Koscielny

[Özim]

look, it's heat of the moment stuff, a last ditch attempt to stop a goal, which I'd prefer to see rather than standing by watching it happen. if he hadn't of, a goal was more than likely - and let's not sit here analysing a slow motion gif that makes everything seem very rational and sensible in hindsight.

our positional lapses cause us far more problems over the season and he doesn't make most of them - in fact, mistakes he tends to make come his attempts to stop something happening.

vermaelen, our wonderful captain, is a far bigger problem back there. he has caused us so many problems over the seasons it is unbelievable. goals covered them up at first but now we are finally seeing what he's about. vermaelen needs a thread to highlight what a fuck up he's become.

The reason I made this thread is because I feel Vermaelen gets a lot of criticism whilst Koscielny largely gets away with little when he's responsible for quite a few key mistakes which cause goals.

The challenge for me was more than rash, I simply can't understand how anyone could think they'd get away with putting their arms round someone and holding onto them, rash would be a pull, a nudge but that wasn't rash for me it was very poor.

Dzeko turned him, once that had happened there's nothing you can do without giving away a penalty and perhaps getting yourself sent off.

IMO Koscielny has been prone to errors for his whole time here and at this stage of his career and at his age he should now have cut these out, I believe this is a trait of his game that won't disappear. That's not excusing Vermaelen, because he's been very poor as well.

[Kano]

The reason I made this thread is because I feel Vermaelen gets a lot of criticism whilst Koscielny largely gets away with little when he's responsible for quite a few key mistakes which cause goals.

The challenge for me was more than rash, I simply can't understand how anyone could think they'd get away with putting their arms round someone and holding onto them, rash would be a pull, a nudge but that wasn't rash for me it was very poor.

Dzeko turned him, once that had happened there's nothing you can do without giving away a penalty and perhaps getting yourself sent off.

IMO Koscielny has been prone to errors for his whole time here and at this stage of his career and at his age he should now have cut these out, I believe this is a trait of his game that won't disappear. That's not excusing Vermaelen, because he's been very poor as well.

i don't think Kos gets away with much really. last season he was very good and improved considerably from the season beforehand, this season? not as good but i would still say our best centre back of the three, following my merts and verm - which is how i saw it at the start of the season.

if the rest of the prem were leading the way in defence qualities then i would probably give him a much harder time but let's face it, there aren't many that can claim to be performing much better. maybe it's a post-euro thing as we've seen in years past, i'm not sure, but on current form, there aren't a whole host of cb's in the premier i would rush out to replace him with.

[Niall_Quinn]

I don't think you can pick between TV, Kos or Merts in terms of who will guarantee you a major fuck up each match. They are all dodgy defenders. I think Merts has been the worst of the bunch in recent weeks with his lack of pace (more like lack of ability to actually move) really showing him up and costing us. Gibbs as well can be host and cold. Cheney too, a mixed bag. Only Sagna seems to play to an acceptable standard at the back, but he's so woeful going forward and destroying our momentum. I think we have the worst group of defenders in the league and have had for years. And a lot of the praise for that needs to go to Wenger and the coaches of course. What the fuck they have been doing for the last 8 years in terms of the defence is one of those deep, deep mysteries.

[IBK]

I think blaming Kos is wide of the mark. Ref was probably right on a very strict application of the law. Problem is that defenders see this kind of thing unpunished most of the time. We all want our players to do what is needed to prevent the other side scoring - Kos fell slightly the wrong side of the line. He is not playing as well as last season, but that's because he hasn't had a run of games. Jury's out on him, but not for today.

[Grebbo]

Our entire defence is scary. It needs to be ripped up and started again. Merts has the turning speed of a double decker bus, Vermaelen still dives in like an 18yr old, Kos and Gibbs are just plain shit. As for Sagna... well he blatantly wants out because his form has bombed.

[Power n Glory]

The guys an idiot. Seemed harsh but you can't rugby tackle the opposition.

[selassie]

Our entire defence is scary. It needs to be ripped up and started again. Merts has the turning speed of a double decker bus, Vermaelen still dives in like an 18yr old, Kos and Gibbs are just plain shit. As for Sagna... well he blatantly wants out because his form has bombed.

I don't think it would matter what we spent and who we have in Defence. It will remain sh*te until Arsene/Bouldy sort out the tactical side of our game. It's really not just defence, for sure Defence is and has been a problem for years, but the team as a whole, suck at Defending/closing down/doing the ugly stuff.

I'm really tired off all of us going on about the same things every single season, we have a multitude of problems with the team and I don't believe any of them will be fixed until Arsene is gone.

[Power n Glory]

I don't think it would matter what we spent and who we have in Defence. It will remain sh*te until Arsene/Bouldy sort out the tactical side of our game. It's really not just defence, for sure Defence is and has been a problem for years, but the team as a whole, suck at Defending/closing down/doing the ugly stuff.

I'm really tired off all of us going on about the same things every single season, we have a multitude of problems with the team and I don't believe any of them will be fixed until Arsene is gone.

Wenger has to go. We're a shambles of a team and it's because of him. He has no idea what he's doing anymore. This is a brand new team and the defensive line up is totally different to what we had four years ago and it's the same shit different toilet.

[Grebbo]

Wenger has to go. We're a shambles of a team and it's because of him. He has no idea what he's doing anymore. This is a brand new team and the defensive line up is totally different to what we had four years ago and it's the same shit different toilet.

Wenger with great players is a great manager.

Wenger with average players is a good manager.

A manager is only as good as his players.

[Grebbo]

I don't think it would matter what we spent and who we have in Defence. It will remain sh*te until Arsene/Bouldy sort out the tactical side of our game. It's really not just defence, for sure Defence is and has been a problem for years, but the team as a whole, suck at Defending/closing down/doing the ugly stuff.

I'm really tired off all of us going on about the same things every single season, we have a multitude of problems with the team and I don't believe any of them will be fixed until Arsene is gone.

I dunno, I think it's more the quality of defender rather than tactics. Yes, Wenger has never been a great tactician but the two goals yesterday and Kos getting sent off were down to having shit defenders. Bould was part of the best defence ever seen and even he can't coach them into being half decent players.

Verms is 27? He still plays like a kid. Way too rash. No amount of coaching is going to fix him now. Now amount of coaching or tactics is going to improve Merts' turning speed of an elephant.

Wenger has won trophies in England. He's also built good defences in England. But he had much better players than he does now - that's the only difference.