Mac the benefit of understanding that there’s different kinds of intelligence and that in the context of the conversation I’m referring to a specific kind of intelligence

It really depends how generous im inclined to be whether i land on genuine misunderstanding caused by ambiguity of language or whether someone is being deliberately slow to catch on, because to a hammer everything looks like a nail

But we all surely know that the inverse is true, that some of the most gifted footballers there have ever been, can also be screaming ignoramuses. But on the footballing field they are geniuses.

[Letters]

Ah. You're doing that thing again where you communicated poorly and you're going to keep pretending that what you said was clear and everyone else is being stupid. Shall we just save us both the effort of that inevitable back and forth and leave it there?

[Mac76]

To be fair you said "very little grey matter".

Exactly, as usual he moves the goalposts to try to avoid showing himself up, and as usual it's pointless

[Mac76]

Ah. You're doing that thing again where you communicated poorly and you're going to keep pretending that what you said was clear and everyone else is being stupid. Shall we just save us both the effort of that inevitable back and forth and leave it there?

:lol:

[HCZ_Reborn]

Exactly, as usual he moves the goalposts to try to avoid showing himself up, and as usual it's pointless

Moving the goalposts suggests im pretending I’m making another argument than the one I’m making

So as Letters suggests we can leave it, because if you’re calling me a liar my instinctive reaction is “Fuck off you cunt”

Being accused of lying is one of those things I don’t take kindly to, though of course if you’re not doing that I take it back

[Mac76]

:blink:

[HCZ_Reborn]

Ah. You're doing that thing again where you communicated poorly and you're going to keep pretending that what you said was clear and everyone else is being stupid. Shall we just save us both the effort of that inevitable back and forth and leave it there?

No in fairness I think it’s clear that what seems obvious in intent to me, is not to others. But to be fair I have to be aware that I was responding to someone who has the restless leg syndrome of needing to correct people even when it’s not appropriate to do so (in fact especially when it’s not appropriate to do so)

And as we discussed earlier before hand, no I’m not going to change my writing style

[HCZ_Reborn]

:blink:

Surely that was unambiguous enough, even for you

Edit - Actually no I apologise, the first sentence isn’t clear

If you’re suggesting or outright stating I’m trying to lie to you…then yes “fuck off you cunt” applies.

Communicating poorly as Letters put it, that I can accept because I literally had to go back and rewrite the first sentence

[Mac76]

Moving the goalposts suggests im pretending I’m making another argument than the one I’m making



You said "lots of pace but very little grey matter"

'grey matter' is a euphemism for the human brain, not the footballing part of the brain

both Letters and I are pointing out that you have a habit of saying something indefensible and then saying you meant something else - playing the 'outraged' card by calling it lying is a bit over the top, maybe you don't even know you're doing it

and while we're here you also did that other thing you appear to do, which is to focus on one point and conveniently sidestep the other, in this case his goal contributions, which I'm pretty sure are better then any single Arsenal midfielder this season...

Anyway I'm going to take a leaf out of Letters' book and leave it there ... :good:

[HCZ_Reborn]

“Didn’t mean it” would imply that I said something in the heat of the moment but I’m walking it back.

And No I mean what I say, but as I tried to point out the other day there are times where you have either misread the post (the Gyokeres example and that’s not exhaustive) or and where I’ve tried to be accommodating admit where I’ve not been clear rather than what I perhaps wrongly assume you do which is to pretend you don’t understand what I’m saying to make an argument.

I’ve said this to be unkind, but your very literalist and often maximalist interpretation genuinely makes me wonder if you’re on the spectrum. But equally I can’t overlook the fact that I’m not making myself as clear as I’d like.


I won’t lie (and I’m sure it’s the same for you) I read some of your posts and think “is there something wrong with you?” Not as a matter of contempt but utter confusion.

The grey matter is a euphemistic term that refers to speaking about intelligence generally, I don’t think it restricts itself to intellect.

And I did address the stats. We all use stats to evidence the argument we want to make (me included) but actually they can be kind of prosaic. Admittedly I’ve seen Eze play more for England than Palace but this is a player for me who doesn’t have much of a footballing brain, and you can score goals and provide assists without one (Walcott managed it).

But it would depend against what team he amassed these goals and assists, sometimes explosive pace can help you, but if you can’t read the game to look up and see what’s around you, if you don’t know when to cut inside and when to take on your man….the effectiveness of that player is limited.

In terms of career Assists, Aaron Ramsey is not a million miles away from Zinedine Zidane but in terms of his natural ability he was. It’s not just about goals or even assists it’s about moments you can create on a pitch that can lead to creating space for others to make assists. The stats don't tell you how invaluable an assist was…whether it was a simple pass or a pass that no one else could see and it’s only from being able to see the game and understand where a player will be that means you can make it.

And finally not everything you don’t personally agree with is an indefensible position.

[Niall_Quinn]

You said "lots of pace but very little grey matter"

'grey matter' is a euphemism for the human brain, not the footballing part of the brain

both Letters and I are pointing out that you have a habit of saying something indefensible and then saying you meant something else - playing the 'outraged' card by calling it lying is a bit over the top, maybe you don't even know you're doing it

and while we're here you also did that other thing you appear to do, which is to focus on one point and conveniently sidestep the other, in this case his goal contributions, which I'm pretty sure are better then any single Arsenal midfielder this season...

Anyway I'm going to take a leaf out of Letters' book and leave it there ... :good:

He's here to win arguments, not make points. But at least he's smart enough to figure out the parameters of those arguments, even if he'll cling on once every last defence has been shot down. Letters has no parameters, just blind belief.

[HCZ_Reborn]

He's here to win arguments, not make points. But at least he's smart enough to figure out the parameters of those arguments, even if he'll cling on once every last defence has been shot down. Letters has no parameters, just blind belief.



Interesting given that in your arguments with Letters, you do exactly what Mac accuses me of doing which is to shift the goalposts

I also enjoy the inappropriate moral tone you take with him, and how you act like he should care about your homilies.


I’d just say “mind your business what I do or don’t do you sanctimonious turd”. But I suppose that’s a reflection of my own lack of patience with trying people

[Letters]

Letters has no parameters, just blind belief.
I will add this to the ever growing list of "things NQ is wrong about" :)

[Mac76]

Zubimendi's pretty much done apparently

[Niall_Quinn]

Interesting given that in your arguments with Letters, you do exactly what Mac accuses me of doing which is to shift the goalposts

I also enjoy the inappropriate moral tone you take with him, and how you act like he should care about your homilies.


I’d just say “mind your business what I do or don’t do you sanctimonious turd”. But I suppose that’s a reflection of my own lack of patience with trying people

That final sentence is my point exactly. But you missed that. I already leave people alone, can't stand them to be honest so it's no great hardship. But they won't leave me alone. So there's the argument. Our mutual friend thinks he has a right to dictate to me, which he doesn't. So he uses force as a substitute. Which is why I adopt my entirely appropriate "inappropriate moral tone".

You should try to work these things out before declaring you have worked them out.

[Niall_Quinn]

Zubimendi's pretty much done apparently

Supposedly so. What does he give us? Confirmation we wasted money on Merino?

[HCZ_Reborn]

That final sentence is my point exactly. But you missed that. I already leave people alone, can't stand them to be honest so it's no great hardship. But they won't leave me alone. So there's the argument. Our mutual friend thinks he has a right to dictate to me, which he doesn't. So he uses force as a substitute. Which is why I adopt my entirely appropriate "inappropriate moral tone".

You should try to work these things out before declaring you have worked them out.

He doesn’t dictate to you, it’s the exact opposite way round.

Don’t take my word for it, ask anyone else on here

[Niall_Quinn]

He doesn’t dictate to you, it’s the exact opposite way round.

Don’t take my word for it, ask anyone else on here

Erm, why would I do that? Is that how it works, he said, she said?

Of course people like him dictate. They prop up the shitty system with their compliance and subservience. Which allows the shitty system to buy guns with our money and then ban us from having guns.

How do I dictate to him. I just call him out for being the abject hypocrite he is. How is that dictating how he lives his life? Intrigued to know what you mean by that.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Erm, why would I do that? Is that how it works, he said, she said?

Of course people like him dictate. They prop up the shitty system with their compliance and subservience. Which allows the shitty system to buy guns with our money and then ban us from having guns.

How do I dictate to him. I just call him out for being the abject hypocrite he is. How is that dictating how he lives his life? Intrigued to know what you mean by that.

This is how it works

He will make a post unrelated to you

You reply with a mixture of vitriol and moral lecturing

He replies and tells you why he thinks you’re wrong

The only way you can argue he dictates to you is that he asks you to evidence the claims you make

[Niall_Quinn]

This is how it works

He will make a post unrelated to you

You reply with a mixture of vitriol and moral lecturing

He replies and tells you why he thinks you’re wrong

The only way you can argue he dictates to you is that he asks you to evidence the claims you make

Oh come on. Expect me to buy that bullshit?

He'll make an innocent post? Just saying - here's a wink to go with it? He's a site owner who trolls. And bans trolls. But whatever.

Drink his koolade all you like, have your fill. But none for me thanks. All for you.

If he posted up something like, "Arsenal won 2-0 today", do I jump in with, "Prove it cunt!"

if he posts up that some pedophile mass killer is such a lovely dude, then I know he's looking for a fight and I give it to him. Not because of that particular fight but because of the underlying issue you are well aware of. He's a symptom and a cause, at the same time. His cowardice is an enabler, his complacency is absolution.

To me he's a perfect specimen.

But all that aside, if that's the level at which your defining "dictate" then try harder. We both know that's not the dictatorship we are really talking about.

So basically no, you. can't defend that earlier statement unless you change the context.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Oh come on. Expect me to buy that bullshit?

He'll make an innocent post? Just saying - here's a wink to go with it? He's a site owner who trolls. And bans trolls. But whatever.

Drink his koolade all you like, have your fill. But none for me thanks. All for you.

If he posted up something like, "Arsenal won 2-0 today", do I jump in with, "Prove it cunt!"

if he posts up that some pedophile mass killer is such a lovely dude, then I know he's looking for a fight and I give it to him. Not because of that particular fight but because of the underlying issue you are well aware of. He's a symptom and a cause, at the same time. His cowardice is an enabler, his complacency is absolution.

To me he's a perfect specimen.

But all that aside, if that's the level at which your defining "dictate" then try harder. We both know that's not the dictatorship we are really talking about.

So basically no, you. can't defend that earlier statement unless you change the context.


I don’t have to defend it, your post is basically saying “this is what I do, but I’m provoked”

That you see an innocuous post about Bill Fucking Gates as provocation makes you sound mental

Waiting for a reply in which you’ll tell me not only is it not innocuous but I know it’s not.

[Niall_Quinn]

I don’t have to defend it, your post is basically saying “this is what I do, but I’m provoked”

That you see an innocuous post about Bill Fucking Gates as provocation makes you sound mental

Waiting for a reply in which you’ll tell me not only is it not innocuous but I know it’s not.

Provoked? You are drifting so far from your original claim now, that I dictate to him as opposed to the other way around. So much obfuscation, but no clarification.

And then you do what he does, shift the onus.

You said I dictate to him. How? And please don't try the bullshit sequence you just went through. Try explaining in real terms how a person who props up the criminal state is dictated to by a person who won't endorse that criminal state.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Provoked? You are drifting so far from your original claim now, that I dictate to him as opposed to the other way around. So much obfuscation, but no clarification.

And then you do what he does, shift the onus.

You said I dictate to him. How? And please don't try the bullshit sequence you just went through. Try explaining in real terms how a person who props up the criminal state is dictated to by a person who won't endorse that criminal state.

I’ve already explained it to you two posts ago. The whole sequence of events

But if you want another example, I’d say telling someone who considers themselves a Christian that they can’t be a proper Christian because they vote, therefore endorsing Evil is dictating to someone

[Niall_Quinn]

I’ve already explained it to you two posts ago. The whole sequence of events

But if you want another example, I’d say telling someone who considers themselves a Christian that they can’t be a proper Christian because they vote, therefore endorsing Evil is dictating to someone

That's not dictating to somebody. That's pointing out self-evident hypocrisy. Dictating to somebody is joining a gang and then using violence to force everyone else into that gang. Ah, you are part of "society" therefore (despite the total lack of correlation) you MUST be subject to government. Trouble with you NPCs is you view dystopia as normality. Therefore everything can be justified. But when you get back to the principles of any argument you can't make a case, so you invent imaginary paradigms and then measure everything against them. You "reason" is based on a manufactured foundation. When you take the crutch away you aren't in the least bit reasonable, quite the contrary. And I know you'll come back with some other unrelated bullshit, something else created from thin air and then landed with a conclusion that makes Olga Korbut seem clumsy. But that won't have any influence on the ACTUAL argument, will it?

[Mac76]

That's not dictating to somebody.

Correct

Like the bit about Olga Korbut too :lol:

[HCZ_Reborn]

That's not dictating to somebody. That's pointing out self-evident hypocrisy. Dictating to somebody is joining a gang and then using violence to force everyone else into that gang. Ah, you are part of "society" therefore (despite the total lack of correlation) you MUST be subject to government. Trouble with you NPCs is you view dystopia as normality. Therefore everything can be justified. But when you get back to the principles of any argument you can't make a case, so you invent imaginary paradigms and then measure everything against them. You "reason" is based on a manufactured foundation. When you take the crutch away you aren't in the least bit reasonable, quite the contrary. And I know you'll come back with some other unrelated bullshit, something else created from thin air and then landed with a conclusion that makes Olga Korbut seem clumsy. But that won't have any influence on the ACTUAL argument, will it?

You're dictating the terms under which someone can call themselves a Christian (using a standard by the way which only makes sense from your logic of government and authority are evil, and therefore voting is aiding and abetting evil) but yes you’re definitely not Dictating.

A lot of things are self-evident to you, but only to you. You dictate to the rest of us what reality is based on your world view. You spent the whole of last year trying to dictate what we should be discussing on the currents btw thread.

And the NPC thing is just pathetic, apart from anything else what have you actually done to fight against “evil”, apart from berating a mod on a post that almost no one uses?

[HCZ_Reborn]

Correct

Like the bit about Olga Korbut too :lol:

Bit rich coming from Goonersweb’s answer to Eddie the Eagle

[Niall_Quinn]

You're dictating the terms under which someone can call themselves a Christian (using a standard by the way which only makes sense from your logic of government and authority are evil, and therefore voting is aiding and abetting evil) but yes you’re definitely not Dictating.

A lot of things are self-evident to you, but only to you. You dictate to the rest of us what reality is based on your world view. You spent the whole of last year trying to dictate what we should be discussing on the currents btw thread.

And the NPC thing is just pathetic, apart from anything else what have you actually done to fight against “evil”, apart from berating a mod on a post that almost no one uses?

Well then why are you all so defensive and indignant and totally wrong? If there's nothing to see here why are you making a show of yourself?

[Niall_Quinn]

Bit rich coming from Goonersweb’s answer to Eddie the Eagle

Took guts for that boy to ski off the end of a cliff. More guts than some would ever muster. Never understood why that guy was ridiculed by so many fat people on their couches.

[Mac76]

Well then why are you all so defensive and indignant and totally wrong? If there's nothing to see here why are you making a show of yourself?

I often wonder that

[HCZ_Reborn]

Well then why are you all so defensive and indignant and totally wrong? If there's nothing to see here why are you making a show of yourself?

You are accusing me of being indignant? When that’s your default settting

But No not defensive or indignant just lacking in patience

[Mac76]

Apparently our CL run earned the club over £99m - should come in handy in the transfer window

[Chippy]

Apparently our CL run earned the club over £99m - should come in handy in the transfer window

Fantastic! That will hopefully boost the transfer budget.

[Niall_Quinn]

You are accusing me of being indignant? When that’s your default settting

But No not defensive or indignant just lacking in patience

And wrong. Couldn't back up your silly claim but you can't just back off and leave it.

[Niall_Quinn]

Fantastic! That will hopefully boost the transfer budget.

Hope we at least get a free scarf out of it!

[Marc Overmars]

Sounds like Gyökeres could be our top target this summer.

Far from convinced that his form in the Portuguese league means an instant impact over here, however he’s reported to be valued at 60m which for a striker who could potentially score a lot of goals is worth a punt.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Sounds like Gyökeres could be our top target this summer.

Far from convinced that his form in the Portuguese league means an instant impact over here, however he’s reported to be valued at 60m which for a striker who could potentially score a lot of goals is worth a punt.

But you’re wrong to worry about that because of Jamie Vardy apparently

[Mac76]

Sounds like Gyökeres could be our top target this summer.

Far from convinced that his form in the Portuguese league means an instant impact over here, however he’s reported to be valued at 60m which for a striker who could potentially score a lot of goals is worth a punt.

That's why I'd like two strikers to come in, it gives competition from the start and more options

Pretty much every player is a punt of some kind (no pun intended), it's no different from Arteta buying Merino and Cala (neither of whom are particularly good in their intended positions IMO) except while he gambles on numerous people for DM and LB, Arteta seems to have a Goldilocks approach to strikers (which btw led to us not getting Isak two years ago for relative peanuts)

It's particularly weird when you consider he thinks Jesus is good enough as a striker, despite the obvious drawback of his hardly ever being in the right place, plus not being able to hit a barn door from three feet

[HCZ_Reborn]

My preference would also be for two strikers but for neither of them to be Gyokeres

Sesko would be one, in an ideal world Lautaro Martinez would be the other (though I think not likely especially if Inter win the Champions League)

Isaak would be one I’d favour but would cost too much

My other preference would be to sign Morgan Rodgers a player of both immense technical talent and physicality as an attacking midfielder

[HCZ_Reborn]

Though I suspect we won’t buy an attacking midfielder because Arteta wants to fast track Max Dowman

Hard to know how good he will be though he’s tearing it up at the level he’s currently playing at. Won’t be available to play before December though

[Mac76]

My preference would also be for two strikers but for neither of them to be Gyokeres



You'll accuse me of trolling I'm sure, but quite genuinely, given your track record in underestimating very good players, if he wasn't already my favourite he would be now

[HCZ_Reborn]

You'll accuse me of trolling I'm sure, but quite genuinely, given your track record in underestimating very good players, if he wasn't already my favourite he would be now

Correction, underestimating players you insist are very good and in a lot of cases buttress your claim by saying “loads of people agree with me”

Gakpo and Eze are really nothing special, at best you could argue that for title winning sides they are squad players (which is exactly what Gakpo was for Liverpool)

Though Rice is a very good player, just not my kind of player and not one that I think can play continuously at 8. You need more of a Bellingham type in that role against the pubbers.

The thing is with Gyokeres he might be good, but I think whilst every signing is a gamble…a player that has played in leagues where defences part like the sea for Moses, that’s a gamble too far when we really need one established player who can hit the ground running.

[Mac76]

we really need one established player who can hit the ground running.

Then there's only one person on that list and that's Isaak and if Newcastle make the CL, which seems fairly certain, we're not getting him for short of £200m = ain't happenin'

As for Gakpo and Eze, you're quite clever at asking for 'proof' when ultimately it's a matter of watching games, seeing how they play and the difference they make and yes backed up by some figures on goals etc

And Bellingham is demonstrably limited plus has temperament problems

You just take up daft indefensible positions and then sit in your bunker taking potshots at anyone who points out you're in error

[HCZ_Reborn]

Then there's only one person on that list and that's Isaak and if Newcastle make the CL, which seems fairly certain, we're not getting him for short of £200m = ain't happenin'

As for Gakpo and Eze, you're quite clever at asking for 'proof' when ultimately it's a matter of watching games, seeing how they play and the difference they make and yes backed up by some figures on goals etc

And Bellingham is demonstrably limited plus has temperament problems

You just take up daft indefensible positions and then sit in your bunker taking potshots at anyone who points out you're in error

I think Bellingham hasn’t hit the heights that he did in his first season at Real Madrid but I really think it’s hilarious that you call him demonstrably limited and accuse me of taking daft indefensible positions.

I haven’t asked you for proof about Gakpo or Eze what a strange statement, if it was a choice between Gakpo, Eze and Martinelli I’d chose Martinelli….and it’s a result of watching all three. You don’t have to agree, but to call it daft indefensible position you’d think I was saying the other two should be playing in the championship

With Eze I would hope you agree that we need players that can take us to the next level in attack, if you think he’s that and not just at best a fairly decent player to add numbers to our squad (and he’d be too expensive for that) I genuinely don’t get where you’re coming from.

You don’t need to call me out, it’s an opinion you don’t agree with. You have oodles of opinions I think are a bit odd, apart from on the political where I’m trying to bait you as much as anything…I really don’t have the energy to argue with you about it.

[Niall_Quinn]

Though I suspect we won’t buy an attacking midfielder because Arteta wants to fast track Max Dowman

Hard to know how good he will be though he’s tearing it up at the level he’s currently playing at. Won’t be available to play before December though

WTF - where did you get that from?

You just make up shit.

[Niall_Quinn]

My preference would also be for two strikers but for neither of them to be Gyokeres

Sesko would be one, in an ideal world Lautaro Martinez would be the other (though I think not likely especially if Inter win the Champions League)

Isaak would be one I’d favour but would cost too much

My other preference would be to sign Morgan Rodgers a player of both immense technical talent and physicality as an attacking midfielder

Because you think Partey would be a good 8 and Rice needs to be a 6. Deluded. Ignoring what you see with your own eyes so you can stick to something you got wrong ages ago, come hell or high water.

Gyokeres wins us the title.

There - you can quote me on it when I'm right. Or beat me with it when I'm not wrong.

[Niall_Quinn]

Then there's only one person on that list and that's Isaak and if Newcastle make the CL, which seems fairly certain, we're not getting him for short of £200m = ain't happenin'

As for Gakpo and Eze, you're quite clever at asking for 'proof' when ultimately it's a matter of watching games, seeing how they play and the difference they make and yes backed up by some figures on goals etc

And Bellingham is demonstrably limited plus has temperament problems

You just take up daft indefensible positions and then sit in your bunker taking potshots at anyone who points out you're in error

Isak is ORDINARY mate. He stands out in a very ORDINARY league. He would have been a bench warmer if generations past, but now he's very good (on a random basis) in this shit league. Which is still the best league out of all the incredibly shit European leagues.

Gyokeres is a proper player. Go and have a watch of how he plays the game. Then compare to the flouncing Isak.

I like Bellighman. He absolutaley hated losing to us and started throwing our players around the field - albeit knowing the ref was bent. I like players that care.

[HCZ_Reborn]

WTF - where did you get that from?

You just make up shit.

https://www.arsenalinsider.com/arsenal-academy/max-dowman-set-for-arsenal-promotion-as-mikel-arteta-has-new-plan-for-academy-star/


Like your drink dependency, it’s not much of a secret

[HCZ_Reborn]

Because you think Partey would be a good 8 and Rice needs to be a 6. Deluded. Ignoring what you see with your own eyes so you can stick to something you got wrong ages ago, come hell or high water.

Gyokeres wins us the title.

There - you can quote me on it when I'm right. Or beat me with it when I'm not wrong.

Don’t start picking fights because there’s no more Johnny Walker in the cupboards

I said Partey is better at 8 than Rice, I don’t think he’s great in that position either…but alas we don’t have a natural 8

Time to go back in your coffin until nightfall

[Niall_Quinn]

Don’t start picking fights because there’s no more Johnny Walker in the cupboards

I said Partey is better at 8 than Rice, I don’t think he’s great in that position either…but alas we don’t have a natural 8

Time to go back in your coffin until nightfall

Rest my case. All 12 bottles.

[Mac76]

Partey works better at 6, as I've said before he can't turn back and recover as well as Rice (or as well as most poeple tbh) he's too slow, he needs the game to be being played in front of him

[KSE Comedy Club]

Correction, underestimating players you insist are very good and in a lot of cases buttress your claim by saying “loads of people agree with me”

Gakpo and Eze are really nothing special, at best you could argue that for title winning sides they are squad players (which is exactly what Gakpo was for Liverpool)

Though Rice is a very good player, just not my kind of player and not one that I think can play continuously at 8. You need more of a Bellingham type in that role against the pubbers.

The thing is with Gyokeres he might be good, but I think whilst every signing is a gamble…a player that has played in leagues where defences part like the sea for Moses, that’s a gamble too far when we really need one established player who can hit the ground running.

When he played for Coventry in the championship, he scored 43 goals in 116 games and got 17 assists.

Are you suggesting that only the prem has defenders that can actually defend and all other leagues are schoolyard kick abouts?

[KSE Comedy Club]

My preference would also be for two strikers but for neither of them to be Gyokeres

Sesko would be one, in an ideal world Lautaro Martinez would be the other (though I think not likely especially if Inter win the Champions League)

Isaak would be one I’d favour but would cost too much

My other preference would be to sign Morgan Rodgers a player of both immense technical talent and physicality as an attacking midfielder

Martinez has already turned us down once, he can get fucked tbh.

[HCZ_Reborn]

When he played for Coventry in the championship, he scored 43 goals in 116 games and got 17 assists.

Are you suggesting that only the prem has defenders that can actually defend and all other leagues are schoolyard kick abouts?

A) Thats pretty unimpressive for the championship

B) No I’m suggesting that much of the Portuguese league is made up of teams about the level of the championship in terms of quality. If he’d played in La Liga, Bundesliga, Serie A or hell even the French league maybe a different story. For a tall physical striker he isn’t getting many headed goals, it’s largely about transition play and beating defenders for pace and skill (something he would not find so easy in the prem)

I don’t know that he couldn’t do well in the premiership, and so despite what someone else here has claimed I’ve never stated that he couldn’t. My contention is that he’s untested in a top league, he’s done ok in the champions league but even then that will include playing teams that aren’t premiership level.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Martinez has already turned us down once, he can get fucked tbh.

Who cares if he turned us down before. If he’s willing to come now…great

[KSE Comedy Club]

A) Thats pretty unimpressive for the championship

B) No I’m suggesting that much of the Portuguese league is made up of teams about the level of the championship in terms of quality. If he’d played in La Liga, Bundesliga, Serie A or hell even the French league maybe a different story. For a tall physical striker he isn’t getting many headed goals, it’s largely about transition play and beating defenders for pace and skill (something he would not find so easy in the prem)

I don’t know that he couldn’t do well in the premiership, and so despite what someone else here has claimed I’ve never stated that he couldn’t. My contention is that he’s untested in a top league, he’s done ok in the champions league but even then that will include playing teams that aren’t premiership level.

A) you are joking right? considering his age, etc.

B) Well I guess the proof will be in the pudding, by all accounts we will be announcing his signing after their last game on sunday :shrug:

[HCZ_Reborn]

A) you are joking right? considering his age, etc.

B) Well I guess the proof will be in the pudding, by all accounts we will be announcing his signing after their last game on sunday :shrug:

No im not joking, he played for Coventry between the ages of 23 and 25, hardly a raw youngster. That’s not a great return, it’s great if you’re looking to be no1 striker for a team like Bournemouth. But we need someone who at that age is scoring a goal every other game in a competent league considering he’s 27 and not 21

Well I hope either the rumours are unfounded or he hits the ground running because otherwise that’s a lot of money we’ve pissed away

[Niall_Quinn]

Oh now we're doing the anti-Gyokeres thing as well? Hardly a surprise given the Rice thing.

In case you hadn't noticed, the PL is by far the shittiest league in European football, filled with useless fucks who can hardly kick a ball. Haven't you been watching the games?

Now you and your fellow travellers are casting doubts on a player who has done well in a league that can't possibly be any worse than the shit we see at home?

So go on then, who did you want as striker?

Let me guess.

Partey?

Jeez, why don't you just propose?

Gyokeres is the premium striker in Europen football right now - he's proven it over multiple seasons and made absolute shitheaps like Mbappe and Haaland seem ordinary (which they are).

We'd have to pay a qurter bill plus give away 25% ownership of the club to sign that fraud Mbappe.

Gyokeres will be about 70mill - steal considering the ludicrous fees being paid these days.

And he can actually play football, in case you haven't noticed. He's a REAL player, not a fake one. Obviously you don't know anything about the bloke and haven't watched him play.

Well, he'll get 30 for us next season if he joins and that means we'll win the title. So good enough for me.

HOWEVER...

If Arteta keeps on telling Odegard and Partey and Rice and Martinelli and Trossard and the rest to play negative football - doesn't matter who we sign, they'll never get the ball.

So I hope Arteta is getting the chequebook out in full knowledge it will be a complete waste unless HE gets his arse in gear and embraces REAL football instead of the shit he learned under the super-fraud (and I mean the corruption as well as the propaganda) Pep.

[HCZ_Reborn]

If you think the PL is the weakest league in Europe, it only goes to prove that you don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about.

What is it with you and Gyokeres anyhow, does he remind you in some way of players from an era you cry for the moon for ?

Im not even being critical of him, im just aghast at how people can be so hazily uncritical of the fact that he’s played in the English second tier and Portuguese football. And whilst he could be a star that no one has gambled on, when the highest level of football you’ve played is in Portugal and half the goals you’ve scored in that league have been penalties…I think I can be excused for worrying that this is another Nicolas Pepe

[Niall_Quinn]

If you think the PL is the weakest league in Europe, it only goes to prove that you don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about.

What is it with you and Gyokeres anyhow, does he remind you in some way of players from an era you cry for the moon for ?

Im not even being critical of him, im just aghast at how people can be so hazily uncritical of the fact that he’s played in the English second tier and Portuguese football. And whilst he could be a star that no one has gambled on, when the highest level of football you’ve played is in Portugal and half the goals you’ve scored in that league have been penalties…I think I can be excused for worrying that this is another Nicolas Pepe

He can play football. He's physical, can run, can pass, can head the ball, can shoot, can take on a player and beat him, has a brain - all the things most modern footballers can't do. So he's a rarity. Watching him play is like watching football again, after so many years of watching whatever this shit is.

You can't SERIOUSLY watch a PL game with all the tip tap and bullshit 9D chess fuckery from untalented coaches and thing, yes, this is what it's all about? If you were 12, maybe. But you;ve actually seen REAL football! You can see the difference, even if you can't accept it for some reason.

[Niall_Quinn]

MLS is a proper footballer too btw. You can probably see that too. That's the real reason why a kid can make it look easy - because it is, for an actual footballer.

[HCZ_Reborn]

He can play football. He's physical, can run, can pass, can head the ball, can shoot, can take on a player and beat him, has a brain - all the things most modern footballers can't do. So he's a rarity. Watching him play is like watching football again, after so many years of watching whatever this shit is.

You can't SERIOUSLY watch a PL game with all the tip tap and bullshit 9D chess fuckery from untalented coaches and thing, yes, this is what it's all about? If you were 12, maybe. But you;ve actually seen REAL football! You can see the difference, even if you can't accept it for some reason.

That’s like watching a non league game where a striker scores after running past defenders like they aren’t there because the defenders in question are incapable and saying that’s proper football.

I think there’s an argument that can be made that there’s too much emphasis on being spoilers because the amount of money in the game means losing is less acceptable. I also am genuinely concerned at the stratification effect. Before last season it was 25 years since all three clubs promoted to the league got relegated, it’s now happened twice in a row and there’s little evidence to me that we aren’t on for a hat trick.

But at the same time there’s clear undeniable talent in the game, I’ve expressed concern that there’s more reliance on speed and athleticism over technical ability. But equally you blast someone who has been one of the best technical players in the game, because of some arbitrary belief that football was better before Pep Guardiola (who didn’t even invent the form of football you detest) ruined it all.

Mateja Kezman was meant to be the next big thing, he’d been tearing things up for PSV and was considered to be a great signing for Chelsea? He was fucking awful in the premier league. Similar story with Vincent Jansen when he went to Spurs

I’d love to be wrong but I think signing any players from the Portuguese league is a big big risk.

[KSE Comedy Club]

If you think the PL is the weakest league in Europe, it only goes to prove that you don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about.

What is it with you and Gyokeres anyhow, does he remind you in some way of players from an era you cry for the moon for ?

Im not even being critical of him, im just aghast at how people can be so hazily uncritical of the fact that he’s played in the English second tier and Portuguese football. And whilst he could be a star that no one has gambled on, when the highest level of football you’ve played is in Portugal and half the goals you’ve scored in that league have been penalties…I think I can be excused for worrying that this is another Nicolas Pepe

This season he has 39 goals scored from open play and 12 (51 total) goals from penalties in the league, so it's not half his goals, more like a quarter.
That is not to be sniffed at.

Also, 6 in the CL plus 2 penalties.

I would rather take a punt on this guy for a low fee than get more average, maybe/journeymen.

[HCZ_Reborn]

This season he has 39 goals scored from open play and 12 (51 total) goals from penalties in the league, so it's not half his goals, more like a quarter.
That is not to be sniffed at.

Also, 6 in the CL plus 2 penalties.

I would rather take a punt on this guy for a low fee than get more average, maybe/journeymen.

That’s a bit of a false binary in my view

I think there’s a lot of both promising and finished article strikers out there that garner more consideration.

I think when a players name gets put about so much, it’s largely the act of an agent salivating over a pay day

Sesko, Martinez, Ekitike, David….these are more the players I’d be looking at (and in one of the few occasions where I’m in alignment with Mac76 we should be looking to bring in two rather than one)


Frankly I think the summer should be purely about signing players in attack, only sign Zubimendi if Partey goes


Two strikers, a winger and an CAM.


Don’t need more defenders, any old cunt can be a backup keeper. Need to stop that shit

[Marc Overmars]

Gyokeres seems more probable now United have fucked it.

Would quite like Sesko because he seems like a bit of a genetic freak. 6ft5 but moves around the pitch with ease, like a more agile Giroud.

[HCZ_Reborn]

On the matter of players being pimped out by their agents, Rodrygo

I’m sure he’s a decent enough player. But Arsenal fans salivating over tenuous links with him….is a direct consequence of the PR job done through social media rather than any particular regard for the player who certainly barely warranted a mention in the preview of our champions league tie against Madrid

[HCZ_Reborn]

Gyokeres seems more probable now United have fucked it.

Would quite like Sesko because he seems like a bit of a genetic freak. 6ft5 but moves around the pitch with ease, like a more agile Giroud.

I see the potential to be a Haaland like player in him

Although Haaland in fairness was already tearing it up at the same age

[KSE Comedy Club]

Gyokeres seems more probable now United have fucked it.

Would quite like Sesko because he seems like a bit of a genetic freak. 6ft5 but moves around the pitch with ease, like a more agile Giroud.

The problem with Sesko is he doesn't score loads and would likely be a player that still needs a couple of seasons to improve to a higher level.

We don't have that time anymore.

[Marc Overmars]

On the matter of players being pimped out by their agents, Rodrygo

I’m sure he’s a decent enough player. But Arsenal fans salivating over tenuous links with him….is a direct consequence of the PR job done through social media rather than any particular regard for the player who certainly barely warranted a mention in the preview of our champions league tie against Madrid

He’s a bit of an unsung hero that gets forgotten about because of the sheer amount of Galactico’s they’ve got but he is a very good player. Trossard and Martinelli are not better than him IMO, he definitely improves us.

[KSE Comedy Club]

That’s a bit of a false binary in my view

I think there’s a lot of both promising and finished article strikers out there that garner more consideration.

I think when a players name gets put about so much, it’s largely the act of an agent salivating over a pay day

Sesko, Martinez, Ekitike, David….these are more the players I’d be looking at (and in one of the few occasions where I’m in alignment with Mac76 we should be looking to bring in two rather than one)


Frankly I think the summer should be purely about signing players in attack, only sign Zubimendi if Partey goes


Two strikers, a winger and an CAM.


Don’t need more defenders, any old cunt can be a backup keeper. Need to stop that shit

Gyokores is ranked higher than all those strikers you have mentioned.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Gyokores is ranked higher than all those strikers you have mentioned.

Ranked higher by who?

That’s an arbitrary classification

Look we are at an impasse here, there is nothing that’s going to convince me that signing a 27 year old playing in Portuguese football is a good idea. If it comes off, it comes off ill accept that my hesitancy was misplaced, but actually I think it’s a far bigger risk than any of the options I’ve mentioned.

We as a club aren’t in a hurry, if Arteta fucks it again next season it doesn’t materially change things for us as a club.

If we end up losing Rice or Saliba to other clubs, it would be a disappointment but hardly the end of the world

And frankly I’d rather take that risk than on a 27 year old who as I say has played no higher level of football than Portugal. For someone of his build the other troubling aspect is for someone of his height and build, less than 5% of his goals are headers.

And a lot of his goals prima facie look good but they are often a result of transition play against static, immobile defences

[KSE Comedy Club]

Ranked higher in most top striker polls, etc, across various websites.

Just because you don't agree, it doesn't mean they are all wrong.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Ranked higher in most top striker polls, etc, across various websites.

Just because you don't agree, it doesn't mean they are all wrong.

I’m not saying it’s wrong, but it’s not exactly substantive evidence…especially as these website polls tend to be user generated polls. Which is you saying, other football fans rate him higher than the other strikers. Great but not exactly relevant

Again, I think where I’m confused is why people are so certain it’s a slam dunk. I’ll be honest I think at best he’s Giroud or Lacazette which really is less prolific than what we need, and at worst he’s Nicolas Pepe (which a lot of fans were also salivating over, at the time)

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

The Spuds will likely be in the market for a marquee striker now that they are in the CL. Gyokeres won't go there as he's gotten use to winning. Obviously he's not going to Man U either, unless they make him a ridiculous offer and offload at least 2 of their misfiring forwards.

Spurs could go for Ekitike and Sesko, seeing as both are pretty young. Ekitike didn't play well in their EL tie, so he might have been crossed off the list.Which leaves Sesko as their standout foreign pursuit. Also, if Villa don't make the CL, Watkins would probably be available again, he could end up their (though with Solanke's poor form they might not want to risk trying this formula again so soon).

As for us, I really hope we wrap up the Gyokeres signing ASAP, and if we're really serious, we add any of the above two I have already mentioned so their will be no excuses next season.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

That’s like watching a non league game where a striker scores after running past defenders like they aren’t there because the defenders in question are incapable and saying that’s proper football.

I think there’s an argument that can be made that there’s too much emphasis on being spoilers because the amount of money in the game means losing is less acceptable. I also am genuinely concerned at the stratification effect. Before last season it was 25 years since all three clubs promoted to the league got relegated, it’s now happened twice in a row and there’s little evidence to me that we aren’t on for a hat trick.

But at the same time there’s clear undeniable talent in the game, I’ve expressed concern that there’s more reliance on speed and athleticism over technical ability. But equally you blast someone who has been one of the best technical players in the game, because of some arbitrary belief that football was better before Pep Guardiola (who didn’t even invent the form of football you detest) ruined it all.

Mateja Kezman was meant to be the next big thing, he’d been tearing things up for PSV and was considered to be a great signing for Chelsea? He was fucking awful in the premier league. Similar story with Vincent Jansen when he went to Spurs

I’d love to be wrong but I think signing any players from the Portuguese league is a big big risk

BTW you'd struggle to make an evidenced based argument that in recent times their is a better European league to buy attacking talent from, especially as an EPL club.

[HCZ_Reborn]

BTW you'd struggle to make an evidenced based argument that in recent times their is a better European league to buy attacking talent from, especially as an EPL club.


Really??

Marmoush and Haaland were bought from Germany

Isaak from Spain

Plus let’s have a look at the current top scorers list in the premier league this season, no one who is in the top ten in the scoring charts is a purchase from the Portuguese league (Luiz Diaz who Liverpool bought from Porto is in 12th)

And Luiz Diaz I grant you is an excellent player, but I’m old enough to remember how it was bemoaned that Liverpool had signed Darwin Nunez instead of us (from Benfica) and three years on?….i can guarantee you they’ll be trying to offload him in order to bring in another attacking player

It’s a mixed bag league for signing players from, for every Bruno Fernandes there’s a Fabio Vieira

Fabio Vieira was a gamble on a player that looked decent for Porto, but even then it was a relatively low risk gamble he wasn’t going to be the centre piece signing of the summer.

I don’t think he’s terrible, he could do a job in the squad next season…but I think more than likely we will sell him back to Porto for less than what we paid for him

[KSE Comedy Club]

Also Gyokores is Swedish

We all know Swedish strikers are great.

Isaak, Ibrahimovic, Larsson, Nordahl....

[HCZ_Reborn]

Also Gyokores is Swedish

We all know Swedish strikers are great.

Isaak, Ibrahimovic, Larsson, Nordahl....

Gunner Nordahl was a bit before my time :lol:

[HCZ_Reborn]

Also how could you miss out Anders Limpar, he was our top goal scorer when we won the league in 91

Alright technically wasn’t a striker but still

[KSE Comedy Club]

Gunner Nordahl was a bit before my time :lol:

I'll be honest, I had to look him up! :)

[HCZ_Reborn]

I'll be honest, I had to look him up! :)

And you’re not the only one

[Marc Overmars]

Seems like Liverpool are interested in Wirtz. Could be a PL record transfer.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Seems like Liverpool are interested in Wirtz. Could be a PL record transfer.

I think Wirtz is a very good player but quite happy for him to go there if they are going to blow their budget on him

They really need a facelift in defence. Van Dijk is getting old and they look like utter shit when he doesn’t play.

[Letters]

They’d be going from bad to Wirtz

:cool:

[Niall_Quinn]

Sounds like it's Sesko over Gyokeres! Arteta has won - he'll get his tippety-tap "striker" who will fit right in with the soul-crushing football he favours. I'm hoping these are just more rumours from wannabe ITKs, but it makes perfect sense. This will be our worst transfer window of the lot, if true. Not saying Sesko is a bad player, he looks fairly run-of-the-mill like all the "top" wonder players you typically get these days. But we had a chance to get a real player and now, if true, noyt only do we end up with the booby prize but I'm betting somebody else will swoop in and grab the real article - so double fucked. Don't see the point in bringing new staff in if they can't use their expertise and Arteta gets to work hi Wenger complex anyway.

[Marc Overmars]

Get them both.

Then offer up the likes of Martinelli and Trossard to Saudi.

[Niall_Quinn]

I see the potential to be a Haaland like player in him

Although Haaland in fairness was already tearing it up at the same age

Haaland! Gyokeres is the exact opposite! He gets all around the pitch and makes shit happen for himself, he doesn't just stand there like a lump waiting for ball to feet. Haaland could well be the laziest player we've ever seen in this league. Gyokeres would be one of the hardest grafting.

What is it with you? You insist on crazy stuff like Partey being able to play 8, and then you stick with it come hell or high water. Sure, Haaland's an epic finisher, no arguments there, but he'd be an absolute luxury we simply couldn't afford to carry, not the way we play. And especially as we are already carrying the likes of Odegard. We need somebody who can go the extra mile to compensate for the shit going on in our team that Arteta apparently doesn't want to fix.

[Niall_Quinn]

Get them both.

Then offer up the likes of Martinelli and Trossard to Saudi.

It'll be a big mistake if we get rid of Martinelli - one of the few players who always puts a shift in, even when the rest of them are asleep. Arteta has ruined him, true enough. But there's still a very good player in there if only Mr Control Freak would give him a bit more license to play.

Trossard could go though, if we're seriously going to spend some money in the window. He's not going to get any better and he's too inconsistent.

Deffo won't be getting two big names in though - not with stadium expansion plans doing the rounds.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Haaland! Gyokeres is the exact opposite! He gets all around the pitch and makes shit happen for himself, he doesn't just stand there like a lump waiting for ball to feet. Haaland could well be the laziest player we've ever seen in this league. Gyokeres would be one of the hardest grafting.

What is it with you? You insist on crazy stuff like Partey being able to play 8, and then you stick with it come hell or high water. Sure, Haaland's an epic finisher, no arguments there, but he'd be an absolute luxury we simply couldn't afford to carry, not the way we play. And especially as we are already carrying the likes of Odegard. We need somebody who can go the extra mile to compensate for the shit going on in our team that Arteta apparently doesn't want to fix.

First of all I was comparing Sesko to Haaland, not Gyokeres

Also you need to get over this Partey thing. If you bothered to read you’d see that my preference was for Partey to play at 8 over Rice not that I think he’d be especially good there. I just think Rice is utterly unsuited to playing at 8 when you’ve got teams that will drop deep and sit behind the ball (which is about 90% of the teams we play).

Haaland is physically strong, quick and good on the ball as well as being a good finisher

[Niall_Quinn]

First of all I was comparing Sesko to Haaland, not Gyokeres

Also you need to get over this Partey thing. If you bothered to read you’d see that my preference was for Partey to play at 8 over Rice not that I think he’d be especially good there. I just think Rice is utterly unsuited to playing at 8 when you’ve got teams that will drop deep and sit behind the ball (which is about 90% of the teams we play).

Haaland is physically strong, quick and good on the ball as well as being a good finisher

Alright, well I'll shut up then.

[HCZ_Reborn]

It'll be a big mistake if we get rid of Martinelli - one of the few players who always puts a shift in, even when the rest of them are asleep. Arteta has ruined him, true enough. But there's still a very good player in there if only Mr Control Freak would give him a bit more license to play.

Trossard could go though, if we're seriously going to spend some money in the window. He's not going to get any better and he's too inconsistent.

Deffo won't be getting two big names in though - not with stadium expansion plans doing the rounds.

I actually agree with you on this

[Niall_Quinn]

I actually agree with you on this

Why does he let Trossard roam all over the pitch but Martinelli is strictly limited to the corner flag? Another bizarre directive from He whose hair shall not be named.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Get them both.

Then offer up the likes of Martinelli and Trossard to Saudi.

100% with you on this.

Get rid of both of them if that means bringing in 2 quality strikers.

Though some won't agree, I'm a bit confident that Martinelli and Trossard (to an extent) have reached their ceiling at this club, especially if they are forced to continually play under a micro manager like Arteta.

IMO they'd both benefit with a change of scenery.

[Niall_Quinn]

100% with you on this.

Get rid of both of them if that means bringing in 2 quality strikers.

Though some won't agree, I'm a bit confident that Martinelli and Trossard (to an extent) have reached their ceiling at this club, especially if they are forced to continually play under a micro manager like Arteta.

IMO they'd both benefit with a change of scenery.

I'm hoping the slow trend back towards real football continues next season and Arteta will be forced to get aboard or become irrelevant. Both players would benefit greatly if this happened, Martinelli more so.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Sounds like it's Sesko over Gyokeres! Arteta has won - he'll get his tippety-tap "striker" who will fit right in with the soul-crushing football he favours. I'm hoping these are just more rumours from wannabe ITKs, but it makes perfect sense. This will be our worst transfer window of the lot, if true. Not saying Sesko is a bad player, he looks fairly run-of-the-mill like all the "top" wonder players you typically get these days. But we had a chance to get a real player and now, if true, noyt only do we end up with the booby prize but I'm betting somebody else will swoop in and grab the real article - so double fucked. Don't see the point in bringing new staff in if they can't use their expertise and Arteta gets to work hi Wenger complex anyway.

I keep reading that too - I hope to fuck it's all a big lie. Smoke and mirrors.

But it would be so typical of this club, when it seems like the easiest and most obvious thing is right there, staring us in the face, we will go and do the opposite and then make excuses as to why it didn't work out.

Get Gyokores and you have a ready made striker who will score goals.
Get Sesko and you will be waiting 3 years for him to (reach his higher ceiling or some bullshit) and he might score some goals along the way. As long as he can set up and lay off other players it's 'OK'

I still don't understand the obsession with some of these Arteta fans that want a striker that doesn't score goals but is a playmaker - it's fucking weird and sadistic.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I keep reading that too - I hope to fuck it's all a big lie. Smoke and mirrors.

But it would be so typical of this club, when it seems like the easiest and most obvious thing is right there, staring us in the face, we will go and do the opposite and then make excuses as to why it didn't work out.

Get Gyokores and you have a ready made striker who will score goals.
Get Sesko and you will be waiting 3 years for him to (reach his higher ceiling or some bullshit) and he might score some goals along the way. As long as he can set up and lay off other players it's 'OK'

I still don't understand the obsession with some of these Arteta fans that want a striker that doesn't score goals but is a playmaker - it's fucking weird and sadistic.

:haha: ......he'll have to get behind the line, Havertz fills that role already.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I keep reading that too - I hope to fuck it's all a big lie. Smoke and mirrors.

But it would be so typical of this club, when it seems like the easiest and most obvious thing is right there, staring us in the face, we will go and do the opposite and then make excuses as to why it didn't work out.

Get Gyokores and you have a ready made striker who will score goals.
Get Sesko and you will be waiting 3 years for him to (reach his higher ceiling or some bullshit) and he might score some goals along the way. As long as he can set up and lay off other players it's 'OK'

I still don't understand the obsession with some of these Arteta fans that want a striker that doesn't score goals but is a playmaker - it's fucking weird and sadistic.

I’ve rather patiently explained my position of Gyokeres, you don’t have to agree with me or accept it. But if you can’t understand it, that’s on you.

[KSE Comedy Club]

I’ve rather patiently explained my position of Gyokeres, you don’t have to agree with me or accept it. But if you can’t understand it, that’s on you.

Rather vain, I wasn't addressing you :shrug:

[HCZ_Reborn]

Ah yes, my mistake… read Arteta fans and saw Arsenal fans

Don’t think anyone in their right mind on here would accuse me of being an Arteta fan :lol:

But the point remains the same, I’d rather pay money for potential than high risk for a player who could be the next Nicolas Pepe. Whilst I want us to win the title next season, the imperative for it is to save Arteta’s job (and I don’t give a fuck about that…be glad to see the passive agressive shit booted onto the kerb)

[HCZ_Reborn]

Anyway my ideal summer transfers would look like this


Out: Jorginho, Tierney, Jesus, Trossard, Merino, Vieira, Lokonga, Tavares


In : Zubimendi, Rogers, Mbeumo, Sesko, Adeyemi


When Dowman comes of age I’d make that a 23 man squad

[Chippy]

Anyway my ideal summer transfers would look like this


Out: Jorginho, Tierney, Jesus, Trossard, Merino, Vieira, Lokonga, Tavares


In : Zubimendi, Rogers, Mbeumo, Sesko, Adeyemi


When Dowman comes of age I’d make that a 23 man squad

Yep!
Agree with all of the above except for Merino.

I have also been looking at Dowman, he looks like a good player (you must have seen his performance with Enland under 17's this week)?
Let's hope he is nurtured in the right way.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Merino has zero value as a midfielder and I don’t see the need to keep him as a backup striker

Offer him back to Sociedad to keep the price down for Zubimendi

[HCZ_Reborn]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/c071mlpjxxko

[KSE Comedy Club]

Ah yes, my mistake… read Arteta fans and saw Arsenal fans

Don’t think anyone in their right mind on here would accuse me of being an Arteta fan :lol:

But the point remains the same, I’d rather pay money for potential than high risk for a player who could be the next Nicolas Pepe. Whilst I want us to win the title next season, the imperative for it is to save Arteta’s job (and I don’t give a fuck about that…be glad to see the passive agressive shit booted onto the kerb)

Exactly ;)

[HCZ_Reborn]

Liam Delap likely to go to Chelsea

This is a shame, I think he could have been an excellent squad player for us.

[dazthegooner]

Liam Delaps career :rose:

[HCZ_Reborn]

I’ve no sympathy for anyone who chooses to play for Man City or Chelsea

[dazthegooner]

Seems Chelsea will be trying to buy everyone hopefully will spend themselves into bankruptcy.

Rumor is that we might try and resign Martinez yey or neh?

[Marc Overmars]

It appears that Sesko is our guy. Fabrizio Romano has confirmed that we’ve opened talks with Leipzig.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Good, shame that we probably won’t try and bring in a second striker. But I think Sesko is the right choice

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Fuck Romano.

I think Gyokeres would be better for the here and now.

Think we'll regret it personally.

To be honest, should be both Gyokeres and Sesko.

[Niall_Quinn]

Sounds like Arteta is winning the war and is set to ruin the transfer window. The first real test to see if we could run a coordinated, professional outfit and we've fallen back to Wengerisation. Well, this will cost the club a decade of progress. Arteta will be long gone but the damage will be enduring.

I wish they would just sell Odegard from under his arse and force him to build a team that can seriously compete. But it won't happen. The leech owners are busy with plans to upgrade the stadium and rob more people. Arteta is fantasising about signings who can bump his possession numbers up by 0.043% and the new sporting director doesn't really have that much to do at all, except vainly try to explain to them all what's actually required to get shit done.

Same arseholes.

[Mac76]

Fuck Romano.

I think Gyokeres would be better for the here and now.

Think we'll regret it personally.

To be honest, should be both Gyokeres and Sesko.

Was about to write the same, Arteta's going for an outside-the-box utility player rather than someone like Gyokeres who regularly scores strikers' goals (including in the CL btw not just Portugal)

Plus as you say Sesko's a 'project', not the finished article.

Apart from Timber Arteta's signings have been woeful - Havertz was bought for a position he can't play in and Arteta got lucky he could actually do an ok job upfront instead, same with Merino but with bells on, Cala and Zin are both fails, again particularly in the position he wanted them to play in.

I fear Sesko will be the same, we need a straight up poacher but he'll put Sesko at LW or something and still not have someone where they need to be to score the goals we need

[HCZ_Reborn]

Lot of complaining about this on Twitter as well

One of the few occasions where I’m aligned with Arteta on this, not just because I don’t particularly want us to sign Gyokeres but I actually like what I’ve seen of Sesko as a player.

Also Gyokeres isn’t a goal poacher anyway, in fact Sesko fulfills more of the attributes of the typical no9.

I absolutely would like us to sign more than one striker and treat Jesus as a write off, but even then I think I’d more go for someone who can play along the front three like Mbeumo or Adeyemi.

One of the things I admire about Liverpool is the interchangeable front three model (well not so much now but what they had with Salah, Mane and Firminho) and being able to adopt something like that would be good in my view

[KSE Comedy Club]

Fuck Romano.

I think Gyokeres would be better for the here and now.

Think we'll regret it personally.

To be honest, should be both Gyokeres and Sesko.

Exactly, and now watch Gyokores go to chavs or something and bang in 30 goals this season.

Like I said earlier, when the easiest and most obvious choice is staring us in the face, we will do the opposite, fail and then make excuses.

There was no point bringing Berta in if transfers are going to be overidden for more of Arteta's vanity project players.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Also, there is no evidence to suggest that Sesko is going to become a prolific scorer.
I've got numpties on Reddit saying he has a 'higher ceiling' - why, where is the evidence? He has averaged around 15 goals per season in his career so why does everyone think he's gonna come and score more suddenly?
If it works and he's the next Henry, then yeh he has and it's great.
But if it doesn't and he can only manged 15 goals a season (which is average and not what we need) then we will have wasted money.

If he is more of the same then we will be in the same boat next season.

More of what hasn't worked should not be the basis for our summer transfer plans.

[Marc Overmars]

Newcastle signed Isak off the back of a 10 goal season in Spain. I’m pretty sure had we splashed out back then we would have been scratching our heads and crying about that.

I just think rarely are there guarantees with strikers and their likelihood of becoming prolific. It’s just about taking a chance on someone who could be a good fit and hoping they level up. I’m not fussed really about Sesko or Gyokeres, we’ve put off signing a striker for so long that I don’t care at this point, I see upsides to both so just get it done.

[Niall_Quinn]

Let's just hope the return of Havertz doesn't encourage them to avoid spending at all! I've sat through many Arsenal transfer windows thinking, no WAY would they try to pull that again!

But yeah, it's simple. Arteta will be made up if he can get 2 x Havertz and play his backs-to-goal system with interchangeable Havertz/ Sesko as part of a complex, rotating triangle/ sometimes diamond/ sometimes rectangle with a little bit stuck on the side (or BOLLOCKS system, in layman's terms). Joke is, he's willing to spend more than we'd have to to get a proper striker - so we'll lose out on another signing too.

Arteta's an arrogant fuck. He's just seen his patter-ball get us nowhere near a title and leave us unable to stick the ball in the net against a lame PSG. So try, try again. Meanwhile teams like Vill and Newcastle and even Liverpool have rediscovered an ancient football secret, drawn from times before Peps walked the earth. If you kick the ball towards the opposition goal and run a bit faster - you have more chance of scoring!

[KSE Comedy Club]

Newcastle signed Isak off the back of a 10 goal season in Spain. I’m pretty sure had we splashed out back then we would have been scratching our heads and crying about that.

I just think rarely are there guarantees with strikers and their likelihood of becoming prolific. It’s just about taking a chance on someone who could be a good fit and hoping they level up. I’m not fussed really about Sesko or Gyokeres, we’ve put off signing a striker for so long that I don’t care at this point, I see upsides to both so just get it done.

The difference is Newcastle didn't expect to be winning the league the next season. Their target was top 4 so they recruited accordingly.

We are now in a position where Arteta has next season to win a major trophy or he will lose 50% of the fanbase.
I am in that camp. He needs to stop making excuses and start winning.

We don't have time for more project players.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Let's just hope the return of Havertz doesn't encourage them to avoid spending at all! I've sat through many Arsenal transfer windows thinking, no WAY would they try to pull that again!

But yeah, it's simple. Arteta will be made up if he can get 2 x Havertz and play his backs-to-goal system with interchangeable Havertz/ Sesko as part of a complex, rotating triangle/ sometimes diamond/ sometimes rectangle with a little bit stuck on the side (or BOLLOCKS system, in layman's terms). Joke is, he's willing to spend more than we'd have to to get a proper striker - so we'll lose out on another signing too.

Arteta's an arrogant fuck. He's just seen his patter-ball get us nowhere near a title and leave us unable to stick the ball in the net against a lame PSG. So try, try again. Meanwhile teams like Vill and Newcastle and even Liverpool have rediscovered an ancient football secret, drawn from times before Peps walked the earth. If you kick the ball towards the opposition goal and run a bit faster - you have more chance of scoring!

That's my concern. He wants Sesko so that he can rotate him with Havertz so he can have another like for like sub.
So it will be more of the same with no plan B when we need to change things up and get a result.

That's one area that Arteta has so far failed in - making a difference to positively affect the outcome of a game.

Fucking infuriating tbh.

That's the other thing I keep reading from idiots on Reddit - "Gyokores operates in loads of space, he won't be able to do that agianst teams in the prem when they are plaing low block"

Well, maybe if we try running forward with the ball and attacking instead of slow sieways passing, we would create more space to play in!

[HCZ_Reborn]

Also, there is no evidence to suggest that Sesko is going to become a prolific scorer.
I've got numpties on Reddit saying he has a 'higher ceiling' - why, where is the evidence? He has averaged around 15 goals per season in his career so why does everyone think he's gonna come and score more suddenly?
If it works and he's the next Henry, then yeh he has and it's great.
But if it doesn't and he can only manged 15 goals a season (which is average and not what we need) then we will have wasted money.

If he is more of the same then we will be in the same boat next season.

More of what hasn't worked should not be the basis for our summer transfer plans.

But that principle applies both ways, why assume that Gyokeres is going to be able to get goals in a far superior league.

Gyokeres is good at direct play and on the counter. But Sesko works better in tight spaces, deals well with pressing etc

We aren’t going to change our approach (whether one thinks we should or not is a different discussion) and so Sesko suits the way we want to play better

[KSE Comedy Club]

But that principle applies both ways, why assume that Gyokeres is going to be able to get goals in a far superior league.

Gyokeres is good at direct play and on the counter. But Sesko works better in tight spaces, deals well with pressing etc

We aren’t going to change our approach (whether one thinks we should or not is a different discussion) and so Sesko suits the way we want to play better

Because Gyokores has a track record of scoring lots of goals, Sesko does not.

I don't want us to play the way we do if it's based of this season - it was fucking terrible. Some of the worst football I've seen in years.

[Marc Overmars]

In other news United may have bagged 100m from Saudi for Bruno.

Can they take any of our dead players please?

[HCZ_Reborn]

Because Gyokores has a track record of scoring lots of goals, Sesko does not.

I don't want us to play the way we do if it's based of this season - it was fucking terrible. Some of the worst football I've seen in years.

Again if you’ve got a track record of scoring against teams that would struggle in the championship in England, that’s simply not a guarantee of anything

I don’t think we are suddenly going to become a more direct team or it working even if we tried it. What we need to stop doing is playing two defensive midfielders in most games and sign a creative midfielder as well as a striker

[HCZ_Reborn]

In other news United may have bagged 100m from Saudi for Bruno.

Can they take any of our dead players please?

So United respond to their playing footsie under the table with relegation by selling their best player?

Top strategy

[KSE Comedy Club]

Again if you’ve got a track record of scoring against teams that would struggle in the championship in England, that’s simply not a guarantee of anything

I don’t think we are suddenly going to become a more direct team or it working even if we tried it. What we need to stop doing is playing two defensive midfielders in most games and sign a creative midfielder as well as a striker

But you are assuming these are teams that would struggle against championship level teams. There is no basis in fact for that, its just guessing.

What is a fact is that Gyokores score a lot of goals, Sekso historically, does not.

[KSE Comedy Club]

So United respond to their playing footsie under the table with relegation by selling their best player?

Top strategy

They really are in a complete mess tbh.

[Niall_Quinn]

But that principle applies both ways, why assume that Gyokeres is going to be able to get goals in a far superior league.

Gyokeres is good at direct play and on the counter. But Sesko works better in tight spaces, deals well with pressing etc

We aren’t going to change our approach (whether one thinks we should or not is a different discussion) and so Sesko suits the way we want to play better

I think you are unwittingly making a compelling case for Gyokeres and explaining why Sesko should be nowhere near Arteta. Exactly, Arteta wants the latter so he can persist with his bollocks-ball. If at first, second, third, fourth and fourteenth you don't succeed - keep on doing it! All the evidence of why we need to break out from the rigid, predictable, unwatchable blight he calls football is laid out in a season where City, Utd, Chavs never showed up! And a Liverpool with players like Nunez on the books coasted to a title. So maybe Liverpool did win the easiest title in living memory - but we also picked up the easiest second spot! In a typically competitive league we would have been eaten alive. Or Arteta would have been forced to change. If he gets his way in this transfer window we are super fucked - another season down the drain and then start again in 2027 - around and around. Nearly there, almost there, soon be there, on track, progressing. How many times will the fans have to listen to it? We've done the Wenger thing. Here we go again!

[Niall_Quinn]

In other news United may have bagged 100m from Saudi for Bruno.

Can they take any of our dead players please?

Says everything about the modern footballer.

[KSE Comedy Club]

I think you are unwittingly making a compelling case for Gyokeres and explaining why Sesko should be nowhere near Arteta. Exactly, Arteta wants the latter so he can persist with his bollocks-ball. If at first, second, third, fourth and fourteenth you don't succeed - keep on doing it! All the evidence of why we need to break out from the rigid, predictable, unwatchable blight he calls football is laid out in a season where City, Utd, Chavs never showed up! And a Liverpool with players like Nunez on the books coasted to a title. So maybe Liverpool did win the easiest title in living memory - but we also picked up the easiest second spot! In a typically competitive league we would have been eaten alive. Or Arteta would have been forced to change. If he gets his way in this transfer window we are super fucked - another season down the drain and then start again in 2027 - around and around. Nearly there, almost there, soon be there, on track, progressing. How many times will the fans have to listen to it? We've done the Wenger thing. Here we go again!

Sadly there are fans that think Arteta is doing well and we are 'progressing' which is all that matters.

Where the fuck do we get these losers from?!

[dazthegooner]

Madrid have paid Liverpool £10m for Terrance Trent Darby so he can play in the World Cup championship.

[HCZ_Reborn]

But you are assuming these are teams that would struggle against championship level teams. There is no basis in fact for that, its just guessing.

What is a fact is that Gyokores score a lot of goals, Sekso historically, does not.

You’re reaching I'm afraid

You might as well be saying there’s no way of knowing that I couldn’t beat Usain Bolt in a 100m sprint

If you’re simply refusing to acknowledge that scoring lots of goals is context dependent on who you are scoring against. This becomes utterly pointless. I’m not saying he’s not capable of scoring against better teams, but to treat his signing as a no brainer when it absolutely represents just a big a gamble as Sesko is silly

[KSE Comedy Club]

You’re reaching I'm afraid

You might as well be saying there’s no way of knowing that I couldn’t beat Usain Bolt in a 100m sprint

If you’re simply refusing to acknowledge that scoring lots of goals is context dependent on who you are scoring against. This becomes utterly pointless. I’m not saying he’s not capable of scoring against better teams, but to treat his signing as a no brainer when it absolutely represents just a big a gamble as Sesko is silly

Not really.

One player has scored 50 goals this season, the other player has scored 13 goals.

That is factual, yes?
So it's not reaching to suggest that the player who consistently has scored over 3 times as many goals has a good chance of converting that to an extent, to the PL.

Lets say Gyokores comes here and gets 20 goals - that's ok as he would be playing at a different level.

But there is nothing anywhere, ever recorded to suggest that Sesko will outperform him or get 20 goals too.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Not really.

One player has scored 50 goals this season, the other player has scored 13 goals.

That is factual, yes?
So it's not reaching to suggest that the player who consistently has scored over 3 times as many goals has a good chance of converting that to an extent, to the PL.

Lets say Gyokores comes here and gets 20 goals - that's ok as he would be playing at a different level.

But there is nothing anywhere, ever recorded to suggest that Sesko will outperform him or get 20 goals too.


And what is there to suggest Gyokeres is capable of getting 20 goals in the league? Darwin Nunez a player who has a very similar profile to Gyokeres has managed 25 in three seasons.



You’re talking about one player who has scored many goals in the Portuguese league and one who has scored fewer goals in the Bundesliga (but on average has 27 goals in 64 games). The Bundesliga is much much nearer in quality to the premier league than the Portuguese league is. Sesko like Gyokeres has scored goals in the champions league and at 21 has a scope for potentially exponential improvement.


Sesko is far better equipped to score against in packed defensive areas because like Gyokeres he is strong, but he also has a better first touch. Fact is whatever way we play we are more likely to face tight defensive units that sit back than teams that can be caught on the counter attack

[HCZ_Reborn]

I’ve of course kicked off when we have signed players I don’t think we should have signed. So I’m not telling anyone to wind their neck in.

Plus I wouldn’t have been happy at all had we signed Gyokeres so it’s swings and roundabouts

[HCZ_Reborn]

https://x.com/now_arsenai/status/1928405499554263202?s=46&t=n1tnxEg6k_DvSqUkaQFrjw

[KSE Comedy Club]

And what is there to suggest Gyokeres is capable of getting 20 goals in the league? Darwin Nunez a player who has a very similar profile to Gyokeres has managed 25 in three seasons.



You’re talking about one player who has scored many goals in the Portuguese league and one who has scored fewer goals in the Bundesliga (but on average has 27 goals in 64 games). The Bundesliga is much much nearer in quality to the premier league than the Portuguese league is. Sesko like Gyokeres has scored goals in the champions league and at 21 has a scope for potentially exponential improvement.


Sesko is far better equipped to score against in packed defensive areas because like Gyokeres he is strong, but he also has a better first touch. Fact is whatever way we play we are more likely to face tight defensive units that sit back than teams that can be caught on the counter attack

1. He isn't Darwin Nunez, funny enough, not every player from that league is.

2. Out of 224 games he has 100 goals and 26 assists (all time stats) that's less than a goal a game. Just because he is younger it doesn't mean he will 'exponentially improve' - the stats would suggest otherwise, more that this is as good as he's ever gonna be.
His stats for this season are worse than Havertz' - we need to be improving not going backwards.

3. We don't need anymore raw talent - we need results. Gyokores is more of a natural goal scorer, we need an instinctive striker, not one that might shoot once in 4 games.
How exactly is he going to score when we spend all our time passing the ball around the edge of the box rather than getting in behind?

[KSE Comedy Club]

https://x.com/now_arsenai/status/1928405499554263202?s=46&t=n1tnxEg6k_DvSqUkaQFrjw

Amazing.

I can see the excuses already lined up at the end of next season.
Another project player that might come good or might not.

Bye bye Arteta.

[KSE Comedy Club]

We could get Gyokores and Delap for the same price as Sesko.

Imagine that.

[HCZ_Reborn]

1. He isn't Darwin Nunez, funny enough, not every player from that league is.

2. Out of 224 games he has 100 goals and 26 assists (all time stats) that's less than a goal a game. Just because he is younger it doesn't mean he will 'exponentially improve' - the stats would suggest otherwise, more that this is as good as he's ever gonna be.
His stats for this season are worse than Havertz' - we need to be improving not going backwards.

3. We don't need anymore raw talent - we need results. Gyokores is more of a natural goal scorer, we need an instinctive striker, not one that might shoot once in 4 games.
How exactly is he going to score when we spend all our time passing the ball around the edge of the box rather than getting in behind?


1) I compared him to Darwin Nunez because they have similar attributes


2) A player that is a highly rated youngster and has scored double figures back to back in the Bundesliga, is no more of a risk than a player who is 27 and has not played at any higher level than the Portuguese League. You don’t have to agree, but this insistence that Gyokeres is a dead cert just makes no sense to me

3) Sesko is more of a natural no9 than Gyokeres in terms of attributes, Gyokeres is a player that exploits existing space. Sesko is one that works well in very little space. We have too many players without a great first touch who need the time and space that you don’t get in the premier league.


Let Man United sign Gyokeres….for all the good he will do them

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

We could get Gyokores and Delap for the same price as Sesko.

Imagine that.

There is really only one reason we are choosing Sesko over Gyokeres, and that's due to his age and imagined unfulfilled potential.

Its the same story carried over from the AW days, though at least then, most of the time we weren't paying top dollar for potential, though we always prioritised them in our first team.

What does it say about a manager, if he knows that he came close to achieving all his dreams this season but failed only because he stuck his middle finger out at the world who pointed out to him he needed goals and a striker.

Yet the same man is ready to gamble most of our transfer budget, on a "project" again and not the finished article. Why TF are we saddled with these selfish clowns that can't sacrifice just a bit of their ego to do the "needed" thing at the right time.

Sesko is a great player. Clearly talented and beautiful to watch at full flow. But so is Jesus!! I mean it's clear as day that what we we need is goals/results and not a younger Jesus. Not another Martinelli. Not another Odegaard ..... fucking results and the finished article, simple.

If Arteta took any of us, or should I say "this" seriously, he'd be going for two strikers and nothing less. The same way AW betrayed his principles and splurged for Lacazette and Auba within a year. But it was too late, the damage had been done after years of ignoring the fans and insisting their was no value in winning things any other way but his way and by his principles.

To think we are repeating the same mistake and allowing ourselves to be part of another egotrip, but this time of a Rookie who has won nothing major after 5 years and seizes us by the balls insisting his saga must be written in his own terms.

Imagine, we're going to pay almost double the price Citeh paid for Halaand for "potential" and a goal evey 3 games! Just imagine!

[HCZ_Reborn]

We could get Gyokores and Delap for the same price as Sesko.

Imagine that.

Sure If you’re running with the 93 million figure being bandied around (it’s 67 million)

[HCZ_Reborn]

If Arteta took any of us, or should I say "this" seriously

If Arteta took any of us seriously, I’d have far less respect for him than I already do. None of us (including me) have the slightest inkling of what it takes to coach/manage a football team. We are a bunch of irritable middle aged armchair commentators

However I don’t disagree with you re: two strikers. But to be honest in a modern game which has made strikers almost passe, what I’d like is someone with goalscoring pedigree in this league who can play up front or wide. That’s why I think we should target Mbeumo.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

If Arteta took any of us seriously, I’d have far less respect for him than I already do. None of us (including me) have the slightest inkling of what it takes to coach/manage a football team. We are a bunch of irritable middle aged armchair commentators

However I don’t disagree with you re: two strikers. But to be honest in a modern game which has made strikers almost passe, what I’d like is someone with goalscoring pedigree in this league who can play up front or wide. That’s why I think we should target Mbeumo.

I have agreed with you before on Mbuemo, he's the best choice from the EPL if you are not going to go all crazy and be held to hostage by Newcastle chasing Isak.

Two strikers, is extremely important, and I do think Sesko is a true talent. But in no way do I believe he is a talent worth sacrificing getting immediate results and winning something next season which I believe Gyokores superior experience and ability to actually play in the box and be relentless with that will achieve.

Their is something on Youtube where they do comparisons of players by looking at their last 40 shots/headers.Sesko scores the better goals and has that Laca kind of shot power....but Gyokeres is varied and always almost gets into the box.

Experience counts and this is something me and you have always disagreed about.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I have agreed with you before on Mbuemo, he's the best choice from the EPL if you are not going to go all crazy and be held to hostage by Newcastle chasing Isak.

Two strikers, is extremely important, and I do think Sesko is a true talent. But in no way do I believe he is a talent worth sacrificing getting immediate results and winning something next season which I believe Gyokores superior experience and ability to actually play in the box and be relentless with that will achieve.

Their is something on Youtube where they do comparisons of players by looking at their last 40 shots/headers.Sesko scores the better goals and has that Laca kind of shot power....but Gyokeres is varied and always almost gets into the box.

Experience counts and this is something me and you have always disagreed about.

Oh I don’t necessarily disagree with you about experience, in that I don’t dismiss its value. But as I keep saying to the other guy. I think half the problem is Gyokeres is incredibly inexperienced at top level football for his age given the level of football he’s been playing in

What I think you’re getting at is that I’m wary of signing any player over the age of 25 for big money. And I’d absolutely stick by that. I think older players are more sticking plaster solutions


Trossard and Jorginho were good signings (although I wasn’t happy with us signing Trossard at the time) because they were relatively inexpensive and yes had experience and ultimately you don’t envisage them being at the club for more than a few years. But if you’re talking about building a dynasty rather than just instant mash success which in many ways makes it if anything harder to replicate that success, you want younger players that you can mould.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

BTW, Henry thinks we should go for Julian Alvarez, and TBH his last 40 (or was it 80 shots) video I saw was quite remarkable. Happy to see Pep proved wrong again by one of his former players, even if he got the last laugh with us with the Jesus and Zinchenko deal

[HCZ_Reborn]

BTW, Henry thinks we should go for Julian Alvarez, and TBH his last 40 (or was it 80 shots) video I saw was quite remarkable. Happy to see Pep proved wrong again by one of his former players, even if he got the last laugh with us with the Jesus and Zinchenko deal

I wouldn’t mind Alvarez additional to Sesko

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Oh I don’t necessarily disagree with you about experience, in that I don’t dismiss its value. But as I keep saying to the other guy. I think half the problem is Gyokeres is incredibly inexperienced at top level football for his age given the level of football he’s been playing in

What I think you’re getting at is that I’m wary of signing any player over the age of 25 for big money. And I’d absolutely stick by that. I think older players are more sticking plaster solutions


Trossard and Jorginho were good signings (although I wasn’t happy with us signing Trossard at the time) because they were relatively inexpensive and yes had experience and ultimately you don’t envisage them being at the club for more than a few years. But if you’re talking about building a dynasty rather than just instant mash success which in many ways makes it if anything harder to replicate that success, you want younger players that you can mould.

Well fair enough. Having reservations paying big money for players over 25 does make sense, however you cannot deny their are a lot of late bloomers who turn out to be exceptional.. and TBH most of the best strikers in the world have usually fallen in that category, especially if we go far back.

I personally think we have a track record of always chasing potential and usually getting it wrong. So I struggle to see why we are not learning from this especially as paying top dollar for proven experience like Partey and Rice recently have been shown to be good business.

[Niall_Quinn]

You’re reaching I'm afraid

You might as well be saying there’s no way of knowing that I couldn’t beat Usain Bolt in a 100m sprint

If you’re simply refusing to acknowledge that scoring lots of goals is context dependent on who you are scoring against. This becomes utterly pointless. I’m not saying he’s not capable of scoring against better teams, but to treat his signing as a no brainer when it absolutely represents just a big a gamble as Sesko is silly

How does having a striker who will get in the box and belt home those sitters the rest of them are missing be a gamble? And if we go on the track record established so far, we have STERLING as exhibit A. Who the fuck was responsible for that and why would they ever be let near a transfer window again? And how have Cala or Merino actually progressed anything other than fill gaps? Arteta actually rates these players - because they are cogs of the type he prefers in his monotonously remorseless machine. Zubi's not coming here to open up the play and the flanks and facilitate high speed transition through the centre - he's coming here because he can achieve a 97.82% pass success sideways over 3 yards - can you imagine him and Odegard in the same team? Just shoot me now. We have Saka, Martinelli, Ethan, players who could do so much more than they are given license. We could use Zubi in so many creative and effective ways, deploy a proper striker in so many dangerous way, but we won't. So it's true in some respects, Gyokeres, Sesko, Vardy? Might not actually matter because Arteta will have them pottering around the edge of the box shuffling it sideways and trying to master then 74 pass sequence that end up with Raya walking it into the net.

[Niall_Quinn]

And what is there to suggest Gyokeres is capable of getting 20 goals in the league? Darwin Nunez a player who has a very similar profile to Gyokeres has managed 25 in three seasons.



You’re talking about one player who has scored many goals in the Portuguese league and one who has scored fewer goals in the Bundesliga (but on average has 27 goals in 64 games). The Bundesliga is much much nearer in quality to the premier league than the Portuguese league is. Sesko like Gyokeres has scored goals in the champions league and at 21 has a scope for potentially exponential improvement.


Sesko is far better equipped to score against in packed defensive areas because like Gyokeres he is strong, but he also has a better first touch. Fact is whatever way we play we are more likely to face tight defensive units that sit back than teams that can be caught on the counter attack

Yeah, and the goals for Sweden too - so he seems to do okay regardless of the level. Might be worth a punt seeing as we have Sterling or Merino as the alternative, oh and yes, the prolific Jesus and the lethal Havertz. Just a proper, direct, hit the ground running striker who can bang in all those goals we avoided scoring this season. If we're also doing some come-good-in-2 -years project thing then great - but not as an alternative! In addition! We can't afford to wait another season - and hopefully neither can Arteta. If he's got any sense he'll do the glaringly sensible thing and get a proper 9. Oh look - there's one available who wants to come! All that remains is to watch how we fuck it up.

[Niall_Quinn]

https://x.com/now_arsenai/status/1928405499554263202?s=46&t=n1tnxEg6k_DvSqUkaQFrjw

Yeah, don't believe that for 1 second. I'd be more inclined to believe Berta is scratching his head asking, what the fuck have I got into here?

[HCZ_Reborn]

Yeah, don't believe that for 1 second. I'd be more inclined to believe Berta is scratching his head asking, what the fuck have I got into here?

You’ll be surprised to learn I couldn’t give a flying fuck what you happen to believe

[Niall_Quinn]

There is really only one reason we are choosing Sesko over Gyokeres, and that's due to his age and imagined unfulfilled potential.

Its the same story carried over from the AW days, though at least then, most of the time we weren't paying top dollar for potential, though we always prioritised them in our first team.

What does it say about a manager, if he knows that he came close to achieving all his dreams this season but failed only because he stuck his middle finger out at the world who pointed out to him he needed goals and a striker.

Yet the same man is ready to gamble most of our transfer budget, on a "project" again and not the finished article. Why TF are we saddled with these selfish clowns that can't sacrifice just a bit of their ego to do the "needed" thing at the right time.

Sesko is a great player. Clearly talented and beautiful to watch at full flow. But so is Jesus!! I mean it's clear as day that what we we need is goals/results and not a younger Jesus. Not another Martinelli. Not another Odegaard ..... fucking results and the finished article, simple.

If Arteta took any of us, or should I say "this" seriously, he'd be going for two strikers and nothing less. The same way AW betrayed his principles and splurged for Lacazette and Auba within a year. But it was too late, the damage had been done after years of ignoring the fans and insisting their was no value in winning things any other way but his way and by his principles.

To think we are repeating the same mistake and allowing ourselves to be part of another egotrip, but this time of a Rookie who has won nothing major after 5 years and seizes us by the balls insisting his saga must be written in his own terms.

Imagine, we're going to pay almost double the price Citeh paid for Halaand for "potential" and a goal evey 3 games! Just imagine!

Don't forget the all-important sell-on fee - suddenly Arsenal is bothered by that, despite all those years of achieving around £9.50 combined sell-ons. NOW is the time to worry about that, when we have Merino in the 9 shirt. Of course Sesko might arrive and set the place on fire, or he might arrive and nobody notices for months or years, most likely something in-between. But we'll be condemned to having to watch Arteta ball through all of it, tearing our hair out watching Saka fizzing it across the opposition goal line with Raya being the closest to getting on the end of it. The sheer arrogance of not signing a striker in the last 2 windows, and now they are STILL fucking around? We're fucking around like Madrid - they didn't need Mbappe but they let an arrogant dick sign him up anyway and he ended up fucking the whole team. We desperately need a proper striker, have done since Auba left, not some vanity project. The guy we brought in to identify that striker has found him and can get him, but the arrogant bloke who wasted two windows and two potential titles waiting for his personal preference is now going to finally get his way to the detriment of everything and everyone again.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

The guy we brought in to identify that striker has found him and can get him, but the arrogant bloke who wasted two windows and two potential titles waiting for his personal preference is now going to finally get his way to the detriment of everything and everyone again.

:gp:

[Niall_Quinn]

You’ll be surprised to learn I couldn’t give a flying fuck what you happen to believe

Not in the least. What's surprising is you are posting up love stories coming out of Arsenal.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Not in the least. What's surprising is you are posting up love stories coming out of Arsenal.

Yes because it’s totally unbelievable to think that Sesko the player we’ve been after for over a year was always our first target, that Gyokeres was a backup option which was the case before Berta came to the club, and that somehow this got manufactured into a battle of wills into the coach wanting one player and the director of football wanting the other. And of course you don’t believe it because it’s not in keeping with the narrative of your choosing.

I have concerns that Berta could be used as a yes man by someone who wants too much control over things at the club, and that this is why I’ve stated that we should never have allowed Arteta to grab the manager role when we appointed him as head coach.

But Sesko is clearly highly rated player so to dismiss that they thought he was the better option as a lie, is more you saying you don’t want to believe it. Which happens to be your attitude with a lot of things

[KSE Comedy Club]

Yes because it’s totally unbelievable to think that Sesko the player we’ve been after for over a year was always our first target, that Gyokeres was a backup option which was the case before Berta came to the club, and that somehow this got manufactured into a battle of wills into the coach wanting one player and the director of football wanting the other. And of course you don’t believe it because it’s not in keeping with the narrative of your choosing.

I have concerns that Berta could be used as a yes man by someone who wants too much control over things at the club, and that this is why I’ve stated that we should never have allowed Arteta to grab the manager role when we appointed him as head coach.

But Sesko is clearly highly rated player so to dismiss that they thought he was the better option as a lie, is more you saying you don’t want to believe it. Which happens to be your attitude with a lot of things

Sesko is highly rated - by whom?

Arteta, yes but outside of that most of the comments I've been hearing today is that he is actually bang average in the bundesliga and most of his games he doesn't do anything of note.

[Niall_Quinn]

Yes because it’s totally unbelievable to think that Sesko the player we’ve been after for over a year was always our first target, that Gyokeres was a backup option which was the case before Berta came to the club, and that somehow this got manufactured into a battle of wills into the coach wanting one player and the director of football wanting the other. And of course you don’t believe it because it’s not in keeping with the narrative of your choosing.

I have concerns that Berta could be used as a yes man by someone who wants too much control over things at the club, and that this is why I’ve stated that we should never have allowed Arteta to grab the manager role when we appointed him as head coach.

But Sesko is clearly highly rated player so to dismiss that they thought he was the better option as a lie, is more you saying you don’t want to believe it. Which happens to be your attitude with a lot of things

Yeah so I didn't say it was a lie, I said I didn't believe it. Gyokeres had fallen off the radar well before Berta arrived and then, suddenly, it was back on. Going on the rumour mill and press reports, of course, so true, false, whatever, all you can really do is watch who's talking about what and how frequently. Nobody disputes Arteta has been after Sesko either. But if we judge on who has been reporting what and how frequently, the Gyokeres interest sparked again when Berta arrived. And why shouldn't it have done so? That's what he was brought in to do surely? So either all the reports he wanted Gyokeres are false - could be - or the reports he's on the same page as Arteta are false. OR he's just not very good at his job, but once he sat down with the geniuses who bagged Sterling, he can suddenly see the light. Can't say which it is for sure, but I can take a stab at which is more likely.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

I think it's unfair to cite Gyokores won't succeed because Nunez didn't.

Darwin Nine is one of the dumbest footballers I've ever seen, absolute chaos and so off the cuff it's untrue.

Gyokores clearly is not that and is absolutely ruthless in his pursuit of goals. I think when it comes to a point of scoring 50+ goals in a season, the league you play in becomes less of a concern to me. There are some Champions League goals in there of course too.

No doubt in my kind Sesko signing would be so Arteta can continue playing Haverz there. Far more palatable for him to be on the bench at 21 then Gyokores. Obviously he wouldn't come for that.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I think it's unfair to cite Gyokores won't succeed because Nunez didn't.

Darwin Nine is one of the dumbest footballers I've ever seen, absolute chaos and so off the cuff it's untrue.

Gyokores clearly is not that and is absolutely ruthless in his pursuit of goals. I think when it comes to a point of scoring 50+ goals in a season, the league you play in becomes less of a concern to me. There are some Champions League goals in there of course too.

No doubt in my kind Sesko signing would be so Arteta can continue playing Haverz there. Far more palatable for him to be on the bench at 21 then Gyokores. Obviously he wouldn't come for that.

It would be unfair if someone had said that.

[Niall_Quinn]

I think it's unfair to cite Gyokores won't succeed because Nunez didn't.

Darwin Nine is one of the dumbest footballers I've ever seen, absolute chaos and so off the cuff it's untrue.

Gyokores clearly is not that and is absolutely ruthless in his pursuit of goals. I think when it comes to a point of scoring 50+ goals in a season, the league you play in becomes less of a concern to me. There are some Champions League goals in there of course too.

No doubt in my kind Sesko signing would be so Arteta can continue playing Haverz there. Far more palatable for him to be on the bench at 21 then Gyokores. Obviously he wouldn't come for that.

That's almost certainly one of the reasons, and my main fear. Sesko will be Havertz MKII - using his height with back to goal to distribute back to the middle. In other words, Arteta won't even have to tweak the system, let alone change it.

[Marc Overmars]

Liverpool have signed Jeremie Frimpong. Wirtz deal looking likely too.

Quite a start to the summer for them.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Darwin Nine. :lol:

Not what I mean to say but well, it works.

[Niall_Quinn]

Liverpool have signed Jeremie Frimpong. Wirtz deal looking likely too.

Quite a start to the summer for them.

We'll be here is six weeks waiting for the first deal to get over the line. Any day now. Have we even done the Zubi deal yet? I thought that was in the bag, just needed the papers signed?

[Mac76]

In other news United may have bagged 100m from Saudi for Bruno.

Can they take any of our dead players please?

If they sell Bruno and Garnacho they're going down, unless they recruit really well - amd given it's Man Ure that's very unlikely so it looks like its :wave: this season

[Niall_Quinn]

If they sell Bruno and Garnacho they're going down, unless they recruit really well - amd given it's Man Ure that's very unlikely so it looks like its :wave: this season

They'll never go down, refs wouldn't allow it. But it might be funny to see what outrageous shit they could pull to stay up - like changing the kick-off time to 2 hours earlier and forgetting to tell the opposition.

[Chippy]

We'll be here is six weeks waiting for the first deal to get over the line. Any day now. Have we even done the Zubi deal yet? I thought that was in the bag, just needed the papers signed?

I kind of agree but hope you are wrong. I reckon the Zubi deal could be done within a week or two and Sesko straight after. We will then need to get rid of the dead wood.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Sky is reporting a minimum of £75m for Sesko with considerable add ons.... makes little sense to me when we could try getting Isak for just a bit more.

Also the folly of going for an overpriced Sesko so early means as usual, we've inflated the market for any striker (actually any player) we go for, especially if we can't seal the deal.

People will smell the desperation mixed with cash on us a mile away. But TBF the former was magnified and made crystal clear by Arteta who allowed us to have the season we just had, so can't blame Sesko for that.

I wish we could just go for Mbeumo and move on. We got a lot more areas we'd need to strengthen in the attack especially if the likes of Wirtz and co are coming to our rivals.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Sky is reporting a minimum of £75m for Sesko with considerable add ons.... makes little sense to me when we could try getting Isak for just a bit more.

Also the folly of going for an overpriced Sesko so early means as usual, we've inflated the market for any striker (actually any player) we go for, especially if we can't seal the deal.

People will smell the desperation mixed with cash on us a mile away. But TBF the former was magnified and made crystal clear by Arteta who allowed us to have the season we just had, so can't blame Sesko for that.

I wish we could just go for Mbeumo and move on. We got a lot more areas we'd need to strengthen in the attack especially if the likes of Wirtz and co are coming to our rivals.

You think Newcastle who are in the champions league are going to sell us Isaak for 75 million??

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

You think Newcastle who are in the champions league are going to sell us Isaak for 75 million??

It would be crazy if someone had said that (see what I did ;) )

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

An update is that apparently RB want this deal concluded within a week, as they want to be able to plan their purchases properly for this summer. Seeing as they usually full their squad with loads of young unknown talent, I think theirs legs to this.

This should also help us in negotiating, that's if we had people good at their jobs..... but that's another debate I'm not interested in having with HCZ again.

I personally hope we act out our usual script where we dither and they basically state it's too late and they can't sell.

Which means their is a bright side to everything eventually ;)

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Leipzig to take Gyokeres. :lol:

[HCZ_Reborn]

It would be crazy if someone had said that (see what I did ;) )

Well a little bit more you said. A little bit more in that case would be an extra 50 million minimum

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Leipzig to take Gyokeres. :lol:

Do you know you almost gave me a heart attack :threaten: ....I actually googled the news, though with our luck this could still end up being true.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I think he will go to United, though would have found it hilarious if he had gone to Leipzig

[Niall_Quinn]

So it looks like Zubimendi, Sesko and a winger (Nico bloody Williams being mentioned). This is just bad news across the board and makes it all but certain Arteta will be sticking with the system that has yielded nothing to date (and is in fact taking us backwards).

Zubimendi (not that I want him here but it's a done deal apparently), then Gyokeres and Gordon makes total sense - with Arteta changing the system so we play proper football. We have the squad to do it.

[Mac76]

If Gyokeres comes to another team in the PL i'm betting a handsome sum at the bookies that he outscores Sesko if that's who we go for, a) because he's a better striker and b) because Arteta, as NQ, KSE and others point out, Arteta is wedded to a failed system

[HCZ_Reborn]

Fair enough, I disagree that Gyokeres is a better striker. I think the difference is the respective levels both are playing at

As for the system. I think we are often at danger of over complicating things. If we want quicker more efficient football, we simply don’t play two defensive midfielders in every game. Fruitless sideways passing is a consequence of teams getting back into position rather than a feature of how we intend to play. I think we want to sign more players who have a good first touch and do well against the press. Sesko is one such player