Summer Transfers 2025 Missed Opportunities and Regrets

[KSE Comedy Club]

This is what I've been trying to say...

Using Net spend is inaccurate though.

It's like getting a extension with a new Kitchen on your home - you will spend (let's say) 60,000 on it.
But you plan to sell your old Kitchen to offset some of the cost.

Now, that sell on value could be 5,000 / 10,000 / 15,000 - great.

But if someone asked you how much it cost as they want to do the same the answer is - 60,000.
You cannot tell them it's only 45,000 as that would be misleading.

What you recoup is not a set figure and can only be known after you have sold your assets for what someone is willing to pay.

The amount you spent to get the finished job done is 60,000

The amount Arteta has spent to build this squad is nearly a billion pounds.


This is a real figure and factual as already posted. Notice it doesn't have a side note that says this amount is less if you go buy net spend

https://tmssl.akamaized.net//images/foto/newsansicht/biggest-spender-2-1755165040-174803.png?lm=1755165048

[HCZ_Reborn]

Just wait a few games, that's where the evolution is going to.

Meh if it works and we aren’t just making pointless short sideways passing in front of a team with everyone behind the ball

I haven’t found our football that entertaining for the most part for a long time, whilst entertainment is good…effective is better

[IBK]

Using Net spend is inaccurate though.

It's like getting a extension with a new Kitchen on your home - you will spend (let's say) 60,000 on it.
But you plan to sell your old Kitchen to offset some of the cost.

Now, that sell on value could be 5,000 / 10,000 / 15,000 - great.

But if someone asked you how much it cost as they want to do the same the answer is - 60,000.
You cannot tell them it's only 45,000 as that would be misleading.

What you recoup is not a set figure and can only be known after you have sold your assets for what someone is willing to pay.

The amount you spent to get the finished job done is 60,000

The amount Arteta has spent to build this squad is nearly a billion pounds.


This is a real figure and factual as already posted. Notice it doesn't have a side note that says this amount is less if you go buy net spend

https://tmssl.akamaized.net//images/foto/newsansicht/biggest-spender-2-1755165040-174803.png?lm=1755165048

But this ignores 2 crucial factors. First (as I have said before) if you are going to cite actual (non-net) spend (as many are doing criticise Arteta's performance on this basis), then you need to compare apples with apples. On non-net spend since our manager arrived, we are only 4th in the table and almost equal to 5th (Spurs) so he has out performed on this basis. I think its also fair to mention that Liverpool are 6th but have been a much better run, and established team than Arsenal during this period.


Second, net spend is a far more accurate indicator of funds available to managers, because transfer income both affects ability to comply with PSR, and directly generates transfer funds. We lie 3rd in the net spend table for the past 5 years.


Next, it's pretty ludicrous to point to Arteta's net spend since he joined the club without accepting that we have had a far bigger gap to make up than the managers you are comparing him to - and specifically Citeh; Liverpool and Chelsea. This comparison (and criticism) implies that there has been a level starting point. There hasn't. We were in a shambles when Arteta joined us - and more pertinently had ageing players on the way down and a squad full of difficult or impossible to sell players on high wages. To use your example - our competitors had bespoke kitchens in mansions that required freshening up. While we had a 15 year old kitchen in a red brick house. Of course we needed to spend a lot more to join the dinner party set.


Noone is denying that our traditional failure to sell players has been a problem for Arsenal. We would be in much better shape had we been in a position to improve transfer income, and if this was the case then your £1bn figure would be much lower. But Arteta can neither be blamed for this, nor was it his job to turn around the club's business model. Hi brief was to take us from mid table - and years of under performance given the size of the club - to being competitors for major trophies. We have made solid progress during his time at the club. If people want to point to last season as an underperformance/disappointment then fine - but this does not change the overall picture.


I have said that I have concerns that the manager might not have what it takes to make the final step to major silverware. But anyone who denies that Arteta has done very well in taking us back to a place at the top table - and wants to use a deceptive headline figure to detract from what he has achieved is IMO mistaken.

[Chippy]

Tbf he shouldn't be played on the LW - this was an issue at Chelsea as he was terrible there - but Arteta seems to be clueless to that fact.

Sooooo, the Rookie bought a player from Chelsea that played terribly on the left wing for £50m in order to play him on the left wing at Arsenal?

Can anyone see the problem here? :rolleyes:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Sooooo, the Rookie bought a player from Chelsea that played terribly on the left wing for £50m in order to play him on the left wing at Arsenal?

Can anyone see the problem here? :rolleyes:

Yes indeed. I think we can all see the problem - except for Arteta

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Irrelevant. It doesn't matter who bought which players. The point is if you spend a billion on players and recoup nothing then you should be a billion pounds of talent better off. If you spend a billion and recoup 350m then you're only 650m better off. That's all a bit simplistic of course but the players who go out are completely relevant.


Also irrelevant for the same reason as above. It doesn't matter which manager bought or sold which player - actually these days is it even the manager who does that? The point is the club's net spend is a better metric of how much "better" you would expect a squad to be.

Like HCZ, I don't know what you're talking about with the route one football. That isn't what we play. Pretty much everyone on here laments how we fanny around at the back and move the ball forward far too slowly.

It's totally fair to judge where we are by how much we've spent, although I continue to believe net spend is the more relevant metric. And our wage bill is another. I think it's fair to argue that the ROI hasn't been that good. 1 FA Cup in 5 years isn't a great return. Although that's a little simplistic, we've had two serious title challenges. One was unexpected, the other we pushed City to the last day. Last year was disappointing, to say the least. The CL run was pretty good, the league form was patchy at best. I feel cautiously optimistic for this season. We were certianly poor on Sunday but we got the result. Obviously far too early to make any sensible comment about the season that has just started.
For me Arteta absolutely has to deliver a big trophy this season to survive.

Letters, your argument (especially the part in bold) isn't genuine and you know it.

In one sentence you are asking us to judge him on his effort in bringing in and selling players (the theory behind net spend), and when it is pointed out to you that practically all the players he has sold that have value weren't recruited by him, you say it's irrelevant , despite the fact that it has also been shown that the players recruited and sold by him have little or no value. Be honest, if this business was your family heirloom and he was your staff, how would you rate him on that?

Also, we are both old enough to know that net spend became a buzzword because of AW, with the way he consistently brought unknowns into our team, created value and sold them off for quite profitable amounts. It was never considered a big thing in England till he came and practically invented the model.

No one was rating him for selling Graham's or Riochs players, it was his direct effort with his recruitment that showed a club could be self sustaining on transfers if they knew what they were doing and trusted their manager. Is there anything in this model that Arteta scores highly on or has followed properly? What do you think AW would say if he had to rate him? Why is everyone in agreement about Arteta needing to deliver now if he has done such a great job on netspend?

But if if you insist that we should judge him on this padded figure why are you only highlighting what Chelesa and United have done? Why not comment on the fact that the two clubs that have won the league (on multiple occasions since he arrived) have spent considerably less than us? Even the two above us, have better trophies. Chelsea's won a CL and two WC titles, while United have an FA cup and LC...so what exactly are we arguing on? That out of the 6 top net spenders Arteta has provided the least value when it comes to silverware? Oh and please, I hope we are not going to consider imaginary 2nd place trophies again, I want to believe we've greyed out and moved beyond that.

As for the style of football, my point was that we are retrogressing back to days of Graham slowly, something we thought we had moved past thanks to AW.

No top club in Europe is winning trophies by playing route one football, but if you guys think it's ok to spend a 1billion on a squad to take us back to the past, where extreme physicality and "kick and run" tactics are the only way we score, then so be it.

[KSE Comedy Club]

But this ignores 2 crucial factors. First (as I have said before) if you are going to cite actual (non-net) spend (as many are doing criticise Arteta's performance on this basis), then you need to compare apples with apples. On non-net spend since our manager arrived, we are only 4th in the table and almost equal to 5th (Spurs) so he has out performed on this basis. I think its also fair to mention that Liverpool are 6th but have been a much better run, and established team than Arsenal during this period.

Ok that's fair enough, but I don't care what other teams have spent tbh :shrug:


Second, net spend is a far more accurate indicator of funds available to managers, because transfer income both affects ability to comply with PSR, and directly generates transfer funds. We lie 3rd in the net spend table for the past 5 years.

That's half true. Every club has a transfer pool of money that they can use without selling. Otherwise no one could do any business without selling players for fixed fees first to be able to generate their transfer funds.


Next, it's pretty ludicrous to point to Arteta's net spend since he joined the club without accepting that we have had a far bigger gap to make up than the managers you are comparing him to - and specifically Citeh; Liverpool and Chelsea. This comparison (and criticism) implies that there has been a level starting point. There hasn't. We were in a shambles when Arteta joined us - and more pertinently had ageing players on the way down and a squad full of difficult or impossible to sell players on high wages. To use your example - our competitors had bespoke kitchens in mansions that required freshening up. While we had a 15 year old kitchen in a red brick house. Of course we needed to spend a lot more to join the dinner party set.

I didn't point to net spend, Letters did. I don't use that as marker because it's for financial analysts & accountants. It's also completely variable as I have already explained.
Our competitors Kitchens are not the point and whataboutism.


Noone is denying that our traditional failure to sell players has been a problem for Arsenal. We would be in much better shape had we been in a position to improve transfer income, and if this was the case then your £1bn figure would be much lower. But Arteta can neither be blamed for this, nor was it his job to turn around the club's business model. Hi brief was to take us from mid table - and years of under performance given the size of the club - to being competitors for major trophies. We have made solid progress during his time at the club. If people want to point to last season as an underperformance/disappointment then fine - but this does not change the overall picture.

True, I agree with you.


I have said that I have concerns that the manager might not have what it takes to make the final step to major silverware. But anyone who denies that Arteta has done very well in taking us back to a place at the top table - and wants to use a deceptive headline figure to detract from what he has achieved is IMO mistaken

No issue with this either, I agree with what you are saying here - but again this isn't what sparked this initial debate.

It was that after all the money we have spent, we are still 1-2 players short :shrug:

[Mac76]

I'm seeing reports that we're giving up on Eze with only Spuds really going for him.

Ofc if he's really a childhood gooner he shouldn't even contemplate gping to Spuds but we should just pay what it takes to stop it IMO, if the Kroenkes got what Arsenal is they'd do it and not give a f*** about the money

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Meh if it works and we aren’t just making pointless short sideways passing in front of a team with everyone behind the ball

I haven’t found our football that entertaining for the most part for a long time, whilst entertainment is good…effective is better

Trust me, you'd change tune after a while....but anyway like I said, once we get into a proper barren spell, we'll see it live.

He's obviously been planning for it for a while, which is why he insists on buying physically imposing attackers no matter what their skill level.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

.

No issue with this either, I agree with what you are saying here - but again this isn't what sparked this initial debate.

It was that after all the money we have spent, we are still 1-2 players short :shrug:
:gp:
I really wish people would stick to the points and recognise the patterns.

[KSE Comedy Club]

The point is if you spend a billion on players and recoup nothing then you should be a billion pounds of talent better off. If you spend a billion and recoup 350m then you're only 650m better off.

I'm sorry - but What????

If you send a billion pound on talent then yes you should be a billion pound better off. End of.
What you sell to recoup has nothing to do with the squad you have bought, what it is worth or how talented it is.

If I buy a car for £100,000 - then I expect to have a car that comes with everything to make it worth that amount.
It doesn't make it only worth £60,000 if I sell my old car for £40,000 :doh:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Fair comments


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZT-sWdWWzc

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Fair comments


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZT-sWdWWzc

I agree that most of those players could have an important part to play this season if we gave them chances, especially Nelson and maybe even Kiwior.

But Lokonga, nahhhhh, please do whatever to get that kid off our books.

[HCZ_Reborn]

How much money the club has spent net or gross is for the club to worry about.

It’s where that money has been spent that concerns me. The foundations of a good team is its back line but too often that’s been over enforced and the attacking aspect of the team gets neglected, I imagine even with Madueke and Gyokeres the overall money we spend on goal creators and goal scorers is dwarfed by other teams

I personally couldn’t give a toss about Eze, he’s a player that would be nice to have rather than must have. It would be good to have a versatile player that can play centrally as well as on the wing but Eze himself is ok…and if we think he individually is going to raise the level around us, then we are already fucked before we’ve begun.


I think because we as a club have shown preference for clearing the wage bill over getting in transfer fees, the expectation amongst buying clubs is that they can get our players for cheap (where as Chelsea need to present the myth that they are complying with PSR/FFP…so their consideration is more about bringing in transfer fees)

The problem with our approach is that there does come a point where we need to actually make some money on transfers to allow us to spend what we feel we need to, to strengthen the squad.

That said I don’t agree with the idea that if you spend a billion on players and you get back 350 million that means you’ve got only 650 million worth of quality. The players we’ve sold have been considered to be surplus to requirement (although equally you also do have to factor in that some of the money we’ve got back comes from players we’ve spent a billion gross on to begin with)

[Letters]

In one sentence you are asking us to judge him on his effort in bringing in and selling players (the theory behind net spend), and when it is pointed out to you that practically all the players he has sold that have value weren't recruited by him, you say it's irrelevant
What I am saying is net spend is more relevant in terms of how much improvement we should expect to see in the squad.

I don't think your kitchen analogy really works but OK, let's go with that. Three scenarios:
- You buy a new kitchen for £30k, but your old one was worth £60k - in that situation you spent £30k but your kitchen is probably actually worse than before. I guess the football equivalent of that would be a club in financial trouble who has to downgrade the squad to keep their heads above water financially or comply with the financial regulations.
- You buy a new kitchen for £30k, but your old one was only worth £15k. In that case I'd now expect you to have a better kitchen or, in football terms, a better player. That should improve the squad.
- You buy a new kitchen for £30k, your old one was only worth £15k and you keep it. Now you have two kitchens. If something in one breaks - I guess that would be analogous to an injury - then you have another one you can use. Maybe not as good as the new one but good enough, better than having to use a camping stove.

In all 3 scenarios you have spent £30k - by your metric those 3 scenarios are equivalent. But the net spend is different in all 3 scenarios and the result is very different. The first one is a downgrade in quality, the second is an upgrade. The 3rd is too and you're adding squad depth. That's why net spend is the more important metric.

And one relevant thing is were you the best restaurant in town before the work on the kitchen? If you were then in the first scenario you might not be any more. In the second you should be even better and in the third you would too and you've mitigated against having to give a reduced service if something in the kitchen breaks.


Be honest, if this business was your family heirloom and he was your staff, how would you rate him on that?

I've already said that I think the ROI has been pretty poor under Arteta. 1 trophy in 5 years given the spend isn't great.
That said, he took over a side who finished 5th the season before he arrived and we had a very patchy start to the season which saw Emery sacked and him appointed. We were in 10th when he took over with a league record of P17 W5 D7 L5.
We were not the best restaurant in town.
From there he took us to the brink of a title. One could argue that "brink" isn't good enough, and that is a reasonable argument. But it's not like there's been no progress under him. I'd say last season was the real disappointment. Before that - the title challenge 2 years ago was unexpected. We ran out of steam and got mown down by the City machine but we're not the first side to have that happen to them. The following season we pushed City all the way. People point to the Villa game but I don't think you can really ask much more than P18 W16 D1 L1 in the second half of the season. We pushed City to the last day. But last season...City finally dropped off, it felt like the title was there for the taking. It's massively frustrating to have lost out to Liverpool. Yes, we had injuries but we also didn't do the right things in the transfer market last summer. If people want Arteta out on the basis of that season then I have some sympathy for that. Personally I'd give him this season but he has to deliver.


Also, we are both old enough to know that net spend became a buzzword because of AW
I don't know if that's true, but if it is then it's like saying that good diet and nutrition only became a thing because of AW. That might be true but he was right about nutrition and he's right about net spend for the reasons I've explained.


Why is everyone in agreement about Arteta needing to deliver now if he has done such a great job on netspend?
I don't think he's done a great job on net spend. Ours is still in the top 3 under Arteta. I've agreed that the ROI hasn't been good enough.
My only point in this exchange is that it is a more reasonable metric.


But if if you insist that we should judge him on this padded figure why are you only highlighting what Chelesa and United have done? Why not comment on the fact that the two clubs that have won the league (on multiple occasions since he arrived) have spent considerably less than us?
Again, this comes back to whether you start off as the best restaurant in town. City had already spent the money to make them champions over and over before Arteta arrived. The fact they don't need to spend as much to maintain that level is not relevant. Liverpool are probably a better example but I am not arguing that Arteta has done a wonderful job.


As for the style of football, my point was that we are retrogressing back to days of Graham slowly
Maybe in the sense of 1-0 to the Arsenal, but the style of play is nothing like Graham's route one. Did you not see the game on Sunday where we endlessly passed it round at the back? I actually thought the occasions we did break we did so with decent pace - that felt like an improvement on last season. But the final ball was non-existent or poorly played. It wasn't anything like the Seaman booting it upfield to be flicked on for Smith or Wright to get on to we used to play under Graham.

[IBK]

Ok that's fair enough, but I don't care what other teams have spent tbh :shrug:



That's half true. Every club has a transfer pool of money that they can use without selling. Otherwise no one could do any business without selling players for fixed fees first to be able to generate their transfer funds.



I didn't point to net spend, Letters did. I don't use that as marker because it's for financial analysts & accountants. It's also completely variable as I have already explained.
Our competitors Kitchens are not the point and whataboutism.



True, I agree with you.



No issue with this either, I agree with what you are saying here - but again this isn't what sparked this initial debate.

It was that after all the money we have spent, we are still 1-2 players short :shrug:

It matters what other teams have spent because we are not operating in a bubble. You are free to think what you like, but in a competetive league the resources available to other teams are highly relevant our ability to challenge for silverware.

I thought I was responding to NQ re net spend, but in answer to your reply, it is a very simple point. It is more accurate to factor in transfer fees generated by player sales to assess how much a club has spent overall than simply to look at transfer outgoings.

My other point is that if you are judging a manager by how much he has spent, you need also (if you are being fair) to look at how much ground they have had to make up. Without this any assessment is flawed. And Arteta had to make up a huge amount of ground on his competitors, and completely overhaul his squad. It's obvious to me that this was bound to cost more than refreshing already competetive teams.

I don't think I have misconstrued the criticism of Arteta's supposed underperformance as our manager by reference to his spending. But if the criticism is more nuanced - ie that despite spending, we are still 1/2 players short, then I would argue that similar points apply in the end.

If you accept that the club only has limited resources, whether owing to PSR; the owners or whatever - which I think most sensible people would - then that argument becomes that Arteta has misallocated these.

Does this argument really stand up? Without getting into individual players' percieved merits all of this Summer's acquisitions have been to address holes; provide vital backup or replace outgoing players. Even if we look to last Summer, suddenly Calafiori and even Merino look like sensible back ups (or in Cala's case rotation options) for first team players. The intention with any top team is to have a stand in for every position. So why are we beating Arteta up for working to this? We can argue that we need an Odegard back up, but we have signed Nwaneri on a decent contract for that position (and BTW Nwaneri, not Madueke is the reason why we colled on Eze).

We are certainly short at LW, but our inability to further strenghten there is because not despite what the club has spent so far! We cannot sign anyone else wthout getting rid of Reiss-Nelson; Kiwor; Zinchenko and possibly Trossard, and the market isn't there by all appearances. So why, in seriousness, is this £1bn figure being used to hang the manager?

[IBK]

What I am saying is net spend is more relevant in terms of how much improvement we should expect to see in the squad.

I don't think your kitchen analogy really works but OK, let's go with that. Three scenarios:
- You buy a new kitchen for £30k, but your old one was worth £60k - in that situation you spent £30k but your kitchen is probably actually worse than before. I guess the football equivalent of that would be a club in financial trouble who has to downgrade the squad to keep their heads above water financially or comply with the financial regulations.
- You buy a new kitchen for £30k, but your old one was only worth £15k. In that case I'd now expect you to have a better kitchen or, in football terms, a better player. That should improve the squad.
- You buy a new kitchen for £30k, your old one was only worth £15k and you keep it. Now you have two kitchens. If something in one breaks - I guess that would be analogous to an injury - then you have another one you can use. Maybe not as good as the new one but good enough, better than having to use a camping stove.

In all 3 scenarios you have spent £30k - by your metric those 3 scenarios are equivalent. But the net spend is different in all 3 scenarios and the result is very different. The first one is a downgrade in quality, the second is an upgrade. The 3rd is too and you're adding squad depth. That's why net spend is the more important metric.

And one relevant thing is were you the best restaurant in town before the work on the kitchen? If you were then in the first scenario you might not be any more. In the second you should be even better and in the third you would too and you've mitigated against having to give a reduced service if something in the kitchen breaks.



I've already said that I think the ROI has been pretty poor under Arteta. 1 trophy in 5 years given the spend isn't great.
That said, he took over a side who finished 5th the season before he arrived and we had a very patchy start to the season which saw Emery sacked and him appointed. We were in 10th when he took over with a league record of P17 W5 D7 L5.
We were not the best restaurant in town.
From there he took us to the brink of a title. One could argue that "brink" isn't good enough, and that is a reasonable argument. But it's not like there's been no progress under him. I'd say last season was the real disappointment. Before that - the title challenge 2 years ago was unexpected. We ran out of steam and got mown down by the City machine but we're not the first side to have that happen to them. The following season we pushed City all the way. People point to the Villa game but I don't think you can really ask much more than P18 W16 D1 L1 in the second half of the season. We pushed City to the last day. But last season...City finally dropped off, it felt like the title was there for the taking. It's massively frustrating to have lost out to Liverpool. Yes, we had injuries but we also didn't do the right things in the transfer market last summer. If people want Arteta out on the basis of that season then I have some sympathy for that. Personally I'd give him this season but he has to deliver.


I don't know if that's true, but if it is then it's like saying that good diet and nutrition only became a thing because of AW. That might be true but he was right about nutrition and he's right about net spend for the reasons I've explained.


I don't think he's done a great job on net spend. Ours is still in the top 3 under Arteta. I've agreed that the ROI hasn't been good enough.
My only point in this exchange is that it is a more reasonable metric.


Again, this comes back to whether you start off as the best restaurant in town. City had already spent the money to make them champions over and over before Arteta arrived. The fact they don't need to spend as much to maintain that level is not relevant. Liverpool are probably a better example but I am not arguing that Arteta has done a wonderful job.


Maybe in the sense of 1-0 to the Arsenal, but the style of play is nothing like Graham's route one. Did you not see the game on Sunday where we endlessly passed it round at the back? I actually thought the occasions we did break we did so with decent pace - that felt like an improvement on last season. But the final ball was non-existent or poorly played. It wasn't anything like the Seaman booting it upfield to be flicked on for Smith or Wright to get on to we used to play under Graham.

:gp: agree with all that. Too many absolutes these days. 2 things can be true. That Arteta has done a good job and that it's beyond him to win major silverware. This season will be the acid test of the latter. But this obsession with how much he has spent and writing off what he has achieved with this in getting us to where we are is IMO unjust.

[dostoy]

If they sell Kiwior then surely they will need to sign another CB.

They also need another attacking player as there is not enough goal threat with what they have.

[KSE Comedy Club]

It matters what other teams have spent because we are not operating in a bubble. You are free to think what you like, but in a competetive league the resources available to other teams are highly relevant our ability to challenge for silverware.

I thought I was responding to NQ re net spend, but in answer to your reply, it is a very simple point. It is more accurate to factor in transfer fees generated by player sales to assess how much a club has spent overall than simply to look at transfer outgoings.

My other point is that if you are judging a manager by how much he has spent, you need also (if you are being fair) to look at how much ground they have had to make up. Without this any assessment is flawed. And Arteta had to make up a huge amount of ground on his competitors, and completely overhaul his squad. It's obvious to me that this was bound to cost more than refreshing already competetive teams.

I don't think I have misconstrued the criticism of Arteta's supposed underperformance as our manager by reference to his spending. But if the criticism is more nuanced - ie that despite spending, we are still 1/2 players short, then I would argue that similar points apply in the end.

If you accept that the club only has limited resources, whether owing to PSR; the owners or whatever - which I think most sensible people would - then that argument becomes that Arteta has misallocated these.

Does this argument really stand up? Without getting into individual players' percieved merits all of this Summer's acquisitions have been to address holes; provide vital backup or replace outgoing players. Even if we look to last Summer, suddenly Calafiori and even Merino look like sensible back ups (or in Cala's case rotation options) for first team players. The intention with any top team is to have a stand in for every position. So why are we beating Arteta up for working to this? We can argue that we need an Odegard back up, but we have signed Nwaneri on a decent contract for that position (and BTW Nwaneri, not Madueke is the reason why we colled on Eze).

We are certainly short at LW, but our inability to further strenghten there is because not despite what the club has spent so far! We cannot sign anyone else wthout getting rid of Reiss-Nelson; Kiwor; Zinchenko and possibly Trossard, and the market isn't there by all appearances. So why, in seriousness, is this £1bn figure being used to hang the manager?

£1bn isn't being used to hang the manager at all.

It is being used to highlight that every season for the last 10 years we are always 1-2 players short of having a title winning squad.
The fact we have now spent close to such a large amount means we shouldn't still be in the same position squad wise that we have always been.

That isn't all entirely on Arteta, as that would be vastly unfair - but he's been here long enough and spent enough that should ensure we are not still in the same position.

[HCZ_Reborn]

If they sell Kiwior then surely they will need to sign another CB.

They also need another attacking player as there is not enough goal threat with what they have.

I don’t think so. I’d rather we didn’t sell Kiwior but Calafiori is a centre back and can cover there

This idea that we need eight defenders is silly for me.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

If they sell Kiwior then surely they will need to sign another CB.

They also need another attacking player as there is not enough goal threat with what they have.

We've got Mosquera.

From his few cameos he looks a vast improvement and able to slot in comfortably across the back 4 and maybe even more.

An AWesque like signing....after wasting a billon quid and six years, he got one eventually.

[KSE Comedy Club]

What I am saying is net spend is more relevant in terms of how much improvement we should expect to see in the squad.

I don't think your kitchen analogy really works but OK, let's go with that. Three scenarios:
- You buy a new kitchen for £30k, but your old one was worth £60k - in that situation you spent £30k but your kitchen is probably actually worse than before. I guess the football equivalent of that would be a club in financial trouble who has to downgrade the squad to keep their heads above water financially or comply with the financial regulations.
- You buy a new kitchen for £30k, but your old one was only worth £15k. In that case I'd now expect you to have a better kitchen or, in football terms, a better player. That should improve the squad.
- You buy a new kitchen for £30k, your old one was only worth £15k and you keep it. Now you have two kitchens. If something in one breaks - I guess that would be analogous to an injury - then you have another one you can use. Maybe not as good as the new one but good enough, better than having to use a camping stove.

In all 3 scenarios you have spent £30k - by your metric those 3 scenarios are equivalent. But the net spend is different in all 3 scenarios and the result is very different. The first one is a downgrade in quality, the second is an upgrade. The 3rd is too and you're adding squad depth. That's why net spend is the more important metric.

And one relevant thing is were you the best restaurant in town before the work on the kitchen? If you were then in the first scenario you might not be any more. In the second you should be even better and in the third you would too and you've mitigated against having to give a reduced service if something in the kitchen breaks.

Letters, this is all nonsense - you are going through some mental gymnastics and what if scenarios to try and make your point.
I brought up the kitchen analogy & the car one - so I apologise for going down that road but it was to try and keep it simple.

Fact: Arteta has spent close to £1bn assembling this squad (any attempts to refute this are futile as it is documented fact)

That means we should now have talent worth £1bn. (in fact transfermarket puts our current squad value at £1.32bn)
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/arsenal/marktwertanalyse/verein/11

What we make back in player sales is irrelevant to the value of what we have bought in terms of their talent.

It makes them cheaper on paper and balances the books but it doesn't make them any less talented or reduces their value.

The idea of spending money is to strengthen and improve the squad to make it better with better players (you know this, I'm not trying to teach you to suck eggs).
No team wants to spend loads of money buying shit players that are worse than what they already have.


Despite all of this, the point I'm making still stands: we have spent a hell of a lot of money to rebuild a team that is capable of challenging - but are also still 1-2 players short of a team that can win.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Not sure I agree, I think the squad we have can win either the league or the European cup as it is.

There’s definitely areas to strengthen but I don’t buy into the idea that there’s no way we can win anything big without it

Squad strengthening is a task that you never really finish.

What I mean by that is the title won’t be decided by whether or not we signed Eze or a similar level player

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Not sure I agree, I think the squad we have can win either the league or the European cup as it is.

There’s definitely areas to strengthen but I don’t buy into the idea that there’s no way we can win anything big without it

Squad strengthening is a task that you never really finish.

What I mean by that is the title won’t be decided by whether or not we signed Eze or a similar level player

But our inability to win the title and pretty much every other trophy last season was largely due to the fact that we didn't have a striker....or at least that's the opinion most people share.

While I do agree that the squad is above average and able to win trophies ( if we had a manager that had honed his craft properly), I do believe KSE is spot on assuming THIS MANAGER will not be able to win the league if he doesn't sort out the left wing and what's going on in the middle with Odegaard.

Why? Well because he did the exact same thing last year....and the year before.....he clearly needs everything to go his way before he is able to triumph.

The ultimate point is after spending 6 years and over £1 billion quid, there is no reason why this manager should be short of any player in any position this early on in the league when we have no new longterm injuries.

There is also little reason why other teams should be looking better oiled than us when their managers have had shorter time and spent less money than us to build there "imperfect" squads that actually win things.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Not sure I agree, I think the squad we have can win either the league or the European cup as it is.

There’s definitely areas to strengthen but I don’t buy into the idea that there’s no way we can win anything big without it

Squad strengthening is a task that you never really finish.

What I mean by that is the title won’t be decided by whether or not we signed Eze or a similar level player

I'm not saying there is no way we can win anything, we can always hope results & situations go our way and the squad is very decent as it is.
But we need to address the LW position as there is hug problem there currently with Martinelli & Trossard (neither of them are good enough it would seem)

and I also now agree with you that what is glaringly obvious, is a lack of a proper creative midfielder.

Odegaard is good on his day, but those days are becoming increasingly scattered and inconsistent.
He needs competition to raise his level.

That alone means we will struggle to win without a player with a different approach

[HCZ_Reborn]

But our inability to win the title and pretty much every other trophy last season was largely due to the fact that we didn't have a striker....or at least that's the opinion most people share.

While I do agree that the squad is above average and able to win trophies ( if we had a manager that had honed his craft properly), I do believe KSE is spot on assuming THIS MANAGER will not be able to win the league if he doesn't sort out the left wing and what's going on in the middle with Odegaard.

Why? Well because he did the exact same thing last year....and the year before.....he clearly needs everything to go his way before he is able to triumph.

The ultimate point is after spending 6 years and over £1 billion quid, there is no reason why this manager should be short of any player in any position this early on in the league when we have no new longterm injuries.

There is also little reason why other teams should be looking better oiled than us when their managers have had shorter time and spent less money than us to build there "imperfect" squads that actually win things.

Apart from City I don’t agree that other squads do look better

Injuries aside the same squad that got 89 points in 23/24 wasn’t any stronger than in 24/25. The problem as I see it before we got injuries was tactical. I keep talking heresy that the problem was playing Rice at no 8 against mid table teams as if it was me being obsessively critical of Rice rather than simply pointing out that he’s not a creative midfielder. We had the option to play Odegaard as a double pivot with Nwaneri but never even attempted it and as poor as Odegaard was, the fact that the responsibility is put on him to be the singular creative source in midfield doesn’t help.

The PSG tie the main issue was the lack of a striker to put away chances but it wasn’t the only issue, you look at how many midfielders ever took up position in the opposition penalty area.

And the main issue with mid table teams is playing two holding/defensive players that we don’t need especially when we have inverted full backs that move into midfield. I think we could have won the league with the squad we had last season (with City out of the running) the problem is we are well set up to neutralise the threat of big sides, but we aren’t set up to get the wins against mid table teams. The issue wasn’t creating lots of chances and having no one to finish them in those games it was creating a lot of half chances many of which were blocked.

This is not me saying we didn’t need a striker, it’s saying that a striker needs consistent and viable chances to profit from.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I would change things up in the attack for Leeds


Drop Rice to 6, and play two attacking midfielders in front of him


Nwaneri and Odegaard, Saka and Odegaard, Saka and Nwaneri it doesn’t matter


Stick Madueke on the right, stick one of Martinelli or Trossard on the left (or hell even Gyokeres with Havertz up front)


The problem for me is less the players we have available (ideally we’d have more width but we can experiment) more the need to control games. The irony is that if we play a more attacking line up, we won’t need to push our back four and defensive midfielder up so high.

[Letters]

Letters, this is all nonsense - you are going through some mental gymnastics and what if scenarios to try and make your point.
Sigh. If it's nonsense then it should be simple to refute. You haven't engaged with what I'm saying.
How hard is this to understand? I have clearly outlined 3 scenarios which can be mapped on to football squads where one can spend the same amount and end up with a weaker team, a stronger team or a stronger team and a stronger squad. Your claim is that those 3 things are equivalent. They just aren't. Which is why net spend is a better metric of what a club has done.


That means we should now have talent worth £1bn. (in fact transfermarket puts our current squad value at £1.32bn)
Well OK. And the valuation of a squad is another useful metric. No argument there. That's actually probably an even better metric than net spend.
As is wage bill.


Despite all of this, the point I'm making still stands: we have spent a hell of a lot of money to rebuild a team that is capable of challenging - but are also still 1-2 players short of a team that can win.
That is your claim, but it remains to be seen. We're 1 game in.
We've challenged 2 out of the last 3 years. Last season was the outlier. Injuries were a factor, I'm certain we'd have been closer had we had fewer players out. But we also didn't do the right things in the transfer window last summer. I think we've done better this year, but other clubs have bought well too so I guess we'll see. We aren't going to sweep all before us but I reckon we'll be in the mix somewhere.

[dazthegooner]

Apparently Trossard has signed a contract extension

[Marc Overmars]

New deal for Trossard which I presume ends the search for another attacker this summer.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Apparently Trossard has signed a contract extension

Great news.

Of all the options we currently have on the left, he is by far the most effective.

I just hope his attitude improves with the new contract.

[KSE Comedy Club]

So we have agreed to pay Trossard more money but his contract has not been extended

And they wonder why we struggle to sell players :doh: :banghead:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Great news.

Of all the options we currently have on the left, he is by far the most effective.

I just hope his attitude improves with the new contract.

It’s not great news.

He’s a bench player and he is now 3rd choice behind Madueke.

So we are paying him more money to maybe come on at some point.


It also suggests we aren’t buying a LW player, so that’s our window done.
Ffs

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

So we have agreed to pay Trossard more money but his contract has not been extended

And they wonder why we struggle to sell players :doh: :banghead:

Yeah I just checked Sky and seen the news..... pretty strange.

However, I must say he was vastly underpaid compared to the rest of the squad (I mentioned it quite a few times in the past), and IMO if this improves his mood and gets him back to his best, it is worth it.

@KSE

Like I said earlier, at his best, he is by far the best option we have on the left...unless Martinelli is able to go back in time Marty Mcfly style.

[Marc Overmars]

I don’t mind Trossard staying at all, just annoyed that we couldn’t upgrade the left this summer. I don’t believe Madueke is going to play there as he’ll be Saka’s back up.

Maybe Martinelli is the one we’ll look to sell next summer now.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Trossard wasn't great last season.

He scored 8 goals total in the prem, 2 in the CL.
He also had that daft strop and Arteta then started him in games - where he was non existent.

Add to that he's 31 this year and his contract takes him to nearly 33 (this is a wage increase not an extension)

He's just going to be another player that we get no money for or leaves on a free.

We should have sold him this window and got someone else in. Hell, even sell Martinelli next summer too, if he doesn't improve. But the LW is a problem and these two players are part of it.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Sigh. If it's nonsense then it should be simple to refute. You haven't engaged with what I'm saying.
How hard is this to understand? I have clearly outlined 3 scenarios which can be mapped on to football squads where one can spend the same amount and end up with a weaker team, a stronger team or a stronger team and a stronger squad. Your claim is that those 3 things are equivalent. They just aren't. Which is why net spend is a better metric of what a club has done.

Because that is a different topic and conversation and doesn't change the fact Arteta has spent nearly a billion quid. It's also not what you were saying about net spend determining how good the squad is.



Well OK. And the valuation of a squad is another useful metric. No argument there. That's actually probably an even better metric than net spend.
As is wage bill.

Yes as it is fairly, in line with what has been spent.


That is your claim, but it remains to be seen. We're 1 game in.
We've challenged 2 out of the last 3 years. Last season was the outlier. Injuries were a factor, I'm certain we'd have been closer had we had fewer players out. But we also didn't do the right things in the transfer window last summer. I think we've done better this year, but other clubs have bought well too so I guess we'll see. We aren't going to sweep all before us but I reckon we'll be in the mix somewhere.

It's not just my claim, loads of people have said the same and I'll bet if you go back and extract the data from Goonersweb over the last 10 years or so you will see that being said plenty of times by other posters too.
Loads of Gooners have had that feeling over the years, every window "we are 1 or 2 players short still" - it's been said over and over again.

We started last season with a 23 man squad registered - that is 2 players short of a full 25 man squad :shrug:
We have bought 6 players, 5 of which are replacements so that means we are 1 up on the squad.

There has to come a point where we don't just challenge but try to win. Yes this current squad may now go and do just that. But we still have players that are not good enough or don't perform as they should when needed.
We could and should, have fixed most of these deficiencies by now.

Last season we needed a striker - didn't get one.
This season (everyone pretty much agrees) we need to sort the LW - likely not gonna happen.

[HCZ_Reborn]

When you talk about 1 or 2 players short are you talking about number or quality. Because if it’s the latter well I don’t know anyone we were linked with who I could definitely say improves us in terms of quality. Rodrygo, I’ll be honest not sure what a lot of people are seeing there.

Martinelli has been incredibly disappointing the last couple of seasons but I think a lot of the problem is the way we play that isolates the left hand side and Trossard has often had similar issues as well.


So for me it comes down to the form of the players we have rather than the players we lack. What’s to say if we signed the players people here think we should that they aren’t also going to be suffocated by Arteta’s system.


I really wanted us to sign a creative midfielder but it’s abundantly clear to me that Arteta will never play two creative midfielders in the same XI (with the exception of maybe friendlies).

Ultimately it comes down to not what players we have, but what coach we have. If Arteta is not good enough to win the league with the squad we currently have, than he’s not good enough to win it even if we add the 1-2 extra players so therefore the issue is moot.

[Marc Overmars]

In talks with Stuttgart over a loan for Vieira, with an obligation of a 17m fee next year if performance targets are met.

Having to come up with creative ways to get anything for our duds. :lol:

[KSE Comedy Club]

When you talk about 1 or 2 players short are you talking about number or quality. Because if it’s the latter well I don’t know anyone we were linked with who I could definitely say improves us in terms of quality. Rodrygo, I’ll be honest not sure what a lot of people are seeing there.

Martinelli has been incredibly disappointing the last couple of seasons but I think a lot of the problem is the way we play that isolates the left hand side and Trossard has often had similar issues as well.


So for me it comes down to the form of the players we have rather than the players we lack. What’s to say if we signed the players people here think we should that they aren’t also going to be suffocated by Arteta’s system.


I really wanted us to sign a creative midfielder but it’s abundantly clear to me that Arteta will never play two creative midfielders in the same XI (with the exception of maybe friendlies).

Ultimately it comes down to not what players we have, but what coach we have. If Arteta is not good enough to win the league with the squad we currently have, than he’s not good enough to win it even if we add the 1-2 extra players so therefore the issue is moot.

For me it's not a numbers thing, it's a quality issue.

I too want a creative player as I think we lack anyone outside of Odegaard.
Also the LW is stale and needs a refresh. That means selling on or both and replacing them with better players.

[HCZ_Reborn]

For me it's not a numbers thing, it's a quality issue.

I too want a creative player as I think we lack anyone outside of Odegaard.
Also the LW is stale and needs a refresh. That means selling on or both and replacing them with better players.

The issue is there’s no one obviously going to improve us. Eze was considered as an alternative to Odegaard, but just different kind of player rather than any better. Eze would be a good strong dribbler, well arguably so would Max Dowman

Same with Rodrygo under a system where the ball all comes down the right, what’s to say Rodrygo or someone else is not going to be left just as isolated.

[KSE Comedy Club]

The issue is there’s no one obviously going to improve us. Eze was considered as an alternative to Odegaard, but just different kind of player rather than any better. Eze would be a good strong dribbler, well arguably so would Max Dowman

Same with Rodrygo under a system where the ball all comes down the right, what’s to say Rodrygo or someone else is not going to be left just as isolated.

Agreed, but that is where a creative player that actually sits centrally would be a different option to bring on.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Agreed, but that is where a creative player that actually sits centrally would be a different option to bring on.

But we arguably already have that in Nwaneri and to a lesser extent in Dowman (and I only say lesser extent because the lad is 15, his potential is immense)

Plus actually we could also play Saka through the middle as he’s clearly talented enough to do it.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

In talks with Stuttgart over a loan for Vieira, with an obligation of a 17m fee next year if performance targets are met.

Having to come up with creative ways to get anything for our duds. :lol:

Same thing being said about Kiwior.

Porto, once again trying to rip us off with a loan and an obligation to buy for £25m..... honestly the King of Net spend is really outdoing himself this window.... but that was kind of predictable as he 's run out of other manager's assets to sell.

[KSE Comedy Club]

But we arguably already have that in Nwaneri and to a lesser extent in Dowman (and I only say lesser extent because the lad is 15, his potential is immense)

Plus actually we could also play Saka through the middle as he’s clearly talented enough to do it.

True but Nwaneri & Dowman are both inexperienced still & the likelihood of Arteta ever putting Saka in the middle is as much as me sticking my cock in a paper shredder*




*just so you know, I'm not kinky like that so I deffo wouldn't ;)

[IBK]

When you talk about 1 or 2 players short are you talking about number or quality. Because if it’s the latter well I don’t know anyone we were linked with who I could definitely say improves us in terms of quality. Rodrygo, I’ll be honest not sure what a lot of people are seeing there.

Martinelli has been incredibly disappointing the last couple of seasons but I think a lot of the problem is the way we play that isolates the left hand side and Trossard has often had similar issues as well.


So for me it comes down to the form of the players we have rather than the players we lack. What’s to say if we signed the players people here think we should that they aren’t also going to be suffocated by Arteta’s system.


I really wanted us to sign a creative midfielder but it’s abundantly clear to me that Arteta will never play two creative midfielders in the same XI (with the exception of maybe friendlies).

Ultimately it comes down to not what players we have, but what coach we have. If Arteta is not good enough to win the league with the squad we currently have, than he’s not good enough to win it even if we add the 1-2 extra players so therefore the issue is moot.

I agree with most of this. And to respond to some of the points made previously by others...

I agree that squad valuation is a useful metric, and if this is used, our squad is currentlythe joint most valuable (with Citeh) according to a recent planet football ranking - at £1,222,000,000, followed by Chelsea and Liverpool. This will change if Liverpool land Isaak as expected.

Last season, according to Give Me Sport, we were in 4th place - behind Citeh Chelsea and Liverpool. In 2023/4 we were second, behind Citeh, as we were in 2022/3. So our last 3 league finishes correlate fairly consistently with squad value.

As HZC and Letters have mentioned, our disappointing season last season when we were 10 points off the pace had more to do with injuries to key players than anything else. Before that, any fair observer has to factor in that experience and know how count. We were pipped at the post by Citeh in 2023/4, and 5 points behind them in 2022/3 being beaten by Guardiola's juggernaut is no disgrace. We also need to remember that Saliba's injury in 2023/4 probably accounted for us not winning the title - and is a good example of how luck (or the lack of it) is a big factor in a title chase that can confound any stats based arguments.

I disagree that people haven't been arguing that Arteta has underperformed - and citing his spending in support of this. And I don't think either that this is true (if we make an allowance for last season's injuries), or that it is obvious that someone else would have done better than him. Of course in a hypothetical world another manager could have won the league with his resources, but by the same token a hypothetical manager could also have done worse. The argument is subjective as well as hypothetical, and largely dictated by whether people like Arteta and focus on the good parts of his management, or dislike him and focus on the negatives.

The debate about Arteta's merits (as opposed siimply to what he has spent) is a different one. I think we are all mostly agreed that he has made mistakes, and that as far as he was responsible (to whatever extent) in last Summer's transfer business he got things wrong. I think we are also agreed that this season is make or break, and sceptical as to whether the manager has what it takes to win major silverware with us (I certainly am).

HCZ's point about form is an interesting one. As well as injuries (and maybe as a result of them), too many of our players last season did not hit top form. I think it is valid to ask whether Arteta's system is the reason for this. What I would say is that transfer business is all about hoping/expecting players to play to their potential, so if we feel that players are out of form this is not really a ground on which to criticise the transfer itself.


If Arteta is not good enough to win the league with the squad we currently have, than he’s not good enough to win it even if we add the 1-2 extra players so therefore the issue is moot.

Sometimes a post really gives pause for thought. And this comment falls into this category. We have spent 3 months obsessing about our transfer business, and there is always the feeling that (usually a headline) transfer will give us what is needed for success. If you go through our current squad and our players' individual merits - and also look at our last 3 seasons - then I think I agree that we are good enough to win the league. If you accept this then further debate about our transfer business becomes facile.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

But we arguably already have that in Nwaneri and to a lesser extent in Dowman (and I only say lesser extent because the lad is 15, his potential is immense)

Plus actually we could also play Saka through the middle as he’s clearly talented enough to do it.

While I agree with the options that could play through the middle (except Saka), they're obviously kids and still on a long learning curve.

If the plan is to win important silverware ASAP, then we must be consistent by continuing in the path of choosing players that have a verifiable track record and can make impact now instead of later, which I believe was one of the reasons we finally agreed to go with Gyokores over Sesko.
.
Not going all out and completing this Eze move seems like the decision that might haunt us this season, just like the madness of playing without a proper striker did last season (though the latter was pretty pretty stupid).

BTW I must admit that I'm also slowly beginning to buy into the argument that Arteta could recruit all the players he wants and we'd still fall short (something you hinted on earlier), as our inflexibility with tactics is being exposed by a lot more analysts all over the media....however I'd still rather be damned if we do, than the other way around.

[IBK]

Same thing being said about Kiwior.

Porto, once again trying to rip us off with a loan and an obligation to buy for £25m..... honestly the King of Net spend is really outdoing himself this window.... but that was kind of predictable as he 's run out of other manager's assets to sell.

So Arteta has replaced Berta and is now dealing with transfer business as well as preparing the team for Leeds?

Our lamantable record of player sales is a deep seated and historic problem, that also has its roots in (1) the post Wenger wilderness - and having to play catch up since Arteta joined, and (2) our Club's tendency to pull its punches when it comes to signing the best of the best.

How, exactly, do you think we find sale value in this team? After the manager arrived, we had to get rid of Ozil; Mkhitaryan; Mustaphi; Mavrapanos on frees; followed by Aubamyang and Lacazette the following year; and Pepe the following year. All senior players on big (mostly huge) wages who were busted flushes. The manager's brief was to restore the team to being competetive, and to do so he had to bring in talent to improve the team (and develop academy players) rather than buy with an eye on outgoing transfer value.

In order to persuade our most valuable transfers to join - and others to remain with the project we had to offer big wages - which is one of the reasons why we find players hard to shift.

We can look to the likes of Zinchenko and Jesus as examples of players whose value has plummeted all we like, but at the time they were key components of our resurgence. It is simply not possible to bring in top 'now' talent without the risk that we use up their transfer value in improving results - being left with little value when we need to sell.

In terms of younger players that Arteta has brought through - we did a resonable job with player sales last Summer - Smith Rowe; Nketiah and Ramsdale all went for decent fees.

Yes there are obvious errors under Arteta. Lokonga and Vieira stand out - but this happens with every team.

The corrollary to the debate above re transfer expenditure and squad value is that the manager has had to spend years inproving the quality of his squad. The valuable players we have are needed to play. I fail to see how we are failing to get value out of our surplus to requirement players in a market where there is no demand for them. Maybe Kiwor is the exception but (albeit that circumstances forced his had), its not as though Arteta did not put him in the shop window last season.

We are at a stage in the season where is they do fancy our players other clubs will have waited until they can drive a hard bargain. Should we have ignored our incoming transfer requirements (and lost out on targets) by focussing on outgoings first?

It's easy to be critical of the club for its achilles heel, but why the manager, and where is the value that we are currently failing to realise?

[IBK]

While I agree with the options that could play through the middle (except Saka), they're obviously kids and still on a long learning curve.

If the plan is to win important silverware ASAP, then we must be consistent by continuing in the path of choosing players that have a verifiable track record and can make impact now instead of later, which I believe was one of the reasons we finally agreed to go with Gyokores over Sesko.
.
Not going all out and completing this Eze move seems like the decision that might haunt us this season, just like the madness of playing without a proper striker did last season (though the latter was pretty pretty stupid).

BTW I must admit that I'm also slowly beginning to buy into the argument that Arteta could recruit all the players he wants and we'd still fall short (something you hinted on earlier), as our inflexibility with tactics is being exposed by a lot more analysts all over the media....however I'd still rather be damned if we do, than the other way around.

It's a nuanced issue, really. It's fine to say that we have to go all out on now players - and we largely have. But if we value talent like Nwaneri we need (1) to keep it, and (2) make sure there is a pathway for him to play. The problem with 'now' is that we then continue the cycle of giving big wages to older players and facing problems with generating transfer fees down the line. We have already IMO sailed quite close to the wind with Gyok and Zubi. At some stage we need to hedge our bets. I love Eze and would have been very pleased if we had signed him. But he is not the out and out LW that I think we need, and at some stage we need to pivot to a strategy that tries to protect our future - which is what I think the Nwaneri deal - and our consequent colling on Eze - represents.

[HCZ_Reborn]

FFS Havertz out with knee injury for the forseeable

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

FFS Havertz out with knee injury for the forseeable

You have a chance to do something hilarious now. £120m+1 for Isak?

[KSE Comedy Club]

Ultimately it comes down to not what players we have, but what coach we have. If Arteta is not good enough to win the league with the squad we currently have, than he’s not good enough to win it even if we add the 1-2 extra players so therefore the issue is moot.

Well yes and no.

The problem is, if we continually remain 1-2 players short, then how can we say it's down to the manager / coach if they never have everything they need?

The other top clubs don't seem to have this problem. When they have an area they need to improve on they usually do or they have a player that can fill in the role and do a good job.
We always seem to be stuck in a situation where we have to make shift a replacement and hope it works.

[KSE Comedy Club]

FFS Havertz out with knee injury for the forseeable

Oh FUCK!!

Nicolas Jackson incoming...................

[Marc Overmars]

FFS Havertz out with knee injury for the forseeable

So it begins. :haha:

Gyokeres injury next.

[Marc Overmars]

The fact it’s been reported by The Athletic that we are exploring the market for options now suggests it’s probably very serious for Havertz, “knee issue” possibly means ACL. Horrendous luck.

Might also explain why Trossard was given a pay rise to stick around if he was looking to leave.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

So Arteta has replaced Berta and is now dealing with transfer business as well as preparing the team for Leeds?

Our lamantable record of player sales is a deep seated and historic problem, that also has its roots in (1) the post Wenger wilderness - and having to play catch up since Arteta joined, and (2) our Club's tendency to pull its punches when it comes to signing the best of the best.

How, exactly, do you think we find sale value in this team? After the manager arrived, we had to get rid of Ozil; Mkhitaryan; Mustaphi; Mavrapanos on frees; followed by Aubamyang and Lacazette the following year; and Pepe the following year. All senior players on big (mostly huge) wages who were busted flushes. The manager's brief was to restore the team to being competetive, and to do so he had to bring in talent to improve the team (and develop academy players) rather than buy with an eye on outgoing transfer value.

In order to persuade our most valuable transfers to join - and others to remain with the project we had to offer big wages - which is one of the reasons why we find players hard to shift.

We can look to the likes of Zinchenko and Jesus as examples of players whose value has plummeted all we like, but at the time they were key components of our resurgence. It is simply not possible to bring in top 'now' talent without the risk that we use up their transfer value in improving results - being left with little value when we need to sell.

In terms of younger players that Arteta has brought through - we did a resonable job with player sales last Summer - Smith Rowe; Nketiah and Ramsdale all went for decent fees.

Yes there are obvious errors under Arteta. Lokonga and Vieira stand out - but this happens with every team.

The corrollary to the debate above re transfer expenditure and squad value is that the manager has had to spend years inproving the quality of his squad. The valuable players we have are needed to play. I fail to see how we are failing to get value out of our surplus to requirement players in a market where there is no demand for them. Maybe Kiwor is the exception but (albeit that circumstances forced his had), its not as though Arteta did not put him in the shop window last season.

We are at a stage in the season where is they do fancy our players other clubs will have waited until they can drive a hard bargain. Should we have ignored our incoming transfer requirements (and lost out on targets) by focussing on outgoings first?

It's easy to be critical of the club for its achilles heel, but why the manager, and where is the value that we are currently failing to realise?
Mate, I mean this in a nice way, but I'm hardly disputing things you say anymore, especially when it comes to anything Arteta related.

Your views on him are pretty much entrenched and I'm turning a new leaf trying to avoid forever arguments that go no where until obviously time proves me right (and a sometimes wrong).

Your views are clear, Arteta has done an outstanding job taking us from relegation fodder (apparently) to the dizzying heights of 2nd place in everything while spending what is appropriate to do so. He might not win anything for us, as you concede, but he has done a great job which few in the world could replicate.

I on the other hand feel he's done nothing but the bare minimum based on the verifiable amounts we've given him and more importantly, like I keep emphasising, the time and trust we've invested. We were never a total basket case, and even if we were, the jobs that managers like AW, Klopp and Alonso had to do to turn around their squads, under far more pressure and with less goodwill, were far more impressive.

This is where I'm entrenched, and even if he won the treble this season it's not going to erase what happened in the past few years where I believed a better manager would have gotten more from an expensively acquired squad "in his image".

Your first line above, where you're trying to isolate the manager from any culpability in our inability to get proper value for players he recruited, after arguing copiously in the last few pages that he's done miracles with recruitment and creating value is why I can't be bothered to keep these debates up with all its inherent futility.....I know you'll say your usual line of "2 things can be true at once" but TBH I really don't care how many things are true, when I only need one thing to be.

I want a manager who can win the league and play entertaining football while doing so, while also ensuring our academy products get the best opportunities they deserve. Arteta hasn't succeeded in any of the 3 aspects IMO, and you going on about how Herculean the brief was doesn't change the fact that it's a doable job, what he signed up for, and more importantly, has been achieved by several managers all over the world in the past with less drama.

[KSE Comedy Club]

The fact it’s been reported by The Athletic that we are exploring the market for options now suggests it’s probably very serious for Havertz, “knee issue” possibly means ACL. Horrendous luck.

Might also explain why Trossard was given a pay rise to stick around if he was looking to leave.

Is Sterling still available for a loan deal........:unsure:

True re: Trossard. They knew Havertz was going to be out so they dropped the Trossard news first thinking it would soften the blow.

Worryingly it also means they had no intention of signing anyone else and now this will force there hand. Same old Arsenal.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Well yes and no.

The problem is, if we continually remain 1-2 players short, then how can we say it's down to the manager / coach if they never have everything they need?

The other top clubs don't seem to have this problem. When they have an area they need to improve on they usually do or they have a player that can fill in the role and do a good job.
We always seem to be stuck in a situation where we have to make shift a replacement and hope it works.

Except they do. Liverpool look massively vulnerable at the back and that’s not going to be fixed by signing Guehi alone

The only side for me that has a perfectly balanced squad is City.

As I say if there were these one or two players out there that I’d say would unquestionably improve what we’ve already got I might agree but I don’t think there necessarily is.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

The fact it’s been reported by The Athletic that we are exploring the market for options now suggests it’s probably very serious for Havertz, “knee issue” possibly means ACL. Horrendous luck.

Might also explain why Trossard was given a pay rise to stick around if he was looking to leave.

I initially wanted us to recruit 2 strikers this window and sell Havertz, but that was when quality like Ekitike and Sesko were available.

I think we'll be ok, as Goku has a pretty impressive injury record (another huge plus for the signing) and we have Merino if needed. I also liked that young kid we had pre-season and probably he'll get an opportunity.

If any more money is made available for this transfer window, IMO the priority still has to be getting someone else to take the load off our misfiring captain....spending money on anything else is a waste IMO.

BTW, I wonder who tackled him, I hope it's not Gabby again :lol:

[IBK]

Mate, I mean this in a nice way, but I'm hardly disputing things you say anymore, especially when it comes to anything Arteta related.

Your views on him are pretty much entrenched and I'm turning a new leaf trying to avoid forever arguments that go no where until obviously time proves me right (and a sometimes wrong).

Your views are clear, Arteta has done an outstanding job taking us from relegation fodder (apparently) to the dizzying heights of 2nd place in everything while spending what is appropriate to do so. He might not win anything for us, as you concede, but he has done a great job which few in the world could replicate.

I on the other hand feel he's done nothing but the bare minimum based on the verifiable amounts we've given him and more importantly, like I keep emphasising, the time and trust we've invested. We were never a total basket case, and even if we were, the jobs that managers like AW, Klopp and Alonso had to do to turn around their squads, under far more pressure and with less goodwill, were far more impressive.

This is where I'm entrenched, and even if he won the treble this season it's not going to erase what happened in the past few years where I believed a better manager would have gotten more from an expensively acquired squad "in his image".

Your first line above, where you're trying to isolate the manager from any culpability in our inability to get proper value for players he recruited, after arguing copiously in the last few pages that he's done miracles with recruitment and creating value is why I can't be bothered to keep these debates up with all its inherent futility.....I know you'll say your usual line of "2 things can be true at once" but TBH I really don't care how many things are true, when I only need one thing to be.

I want a manager who can win the league and play entertaining football while doing so, while also ensuring our academy products get the best opportunities they deserve. Arteta hasn't succeeded in any of the 3 aspects IMO, and you going on about how Herculean the brief was doesn't change the fact that it's a doable job, what he signed up for, and more importantly, has been achieved by several managers all over the world in the past with less drama.

You make good points on here generally, but your overstatements let you down this time. I have not made a number of the assertions that you attribute to me, and I don't regard Arteta as either outstanding or a miracle worker, or without fault. I have said repeatedly that I have significan't misgivings about whether he can take us further forward. But I do not like absolutes, because I have learnt that nothing in the world is black and white, and the intention of my posts has been to argue against those (not necessarily you) who are not willing to see the other side of the Arteta argument.

We essentially want the same thing - like most Gooners - so your right best to leave it there.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Except they do. Liverpool look massively vulnerable at the back and that’s not going to be fixed by signing Guehi alone

The only side for me that has a perfectly balanced squad is City.

As I say if there were these one or two players out there that I’d say would unquestionably improve what we’ve already got I might agree but I don’t think there necessarily is.

Well ok but that suggests that there are no players better than Martinelli & Trossard on the LW - and the general concensus is that they are both not good enough :shrug:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Oh FUCK!!

Nicolas Jackson incoming...................

I was joking but...........

https://x.com/SantosMwine/status/1958145371621765318?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcam p%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet


����Following the injury of Kai, The Gunners are reportedly going back to the market to scout for another attacking option��️!

Nicolas Jackson is among the targets , understand Arsenal have excellent relationship with Chelsea as far transfer is concerned

and here:

https://www.teamtalk.com/arsenal/nicolas-jackson-arsenal-chelsea-ollie-watkins-aston-villa


Arsenal have identified Chelsea striker Nicolas Jackson as a potential signing before the summer transfer window closes on September 1, sources have told TEAMtalk, with Mikel Arteta and Andrea Berta also considering another Premier League star following the injury to Kai Havertz.


I cannot take this club seriously if this happens :banghead::fury::censored::ilt:

[Marc Overmars]

I initially wanted us to recruit 2 strikers this window and sell Havertz, but that was when quality like Ekitike and Sesko were available.

I think we'll be ok, as Goku has a pretty impressive injury record (another huge plus for the signing) and we have Merino if needed. I also liked that young kid we had pre-season and probably he'll get an opportunity.

If any more money is made available for this transfer window, IMO the priority still has to be getting someone else to take the load off our misfiring captain....spending money on anything else is a waste IMO.

BTW, I wonder who tackled him, I hope it's not Gabby again :lol:

If Havertz is cooked long term then we need another forward. Jesus won’t be back until the winter which means we’re a Gyokeres injury away from a really bad situation again.

I wouldn’t bank on his past fitness reliability at all. That seems to change for every player once they put on our shirt. :lol:

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Forrest just signed Douglas Luiz, pretty impressive deal for them, especially if they can get him back to his Villa form

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I was joking but...........

https://x.com/SantosMwine/status/1958145371621765318?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcam p%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet



and here:

https://www.teamtalk.com/arsenal/nicolas-jackson-arsenal-chelsea-ollie-watkins-aston-villa




I cannot take this club seriously if this happens :banghead::fury::censored::ilt:

It won't.

This will actually cause a riot.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

You make good points on here generally, but your overstatements let you down this time. I have not made a number of the assertions that you attribute to me, and I don't regard Arteta as either outstanding or a miracle worker, or without fault. I have said repeatedly that I have significan't misgivings about whether he can take us further forward. But I do not like absolutes, because I have learnt that nothing in the world is black and white, and the intention of my posts has been to argue against those (not necessarily you) who are not willing to see the other side of the Arteta argument.

We essentially want the same thing - like most Gooners - so your right best to leave it there.

I apologise if I upset you as I actually didn't mean to.

What I wanted to do was contrast clearly where our differences are and get to why going on about recruitment and transfer spends would be futile as we're both coming from opposite ends.

I hope me clearing this up helps so you understand that my post was in no way meant to paint you as some sort of absolutist or apologist.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

If Havertz is cooked long term then we need another forward. Jesus won’t be back until the winter which means we’re a Gyokeres injury away from a really bad situation again.

I wouldn’t bank on his past fitness reliability at all. That seems to change for every player once they put on our shirt. :lol:

Well if most of you think this way that means a Nicholas Jackson loan move is quite probable.

[IBK]

I apologise if I upset you as I actually didn't mean to.

What I wanted to do was contrast clearly where our differences are and get to why going on about recruitment and transfer spends would be futile as we're both coming from opposite ends.

I hope me clearing this up helps so you understand that my post was in no way meant to paint you as some sort of absolutist or apologist.

Not upset at all mate - and you said nothing untoward - just exeggerated a bit. Understand the contrast point :good:

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Not upset at all mate - and you said nothing untoward - just exeggerated a bit. Understand the contrast point :good:

Yeah, I've read it again, and I will hold up my hands that I did exaggerate your stances on a few things....another reason why I don't like to keep particular lines of arguments going on for too long.

Again, I'll take the blame for it, but I do respect your views , just don't agree with some of them (which I should have just said earlier).

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Would we be heading to hell if we put in a cheeky bid for Wissa :shrug:

Edit: just realised, he's pretty good on playing on the left too

[Marc Overmars]

Would we be heading to hell if we put in a cheeky bid for Wissa :shrug:

Edit: just realised, he's pretty good on playing on the left too

Well worth a bid.

19 PL goals last season. Way more than any Arsenal player has managed since we had Aubameyang.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Would we be heading to hell if we put in a cheeky bid for Wissa :shrug:

Edit: just realised, he's pretty good on playing on the left too

£60m for Wissa
£60m for Watkins
£60m for Jackson

lol, this seems to be the going rate now :shrug:

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

£60m for Wissa
£60m for Watkins
£60m for Jackson

lol, this seems to be the going rate now :shrug:

Honestly, like I said earlier I'd prefer we didn't go after anyone.....but if we had to, then I'd still suggest a loan, which will likely only be probable with Jackson, who is easily the worst option IMO.

Also, didn't Arteta say something about Noni being able to play upfront?

[KSE Comedy Club]

Honestly, like I said earlier I'd prefer we didn't go after anyone.....but if we had to, then I'd still suggest a loan, which will likely only be probable with Jackson, who is easily the worst option IMO.

Also, didn't Arteta say something about Noni being able to play upfront?

I'd prefer we went ahead with a LW, Semenyo would be a good choice or Lookman.

These would be better than getting a cover forward

[HCZ_Reborn]

I'd prefer we went ahead with a LW, Semenyo would be a good choice or Lookman.

These would be better than getting a cover forward

Depends how long Havertz is out for, if he’s out till the new year we need a striker


Vlahovic would be my pick

[Marc Overmars]

The way it’s been reported suggests that it’s long term.

I think any signings we make from here will just be from the bargain basement anyway.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Depends how long Havertz is out for, if he’s out till the new year we need a striker


Vlahovic would be my pick

"Well, we have Merino who can play there & Gabriel who could also play there as well"

[KSE Comedy Club]

Barcodes have bid £40m for Wissa

[HCZ_Reborn]

"Well, we have Merino who can play there & Gabriel who could also play there as well"

Well Merino is probably likely to be the internal solution as it feels unlikely to me that anything other than a loan deal would occur to bring in a replacement for Havertz.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Some papers are reporting that we could go after Morgan Rogers.

I'd be over the moon with this as rated him for quite a while and mentioned him here a few times. He's also versatile and could help fans get over not getting Eze.

I'd suggest if Villa are willing, we offer a swap for Martinelli (lets not forget Emery bought him and probably still rates him) and pay whatever on top is needed to complete this deal.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Some papers are reporting that we could go after Morgan Rogers.

I'd be over the moon with this as rated him for quite a while and mentioned him here a few times. He's also versatile and could help fans get over not getting Eze.

I'd suggest if Villa are willing, we offer a swap for Martinelli (lets not forget Emery bought him and probably still rates him) and pay whatever on top is needed to complete this deal.

Emery didn’t buy anyone. He had no say over Transfers. It was either Sanhelhi or Mislintat who bought in Martinelli

[HCZ_Reborn]

Havertz has NOT suffered ACL injury apparently, so that’s one thing ruled out that could land him out for the rest of the season

Could be a Meniscus tear, If Chat GPT is correct i am carrying that on my right knee which means were I a footballer any knee slide celebrations would be out.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Well ok but that suggests that there are no players better than Martinelli & Trossard on the LW - and the general concensus is that they are both not good enough :shrug:

Martinelli has doubtlessly underperformed last couple of seasons my point is given the issues on the left hand side I wonder if there is this player who is definitely going to be miles better when we have a system that isolates the left


21 _Gooner stated that we’d been linked with Rodgers and mooted a swap deal with Martinelli. Now would I be happy to see that kind of deal? Yeah of course but it’s never happening. Martinelli isn’t going to agree to go to Villa and I doubt highly they could come to an accommodation over his wage demands even if he was prepared to consider it.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Emery didn’t buy anyone. He had no say over Transfers. It was either Sanhelhi or Mislintat who bought in Martinelli

Another argument in futility loading........

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Martinelli has doubtlessly underperformed last couple of seasons my point is given the issues on the left hand side I wonder if there is this player who is definitely going to be miles better when we have a system that isolates the left


21 _Gooner stated that we’d been linked with Rodgers and mooted a swap deal with Martinelli. Now would I be happy to see that kind of deal? Yeah of course but it’s never happening. Martinelli isn’t going to agree to go to Villa and I doubt highly they could come to an accommodation over his wage demands even if he was prepared to consider it.

While you've got a point about his wages, let's not forget that he also represents great resell on value for them if they are able to get anything out of him.

Also this is a World cup year, if Martinelli is seriously dreaming about representing Brazil in a WC (like most young Brazilians usually do) he really needs a drastic change in his fortune and form.

If I was advising him, I'd say he should take a risk while he's still young (Villa isn't that much of a risk BTW) and look for a manager who allows him to express himself properly.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Wasn’t meant to be an argument. Just slight cold water on your Emery would want to be reunited with Martinelli idea

All academic anyway

[Marc Overmars]

Ornstein reporting that we’ve made a move for Eze. :wacko:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Ornstein has tweeted that our interest in Eze was when we were hoping to get him for £40m
Spurs are wiling to pay £60m so we have ruled him out.

Two things:

1. On what planet did we ever think we could get him for £40m??
2. Why is it that we are happy with spunking large sums on players like Madueke with no haggling of any kind but when there is an actual decent player that would improve our attack it’s too much money??


Ffs

[KSE Comedy Club]

Ornstein has tweeted that our interest in Eze was when we were hoping to get him for £40m
Spurs are wiling to pay £60m so we have ruled him out.

Two things:

1. On what planet did we ever think we could get him for £40m??
2. Why is it that we are happy with spunking large sums on players like Madueke with no haggling of any kind but when there is an actual decent player that would improve our attack it’s too much money??


Ffs

I stand corrected, that tweet was earlier and as MO said, he’s now reporting we’ve made a move for Eze!

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Ornstein reporting that we’ve made a move for Eze. :wacko:

Yup just seen it on BBC, seems we've made up our mind to hug all the limelight today.

Great news again, if true.

[Marc Overmars]

Spurs. :lol:

This could be sweet.

[Shaqiri Is Boss]

Poor Spurs :lol:

Just when there is that glimmer of hope.

Their own fault really, unless he was stalling for you behind the scenes.

[KSE Comedy Club]

According to Arsenal insider the deal is already done :shrug:

The Arsenal Pulse @Arsenalinsider5
BREAKING: Eberechi Eze to Arsenal is 100%
DONE!
Eze has agreed personal terms with the
Gunners, and a £60m fee has been settled with Crystal Palace. You all doubted me, but it's official
—he's an Arsenal player!
•
#TransferNews
#Eze #Arsenal
8:07 pm • 20 Aug 2025 • 18.6K Views

[Marc Overmars]

Most of the respected journo’s are saying this moved very quickly today after we only came to the table this afternoon.

2001 vibes with Sol. :bow:

[dazthegooner]

Now on Skysports

[Letters]

Holy shit, this would be quite the coup.

[Marc Overmars]

Ornstein has now said an agreement with Palace is in place.

Eze is expected to play in Palace’s European game tomorrow for his farewell. For the love of god don’t get injured. :sick:

[dazthegooner]

Might he be cup tied for the Champions league or doesn't other European competitions count?

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Might he be cup tied for the Champions league or doesn't other European competitions count?

No, playing in another competition doesn't count....also I think the game is a qualifier, so evn if it had been in the CL, it probably wouldn't count either.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Had to pinch myself when I woke up this morning as still in shock from last night's drama.

Social media is currently on meltdown with Spuds having a real go at Levy, calling him all sorts of names.

I know it seems it took Havertz getting injured, but I'm struggling to see how this script could have been written better.

I am ecstatic at the news and I must say it does seem the club has done something really special this window, and I don't just mean the signings or the amount we are spending, it seems for the first time I can ever really remember they generally listened to the fans, and honestly it cannot be understated what this does to an average fan.

The amount of goodwill that will be generated at the end of this window is something I can't recall ever being done.

I know, I have criticised the club on here a lot, and to some it does seem OTT, but honestly I am still speechless after last night's developments and for now I'm uttering the words "Bravo, Bravo" and "bring it on"......

...off to edit my season's predictions with a pleasant smile on my face.

[HCZ_Reborn]

On one hand I stick by what I said which is that I think signing Eze is a good move but on it’s own it doesn’t move the dial massively, with or without him we are either capable of winning the title or we aren’t.

However it is a sign of ambition. And more so a sign of learning from the mistakes in the previous two seasons. If we get this deal over the line by early next week, we don’t have to as fans play the silly game of hoping against hope that something materialises on deadline day. We can watch with some interest to see who goes either on loan or permanently to free up squad space

I do wonder now if Nwaneri might end up out on loan this season

[Letters]

It is dizzying how quickly we have moved here, given the common (and somewhat justified) lament from Gooners at how slowly we do things. I was pretty happy with our summer dealings anyway, this would be an absolutely brilliant coup.
Puts some extra pressure on Arteta though. Either deliver or piss off. The club have backed him as much as they can.
If he can’t deliver a big trophy this year (and I fear he can’t, but would love to be proven wrong) then he never will and we need to find someone who can.

[KSE Comedy Club]

On one hand I stick by what I said which is that I think signing Eze is a good move but on it’s own it doesn’t move the dial massively, with or without him we are either capable of winning the title or we aren’t.

However it is a sign of ambition. And more so a sign of learning from the mistakes in the previous two seasons. If we get this deal over the line by early next week, we don’t have to as fans play the silly game of hoping against hope that something materialises on deadline day. We can watch with some interest to see who goes either on loan or permanently to free up squad space

I do wonder now if Nwaneri might end up out on loan this season

The deal is done according to some, on paper at least. His medical is booked for Friday

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

On one hand I stick by what I said which is that I think signing Eze is a good move but on it’s own it doesn’t move the dial massively, with or without him we are either capable of winning the title or we aren’t.

However it is a sign of ambition. And more so a sign of learning from the mistakes in the previous two seasons. If we get this deal over the line by early next week, we don’t have to as fans play the silly game of hoping against hope that something materialises on deadline day. We can watch with some interest to see who goes either on loan or permanently to free up squad space

I do wonder now if Nwaneri might end up out on loan this season

I thought of this a bit in the past few days and it seems nowadays we do less loans of our young talent, something that formed part of my crtique on how Arteta handles young players.

But in Nwaneri's case, I really think Arteta should go back to using him as Saka's number one backup and believe Saka should play far less this season, as he already looks tired this preseason as usual.

Anyway, Arteta will do what Arteta will do and the good news is obviously he just signed a new contract. I hope Ethan can be patient, but honestly he should be playing more due to what he actually contributes.

[KSE Comedy Club]

It is dizzying how quickly we have moved here, given the common (and somewhat justified) lament from Gooners at how slowly we do things. I was pretty happy with our summer dealings anyway, this would be an absolutely brilliant coup.
Puts some extra pressure on Arteta though. Either deliver or piss off. The club have backed him as much as they can.
If he can’t deliver a big trophy this year (and I fear he can’t, but would love to be proven wrong) then he never will and we need to find someone who can.

:lol: I was just going to post about this.

Amazing how quickly we have got this deal done, surely transfers take weeks......

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

It is dizzying how quickly we have moved here, given the common (and somewhat justified) lament from Gooners at how slowly we do things. I was pretty happy with our summer dealings anyway, this would be an absolutely brilliant coup.
Puts some extra pressure on Arteta though. Either deliver or piss off. The club have backed him as much as they can.
If he can’t deliver a big trophy this year (and I fear he can’t, but would love to be proven wrong) then he never will and we need to find someone who can.
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/13413994/real-madrid-have-worlds-most-valuable-squad-but-where-do-liverpool-man-utd-man-city-chelsea-and-arsenal-rank

This was compiled even before the Eze deal was completed. No pressure :lol:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

I don't really think this impacts Nwaneri tbh

It's more of what it means for Martinelli. On to the bench you go.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Also, Havertz sacrificing his knee for the greater good. :bow:

What a hero.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

The deal is done according to some, on paper at least. His medical is booked for Friday

Done deal, even Sky have announced it.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Also, Havertz sacrificing his knee for the greater good. :bow:

What a hero.

:lol: ...... never seen an injury bring so much joy :wwf:

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I don't really think this impacts Nwaneri tbh

It's more of what it means for Martinelli. On to the bench you go.

Less chance of him playing through the middle , which Arteta seems to prefer nowadays.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

BTW I think Liverpool will surely sign Isak now....and I'm not even afraid anymore :scarf:

Edit: Also Sky are still reporting our interest in Rogers still exists.... even I think its ok to stop now, that's if we want to :lol:

[KSE Comedy Club]

I don't really think this impacts Nwaneri tbh

It's more of what it means for Martinelli. On to the bench you go.

Yep I think this too.

Bench or sold....... :shrug:

[Marc Overmars]

Is this now (on paper) our best ever transfer window?

[Letters]

Is this now (on paper) our best ever transfer window?

It's probably the one I've been most excited by, so I guess by that metric yes it is.

[KSE Comedy Club]

I would agree :)

[HCZ_Reborn]

The last transfer I was genuinely excited by was Alexis Sanchez

[KSE Comedy Club]

The last transfer I was genuinely excited by was Alexis Sanchez

Every party has a pooper


except for Thomas who has a court date :rimshot:

[KSE Comedy Club]

Sorry :getcoat:

[Letters]

:lol:

So you should be.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Every party has a pooper


except for Thomas who has a court date :rimshot:


The people who had to worry about pooping were his victims apparently

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

The people who had to worry about pooping were his victims apparently

:haha:

[KSE Comedy Club]

The people who had to worry about pooping were his victims apparently

:haha:

[Marc Overmars]

Nothing from any reputable sources but there is some chit chat about Saudi clubs looking at Martinelli. Would definitely sell if a big offer were to come in. Would be sad to see him go because he’s been here from the start of this journey in getting us back to competing again, however his progress has massively stalled and I’m not convinced we’ll get more out of him. Feel like there has to be a significant outgoing soon enough with how much we’ve spent and he ticks the boxes.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Nothing from any reputable sources but there is some chit chat about Saudi clubs looking at Martinelli. Would definitely sell if a big offer were to come in. Would be sad to see him go because he’s been here from the start of this journey in getting us back to competing again, however his progress has massively stalled and I’m not convinced we’ll get more out of him. Feel like there has to be a significant outgoing soon enough with how much we’ve spent and he ticks the boxes.

Yup, seeing figures as high as £80m....but like HCZ said regarding Villa, he probably won't go.

Also it's a World cup year, so doubt he'd take the risk.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Is this now (on paper) our best ever transfer window?

I think so. 7 signings in one window is not normally what we do.

Rememebr when we signed Cech and no fucker else. :lol:

[HCZ_Reborn]

So for Eze to be eligible for tomorrow, the transfer has to be completed by noon

Tick Tock

Seriously though, I don’t think the expectation is that his first game will be next Sunday

The last time we signed seven players in one window was 2011. But that was the summer that we sold Clichy, Nasri and Fabregas and bought in

Gervinho, Benayoun, Park, Mertesacker, Arteta, Andre Santos, Oxlade Chamberlain


So yeah not a real basis of comparison

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Oh of couse, five players on one day :bow:

Andre Santos goal against Chelsea. :bow:

[Marc Overmars]

So for Eze to be eligible for tomorrow, the transfer has to be completed by noon

Tick Tock

Seriously though, I don’t think the expectation is that his first game will be next Sunday

The last time we signed seven players in one window was 2011. But that was the summer that we sold Clichy, Nasri and Fabregas and bought in

Gervinho, Benayoun, Park, Mertesacker, Arteta, Andre Santos, Oxlade Chamberlain


So yeah not a real basis of comparison

That also felt like a last minute trolley dash after losing Nasri and Cesc. We were in the mud then, which culminated in that 8-2 at Old Trafford.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

I watched that 8-2 with a Man Utd fan, it was torture.

[HCZ_Reborn]

I watched that 8-2 with a Man Utd fan, it was torture.

Watched the first half of that game. Didn’t we have a pel at 1-0 which we missed or was saved ?

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Yeah Van Persie had it saved I think.

[Marc Overmars]

Watched the first half of that game. Didn’t we have a pel at 1-0 which we missed or was saved ?

Yeah RVP had it saved.

Think Rooney also missed a penalty in that game. Or that might have been another time against us.

[HCZ_Reborn]

That was a very strange season, another mind the gap race with Spurs but it was for third place rather than 4th in case Chelsea won the champions league (man that still depresses me today).

Had some shockingly bad results and some really good ones too


Winning 5-3 at Stamford Bridge, injury time winner from RVP at Anfield, late winner for Vermaelen against Newcastle, the 2-0 down, 5-2 up game against Spurs.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Glasner is insisting that Guehi going nowhere

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Glasner is insisting that Guehi going nowhere

That would be good news for us and all Liverpool's rivals, however Parish has made it clear that no one will be allowed to run down their contract and after some scenes I saw after their game against Liverpool (where Guehi practically blanked him), I wonder why he still thinks he can work with him.

Though it's probable he's got the trophy itch now and wants to be in a position to make it a regular thing.

[IBK]

I am very very pleased about Eze. I don't think I can remember a transfer that was so desired by Arsenal fans, or that has generated such excitement and anticipation. He is a real talent, and what's more by all accounts a good and intelligent human being. His journey arc and connection to Arsenal is special, and while I understand HZC's point that he doesn't fit in exactly with what we percieved to be this team's requirements, I think he is good enough essentially to create his own role, and is what we've been crying out for in terms of creativity, unpredictability and goal threat. I think he raises the ceiling and elevates our team.

At last - real excitement and promise, and I think I've said before (and agree with others above) that this makes our transfer season an excellent one.

I'm not sure I quite buy that this was all done in lightening quick time. There are reports saying that this deal was already lined up before Havertz's injury, and that the injury was the final incentive, not the only one. This makes sense to me in the circumstances (perhaps we were holding on for outgoing sales and had to take the plunge without these on the Havertz news?). Either way, Eze is the first team cover that we need in Havertz's absence. I'm even hearing today that Havertz's injury muight not be as bad as we all feared...

[HCZ_Reborn]

Yes I have heard that about Havertz as well

Good, I want Arteta to have a selection headache but one that results from having too many choices

[McNamara That Ghost...]

I heard they're going to try and treat Havertz's issue with physiotherapy but if it doesn't respond, it'll need surgery.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I heard they're going to try and treat Havertz's issue with physiotherapy but if it doesn't respond, it'll need surgery.

Heard the same earlier....no one is going to be sure till like 2 or 3 weeks.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Heard the same earlier....no one is going to be sure till like 2 or 3 weeks.

Makes me think it’s a meniscus injury

Muscles can heal by themselves with proper exercise/physio. But likely a result of bulking up. Look what all that bulk did to Nadal’s knees (his was tendinitis which you can’t really do surgery on unless it’s chronic and even then it’s not a cure)

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Eze. :bow:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Saka down.

Arteta to pull the same trick to get Rodrygo too? :ninja:

[Mac76]

Saka down.

Arteta to pull the same trick to get Rodrygo too? :ninja:

:lol:

[HCZ_Reborn]

I have to say my main issue going into the summer was creativity and I have to say that issue seems to have been addressed now.

I see that we’ve been linked with a left back, probably sensible but I think we will need to sell someone like Kiwior first. I certainly now expect the vast majority of our transfer dealing in the next few days to be departures rather than arrivals as squad is far too big


Zinchenko, Kiwior, Vieira, Nelson, Lokonga and maybe even Martinelli (maybe sell him and keep Nelson as a backup if Saka is out for a while)

I’m massively biased pro Martinelli but if he’s fallen out of favour, might as well get a big transfer fee for him.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

We've reacted already.

tps://x.com/David_Ornstein/status/1959524115724779671

And the text version below, for those that don't use Twitter.

Arsenal reach agreement for Shamrock Rovers 16yo Victor Ozhianvuna. Deal not signed but now in place + worth Ireland record fee. #ShamrockRovers midfielder to join #AFC on pre-contract & arrive Jan 2027. W/
@gunnerblog
after
@McDonnellDan @TheAthleticFC

Another Ornstein bomba.

Also, who?

[HCZ_Reborn]

We've reacted already.

tps://x.com/David_Ornstein/status/1959524115724779671

And the text version below, for those that don't use Twitter.

Arsenal reach agreement for Shamrock Rovers 16yo Victor Ozhianvuna. Deal not signed but now in place + worth Ireland record fee. #ShamrockRovers midfielder to join #AFC on pre-contract & arrive Jan 2027. W/
@gunnerblog
after
@McDonnellDan @TheAthleticFC

Another Ornstein bomba.

Also, who?

Irish international born to Russian and Nigerian parents. Presumably one for the future

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

We've reacted already.

tps://x.com/David_Ornstein/status/1959524115724779671

And the text version below, for those that don't use Twitter.

Arsenal reach agreement for Shamrock Rovers 16yo Victor Ozhianvuna. Deal not signed but now in place + worth Ireland record fee. #ShamrockRovers midfielder to join #AFC on pre-contract & arrive Jan 2027. W/
@gunnerblog
after
@McDonnellDan @TheAthleticFC

Another Ornstein bomba.

Also, who?

Just looked at a few clips of him and he seems to be a first team singing......I obviously don't think we need anymore defenders, but the kid does look talented though.

Edit: Sky seems to suggest we'll let him stay at Shamrock and he'll join us properly when he is 18, oh and that he is a MF.

[McNamara That Ghost...]

He can't come in for two years, I guess because of EU stuff.

[Chippy]

Irish international born to Russian and Nigerian parents. Presumably one for the future

Fuck me! Which country will he play for? :unsure:

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Dunking on Spuds again trying to get Hincapie apparently. :bow:

[Marc Overmars]

Ornstein says it’s also subject to player exits.

This guy is another one of these utility type defenders, so maybe Kiwior and Zinchenko will be sold.

Think we’re bloody mad really to be potentially spending 40m or so on another defender. Just keep Kiwior.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Where are peoples respect for tradition, we don’t go through a summer transfer period without signing either a left back or someone who can play there :lol:

2021 - The dog snogger

2022 - Zin

2023 - Timber

2024 - Calafiori

[McNamara That Ghost...]

Ornstein says it’s also subject to player exits.

This guy is another one of these utility type defenders, so maybe Kiwior and Zinchenko will be sold.

Think we’re bloody mad really to be potentially spending 40m or so on another defender. Just keep Kiwior.

It's what Liverpool probably would be spending thereabouts on Guehi.

Next summer will be :tumbleweed: territory though.

[dostoy]

Ornstein says it’s also subject to player exits.

This guy is another one of these utility type defenders, so maybe Kiwior and Zinchenko will be sold.

Think we’re bloody mad really to be potentially spending 40m or so on another defender. Just keep Kiwior.

If Arsenal can get this bloke in for about the same they can get for Zinchenko and Kiwior then it must be a good deal especially if they think he is better than Kiwior.

[dostoy]

I can't believe the biggest deal of the summer is going to be left until the last few days of the window.

Isak will be a Liverpool player this time next week, surely its inevitable.

[Marc Overmars]

Kiwior is expected to join Porto on loan with a 25m obligation to buy next year.

Which means Hincapie is likely to come in and apparently it’s for the same type of deal too. Like when we signed Raya.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Kiwior is expected to join Porto on loan with a 25m obligation to buy next year.

Which means Hincapie is likely to come in and apparently it’s for the same type of deal too. Like when we signed Raya.

Its a shame we can't get at least 40m for Kiwior, he's actually a decent CB and would improve most EPL teams, he just hasn't been put in the shop window properly.

Anyway I'm more than ok with him going as I rate every CB we have over him defensively....except maybe White and Calafiori. Mosquera, like I've said a few times, is a great find and looking forward to seeing him play more.

[Marc Overmars]

Its a shame we can't get at least 40m for Kiwior, he's actually a decent CB and would improve most EPL teams, he just hasn't been put in the shop window properly.

Anyway I'm more than ok with him going as I rate every CB we have over him defensively....except maybe White and Calafiori. Mosquera, like I've said a few times, is a great find and looking forward to seeing him play more.

If Guehi is valued at 40m then I certainly think Kiwior is too. By all accounts he preferred a move abroad than staying in the Prem, which sucks for us because Europe is broke.

[KSE Comedy Club]

Interesting.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1178022351031240&id=100064704577210&set=a.599866928846788


Rodygo on deadline day?

[HCZ_Reborn]

Albert Sambi Lokonga is likely to go to Trabzonspor on loan with an option to buy (an option I suspect they won’t take up, I mean would you?)

I feel that being sent to Turkey should be considered the footballing parlance equivalent of being sent to Coventry

[IBK]

Its a shame we can't get at least 40m for Kiwior, he's actually a decent CB and would improve most EPL teams, he just hasn't been put in the shop window properly.

Anyway I'm more than ok with him going as I rate every CB we have over him defensively....except maybe White and Calafiori. Mosquera, like I've said a few times, is a great find and looking forward to seeing him play more.

I think that of all our potential outgoings, Kiwor has actually been put in the shop window. Granted it was due to big Gabi's injury last season, (and I suspect that but for that he would be in the same position as the rest of our largely 'un-sellable' players), but he had (and took) the opportunity to be visible to potential suitors - particulrly in the CL. As MO says, a sale to Europe rather than the EPL tends to depress value, so I agree that £25M is disappointing. I'm sure this move is as much to do with Kiwor's wish to play though, so keeping him is not an option, really. I think with understudies to maybe the best CB pairing in Europe we have to keep re-cycling and bringing in players happy to play rarely but learn from them and our manager.

I really hope that now we have genuine, quality back ups (of which Kiwor is one) there will be more rotation and our traditional issue with trying to sell frozen out players will start to recede.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

I think that of all our potential outgoings, Kiwor has actually been put in the shop window. Granted it was due to big Gabi's injury last season, (and I suspect that but for that he would be in the same position as the rest of our largely 'un-sellable' players), but he had (and took) the opportunity to be visible to potential suitors - particulrly in the CL. As MO says, a sale to Europe rather than the EPL tends to depress value, so I agree that £25M is disappointing. I'm sure this move is as much to do with Kiwor's wish to play though, so keeping him is not an option, really. I think with understudies to maybe the best CB pairing in Europe we have to keep re-cycling and bringing in players happy to play rarely but learn from them and our manager.

I really hope that now we have genuine, quality back ups (of which Kiwor is one) there will be more rotation and our traditional issue with trying to sell frozen out players will start to recede.

Yeah, I guess you and MO are right, selling to a European team is likely what is reducing his value. I also need to give him props for insisting he doesn't want to play for another EPL team as I'm thinking his decision might actually be emotional more than anything else.

On your last point, I don't know, I know its still early days, but it looks like Arteta is beginning to embrace substitutions a whole lot more during games....if this turns out to be true, and the focus isn't only on recycling defenders, then the change will make a lot of people happy.

[21_GOONER_SALUTE]

Albert Sambi Lokonga is likely to go to Trabzonspor on loan with an option to buy (an option I suspect they won’t take up, I mean would you?)

I feel that being sent to Turkey should be considered the footballing parlance equivalent of being sent to Coventry

:lol:

[IBK]

Yeah, I guess you and MO are right, selling to a European team is likely what is reducing his value. I also need to give him props for insisting he doesn't want to play for another EPL team as I'm thinking his decision might actually be emotional more than anything else.

On your last point, I don't know, I know its still early days, but it looks like Arteta is beginning to embrace substitutions a whole lot more during games....if this turns out to be true, and the focus isn't only on recycling defenders, then the change will make a lot of people happy.

Yep - and hopefully reduce injuries....

[Mac76]

Palace are in for Nelson apparently, good move for him if it goes through, decent club under Glasner and bit of European football even if it's just a pub league

[Marc Overmars]

Palace are in for Nelson apparently, good move for him if it goes through, decent club under Glasner and bit of European football even if it's just a pub league

15m apparently which seems fair enough. Hopefully it happens.

[HCZ_Reborn]

15m apparently which seems fair enough. Hopefully it happens.

Yep. Good luck to him